Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2012-03-04

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:00 [Coke] well, it's worth about 1K spectests to pugs if you figure it out. ;)
00:10 [Coke] pugs: say Pair
00:10 p6eval pugs b927740: OUTPUT«Pair␤»
00:43 packetknife joined #perl6
00:47 packetknife left #perl6
00:48 TimToady I get a 404 on that link
00:48 TimToady oh, I see the fix
01:04 TimToady [Coke]: I smell an extra Rat: yer Num group takes args (Rat) (Num) (Rat); the first one should be (Int) instead of (Rat)
01:05 colomon joined #perl6
01:07 PacoAir_ joined #perl6
01:12 geekosaur aaaaa
01:12 geekosaur why did pugs build just reinstall network?  I like my ghc working...
01:13 xinming joined #perl6
01:17 [Coke] TimToady: checking...
01:18 TimToady line 1898 or so
01:18 dalek roast: 9dac81d | coke++ | S (9 files):
01:18 dalek roast: pugs fudge
01:18 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/9dac81d151
01:18 dalek Pugs.hs: eb06f3b | coke++ | t/spectest.data:
01:18 dalek Pugs.hs: run fudged tests
01:18 dalek Pugs.hs: review: https://github.com/perl6/Pugs.hs/commit/eb06f3b133
01:20 moritz \o
01:20 * moritz can't sleep
01:20 [Coke] TimToady: good catch. I still get the same error, though.
01:21 moritz had a glass of coke yesterday night -- didn't think it'd affect me that much :/
01:21 [Coke] updated the .diff
01:23 * [Coke] is pretty powerful
01:23 moritz cross-atlantic insomnia
01:24 colomon o/
01:24 TimToady I wonder if you're fighting the fact that type names are also op0 if there are no parens
01:25 TimToady that's why we generally think of it as Type (0-ary) returning an object that responds to .()
01:25 TimToady so if the .() isn't called it is just the type name
01:27 TimToady pugs: say Int
01:27 p6eval pugs b927740: OUTPUT«Int␤»
01:27 TimToady pugs: say Int.(4.2)
01:27 p6eval pugs b927740: OUTPUT«*** Must only use named arguments to new() constructor␤    Be sure to use bareword keys.␤    at /tmp/Gy2t5_TOMK line 1, column 5 - line 2, column 1␤»
01:27 TimToady o_O
01:28 TimToady pugs: my $type = Int; say $type(4.2)
01:28 p6eval pugs b927740: OUTPUT«*** Must only use named arguments to new() constructor␤    Be sure to use bareword keys.␤    at /tmp/xknJikVhXn line 1, column 21 - line 2, column 1␤»
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01:28 TimToady nom: my $type = Int; say $type(4.2)
01:28 p6eval nom 4bdb94: OUTPUT«4␤»
01:28 TimToady niecza: my $type = Int; say $type(4.2)
01:28 p6eval niecza v15-2-gd19c478: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Unable to resolve method postcircumfix:<( )> in class Int␤  at /tmp/6wQbqYA0uq line 1 (mainline @ 2) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 3838 (ANON @ 3) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 3839 (module-CORE @ 65)…
01:28 TimToady nom++
01:29 wolfman2000 joined #perl6
01:29 TimToady moritz: are nom: and rakudo: still the same thing?
01:30 moritz TimToady: yes
01:32 moritz I've thought about adding additional aliases
01:32 moritz and have both 'nom' and 'r' mean 'rakudo' (and report as "rakudo")
01:32 [Coke] mmm, reporting the unaliased name++
01:33 moritz and 'n' and 'niecza' alias to the the same thing, and reporting as niecza
01:33 [Coke] I'm I'm fighting that, but have no idea how to win. ;)
01:36 [Coke] (back to TimToady)
01:38 * [Coke] kicks off a specomparun
01:38 havenn joined #perl6
01:43 dalek evalbot: 07fa2a2 | moritz++ | evalbot.pl:
01:43 dalek evalbot: implement aliasing mechanism (untested)
01:43 dalek evalbot: review: https://github.com/perl6/evalbot/commit/07fa2a21cc
01:43 moritz evalbot control restart
01:43 p6eval joined #perl6
01:44 moritz n: say 'OH HAI'
01:44 moritz hey, don't be that slow!
