Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2008-08-24

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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All times shown according to UTC.

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08:41 rakudo_svn r30502 | moritz++ | [rakudo] add S29-hash/delete.t to spectest_regression
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09:27 moritz_ rakudo: say List ~~ Array
09:27 p6eval rakudo 29834: OUTPUT[0␤]
09:27 moritz_ rakudo: say Array ~~ List
09:27 p6eval rakudo 29834: OUTPUT[1␤]
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10:04 pugs_svn r22026 | moritz++ | [t] move match.t to spec/S05-substitution/, add a smartlink
10:11 rakudo_svn r30503 | moritz++ | [rakudo] allow access to $/, $!, $_ in while loops, closes RT #58306
10:16 moritz_ rakudo: "abc" ~~ m/../ && say "$/"
10:16 p6eval rakudo 29834: OUTPUT[Statement not terminated properly at line 1, near "/../ && sa"␤current instr.: 'parrot;PGE::Util;die' pc 120 (runtime/parrot/library/PGE/Util.pir:82)␤]
10:16 moritz_ rakudo: "abc" ~~ /../ ; say "$/"
10:16 p6eval rakudo 29834: OUTPUT[ab␤]
10:17 moritz_ rakudo: my @a; "abc" ~~ /../; push @a, $/; say "survived2
10:17 p6eval rakudo 29834: OUTPUT[Statement not terminated properly at line 1, near "\"survived2"␤current instr.: 'parrot;PGE::Util;die' pc 120 (runtime/parrot/library/PGE/Util.pir:82)␤]
10:18 moritz_ rakudo: my @a; "abc" ~~ /../; push @a, $/; say "survived"
10:18 p6eval rakudo 29834: OUTPUT[survived␤]
10:18 moritz_ rakudo: my @a; "abc" ~~ /../; push @a, "$/"; say "survived"
10:18 p6eval rakudo 29834: OUTPUT[survived␤]
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10:45 pugs_svn r22027 | bacek++ | [spec] Fudge 3 unicode tests for rakudo
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10:51 pugs_svn r22028 | bacek++ | [spec] Str.rindex: Replace comparition to -1 with checking defined() according to spec
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12:12 moritz_ rakudo: my $str 'foo <bar'; if $str ~~ /'<'/ { say $/.WHAT }
12:12 p6eval rakudo 29834: OUTPUT[Statement not terminated properly at line 1, near "'foo <bar'"␤current instr.: 'parrot;PGE::Util;die' pc 120 (runtime/parrot/library/PGE/Util.pir:82)␤]
12:12 moritz_ rakudo: my $str = 'foo <bar'; if $str ~~ /'<'/ { say $/.WHAT }
12:12 p6eval rakudo 29834: OUTPUT[Null PMC access in find_method()␤current instr.: '_block23' pc 118 (EVAL_14:43)␤]
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12:58 masak moritz_++ # ur in our wiki, patching our code
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14:47 xshelf I am unable to build perl6 on windows xp, it fails saying 'sal.h' not found
14:48 masak xshelf: could you paste the build output on http://sial.org/pbot/perl6?
14:48 masak xshelf: also, we're talking about Rakudo here, right?
14:48 pasteling "xshelf" at 59.92.171.84 pasted "build failure" (7 lines, 390B) at http://sial.org/pbot/31979
14:49 xshelf done: http://sial.org/pbot/31979
14:50 masak xshelf: I'd recommend sending a bug report to rakudobug@perl.org -- include the build failure and that you're running Windows XP.
14:51 masak also, you could ask over on #parrot at irc.perl.org -- but it's fairly quiet there right now
14:51 masak busier on weekdays.
14:51 xshelf masak: Should I register to send a bug report?
14:51 masak xshelf: nah, just send it
14:52 xshelf good, will do it
14:52 masak xshelf++
14:52 xshelf How far is perl6 for being usable (with true class support)
14:52 masak xshelf: I use classes in rakudo. it's not all there yet, but fairly usable already.
