Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2011-06-16

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
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00:22 lichtkind soroar allright :)
00:25 daniel-s perl6: my $a = "hello"; $a.length.say;
00:25 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT«*** No such method in class Str: "&length"␤    at /tmp/ZOMkiW9LNz line 1, column 18-31␤»
00:25 p6eval ..niecza v6-157-ga94e021: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Unable to resolve method length in class Str␤  at /tmp/TIQrTIxksV line 1 (MAIN mainline @ 1) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 1769 (CORE C837_ANON @ 2) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 1770 (CORE module-CORE @ 57) ␤
00:25 p6eval .. at /home/p6eva…
00:25 sorear lichtkind: #2?
00:25 p6eval ..rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«Method 'length' not found for invocant of class 'Str'␤  in main program body at line 22:/tmp/xNznjFx8ng␤»
00:25 daniel-s perl6: my $a = "hello"; $a.bytes.say;
00:25 p6eval pugs, rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«5␤»
00:25 p6eval ..niecza v6-157-ga94e021: OUTPUT«10␤»
00:26 daniel-s perl6: my $a = "Селекторот"; $a.bytes.say;
00:26 p6eval rakudo 248244, niecza v6-157-ga94e021: OUTPUT«20␤»
00:26 p6eval ..pugs: OUTPUT«decodeUTF8': bad data: '\1057'␤decodeUTF8': bad data: '\1077'␤decodeUTF8': bad data: '\1083'␤decodeUTF8': bad data: '\1077'␤decodeUTF8': bad data: '\1082'␤decodeUTF8': bad data: '\1090'␤decodeUTF8': bad data: '\1086'␤decodeUTF8': bad data: '\1088'␤decodeUTF8': bad data: '\1086'␤dec…
00:26 daniel-s what's the proper way to get the length of a string
00:26 sorear .chars
00:26 daniel-s because .bytes is not it
00:26 daniel-s perl6: my $a = "Селекторот"; $a.chars.say;
00:26 p6eval rakudo 248244, niecza v6-157-ga94e021: OUTPUT«10␤»
00:26 p6eval ..pugs: OUTPUT«decodeUTF8': bad data: '\1057'␤decodeUTF8': bad data: '\1077'␤decodeUTF8': bad data: '\1083'␤decodeUTF8': bad data: '\1077'␤decodeUTF8': bad data: '\1082'␤decodeUTF8': bad data: '\1090'␤decodeUTF8': bad data: '\1086'␤decodeUTF8': bad data: '\1088'␤decodeUTF8': bad data: '\1086'␤dec…
00:27 daniel-s pugs doesn't like UTF
00:32 sorear probably something is getting double decoded
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00:35 * sorear wonders what selektorot is
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00:39 sorear lichtkind: you said you had more questions
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00:48 lichtkind sorear: yes but time is approaching and had to fix here a small script, i would like to ask tommorow if you dont bother
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00:53 sorear lichtkind: no, it's fine by me.
00:53 lichtkind :), good night
00:53 lichtkind to all here
00:53 sorear good night.
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01:46 dalek niecza: 042c7c2 | sorear++ | src/ (3 files):
01:46 dalek niecza: Improve detection of when names are actually used
01:46 dalek niecza: review: https://github.com/sorear/niecza/commit/042c7c2a2d
01:46 sorear \o/ make test passes without warnings now
01:48 colomon \o/
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02:36 sorear std: "{ my $x }"
02:36 p6eval std 37a0cdd: OUTPUT«ok 00:01 119m␤»
02:37 dalek niecza: c0de568 | sorear++ | / (3 files):
02:37 dalek niecza: Refactor to enable more detection of unused variables
02:37 dalek niecza: review: https://github.com/sorear/niecza/commit/c0de5681c0
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02:49 dalek niecza: f958d2d | sorear++ | src/niecza:
02:49 dalek niecza: Allow catching unused variables in the mainline block
02:49 dalek niecza: review: https://github.com/sorear/niecza/commit/f958d2d734
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03:18 dalek niecza: e8230ae | sorear++ | src/ (3 files):
03:18 dalek niecza: Fix declared but not used checking for subs
03:18 dalek niecza: review: https://github.com/sorear/niecza/commit/e8230aed06
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03:28 kai__ whois clkao
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03:29 sorear Su-Shee_: ping
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03:34 KKK Is there any detailed documentation for perl6 module?
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03:49 zhang How could I get the length of a array?
03:49 sorear use the array as a number
03:49 sorear @array > 3
03:50 sorear if you don't need to use the value right away, use unary +
03:50 sorear my $len = +@array
03:50 zhang sorear Thank you.
03:52 tylercur1is Or @array.elems
03:53 tylercur1is is now known as tylercurtis
03:53 zhang This one looks more natural.
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04:20 sorear o/ araujo
04:20 araujo hi sorear
04:20 sorear oh wow, I didn't break any spectests
04:21 tadzik good morning #perl6
04:21 sorear hello tadzik
04:21 tadzik sorear: what's so bad about IRC?
04:22 sorear where do I begin?
04:22 tadzik I wonder
04:22 sorear enforced tree topology makes redundant connections impossible
04:22 sorear no way for clients to transparently resume after a connection drop
04:22 sorear 510-character limit by truncation brain damage
04:23 sorear lack of character encoding awareness
04:23 sorear inadequate handling of presense data
04:23 sorear no remote echo
04:24 sorear "standard" that NO server follows anymore
04:24 sorear ad-hoc extensions with no discovery protocol
04:25 sorear basically, the protocol is set up at every level to make it impossible to write a better client than irssi
04:25 tadzik I see your point
04:25 sorear I learned most of this when I got fed up with irssi and tried to do exactly that
04:25 Eevee time for a new protocol
04:26 tadzik or for wider adoption
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04:58 dalek niecza: fa38b18 | sorear++ | / (4 files):
04:58 dalek niecza: Fix explain_mystery/inlining misinteraction
04:58 dalek niecza: review: https://github.com/sorear/niecza/commit/fa38b18d9c
04:58 dalek niecza: 174da63 | sorear++ | src/Metamodel.pm6:
04:58 dalek niecza: Re-add use before declaration suppressing nonusage warning
04:58 dalek niecza: review: https://github.com/sorear/niecza/commit/174da63af1
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05:33 TimToady phenny: tell masak oh, and in the same paragraph, "short-curcuiting"
05:34 TimToady ENOPHENNY
05:34 tadzik /o\
05:34 tadzik that explains the lack of breakfast
05:35 sorear o/ TimToady
05:35 TimToady yo
05:36 TimToady looks like yer making good progress on the symtab stuff
05:36 dalek niecza: 3332d84 | sorear++ | src/niecza:
05:36 dalek niecza: &foo adds to %*MYSTERY
05:36 dalek niecza: review: https://github.com/sorear/niecza/commit/3332d8467c
05:37 sorear yeah, it's basically done except for the "defined but not used" warnings, which keep bouncing between oversensitive and undersensitive
05:37 TimToady I gave niecza more visibility on the http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Category:Perl_6 page today
05:39 tadzik examtime &
05:40 TimToady have the appropriate amount of fun
05:42 sorear it'
05:42 sorear it's not regressed on spectests at this point (though I haven't reviewed warnings yet), also can compile itself again
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05:48 sorear I'm thinking of changing source position in backtraces to a range of positions
05:50 sorear if we have A(B), then there are 3 possible points for an exception - in eval(A), in eval(B), or in apply()
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05:50 sorear the other trick is that sometimes niecza doesn't exactly know when an exception came in, due to a bit of CLR brain damage
05:51 sorear so sometimes niecza might know "either in eval(A) or eval(B), but definitely not in apply"
05:51 sorear I wonder how best to present that to the user
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05:52 TimToady better to be too general than to be wrong
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06:04 moritz good mroning
06:05 sorear hi moritz
06:05 moritz too early to write properly, it seems
06:05 TimToady you should blame the german keyboard :)
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06:05 moritz only a poor blameman works his tools
06:05 moritz erm...