01:44 p6eval niecza v15-2-gd19c478: OUTPUT«OH HAI␤»
01:45 moritz it seems that the first execution (or just niecza execution) after a restart is terribly slow
01:45 moritz n: say 'again'
01:45 p6eval niecza v15-2-gd19c478: OUTPUT«again␤»
01:45 moritz much faster
01:45 moritz r: say "It's me"
01:45 p6eval rakudo 4bdb94: OUTPUT«It's me␤»
01:45 moritz nom: say "and me too!"
01:45 p6eval rakudo 4bdb94: OUTPUT«and me too!␤»
01:47 moritz nqp: say("just checkin'")
01:47 p6eval nqp: OUTPUT«just checkin'␤»
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02:04 colomon niecza: constant fib := 0, 1, *+* ... *;
02:04 p6eval niecza v15-2-gd19c478: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤â�¤Cannot use bind operator with this LHS at /tmp/yW20xgjtEX line 1:â�¤------> [32mconstant fib := 0, 1, *+* ... *[33mâ��[31m;[0mâ�¤â�¤Unhandled exception: Check failedâ�¤â�¤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/boot/lib/CORE.setting line 1362 (die …
02:04 colomon niecza: constant fib = 0, 1, *+* ... *;
02:04 p6eval niecza v15-2-gd19c478:  ( no output )
02:05 colomon niecza: constant fib = 0, 1, *+* ... *; say fib[100]
02:05 p6eval niecza v15-2-gd19c478: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: System.NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object␤  at Niecza.Kernel.ToComposable (Niecza.STable arg, Niecza.STable cls) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 ␤  at Niecza.Kernel.ApplyRoleToClass (Niecza.ST…
02:08 moritz r: constant fib = 0, 1, *+* ... *; say fib[100]
02:08 p6eval rakudo 4bdb94: OUTPUT«354224848179261915075␤»
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02:15 dalek roast: 13da829 | moritz++ | S12-class/inheritance.t:
02:15 dalek roast: RT #82814 unspeakable evil with constructors and nextsame
02:15 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/13da829571
02:16 dalek roast: 4b53779 | (Solomon Foster)++ | S04-declarations/constant.t:
02:16 dalek roast: Additional fudging for niecza.
02:16 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/4b53779677
02:19 aindilis joined #perl6
02:20 dalek roast: bea87e2 | moritz++ | S32-exceptions/misc.t:
02:20 dalek roast: RT #85942
02:20 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/bea87e2b43
02:21 dalek roast: 9a6c674 | moritz++ | S02-types/capture.t:
02:21 dalek roast: RT #89766, \()[0]
02:21 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/9a6c6742d5
02:28 [Coke] # 03/03/2012 - rakudo++ ; niecza (96.29%); pugs (30.33%)
02:28 [Coke] "niecza",     20270,     8,   747,  1530, 22555, 23755
02:28 [Coke] "pugs"  ,      6386,    17,  2793,  1586, 10781, 23564
02:28 [Coke] "rakudo",     21049,    30,   621,  1890, 23590, 24022
02:29 colomon woah
02:29 [Coke] you're falling behind!
02:29 colomon go away for a few days, and look what happens....
02:31 sftp joined #perl6
02:40 [Coke] n: say 21049*.3333-6386
02:40 p6eval niecza v15-2-gd19c478: OUTPUT«629.6317␤»
03:13 orafu joined #perl6
03:31 sorear good * #perl6
03:33 lutok joined #perl6
03:34 [Coke] pugs: say 1..5
03:34 p6eval pugs b927740: OUTPUT«12345␤»
03:35 [Coke] pugs: say 111 ~~ 1..5
03:35 p6eval pugs b927740: OUTPUT«␤»
03:35 [Coke] pugs: say 3 ~~ 1..5
03:35 p6eval pugs b927740: OUTPUT«␤»
03:38 sorear today: would have gone better if my computer hadn't resisted booting for so long :|
03:40 sorear TimToady: i've added you to The List
03:40 TimToady [Coke]: pugs is from before we had ..., so .. was not considered an interval
03:40 TimToady sorear: thanks
03:40 dalek niecza: 1c4b5a7 | larry++ | lib/NieczaCLR.cs:
03:40 dalek niecza: Also improve niecza's multi call messages
03:40 dalek niecza: review: https://github.com/sorear/niecza/commit/1c4b5a70d0
03:40 sorear at least now I don't have to worry about y'all thinking I'm dead ;)
03:41 [Coke] TimToady: mmm. just seeing if it's worth running that test file; nope.
03:41 TimToady sorear: we're assuming either you had a *long* power failure, or you're assiduously applying yourself to your studies
03:41 TimToady if you want us to think you're dead, just let us know :)
03:42 sorear :p
03:42 sorear there was a #p5p person from Buenos Aires who went incommuncado at the time of the most recent calamity, and only resurfaced yesterday, was a bit worrying
03:43 TimToady perl6: constant @fib = 0, 1, *+* ... *; say @fib[100]
03:43 p6eval pugs b927740: OUTPUT«*** ␤    Unexpected "@fib"␤    expecting "=", context, ":" or "("␤    at /tmp/jbiIkNN6l_ line 1, column 10␤»
03:43 p6eval ..rakudo 4bdb94, niecza v15-2-gd19c478: OUTPUT«354224848179261915075␤»
03:43 TimToady yes, niecza handles it with the sigil, just not without
03:43 TimToady perl6: constant \fib = 0, 1, *+* ... *; say fib[100]
03:43 p6eval rakudo 4bdb94: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Missing initializer on constant declaration␤at /tmp/R6nakjj5NN:1␤»
03:43 p6eval ..niecza v15-2-gd19c478: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: System.NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object␤  at Niecza.Kernel.ToComposable (Niecza.STable arg, Niecza.STable cls) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 ␤  at Niecza.Kernel.ApplyRoleToClass (Niecza.ST…
03:43 p6eval ..pugs b927740: OUTPUT«*** ␤    Unexpected "\\"␤    expecting "=", formal parameter, context, ":" or "("␤    at /tmp/rbixz362ZU line 1, column 10␤»
03:44 sorear interesting failure mode
03:44 dalek roast: 246ed8d | coke++ | S (10 files):
03:44 dalek roast: pugs fudges
03:44 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/246ed8d50b
03:44 dalek Pugs.hs: 485869d | coke++ | t/spectest.data:
03:44 dalek Pugs.hs: run fudged tests
03:44 dalek Pugs.hs: review: https://github.com/perl6/Pugs.hs/commit/485869db82
03:44 sorear niecza's handling of list constants is a giant pile of crocks with no underlying semantic model, so it's suprising it ever works at all
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04:00 [Coke] pugs: use Test; say eval_lives_ok()'
04:00 p6eval pugs b927740: OUTPUT«pugs: *** Unsafe function 'use' called under safe mode␤    at /tmp/RP5j12Bcxa line 1, column 1␤»
04:00 [Coke] pugs: use Test; say eval_lives_ok();
04:00 p6eval pugs b927740: OUTPUT«pugs: *** Unsafe function 'use' called under safe mode␤    at /tmp/us0aH1_2ga line 1, column 1␤»
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04:27 Radvendii joined #perl6
04:27 Radvendii o/
04:27 Radvendii I'm getting an error trying to build rakudo 2012.02 on mac OS X
04:30 sorear what is it?
04:30 Radvendii hang on… im trying to get it into a gist
04:33 Radvendii https://gist.github.com/1970675
04:33 Radvendii i didn't know what to include
04:33 Radvendii so i put all of the output
04:33 Radvendii the error appears near the bottom (as always)
04:35 Radvendii i think i might have screwed up the copy-paste (if so, i updated the gist with the data straight from the command line)
04:38 birdwindupbird joined #perl6
04:38 Radvendii oh, and hey sorear! long time no see!
04:38 Radvendii how are you?
04:38 sorear "long time"
04:38 sorear I've only been incommunicado for ~20 hours
04:39 sorear Radvendii: you appear to be trying to build rakudo with an incompatible parrot
04:39 Radvendii yeah but i haven't been on #perl6 in a *while*
04:40 Radvendii but i used --gen-parrot
04:40 Radvendii shouldn't that update it?
04:40 Radvendii for configuring i ran: "perl ./Configure.pl --gen-parrot --prefix=/usr/local/"
04:50 sorear you're updating, but you're not using the update because of --prefix
04:50 sorear you need to use --gen-parrot-prefix instead.
04:50 Radvendii ah
04:50 Radvendii will that also set --prefix?
04:50 Radvendii or should i set both
04:51 Radvendii to the same value
04:52 sorear that will also set --prefix, yes
04:54 Radvendii --gen-parrot-prefix isn't an option though, don't i have to set --parrot-option='--prefix=$path'
05:03 Radvendii i think it's working now
05:03 Radvendii thanks
05:06 Radvendii if use .shift in the body of a program, will it take the first command line argument (from @ARGS)
05:08 sorear no
05:08 Radvendii ,':-/
05:08 Radvendii so i should do $_=@ARGV first?
05:08 Radvendii or given @ARGV{}
05:08 japhb Am I correct in assuming that S32-setting-library/Exception.pod:130-131 needs to be revised after https://github.com/perl6/specs/commit/d​28c8ef33bd4dc20f4ac7c4bf64fb4d2ae8fe92e ?
05:09 Radvendii i am correct that that was the behavior in perl5 though no? i'm not imagining things.
05:10 sorear Radvendii: I have no words for this.
05:11 Radvendii as in, you don't know?
05:11 japhb Radvendii, shift with no arguments in Perl 5 was sensitive to context: It shifted @_ inside a sub, or @ARGV outside a sub.
05:11 japhb Well, to a first approximation ... see `perldoc -f shift`
05:11 Radvendii japhb: that's what i though. i see that was taken away in perl6
05:12 sorear This feature is incredibly stupid and I have *no* sympathy for anyone who misses it.
05:12 japhb Radvendii, special cases and magic lists of exceptions were much reduced in Perl 6.
05:12 japhb s/were/are/ I suppose
05:13 Radvendii understood.
05:13 Radvendii I would think though, that @ARGV really serves the purpose that @_ does, except outside of a subroutine
05:13 japhb While I love using Perl 5's auto-shift of @_ in subs, that's only because I don't have real parameter lists and methods.
05:14 sorear $_=@ARGV reminds me of a story about an ALGOL programmer who switched to C and then started starting all eir programs with #define BEGIN { #define END }
05:14 japhb Radvendii, yes, that mnemonic of sorts was perfectly useful in Perl 5.  Perl 6 doesn't really need that any more.
05:14 Radvendii right, but from quick programs, i dont really want to deal with it
05:14 Radvendii why not?
05:15 Radvendii sorear: what? what would that even do?
05:16 japhb I just had a discussion at $day-job last week about ancient code we'd found in which someone managed to write 50's/60's era assembly language in Perl 5, metaphorically speaking.
05:16 Radvendii as in, totally obfuscated
05:16 Radvendii ?
05:17 japhb Radvendii, because subs have real parameter lists that do intelligent parameter binding, and in particular, MAIN has a very magical parameter list that can do command line parsing.
05:17 japhb Radvendii, no subroutines.  All control flow done by setting globals and jumping.
05:17 Radvendii japhb: oh i see
05:18 Radvendii but I liked perl5's conspicous lack of a MAIN subroutine… ah well
05:18 japhb It was quite effectively obfuscated even though it clearly wasn't intended to be, since the mental disconnect in most readers was pretty extreme.
05:19 japhb The author was convinced that these new-fangled subroutines were just confusing.  (I kid you not.)
05:19 Radvendii I can actually see that… if your brain is hard-wired one way…
05:20 japhb Radvendii, sorear's ALGOL-to-C joke was basically talking about using the C preprocessor to redefine curly braces to be the "more readable" BEGIN and END.
05:20 japhb Or rather ...
05:20 Radvendii oooh
05:20 Radvendii i see
05:20 japhb to allow the programmer to use BEGIN and END instead of curly braces.
05:22 Radvendii the message of the story being, adapt to the language, don't try to make it fit to your limited worldview
05:22 Radvendii nom: (4.5).floor.say
05:22 p6eval rakudo 4bdb94: OUTPUT«4␤»
05:24 dalek specs: 637b6b4 | (Geoffrey Broadwell)++ | S32-setting-library/Exception.pod:
05:24 dalek specs: Fix naming skew (which also fixes a semantic mismatch)
05:24 dalek specs: review: https://github.com/perl6/specs/commit/637b6b4547
05:24 japhb Radvendii, exactly.
05:24 Radvendii and this lies in balance with TMTOWTDI
05:25 japhb Radvendii, I'll answer that with another story:
05:26 japhb When I was in high school, I used to make up words to fit in English class.  The professor told me to learn the right words to use, and use those instead of ones I made up.
05:27 japhb I protested that Shakespeare, who we were constantly being told was the greatest English poet, had possibly introduced more words into the English language *himself* than any other famous author.
05:27 japhb So why couldn't I?
05:27 japhb The professor said: You have to learn all the rules, before you can be clever breaking them.
05:28 djanatyn joined #perl6
05:28 Radvendii alright… fair enough.
05:31 japhb It's worth noting that I've heard a similar sentiment in a wide range of fields from masters of each.  It's rather humbling, actually.
05:31 rsimoes joined #perl6
05:32 Radvendii mhmm. However… i would say that sometimes someone who has not been indoctrinated into the way of thinking of a field can offer some valuable *different* insite…
05:34 Radvendii for example, i feel like the interpretation of the torah has become such that there is only one way of interpretation, because everyone studies from, and learns from, the torah scholars of the past, and so they do not think to think a different way.
05:34 japhb Sure ... but one has to be careful to differentiate true insight from the all-too-seductive "make your scary moon world look like my friendly Earth"
05:34 Radvendii mhmm…
05:35 japhb Radvendii, how then do you explain the vast range of actual life choices made by those who nominally follow the teachings of the Torah?
05:35 japhb And then there's "Your dogma just ran over my karma."
05:37 japhb It takes a great deal of experience to know when the masters are wrong -- as they inevitably eventually are.
05:39 Radvendii japhb: This is a great conversation, and i would really like to continue it, but it's 12:30 my time, and my brain is fried.
05:39 Radvendii I think I'm going to go to bed
05:39 Radvendii thanks for the stories, and discussion
05:39 japhb And all that said (and to come full circle) ... you will rarely find a community more welcoming of other language's viewpoints than this one.  :-)
05:39 japhb You're quite welcome, and thank you.
05:39 japhb Have a good night!
05:39 Radvendii oh, for sure
05:40 Radvendii good night
05:40 Radvendii o/
05:40 sorear japhb: are you sure that this community is actually inclusive and pluralistic?  maybe it's just groupthink telling you that. :D
05:41 japhb That was very much *not* the conversation I expected to have after popping my head in here for the first time in months.
05:41 japhb Nah, I've seen it in action.
05:41 japhb Plus, a group of people having a willful hallucination can make it true (or effectively so).
05:42 japhb And how have you been, my fine fellow?
05:44 sorear today could definitely be better.
05:45 japhb Oh?  What troubles you?
05:45 sorear last night there was a (pre-announced) power cut, so I shut my computer down
05:45 sorear this morning it told me it had no hard drive
05:45 japhb OUCH
05:45 japhb Been there, hated that.
05:45 sorear for no apparent reason I then cycled the power about 15 times
05:46 sorear on the ~15th try it booted and is working fine
05:46 sorear which makes me think the BIOS is fried, if that's possible
05:46 japhb Yeah, that'll make you feel *oh* so comfortable.
05:46 sorear no I/O errors on sda in dmesg yet
05:47 sorear (I'm on it right now, not cellphone IRC or anything like that)
05:47 japhb The last time a similar thing happened to me, it turned out to be residual charge on the case.  After a few failed tries to boot, I went to open the case, got a shock strong enough to sting for a few seconds, and it booted just fine after that.
05:48 japhb Apparently the maintenance on the power system had led to the ground line getting charged, or some such.
05:48 sorear in the middle (not the end) of that sequence of attempts, I opened the case and reinstalled all the IDE cables
05:48 geekosaur grins and giggles, open it and reseat all the cables.  but, my alternate guess is not fried bios, it's a borderline component that only works properly when wrmed up to operating temperature
05:48 geekosaur ah, ok
05:49 * japhb thinks for a bit ... what do you have between your computer and mains?
05:49 * sorear procured a portable drive and attempted a backup...
05:49 TimToady charging UPS drawing down voltage, you're thinking?
05:50 sorear [ 5607.913634] Buffer I/O error on device sdb1, logical block 786687
05:50 TimToady the fact that sorear could say the power was out seems to indicate a UPS
05:50 * japhb is wondering if sorear's power supply is limping and providing cruddy power (bad regulation or noisy output)
05:50 sorear that's what I was going to back up *onto*
05:50 japhb ouch again
05:51 TimToady low voltage while the refrigerator cools down?
05:51 sorear TimToady: no, I could say the power was out because I had a piece of mail from SDG&E saying "we'll disconnect your power at 10pm for maintaince, please make sure you have no generators running that could electocute our employees"
05:51 TimToady ah
05:52 japhb TimToady, yeah, possibly, or just component temperature changes moving it in and out of spec.  A marginal power supply plays havoc on the system (and runs it into the ground quickly, I might add -- some components REALLY don't like crappy power).
05:52 TimToady well, I guess I'm not Sherlock Holmes :)
05:53 * japhb idly wonders just how many actors have played Holmes over the years ....
05:53 TimToady it's that dirty power a-comin' from that thar nukular station
05:53 japhb Heh.
05:54 japhb sorear, did you ever answer what you had between your computer's power supply and the wall?  If so, I missed it.
05:54 sorear I'm not sure.
05:54 sorear Or rather
05:54 sorear One power strip w/breaker (and possibly a MOV?) and one brick that claims to be a UPS
05:55 japhb How long has it been since you had the electronics in the UPS replaced?
05:55 TimToady as I say, a charging UPS can draw down the voltage some
05:55 TimToady depending on how good the circuitry is
05:55 japhb Nodnod
05:55 japhb Also, what brand/model of UPS is it?
05:56 * TimToady has yet to find a good brand...
05:56 sorear I don't think this "UPS" charges.
05:57 japhb I've been happy with running an APC Smart-UPS at about 20-40% load for quite a long time.  It's had it's guts swapped out two or three times over the years, and I upgraded it from 1000 VA to 1500 VA at one point.  Otherwise it's taken quite a few hits from crappy mains over the years, without the computers being (apparently) the worse for wear.
05:58 TimToady I can't count how many UPSs I've killed, and we have pretty good power here most of the time...
05:58 sorear For the entire time I've had it, it's just been a very heavy extension cord - which had a purpose at one point, but I just noticed it no longer
05:58 TimToady maybe UPSs thrive on adversity, I dunno...
05:59 sorear (prevented me from unplugging my computer when tripping - since last move, cord no longer crosses a footpath)
06:00 japhb The last time I had to have the guts replaced (and paid the non-trivial fee), I asked why UPS systems die way earlier than the computers they protect.  The support guy basically said "because the UPS keeps sacrificing itself".
06:02 kaare_ joined #perl6
06:02 sorear someday I need to rework this room so that the PC is less than 4m from the nearest outlet
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07:13 dalek nqp/kill_props_vtables: cc387d7 | bacek++ | tools/build/PARROT_REVISION:
07:13 dalek nqp/kill_props_vtables: Bump parrot revision to kill_props_vtables marge commit.
07:13 dalek nqp/kill_props_vtables: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/cc387d7bde
07:14 bacek phenny, tell jnthn Any objections on merging nqp's kill_props_vtables branch?
07:14 phenny bacek: I'll pass that on when jnthn is around.
07:14 bacek phenny, tell moritz Any objections on merging nqp's kill_props_vtables branch?
07:14 phenny bacek: I'll pass that on when moritz is around.
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07:56 moritz \o
07:56 phenny moritz: 07:14Z <bacek> tell moritz Any objections on merging nqp's kill_props_vtables branch?
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07:59 moritz I'll take a look, spectest, and merge if everything works out
08:01 bacek moritz, o/
08:01 bacek moritz, it will need one-line patch for rakudo
08:03 bacek moritz, https://gist.github.com/1971209
08:04 moritz bacek: ok
08:04 bacek moritz, t/spec/S32-str/comb.rakudo                              (Wstat: 0 Tests: 41 Failed: 2)
08:05 bacek Is it expected? (rakudo, spectest)
08:05 moritz I've seen that before the branch merge too
08:05 bacek "comb... dies for expected reason"
08:05 moritz (though it's fairly recent)
08:05 bacek ah, ok.
08:06 bacek I just want to make sure it's not all my fault :)
08:06 moritz bacek: it's ALL your fault, even if you didn't touch anything related :-)
08:07 bacek moritz, hang on. This meme is about 10 years old!!!
08:07 moritz bacek: and it still works great :-)
08:07 bacek bah!
08:11 moritz ah, it's just a matter of change error message wording
08:19 dalek rakudo/nom: 943e4c5 | moritz++ | src/core/Cool.pm:
08:19 dalek rakudo/nom: correct the sub form of comb
08:19 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/943e4c5f2f
08:20 dalek roast: 952d663 | moritz++ | S32-str/comb.t:
08:20 dalek roast: fix and unfudge comb.t
08:20 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/952d663855
08:20 dalek nqp: 572970e | bacek++ | src/ (2 files):
08:20 dalek nqp: Update to latest parrot with replaceing prop VTABLEs with standalone functions
08:20 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/572970edfa
08:20 dalek nqp: cc387d7 | bacek++ | tools/build/PARROT_REVISION:
08:20 dalek nqp: Bump parrot revision to kill_props_vtables marge commit.