14:53 masak see jonathan's recent blog posts for an idea of what's implemented and what isn't
14:53 masak http://use.perl.org/~JonathanWorthington/journal/
14:54 xshelf thanks for the link, I am new here
14:54 xshelf I went through this confusion of switching to python or stick to perl
14:55 masak xshelf: you don't have to choose. it's not monogamy, it's programming languages.
14:55 xshelf The only feature that I missed from python was ability to create classes, when I realized perl6 will have it. I decided to stick to perl
14:55 masak "the ability to create classes"?
14:55 xshelf I mean not through the bless and related stuff
14:56 masak ...but...?
14:56 xshelf I need to be able to create objects (with data and functions)
14:56 masak I'm sorry, but Python does that for you.
14:57 masak not saying you should prefer it to Perl, just clearing out the FUD
14:57 xshelf yes, I like perl as I have worked with it and do not have to learn a new syntax
14:57 masak well, you do :)
14:57 masak Perl 6 is not all the same syntax
14:57 masak many new things
14:58 xshelf psychologically, it still feels like a big upgrade rather than a new language
14:59 masak yes.
15:01 xshelf At work, it has been decided all scripts officially developed and that goes to customers (with official stamp) has to be in PERL. We were getting in to a real concoction of scripts
15:02 masak http://svn.pugscode.org/pugs/do​cs/Perl6/Perl5/Differences.pod
15:02 masak xshelf: I hope you don't write it "PERL" with all capitals :)
15:03 * moritz_ doesn't recommend Perl 6 for production yet
15:03 masak http://www.perlmonks.org/?node_id=510594
15:03 moritz_ at least not with the currently available compilers
15:04 masak xshelf: moritz_ is right. if it's for your $work you're building Perl 6, try out the new Perl 5.10.0 instead. it's pretty cool, and much more stable.
15:05 xshelf Perl is what I see (not all caps) but at times I get confused as it is also an acronym
15:05 xshelf I am using Perl 5.10
15:05 masak xshelf: it is also an acronym, but not primarily.
15:05 xshelf ok, thanks for the clarification
15:05 moritz_ the various acronymical meanings were added later
15:06 masak a "backronym"
15:06 moritz_ like "Pathologically Eclectic Rubbish Lister"
15:06 moritz_ "Polymorphic existential recursive lambda"
15:06 moritz_ you name it ;)
15:07 xshelf talking about acronyms, I like GNU the best
15:07 xshelf for the 'bacronyms', Emacs has it own share
15:07 moritz_ I know
15:07 moritz_ there's a whole file with them in the emacs debian package ;)
15:07 masak we haven't backronymed 'november' yet :)
15:08 xshelf true
15:08 xshelf masak: I posted a bug report
15:08 moritz_ Not Only Very Early, But Equally Radical (new wiki)
15:09 masak :)
15:09 xshelf 'm' missing
15:09 masak you missed an "M", yes
15:09 moritz_ m... maintainable?
15:09 masak and "early" is in the eye of the beholder -- the challenge was put out in 2006 :)
15:10 masak moritz_: we can only hope :)
15:10 moritz_ an early Perl 6 application
15:11 xshelf i will just hope and pray that perl6 comes out on time
15:11 * moritz_ not only hopes, but also works towards that goal
15:12 xshelf not sure how I can contribute with my skill set
15:13 moritz_ the easiest entry is by writing tests
15:13 masak xshelf: have you looked at the test suite?
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15:14 xshelf ok, I will first sort out the build. I wanted to play with svk, found perl6 is hosted on svk and started getting into pulling it and building it for fun. It is now becoming a serious interest now
15:14 xshelf i am just ~1week old to perl6
15:14 moritz_ ;)
15:14 xshelf I brought the book 'Perl6 and Parrot', started reading it
15:14 moritz_ http://perlgeek.de/blog-en/perl-5-to-6/ if you haven't already seen it
15:15 xshelf my 1 month goal is to read that book
15:15 moritz_ the book is good, but rather outdated wrt perl 6
15:16 xshelf the only one available... I am used to reading books in print :-(
15:17 moritz_ that's definitely something sombody[tm] should do: write an up-to-date book about Perl 6
15:18 moritz_ but it seems that most people are either not enough interested, or don't understand the language well enough, or don't have enough time, or care more about the implementation
15:19 xshelf would using strawberry perl help so that might use GCC to build perl6/parrot
15:20 moritz_ dunno, it's been years that I used windows voluntarily
15:21 xshelf anyone working on windows port of parrot/perl6 here?