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06:06 TimToady that almost blames...er...works
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06:08 sorear hmm... no spectests for tighter/looser it seems
06:08 * sorear writes up a battery of tests
06:09 TimToady be sure to keep + and - terminals straight...oh wait, you said a battery of tests, not a test of batteries...
06:09 TimToady permutational humor is humorously permutational, except when permutationally humurous or prohibited by law...
06:11 sorear for many years while growing up I thought "voidware" was a noun-type legal concept
06:11 Su-Shee_ sorear: yes pong?
06:11 sorear then I decided to ask what it was one day...
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06:11 sorear Su-Shee: you said you wanted an article.  What information?
06:12 TimToady I kinda like "the", it's very definitive.
06:12 Su-Shee sorear: what I asked yesterday. why did you choose c#, how does .net come into play (does it even?) what were your experiences etc
06:21 sorear ah...
06:23 sorear niecza: sub infix:<@a> { "a({@_})" }; say 1 @a 2
06:23 p6eval niecza v6-163-g174da63: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m␤␤Placeholder variable @_ may not be used here because the surrounding block takes no signature at /tmp/NnXRyPsTvd line 1:␤------> [32msub infix:<@a> { "a({[33m⏏[31m@_})" }; say 1 @a 2[0m␤␤Unhandled exception: Check failed␤␤  at
06:23 p6eval ../home/p6eval/niecza…
06:23 sorear ...eheheh
06:24 sorear niecza: sub infix:<@a> { "a(@_.item())" }; say 1 @a 2
06:24 p6eval niecza v6-163-g174da63: OUTPUT«a(1 2)␤»
06:25 moritz niecza: sub infix:<@a> { "a(@_.item())" }; my @a = 3; say @a @a @a
06:25 p6eval niecza v6-163-g174da63: OUTPUT«a(3 3)␤»
06:26 sorear clearly, starry 2.0 is warranted
06:27 moritz niecza: sub infix:<@a> { "a(@_.item())" }; my @a = 3; say (* @a *).(@a, @a)
06:27 p6eval niecza v6-163-g174da63: OUTPUT«a(3 3)␤»
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06:29 sorear TimToady: given infix:<@a> is tighter<|>; infix:<@b> is looser<&>  what is the precedence relationship between @a and @b?
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06:30 sorear TimToady: I'm planning to make tigher subst('=','>=') and looser subst('=','<=') so the original op will always trump refinement.  But you might've had a different plan
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06:34 sorear std: sub foo is export('PIE') { }
06:34 p6eval std 37a0cdd: OUTPUT«ok 00:01 119m␤»
06:34 sorear std: sub foo is export ('PIE') { }
06:34 p6eval std 37a0cdd: OUTPUT«ok 00:01 121m␤»
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06:35 sorear std: sub foo is export ($fie) { }
06:35 p6eval std 37a0cdd: OUTPUT«Potential difficulties:␤  $fie is declared but not used at /tmp/Pu9tXl0oUP line 1:␤------> [32msub foo is export ([33m⏏[31m$fie) { }[0m␤ok 00:01 120m␤»
06:35 sorear std: sub foo is export($fie) { }
06:35 p6eval std 37a0cdd: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m␤Variable $fie is not predeclared at /tmp/U7ZjedO07M line 1:␤------> [32msub foo is export($fie[33m⏏[31m) { }[0m␤Check failed␤FAILED 00:01 119m␤»
06:35 sorear ok then
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06:43 TimToady a tighter based on a looser op is always looser than the looser based on the tigher op; such precedence levels never overlap, so tighter/looser are only tiebreakers if the original precedence would be ambig
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06:44 TimToady if if there is a between of the original precedence levels, it's between all the looser-tighters and all the tighter-loosers, as it were
06:44 sorear between exists?
06:45 sorear or do you just mean like + relative to tighter(=) and looser(*) ?
06:45 TimToady it was speculated at least
06:45 TimToady tighters and loosers are only infinitesimally far away from their base prec
06:46 TimToady though you can always fit more in
06:46 TimToady if we have between, it has to interpolate though
06:47 TimToady interpolating between loosers and tighters looks to be fraught with peril, though :)
06:47 sorear pugs: sub infix:<@>($x,$y) { $x * $y }; say 2 + 4 @ 4; # 24
06:47 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT«24␤»
06:47 TimToady so feel free to ignore between for now
06:48 sorear pugs: sub infix:<@>($x,$y) is tighter<+> { $x * $y }; say 2 + 4 @ 4; # does pugs support this? (18)
06:48 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT«*** ␤    Unexpected "<+>"␤    expecting trait or block␤    at /tmp/StONe8U86z line 1, column 32␤»
06:48 sorear pugs: sub infix:<@>($x,$y) is tighter(&infix:<+>) { $x * $y }; say 2 + 4 @ 4; # does pugs support this? (18)
06:48 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT«24␤»
06:48 sorear pugs: sub infix:<@>($x,$y) is equiv(&infix:<*>) { $x * $y }; say 2 + 4 @ 4; # does pugs support this? (18)
06:48 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT«24␤»
06:48 TimToady I don't think pugs does anything with tighter/looser
06:48 sorear doesn't look like it
06:48 sorear so probably niecza will be the first implementation to do infinite precedence \o/
06:49 TimToady well, till you run out of memory :)
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06:50 TimToady similarly a tighter(looser(+)) is still looser than +
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06:51 sorear I could make between work, using infinitesimal calculus, but it would be a pain to test and it would probably slow down EXPR
06:51 sorear since it wouldn't be able to use lt/gt anymore
06:52 sorear plus I'm not really sure "0.5 of the way between the arguments precedence" is really _useful_
06:52 TimToady you'd just have to figure out some way to generate an intermediate string
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06:52 TimToady me either
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06:52 TimToady so consider it conjectural
06:52 sorear if we wanted to go that far I'd rather see topological sorting stuff
06:53 sorear where you give X > Y constraints, and then the system decides if operators are <, >, =, incomparable by the transitive closure
06:53 TimToady oh, I think we decided to replace 'is between' with 'is tighter is looser'
06:53 TimToady and let the two traits fight it out :)
06:53 sorear I think I proposed that system for Haskell' back when I was 10 or so...
06:54 sorear hmm
06:54 TimToady in any case, don't need new syntax for it
06:54 sorear ah, Haskell' was 2010, not 2000
06:55 sorear that's more consistent with my timeline... I didn't think I was playing with Haskell until after I was on Linux, which required post-13
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06:58 TimToady useful topological prec likely requires you to name both upper and lower bounds, which is problematic from an extensibility point of view
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06:59 TimToady the between stuff more more useful for bootstrapping your initial levels, I suspect
06:59 sorear I was supposing just is Niecza::absprec<k= right> for that
07:00 TimToady so you can get the moral equivalen of the a..z levels without going all Church numerally
07:00 sorear between needs at least 2 prec levels to bootstrap
07:00 TimToady yes, but you can see how you could bootstrap between a..z with a split-the-difference thing
07:01 sorear and I'd rather have a system that allows users to see at a glance that is absprec<i= right> is related to constant $item_assignment_prec = 'i=';
07:02 TimToady yes, I prefer to hardwire the initial levels
07:02 TimToady it's an example of "Give them all the rope they want to be flexible, but then give them enough options that the don't want to extend it." :)
07:02 TimToady *they
07:03 TimToady that's easier with precedence levels than with operators, of course
07:03 TimToady but we'll probabl never add factorial as a built-in op simply because it's such an amusing operator to add :)
07:04 sorear "show me the use case"
07:04 sorear factorial... well it's a great builtin operator in Maxima
07:04 sorear but Perl 6 has no delusions of being a CAS
07:05 TimToady we've got plenty of delusions already, thank you...
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07:17 dalek niecza: dff3b35 | sorear++ | / (2 files):
07:17 dalek niecza: 36 new tests for tighter/looser/equiv.  tighter+looser is not tested, as semantics uncertain
07:17 dalek niecza: review: https://github.com/sorear/niecza/commit/dff3b35c11
07:18 sorear (warning: not my most readable code)
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07:28 * TimToady wanders off to see how interesting the inside of his eyelids will be tonight...
07:29 frettled I'm sure they will be most fascinating.
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07:52 TiMBuS https://twitter.com/#!/MICROSOFTWORD97
07:52 TiMBuS ahahah
07:57 frettled heh
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08:07 dalek niecza: f6d94cc | sorear++ | / (2 files):
08:07 dalek niecza: Fix stubbing qualified packages
08:07 dalek niecza: review: https://github.com/sorear/niecza/commit/f6d94ccca8
08:08 * mathw snorts milk out of his nose
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08:22 * sorear -> sleep
08:22 dalek niecza: 6cff873 | sorear++ | src/niecza:
08:22 dalek niecza: 'subset' and 'enum' default to our scope
08:22 dalek niecza: review: https://github.com/sorear/niecza/commit/6cff873d1c
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09:22 tadzik o/
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09:32 jnthn o/
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09:34 moritz o|
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10:22 daniel-s !wave
10:22 DBot1 o/
10:22 DBot1 o|
10:22 DBot1 o/
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10:25 moritz daniel-s: could you please compress that to one line? verbose bots are a bit annoying
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11:26 daniel-s !wave at moritz
11:26 DansBot Hai moritz o/ o| o/
11:26 moritz \o  |o /o
11:26 moritz daniel-s++
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12:07 colomon niecza: say [*] 1..20;
12:07 p6eval niecza v6-167-g6cff873: OUTPUT«2432902008176640000␤»
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12:10 takadonet morning all
12:10 colomon niecza: say [*] 2, 3, 5, 7, 11, 13, 17, 19
12:10 p6eval niecza v6-167-g6cff873: OUTPUT«9699690␤»
12:16 moritz sorear: 'make test' fails in current niecza: Undeclared routine: 'testx:sym<<foo bar>>' used at line 815
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12:21 daniel-s perl6: say [*] 1..20;
12:21 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«2.43290200817664e+18␤»
12:21 p6eval ..pugs, niecza v6-167-g6cff873: OUTPUT«2432902008176640000␤»
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12:22 daniel-s perl6: say [*] 1..5; say 1*2*3*4*5;
12:22 p6eval pugs, rakudo 248244, niecza v6-167-g6cff873: OUTPUT«120␤120␤»
12:24 xinming left #perl6
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12:33 daniel-s rakudo: [-] 6 5;
12:33 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Confused at line 22, near "[-] 6 5;"␤»
12:33 daniel-s rakudo: [-] 6, 5;
12:33 p6eval rakudo 248244:  ( no output )
12:33 daniel-s rakudo: [+] 6, 5;
12:33 p6eval rakudo 248244:  ( no output )
12:33 daniel-s rakudo: [*] 6, 5;
12:33 p6eval rakudo 248244:  ( no output )
12:33 daniel-s rakudo: say [*] 6, 5;
12:33 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«30␤»
12:33 daniel-s rakudo: say [-] 6, 5;
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12:33 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«1␤»
12:34 daniel-s rakudo: say [%] 6, 5;
12:34 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«1␤»
12:36 jt_ joined #perl6
12:37 moritz rakudo: say [**] 1..10
12:37 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«1␤»
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12:39 daniel-s that seems not right
12:40 daniel-s say [%] 6,4;
12:40 daniel-s rakudo: say [%] 6,4;
12:40 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«2␤»
12:40 daniel-s rakudo: say [**] 1..3;
12:40 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«1␤»
12:40 daniel-s rakudo: say [**] 2..3;
12:40 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«8␤»
12:41 daniel-s oh yea, it starts at 1
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13:18 colomon niecza: say 10 !%% 3
13:18 p6eval niecza v6-167-g6cff873: OUTPUT«Bool::True␤»
13:18 colomon niecza: say 10 !%% 2
13:18 p6eval niecza v6-167-g6cff873: OUTPUT«Bool::False␤»
13:24 daniel-s rakudo: say 10%3;
13:24 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«1␤»
13:24 daniel-s rakudo: say 10%%3;
13:24 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«Bool::False␤»
13:24 daniel-s what is %%?
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13:25 daniel-s and why does the first one get ignored in IRC
13:25 moritz the "divisible by" operator
13:25 moritz which one is ignored?
13:25 daniel-s oh, so if 10%2 is zero, 10%2 == true
13:25 daniel-s oh, so if 10%2 is zero, 10%%2 == true
13:25 moritz right
13:26 daniel-s %
13:26 daniel-s %%
13:26 daniel-s if I type %% only one % comes up
13:26 moritz daniel-s: that's a feature of your IRC client. Works fine in mine
13:30 daniel-s rakudo: say !10%%3.5;
13:30 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«Bool::True␤»
13:30 daniel-s rakudo: say 10%%3.5;
13:30 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«Bool::False␤»
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13:30 daniel-s rakudo: say !10;
13:30 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«Bool::False␤»
13:30 daniel-s rakudo: say !"hello";
13:30 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«Bool::False␤»
13:31 daniel-s rakudo: say !"0";
13:31 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«Bool::True␤»
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13:38 colomon hmmm.... we have grep and first.  do we have an exists?  (ie, like first but returns True if the condition matches something in the list, False otherwise.)
13:38 colomon I guess ?@a.grep should do that, in theory....
13:38 moritz and with lazy lists it does that well
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13:40 tadzik http://blogs.perl.org/users/andrew_shitov/2011/06​/perl-6-influence-talk-wanted-at-yapceurope.html
13:40 colomon Obviously !@a.grep could be that efficient as well.  Wonder if it is.
13:41 colomon rakudo: my @a := 1, -> $n { say ++$n } ... 20; @a.grep(* %% 13)
13:41 p6eval rakudo 248244:  ( no output )
13:41 colomon rakudo: my @a := 1, -> $n { say ++$n } ... 20; say ?@a.grep(* %% 13)
13:41 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«Cannot modify readonly value␤  in '&infix:<=>' at line 1␤  in <anon> at line 22:/tmp/alerlUeyQd␤  in <anon> at line 872:CORE.setting␤  in 'List::Bool' at line 1␤  in <anon> at line 888:CORE.setting␤  in <anon> at line 1␤  in 'List::Bool' at line 1␤  in 'prefix:<?>' at line
13:41 p6eval ..497:CORE…
13:41 colomon rakudo: my @a := 1, -> $n is copy { say ++$n } ... 20; say ?@a.grep(* %% 13)
13:41 p6eval rakudo 248244:
13:41 p6eval ..OUTPUT«(timeout)rue␤Bool::True␤Bool::True␤Bool:​:True␤Bool::True␤Bool::True␤Bool::True␤Bool::True​␤Bool::True␤Bool::True␤Bool::True␤Bool::True␤Bool​::True␤Bool::True␤Bool::True␤Bool::True␤Bool::Tru​e␤Bool::True␤Bool::True␤Bool::True␤Bool::True␤Boo​l::True␤Bool::True␤Bool::True␤Bool::True␤Bool:…
13:42 colomon doh!
13:42 colomon rakudo: my @a := 1, -> $n is copy { say ++$n; $n; } ... 20; say ?@a.grep(* %% 13)
13:42 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«2␤3␤4␤5␤6␤7␤8␤9␤10␤11␤12␤13␤Bool::True␤»
13:42 colomon rakudo: my @a := 1, -> $n is copy { say ++$n; $n; } ... 20; say !@a.grep(* %% 13)
13:42 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«2␤3␤4␤5␤6␤7␤8␤9␤10␤11␤12␤13␤Bool::False␤»
13:43 colomon so, not smart now, but an easy fix
13:43 moritz you have to check how often the grep block is executed
13:43 moritz not how often the generating code block is executed
13:43 moritz you see that it only goes up to 13 in the generating block
13:43 moritz so you know that it stopped after it found the first match
13:44 colomon right, that's because !@a.grep translators to !?@a.grep
13:44 colomon errr, hmmm.
13:44 colomon that's right, actually, isn't it?
13:45 moritz well, both end up calling List.Bool
13:45 * moritz doesn't see anything wrong
13:45 PerlJam greetings fellow perl6ers
13:46 colomon rakudo: my @a := 1, -> $n is copy { say ++$n; $n; } ... 20; say !@a.grep(* !%% 13)
13:46 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«Bool::False␤»
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13:47 * colomon needs to stop fiddling around with p6 and get back to work
13:47 colomon niecza: my @a := 1, -> $n is copy { say ++$n; $n; } ... 20; say ?@a.grep(* %% 13)
13:47 p6eval niecza v6-167-g6cff873: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Nominal type check failed in binding $v is rw in CORE prefix:<++>; got Mu, needed Any␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 0 (CORE prefix:<++> @ 0) ␤  at /tmp/LsEbplSSHe line 1 (MAIN C1_ANON @ 1) ␤  at
13:47 p6eval ../home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 1537 (C…
13:48 colomon niecza: my @a := 1, -> $n { say $n + 1; $n + 1; } ... 20; say ?@a.grep(* %% 13)
13:48 p6eval niecza v6-167-g6cff873: OUTPUT«2␤3␤4␤5␤6␤7␤8␤9␤10␤11␤12␤13␤Bool::True␤»
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14:01 PerlJam I just compiled nom again and I'm really having a hard time getting used to it being so fast  :-)
14:01 benabik joined #perl6
14:01 PerlJam It surprises me every time.
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14:02 tadzik :)
14:03 llabthgie joined #perl6
14:03 moritz PerlJam: I can volunteer to implement a --with-breaks option that eases the transition for you :-)
14:03 PerlJam heh
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14:08 jnthn lol :)
14:08 jnthn Happy it's a better experience. :)
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14:21 PerlJam I'm looking forward to the day when I'm *not* surprised by how fast rakudo compiles  :)
14:22 moritz oh well, it will slow down again when we add more stuff to the setting :-)
14:25 arnsholt I tried compiling Perl 5 the other day. Definitely took longer =)
14:25 tadzik ha! :P
14:26 moritz arnsholt: I'm a bit surprised... if you include the time for parrot and nqp in the rakudo build
14:26 moritz (and don't count the tests in both cases)
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14:26 moritz might also depends on the number of parallel compilation processes
14:26 PerlJam I don't know ... perl 5 does a lot of things to make sure execution is faster
14:26 lichtkind TimToady: you got mail :)
14:27 arnsholt moritz: Yeah, I didn't include parrot, that's true
14:28 moritz though parallelized parrot rebuild with ccache isn't slow either
14:28 moritz but then you have to consider ccache for perl 5 too
14:28 * jnthn wonders how well the Rakudo build parallelizes.
14:29 moritz not well at all
14:29 moritz the dynpmcs do
14:29 moritz but the rest mostly not
14:29 moritz maybe building the blib/Perl6/*.pbc things
14:29 moritz setting compilation: not at all
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14:33 jnthn Setting compilation kinda can't.
14:33 PerlJam I just helped our very staid accountant do something on a system I don't use in a language I don't know and it worked :-) and the accountant actually shouted "yay!".  It's the largest expression of emotion I've ever seen from her.
14:34 moritz configuring and building perl 5 (blead) from scratch: 6 minutes
14:35 moritz now trying rakudo + nqp + parrot
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14:38 moritz parrot build finished, now on to nqp...
14:38 * PerlJam idly wonders where "blead" actually originated.
14:38 moritz "bleading edge" - like leading edge, but sometimes a bit painful
14:39 PerlJam Aye, I know what it means, but where was it first used?
14:39 PerlJam who first came up with it?
14:39 moritz probably any < damian TimToady tchrist > on p5p :-) (just guessing)
14:40 thou joined #perl6
14:40 PerlJam as much as its usage pervades hackerdom, it could be one of those things perl culture borrowed for all I know
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14:48 PerlJam moritz: doesn't building perl also compile a bunch of modules?  For it to be a fair timing comparision, you'd have to discount those too
14:48 llabthgie left #perl6
14:48 moritz nom + nqp + parrot: 7m41
14:48 llabthgie joined #perl6
14:48 moritz PerlJam: well, I don't want to spend much more time on that
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15:03 Kaedenn So, um, I see the following line in Perl6: my $*endsym = "null";
15:03 Kaedenn What does the * do in that context, if anything?
15:03 PerlJam deja vu
15:03 PerlJam (I just saw that on #perl :)
15:03 moritz Kaedenn: dynamic variable
15:03 Kaedenn Um.
15:03 PerlJam Kaedenn: See S02
15:03 * Kaedenn smiles and nods
15:03 Kaedenn Okay.
15:04 Kaedenn Which section?
15:04 wamba joined #perl6
15:04 PerlJam Kaedenn: um ... search for "twigil"
15:05 silug left #perl6
15:05 Kaedenn Aha!
15:05 Kaedenn Okay, that's what I was looking for. Thanks.
15:06 betterworld joined #perl6
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15:07 Kaedenn God this is making my head hurt.
15:07 Kaedenn left #perl6
15:07 moritz just one new dimension
15:09 JimmyZ good evening, #perl6
15:10 slavik JimmyZ: wrong timezone :P
15:11 tzhs left #perl6
15:11 JimmyZ slavik: then s/evening/*/ ;)
15:11 slavik ^^
15:11 slavik damn straight
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15:12 slavik JimmyZ: you be from nearby mother country :D
15:12 benabik I say "Good morning" to people in my own timezone well into the PM, so I don't really care what greeting people use on IRC.  :-D
15:13 betterworld joined #perl6
15:13 JimmyZ well, maybe I'm from the future
15:14 huf the perl6 greeting is * *, * anyway
15:14 huf i learned that from TimToady
15:14 moritz though 'good *, *' is also acceptable
15:15 slavik well, he is a linguist, which would make him more qualified than any/most of us in that regard
15:15 huf slavik: * * * * * * :)
15:15 slavik exactly!
15:15 slavik http://bash.org/?244321
15:15 slavik reminds me of that
15:17 PerlJam All of the *s remind me of crontabs
15:18 benabik A crontab entry of * * * * * means someone needs to have login privs revoked.
15:19 moritz benabik: depends on what the job does
15:19 huf removes login privileges :D
15:19 JimmyZ I didn't recall crontabs, most Perl 6
15:19 moritz benabik: once per minute isn't too bad if what it does is reliably < 1s
15:20 benabik moritz: Still, uhg.  I'd rather something like that just be a daemon than forcing crond to wake every minute and spawn a process.
15:20 benabik moritz: But I guess I see your point.
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15:36 TimToady it's hard to know how best to do it in Japanese--since the word boundaries are not very distinct from morpheme boundaries, you could justify anything from ** to *****
15:36 birdwindupbird joined #perl6
15:36 TimToady o hayou go zai masu
15:37 TimToady oh, and that's without the minna san on the end :)
15:37 TimToady so make it *******
15:38 TimToady but * *, * works too :)
15:39 TimToady I guess that'd really have to be **,*
15:39 cooper joined #perl6
15:39 TimToady .u *
15:39 phenny U+FF0A FULLWIDTH ASTERISK (*)
15:39 TimToady or more likely **、*
15:41 TimToady .u ,
15:41 phenny U+FF0C FULLWIDTH COMMA (,)
15:41 TimToady .u 、
15:41 phenny U+3001 IDEOGRAPHIC COMMA (、)
15:44 TimToady so how come there's an IDEOGRAPHIC SPACE but no FULLWIDTH SPACE?  :)
15:47 mj41 left #perl6
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15:51 pmichaud maybe it's ideotic.
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16:03 Eevee 「なにか」
16:03 icwiener joined #perl6
16:06 TimToady or 何か, since Japanese is rather TMTOWTDI :)
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16:09 Eevee yes, I've seen many a comparison drawn to Perl
16:09 Eevee I wouldn't be surprised to find $_ aliased to $は someday  :P
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16:22 icwiener Hi, small question: What kind of regexpes does the smart match operator expect?
16:24 PerlJam what kind?
16:25 PerlJam icwiener: what do you mean?
16:26 icwiener PerlJam: Well, I use a regular expression that works fine with plain grep but Perl6 gives me a syntax error there. if $line ~~ /^\#.*20[01][0-9]\.$/ {
16:26 icwiener So I thought Perl6 might use a different style of regular expressions.
16:26 PerlJam oh!
16:26 PerlJam perl 6 expects Perl 6 regex  :)
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16:27 PerlJam icwiener: Perl 6 has refactored regex syntax somewhat so, for instance, character classes are now <[0..9]> instead of [0-9]
16:27 icwiener Hmm,, the ones I saw pretty much looked the same as the usual extended regexp I used to use in Perl 5.
16:28 icwiener Oh!
16:28 PerlJam but maybe you want to use \d instead ?
16:28 icwiener That explains a bit. :)
16:29 icwiener Is there something to read about the new syntax?
16:29 PerlJam icwiener: well, there's https://github.com/perlpilot/perl6-doc​s/blob/master/intro/p6-regex-intro.pod
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16:30 PerlJam icwiener: and there's https://github.com/perl6/spe​cs/blob/master/S05-regex.pod
16:30 PerlJam icwiener: and there's http://szabgab.com/blog/20​09/07/perl-6-regexes.html
16:33 icwiener Thanks a lot. I just read http://strangelyconsistent​.org/blog/june-13-regexes and felt confident enought to try it. :D
16:33 PerlJam masak++
16:34 icwiener Yep, great series of articles.
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16:43 TimToady niecza: /^\#.*20[01][0-9]\.$/
16:44 p6eval niecza v6-167-g6cff873: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m␤␤Any()No unspace allowed in regex; if you meant to match the literal character, please enclose in single quotes ('#') or use a backslashed form like \xXX at /tmp/t1jJyKgLUM line 1:␤------> [32m/^\[33m⏏[31m#.*20[01][0-9]\.$/[0m␤␤Parse
16:44 p6eval ..failed␤␤»
16:44 TimToady std: /^\#.*20[01][0-9]\.$/
16:44 p6eval std 37a0cdd: OUTPUT«Invalid conversion in sprintf: "%M" at /usr/local/share/perl/5.10.1/STD.pm line 57286.␤[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m␤No unspace allowed in regex; if you meant to match the literal character, please enclose in single quotes ('#') or use a backslashed form like \x%M->{02}x at
16:44 p6eval ../tmp/7…
16:44 TimToady interesting
16:44 PerlJam and LTA  :)
16:44 TimToady std: /^'#'.*20[01][0-9]\.$/
16:44 p6eval std 37a0cdd: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m␤Invalid regex metacharacter (must be quoted to match literally) at /tmp/unXX94pgrf line 1:␤------> [32m/^'#'.*20[01][0-[33m⏏[31m9]\.$/[0m␤Potential difficulties:␤  [01] appears to be an old-school character class; please use <[01]> if you␤
16:44 p6eval ..mean…
16:45 TimToady std: /^'#'.*20<[01]>[0-9]\.$/
16:45 p6eval std 37a0cdd: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m␤Invalid regex metacharacter (must be quoted to match literally) at /tmp/h3xU4Nl4Fz line 1:␤------> [32m/^'#'.*20<[01]>[0-[33m⏏[31m9]\.$/[0m␤Potential difficulties:␤  [0-9] appears to be an old-school character class; digits should be matched
16:45 p6eval ..with …
16:45 TimToady std: /^'#'.*20<[01]>\d\.$/
16:45 p6eval std 37a0cdd: OUTPUT«ok 00:01 121m␤»
16:45 TimToady std: / ^ '#' .* 20 <[01]> \d \. $ /
16:45 p6eval std 37a0cdd: OUTPUT«ok 00:01 121m␤»
16:46 TimToady happyspace!
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17:10 thou thanks, i'm getting back online now
17:10 thou for some reason my wireless stopped transmitting
17:10 thou erm, sorry, wrong channel
17:11 TimToady it's pretty hard to be offtopic here :)
17:11 benabik thou: welcome back anyway.  :-D
17:12 thou lol
17:12 thou thanks
17:12 TimToady since Perl 6 will solve all the problems of the world including wireless dropouts
17:13 TimToady so I guess only death and taxes are offtopic here...
17:14 thou maybe perl6 could help with the *fear* of death
17:14 thou which is, i imagine, worse than the real thing
17:14 slavik perl6 will also solve the world hunger problem?
17:14 TimToady of course
17:15 slavik and global warming and energy crisis?
17:15 TimToady it will make everyone into sedentary programmers
17:15 TimToady so they'll need less energy
17:15 slavik nice
17:15 slavik I am already fat :(
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17:16 TimToady yes, but then everyone else will be fat too, and we will redefine the norm
17:17 thou left #perl6
17:17 flussence somewhat on-topic: I've read a story about one compiler from the 80s/90s, where a single bugfix saved all the devs a few thousand kWh in electricity bills in the long run...
17:17 thou joined #perl6
17:17 flussence (it was pretty similar to the ld -> gold thing going on today, actually)
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17:31 masak bom tarde, #perl6
17:31 phenny masak: 15 Jun 23:04Z <TimToady> tell masak methinks you said "right side" when you meant "left side"
17:31 masak probably. I do that a lot...
17:32 * jnthn boms the tarde
17:32 TimToady colomon: you should add your solution to http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Pi someday
17:32 benabik left #perl6
17:32 TimToady and there's a misspelling in the same paragraph, but phenny was down when I noticed it
17:32 masak TimToady: thanks, twice. fixing.
17:33 colomon TimToady: Probably.  :)
17:33 masak it's slightly doubtful I'll have time to blog today. but I'll try my best.
17:34 tadzik hello masak
17:35 masak czesc tadzik
17:35 tadzik hej
17:35 masak ;)
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17:42 masak the difference between left and right bothers me. there's nothing *a priori* to tell them apart.
17:42 pmichaud jnthn: ping
17:44 jnthn pmichaud: pong
17:44 masak just as we might have picked -i as the imaginary base, and no-one would be able to tell the difference. (may that's what happened!) :P
17:46 pmichaud jnthn: never mind, I figured out what was going on.  I couldn't see why I was getting an error on binding to an attribute (it was an operator precedence problem)
17:46 jnthn pmichaud: ah, k :)
17:47 pmichaud oh, imcc, how do I hate thee?  Let me count the ways......
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17:48 * moritz guesses that pmichaud is aware of the utter lack of methods in Parcel, and works on related stuff anyway
17:48 pmichaud yes, I'm aware.
17:48 pmichaud I'm redoing Parcel/List/Array at the moment anyway.
17:48 pmichaud vi l5
17:48 pmichaud ww
17:51 TimToady masak: your premise is arguably incorrect, since there's http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CP_violation you'd have to argue that you can't tell forward from backward in time
17:52 colomon pmichaud: redoing them in nom?  Is that in the sense of fixing up nom's versions, or actual improvements over master?
17:53 pmichaud actual improvements over master
17:53 pmichaud I'm even working on equivalent new versions in master
17:53 pmichaud don't know if they'll result in any significant performance improvements (they should), but they'll certainly be cleaner than what master has now
17:55 colomon \o/
17:55 masak TimToady: while I appreciate the logic of that, my heart tells me otherwise... :)
17:55 * colomon is switching from one frustrating task for $work (still completely non-functioning) to a different frustrating task for $work
17:55 * moritz guesses that pmichaud will stumble over some list/iterator issus in the meta ops while doing things more correctly
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17:56 * colomon is listening to a Fleet Foxes concert, on the bright side
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17:58 TimToady masak: your heart is also not completely left-right symmetrical
18:00 masak :P
18:01 masak augh, there's no axiomatic basis anywhere!
18:02 PerlJam masak: There's a mathematician who has some interesting things to say about axiomatic systems; you should read him some time  ;-)
18:03 TimToady "no axiomantic basis" is a rather axiomatic assertion...
18:03 masak TimToady: well, it depends... I've been going back and forth on that one.
18:03 TimToady perhaps we can build up Church axioms from that  :P
18:04 TimToady though we'd have to prove that the next axiom is both derived from and could not possibly be derived from the previous axiom...
18:05 TimToady that's where I go back and forth :)
18:05 pmichaud moritz: stumble in master, you mean?
18:06 moritz pmichaud: yes
18:06 pmichaud perhaps.  it was actually in the role stuff that I got blocked yesterday.
18:06 pmichaud but that's actually fortunate, as it forced me to go back and rethink things yet again :)
18:06 masak "there are no universal truths" is a pretty self-defeating statement. the problem with slaying logic in the first blow is a bit similar to destroying the boat after just setting out from the shore.
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18:07 masak it doesn't get you very far. :)
18:07 TimToady well, but if it's all relative than you can't quantify "very far" very well :)
18:07 TimToady *then
18:08 masak :P
18:08 pmichaud never argue with a linguist.  :)
18:08 masak so the consolation is that I won't know how much I've failed? :P
18:08 masak I think I'll head back to utter certainty now... :)
18:15 masak on the other hand, a postmodernist theorem prover should be a breeze to implement.
18:16 PerlJam Does "utter certainty" even exist?
18:16 masak oh, I'm sure it does.
18:17 PerlJam yeah, but I think many cultures call that "God" or something
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18:20 PerlJam chromatic is funny
18:24 masak he is.
18:26 masak anything in particular? http://www.modernperlbooks.com/mt/2011/​06/meaning-mechanism-type-tyranny.html , perhaps?
18:29 PerlJam yes, the parenthetical bit near the beginning gives some insight into his how his brain works  ;)
18:30 moritz somehow I don't understand the point
18:30 moritz having the option to write custom arrays that use the built-in syntax seem to solve the big problem he mentions
18:31 moritz so to me it looks like a problem specific to perl 5, not dynamic languages and their types in general
18:31 moritz there could be a deeper point I'm missing, though
18:31 masak I always get the feeling chromatic has something important and noteworthy to express. I'm not always convinced biting sarcasm helps get the point across in the best way possible. but it's usually enjoyable to read.
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18:35 masak first link in paragraph "Then I read..." looks broken.
18:35 masak I meant to tell chromatic, but I can't find him on IRC.
18:35 masak maybe Twitter will serve.
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18:42 sorear good * #perl6
18:43 masak sorear! \o/
18:48 sorear masak: down to 18 lines of changes in yapsi/niecza, some of which I think are worth merging to master
18:48 sorear like yapsi/master uses $obj1 eq $obj2 in a few places
18:49 sorear I think this is a bug waiting to happen... what if $obj1 === $obj2, but the first call triggers a garbage collection which changes the object's address?
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19:03 masak sorear: agreed.
19:03 masak sorear: I've been meaning to look at the diff and perhaps blog about it.
19:04 masak it will be a few days before I have that kind of time; probably sometime early next week.
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19:17 * colomon is having one of those "nothing is working" days
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19:19 colomon ack.
19:19 PerlJam colomon: that's okay, I'm having one of those "can't get motivated to do anything productive" days
19:19 hudnix left #perl6
19:19 colomon PerlJam: not really sure which is worse
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19:20 colomon so, MAIN(Int $n) doesn't work?
19:20 PerlJam I think it's mainly because I have these ideas of things I want to work on for $work, but I have to put together a narrative for a proposal by tomorrow and that's more important but less fun.
19:21 masak moritz: today, researching Perl 5's pseudo-package SUPER, I realized that it actually does handle MRO and MI. I'm not advocating putting it back into Perl 6 (because nextsame et al are just fine), but I no longer see a conceptual problem with having it there.
19:24 moritz masak: but it is otherwise completely insane
19:24 masak right, exactly.
19:24 PerlJam heh
19:24 moritz ie it's not tied to an invocant, but to the current package
19:25 masak it just struck me that the "won't work with MI" objection wasn't very strong, since it does work with MI in Perl 5.
19:25 moritz but does it work *well* with MI in Perl 5?
19:25 masak I didn't say that. :)
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19:25 colomon what I'm seeing (this is in master): MAIN(Int $n) doesn't work.  MAIN($n) works, but then hides MAIN("test") (ie if the command-line argument is "test", MAIN($n) is called.  Help?
19:26 masak I don't plan to use MI much in Perl 5. Perl 5 has Moose, and Moose has roles.
19:26 masak colomon: the former is well-known. the latter sounds weird and new.
19:26 masak colomon: are those really multis?
19:27 masak rakudo: sub MAIN("test") {}; sub MAIN($n) {}
19:27 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Cannot re-declare sub &MAIN without declaring it multi at line 22, near ""␤»
19:27 masak guess so :)
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19:28 colomon masak: https://gist.github.com/1030030
19:28 moritz colomon: re-order the mutlis
19:28 masak huh, what?
19:28 moritz colomon: thing is, the main helper doesn't do a proper multi dispatch (yet)
19:28 masak ah.
19:29 * masak didn't know that
19:29 masak is that filed?
19:29 colomon moritz++
19:29 moritz but it just iterates over the candidates, and invokes the first one it finds
19:29 moritz erm, the first one it can bind to
19:29 * masak submits rakudobug
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19:31 Moukeddar_ Hi guys , hope you're all fine
19:32 masak Moukeddar_: hi Moukeddar_ of the abundant whitespace ;)
19:32 tadzik hello Moukeddar_
19:32 Moukeddar_ you noticed that ?
19:33 Moukeddar_ what's cooking in the labs?
19:34 masak well, jnthn++ is working on nom, sorear++ is hacking away on Niecza, and the rest of as are (to a first approximation) awestruck by their productivity. :)
19:34 moritz masak: btw I'm working on https://github.com/moritz/WebService-Libris right now
19:34 masak us*
19:34 masak moritz: ooh
19:36 moritz it has neither tests nor documentation right now :/
19:38 leprevost left #perl6
19:39 Moukeddar_ so you think you can code ?
19:39 Moukeddar_ that's a show :)
19:40 masak Moukeddar_: sorry, what do you mean?
19:40 Moukeddar_ you know the TV shows , Dance with the stars , America got talent , so you think you can dance etc...
19:41 masak ah.
19:41 Moukeddar_ please please , overlook the spaces:)
19:41 masak in this case, quotes would've helped more :P
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19:41 Moukeddar_ yes, certainly
19:41 masak it's the ol' use-mention distinction. some of us are very into that one.
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19:42 Moukeddar_ i can  tell
19:43 masak Moukeddar is 185 cm tall, but "Moukeddar" is 8 characters wide :)
19:43 Moukeddar_ lol
19:43 Moukeddar_ middle value is always the best
19:43 masak well, those two units aren't fungible.
19:44 flussence rakudo: say "Moukeddar".split.uniq.join.chars
19:44 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«No applicable candidates found to dispatch to for 'split'. Available candidates are:␤:(Mu : Regex $matcher, Any $limit = { ... }, Any :all($all);; *%_)␤:(Mu : Any $delimiter, Any $limit = { ... }, Any :all($all);; *%_)␤␤  in main program body at line 22:/tmp/w3g5q22gG0␤»
19:44 moritz flussence: try .comb
19:44 flussence I seem to have misplaced my clue today :)
19:44 masak btw, uniq isn't spec'd. maybe someone should spec it.
19:44 flussence rakudo: say "Moukeddar".comb.uniq.join.chars
19:44 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«8␤»
19:44 masak I'm curious how the spec for uniq would read.
19:44 Moukeddar_ the one and the five?N
19:45 Moukeddar_ do you guys use mocking?
19:45 tadzik yes
19:45 masak oops, sorry. 9 characters wide. :)
19:45 masak Moukeddar_: I used it today at work.
19:46 Moukeddar_ pretty useful, but all the web is teaching you how to use existing libs , what if you wanted to make your own ?
19:46 masak Moukeddar_: I didn't use a lib. I just wrote the code I needed.
19:46 moritz Moukeddar_: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aAb7hSCtvGw
19:47 Moukeddar_ i as a try, i created a  FakeRepository which implemented the IRepository , i guess that's the principle , right?
19:48 masak aye, sounds like a good start.
19:48 Moukeddar_ moritz, kisses and hugs to you
19:48 lue hello zebras o/
19:48 Moukeddar_ and the FakeRepository would return specific items/values i hard-coded
19:48 moritz Moukeddar_: that's a bit... over-enthusiastic
19:49 Moukeddar_ it's completely normal
19:49 moritz depends on the culture
19:49 Moukeddar_ i guess
19:50 masak lue: hello little panda
19:51 tadzik lue: o/
19:51 masak yes, we don't have a kissbot ;)
19:51 Moukeddar_ you should have one
19:51 masak I'm not so sure...
19:52 masak we're pretty radical with the hugs already, compared to other channels.
19:52 tadzik i prefer hugs, especially when it comes to the male population
19:52 moritz same here
19:52 Moukeddar_ homophobic?
19:52 moritz a bit, yes
19:52 masak well, it's mostly a cultural thing.
19:53 Moukeddar_ lol
19:53 tadzik no, but heterosexual. I don't mind anyone doing anything, I'm speaking for myself
19:53 Moukeddar_ there's nothing wrong with hugs and kisses
19:53 tadzik I didn't say there is
19:53 moritz I don't mind either as long as no man tries to kiss me
19:54 masak "to kiss someone" is quite a wide phenomenon in English. could be anything from a peck to making out.
19:54 Moukeddar_ i kiss you = i love/like/respect you
19:54 masak or I'm the godfather.
19:55 lue masak: for some reason I thought your June 15 post would be about &chomp :)
19:55 Moukeddar_ hehe , you might
19:55 Moukeddar_ if you were they'd kiss your forehead
19:55 masak lue: oh! I didn't make the connection, even :P
19:55 wolverian I've been totally out of the loop when it comes to (#)perl6 for six months or so. anyone want to summarize what's happened? :>
19:56 tadzik ho ho ho :
19:56 tadzik :)
19:56 tadzik the new object model is almost there
19:56 tadzik the new module manager came around
19:56 masak wolverian! \o/
19:58 envi_laptop left #perl6
19:58 wolverian nom nom
20:00 sorear as opposed to the Spanish-speaking world, where "to kiss" doesn't necessarily have any romantic overtones
20:01 sorear wolverian: the toy Perl 6 compiler I've been working on is starting to make waves
20:01 moritz niecza: say '~' x 10
20:01 p6eval niecza v6-167-g6cff873: OUTPUT«~~~~~~~~~~␤»
20:01 moritz ~\o/~
20:01 Moukeddar_ left #perl6
20:02 masak niecza++
20:02 Moukeddar joined #perl6
20:02 wolverian I haven't thought of niecza as a toy :)
20:02 colomon rakudo: say prime ... 10
20:02 p6eval rakudo 248244:  ( no output )
20:03 colomon yeah, that.  where's the error?
20:03 colomon niecza: say prime ... 10
20:03 p6eval niecza v6-167-g6cff873: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m␤␤Undeclared routine:␤     'prime' used at line 1␤␤Unhandled exception: Check failed␤␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/boot/lib/CORE.setting line 469 (CORE die @ 2) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/src/niecza line 185 (MAIN P6.comp_unit @ 30) ␤  at
20:03 p6eval ../home/p6eval/niecza/sr…
20:03 sorear colomon: ( no output ) usually means segfault
20:04 colomon sorear: it's not segfaulting locally, rakudo just silently dies
20:04 Moukeddar left #perl6
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20:04 colomon and of course, that's totally not something that should make it segfault
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20:07 sorear Why does p6eval use a temporary file for output, moritz?
20:09 moritz sorear: because that seemed like the easiest way back then when I implemented it
20:09 moritz sorear: no SIGPIPE, no deadlocks
20:09 * moritz is pretty clueless about IPC
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20:20 wolverian huh. nom passes tests.
20:21 moritz yes, a few of them
20:26 benabik left #perl6
20:27 wolverian right, I was running just "make test"
20:27 lichtkind wolverian: cool to see you again
20:27 wolverian thanks!
20:28 masak wolverian: yeah, nice to have you back. hope things are good with you, too.
20:29 tadzik what, make test passes something on nom?
20:30 wolverian my local nom branch was accidentally tracking master. :)
20:31 M_o_C joined #perl6
20:31 masak that's cheating :)
20:31 thou joined #perl6
20:31 tadzik :)
20:31 wolverian masak: nice to be back. I have a full-time perl job now.
20:32 masak wolverian: congratulations! hope it's satisfying, too.
20:32 bluescreen10 left #perl6
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20:33 wolverian it has been.
20:40 wolverian real nom passes some tests, yes. not all. :)
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22:36 * sorear wanders back
22:36 sorear wolverian: not a toy eh? :D
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23:00 masak blog post! http://strangelyconsistent.org​/blog/june-16-2011-subroutines
23:00 * masak sleeps
23:00 masak 'night, #perl6
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23:16 Krunch perl6: say (2, 3, 1)>>.&sleep
23:16 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT«<Error><Error><Error>␤»
23:16 p6eval ..niecza v6-167-g6cff873: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m␤␤Undeclared routine:␤     'sleep' used at line 1␤␤Unhandled exception: Check failed␤␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/boot/lib/CORE.setting line 469 (CORE die @ 2) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/src/niecza line 185 (MAIN P6.comp_unit @ 30) ␤  at
23:16 p6eval ../home/p6eval/niecza/sr…
23:16 p6eval ..rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«231␤»
23:24 TimToady given that no guarantees are made about threading hyperops, the best you can say is that it'll sleep from 3 to 6 seconds
23:26 TimToady and given that hyper specifically declares you don't care about side effect interactions, you won't get a better promise than that from Perl 6
23:27 TimToady hyper *does* guarantee to return the results in the original order though
23:27 Krunch i wasn't really hoping for more :)
23:27 TimToady so rakudo is correct there
23:27 TimToady the other failures were amusing :)
23:28 Krunch in p5 i ended up with perl -ne'fork&&sleep$_,print,last'
23:28 Krunch this is from http://dis.4chan.org/read/prog/1295544154 for people who didn't follow
23:29 sorear the niecza error is because somebody put token prefix:sleep { <sym> <O(%named_unary) } in the parser :)
23:29 am0c joined #perl6
23:29 sorear so... you want .&prefix:<sleep>
23:30 Krunch ah, thanks
23:30 TimToady perl6: say sleep«(2,3,1)
23:30 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Confused at line 22, near "say sleep\x{ab}"␤»
23:30 p6eval ..niecza v6-167-g6cff873: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Asynchronous programming NYI␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 570 (CORE die @ 2) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 1631 (CORE prefix:<sleep> @ 2) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 1407 (CORE hyperunary @
23:30 p6eval ..56) ␤  at /home…
23:30 p6eval ..pugs: OUTPUT«decodeUTF8': bad data: '\171'␤*** No such subroutine: "&sleep\194\171"␤    at /tmp/rDvwrLkrAz line 1, column 5 - line 2, column 1␤»
23:31 TimToady also amusing :)
23:31 TimToady perl6: say sleep<<(2,3,1)
23:31 p6eval rakudo 248244: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Confused at line 22, near "say sleep<"␤»
23:31 p6eval ..niecza v6-167-g6cff873: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Asynchronous programming NYI␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 570 (CORE die @ 2) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 1631 (CORE prefix:<sleep> @ 2) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 1407 (CORE hyperunary @
23:31 p6eval ..56) ␤  at /home…
23:31 p6eval ..pugs: OUTPUT«*** No such subroutine: "&sleep<<"␤    at /tmp/Yor66GwhT2 line 1, column 5 - line 2, column 1␤»
23:32 sorear oops
23:33 TimToady pretty nice traceback though
23:35 TimToady would be interesting to see a Haskell backend for niecza someday...
23:35 rafiot joined #perl6
23:35 sorear why?
23:36 TimToady we could have an up-to-date(r) pugs
23:37 TimToady and Haskell will be glad to tell us exactly why it's impossible :)
23:42 lichtkind TimToady: thanks for reacting and dont worry johan cleans up the latex mess after you :)
23:43 * sorear is rewriting add_categorical to allow for is tigther
23:44 lichtkind cheers sorear
23:51 donri left #perl6
23:53 daniel-s about modules and packages
23:53 daniel-s what I get now is that there is a definite hierarchy
23:53 daniel-s it goes packages -> modules -> class
23:54 daniel-s where the lower down you go, the more functionality you have, but it covers a narrower part of the code
23:55 daniel-s ...well, nobody has corrected me, so I must be correct, :)
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