Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #perl6, 2009-06-22

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo | Niecza | Specs

| Channels | #perl6 index | Today | | Search | Google Search | Plain-Text | summary

All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:05 Caelum joined #perl6
00:14 tann_ joined #perl6
00:22 frew joined #perl6
00:27 s1n1 joined #perl6
01:18 amoc eval: say 'may i test'
01:18 amoc rakudo: say 'again'
01:18 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«again␤»
01:18 amoc rakudo: say 'again 2'
01:18 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«again 2␤»
01:22 kst joined #perl6
01:38 netfish joined #perl6
01:42 twigil joined #perl6
01:47 mycelium joined #perl6
01:49 molaf_xx joined #perl6
01:49 synth joined #perl6
02:02 dukeleto joined #perl6
02:07 amoc joined #perl6
02:08 jonathanturner joined #perl6
02:11 agentzh joined #perl6
02:34 amoc__ joined #perl6
02:48 ihrd left #perl6
02:48 cotto joined #perl6
02:52 amoc joined #perl6
02:58 kst joined #perl6
03:01 meppl joined #perl6
03:07 azawawi joined #perl6
03:07 azawawi hi
03:07 phenny azawawi: 21 Jun 21:07Z <japhb> tell azawawi In http://ahmadzawawi.blogspot.com/2009/06/​padres-perl-6-support-and-ecliptic.html, the last bullet point is incorrect: "Use of C++ constructor syntax (in Perl 6 new Foo should be written Foo->new)."
03:07 * azawawi scratches his head
03:08 cotto joined #perl6
03:14 Tene azawawi: wh?
03:14 Tene eh?
03:16 agentzh left #perl6
03:16 azawawi Tene: what's wrong in my last bullet point in your opinion?
03:17 agentzh joined #perl6
03:17 Tene It should be Foo.new instead of Foo->new, yes?
03:18 azawawi lol
03:18 azawawi i just woke up
03:18 azawawi thanks
03:18 Tene can you quick fix it?
03:18 Tene ;)
03:20 azawawi done
03:20 donaldh joined #perl6
03:20 azawawi japhb: thanks. fixed :)
03:22 azawawi Tene: now it is time to continue creating quick fixes for more popular STD errors/warnings.
03:28 azawawi so once grok is ready, i think the process of tying STD error reporting to Perl 6 documentation would be very interesting.
03:29 frew joined #perl6
03:42 meppuru joined #perl6
03:44 alester joined #perl6
03:56 azawawi std: "abc" ~~ //;
03:56 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Null regex not allowed at /tmp/xAegvdquFJ line 1:␤------> [32m"abc" ~~ //[31m;[0m␤FAILED 00:04 36m␤»
03:57 azawawi what's a good quick fix to null regex "abc" ~~ // ?
04:04 amoc rakudo: Block.does(Code).say
04:04 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«1␤»
04:07 awwaiid azawawi, your nick is the closest to mine as any I've ever seen!
04:08 azawawi cool
04:11 Tene azawawi: why would someone try to match against //?
04:12 azawawi Tene: im going through all of STD's errors/warnings and im trying to find quick fixes for them
04:13 azawawi Tene: so if a user types a null //, what possible fixes is there?
04:14 Tene in Perl 5, // means "the most-recent successful match"
04:14 Tene That doesn't exist in Perl 6, afaik.
04:14 TimToady which is /<prior>/
04:14 Tene Ah.
04:14 Tene As a special case, // in 'split' means "split on every character"
04:15 japhb TimToady: Oh sure, have all the answers.
04:15 Tene so you could look to see if it's being used in 'split'
04:15 TimToady otherwise you want /<?>/ or some such
04:15 Tene and suggest '' as an alternate
04:15 TimToady '' works in split
04:15 Tene can you check for 'split' in your quick fix thing?
04:16 twigil joined #perl6
04:16 azawawi Tene: only if std warns/panics about it atm
04:18 azawawi TimToady: i cannot replicate "Precedence too loose within ??!!; use ??()!! instead ".  my Perl $foo is weak :)
04:21 kst joined #perl6
04:22 azawawi Tene: anything that generates warnings/errors can be a possible source for quick fixes (like PerlCritic for instance)
04:22 Tene compile time only, or runtime also?
04:24 azawawi Tene: currently, compile time.
04:25 azawawi Tene: but there is no reason not to extend it to runtime also (in debugging mode for instance)...
04:28 azawawi Tene: for instance we can quick fix a file that has trailing whitespace, hard tabs, inconsistent new lines,...
04:33 amoc rakudo: multi sub infix:<,> { ... }
04:33 p6eval rakudo 1b06df:  ( no output )
04:34 amoc rakudo: multi sub infix:<,> { ... }; say "foooo~~"
04:34 p6eval rakudo 1b06df:  ( no output )
04:36 azawawi moritz_: any idea how to find a regex for a Perl 6 identifier?
04:38 azawawi std: eval { };
04:38 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«ok 00:02 36m␤»
04:40 azawawi TimToady: regarding eval { }; should STD warn about it? see S04-control, ...Perl 6's C<eval> function only evaluates strings, not blocks.
04:40 azawawi rakudo: eval { }
04:40 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«Parameter type check failed on call to 'eval'.␤in Main (/tmp/dwbqAuIcXH:2)␤»
04:40 azawawi rakudo: eval { };
04:40 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«Parameter type check failed on call to 'eval'.␤in Main (/tmp/VDG6FGmOnn:2)␤»
04:40 azawawi rakudo: eval "";
04:40 p6eval rakudo 1b06df:  ( no output )
04:41 azawawi rakudo seems to handle it better
04:48 eternaleye_ std: 42 ?? 1,2,3 Z 4,5,6 !! 1,2,3 X 4,5,6;
04:48 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Precedence too loose within ??!!; use ??()!! instead  at /tmp/SKCgZbyi2t line 1:␤------> [32m42 ?? 1[31m,2,3 Z 4,5,6 !! 1,2,3 X 4,5,6;[0m␤    expecting any of:␤ POST␤   infix or meta-infix␤        infix or meta-infix (with precedence tighter than item
04:48 p6eval ..assignment)…
04:49 eternaleye_ phenny: tell azawawi std: 42 ?? 1,2,3 Z 4,5,6 !! 1,2,3 X 4,5,6; # re Precedence too loose within ??!!
04:49 phenny eternaleye_: I'll pass that on when azawawi is around.
04:50 eternaleye (grep'able backlogs)++ (postgres \o command)++
04:52 amoc rakudo: 42 ?? 1,2,3 Z 4,5,6 !! 1,2,3 X 4,5,6;
04:52 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«Ternary error␤»
04:54 eternaleye rakudo: 42 ?? ( 1,2,3 Z 4,5,6 ) !! ( 1,2,3 X 4,5,6 );
04:54 amoc rakudo: 1 ?? 1,2 !! 1,2
04:54 p6eval rakudo 1b06df:  ( no output )
04:54 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«Ternary error␤»
04:55 eternaleye rakudo: say( 1 ?? 1,2 !! 1,2 )
04:55 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«Ternary error␤»
04:55 eternaleye rakudo: say 42 ?? ( 1,2,3 Z 4,5,6 ) !! ( 1,2,3 X 4,5,6 );
04:55 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«142536␤»
04:58 amoc "," has looser precedence then '??', '!!'. but it doesn't handle the error properly.
05:00 twigil can somebody help me with parrot? it says "parrot revision r39599 required"
05:01 amoc twigil: what are you trying to do?
05:03 amoc if you are compiling rakudo, just type "perl ./Configure --gen-parrot" then "make".
05:03 twigil the problem is that the machine i'm doing it on doesn.t have a direct connection to the internet
05:07 twigil maybe i should get the newest version from svn
05:10 Tene twigil: the issue is that the rakudo you have requires a newer parrot than you have
05:11 twigil Tene: thanks
05:34 finanalyst joined #perl6
05:36 jjore_ joined #perl6
05:38 jjore_ joined #perl6
05:41 justatheory joined #perl6
05:49 twigil joined #perl6
06:07 kst joined #perl6
06:11 rfordinal joined #perl6
06:32 pmurias joined #perl6
06:40 user` joined #perl6
06:41 user` left #perl6
06:42 Matt-W eww 419 scam in RT
06:47 moritz_ moved one to the spam queue, thanks
06:56 rfordinal joined #perl6
07:03 viklund joined #perl6
07:03 wayland76 joined #perl6
07:03 iblechbot joined #perl6
07:04 moritz_ rakudo: class A { }; say A.new() === A.new();
07:04 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«0␤»
07:07 moritz_ rakudo: class A { }; say A.new().WHAT === A.new().WHAT;
07:07 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«1␤»
07:17 baest joined #perl6
07:21 donaldh joined #perl6
07:35 ejs joined #perl6
07:40 beggars joined #perl6
07:42 azawawi joined #perl6
07:42 azawawi hello
07:42 phenny azawawi: 04:49Z <eternaleye_> tell azawawi std: 42 ?? 1,2,3 Z 4,5,6 !! 1,2,3 X 4,5,6; # re Precedence too loose within ??!!
07:43 azawawi eternaleye: thx
07:43 azawawi std: 42 ?? 1,2,3 Z 4,5,6 !! 1,2,3 X 4,5,6;
07:43 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Precedence too loose within ??!!; use ??()!! instead  at /tmp/WKIVxdegxO line 1:␤------> [32m42 ?? 1[31m,2,3 Z 4,5,6 !! 1,2,3 X 4,5,6;[0m␤    expecting any of:␤ POST␤   infix or meta-infix␤        infix or meta-infix (with precedence tighter than item
07:43 p6eval ..assignment)…
07:46 kst joined #perl6
07:47 DemoFreak joined #perl6
07:52 barney joined #perl6
07:54 amoc azawawi: the error is the right behavior according to S03. but rakudo just dies. #66840
07:58 hanekomu joined #perl6
07:58 eMaX joined #perl6
08:01 rfordinal joined #perl6
08:01 rfordinal left #perl6
08:03 eternaleye std: 1 ?? 1, 2 !! 3, 4;
08:03 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Precedence too loose within ??!!; use ??()!! instead  at /tmp/Cnnizs0gTs line 1:␤------> [32m1 ?? 1[31m, 2 !! 3, 4;[0m␤    expecting any of:␤    POST␤   infix or meta-infix␤        infix or meta-infix (with precedence tighter than item assignment)␤
08:03 p6eval .. infix stopper␤    po…
08:04 masak joined #perl6
08:04 eternaleye H H   masak
08:04 eternaleye O   AI
08:04 masak ahoj, scurvy parrotcamels!
08:05 moritz_ oh hai
08:05 moritz_ masak: I filled your role yesterday :-)
08:06 masak moritz_: I would expect nothing less. :)
08:06 masak moritz_: seems we'll have a second-ever #perl6-soc meeting on Wednesday 19:00 UCT, me and literal++.
08:07 moritz_ masak: I'll join, unless I forget it. Feel free to ping me on #perl6
08:07 masak goodie.
08:07 azawawi joined #perl6
08:07 masak I'll announce it shortly before, so others who might have forgotten can join, too.
08:08 azawawi masak: Hello captain :)
08:09 moritz_ masak++
08:09 masak azawawi: I'm not the captain, just one of the first mates. :)
08:09 azawawi masak: so who's the captain here then? :)
08:09 masak azawawi: who could it be? :)
08:10 * azawawi wonders :)
08:10 moritz_ perl6 is a fleet, not just a ship
08:10 masak an armada.