15:22 xshelf i spend most time on windows (as I spend most of my time at work)
15:22 xshelf no option!
15:23 moritz_ xshelf: you'll have much more success in #parrot (on irc.perl.org), I know jonathan builds parrot on windows
15:23 moritz_ and particle
15:23 xshelf moritz_: great, I will hang out on that channel too
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15:25 xshelf is it #parrot?
15:25 xshelf no one was there...
15:25 masak xshelf: yes, but not on this server.
15:25 xshelf oh!
15:25 masak irc.perl.org
15:25 xshelf thanks, I would have waited till infinity!
15:26 edpratomo moritz_: thank you for the perl5-to-6 series
15:26 moritz_ edpratomo: you're welcome
15:27 edpratomo what is the status of continuation and coroutine spec in perl6?
15:27 moritz_ coroutines are done with gather/take
15:28 moritz_ there's no explicit yield()
15:28 edpratomo ah.. which synopses is it in?
15:29 edpratomo i was looking in s17.. looks like the wrong place
15:29 moritz_ S04 iirc
15:30 moritz_ http://perlcabal.org/syn/S0​4.html#The_gather_statement
15:30 edpratomo got it. thx
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15:47 pugs_svn r22029 | moritz++ | [t/spec] removed double fudges from basic-open.t
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16:07 rakudo_svn r30520 | pmichaud++ | [rakudo]: spectest-progress.csv update: 126 files, 2267 passing tests
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17:40 ujwalic what is the irc channel for parrot
17:44 wolverian irc.perl.org #parrot
17:45 ujwalic thnak's wolverian
17:45 wolverian you're welcome
17:46 ujwalic I need to generate html doc from parrot source (svn check out)
18:05 moritz_ make html
18:10 ujwalic thank you
18:16 ujwalic is it same for pugs code too
18:27 moritz_ don't think so
18:28 moritz_ you can use util/smartlinks.pl to convert some of the POD to html
18:28 moritz_ for example the specification
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20:16 chris2 hi. i thought i read a kwiki-like format is considered as alternative to pod for perl 6 docs, but i can't find it anymore. who knows the proposal?
20:16 moritz_ I think it has been deprecated by S26
20:17 moritz_ but the Perl6::Perl5::Differences document still describes the old kwiki style
20:17 chris2 oh, okay
20:17 chris2 kwid!
20:18 moritz_ right
20:18 chris2 that's the key phrase i was looking for, thanks
20:18 moritz_ ;)
20:21 chris2 what was the rationale for reverting that?
20:21 moritz_ I don't think kwid can reference code
20:22 moritz_ there's also no really good reason to change, IMHO
20:23 chris2 matter of taste ;)
20:23 moritz_ ask TheDamian, he wrote S26
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21:34 Guest37528 hello
21:34 moritz_ hi
21:35 Guest37528 lusers
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21:52 moritz_ rakudo: { 'a' ~~ /./ }; say $/
21:52 p6eval rakudo 29834: OUTPUT[␤]
21:52 dr_df0 Hi, I would like to contribute to Perl6 development. Where should I go?
21:52 moritz_ here ;)
21:53 moritz_ dr_df0: what would you like to do? write tests? documentation? help with some compiler?
21:57 pugs_svn r22030 | moritz++ | [t/spec] add tests for matching regexes in various types of blocks
22:03 pugs_svn r22031 | moritz++ | [t/TASKS] some minor clarifications
22:06 moritz_ rakudo: 'abc' ~~ /b/ && say $/.from
22:06 p6eval rakudo 29834: OUTPUT[1␤]
22:06 moritz_ rakudo: 'abc' ~~ /b/ && say $/.to
22:06 p6eval rakudo 29834: OUTPUT[2␤]
22:13 pugs_svn r22032 | dr_df0++ | Entry added to AUTHORS
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22:27 moritz_ bed &
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23:05 ruoso Hello!
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Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo