Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2011-12-27

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
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01:59 thou nom: role Base { has @.xyz = 1; }; role A does Base { }; role B does Base { }; class Example does A does B { }
01:59 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Attribute '@!xyz' conflicts in role composition␤»
01:59 thou nom: role Base { method foo() { say "foo" } }; role A does Base { }; role B does Base { }; class Example does A does B { }
01:59 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Method 'foo' must be resolved by class Example because it exists in multiple roles (B, A)␤»
02:00 thou ^ are these correct results? known bugs? something I should file bug reports for?
02:01 thou i expect them both to work, and just accept the (single) definition in the Base role
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02:12 sorear thou: I think that diamond composition is known-broken, but I'm not positive
02:12 donri left #perl6
02:12 thou thanks
02:12 sorear phenny: tell jnthn http://irclog.perlgeek.de/perl6/2011-12-27#i_4883396 I'd like a second opinion
02:12 phenny sorear: I'll pass that on when jnthn is around.
02:13 colomon I've been poking around in the spec tests, I haven't found any test vaguely resembling that yet.  :(
02:14 sorear o/ colomon
02:14 sorear how are you today?
02:14 colomon \o
02:14 colomon a little bit under the weather, a little bit worn out from yesterday.  :)
02:14 colomon are you recovered yet?
02:15 sorear yes
02:15 colomon glad to hear it.
02:15 colomon ooo, and I see there was a release!  sorear++
02:16 sorear whatever that was, it was freakishly short.  anyone who didn't know better could assume I was making excuses to avoid attending the Christmas eve party I was supposed to be at
02:17 sorear thanks
02:19 colomon we had that sort of thing run through the whole extended family at Christmas back in 1985 or so.  20 cases of 24 hour flu with the first cases starting right at time to go to the Christmas Eve church service.  (literally our car left went to church without knowing anything was wrong, and the cars that were supposed to follow us never left because of the sudden vomiting.)
02:21 sorear My first attempt to parse that sentence involved catestrophic brake failure and your car leaving your hourse without you.
02:21 sorear house
02:22 sorear but this wasn't even 24 hour flu.  more like 12AM-10PM flu.
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02:31 colomon ah, yeah.  no, we sat in church wondering what the heck happened to everyone else.
02:33 colomon like we were the Golgafrinch's B Ark
02:35 colomon nom: say "a" cmp Inf
02:35 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«-1␤»
02:35 colomon niecza: say "a" cmp Inf
02:35 p6eval niecza v13: OUTPUT«-5␤»
02:35 colomon -5?
02:35 colomon :)
02:36 sorear I'm not entirely usre myself...
02:36 sorear however, cmp in niecza is very, very bogus
02:36 sorear niecza: say "a" leg "f"
02:36 p6eval niecza v13: OUTPUT«-5␤»
02:37 sorear the classic way to implement strcmp involves a return *a - *b once *a != *b
02:37 sorear which niecza seems to be doing, at some level
02:37 sorear but how did Inf become something starting with f?
02:38 * sorear goes source-digging
02:39 sorear niecza: say Str leg Num
02:39 p6eval niecza v13: OUTPUT«-5␤»
02:39 sorear niecza: say ~Num
02:39 p6eval niecza v13: OUTPUT«Num()␤»
02:39 sorear niecza: say ~Str
02:39 p6eval niecza v13: OUTPUT«Str()␤»
02:39 sorear niecza: say "S" leg "N"
02:39 p6eval niecza v13: OUTPUT«5␤»
02:40 * sorear isn't totally sure how this is working
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02:46 colomon wait, that's the code I was looking at last week
02:46 colomon it does Str leg Num because they are different types, right?
02:47 shinobicl_ just asking... is there another rakudo star in development?
02:48 colomon shinobicl_: yes
02:48 colomon sorear: ERROR: cannot verify github.com’s certificate -- that's what I get from make in Niecza?!
02:48 sorear colomon: yes, but I can't figure out why the result comes out negative.
02:49 colomon shinobicl_: as soon as the current development Rakudo has its act together fully, a Rakudo Star will be cut from it.
02:49 colomon sorear: oh, Str leg Num, you mean?
02:49 dalek niecza: bfba5a3 | sorear++ | Makefile:
02:49 dalek niecza: Revert "github.com has a valid SSL certificate now"
02:49 dalek niecza:
02:49 dalek niecza: Ah, optimism.
02:49 dalek niecza:
02:49 dalek niecza: This reverts commit 66cefa779d65646bca9f8fc7effbc46d08c6bdde.
02:49 dalek niecza: review: https://github.com/sorear/niecza/commit/bfba5a3546
02:49 sorear colomon: yes
02:50 colomon sorear++ for the quick patch!
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03:11 colomon btw, I like the looks of your niecza plans (re the release announcement), but I have to say that #3 and #4 seem drastically more important for my purposes.  ;)
03:14 sorear ...I forgot to update those from last month.
03:19 colomon I wondered what the heck you had left to do for regexes!  :)
03:23 colomon 'night!
03:26 sorear bye
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05:26 * djanatyn claims a new task!
05:26 djanatyn I should have time, since it's winter vacation :P
05:26 sorear task?
05:29 kaare_ joined #perl6
05:29 djanatyn For Google Code-In.
05:29 djanatyn I picked a bugfix task.
05:30 djanatyn Or, writing a test for a bugfix.
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05:33 sorear is that still going on?
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06:45 moritz djanatyn: I've now assigned the task to you, have fun!
06:46 sorear o/ moritz
06:54 moritz \o sorear
06:54 moritz sorear++ # v13
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08:24 masak morning, #perl6
08:24 masak sorear++ # v13
08:30 masak got an email. "Here’s my first pass solution at the first 3 problems on your list." o.O
08:30 masak oh noes, another moritz :P
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08:32 masak but... he's already ceded the prize. odd.
08:37 kshannon With the colonpair you can easily create unamed pairs (e.g. :(5) :<foo> :{ my $bar = 1; } ),  is there a way to write a signature to capture such an "unnamed" named argument?
08:38 masak perl6: say (:(5)).^name
08:38 p6eval niecza v13-1-gbfba5a3: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Unable to resolve method ast in class Any␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/src/NieczaActions.pm6 line 2122 (NieczaActions.parameter @ 2) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/src/STD.pm6 line 2931 (P6.parameter @ 234) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/src/STD.pm6 …
08:38 p6eval ..rakudo eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Signature␤»
08:38 p6eval ..pugs b927740: OUTPUT«*** ␤    Unexpected ")).^"␤    expecting signature or ")"␤    at /tmp/w23uZtGg5C line 1, column 9␤»
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08:38 masak :(5) is not an unnamed pair, it's a siggie.
08:39 kshannon Oops,  Good point :)
08:39 masak nom: say (:<foo>).^name
08:39 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Str␤»
08:39 masak nom: say (:{ my $bar = 1 }).^name
08:40 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Block␤»
08:40 masak none of these are pairs.
08:41 kshannon OK,  now I'm really confused.  I'm working on RT#53804.
08:44 moritz kshannon++ # rakudo pull requests
08:44 kshannon Bingo,  found the bit in the spec talking about adverbial blocks....
08:46 kshannon If anyone has a simple rakudobug they's like me to look at let me know,  otherwise I'm just going to start from the top of the RT query and skip anything which looks like it could take a couple of days or more.
08:47 masak kshannon: how about the latest one? https://rt.perl.org/rt3/Ticket/Display.html?id=107022
08:48 masak since it's a library thing, it's almost guaranteed to have a Perl 6 solution.
08:49 moritz nom: say set 1, 2, 3
08:49 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤CHECK FAILED:␤Undefined routine '&set' called (line 1)␤»
08:49 * masak sometimes wishes for a NOT_FIRST phaser
08:50 moritz that bug report seems to be about the 2011.07 release
08:50 moritz because nom doesn't have sets yet
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08:57 kshannon perl6: my @array = 1, 2, 3; say @array.min:{ $^b <=> $^a }
08:57 p6eval rakudo eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Method 'min:{ $^b <=> $^a }' not found for invocant of class 'Array'␤  in block <anon> at /tmp/ySWtGEoeOY:1␤  in <anon> at /tmp/ySWtGEoeOY:1␤»
08:57 p6eval ..pugs b927740, niecza v13-1-gbfba5a3: OUTPUT«3␤»
08:58 kshannon I've got a patch to fix rakudo's parsing for that,  but it still gets the wrong answer :(
08:58 kshannon ./perl6 -e 'my @array = 1, 2, 3; say @array.min:{ $^b <=> $^a }'
08:58 kshannon Inf
08:59 kshannon perl6: my @array = 1, 2, 3; say @array.min: { $^b <=> $^a }
08:59 p6eval pugs b927740, niecza v13-1-gbfba5a3: OUTPUT«3␤»
08:59 p6eval ..rakudo eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Inf␤»
09:00 masak huh.
09:00 masak it would get Inf, I guess, if it had *no* way of comparing elements.
09:01 masak rakudo: my @array = 1, 2, 3; say @array.min
09:01 p6eval rakudo eb6c4b: OUTPUT«1␤»
09:01 masak rakudo: my @array = 1, 2, 3; say @array.min({ -1 })
09:01 p6eval rakudo eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Inf␤»
09:01 masak rakudo: my @array = 1, 2, 3; say @array.min({ 1 })
09:01 p6eval rakudo eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Inf␤»
09:01 masak rakudo: my @array = 1, 2, 3; say @array.min({})
09:01 p6eval rakudo eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Method 'arity' not found for invocant of class 'Hash'␤  in method min at src/gen/CORE.setting:1058␤  in block <anon> at /tmp/tKQETi7Aae:1␤  in <anon> at /tmp/tKQETi7Aae:1␤»
09:01 masak rakudo: my @array = 1, 2, 3; say @array.min({;})
09:01 p6eval rakudo eb6c4b: OUTPUT«use of uninitialized value of type Nil in numeric context␤use of uninitialized value of type Nil in numeric context␤use of uninitialized value of type Nil in numeric context␤use of uninitialized value of type Nil in numeric context␤use of uninitialized value of typ…
09:02 masak rakudo: my @array = 1, 2, 3; say @array.min({42})
09:02 p6eval rakudo eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Inf␤»
09:02 masak rakudo: my @array = 1, 2, 3; say @array.min({ <-1 0 1>.pick.Int })
09:02 p6eval rakudo eb6c4b: OUTPUT«2␤»
09:02 masak :D
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09:05 kshannon It's because I was using a comparison sub with swapped arguments (i.e. actually looking for max)
09:06 kshannon It starts with Inf,  and then iterates looking for a smaller element...
09:07 kshannon perl6: my @array = 5, 6, 7, 1, 2, 3; say @array.min: { $^a <=> $^b }
09:07 p6eval pugs b927740, rakudo eb6c4b, niecza v13-1-gbfba5a3: OUTPUT«1␤»
09:08 kshannon perl6: my @array = 5, 6, 7, 1, 2, 3; say @array.min: { $^b <=> $^a }
09:08 p6eval niecza v13-1-gbfba5a3: OUTPUT«Rebuild in progress␤»
09:08 p6eval ..pugs b927740: OUTPUT«7␤»
09:08 p6eval ..rakudo eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Inf␤»
09:08 moritz it's just wrong to ues Inf in .min
09:09 masak aye.
09:09 kshannon perl6: my @array = (); say @array.min: { $^a <=> $^b }
09:09 p6eval niecza v13-1-gbfba5a3: OUTPUT«Any()␤»
09:09 p6eval ..rakudo eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Inf␤»
09:09 p6eval ..pugs b927740: OUTPUT«␤»
09:09 masak we've already proven that that doesn't work.
09:09 moritz the right way it is to  1) return the element if the list has just one item and 2) otherwise only compare items within the list
09:09 masak Inf is not sufficiently out-of-band for .min
09:09 kshannon especially if you want to do string min
09:09 moritz nor is it sufficiently safe to pass to custom compare blocks
09:09 moritz or any other min
09:09 moritz like
09:10 moritz ([1, 2], [-2, 5], [5, -5).min: { $^a[1] <=> $^b[1]}
09:12 masak right.
09:12 kshannon Do you think Any() is an appropriate answer for ().min
09:12 masak no, Inf is an appropriate *answer*.
09:13 masak not just appropriate to use inside the algorithm.
09:13 masak kshannon: the spec seems to be of the opinion that Inf can be used with Str. like "a"..Inf
09:14 kshannon Hmmm, OK.
09:15 masak Inf, like Failure, is a bit type-schizophrenic.
09:19 moritz hm
09:19 moritz nom: say [min] ()
09:19 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Inf␤»
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09:42 colomon woah, I really think Inf is *not* an appropriate answer for ().min
09:44 moritz so, what should it be? a Failure? Nil?
09:45 colomon My first inclination is Failure
09:47 colomon my second inclination is to go back to bed.  ;)
09:48 kshannon Yeah,  I'm not sure I agree with the idea: "All orderable object types must support C<+Inf> and C<-Inf> values as special forms of the undefined value."
09:48 moritz a tempting response
09:48 moritz (going to bed, that is)
09:51 kshannon And if that is going to be the case then I don't think this is right:
09:51 kshannon nom: say Inf.^name
09:51 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Num␤»
09:51 masak they're not "special forms of the undefined value" so much as "sentinel" values that always "win" a given comparison.
09:51 masak kshannon: now that I agree with.
09:52 masak kshannon: Inf and -Inf should probably both be of the type Inf :) or something
09:52 masak and then maybe Inf ~~ <any comparable type>
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10:15 masak tadzik++ # https://gist.github.com/1522280
10:20 kshannon While we're on the subject of min/max,  I'm not sure that Range should be accepting a comparator (RT#105118 and tests 9, 10, 15, and 21 in t/spec/S32-list/minmax.t)
10:21 kshannon If it does, then what does it do with excluded endpoints?
10:24 masak kshannon: Range is mostly a "continuum" these days, but the exception is when it's used as a list; then it collapses into discrete values. .min and friends are such an exception.
10:25 masak re what it does with excluded endpoints: it excludes them. :)
10:25 kshannon perl6: say (3 ^.. 5).min;
10:25 p6eval pugs b927740: OUTPUT«4␤»
10:25 p6eval ..rakudo eb6c4b, niecza v13-1-gbfba5a3: OUTPUT«3␤»
10:26 kshannon So only pugs is right?
10:27 masak I... I think so.
10:27 kshannon perl6: say (3 ^.. 5).excludes_min;
10:27 p6eval rakudo eb6c4b, niecza v13-1-gbfba5a3: OUTPUT«Bool::True␤»
10:27 p6eval ..pugs b927740: OUTPUT«*** No such method in class Array: "&excludes_min"␤    at /tmp/uCIRWSoSRX line 1, column 5-27␤»
10:28 moritz I think that niecza and rakudo conform to the spec, weird as it is
10:30 kshannon Yeah,  just found the bit in the spec which has excludes_min
10:31 kshannon But that means .min (with no comparator) has to return an excluded min.
10:31 masak I don't like that.
10:32 kshannon I think I'm going to put an e-mail together for p6lang
10:32 masak please do.
10:33 moritz the problem is that Range.min returns either a minimum or an infimum, depending on .excludes_min
10:35 kshannon Ahh!  .min with comparator is in S32-setting-library/Containers.  Range is NOT a Container.
10:36 masak no, it's not.
10:38 kshannon our multi method min( @values: *&by )
10:38 kshannon So it's part of role Positional {...}
10:38 kshannon We just put it in Any at the moment
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10:46 masak there are now 14 contestants in this year's p6cc.
10:46 daxim already?
10:47 masak yes, people are quick to sign up this year.
10:47 masak didn't have half as many by this time last year.
10:47 daxim I don't want to participate in earnest, then
10:47 masak why not?
10:47 masak if last year is any guide, 75% of the signups will sign up and never be heard from again ;)
10:48 daxim it's an enormous time sink without a p6 port of Algorithm::Combinatorics
10:48 masak hm, that reason seems completely unrelated to the speedy signup of contestants.
10:48 masak but fair enough -- you feel the lack of modules. so do I. :/
10:49 daxim I had a look yesterday, not so easily ported.  the important part is XS, which is impenetrable for me
10:49 daxim the module documentation links to a math paper at the end that contains the pseudo-code
10:51 masak would be cool if someone did a port of it using Zavolaj.
10:56 moritz daxim: instead of bemoaning the lack of libraries, you could also be happy about the option to solve problems yourself :-)
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11:00 fsergot hi o/
11:01 moritz I often read about people complaining that programming has degenerated to stringing together many libraries, and no more "real programming" done
11:01 moritz whatever you can say about Perl 6, that is not one of its problems :-)
11:01 moritz \o fsergot
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11:11 masak hi fsergot
11:13 fsergot How are You today? :)
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11:30 kaare_ joined #perl6
11:31 tadzik 'morning
11:35 fsergot o/ tadzik
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11:56 masak tadzik! \o/
11:57 mj41 joined #perl6
11:57 tadzik \o/
11:57 masak fsergot: I'm fine today, thank you. the events so far in p6cc make me happy :)
11:57 masak fsergot: how're you?
11:58 Trashlord joined #perl6
11:58 fsergot Hmm, fine. I'll "start" again with p6 :)
11:58 fsergot I hadn't enough time.
11:58 tadzik play with Bailador!
11:58 tadzik (and hopefully catch some segfaults and GC bugs)
11:59 fsergot tadzik, i just saw Your project. It's awesome. :)
11:59 Trashlord joined #perl6
12:00 tadzik :) I'm glad
12:00 tadzik I think it's time to implement some full-blown Bailador::Response today
12:01 fsergot Great. :)
12:02 fsergot Why "Bailador"? :)
12:02 masak hm. some of the functions in Algorithm::Combinations don't need a library in Perl 6. for example &variations is simply .pick, and &variations_with_repetition is simply .roll
12:02 fsergot From spanish?
12:03 tadzik it's "Dancer" in Spanish and I wrote the first version of it on a piece of paper during my Spanish classes
12:03 tadzik yes
12:03 tadzik masak: I think every observation like this is a material for a blog post "Yet another module we don't need anymore"
12:03 fsergot :)
12:03 tadzik (and it worked!)
12:04 masak tadzik: well, to be fair, we still don't have a primitive for permutations ;)
12:05 masak and I *always* have to reinvent them with some almost-but-not-quite-trivial recursive sub or other. grrr!
12:06 masak same with combinations.
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12:36 kshannon A bit of gather and take magic and I've translated the first couple of subs in Algorithm::Combinations...
12:39 kshannon nom: my Int @a = 1, 2, 3;
12:39 p6eval nom eb6c4b:  ( no output )
12:39 kshannon nom: my int @a = 1, 2, 3;
12:39 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Method 'STORE' not found for invocant of class 'Integer'␤  in block <anon> at /tmp/nwdVcKFz4a:1␤  in <anon> at /tmp/nwdVcKFz4a:1␤»
12:39 tadzik oh, speaking of bugs
12:40 masak kshannon: I haven't seen that one before.
12:40 tadzik nom: my @a = 1, 2, 3; @a.map: { $_ = $_ + 1; $_ - 1 }
12:40 mishin joined #perl6
12:40 p6eval nom eb6c4b:  ( no output )
12:40 tadzik hmm
12:40 * masak submits rakudobug
12:40 masak (the int one)
12:40 kaare_ joined #perl6
12:40 masak nom: my @a = 1, 2, 3; @a.map: { $_ = $_ + 1; $_ - 1 }; say @a.perl
12:40 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Array.new(1, 2, 3)␤»
12:41 masak niecza: my @a = 1, 2, 3; @a.map: { $_ = $_ + 1; $_ - 1 }; say @a.perl
12:41 p6eval niecza v13-1-gbfba5a3: OUTPUT«[2, 3, 4].list␤»
12:41 masak Niecza++
12:41 * masak submits rakudobug
12:41 masak pugs: my @a = 1, 2, 3; @a.map: { $_ = $_ + 1; $_ - 1 }; say @a.perl
12:41 p6eval pugs b927740: OUTPUT«*** Can't modify constant item: VInt 1␤    at /tmp/rLuvFvdW0Q line 1, column 28-39␤»
12:41 masak wuss :P
12:42 masak I *assume* $_ is rw by default.
12:42 tadzik nom: my @a = "foo=bar"; @a.map: { $_ = $_.split('='); $_[0] => $_[1] }
12:42 p6eval nom eb6c4b:  ( no output )
12:42 tadzik -_-
12:42 tadzik nom: my @a = "foo=bar"; @a.=map: { $_ = $_.split('='); $_[0] => $_[1] }
12:42 p6eval nom eb6c4b:  ( no output )
12:42 tadzik ok, whatever
12:42 masak tadzik: you're not printing anything.
12:42 tadzik masak: shouldn't matter
12:43 masak please elaborate.
12:43 tadzik I got "cannot assign to non-container" with something of this sort while hacking on Bailador recently
12:43 masak and were you happy about that? or sad?
12:43 tadzik sad, quite
12:43 masak good, now we're getting somewhere.
12:44 * masak is peeved by people who don't state their expectations in a bug report :)
12:44 tadzik I'll try to re /* :P */ produce it
12:47 masak oh, I see. you were trying to reproduce the bug above, and nonplussed when you couldn't. yes, that explains why you left out vital information.
12:47 tadzik yeah
12:47 tadzik and I can't seem to reproduce it today
12:48 masak as much as possible, I try to reproduce things locally *before* going live with them on channel :)
12:48 masak if not, you'd see me making a fool of myself almost daily :P
12:48 tadzik gah, it still works
12:48 masak "a-haaa, a bug!" (five minutes later) "OK, I suck."
12:49 tadzik ok, whatever
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12:52 masak but I do recognize the feeling. some of the hardest-to-track-down bugs have had to do with lexical lookup and scope reentrancy.
12:52 masak that's the kind of thing that really makes one respect working lexicals. :)
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13:33 kshannon nom: sub foo (Array of int @f) { ... }; my Array of int @a = 1, 2, 3;
13:33 p6eval nom eb6c4b:  ( no output )
13:33 kshannon nom: sub foo (Array of int @f) { ... }; my Array of int @a = 1, 2, 3; foo(@a);
13:33 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤CHECK FAILED:␤Calling 'foo' will never work with argument types (Positional) (line 1)␤    Expected: :(Positional @f)␤»
13:34 kshannon :(
13:35 Trashlord joined #perl6
13:36 masak kshannon: you probably don't mean 'Array of int', but just 'int' in both places.
13:36 masak kshannon: the '@' in '@f' already implies 'Array'.
13:42 tadzik how to compile a string to a regex?
13:47 masak nom: my $regex_string = "f o*"; my $regex = / <$regex_string> /; say "fooo" ~~ $regex; say "bar" ~~ $regex
13:47 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«=> <fooo>␤␤#<failed match>␤»
13:48 tadzik it will match its insides literally, I think
13:48 tadzik just as regex { foo foo } does
13:48 masak please read the above eval carefully.
13:48 kshannon masak: Yeah,  but nom doesn't pay attention to that for natives...
13:49 tadzik oh
13:49 masak kshannon: just pointing out that the declaration probably isn't what you want.
13:49 tadzik masak++, thanks, didn't notice that
13:49 masak tadzik: :)
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13:54 tadzik nom: my @a = 1, 2, 3; @a.map: { return $_ + 1 }
13:54 p6eval nom eb6c4b:  ( no output )
13:54 tadzik hrm
13:54 tadzik dies with Can not get non-existent attribute '$!storage' on class 'Parcel' locally
13:54 tadzik nom: my @a = 1, 2, 3; @a.map: { return $_ + 1 }; say 'alive'
13:54 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«alive␤»
13:54 tadzik wierd
13:54 masak guess you have a busted build.
13:55 masak are you on eb6c4b too?
13:55 tadzik seems to be RELEASE_3_11_0-2-g80e365d
13:55 tadzik update time, aye
13:55 sftp joined #perl6
13:56 tadzik but the following commits change only lib/Test.pm
13:56 tadzik may be the REPL issue
13:57 masak you're *using* the REPL!?
13:58 * masak is just as surprised every time
13:58 masak nom: my @a = 1, 2, 3; say (@a.map: { return $_ + 1 }).perl
13:58 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Can not get non-existent attribute '$!storage' on class 'Parcel'␤  in method reify at src/gen/CORE.setting:4257␤  in method gimme at src/gen/CORE.setting:4621␤  in method perl at src/gen/CORE.setting:4826␤  in block <anon> at /tmp/p5FwSgR5UN:1␤  in <anon> at /tmp/p5Fw…
13:58 masak tadzik: keep in mind that the REPL outputs things in the above way.
13:59 masak unless you output something yourself in the last statement, that is.
14:02 tadzik aye
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14:10 masak huh! haven't gotten a "sign me up" email for several hours now! :)
14:12 kaare_ joined #perl6
14:13 tadzik yay, got rakudo to segfault reliably!
14:14 tadzik https://gist.github.com/1523773
14:14 Trashlord joined #perl6
14:15 mucker joined #perl6
14:16 masak yay!
14:16 masak it's been so long... :)
14:16 arlinius joined #perl6
14:16 masak how did you do it?
14:17 tadzik Bailador hacking
14:17 tadzik no idea where exactly
14:18 tadzik you can try https://github.com/tadzik/bailador/tree/placeholders if you're curious
14:21 tokuhirom joined #perl6
14:22 masak ok.
14:23 GlitchMr42 joined #perl6
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14:29 masak tadzik: "Started HTTP server." -- but that's with a slightly old nom: 7a1925 from 2011-12-22
14:29 masak updating and trying again.
14:29 tadzik masak: that's fine!
14:29 tadzik masak: now direct your browser to http://localhost:3000/hello
14:29 masak ah, ok.
14:29 * masak does that
14:30 masak ack! segphpthpthpt!
14:30 tadzik :)
14:30 tadzik I'm quite curious where does the actual segfault occur
14:30 tadzik print-based debugging shows that it's _not_ inside dispatch()
14:31 masak happy golfing.
14:31 tadzik ha ha ha
14:32 MayDaniel joined #perl6
14:32 masak I wasn't being sarcastic. I think this part of debugging is quite fun.
14:32 tadzik :)
14:33 tadzik I know, I know
14:33 tadzik unless it's a GC issue and the bug disappears when you remove code :)
14:34 masak aughh
14:34 masak but you said "reliably", so that's not likely.
14:34 masak GC issues come and go.
14:34 tadzik yeah
14:35 * masak fondly remembers when, in the heyday of November development, adding or removing a *comment* would cause segfaults
14:35 huf joined #perl6
14:36 tadzik :)
14:36 mkramer joined #perl6
14:37 tadzik that did happen in the days of Pod hackin :P
14:38 tadzik haha, got it
14:39 masak \o/
14:49 fsergot :)
14:58 tadzik perl6: say so any('Foo', 'bar') ~~ Str
14:58 p6eval pugs b927740: OUTPUT«*** No such subroutine: "&so"␤    at /tmp/xRL4Lm6I5a line 1, column 5 - line 2, column 1␤»
14:58 p6eval ..rakudo eb6c4b, niecza v13-1-gbfba5a3: OUTPUT«Bool::False␤»
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15:02 tadzik is there anything like '.is_junction' or something?
15:06 tadzik nevermind
15:07 tadzik okay, I take it back. It is a GC bug
15:08 masak :(
15:08 masak we should all switch over to refcounting or something.
15:08 masak tadzik: $obj ~~ Junction should work, I think.
15:08 tadzik it does
15:09 tadzik I was more curious about what happens when you do my $p = parse_route($x.key) => $x.value;, $x.key being a Junction
15:09 tadzik and it Just Works too :)
15:10 tadzik masak: can you confirm that stuff works when you run it without GC?
15:10 masak if you remind me how to do that :)
15:10 tadzik parrot -G /path/to/perl6.pbc foo.pl
15:10 * masak attempts
15:12 masak confirmed. no segfault.
15:12 masak it gives a page with "Not found" instead.
15:12 tadzik okay. How about with GC and with https://gist.github.com/1523959
15:13 tadzik GC segfaulting reliably, who would've guessed
15:17 masak huh.
15:18 masak segfaults here too.
15:23 tadzik btw, I have some bad feelings about / <$foo> /
15:24 tadzik nom: https://gist.github.com/1523992
15:24 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Any()␤Match.new(orig => "/hello/bug", from => 7, to => 10, ast => Any, list => ().list, hash => EnumMap.new())␤»
15:24 tadzik niecza: https://gist.github.com/1523992
15:24 p6eval niecza v13-1-gbfba5a3: OUTPUT«Any()␤#<match from(7) to(10) text(bug) pos([].list) named({}.hash)>␤»
15:24 tadzik huh, same reaction
15:24 tadzik can you take a look?
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15:32 [Coke] sorear: to run autounfudge, copy it over from rakudo, first.
15:32 phenny [Coke]: 26 Dec 22:31Z <sorear> tell [Coke] What do I need to do to run autounfudge against niecza?
15:32 [Coke] (then open it up and s/rakudo/niecza/)
15:33 [Coke] it then expects tools/perl6-limited.pl to exist and run your perl6 programs. (you can either change it or create the .pl file)
15:37 masak tadzik: I didn't look at it closely, but are you sure we correctly implement backslash sequences inside charclasses yet? at some point we didn't.
15:38 masak oh, it can't be that; sorry.
15:38 masak oh!
15:38 masak tadzik: backwhack your backslashes in the qq string ;)
15:39 masak nom: my $hello = "'/'hello'/'(<-[\\\\/\\\\.]>+)"; my $reg  = / ^ <$hello> $ /; "/hello/bug" ~~ $reg; say $/[0];
15:39 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Any()␤»
15:39 masak hrmph.
15:39 masak oh, I'm not thinking clearly.
15:40 masak they're already backwhacked. something else is the matter.
15:41 masak tadzik: could be that captures inside regexes interpolated as strings simply don't capture.
15:41 masak tadzik: that actually sounds very plausible, and probably even spec, since capture numbering is static in Perl 6 regexes.
15:41 masak and it can't be static if string-interpolated captures count.
15:42 masak hence, they don't.
15:44 tadzik ech
15:46 tadzik so I need a different way to turn a string into a regex, probably
15:46 [Coke] phenny: tell sorear your autounfudge question is answered a few lines back from here.
15:46 phenny [Coke]: I'll pass that on when sorear is around.
15:47 masak tadzik: in the best case, this will work for you: /<capture=$regex>/
15:47 masak that gives it a place in the match tree.
15:48 tadzik aye. Then I have to distinguish user-defined regexes and generated regexes
15:48 tadzik maybe I'll just look at how Dancer does it :)
15:49 masak "Use Perl 5 as a style guide. What could possibly go wrong?"
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15:50 sorear good * #perl6
15:50 phenny sorear: 15:46Z <[Coke]> tell sorear your autounfudge question is answered a few lines back from here.
15:52 masak ha ha "10.11: Why can't I perform arithmetic on a void * pointer? -- You're too big and clumsy. When you try to push the numbers together, you lose your balance. Perhaps you should get some angels from the rave over on pin 3." -- http://www.seebs.net/faqs/c-iaq.html
15:52 masak sorear: nice to see v13 out. I'll give it a spin tonight.
15:53 sorear masak++ # "type-schizophrenic"
15:53 masak sorear: I felt bad about that use of "schizophrenic" afterwards, since I know enough about mental diseases to be able to tell schizophrenia from split-personality disorder. :/
15:54 masak I'd hate to propagate the belief further that they are identical.
15:54 sorear kshannon: 3 ^.. 5, treated as a smartmatcher, includes 3 + 1e-10.  For .min to return 4 does not make a whole lot of sense
15:54 Chillance joined #perl6
15:55 masak sorear: it does if you consider there to be an intermediate listification/discretization step.
15:56 masak "10.15: Is C an acronym? -- Yes, it stands for ``C''. It's another of those funky recursive acronyms." :D
15:57 sorear [Coke]: thanks
15:57 * [Coke] just downloaded the 2010 contest files. wtf.
15:58 masak huh? how did you end up doing that?
15:58 sorear niecza: my $hello = "'/'hello'/'(<-[\\\\/\\\\.]>+)"; my $reg  = / ^ <hello=$hello> $/; "/hello/bug" ~~ $reg; say $/<hello>[0];
15:58 p6eval niecza v13-1-gbfba5a3: OUTPUT«Any()␤»
15:59 [Coke] masak: found a link to last year's blog post.
15:59 sorear niecza: my $hello = "'/'hello'/'(<-[\\\\/\\\\.]>+)"; my $reg  = / ^ <hello=$hello> $/; "/hello/bug" ~~ $reg; say $/;
15:59 p6eval niecza v13-1-gbfba5a3: OUTPUT«#<match from(0) to(10) text(/hello/bug) pos([].list) named({"hello" => #<match from(0) to(10) text(/hello/bug) pos([].list) named({}.hash)>}.hash)>␤»
15:59 [Coke] glad I noticed before I wrote any code! ;)
15:59 masak [Coke]: ah. heh :)
15:59 masak me too!
15:59 sorear niecza: my $hello = "'/'hello'/'(<-[\\\\/\\\\.]>+)"; my $reg  = / ^ <hello=$hello> $/; "/hello/bug" ~~ $reg; say $/<hello>;
15:59 p6eval niecza v13-1-gbfba5a3: OUTPUT«#<match from(0) to(10) text(/hello/bug) pos([].list) named({}.hash)>␤»
16:00 sorear oh
16:00 sorear it's not being recognized as a capturing operator :|
16:00 * masak submits nieczabug
16:01 masak tadzik++
16:02 [Coke] masak: nice gmail icon. :)
16:02 tadzik haha
16:02 tadzik to much testing w/o GC
16:02 tadzik 4 GBs of ram was not enough :P
16:03 masak [Coke]: is it the south park drawing? :)
16:03 tadzik that reminds me of a quote from the PHP guy
16:04 Trashlord joined #perl6
16:04 masak [Coke]: hah, you have one too :P
16:05 kshannon "The indirect subrule assertion is not captured.  (No assertion with leading punctuation is captured by default.)  You may always capture it explicitly, of course:"
16:06 masak aye.
16:06 kshannon It looks like niecza is working to spec.
16:06 masak kshannon: no, sorear was capturing it explicitly.
16:06 masak read the thing after the colon :P
16:06 [Coke] current round of grants were all not funded. new round opens in a week (TPF standard grants)
16:07 kshannon Oh! I see, $<hello>[0] isn't being captured...
16:07 masak right.
16:08 lichtkind joined #perl6
16:08 masak kshannon: and there's now a github issue for that: https://github.com/sorear/niecza/issues/95
16:09 kshannon Well I'll leave that to sorear,  don't have .net setup to be able to hack on niecza...
16:09 Yary joined #perl6
16:11 cedric joined #perl6
16:11 cedric hello #perl6!
16:11 tadzik hello cedric!
16:11 cedric perl6: say caller.WHAT
16:11 p6eval pugs b927740: OUTPUT«Scalar␤»
16:11 p6eval ..rakudo eb6c4b: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤CHECK FAILED:␤Undefined routine '&caller' called (line 1)␤»
16:11 p6eval ..niecza v13-1-gbfba5a3: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: System.NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object␤  at Anon.1.Run.MAIN.C0mainline (Niecza.Frame ) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 ␤  at Niecza.Kernel.RunCore (Niecza.Frame& cur) [0x00000] in <filename…
16:12 tadzik b: say caller.WHAT
16:12 p6eval b 1b7dd1: OUTPUT«Could not find sub &caller␤  in main program body at line 22:/tmp/XZd_AnQ949␤»
16:12 cedric ? niecza says "CallFrame()" @home
16:13 cedric ... when running the REPL
16:13 masak hello cedric!
16:13 sorear hello cedric!
16:13 lichtkind masak: seen i put som 6-8 h work into tablets, mostly index a and mostly around bugs in the wikisyntax but its much nicer to navigate and man more correct desciptions, not so much removed cruft or added new stuff
16:13 cedric o/ tadzik masak :)
16:13 lichtkind o/
16:14 masak lichtkind: \o
16:16 cedric perl6: sub foo { say caller.WHAT }; sub bar { foo() }; bar;
16:16 p6eval niecza v13-1-gbfba5a3: OUTPUT«CallFrame()␤»
16:16 p6eval ..pugs b927740: OUTPUT«Control::Caller␤»
16:16 p6eval ..rakudo eb6c4b: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤CHECK FAILED:␤Undefined routine '&caller' called (line 1)␤»
16:16 sorear eh heheheh
16:16 sorear I see what's going on here
16:16 lichtkind masak: but it think it totally screwed the regex of the script which harvested part of the index
16:17 cedric sorear, is ^ expected?
16:17 sorear cedric: NRE is not expected
16:17 [Coke] sorear: any plans for an installable niecza?
16:18 sorear [Coke]: no
16:18 Yary Hi. I'm having trouble building a working Rakudo, using an updated git + after a "make realclean". I see that I am in a "master" branch. Should I be in the "nom" branch?
16:19 sorear Yary: yes
16:19 cedric sorear: what does NRE mean?
16:20 Yary ("updated git" = "git pull" )- thanks sorear
16:21 Trashlord joined #perl6
16:22 masak Yary: the nom branch is the latest-and-greatest Rakudo. you can see a feature comparison between nom and the old branch ("master", but now known as "b") here: http://perl6.org/compilers/features
16:23 Yary That's a pretty chart
16:24 masak we like pretty charts :)
16:24 masak ...also, that's a pretty good answer when people ask "will I be able to use Perl 6 for X?"
16:25 * masak decommutes &
16:25 cedric will I be able to use Perl 6 for world domination ? :)
16:29 * ruoso wonders if there is a better way to connect to the existing irc session from my phone then connectbot+ssh+screen
16:31 sorear cedric: NullReferenceException
16:34 thou joined #perl6
16:35 sorear ...well I thought I understood what was going on.  The obvious fix...didn't work
16:38 * sorear stops trying
16:40 cedric perl6: say say.WHAT
16:40 p6eval pugs b927740: OUTPUT«␤Bool␤»
16:40 p6eval ..niecza v13-1-gbfba5a3: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤â�¤Unsupported use of bare 'say'; in Perl 6 please use .say if you meant $_, or use an explicit invocant or argument at /tmp/Q4iTHHNb05 line 1:â�¤------> [32msay say[33mâ��[31m.WHAT[0mâ�¤â�¤Unhandled exception: Check failedâ�¤â�¤  at /h…
16:40 p6eval ..rakudo eb6c4b: OUTPUT«␤Bool()␤»
16:41 cosimo ruoso: i've heard about irccloud recently, not sure if it's usable from a phone
16:41 cedric it seems I'm not lucky today :(
16:42 cedric BTW, how could I call .WHAT on a subroutine (I'm expecting something like "Sub")?
16:42 ruoso cosimo: i'd prefer running the servic myself...
16:42 sorear perl6: say &say.WHAT
16:42 p6eval pugs b927740: OUTPUT«Sub␤»
16:42 p6eval ..rakudo eb6c4b, niecza v13-1-gbfba5a3: OUTPUT«Sub()␤»
16:43 cedric and if I don't know that it is a sub initially?
16:43 kaleem joined #perl6
16:44 tadzik what is the problem you're trying to solve?
16:44 tadzik nom: my $a = sub { "eek!" }; say $a.WHAT
16:44 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Sub()␤»
16:44 tadzik my $a = [sub { "eek!" }, "eek!"].pick; say $a.WHAT;
16:44 tadzik perl6: my $a = [sub { "eek!" }, "eek!"].pick; say $a.WHAT;
16:45 p6eval pugs b927740: OUTPUT«Str␤»
16:45 p6eval ..niecza v13-1-gbfba5a3: OUTPUT«Str()␤»
16:45 p6eval ..rakudo eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Sub()␤»
16:45 tadzik you don't need to know
16:48 cedric tadzik: suppose someone says to me to use "foo" and I didn't hear about "foo" at all, I would like to know quickly from the REPL what "foo" is :)
16:50 cedric maybe I can guess from its name, are there objects that are bare words in Perl 6?
16:50 ruoso there are no bare words in Perl 6
16:51 ruoso there are sigil-less symbols, but they are declared.
16:52 cedric then how to get the full qualified name of a "sigil-less" symbol?
16:53 sorear what do you mean by a full qualified name?
16:53 sorear constant five = 5;  # this defines a symbol named simply "five", no more, no less
16:54 ruoso and more importantly, it defines in the current lexical scope...
16:56 cedric by "full qualified name" I mean something like "sub GLOBAL::foo (Int a, Int b --> Bool"
16:57 cedric *Bool)
16:57 tadzik I believe what you're looking for is Documentation
16:57 ruoso less things are global in Perl 6...
16:58 ruoso I think you would need to declare it that way ifthat's what you mean...
16:59 cedric Actually I would like to use the some "meta-features" of Perl 6 to get information about anything.
17:00 sorear rakudo: say &say.signature
17:00 p6eval rakudo eb6c4b: OUTPUT«:(Any)␤»
17:00 sorear rakudo: say &say.signature.perl
17:00 p6eval rakudo eb6c4b: OUTPUT«:(Any)␤»
17:00 ruoso yes, you can get the symbol lexically. you don't need to use it as global....
17:02 * cedric is dreaming of an IDE that could provide this kind of information (Padre?)
17:02 cedric Thanks for you help!
17:03 ruoso well... that is actually fairly possible...
17:03 ruoso of course BEGIN blocks would still be executed, but the ide could compile the code an introspect its symbols
17:04 dalek niecza: 88d20b0 | sorear++ | / (2 files):
17:04 dalek niecza: Allow <foo=$bar> to work (fixes #95)
17:04 dalek niecza: review: https://github.com/sorear/niecza/commit/88d20b0ca0
17:06 sorear cedric: the creator of Padre has gone on record to say that Perl 6 doesn't have enough static structure to allow making a reasonable IDE
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17:21 cedric sorear: in the latest release note, you say that the "grapheme mode" is your next priority. Are you talking about Unicode modifier ":graphs"?
17:21 sorear cedric: yes
17:21 [Coke] https://gist.github.com/1476841 - niecza at 83.67%
17:21 sorear but I forgot to update that list :|
17:22 [Coke] looks like rakudo is backsliding.
17:23 sorear that's my fault.
17:23 cedric sorear: Do you mind if I ask you to think about the :bytes modifier too? :D
17:23 simcop2387 joined #perl6
17:23 sorear I picked a code point to use as a placeholder that ICU wasn't happy with.
17:24 moritz \o
17:24 sorear o/ moritz
17:24 colomon \o
17:24 sorear cedric: there's been talk of getting rid of :bytes actually.  Modern thinking is that a Str is "just" a list of codepoints/graphemes and doesn't know anything about encoding
17:25 sorear s/Modern/Current/
17:25 moritz you can always .encode to Buf if you want to match bytes
17:25 masak moritz! \o/
17:26 sorear flussence! \o/
17:26 flussence ohai
17:26 sorear flussence: message waiting for you under the _ nick
17:26 * masak goes out hunting for food to eat with his beer
17:26 flussence whoops
17:26 flussence_ ohai
17:26 phenny flussence_: 26 Dec 00:16Z <sorear> tell flussence_ Do you mind if I use https://github.com/flussence/specgraphs/raw/master/impls.png in the niecza v13 announcement?
17:26 flussence_ sure
17:27 sorear but I now have to ask forgiveness rather than permission.
17:27 sorear thanks
17:27 flussence there wouldn't be much point making it if I wasn't going to let anyone use it :)
17:30 tokuhirom joined #perl6
17:31 flussence (maybe it's just me, but using regex on binary strings feels "dirty"...)
17:33 Trashlord joined #perl6
17:39 sorear masak: what do you think about proto token foo { (.) {*} (.) }; token foo:bar { (.) } ?
17:40 fsergot joined #perl6
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17:49 [Coke] sorear: getting a failure int/spec/S02-literals/listquote-whitespace.t^C
17:50 [Coke] and t/spec/S02-literals/numeric.t
17:50 [Coke] unfudging the passing todos.
17:51 dalek roast: 2788c08 | coke++ | S02-lexical-conventions/unicode (2 files):
17:51 dalek roast: niecza unfudge
17:51 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/2788c08792
17:51 [Coke] sorear: let me know if you want me to fudge those 2 failures or not.
18:03 * [Coke] wonders who Kris Shannon is.
18:03 moritz [Coke]: kshannon in here
18:04 [Coke] ah. kshannon: note that 105118 is against spec tests; so if your diagnosis is correct, the spec tests need to be updated.
18:05 [Coke] (and it's not quite a dup of the other ticket, though certainly related)
18:05 moritz which reminds me, I wanted to review kshannon++'s pull requests
18:06 sorear [Coke]: ah, I forgot to push
18:06 dalek roast: 1650c5c | sorear++ | S02-literals/ (2 files):
18:06 dalek roast: [S02-literals/{listquote-whitespace,numeric}] Refudge two tests for the niecza bootstrap
18:06 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/1650c5cb88
18:08 [Coke] sorear: np. glad I pinged first. ;)
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18:14 moritz uhm, urks
18:14 moritz STD.pm line 312
18:15 moritz listing a..z A..Z _ seems so wrong
18:15 moritz that seems... not very Unicody at all
18:18 moritz nqp: say('æ' ~~ /<+alpha+[ \< \[ ]>/)
18:18 p6eval nqp: OUTPUT«æ␤»
18:20 sorear viv doesn't support <+syntax>
18:23 masak sorear: I don't know what I think of it. haven't played around enough with proto tokens, I'm afraid.
18:23 masak or protoregexes in general.
18:32 snearch joined #perl6
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18:38 Radvendii joined #perl6
18:38 Radvendii what happened to perl6 -e?
18:38 Radvendii oh wait...
18:39 [particle] joined #perl6
18:40 Radvendii is use strict enabled for perl6 -e?
18:40 benabik Does perl6 have use strict?
18:40 colomon benabik: use strict is default
18:41 Radvendii that's weird. for one liners??
18:41 colomon I dunno about one liners, but it's default for normal p6 code
18:41 Yary joined #perl6
18:42 Radvendii yeah, i know that (and that's good) but i was talking about for perl6 -e
18:42 Radvendii yeah. it is
18:42 Radvendii that's unfortnate
18:42 colomon Radvendii: and I was answering benabik's question.  ;)
18:42 Radvendii oh
18:42 Radvendii sorry
18:42 Radvendii my bad
18:42 ksi joined #perl6
18:43 * Yary has a freshly built Rakudo "nom" working on an OpenBSD box. Might actually write some code in perl6 now
18:43 benabik colomon: Conversely, is there a 'no strict'?
18:43 Radvendii im sure
18:43 colomon benabik: I think so, but it's definitely never been implemented
18:43 colomon Yary++ \o/
18:43 masak Radvendii: there's no 'no strict' in any implementation yet.
18:43 masak Radvendii: -e is spec'd to be 'no strict', though.
18:43 benabik S02:2810
18:44 benabik "When "strict" is in effect (which is the default except for one-liners),"
18:44 colomon "Perl 5 code is not strict by default, while Perl 6 code is. But it should be easy to relax with -e or a bare version number"
18:44 colomon that's in S01
18:44 Radvendii oh. so it will work, but doesn't currently
18:44 benabik "bare version number?
18:44 colomon I dunno if the bare version number thing is a fossil or not...
18:44 colomon benabik: the example is
18:45 colomon v6;
18:45 colomon as opposed to
18:45 colomon use v6;
18:45 colomon presumably
18:45 benabik odd.
18:45 colomon agreed
18:46 Radvendii perl6: say split '' "hello"
18:46 p6eval rakudo eb6c4b: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Confused at line 1, near "say split "␤»
18:46 p6eval ..pugs b927740: OUTPUT«*** ␤    Unexpected "\""␤    expecting operator, ":" or ","␤    at /tmp/LJ_CW9A1Rh line 1, column 14␤»
18:46 p6eval ..niecza v13-2-g88d20b0: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m��Two terms in a row at /tmp/89pAMYVTta line 1:�------> [32msay split '' [33m�[31m"hello"[0m��Parse failed��»
18:46 Radvendii perl6: say split '', "hello"
18:46 p6eval pugs b927740: OUTPUT«hello␤»
18:46 p6eval ..niecza v13-2-g88d20b0: OUTPUT« h e l l o ␤»
18:46 p6eval ..rakudo eb6c4b: OUTPUT«h e l l o␤»
18:47 [particle] joined #perl6
18:47 colomon oooo, interesting
18:47 colomon is niecza or rakudo right there?
18:47 Radvendii perl6: my $a="hi"; my @a := split '', $a; $a="hello"; say @a[^10]
18:47 p6eval rakudo eb6c4b: OUTPUT«h i␤»
18:47 p6eval ..niecza v13-2-g88d20b0: OUTPUT« h i  Any() Any() Any() Any() Any() Any()␤»
18:47 p6eval ..pugs b927740: OUTPUT«hi␤»
18:48 Radvendii but... i used :=
18:48 Radvendii shouldn't that link them?
18:48 colomon no
18:48 colomon it links @a to the output of the split statement, which is based on the first $a
18:49 Radvendii that's odd...
18:49 Radvendii then how do i do what i'm trying to do?
18:50 Radvendii that's kind of counter intuitive...
18:50 colomon what are you trying to do?
18:51 Radvendii link the two
18:51 Radvendii so that @a is an array version of $a
18:51 colomon I'm pretty sure you'd have to create a custom Positional class to do that.
18:52 Radvendii for real? i feel like that should be pretty basic...
18:52 overrosy joined #perl6
18:53 Radvendii so what is the point of :=? is it just to force lazy evalutaion?
18:54 benabik @a := foo means that @a _is_ the output of foo, not a new array initialized with the output of foo.
18:54 AndreasX joined #perl6
18:54 Radvendii so it should call foo when you try to access @a right...
18:54 AndreasX left #perl6
18:54 benabik No, it calls foo right then.
18:55 benabik It doesn't automatically create a closure.
18:55 Radvendii but if you do @a := 1..* it will lazy evalutate
18:55 benabik It doesn't "call" 1..* every time you access @a.
18:56 Radvendii ugh...
18:56 Radvendii so why would := be useful?
18:56 benabik nom: (1..*).WHAT
18:56 p6eval nom eb6c4b:  ( no output )
18:56 colomon Radvendii: the basic way to do what you're thinking of is to create a closure function.
18:56 benabik Blah.
18:57 benabik nom: (1..*).WHAT.say
18:57 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Range()␤»
18:57 colomon nom: my $a="hi"; sub a() { split '', $a; } $a="hello"; say a()[^10]
18:57 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Confused at line 1, near "sub a() { "␤»
18:57 benabik nom: my @a; say @a.WHAT; @a := 1..*; say @a.WHAT
18:57 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Array()␤Range()␤»
18:57 colomon nom: my $a="hi"; sub a() { split '', $a; } ;$a="hello"; say a()[^10]
18:57 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Confused at line 1, near "\x{1c}$a=\"hello"␤»
18:58 benabik nom: my @a; say @a.WHAT; @a = 1..*; say @a.WHAT;
18:58 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Array()␤Array()␤»
18:58 colomon nom: my $a="hi"; sub a() { split '', $a; }; $a = "hello"; say a()[^10]
18:58 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«h e l l o␤»
18:59 benabik Although I'll note that's a bit slow because it resplits $a every time you call &a.
18:59 Radvendii still, what's the utility of :=?
18:59 benabik Although I suppose it depends on if you set $a more than you call &a.
18:59 Radvendii and shouldn't splitting arrays be really easy? they have to be represented as arrays at some point
19:00 benabik Spliting an array into characters is not necessarily trivial.
19:00 benabik *string
19:00 Radvendii why not? it's fundamentally an array of chars...
19:01 Radvendii no?
19:01 benabik array of _unicode_ characters.
19:01 colomon nope
19:01 Radvendii so?
19:01 benabik If it's stored internally as UTF8, a character may be 1, 2, or 3 bytes.
19:01 colomon there's no one-to-one correspondence  between bytes and characters.
19:01 tadzik or 4, I think
19:02 Radvendii what about just getting access to that array?
19:02 benabik tadzik: Blub.  Yes, you're right.
19:02 Radvendii the array of chars....
19:02 colomon btw, the idiomatic perl 6 way to get all the characters in a string is to use comb instead of split.
19:02 Radvendii what's comb?
19:02 tadzik Radvendii: what do you want to achieve?
19:02 tadzik nom: "foo".comb.perl.say
19:02 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«("f", "o", "o").list␤»
19:03 colomon nom: "this is a test".comb(/\w+/).perl.say
19:03 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«("this", "is", "a", "test").list␤»
19:03 Radvendii tadzik: what i really want is for the strings to also be accessable as arrays.
19:03 colomon comb lets you specify what you are looking for in the string, rather than the bits between what you are looking for (which is split).
19:04 tadzik Radvendii: as in, postcircumfix:<[]>?
19:04 Radvendii eys
19:04 Radvendii yes
19:04 Radvendii can i just do $a="hello";$a[3]?
19:04 colomon no
19:04 Radvendii perl6: $a="hello"; say $a[2]
19:04 p6eval niecza v13-2-g88d20b0: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m��Variable $a is not predeclared at /tmp/219u_hJPf3 line 1:�------> [32m<BOL>[33m�[31m$a="hello"; say $a[2][0m��Variable $a is not predeclared at /tmp/219u_hJPf3 line 1:�------> [32m$a="hello"; say [33m�[31m$a[2][0m��Un…
19:04 p6eval ..rakudo eb6c4b: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Variable $a is not predeclared at line 1, near "=\"hello\"; "␤»
19:04 p6eval ..pugs b927740: OUTPUT«*** ␤    Unexpected "=\""␤    expecting "::"␤    Variable "$a" requires predeclaration or explicit package name␤    at /tmp/cgYYNUeag8 line 1, column 3␤»
19:04 tadzik you can just $a.comb[3]
19:05 tadzik perl6: my $a="hello"; say $a.comb[2]
19:05 p6eval rakudo eb6c4b, niecza v13-2-g88d20b0: OUTPUT«l␤»
19:05 p6eval ..pugs b927740: OUTPUT«␤»
19:05 colomon or $a.substr(3,1)
19:05 Radvendii yeah, but using substr is just cumbersome
19:05 benabik That's interesting...
19:05 benabik nom: my $a = 'hello'; say $a[1]
19:05 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Failure.new(exception => Exception.new())␤»
19:05 benabik ^^ LTA
19:05 Radvendii and comb... ugh. alright then.
19:05 tadzik Radvendii: keep in mind that we're not coping with C-strings here. They _may_ be implemented as mere array of characters
19:06 dalek niecza: d8f1334 | (Solomon Foster)++ | lib/CORE.setting:
19:06 dalek niecza: Add infix:<cmp> rule for Pairs.
19:06 dalek niecza: review: https://github.com/sorear/niecza/commit/d8f13342dc
19:06 Radvendii d
19:06 Radvendii sorry
19:06 Radvendii alright
19:06 Radvendii i guess comb is as good as im going to get...
19:07 benabik You could make $a be a proxy object where STORE sets @a to $a.comb.  :-D
19:07 benabik (In theory.)
19:07 benabik Not sure how that would actually work.
19:07 Radvendii what?
19:07 tadzik hmm
19:08 Radvendii proxy object?
19:08 colomon that's what I was trying to say before
19:08 Radvendii oh
19:08 Radvendii i see
19:08 Radvendii that's interesting...
19:08 tadzik nom: use MONKEY_TYPING; augment class Str { method postcircumfix:<[]>($a) { self.comb[$a] } }; "perl"[3].say
19:08 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Failure.new(exception => Exception.new())␤»
19:08 tadzik eeh
19:09 benabik tadzik: Yeah, that's the problem I was trying to point out a moment ago.
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19:16 Radvendii does anyone have a good tutorial for proxy objects in perl 6
19:16 Radvendii ?
19:17 colomon Radvendii: I think the real point here is, what are you ACTUALLY trying to do?  In general, trying to treat a Unicode string like a C-style character array is a bad idea.
19:17 Radvendii why?
19:17 benabik Hm.  Proxy objects aren't on compiler feature list.  Are they currently implemented?
19:18 tadzik I think they are
19:18 tadzik istr jnthn used them in some of the advent blog posts
19:18 benabik Cool.
19:18 colomon jnthn was definitely messing around with them this month, but I don't know if they're fully functional yet
19:19 Radvendii why is it a bad idea to treat them like C-style character arrays?
19:19 colomon Radvendii: because it's not, as we tried to explain to you above.  You cannot access character 25 without looking at characters 0-24.
19:19 Radvendii dang :(
19:19 Radvendii alright
19:19 Radvendii well
19:19 Radvendii i have to go
19:19 Radvendii but thanks for the help and patience
19:19 colomon if you build a proxy (or whatever), it will just be doing that behind the scenes.
19:20 Radvendii im not so good at understanding the inner workings of the programming language.
19:20 moritz benabik: rakudo passes most of the tests that use Proxy
19:23 benabik nom: https://gist.github.com/1524863
19:23 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Unable to parse blockoid, couldn't find final '}' at line 5␤»
19:23 benabik :-(
19:24 moritz benabik: try to give the FETCH emthod a signature too
19:25 moritz benabik: oh, and write it as  Proxy.new(...), not new Proxy:
19:25 moritz we don't do indirect method calls
19:25 moritz not sure why S06 uses that arcane and weird syntax
19:26 benabik Hah, yes that fixed it.
19:26 benabik nom: https://gist.github.com/1524863
19:26 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«s␤»
19:26 tadzik ha
19:27 overrosy joined #perl6
19:27 dalek specs: 8a99698 | moritz++ | S06-routines.pod:
19:27 dalek specs: [S06] avoid indirect method call syntax
19:27 dalek specs:
19:27 dalek specs: It is unrelated to the topic, and seem to confuse readers. Me too.
19:27 dalek specs: review: https://github.com/perl6/specs/commit/8a99698d29
19:28 tadzik std: new Proxy;
19:28 p6eval std dc62e1d: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m�Unsupported use of C++ constructor syntax; in Perl 6 please use method call syntax at /tmp/yTzaQ9pfli line 1:�------> [32mnew Proxy[33m�[31m;[0m�Parse failed�FAILED 00:01 118m�»
19:28 tadzik thought so
19:28 benabik std: new Proxy: ;
19:28 p6eval std dc62e1d: OUTPUT«ok 00:01 121m␤»
19:28 colomon tadzik++
19:29 benabik It wants the colon.
19:29 tadzik mhm
19:29 * moritz hates indirect method syntax
19:30 tadzik confusing and ugly :)
19:30 benabik nom: https://gist.github.com/1524863
19:30 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Str.new()␤Array.new("t", "e", "s", "t")␤»
19:30 benabik Huh.
19:30 benabik nom: $a = 'test; $a.perl.say
19:30 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Variable $a is not predeclared at line 1, near " = 'test; "␤»
19:30 benabik nom: my $a = 'test'; $a.perl.say
19:30 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«"test"␤»
19:31 benabik Oh, I think it's confused by the Proxy.
19:31 benabik nom: my $a_ = 'test'; my $a := Proxy.new(FETCH => method { $a_ }); say $a.perl
19:31 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«Str.new()␤»
19:31 benabik LTA.
19:32 benabik nom: https://gist.github.com/1524863
19:32 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«"test"␤Array.new("t", "e", "s", "t")␤»
19:37 overrosy joined #perl6
19:38 benabik nom: https://gist.github.com/1524863
19:38 p6eval nom eb6c4b: OUTPUT«"test"␤t e s t␤»
19:39 benabik Not sure why say $a adds the ""s and why $a.perl becomes Str.new().  But other than that, I think it's kinda neat.
20:04 masak std: class A {}; new A:
20:04 p6eval std dc62e1d: OUTPUT«ok 00:01 122m␤»
20:04 masak std: class A {}; new (new A:):
20:04 p6eval std dc62e1d: OUTPUT«ok 00:01 123m␤»
20:04 tadzik :F
20:04 masak std: class A {}; new (new (new A:):):
20:04 p6eval std dc62e1d: OUTPUT«ok 00:01 123m␤»
20:04 masak weird. :)
20:05 tadzik it laughs at you! :P
20:05 tadzik new A:):)
20:05 tadzik like :D, but more subtle
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20:08 bbkr1 tadzik: I'm testing panda on 2011.12 and it cannot find Shell::Command (required by Panda::Installer), which package contains it?
20:08 tadzik bbkr1: File::Tools
20:09 tadzik bbkr1: bootstrap.sh should install it
20:09 tadzik also, META.info should list everything that's needed
20:09 tadzik also also, all the deps are shipped in ext/ :)
20:09 stepnem joined #perl6
20:09 bbkr1 I've run bootstrap, weird. I'll remove everything and repeat process.
20:09 tadzik huh
20:10 tadzik oh
20:10 tadzik do you have ~/.perl6/lib in your $PERL6LIB?
20:12 bbkr1 I have it in @*INC
20:12 dalek roast: b52a5cb | moritz++ | S32- (3 files):
20:12 dalek roast: minor rakudo fudging and corrections
20:12 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/b52a5cbd17
20:12 tadzik hmm
20:13 dalek rakudo/kshannon-fixes: 7300003 | (Kris Shannon)++ | src/Perl6/Grammar.pm:
20:13 dalek rakudo/kshannon-fixes: Make termish panic on failure when before an infixish (fixes RT#53814)
20:13 dalek rakudo/kshannon-fixes: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/7300003f09
20:13 dalek rakudo/kshannon-fixes: ac925b0 | (Kris Shannon)++ | src/Perl6/Grammar.pm:
20:13 dalek rakudo/kshannon-fixes: <args> already has an empty option, no need to make it optional
20:13 dalek rakudo/kshannon-fixes: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/ac925b0750
20:13 dalek rakudo/kshannon-fixes: 8d63d90 | (Kris Shannon)++ | src/Perl6/Actions.pm:
20:13 dalek rakudo/kshannon-fixes: Make the stubby exception generators actually use any passed parameters (fixes RT#58558)
20:13 dalek rakudo/kshannon-fixes: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/8d63d90656
20:13 dalek rakudo/kshannon-fixes: 84b1fcc | moritz++ | src/Perl6/ (2 files):
20:13 dalek rakudo/kshannon-fixes: Merge remote branch 'kshannon/fix-rt58558' into nom
20:13 tadzik bbkr1: does "perl6 -e 'use Shell::Command'" work?
20:13 dalek rakudo/kshannon-fixes: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/84b1fcccd8
20:13 sorear my #1 priority for this month is getting MOPpy stuff to work.  "6model convergence" but especially roles, allowing custom ClassHOWs
20:13 bbkr1 ok, i've catched error this time: t/panda/fetcher.t .... fatal: failed to open '/Users/bbkr/.panda/src/panda/t//objects': No such file or directory
20:13 tadzik bbkr1: that's not an error, I know it looks like one
20:13 tadzik that's expected, and git just doesn't shut up about it
20:13 moritz oops, I didn't mean to push that branch. OTOH, not much harm done
20:15 bbkr1 tadzik: using Shell::Command from command line doesn't work either.
20:15 masak moritz: just use the strangely out-of-place colon syntax in git to remove it again :P
20:15 tadzik bbkr1: after bootstrap, did Shell/Command.pm end up in ~/.perl6/lib?
20:16 moritz masak: I will, in time
20:16 bbkr1 tadzik: no, which is weird. I'll check bootstrap code, maybe it's some Apple'ism
20:17 tadzik huh, it always worked on Macs
20:17 tadzik bbkr1: does panda pass its tests? Particulary panda/installer.t
20:17 moritz what I actually planned was to push these commits to nom, and keep those plus a few more in the branch
20:17 moritz ah well
20:18 bbkr1 tadzik: during bootstrap - yes
20:18 tadzik oddness
20:18 * tadzik reruns locally
20:23 rsimoes Is there a complete perl 6 parser yet? Even if it just produces a somewhat stubby op tree?
20:24 moritz I think that std and niecza are both fairly complete wrt parsing
20:24 rsimoes omgggg my roomba is knocking over everything
20:24 rsimoes oh yeah?
20:24 moritz oh yeah
20:24 rsimoes Thanks, I'll take a peak
20:26 masak rsimoes: there's also viv in connection with STD, but I don't know how bitrotted it is at this point.
20:30 bbkr1 tadzik: mystery solved. bootstrapping was using old files in ~/.panda directory (from previous installation).
20:30 rsimoes is there a std repo somewheres?
20:30 masak http://github.com/perl6/std
20:31 tadzik bbkr1: so it considered stuff installed, and didn't reinstall, aye?
20:31 ksi joined #perl6
20:31 tadzik I wonder if a "Foo::Bar is already installed" message would be useful
20:32 bbkr1 tadzik: yes, i've removed my old stuff in ~/.perl6 (whole directory) and panda got somehow confused due to presence of old files in ~/.panda.
20:33 tadzik yeah. ~/.panda/state has probably shown File::Tools installed, and bootstrap didn't install it
20:33 bbkr1 tadzik: thanks for help and sorry about wasting your time, everything is working afterall
20:33 tadzik bbkr1: no problem with that :) Glad it works
20:33 [Coke] sorear: ping.
20:34 bbkr1 time to reanimate JSON::RPC on nom :)
20:34 tadzik \o/
20:36 [Coke] niecza: say +("bac" ~~ /a/).WHAT.gist
20:36 p6eval niecza v13-3-gd8f1334: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Cannot parse number: Match()␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 919 (die @ 2) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 2328 (ANON @ 9) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 2330 (NumSyntax.str2num @ 3) ␤  at…
20:37 [Coke] sorear: (just reopened #84.)
20:50 dalek rakudo/nom: 7300003 | (Kris Shannon)++ | src/Perl6/Grammar.pm:
20:50 dalek rakudo/nom: Make termish panic on failure when before an infixish (fixes RT#53814)
20:50 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/7300003f09
20:50 dalek rakudo/nom: ac925b0 | (Kris Shannon)++ | src/Perl6/Grammar.pm:
20:50 dalek rakudo/nom: <args> already has an empty option, no need to make it optional
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21:02 fsergot tadzik, whats new about Bailador? :)
21:03 tadzik fsergot: lots of things :) Proper Request and Response objects, POST support, even placeholders work if you turn GC of
21:04 fsergot So, I will install it and build some webpages :)
21:04 tadzik great!
21:05 tadzik let me know if you miss anything in it
21:05 benabik …  "If you turn GC off"?  That's not a good sentance.
21:05 tadzik there's an example pastebin app in the repo which shows off most of the features
21:05 tadzik benabik: Rakudo segfaults are generally not very good :)
21:08 fsergot tadzik, Your project is great. It probably allow me to get into perl6 deeper.
21:08 tadzik I'm glad you like it
21:08 fsergot will* :)
21:09 masak tadzik: I like it too. this was one of the goals of Web.pm
21:09 fsergot tadzik++
21:10 tadzik masak: I'm thinking about stealing some template system for Bailador
21:10 tadzik once GC issues are gone I'll write another blog post as a bait for Dancer guys
21:10 tadzik ...again :)
21:11 fsergot ;]
21:18 masak tadzik: have a look at Python's Genshi and Web.pm's Hitomi.
21:18 masak I still believe that's a really neat idea.
21:18 tadzik does it pass its tests?
21:18 tadzik istr one of those templaters did
21:19 tadzik maybe ratel
21:19 masak dunno.
21:19 tadzik meh, I only recenly fixed all those stuff to work on ng... :)
21:20 fsergot tadzik, just perl6 pastebin.pl (e.g.) or how? :)
21:21 tadzik fsergot: provided you have Bailador installed, yes
21:21 tadzik then just direct your browser to http://localhost:3000
21:21 masak 'night, #perl6
21:22 fsergot Then, how i can run it on serwer without typing port number? :)
21:22 fsergot o/ masak
21:22 tadzik fsergot: modify lib/Bailador.pm at the bottom :P
21:23 tadzik fsergot: oh, and better not run it on a server, it's unsafe and unstable as hell ;)
21:23 tadzik g'night masak
21:23 fsergot Ok :0
21:23 fsergot :)
21:23 fsergot tadzik, so You can add this 'feature' in future. i mean, something like configuration methor, or vars.
21:24 fsergot :)
21:24 tadzik I'll consider that :)
21:24 tadzik well, it now acts like the built-in webserver in Dancer
21:24 tadzik you ran dance(), it listens on :3000
21:24 tadzik if you want fancy stuff, you run the .psgi app with plackup
21:25 tadzik I think someone was working on p6-plackup a while ago
21:25 fsergot Ok. :)
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21:33 sorear good * #perl6
21:34 sorear rsimoes: Why are you spamming me?
21:35 sorear [Coke]: pong
21:36 y3llow_ joined #perl6
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21:38 sorear [Coke]: What should +'Match()' be?
21:38 sorear nom: say +'Match()'
21:38 p6eval nom 5f7f4d: OUTPUT«0␤»
21:39 sorear nom: say +'Moo'
21:39 p6eval nom 5f7f4d: OUTPUT«0␤»
21:39 sorear b: say +'Moo'
21:39 p6eval b 1b7dd1: OUTPUT«0␤»
21:39 sorear wah
21:39 sorear b: say 'Moo'.Numeric
21:39 p6eval b 1b7dd1: OUTPUT«0␤»
21:39 sorear I was sure I had seen actual parse errors earlier
21:41 sorear rakudo: say "123def" + 5
21:41 p6eval rakudo 5f7f4d: OUTPUT«No applicable candidates found to dispatch to for 'Numeric'. Available candidates are:␤:(Mu $v, Mu %_)␤␤  in method Numeric at src/gen/CORE.setting:648␤  in sub infix:<+> at src/gen/CORE.setting:2166␤  in sub infix:<+> at src/gen/CORE.setting:2166␤  in block <anon>…
21:42 sorear rakudo: say +"123def"
21:42 p6eval rakudo 5f7f4d: OUTPUT«Failure.new(exception => Exception.new())␤»
21:42 sorear rakudo: say +"def"
21:42 p6eval rakudo 5f7f4d: OUTPUT«0␤»
21:42 sorear yeeech
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22:31 tadzik wow, Ratel does some dirty magic
23:05 [Coke] sorear: if the spectest is borked, we can of course change that instead. I read the test as the + having higher precedence.
23:06 sorear ah, the issue was the test failure
23:06 sorear oh!  that was a fudge ticket.  I get it now
23:09 drbean joined #perl6
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23:12 dalek roast: 909cd58 | sorear++ | S12-methods/what.t:
23:12 dalek roast: [S12-methods/what] Fix over-zealous .gist usage from f85b8bf9, was testing the wrong thing as a result (fixes sorear/niecza#84)
23:12 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/909cd58948
23:12 sorear I wonder if this will work?
23:12 * [Coke] sees fudges' emit for the first time. "oh!"
23:14 [Coke] that makes it easier to fudge some tests, boy howdy.
23:14 sorear yeah.  avoid it if you can - it messes up the line numbers
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