08:10 moritz_ obra_ used to be the admiral
08:10 azawawi the borg... :)
08:11 moritz_ TimToady, pmichaud, ruoso are certainly captains of their ships
08:12 azawawi so how can i match a perl 6 identifier in p5 regex correctly?
08:12 azawawi i need it to change new Foo-Bar::C to Foo-Bar::C.new
08:12 masak azawawi: is "identifier" here limited to namespaces?
08:13 azawawi masak: just a quick hack to get "Use Perl 6 constructor instead of C++'s" quick fix working correctly
08:14 masak is that a yes? :)
08:14 azawawi yeah
08:14 masak I'd imagine peeking in STD.pm and/or Rakudo's parser.pg might help here.
08:14 * moritz_ tries: (?:pL|_)w*(?:(?=pL|_)['-'(?:pL|L)w*)*
08:15 masak o_O
08:15 azawawi that's really complicated :)
08:15 moritz_ sorry,  (?:\pL|_)\w*(?:(?=\pL|_)['-](?:\pL|L)\w*)*
08:15 masak Perl 5 is scary... :/
08:15 masak at least use /x :P
08:16 azawawi it is easy to write it in Perl 6 :)
08:16 * azawawi tries it...
08:17 masak is Pair parametrized like Hash?
08:18 moritz_ good question
08:24 azawawi moritz_: thx and i think i need to extract that info from STD directly which would make it more robust and predictable than regex replacements
08:26 ejs joined #perl6
08:26 moritz_ :-)
08:31 masak I'm back to thinking about grok and about naming/classifying/storing things.
08:31 masak people are encouraged to help me think this through.
08:31 masak as an example, I'm trying to enumerate all instances of '+' in the Perl 6 grammar.
08:32 masak there's the binary op, and the prefix (numifying) op...
08:32 azawawi masak: im thinking of going simple and adding topic labels/tags like in blogs...
08:32 ejs joined #perl6
08:32 masak azawawi: yes. that sounds right. I hope to be able to co-opt Pod to do that.
08:33 masak and then there's a postfix '+' in the grammar slang.
08:33 masak I don't know how the latter is classified.
08:33 masak STD.pm calls _something_ assertion:sym<+>. it might be that one.
08:34 masak no, wait. it's gotta be quantifier:sym<+>.
08:34 masak wonder what the assertion thing is.
08:35 azawawi masak: like i said going simple :)
08:35 masak yes, I'm all for simple too. that's my default design criterion. :)
08:36 masak but I think using the grammatical categories of STD.pm would be a good way to label things.
08:36 masak we need to do that anyway, to separate the different forms of operators.
08:38 azawawi one thing while looking at STD, it does not go deeper than a literal; so it does not say this is a decimal_literal or a hex_literal...
08:40 azawawi moritz_: when will rakudo be able to run STD.pm? what is stopping it at the moment?
08:40 masak azawawi: I believe protoregexes is one big blocker.
08:40 masak STD.pm uses them liberally.
08:41 meppl joined #perl6
08:42 moritz_ and LTM
08:43 masak oh, right.
08:43 masak azawawi: I bet the Rakudo ROADMAP details the things missing quite well.
08:45 moritz_ btw 1) I compiled parrot and rakudo with clang on llvm. it works when configured --without-gmp, but a few tests fail
08:46 moritz_ 2) when I add Perl 6 multis of operators the setting, I get a Null PMC Acess in find_method
08:50 azawawi std: eval { };
08:50 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«ok 00:02 36m␤»
08:50 azawawi rakudo: eval "this is right";
08:50 p6eval rakudo 1b06df:  ( no output )
08:51 azawawi is eval a routine (part of the settings)?
08:55 masak azawawi: I sense a slight confusion of terminology in your question.
08:55 masak azawawi: eval is a sub AFAIK, and hence a routine.
08:56 masak azawawi: it's more common to talk about 'the setting' in singular, and I'm not sure it's specified what's part of it. by my understanding, that's up to individual implementations.
08:57 masak in the case of Rakudo, eval is not in the setting.
08:57 masak it's defined in src/builtins/control.pir
08:58 azawawi masak: you sensed right :)
08:58 masak (which, by the way, surprises me every time. I'd think a much likelier candidate would be src/builtins/eval.pir)
08:58 azawawi rakudo: eval { };
08:58 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«Parameter type check failed on call to 'eval'.␤in Main (/tmp/lWAie5uf7g:2)␤»
09:00 moritz_ that's now written as try { ... };
09:01 moritz_ rakudo: multi eval(Int $a) { say $a}; eval 3;
09:01 p6eval rakudo 1b06df:  ( no output )
09:02 azawawi i know but shouldnt STD/rakudo flag it as an error or something?
09:02 moritz_ azawawi: it's a run time error
09:02 azawawi moritz_: from S04, ...Perl 6's eval function only evaluates strings, not blocks
09:02 moritz_ which STD.pm doesn't handle in any way, and rakudo does ist (mostly) correctly
09:03 moritz_ azawawi: right, that's why you gute a "Parameter type check" failure
09:03 moritz_ azawawi: the parser doesn't know about eval, and doesn't have to
09:03 azawawi moritz: i get it
09:03 * azawawi hits his forehead
09:06 moritz_ it seems today is the first day of YAPC::NA
09:06 masak moritz_++ # work on '...' operator
09:07 azawawi @karma
09:07 lambdabot You have a karma of 160
09:07 moritz_ masak: today I also tried to add multis for infix:<eqv> (which is already parsed), same failure
09:07 eMaX joined #perl6
09:07 masak @karma
09:07 lambdabot You have a karma of 224
09:08 moritz_ http://yapc10.org/yn2009/talk/2101 "Expect the unexpected." - like, a complete Perl 6 implementation?
09:08 masak moritz_: yes, multis are not quite there yet.
09:10 moritz_ it severly limits the usefulness of the setting, sadly
09:16 moritz_ I think we've reached the point where most built-ins that can easily be written as subs and methods are already implemented
09:16 masak some kind of saturation. maybe.
09:16 moritz_ next should be operators (blocking on said error) and implementation types
09:16 masak a few things are eagerly awaiting laziness. :)
09:17 moritz_ I don't know what you need to get implementation types done
09:17 bsb joined #perl6
09:19 moritz_ masak: btw I saw your Druid+3D post. VeryB cool.
09:19 moritz_ s/B//
09:19 masak :)
09:19 masak I should have done that long ago.
09:19 masak there's nothing especially tricky involved.
09:20 * viklund wonders why S02 is so looong
09:21 moritz_ viklund_: because it explains the syntax, not just "bits and pieces"
09:21 masak maybe we should rename it.
09:21 masak S03, S05, and S06 are almost as long.
09:23 viklund I decided I should read all the synopses at least once
09:23 viklund I'm halfway through S02 now
09:23 masak I did that when I was home for Christmas.
09:24 masak boy, have things happened since then.
09:24 masak I remember feeling a sincere urge to update S29 at the time.
09:24 masak that was before S32.
09:24 viklund ;)
09:24 masak I bet S32 is still incomplete, by the way.
09:28 viklund incomplete in what sense?
09:28 masak viklund: that things mentioned in the rest of the synopses are missing in S32.
09:28 masak that's only a feeling, though.
09:28 viklund ok, that's what I thought you meant
09:30 payload joined #perl6
09:32 kst joined #perl6
09:55 bacek joined #perl6
10:30 bacek joined #perl6
10:42 Whiteknight joined #perl6
10:59 mizioumt joined #perl6
11:02 masak after the latest discussion on Str and Buf, can we say anything more about .pack and .unpack?
11:02 masak should .unpack only be defined on Buf?
11:03 moritz_ presumably, yes
11:03 moritz_ and pack() should return a Buf
11:03 masak right.
11:03 b_jonas joined #perl6
11:04 masak could there be an .unpack() method on Str, if that Str knows how it was encoded, or if the encoding is provided as an argument?
11:04 moritz_ you mean one that does the same as $str.encode.unpack?
11:05 masak essentially, yes.
11:05 masak maybe that's overkill.
11:05 moritz_ the more I think about Perl 6 design the more I regret that multi dispatch doesn't have to consider named arguments
11:05 moritz_ they'd make some things so much neater
11:07 masak moritz_: I looked through STD today. seems it uses multi dispatch on named arguments.
11:08 moritz_ masak: have an example?
11:08 zpmorgan joined #perl6
11:09 masak moritz_: aye, the things starting at line 4809.
11:09 masak that's multiple declarations of the method 'tweak', each with a different named parameter.
11:09 moritz_ aye
11:10 masak (also, with a useless/inecplicable comment on top)
11:10 masak "begin tweaks" -- yes, I can see that.
11:10 moritz_ that might be for gimme5
11:10 masak oh.
11:11 masak it's definitely some kind of magic.
11:12 moritz_ TimToady: see discussion above. multi method tweak(:$named_param) (found in STD.pm:4809) is not a requirement for Perl 6 - is it some kind of temporary hack?
11:13 masak moritz_: your suspicion about gimme5 seems correct. on line 667 it matches against 'multi method tweak'.
11:14 moritz_ ok
11:14 b_jonas heh
11:14 b_jonas I just found an old quote from this channel on irseek
11:14 moritz_ please share
11:14 b_jonas from 2007-01-27
11:15 b_jonas "TimToady:  cbstream.rb is the irc gateway that's feeding PerlMonks' chatterbox to #cbstream on freenode."
11:15 b_jonas "TimToady:  anyway, the implicit cbstream.rb challenge is at http://www.perlmonks.org/?node_id=596867"
11:15 b_jonas "TimToady:  seems like a good chance to see how async {...} works"
11:15 b_jonas "TimToady:  and, of course, to show how much prettier Perl 6 is... :)"
11:16 b_jonas of course, since then it's become easier to write this kind of thing in perl5 because now Coro is more stable and there are three Coro-able http client modules, unlike when I started to write cbstream
11:17 b_jonas I'm still unsure what language I shall use when I rewrite cbstream (it's a long-term plan only, vaporware)
11:17 b_jonas probably whatever I fancy when I actually start rewriting it
11:18 araujo http://hpaste.org/fastcgi/hp​aste.fcgi/view?id=6143#a6143
11:18 araujo tiny stack based language i am working on
11:18 * araujo just got quicksort working!
11:18 b_jonas how does that work?
11:19 araujo b_jonas, you mean?, the flow of the computation?
11:19 b_jonas no, the language
11:19 araujo oh
11:19 b_jonas what do those punctuation mean
11:19 araujo it is a stack based language
11:19 b_jonas the %% and &% and &
11:19 araujo right
11:19 araujo it is what i call ... operator-message composition
11:19 b_jonas + appends two arrays, right?
11:19 araujo correct
11:20 araujo so, % is an operator that means 'dup' or duplicate the value in the stack
11:20 araujo so
11:20 araujo %%head means , dup dup head
11:20 araujo & is swap
11:20 araujo and so on
11:20 b_jonas oh
11:21 b_jonas and what does the (<) o do?
11:21 b_jonas wait, I think o is composition
11:21 araujo the language is what I call .. a stack based object oriented language
11:21 b_jonas and you push that function for filter?
11:21 araujo correct b_jonas !
11:21 b_jonas or something
11:21 araujo correct
11:21 b_jonas but what's bk then
11:22 araujo what i am about to explain
11:22 araujo the language works with blocks
11:22 b_jonas oh, it's postscript-like
11:22 araujo like the smalltalk blocks
11:22 b_jonas so you can just use a constant
11:22 donaldh joined #perl6
11:22 araujo blocks are units of delayed computations
11:22 b_jonas and composing means making a function of two executable objects
11:22 b_jonas makes sense
11:22 araujo right
11:22 araujo :)
11:22 b_jonas funny
11:23 kst joined #perl6
11:23 b_jonas and how does the definition part works? is it the dot that assigns the function to the name qsort or something?
11:23 araujo blocks are kind of delayed computations delayed ... they are also the way to define 'functions' and stuff
11:23 araujo correct b_jonas
11:23 araujo qsort [ .... ] .
11:24 araujo the [ ] is multi-line block
11:24 b_jonas does this still work if qsort already has the same value?
11:24 araujo the ( ) is single-line block
11:24 araujo they are the same
11:24 b_jonas or so you have to quote qsort in that case?
11:24 b_jonas hmm, [] and () is the same?
11:24 b_jonas strange
11:24 araujo yeah, because of the nature of the language
11:24 araujo well
11:25 araujo [ ] is for multi-line
11:25 araujo ( ) single line
11:25 araujo you can get that quicksort example in a single line with ( )
11:25 b_jonas so how do variables work?
11:26 lichtkind joined #perl6
11:26 araujo well, so far ... the language contains what i call links ... it links a stack to a specific name
11:26 b_jonas I don't really like this postscript-like execution when data can just stand in stead of code and is pushed
11:27 araujo i am mixing some ideas here, ideas from stack based languages and object-oriented languages
11:27 araujo everything is an object, and the main object representation is a Stack
11:27 araujo when you say something like:
11:27 araujo qsort [ ] .
11:27 b_jonas so what's the plan? you write an interpreter then put up an evalbot and evangelize everyone to the language by showing with it how some programs can be written more easily in this language? (great way to get kicked out of all channels)
11:28 araujo qsort is a symbol pointing to a stack containing a block
11:28 b_jonas and then... how do you call that function on a list or array or something?
11:28 araujo not really interested to .. evangelize really , just commenting in the channels i know there are people interested on designing languages
11:28 b_jonas how do you even create an array and print it
11:28 araujo i am not really interested on competition , but fun
11:29 araujo like this:
11:29 moritz_ araujo++ # very nice attitude
11:29 araujo { 2 3 87 3 4 387 38 2 } qsort
11:29 araujo then you get the list sorted
11:29 araujo moritz_, :)
11:29 masak moritz_: we'll soon be hitting 400 new/open tickets! \o/
11:29 azawawi std: my @a; @a[-1];
11:29 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Obsolete use of [-1] subscript to access final element; in Perl 6 please use [*-1] instead at /tmp/CGm1vUDph7 line 1:␤------> [32mmy @a; @a[-1][31m;[0m␤FAILED 00:02 38m␤»
11:30 azawawi std: my @a; @a[ -1 ];
11:30 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«ok 00:02 38m␤»
11:30 moritz_ masak: I'll do my very best
11:30 masak :)
11:30 masak Geburtstag.
11:30 azawawi moritz_: does whitespace matter in [-1]  warning?
11:30 azawawi rakudo: my @a; @a[ -1 ];
11:30 p6eval rakudo 1b06df:  ( no output )
11:30 moritz_ I've always wondered if that message doesn't collide with custom array indexes
11:30 azawawi rakudo: my @a; @a[-1];
11:30 masak std: use v5; my $x = 'foo '; $x .= 'bar';
11:31 p6eval rakudo 1b06df:  ( no output )
11:31 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«Potential difficulties:␤  Possible obsolete use of .= as append operator; in Perl 6 please use ~= instead at /tmp/rG4gukX47o line 1:␤------> [32muse v5; my $x = 'foo '; $x .= [31m'bar';[0m␤ok 00:02 37m␤»
11:31 moritz_ azawawi: it seems to, yes
11:31 azawawi so it is an std bug right? :)
11:31 moritz_ I'm not sure.
11:31 azawawi std: my @a; @a[ -1];
11:31 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«ok 00:02 38m␤»
11:32 azawawi std: my @a; @a[-1 ];
11:32 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«ok 00:02 38m␤»
11:32 moritz_ it might be intential
11:32 azawawi std: my @a; @a[ -1 ];
11:32 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«ok 00:02 38m␤»
11:32 masak intentional, even.
11:32 moritz_ aye :-)
11:32 masak TimToady: bug above?
11:32 TimToady nope
11:32 masak whoa!
11:32 azawawi really? :)
11:32 masak don't sneak up on me like that!
11:33 TimToady which one?
11:33 TimToady the v5 one is unimpl
11:33 masak @a[-1] giving a warning, but not @a[ -1 ]
11:33 lambdabot Unknown command, try @list
11:33 TimToady yes, that's intentional
11:33 masak lambdabot: oh, shut up.
11:33 masak TimToady: what's the rationale?
11:33 * azawawi listens
11:33 moritz_ allowing @a[ -1 ] when custom array indexes are defined?
11:34 TimToady just leaving wiggle room
11:34 TimToady could generalize later when we do more semantic analysis
11:34 masak not sure I understand. wiggle room for making mistakes?
11:34 TimToady but for now, any bogus p5 code will likely use [-1]
11:35 moritz_ TimToady: so how's YAPC going?
11:35 TimToady and we're only dealing in probabilities
11:35 moritz_ did you alread hold your keynote?
11:35 TimToady I'm still writing my talk, so I shouldn't be here
11:35 moritz_ oh :-)
11:35 masak don't let us keep you. :)
11:35 TimToady but if you want to be on the screen in a bit under two hours...
11:36 TimToady in fact, I'm giving a talk about error messages
11:36 masak yes, STD.pm is leading in the field on that.
11:36 TimToady so I might show std: to them
11:37 moritz_ uhm, it looks much better on an ordinary terminal
11:37 TimToady I went through all the panics, obs, worrys to see if I could actually produce them
11:37 TimToady so think of it as a down payment on some error testing
11:37 masak TimToady: you should have a test suite or something.
11:37 TimToady what a concept
11:37 TimToady but it's hard for an error message to run itself and spit out "ok"  :)
11:38 moritz_ throw some X::Syntax::Redeclaration error objects or whatever
11:38 masak ah, the old 'if you try to fail and fail, what have you done?' paradox.
11:38 moritz_ and then type-check
11:39 TimToady moritz_: std does not execute anything, how can it throw? :)
11:39 moritz_ TimToady: with die() :-)
11:40 moritz_ it won't be catchable from within Perl 6 code for now
11:40 masak I'm running teststd right now. I'm getting a few failures.
11:40 moritz_ but from the perl 5 code which runs STD.pm
11:41 payload1 joined #perl6
11:44 s1n1 joined #perl6
11:45 moritz_ rakudo: say 1
11:45 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«sh: ./perl6: No such file or directory␤»
11:48 Whiteknight joined #perl6
11:48 moritz_ rakudo: sub postfix:<..>(Str $x) { $x.subst(rx{ / <-[/]>+ $ }, '') }; say "/foo/bar/baz"..
11:48 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«Statement not terminated properly at line 2, near "(rx{ / <-["␤in Main (src/gen_setting.pm:0)␤»
11:49 moritz_ rakudo: sub postfix:<..>(Str $x) { $x.subst(rx{ \/ <-[/]>+ $ }, '') }; say "/foo/bar/baz"..
11:49 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«Statement not terminated properly at line 2, near ".."␤in Main (src/gen_setting.pm:0)␤»
11:49 moritz_ hm. ENOLTM (LTM = longest token matching)
11:49 moritz_ der probiert das als "string". und dann methodenname zu parsen
11:49 ejs1 joined #perl6
11:50 moritz_ sorrz, wrong language
11:50 moritz_ and wrong channel :-)
11:50 moritz_ std: sub postfix:<..>(Str $x) { $x.subst(rx{ \/ <-[/]>+ $ }, '') }; say "/foo/bar/baz"..
11:50 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«ok 00:06 50m␤»
11:51 twigil joined #perl6
11:51 b_jonas std: sub parentdir(Str $x) { $x.subst(rx{ \/ <-[/]>+ $ }, '') }; say parentdir("/foo/bar/baz")
11:51 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«ok 00:04 42m␤»
11:52 moritz_ rakudo: sub parentdir(Str $x) { $x.subst(rx{ \/ <-[/]>+ $ }, '') }; say parentdir("/foo/bar/baz")
11:52 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«/foo/bar␤»
11:55 hanekomu joined #perl6
11:57 b_jonas I guess in perl6 you'll be actually able to define a greeting-suffix context so the statement 'good localtime' can work because good evaluates its argument in greeting-suffix context
11:58 wayland76 I had a ENOLTM a bit ago too, I suspect; it didn't no proto token whatever rules, and IIRC those depend on LTM :)
11:59 azawawi std: rand(10);
11:59 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Obsolete use of rand(N); in Perl 6 please use N.rand or (1..N).pick instead at /tmp/XxGfKnF6uX line 1:␤------> [32mrand[31m(10);[0m␤FAILED 00:02 35m␤»
11:59 azawawi std: 1..10..rand;
11:59 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤".." is not associative at /tmp/1xChtiH2ti line 1:␤------> [32m1..10..[31mrand;[0m␤    expecting any of:␤        infix__S_364DotDot␤       whitespace␤FAILED 00:02 36m␤»
12:00 azawawi std: 1..10.rand;
12:00 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«ok 00:02 36m␤»
12:02 masak azawawi: though that parses as 1..(10.rand), methinks.
12:02 azawawi masak: i noticed
12:03 b_jonas I guess so
12:03 * azawawi prepares another batch of quick fixes for release :)
12:03 b_jonas that's why you have to write (1..10).each in ruby all the time
12:03 masak method-call '.' binds really tightly. I guess that's sane.
12:04 b_jonas yep
12:04 b_jonas and .. has to bind weakly so 1 .. $x - 1 works
12:04 moritz_ right
12:04 b_jonas though there you'd just write 1 ..^ $x of course
12:05 moritz_ that's what I just wanted to write, but b_jonas was faster :-)
12:05 b_jonas but in general you sometimes want + and - stuff
12:05 moritz_ b_jonas: note that that's not the same
12:05 moritz_ rakudo: say 1..2 ~~ 2.5
12:05 azawawi another interesting whitespace case
12:05 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«0␤»
12:05 azawawi std: rand( 10 )
12:05 moritz_ rakudo: say 1..^3 ~~ 2.5
12:05 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«ok 00:02 36m␤»
12:05 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«0␤»
12:05 moritz_ uhm, shouldn't the last one say 1 instead?
12:05 b_jonas raduko: 1..5 ~~ 2.5
12:06 azawawi TimToady: rand(10) and rand( 10 ) give different warnings
12:06 masak moritz_: no, I don't think so.
12:06 b_jonas rakudo: 1..5 ~~ 2.5
12:06 p6eval rakudo 1b06df:  ( no output )
12:06 moritz_ rakudo: say 1..5 ~~ 2.5
12:06 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«0␤»
12:06 moritz_ rakudo: say 1..5 ~~ 2
12:06 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«0␤»
12:07 moritz_ rakudo: say 2 ~~ 1..5
12:07 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«1␤»
12:07 moritz_ rakudo: say 2.5 ~~ 1..5
12:07 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«1␤»
12:07 moritz_ rakudo: say 2.5 ~~ 1..^3
12:07 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«1␤»
12:07 moritz_ that was the problem
12:07 moritz_ the range has to go on the right
12:07 moritz_ ("of course" :-)
12:07 b_jonas oh yeah, perl6' ~~ works the other way from ruby's ===
12:07 b_jonas rakuso: 2.5 ~~ 1..2
12:08 b_jonas rakudo: say 2.5 ~~ 1..2
12:08 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«0␤»
12:09 azawawi std: rand(10)
12:09 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Obsolete use of rand(N); in Perl 6 please use N.rand or (1..N).pick instead at /tmp/NCBYyoJ49q line 1:␤------> [32mrand[31m(10)[0m␤FAILED 00:02 35m␤»
12:09 azawawi std: rand( 10 )
12:09 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«ok 00:02 35m␤»
12:09 azawawi std: rand( 10)
12:09 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«ok 00:02 35m␤»
12:09 azawawi std: rand(10 )
12:09 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Obsolete use of rand(N); in Perl 6 please use N.rand or (1..N).pick instead at /tmp/LmQIg9HwJN line 1:␤------> [32mrand[31m(10 )[0m␤FAILED 00:02 35m␤»
12:12 * azawawi thinks leading whitespace causes warning to go on/off in rand(10)
12:13 azawawi std: rand (10)
12:13 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Syntax error (two terms in a row?) at /tmp/WyLbHPgTte line 1:␤------> [32mrand [31m(10)[0m␤    expecting any of:␤        infix or meta-infix␤      infix stopper␤    standard stopper␤ statement modifier loop␤  term__S_296rand␤  terminator␤FAILED 00:02
12:13 p6eval ..36m␤»
12:16 moritz_ std: ~ 1
12:16 p6eval std 27168: OUTPUT«ok 00:02 37m␤»
12:18 masak running teststd takes 31 minutes on my machine.
12:19 masak I get failures in 8 test files.
12:19 moritz_ I'm looking at these now
12:19 moritz_ some of them seem to be reall problems iin STD.pm
12:19 moritz_ some are plain sytanx errors
12:19 masak aye.
12:20 masak the one in t/spec//S06-advanced_subroutine_features/stub.t is a member of the former set, I believe.
12:20 moritz_ aye
12:23 pugs_svn r27169 | moritz++ | [t/spec] fix some problems found by STD.pm, TimToady++
12:25 Matt-W Afternoon
12:26 * masak tips hat
12:32 wayland76 rakudo: slurp("filename"};
12:32 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«Statement not terminated properly at line 2, near "(\"filename"␤in Main (src/gen_setting.pm:0)␤»
12:32 wayland76 rakudo: slurp("filename");
12:32 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«Unable to open filehandle from path 'filename'␤in Main (/tmp/Z8xqkrnCfh:2)␤»
12:33 moritz_ oh, slurp() is another one that should be forbidden in safe mode
12:33 bacek_ joined #perl6
12:33 wayland76 Hmm.  Looks like I need to update my rakudo again :(
12:33 Whiteknight joined #perl6
12:33 wayland76 I was just checking whether it gives a Null PMC access like mine does
12:36 zamolxes joined #perl6
12:37 wayland76 pmichaud: Regarding the makefile change, can you send me some kind of a link to your branch?  Preferably to somewhere where I can get it in standard diff format, but whatever works for you
12:37 wayland76 (I'm presuming here that he backlogs his own handle at least)
12:39 moritz_ git checkout origin/ins
12:39 moritz_ git diff master
12:41 pmurias joined #perl6
12:48 payload joined #perl6
12:49 alester joined #perl6
12:53 kst joined #perl6
12:56 azawawi std: (1 == 1) ?? 1 :: 2
12:57 p6eval std 27169: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Please use !! rather than :: at /tmp/OzLBOc5wlv line 1:␤------> [32m(1 == 1) ?? 1 [31m:: 2[0m␤    expecting any of:␤     infix or meta-infix␤      infix stopper␤    standard stopper␤ terminator␤FAILED 00:02 36m␤»
12:57 azawawi std: (1 == 1) ?? 1 !! 2
12:57 p6eval std 27169: OUTPUT«ok 00:02 36m␤»
12:57 azawawi std: #(1 == 1) ?? 1 !! 2
12:57 p6eval std 27169: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Syntax error (two terms in a row?) at /tmp/Fv7KLlnU9v line 1:␤------> [32m#(1 == 1) ?? 1 [31m!! 2[0m␤    expecting any of:␤      infix or meta-infix␤      infix stopper␤    infix_prefix_meta_operator␤       standard stopper␤ statement modifier loop␤
12:57 p6eval ..terminator␤FAILED 00:03…
12:57 s1n1 joined #perl6
12:58 azawawi rakudo: (1==1) ?? 1 !! 2
12:58 p6eval rakudo 1b06df:  ( no output )
12:58 azawawi rakudo: #(1==1) ?? 1 !! 2
12:58 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«Can't use embedded columns in column 1 at line 2, near "(1==1) ?? "␤in Main (src/gen_setting.pm:0)␤»
12:58 azawawi rakudo: # (1==1) ?? 1 !! 2
12:58 p6eval rakudo 1b06df:  ( no output )
12:58 azawawi what's wrong with #(1 == 1) ?? 1 :: 2 ?
12:59 azawawi shouldnt it be a comment?
13:00 azawawi moritz_: what's wrong with #(1 == 1) ?? 1 :: 2'
13:00 azawawi std: #(1 == 1) ??
13:01 p6eval std 27169: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Can't understand next input--giving up at /tmp/U5c7wHQE8M line 1:␤------> [32m[31m[0m␤    expecting noun␤FAILED 00:02 37m␤»
13:01 azawawi std: #(1 == 1) ?
13:01 p6eval std 27169: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Can't understand next input--giving up at /tmp/zvHHiyKdAn line 1:␤------> [32m[31m[0m␤    expecting noun␤FAILED 00:02 37m␤»
13:01 moritz_ azawawi: no, #( is forbidden at start of line
13:01 moritz_ azawawi: because it's ambigous - it could be either a line or a block comment
13:02 azawawi moritz_: but the error message was obscure
13:03 azawawi so in perl 6, if i want to "comment error line" quick fix; the best solution is to add a # and then a space before it...
13:04 moritz_ azawawi: right
13:04 moritz_ (to both)
13:04 frew joined #perl6
13:04 azawawi moritz_: where can i find more docs about that?
13:05 moritz_ azawawi: S02, I'd assume
13:06 masak S02:166.
13:07 gbacon joined #perl6
13:07 masak I've gotten into the habit of commenting out lines with two '##' instead of just one.
13:07 dalek rakudo: 6eb3554 | pmichaud++ | docs/spectest-progress.csv:
13:07 dalek rakudo: spectest-progress.csv update: 404 files, 11532 passing, 4 failing
13:07 dalek rakudo: Failure summary:
13:07 dalek rakudo:     S12-enums/basic.rakudo 27 - short name of the enum without parenthesis is an enum
13:07 dalek rakudo:     S32-num/rand.t aborted 3 test(s)
13:07 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/6​eb35549ec9fe7d507ba042c64d315fb0156e93b
13:07 masak every time I do that, I think "well, _I_ don't mind, but boy are people in general going to hate this..."
13:08 masak then again, it's not like I have an alternate solution.
13:13 pmurias TimToady: may i put a .gitignore in src/perl6?
13:15 moritz_ somehow the newer GD::Graph versions don't seem to use the full width of the drawing area
13:19 dalek rakudo: 0677565 | moritz++ | tools/progress-graph.pl:
13:19 dalek rakudo: [tools/progress-graph.pl] better label spacing
13:19 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/0​677565135d00bd037b0c1306fe696b079c036c8
13:19 masak moritz_++
13:20 masak I've been looking at the progress graph and thinking about that spacing from time to time. moritz_ JFDIs.
13:20 moritz_ actually I've been anoyed for quite some time now.
13:21 moritz_ most annoying is that without any option GD::Graph tries to plots *all* captions
13:21 pmurias rakudo: &infix:<\<>
13:21 p6eval rakudo 1b06df:  ( no output )
13:22 masak moritz_: aye, that's an ungood default.
13:24 skids joined #perl6
13:25 synth joined #perl6
13:25 sitaram joined #perl6
13:27 synthEEEE joined #perl6
13:27 s1n1 masak, moritz_: has there been an effort to use smolder instead?
13:28 moritz_ s1n: I think I saw that that on somebody's TODO list
13:28 masak rakudo: class Month {}
13:28 p6eval rakudo 1b06df:  ( no output )
13:29 masak std: subset A of Int;
13:29 p6eval std 27169: OUTPUT«ok 00:02 35m␤»
13:29 masak rakudo: subset A of Int;
13:29 p6eval rakudo 1b06df: OUTPUT«Statement not terminated properly at line 2, near "of Int;"␤in Main (src/gen_setting.pm:0)␤»
13:29 * masak submits rakudobug
13:30 Whiteknight joined #perl6
13:39 b_jonas so how many of you are on that YAPC::NA conference/
13:39 sitaram left #perl6
13:40 * kolibrie is at YAPC::NA
13:41 * s1n_yapc obviously
13:41 * moritz_ not, sadly
13:42 s1n_yapc moritz_: if no one is working it, i might be interested
13:42 * masak also not, also sadly
13:43 pmurias moritz_: will you be at YAPC::EU?
13:44 azawawi std: 42 ?? 1,2,3 Z 4,5,6 !! 1,2,3 X 4,5,6;
13:44 p6eval std 27169: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Precedence too loose within ??!!; use ??()!! instead  at /tmp/9kk3J7TVFt line 1:␤------> [32m42 ?? 1[31m,2,3 Z 4,5,6 !! 1,2,3 X 4,5,6;[0m␤    expecting any of:␤ POST␤   infix or meta-infix␤        infix or meta-infix (with precedence tighter than item
13:44 p6eval ..assignment)…
13:44 moritz_ pmurias: also not, also sadly
13:44 azawawi std: 42 ?? 1,2,3 Z 4,5,6 !! (1,2,3 X 4,5,6);
13:44 p6eval std 27169: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Precedence too loose within ??!!; use ??()!! instead  at /tmp/wGnxCKdDpG line 1:␤------> [32m42 ?? 1[31m,2,3 Z 4,5,6 !! (1,2,3 X 4,5,6);[0m␤    expecting any of:␤       POST␤   infix or meta-infix␤        infix or meta-infix (with precedence tighter
13:44 p6eval ..than item assignmen…
13:44 pmurias moritz_: why?
13:44 azawawi std: 42 ?? (1,2,3 Z 4,5,6) !! 1,2,3 X 4,5,6;
13:44 p6eval std 27169: OUTPUT«ok 00:02 37m␤»
13:44 masak moritz_: that _is_ sad. how will we ever meet if you keep not showing up at conventions? :)
13:45 moritz_ pmurias: time constraints :(
13:45 moritz_ masak: I'll try very hard next year, I promise!
13:45 masak you'd better.
13:45 masak these things add up, you know.
13:45 masak :P
13:46 moritz_ and I did show up at german perl workshop '08, and met jnthn
13:46 twigil joined #perl6
13:48 masak that's something, I guess.
13:51 bacek_ joined #perl6
13:52 KyleHa joined #perl6
13:57 PacoLinux joined #perl6
14:04 meppuru joined #perl6
14:05 finanalyst moritz_: i found GD::Graph had problems. are you porting to perl6?
14:06 azawawi masak: List of new quick fixes so far: http://padre.perlide.org/trac/log/tr​unk/Padre-Plugin-Perl6/lib/Padre/Plu​gin/Perl6/Perl6Document.pm?rev=5470
14:07 moritz_ finanalyst: no, I'm using to generaate graphs :-)
14:07 finanalyst moritz_: i also tried the procedure on your blog to make an executable. it did not work, even in rakudo directory.
14:08 moritz_ finanalyst: in particular the one on rakudo.de is not wide enough
14:08 finanalyst moritz_: for graphs, i found ploticus to be easier
14:08 moritz_ finanalyst: I know, that broke a few days after I posted it :-(.
14:08 azawawi finanalyst: http://rt.perl.org/rt3/Publi​c/Bug/Display.html?id=65994
14:09 masak azawawi: nice! KUTGW.
14:09 azawawi moritz_: not fair, i wrote gui for that :)
14:10 masak no-one said it would be fair.
14:10 finanalyst but precompiling modules into PIR does work!
14:11 finanalyst i really would like some way of generating graphical output from perl6.
14:12 finanalyst presently, i generate a ploticus script, then run it
14:12 moritz_ like, rendering SVG? :-)
14:12 b_jonas how about gnuplot?
14:12 iblechbot joined #perl6
14:12 moritz_ there are opengl bindings for parrot
14:12 moritz_ with some effort they should be usable from Perl 6
14:12 ejs joined #perl6
14:13 b_jonas eg. http://www.perlmonks.com/index.pl?node_id=740055
14:13 * finanalyst looking to see opengl bindings
14:14 finanalyst b_jonas: to use gnuplot from perl6, you need to generate a script, then run the script. I found ploticus easier to use to generate what I needed.
14:15 TimToady everyone say hi to YAPC::NA
14:15 kolibrie hi YAPC!
14:15 s1n_yapc big screen hello
14:15 moritz_ rakudo: say "OH HAI"
14:16 p6eval rakudo 067756: OUTPUT«OH HAI␤»
14:16 s1n_yapc moritz_: now you're at yapc::na
14:16 masak YAPC: \o
14:16 moritz_ s1n_yapc: kinda.
14:16 finanalyst hi YAPC::NA
14:16 pmurias hi ;)
14:16 b_jonas hi YAPC
14:16 masak weather is beautiful, wish we were there.
14:16 frew Hello YAPC!
14:17 deafferret joined #perl6
14:17 moritz_ you see, we're not only lurkers in here :-)
14:17 deafferret HI YAPC! (jhannah)
14:17 deafferret oh, bummer. missed the projector
14:17 masak moritz_: or, at least, this is how you bring the lurkers out. :)
14:17 s1n_yapc moritz_: that's right, some of us like to be annoying on the big screen :)
14:17 frew haha, sucker
14:17 deafferret why isn't this on irc.perl.org?
14:17 masak deafferret: for hysterical raisins.
14:18 moritz_ deafferret: 1) historical reasons 2) to not encapsulate ourselves too much
14:18 pmichaud joined #perl6
14:18 pmurias freenode is considered friendlier
14:18 masak hi pm.
14:18 moritz_ ask audreyt, she created it (I think)
14:18 wigfield joined #perl6
14:18 frew ...
14:18 b_jonas I think it depends on where the evalbots are
14:19 b_jonas well in the start at least
14:19 moritz_ my evalbot is both on freenode on irc.perl.org, so that's not an issue
14:20 masak moritz_: I'm not 100% sure, but I think #perl6 might predate audreyt.
14:20 stDavid joined #perl6
14:20 masak but I wasn't there in the very-very beginning, just after a month or so of audreyt's appearance.
14:20 b_jonas I see
14:21 alester joined #perl6
14:21 s1n_yapc is TimToady is going to code in his keynote?
14:22 masak s1n_yapc: he said he's to talk about errors.
14:23 KyleHa I hope talking about errors isn't a mistake.
14:23 payload1 joined #perl6
14:24 azawawi is there going to be a video of TimToady's speech?
14:25 finanalyst is it online now?
14:25 moritz_ maybe on yapc.tv
14:25 ejs1 joined #perl6
14:26 azawawi cool
14:26 payload joined #perl6
14:27 donaldh left #perl6
14:28 kst joined #perl6
14:28 finanalyst doesnt seem to be
14:28 b_jonas maybe he'll upload some text or slides
14:30 rfordinal joined #perl6
14:33 finanalyst i'm trying to use parrot from the rakudo installation, specifically to run ./parrot examples/opengl/shapes.pir but getting "error:imcc:No such file or directory". Should I have something else installed?
14:35 moritz_ finanalyst: that seems like a bug... care to ask on #parrot?
14:35 s1n_yapc masak: yup, error messages
14:36 finanalyst moritz_: just checking. trying to find an opengl example that works
14:37 moritz_ opengl_defines.pasm is missing.
14:38 moritz_ finanalyst: ah, it might get generated by Configure.pl if it detects your opengl installation correctly
14:38 ejs1 joined #perl6
14:38 finanalyst so if I dont have it, then opengl not detected?
14:39 sitaram joined #perl6
14:39 ruoso joined #perl6
14:39 moritz_ presumably.
14:39 sitaram left #perl6
14:40 moritz_ auto::opengl -        Does your platform support OpenGL....................no.
14:40 moritz_ on one of my machines
14:40 moritz_ which is why there's no such file
14:41 pmurias ruoso: hi
14:41 ruoso Hello!
14:41 finanalyst i have ubuntu and seem to have opengl installed
14:41 finanalyst but not dev files.
14:42 masak announcement: proto, the extremely humble installer, now defaults to fetching Rakudo Pittsburgh.
14:44 masak ,,,and it fails (!) to install on my box.
14:44 ruoso hi pmurias
14:44 masak that's not good.
14:46 s1n_yapc rakudo: #{ }
14:46 p6eval rakudo 067756: OUTPUT«sh: ./perl6: No such file or directory␤»
14:46 s1n_yapc ouch
14:46 s1n_yapc no build?
14:47 masak s1n_yapc: it comes and goes, rebuilds every hour.
14:49 s1n_yapc masak: it should build elsewhere and copy over the old one
14:49 masak s1n_yapc: indeed. patches welcome.
14:53 s1n_yapc masak: what exactly would i be patching?
14:53 masak s1n_yapc: the build process, I guess.
14:54 masak but it occurs to me now that those build scripts might not be puclicly accessible.
14:55 pugs_svn r27170 | pmurias++ | [re-smop] infix + < == and != are multis
14:55 pugs_svn r27170 | pmurias++ | started creating Test.pm
14:55 pugs_svn r27170 | pmurias++ | started working on ModuleLoader
14:55 s1n_yapc masak: then i can't patch anything
14:55 ruoso pmurias, that looks promising ;)
14:55 masak s1n_yapc: no. sorry, I was too quick. please patch something else. :)
14:56 masak s1n_yapc: in return, I'll try and have a look at the build process.
14:56 ruoso pmurias, you added the .so in svn
14:56 s1n_yapc masak: that's fine, i dont have a feather account, so i can't really help
14:56 s1n_yapc not without the source anyways
14:56 masak s1n_yapc: p6eval isn't on feather.
14:57 s1n_yapc masak: where is it?
14:57 sri_kraih_ joined #perl6
14:57 pugs_svn r27171 | pmurias++ | [re-smop] .so files have no place in the repo
14:57 masak on timtowtdi.org
14:57 s1n_yapc wow, never knew about that site
14:58 pmurias ruoso: i'm having my uni end-of-term exams atm so my gsoc project is progressing slowly atm
14:58 ruoso pmurias, I think it's ok... since we're doing much better than I initially expected
15:01 pmurias in a couple of days i'll have much more time so it should progress faster
15:02 ruoso pmurias, btw... Test.pm won't need to have the $LexicalPrelude{...} thing
15:03 ruoso I think at the time we have Test.pm, we'll also have "is export" working too
15:03 TimToady rakudo: say "\c[WHITE SMILING FACE]"
15:03 p6eval rakudo 067756: OUTPUT«☺␤»
15:03 Whiteknight TimToady++
15:03 phenny Whiteknight: 21 Jun 12:56Z <masak> tell Whiteknight yes, I'm coming to YAPC::EU. will do a talk about Web.pm.
15:05 ejs0 joined #perl6
15:05 * ruoso moved back from Lisbon to Brasil right before a YAPC there... what a shame...
15:11 hercynium joined #perl6
15:13 pmurias ruoso: that Test.pm works a bit
15:14 ruoso pmurias, I see... but I mean... you're installing the symbols in the CORE...
15:14 nihiliad joined #perl6
15:19 skids ruoso: FWIW, on smop install, you can get most of the libs in debian now through libhugs packages.  Sid currently has some version issues with the "network" library, but almost there without any local packages.
15:20 ruoso skids, there are only two libs that are installed locally I think
15:20 ruoso zip
15:20 donaldh joined #perl6
15:21 skids zip can be got by package now.
15:21 ruoso and some other I don't recall right now
15:21 ruoso ah... right... in sid...
15:22 skids Right now the only thing holding back pure-package install is that libghc6-network requires an older version of ghc than what is installed, and ghc won't find the hugs version of "network" library for some reason.
15:23 pmurias skids: doesn't libhugs imply hugsiness?
15:23 skids There's "bundle" packages that autoinstall stuff.
15:24 deafferret left #perl6
15:25 pmurias hugs and ghc are seperate implementations, and i can't imagine them being binary compatible
15:26 pmurias there seems to be a lighc-utf8-string-dev package and that's the only library we use
15:27 finanalyst moritz_: ping
15:29 skids pmurias: well, if that's the case then someone screwed up because pugs config picks up hugs libraries after the packages are installed.
15:30 * skids hasn't actually had time to fix the network lib and try a build yet.
15:30 pmurias maybe the hugs ones are not compiled...
15:32 pmurias ruoso: re Test exporting stuff do we have the way it should be implemented worked out?
15:33 ruoso pmurias, there's still the issue about the pacakge
15:35 rfordinal joined #perl6
15:36 skids ruoso: you won't take offense if I clean up some english grammar as I read through things, right? :-)
15:37 ruoso skids, on the contraire... I'd appreciate it
15:42 justatheory joined #perl6
15:44 pmurias skids: what are you reading through?
15:47 kst joined #perl6
15:54 stDavid joined #perl6
15:56 rindolf joined #perl6
15:56 rindolf Hi all.
15:56 rindolf In Firefox 3.0.x the CSS here is all wrong - http://rakudo.org/how-to-get-rakudo
15:56 rindolf On Linux at least.
15:56 rindolf I mean in the buttons at the upper nav-menu.
16:04 azawawi joined #perl6
16:09 PerlJam rindolf: It looks fine for me until you get a window below a certain width, then it looks messed up.
16:11 rindolf PerlJam: oh, I see.
16:11 rindolf Well, my browser window is pretty wide at the moment.
16:12 PerlJam that certain width looks to be about 1005 pixels.  Above that, it looks fine.
16:13 Psyche^ joined #perl6
16:14 rfordinal joined #perl6
16:17 azawawi what's the difference between +> and ~> ?
16:18 azawawi std: 2 >> 1;
16:18 p6eval std 27171: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Obsolete use of >> to do right shift; in Perl 6 please use +> or ~> instead at /tmp/DkWqQmpNKQ line 1:␤------> [32m2 >> [31m1;[0m␤FAILED 00:02 36m␤»
16:18 azawawi rakudo: 2 +> 1;
16:18 p6eval rakudo 067756:  ( no output )
16:19 azawawi rakudo: say 2 +> 1;
16:19 p6eval rakudo 067756: OUTPUT«1␤»
16:19 azawawi rakudo: say 2 ~> 1;
16:19 mtkatwork joined #perl6
16:19 mtkatwork left #perl6
16:19 p6eval rakudo 067756: OUTPUT«Could not find non-existent sub infix:~>␤»
16:22 pmurias azawawi: one is a numeric and the other string bit shift
16:23 azawawi pmurias: can u give me an example of the second one?
16:24 pmurias rakudo: say 100 ~> 2
16:24 p6eval rakudo 067756: OUTPUT«Could not find non-existent sub infix:~>␤»
16:25 pmurias azawawi: it shifts all the bits in a string
16:25 pmurias pugs: say 100 ~> 2
16:25 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT«␤»
16:25 pmurias pugs: say 100 +> 2
16:25 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT«25␤»
16:26 donaldh left #perl6
16:27 azawawi pugs: say 1000 ~> 2
16:27 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT«␤»
16:27 azawawi pugs: say "1000" ~> 2
16:27 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT«␤»
16:27 azawawi pugs: say "1000" ~> 0
16:27 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT«1000␤»
16:27 azawawi pugs: say "1000" ~> 1
16:27 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT«␤»
16:29 stDavid joined #perl6
16:30 azawawi pmurias: thx
16:33 moritz_ finanalyst: pong
16:33 finanalyst moritz_: thanx for responding.
16:33 finanalyst moritz_: about OpenGL and parrot, there is no one on #parrot to talk to :(
16:34 finanalyst could you help a little?
16:35 finanalyst i got a window to open with one of the parrot examples, but nothing appeared in the window
16:36 moritz_ finanalyst: I don't really know much about it... a mail to the parrot list (including output from Configure.pl) might be more helpful
16:37 finanalyst ok, i'll do that.
16:41 ejs joined #perl6
16:44 REPLeffect joined #perl6
16:45 payload joined #perl6
16:46 KyleHa I'm looking at the bug #66840 that came in on perl6-compiler.  The test I came up with is:  eval_dies_ok q[ 1 ?? 2,3 !! 4,5 ], 'Ternary error (bug #66840)';
16:46 KyleHa Even that makes rakudo upchuck and die, so I'd have to fudge it with a skip, right?
16:47 moritz_ KyleHa: exactly
16:47 moritz_ t/spec/S03-operators/precedence.t would be a good place for a test
16:47 KyleHa Is it OK to put that in the file with the other ternary op tests, or...Oh, thanks!
16:48 moritz_ that would also be fine.
16:48 moritz_ there's more than one way to do it ;-)
16:48 KyleHa OK.  I'll stick it there since I already have it there.
16:48 moritz_ sure
16:48 moritz_ KyleHa: do you have a commit bit already?
16:49 KyleHa Yes.
16:49 moritz_ great.
16:49 mtkatwork joined #perl6
16:49 moritz_ ah, removing the Ha$ makes the name more familiar ;-)
16:49 * moritz_ dumb.
16:49 KyleHa *grin*
16:50 mtkatwork left #perl6
16:52 kst joined #perl6
16:53 rindolf Hmmm.... make spectest runs three processes that consume over 50% of my CPU each.
16:53 rindolf So it's becoming somewhat sluggish.
16:53 rindolf The computer I mean.
16:55 moritz_ three processes are expected
16:55 moritz_ (if your TAP::Harness is sufficiently new)
16:55 rindolf moritz_: ah.
16:55 rindolf And there are still no line numbers in Rakudo errors.
16:56 moritz_ rindolf: there are, mostly.
16:57 moritz_ rindolf: cases that don't include them are worth a ticket
16:57 pugs_svn r27172 | kyle++ | [t/spec] Add test for bug #66840
16:57 Chillance joined #perl6
16:57 rindolf moritz_: ah.
16:58 wigfield joined #perl6
16:58 rindolf moritz_: http://erxz.com/pb/18409
16:59 rindolf moritz_: the point is that .hok() is non-existent.
16:59 moritz_ rindolf: yes. Feel free to submit to rakudobug@perl.org
16:59 rindolf moritz_: OK.
17:02 s1n1 joined #perl6
17:02 Whiteknight joined #perl6
17:02 frew joined #perl6
17:02 cdarroch joined #perl6
17:03 s1n2 joined #perl6
17:03 rindolf moritz_: is there any way I can tell TAP::Harness to only use one process?
17:04 moritz_ rindolf: you can try the TEST_JOBS env var
17:05 rindolf moritz_: ah.
17:05 hercynium joined #perl6
17:08 rindolf moritz_: submitted the bug.
17:08 moritz_ it seems I have to patch t/harness to honour TEST_JOBS
17:08 rindolf Man svn from many http:// (not https://) repositories is very slow here.
17:08 rindolf https:// works fine.
17:12 alester_ joined #perl6
17:13 Trey where's the spectest repo?  not in pugs anymore?
17:14 rindolf There's some spam here - http://rakudo.org/how-to-help
17:14 rindolf Trey: it is in pugs.
17:14 Trey ok, i was wondering why i kept getting updates :)
17:15 dalek rakudo: 10f2235 | moritz++ | t/harness:
17:15 dalek rakudo: [t/harness] honour TEST_JOBS environment variable
17:15 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/1​0f2235028194deddf3db350b5a4a5208484ac09
17:17 jaldhar joined #perl6
17:18 azawawi std: $];
17:18 p6eval std 27172: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Obsolete use of $] variable; in Perl 6 please use $::PERL_VERSION instead at /tmp/KFd8cEsMoY line 1:␤------> [32m$][31m;[0m␤FAILED 00:02 36m␤»
17:18 azawawi std: $::PERL_VERSION;
17:18 p6eval std 27172: OUTPUT«ok 00:02 35m␤»
17:18 azawawi rakudo: say $::PERL_VERSION;
17:18 p6eval rakudo 067756: OUTPUT«say requires an argument at line 2, near " $::PERL_V"␤in Main (src/gen_setting.pm:2416)␤»
17:19 azawawi pugs: say $::PERL_VERSION;
17:19 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT«*** Undeclared variable: ("$PERL_VERSION",MkPad (padToList [("$_",PELexical {pe_type = (mkType "Scalar"), pe_proto = <Scalar:0xb653118d>, pe_flags = MkEntryFlags {ef_isContext = True}, pe_store = <ref:0xb655ea09>}),("@_",PELexical {pe_type = (mkType "Array"), pe_proto = <Array:0xb6…
17:19 azawawi std: say $::PERL_VERSION;
17:19 p6eval std 27172: OUTPUT«ok 00:02 36m␤»
17:22 spx2 joined #perl6
17:22 spx2 is the  do BLOCK construct present in p6?
17:22 spx2 this one http://perldoc.perl.org/functions/do.html
17:22 moritz_ std: do { 1 }
17:23 p6eval std 27172: OUTPUT«ok 00:02 36m␤»
17:23 spx2 omfg
17:23 * spx2 runs away
17:23 moritz_ rakudo: do { say 1 }
17:23 p6eval rakudo 067756: OUTPUT«1␤»
17:23 moritz_ what's wrong with it?
17:23 spx2 almost everything ?
17:23 spx2 http://perlmonks.org/?node_id=773663
17:23 spx2 check it out
17:24 spx2 and the fact that BrowserUK which is an usual on perlmonks
17:24 moritz_ I don't see an "almost everything"
17:24 spx2 thought it was ok to have something like this
17:24 spx2 do{{
17:24 spx2 last unless $a==4
17:24 spx2 }} while 1;
17:24 spx2 which is really beyond my worst nigthmares
17:24 spx2 </rant>
17:25 moritz_ that's nothing wrong with the do BLOCK syntax.
17:25 moritz_ what's unexpected is that last() doesn't work in statement-modifying loops in Perl 5
17:25 spx2 moritz_: why do we have this do BLOCK ? I never used it and I've written a fair amount of p5 code
17:26 moritz_ spx2: timtowtdi. It allows you to write code in the verb-followed-by-object form
17:26 moritz_ if you don't need it, don't use it.
17:27 moritz_ rakudo: my $x; do { $x++; last } for 1..3; say $x
17:27 p6eval rakudo 067756: OUTPUT«1␤»
17:27 moritz_ spx2: does that DWIM, in your opinion?
17:27 bizb joined #perl6
17:28 nihiliad joined #perl6
17:28 spx2 I get some garbled characters on my screen
17:28 spx2 is that normal ?
17:28 spx2 except for the garbled characters yes it's ok
17:28 moritz_ spx2: when your client or terminal doesn'T handle UTF-8 that's normal.
17:29 moritz_ spx2: see http://irclog.perlgeek.de/​perl6/2009-06-22#i_1257256 for a non-garbled version
17:29 ejs joined #perl6
17:29 moritz_ .oO( assuming your browser handles UTF-8... ;-)
17:29 spx2 yeah it does :P
17:30 spx2 moritz_: do you use "do BLOCK" in your code ?
17:30 spx2 moritz_: do you find it useful in any way ?
17:30 moritz_ sometimes, and yes.
17:31 * spx2 needs to learn some new langauges :)
17:31 spx2 other than p5/p6 that is
17:31 moritz_ though it's less useful in Perl 6, because you can write loops as repeat { ... } while $condition;
17:31 moritz_ if the presence of a single construct deters you, good luck!
17:31 spx2 aaah yes ! post-condition
17:32 spx2 I like that
17:32 moritz_ (I'm also picky with languages; I abandoned python as soon as I learned it had no "use strict;"
17:32 moritz_ )
17:32 spx2 but maybe python has some form of "lint"
17:33 spx2 isn't "use strict" a lint ?
17:33 moritz_ no
17:33 moritz_ lint is a different tool
17:33 spx2 I think they both serve the same purpose
17:33 moritz_ use strict is something that modifies the behaviour of the compiler
17:33 moritz_ yes
17:33 moritz_ cars and bicycles serve the same purpose too
17:33 mikehh joined #perl6
17:34 moritz_ (also note that "use strict" has runtime effects)
17:35 spx2 moritz_: you mean run-time like this ? perl -Mstrict -e 'eval "$a = 3";'
17:35 spx2 it didn't tell me that I did not use "my" for  $a
17:36 moritz_ spx2: no, I mean the effeccts of use strict 'refs';
17:36 moritz_ anyway, I'm off to play some table tennis
17:36 moritz_ have the appropriate amount of fun
17:37 azawawi std: $*;
17:37 p6eval std 27172: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Obsolete use of $* variable; in Perl 6 please use ^^ and $$ instead at /tmp/sQr9HpuCSL line 1:␤------> [32m$*[31m;[0m␤FAILED 00:02 36m␤»
17:39 Whiteknight joined #perl6
17:40 azawawi what are ^^ and $$?
17:40 PerlJam that's how you match the start and end of lines within a string.
17:43 azawawi and $* 'was' supposed to do their functionality before?
17:43 rindolf moritz_: I'm not getting many <<<Use of uninitialized value>>> warnings without line numbers.
17:44 Trey rakudo: sub foo() { 1 } ; foo;
17:44 p6eval rakudo 067756:  ( no output )
17:44 Trey rakudo: sub foo() { 1 } ; foo(3);
17:44 p6eval rakudo 067756:  ( no output )
17:44 hercynium joined #perl6
17:45 Trey is that right?  how do you specify foo taking zero args?
17:45 azawawi PerlJam: thx
17:45 PerlJam azawawi: $* was how you did multi-line matching.  You see it to a true value.
17:45 PerlJam s/see/set/
17:46 PerlJam But that's *really* old perl.  pre-/m days
17:46 * azawawi finished a couple of quick fixes for today: http://padre.perlide.org/trac/log/trunk/Padre-Plu​gin-Perl6/lib/Padre/Plugin/Perl6/Perl6Document.pm
17:48 szabgab azawawi, your blog made it to IronMan
17:49 Trey rakuda sub foo($a) { say $a }; foo;
17:49 azawawi szabgab: cool thx
17:49 Trey rakudo: sub foo($a) { say $a }; foo;
17:49 p6eval rakudo 10f223: OUTPUT«too few arguments passed (0) - 1 params expected␤in sub foo (/tmp/zXmkJZjcUF:1)␤called from Main (/tmp/zXmkJZjcUF:2)␤»
17:49 Trey rakudo: sub foo($a) { say $a }; foo('hi', 'mom');
17:50 p6eval rakudo 10f223: OUTPUT«too many arguments passed (2) - 1 params expected␤in sub foo (/tmp/r0oiTiXyDf:1)␤called from Main (/tmp/r0oiTiXyDf:2)␤»
17:50 Trey rakudo: sub foo() { say $a }; foo('hi', 'mom');
17:50 p6eval rakudo 10f223: OUTPUT«Symbol '$a' not predeclared in foo (/tmp/3xzc8AtR53:2)␤in Main (src/gen_setting.pm:3225)␤»
17:51 Trey rakudo: sub foo() { say $^a }; foo('hi', 'mom');
17:51 p6eval rakudo 10f223: OUTPUT«Cannot use placeholder var in block with signature. at line 2, near " }; foo('h"␤in Main (src/gen_setting.pm:1966)␤»
17:52 Trey rakudo: sub foo() { say 'hi'}; foo('hi', 'mom');
17:52 p6eval rakudo 10f223: OUTPUT«hi␤»
17:53 Trey rakudo: sub foo() { @_.say }; foo('hi', 'mom');
17:53 p6eval rakudo 10f223: OUTPUT«himom␤»
17:53 Trey rakudo: sub foo { @_.say }; foo('hi', 'mom');
17:53 p6eval rakudo 10f223: OUTPUT«himom␤»
17:54 rindolf If I have a list (or two) and want to find all elements that appear an odd number of times in the list - how can I do that?
17:54 rindolf For starters, one can assume the list will have at most two elements of every number.
17:54 rindolf uniq(5,5,5) == [5]
17:55 rindolf rakudo: uniq(5,5,5).perl().say
17:55 p6eval rakudo 10f223: OUTPUT«[5]␤»
17:55 rindolf rakudo: uniq(5,5).perl().say
17:55 p6eval rakudo 10f223: OUTPUT«[5]␤»
17:55 rindolf rakudo: ones(5,5).perl().say
17:55 p6eval rakudo 10f223: OUTPUT«Could not find non-existent sub ones␤»
17:55 rindolf Is it my imagination or has rakudo become much slower lately?
17:55 Trey what's the rakudo bug email?  [particle] is sitting next to me and said to send that output, but he can't remember the address :)
17:56 PerlJam rindolf: say [+^] 5, 5; say [+^] 5, 5, 5;
17:56 PerlJam rindolf: perhaps
17:56 rindolf PerlJam: let me try.
17:56 PerlJam Trey: rakudobug@perl.org
17:56 Trey PerlJam: danke
17:56 rindolf rakudo: ([+^] (5,5)).perl.say
17:56 p6eval rakudo 10f223: OUTPUT«0␤»
17:56 rindolf rakudo: ([+^] (5,5,5)).perl.say
17:56 p6eval rakudo 10f223: OUTPUT«5␤»
17:57 rindolf PerlJam: I want a list, not a number.
17:57 rindolf rakudo: ([+^] (5,5,5,4)).perl.say
17:57 p6eval rakudo 10f223: OUTPUT«1␤»
17:57 PerlJam rindolf: yeah, that was meant more as a direction to go in rather than an answer to your problem.
17:57 rindolf PerlJam: OK.
17:58 acajou joined #perl6
17:59 kst joined #perl6
17:59 Molaf joined #perl6
17:59 KyleHa Is there any reason to keep the empty directories in pugs/t ?
18:00 rindolf I can write it like I wrote it in p5 - using a loop.
18:04 rindolf How can rakudo's command-line (./perl6) preserve its history across invocations?
18:06 Casan joined #perl6
18:08 PerlJam rindolf: you're talking about the REPL?  I'm not even sure how it keeps its history from one iteration to the next. On some systems it seems to, on others it doesn't.
18:08 rindolf PerlJam: ah.
18:08 rindolf PerlJam: yes, the REPL.
18:11 bizb left #perl6
18:13 FurnaceBoy joined #perl6
18:13 rindolf rakudo: do { my @h = (5,6,7); @h[-1].perl().say }
18:13 p6eval rakudo 10f223: OUTPUT«undef␤»
18:13 rindolf WTF?
18:14 rindolf Isn't it a bug?
18:14 rindolf rakudo: do { my @h = (5,6,7); @h[@h-1].perl().say }
18:14 p6eval rakudo 10f223: OUTPUT«7␤»
18:14 rindolf moritz_: here?
18:15 rindolf OK, and some of the make spectest failed too.
18:15 PerlJam rindolf: no, that's not a bug.
18:16 PerlJam rakudo: my @h = (5,6,7); @h[*-1].perl.say;
18:16 p6eval rakudo 10f223: OUTPUT«7␤»
18:17 rindolf PerlJam: what is the reason for breaking compatibility this way?
18:20 TimToady removes an error-prone discontinuity, and naturally falls out from the meaning of *
18:21 PerlJam TimToady: Here I was typing lots of words to say the same thing as "error-prone discontinuity"
18:22 rindolf OK, now my program works.
18:24 DemoFreak joined #perl6
18:24 rindolf But it's much slower than the p5 version.
18:24 KyleHa Is there any reason to keep the empty directories in pugs/t ?
18:24 icwiener joined #perl6
18:27 b_jonas don't they remind you that you should write tests for those things/
18:28 rindolf b_jonas: what?
18:28 KyleHa No.  They're leftovers from tests that got moved into spec/
18:29 KyleHa I went looking for Pugs tests to ponder moving into spec/ and I found some empty directories.  I'm looking for permission from someone more senior than me to get rid of them.
18:30 spx2 joined #perl6
18:32 mizioumt1 joined #perl6
18:34 athomason joined #perl6
18:35 rindolf http://www.shlomifish.org/Files/fi​les/code/perl/graham-for-rakudo.p6
18:40 kidd_ joined #perl6
18:41 nihiliad joined #perl6
18:47 japhb joined #perl6
18:49 _jaldhar joined #perl6
18:53 mizioumt joined #perl6
19:02 pnu joined #perl6
19:03 jaldhar_ joined #perl6
19:04 cotto joined #perl6
19:06 s1n2 std: my $prove = '\\\"foo \\\"bar\\\", \\\"baz\\\")\\\" \\\"barz\\\"';
19:06 p6eval std 27172: OUTPUT«ok 00:02 36m␤»
19:06 s1n_yapc rakudo: my $prove = '\\\"foo \\\"bar\\\", \\\"baz\\\")\\\" \\\"barz\\\"';
19:06 p6eval rakudo 10f223:  ( no output )
19:06 s1n_yapc huh?
19:07 s1n_yapc pugs: my $prove = '\\\"foo \\\"bar\\\", \\\"baz\\\")\\\" \\\"barz\\\"'; say $prove
19:07 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT«\\"foo \\"bar\\", \\"baz\\")\\" \\"barz\\"␤»
19:07 s1n_yapc hmm
19:08 s1n_yapc rakudo: my $prove = '\\"foo \\"bar\\", \\"baz\\")\\" \\"barz\\"';
19:08 p6eval rakudo 10f223:  ( no output )
19:08 s1n_yapc rakudo: my $prove = '\\\"foo \\\"bar\\\", \\\"baz\\\")\\\" \\\"barz\\\"'; say $prove
19:08 p6eval rakudo 10f223: OUTPUT«\\"foo \\"bar\\", \\"baz\\")\\" \\"barz\\"␤»
19:08 * s1n_yapc is braindead
19:13 stDavid joined #perl6
19:14 kst joined #perl6
19:18 wigfield joined #perl6
19:20 donaldh joined #perl6
19:22 DemoFreak joined #perl6
19:35 azawawi joined #perl6
19:35 its joined #perl6
19:43 s1n_yapc dalek only post commit feed items?
19:43 s1n_yapc we should make it hand out commitbit
19:45 hercynium joined #perl6
19:51 meppl good night
19:51 frew joined #perl6
20:00 pmurias joined #perl6
20:00 azawawi std: rand(10)
20:00 p6eval std 27172: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Obsolete use of rand(N); in Perl 6 please use N.rand or (1..N).pick instead at /tmp/boYoB54voi line 1:␤------> [32mrand[31m(10)[0m␤FAILED 00:02 35m␤»
20:01 azawawi std: rand(10 )
20:01 p6eval std 27172: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Obsolete use of rand(N); in Perl 6 please use N.rand or (1..N).pick instead at /tmp/CZbQ3UcH29 line 1:␤------> [32mrand[31m(10 )[0m␤FAILED 00:02 35m␤»
20:01 azawawi std: rand( 10)
20:01 p6eval std 27172: OUTPUT«ok 00:02 35m␤»
20:01 azawawi TimToady: i think we have a leading space STD bug in rand( 10)
20:02 azawawi std: rand(     10);
20:02 p6eval std 27172: OUTPUT«ok 00:02 35m␤»
20:02 azawawi std: rand(10      );
20:02 p6eval std 27172: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Obsolete use of rand(N); in Perl 6 please use N.rand or (1..N).pick instead at /tmp/2tumXSTsxm line 1:␤------> [32mrand[31m(10      );[0m␤FAILED 00:02 35m␤»
20:03 azawawi TimToady: and what's the difference between [-1] and [ -1] ?
20:03 azawawi std: [-1];
20:03 p6eval std 27172: OUTPUT«ok 00:02 37m␤»
20:03 azawawi std: my @a; @a[-1];
20:03 p6eval std 27172: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Obsolete use of [-1] subscript to access final element; in Perl 6 please use [*-1] instead at /tmp/EFSgrB1Rzy line 1:␤------> [32mmy @a; @a[-1][31m;[0m␤FAILED 00:02 38m␤»
20:03 azawawi std: my @a; @a [-1];
20:03 p6eval std 27172: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Unable to parse infix or meta-infix; couldn't find final ']' at /tmp/Qv3wuafxDv line 1:␤------> [32mmy @a; @a [-[31m1];[0m␤FAILED 00:02 36m␤»
20:04 azawawi std: my @a; @a[ -1];
20:04 p6eval std 27172: OUTPUT«ok 00:02 38m␤»
20:07 nihiliad joined #perl6
20:08 TimToady what, you expect me to be consistent :)
20:09 KyleHa Consistently inconsistent?
20:09 KyleHa Expect the unexpected!
20:10 moritz_ KyleHa: (re empty directories) they can be deleted
20:10 KyleHa moritz_: Thank you.
20:10 moritz_ they are a left-over from me using git-svn, and git doesn't deal with directories at all
20:16 pugs_svn r27173 | kyle++ | [t] remove empty directories
20:16 KyleHa Pewf!
20:17 pugs_svn r27174 | moritz++ | [t] remove test that seems so wrong to me (and has no smartlink)
20:22 KyleHa If I have an AoH, can I say 'foreach my %x ( @aoh )', or is it still my $h ?
20:23 moritz_ in Perl 6 you say 'for %aoh -> %h { ... }'
20:23 KyleHa Thank you.
20:23 moritz_ siince the item is bound to %h, the derefencing step that you need in Perl 5 is gone
20:23 moritz_ likewise:
20:24 Tene for @aoh -> %h { ... }
20:24 moritz_ rakudo: my $a = [1, 2, 3]; sub f(@a) { say @a.elems }; f($a);
20:24 p6eval rakudo 10f223: OUTPUT«3␤»
20:24 moritz_ rakudo: for ({ a => 2 }, { b => 1 }) -> %h { say %h.perl }
20:24 p6eval rakudo 10f223: OUTPUT«{"a" => 2}␤{"b" => 1}␤»
20:25 KyleHa Hmmm, no need for 'my' ?
20:25 moritz_ not in signatures
20:25 moritz_ in -> $x, $y { ... } the '$x, $y' part is actually a signature
20:25 moritz_ just like when you say 'my $anon = sub ($x, $y) { ... }'
20:26 moritz_ std: my Cat $a;
20:26 p6eval std 27174: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤In "my" declaration, typename Cat must be predeclared (or marked as declarative with :: prefix) at /tmp/Q20ynaHXVM line 1:␤------> [32mmy Cat[31m $a;[0m␤FAILED 00:02 35m␤»
20:26 kst joined #perl6
20:27 pugs_svn r27175 | lwall++ | [STD] allow whitespacey forms on rand and .[-1] checkers
20:27 pugs_svn r27175 | lwall++ | [Cursor] reinit setting on reparse
20:27 moritz_ std: class Cat { }; class Dog { }; class Fish { }; my Cat|Dog Fish $mitsy = new Fish but { Bool.pick ?? .does Cat !! .does Dog }; # example from S02
20:27 p6eval std 27174: OUTPUT«##### PARSE FAILED #####␤Malformed my at /tmp/tP7IIsgUad line 1:␤------> [32m}; class Dog { }; class Fish { }; my Cat[31m|Dog Fish $mitsy = new Fish but { Bool.p[0m␤    expecting any of:␤       multi_declarator␤ typename␤ whitespace␤FAILED 00:02 36m␤»
20:28 moritz_ TimToady: please either fix S02 or STD.pm ;-)
20:28 moritz_ it looks rather like two terms in a row
20:28 TimToady it's only possible in theory :)
20:29 moritz_ (actually I was just looking of '$obj but { closure }' is really allowed
20:29 moritz_ and that's the only example in the spec)
20:30 TimToady the parser doesn't care what's on either side of 'but'
20:31 TimToady std: () but ()
20:31 p6eval std 27175: OUTPUT«ok 00:02 36m␤»
20:31 moritz_ that's only half of an answer ;-)
20:31 moritz_ does the rest of the compiler needs to handle closures on the RHS?
20:31 TimToady beats me
20:32 moritz_ well, let's say "yes" for the moment ;-)
20:33 pmurias TimToady: figured out a solution for the use Foo;use Foo::Bar; problem?
20:34 moritz_ upon further review that test is mostly borked anyway
20:34 KyleHa rakudo: my %x=(a=>1); say "interpolate, I say: %x<a>"
20:34 p6eval rakudo 10f223: OUTPUT«interpolate, I say: %x<a>␤»
20:34 moritz_ KyleHa: NYI
20:35 PerlJam KyleHa: for now you can use "interpolate, I say: {%x<a>}"
20:35 KyleHa When you say "for now", does that mean it is sure to break?
20:35 moritz_ no
20:36 moritz_ curly braces interpolate as closures in double-quoted strings.
20:36 PerlJam KyleHa: no, that means that you way that is currently broken will eventually work
20:36 KyleHa Oh, cool.
20:36 KyleHa Thank you all.
20:36 pugs_svn r27176 | moritz++ | [t] remove oo/syntax-but.t
20:36 pugs_svn r27176 | moritz++ |
20:36 pugs_svn r27176 | moritz++ | There were two kinds of tests in there. Some used $value but { closure }, but
20:36 pugs_svn r27176 | moritz++ | the closure didn't return a role or an enum (so they were wrong). The other
20:36 pugs_svn r27176 | moritz++ | onces were of the form '$value but True', which we test elsewhere anyway.
20:37 moritz_ damn, I can't type. "onces" :/
20:39 hercynium joined #perl6
20:45 deafferret joined #perl6
20:45 bennymack joined #perl6
20:47 jan_ joined #perl6
20:48 deafferret left #perl6
20:49 _jaldhar_ joined #perl6
20:55 bennymack left #perl6
20:55 jaldhar joined #perl6
21:00 rindolf http://www.shlomifish.org/Files/fi​les/code/perl/graham-for-rakudo.p6 - any comments?
21:02 pugs_svn r27177 | kyle++ | [t/spec] Make autoincrement string tests data driven.  This should make it
21:02 pugs_svn r27177 | kyle++ | easier to add tests for, e.g., Greek characters.
21:03 KyleHa That autoincrement.t oughta be broken up, I reckon.
21:05 KyleHa I just now figured out that NYI = 'not yet implemented'.
21:06 moritz_ KyleHa: the reason not to use data driven testing is very often that it's harder to fudge individual tests without botching the plan()
21:06 moritz_ KyleHa: that doesn't mean it's bad, it's just something you should be aware of
21:06 KyleHa Indeed, I hadn't thought of that.
21:07 nihiliad joined #perl6
21:09 moritz_ rindolf: I prefer to use dashes instead of underscores in identifiers
21:09 rindolf moritz_: ah.
21:09 KyleHa Now I'm wondering if I should add fudgy features to my test data structure.  Probably not.  There were a couple of tests that I didn't put in the data set because they were fudged already.
21:09 KyleHa So I guess if any of those in the array need fudging, they'll have to be factored back out again.
21:09 moritz_ that works for now
21:10 moritz_ (and in the long run it has to be all implemented anyway ;-)
21:10 stDavid joined #perl6
21:10 KyleHa Yeah, well, no sense making it hard on implementers in the short run.
21:19 azawawi joined #perl6
21:19 azawawi hello
21:20 kolibrie ua
21:22 azawawi Padre's Perl 6 plugin in action: http://ahmadzawawi.blogspot.com/2009/06/​padres-perl-6-quick-fixes-in-action.html
21:26 japhb phenny: tell finanalyst I wrote the OpenGL bindings.  They do work from both PIR and Perl 6 (in Rakudo).  Or at least, WFM.  :-)  The black window problem is a (really long-standing) bug in Parrot NCI when JIT is enabled.  You need to configure parrot with --jitcapable=0.
21:26 phenny japhb: I'll pass that on when finanalyst is around.
21:29 moritz_ I just tested shapes.pir with current rakudo - works, albeit *very* slow
21:29 japhb moritz_: how slow?  I find it ~75x times slower than the PIR version.
21:30 moritz_ japhb: how did you measure the speed?
21:31 japhb let it run until the design has rotated at least one full turn, then hit Esc to quit and look at the average frame rate printed there.
21:31 japhb s/there/in your terminal/
21:32 japhb I should probably add a --benchmark option that runs it until it rotates exactly one full time, to make sure the comparison is as valid as possible.
21:32 moritz_ rakudo: 3.9 fps, parrot: 197 fps
21:32 japhb Right now, they're *so* different, I'm only worried about order of magnitude.
21:32 p6eval rakudo 10f223: OUTPUT«Statement not terminated properly at line 2, near "fps, parro"␤in Main (src/gen_setting.pm:0)␤»
21:32 moritz_ rakudo: 197 / 3.9
21:32 p6eval rakudo 10f223:  ( no output )
21:32 moritz_ rakudo: say 197 / 3.9
21:33 p6eval rakudo 10f223: OUTPUT«50.5128205128205␤»
21:33 japhb So, within variability of architectures and build day.
21:33 moritz_ yes, the order of magnitude has stayed the same
21:33 japhb Also, I compile Parrot with --jitcapable=0 --optimes.
21:33 japhb er --optimize
21:34 moritz_ speaking of which, I could try opengl with clang... ;-)
21:34 japhb :-)
21:34 japhb If clang manages to get a working compile with --jitcapable=1 on 32-bit Intel, I'm all for switching *today*
21:34 lambdabot joined #perl6
21:35 moritz_ I only have amd64 to test
21:35 japhb I have one of each.
21:36 japhb Because I bought my laptop about one season before Core 2 came out.  :-(
21:37 moritz_ if you have no more than 3GB ram, 64bit rarely has practical benefits
21:38 hercynium joined #perl6
21:38 moritz_ never try to compile parrot with --optimize with a debug build of clang
21:38 moritz_ it's just infintely slow
21:38 japhb True, but Core 2 was intrinsically a much faster chip than the original Core, even for 32-bit stuff.  And I wouldn't constantly be getting skipping watching 720p or larger videos ...
21:38 japhb heh
21:40 moritz_ I have to confess I don't know much about individual processors/processor families
21:40 kst joined #perl6
21:40 moritz_ just general statements about broader families
21:41 moritz_ s/families/architectures/
21:50 pugs_svn r27178 | kyle++ | [t/spec] Reduce my own test bloat.  One test per case instead of three.
21:52 japhb moritz_: did you manage to get a clang build with OpenGL?
21:52 bacek joined #perl6
21:54 moritz_ japhb: not yet. With --optimize it seems to hang somewhere...
21:54 japhb nod
21:56 moritz_ and on the machine with clang I don't have the opengl headers yet *sigh*
21:56 japhb oops
21:58 moritz_ uhm, what packages do I need on debian for that?
21:59 moritz_ I have libl1-mesa-dev  and all dependencies
22:03 moritz_ ah, freeglut3-dev is missing
22:03 Tene I still get FAIL with OpenGL.
22:03 Tene :(
22:04 japhb moritz_: sorry, multitasking
22:04 japhb Tene: remind me again what the FAIL form was?
22:04 Tene japhb: paste in #parrot
22:05 japhb Tene: Ah yes, that one
22:05 japhb frack.
22:06 japhb That really seems to be a freeglut error.
22:06 Tene How could I test that?
22:06 japhb Oh yes, I recall, I was going to suggest trying an app that used freeglut to rule it out.
22:06 japhb lemme see if I can find a good one.
22:09 moritz_ will any app do that depends on freeglut?
22:09 Tene probably
22:09 japhb moritz_: yeah, I was filtering the output of apt-cache just now
22:09 moritz_ if you're on debian: adanaxisgpl depends on freeglut3
22:09 moritz_ japhb: 'debtags search hardware::opengl' is a real helper
22:10 Tene I'm on Fedora.
22:10 moritz_ meh.
22:10 Tene but I have that package
22:11 moritz_ or ssystem, if you want to download less ;-)
22:12 japhb Tene: I generally assume that Debian has a first approximation of the union of all other (free) distros, so this produces a list of which some are likely to exist for you.  :-)
22:12 Tene :)
22:13 japhb moritz_: apt-get install debtags  :-)
22:13 japhb I started with Debian long before such tags were all that useful, and never got in the habit
22:14 japhb ah, nice
22:15 moritz_ I first did 'debtags tagsearch opengl' to find hardware::opengl
22:36 rfordinal joined #perl6
22:42 kst joined #perl6
22:42 xomas joined #perl6
22:49 nErVe joined #perl6
22:55 amoc rakudo: my $o = IO::A.new
22:55 p6eval rakudo 10f223: OUTPUT«Null PMC access in invoke()␤in Main (/tmp/vgehkLTATe:2)␤»
22:56 jaldhar joined #perl6
22:57 * amoc submits [perl #66878]
22:58 nErVe "Has 9 duplications and 24 losses, D/L Score is 37.5" i wan to extract lines like these any regex that wld do the trick..??
23:13 jferrero joined #perl6
23:31 kidd_ joined #perl6
23:53 skids joined #perl6
23:56 nihiliad joined #perl6
23:57 kst joined #perl6
23:58 justatheory joined #perl6

| Channels | #perl6 index | Today | | Search | Google Search | Plain-Text | summary

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo | Niecza | Specs