08:20 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/cc387d7bde
08:24 dalek rakudo/nom: 3ce70e6 | moritz++ | / (2 files):
08:24 dalek rakudo/nom: bump NQP revision, and get rid of VTABLE_getprop
08:24 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/3ce70e62f4
08:35 dalek roast: d062730 | moritz++ | S03-operators/repeat.t:
08:35 dalek roast: test that xx thunks the LHS
08:35 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/d062730a31
08:39 dalek roast: 9376407 | moritz++ | S12-construction/BUILD.t:
08:39 dalek roast:  RT #95340
08:39 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/9376407c49
08:50 moritz down to 75 testneeded tickets
08:50 moritz nom: Int but role { }
08:50 p6eval rakudo 943e4c:  ( no output )
09:01 dalek rakudo/nom: 42695ea | moritz++ | docs/ChangeLog:
09:01 dalek rakudo/nom: add :ex and :nth adverbs to ChangeLog
09:01 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/42695ead9e
09:19 * geekosaur had a lucid dream about trying to debug something weird in pugs.  I blame yinz, but "my weird brain, let me show you it" :)
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12:59 fsergot hi o/ !
13:05 moritz \o
13:14 colomon o/
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16:57 sorear amazing.  complete lack of overnight discussion.
16:57 sorear good * #perl6
17:00 [Coke] ~~
17:00 benabik When nobody talks on #perl6, I tend to assume I was on the wrong end of a net split.
17:02 sorear I don't see a netsplit.
17:02 benabik It's not always true, but it's more common than nobody talking.
17:04 Radvendii joined #perl6
17:05 Radvendii nom: my $a="foo"; (*="bar")($a); say $a;
17:05 p6eval rakudo 42695e: OUTPUT«Cannot assign to a non-container␤  in block <anon> at /tmp/pSyfe0gN1B:1␤␤»
17:05 Radvendii is that on purpose?
17:05 Radvendii that you can't assign with whatevercode?
17:06 [Coke] nom: * = "bar"
17:06 p6eval rakudo 42695e: OUTPUT«Cannot assign to a non-container␤  in block <anon> at /tmp/OTrz2HDyEP:1␤␤»
17:06 benabik Looks like that's not even becoming a whatevercode.
17:07 benabik It's just assigning to a Whatever, I think.
17:07 Radvendii hahaha
17:07 Radvendii really?
17:07 Radvendii nom: my $a="foo"; {$^a="bar"}($a); say $a;
17:07 p6eval rakudo 42695e: OUTPUT«Cannot assign to a readonly variable or a value␤  in block <anon> at /tmp/qVV8Leisl4:1␤␤»
17:08 benabik But I wouldn't expect (* = 'bar') to work...  Parameters are readonly by default.
17:08 Radvendii awwww… what's with everything being readonly?
17:08 benabik nom: my $a = 'foo'; (-> ($b is rw) { $b = 'bar' })($a); say $a
17:08 p6eval rakudo 42695e: OUTPUT«Not enough positional parameters passed; got 0 but expected 1 in sub-signature␤  in block <anon> at /tmp/7m0YSvMMes:1␤␤»
17:09 benabik huh
17:09 benabik nom: my $a = 'foo'; (sub ($b is rw) { $b = 'bar' })($a); say $a
17:09 p6eval rakudo 42695e: OUTPUT«bar␤»
17:10 Radvendii what's the justification for making everything readonly by default (im actually curious)
17:12 Radvendii O.o maybe there should be a "use readwrite" option to let everything be readwrite by default
17:12 benabik I think that would kill a lot of optimization.
17:12 benabik You'd have to create a container for every constant passed in.
17:12 Radvendii oh…
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17:12 Radvendii what about just for non-constants
17:13 Radvendii just for if you are passing a variable
17:14 Radvendii here, this is the xy problem again
17:14 Radvendii you know how one can say $a == 1|2?
17:14 Radvendii basically, i want to say $a (==2 | > 5)
17:15 Radvendii or, more specifically $a (==2 | = 5)
17:15 Radvendii (a.k.a. if it doesn't equal 2, make it 5
17:16 Radvendii i could just do "$a == 2 || $a = 5"
17:16 Radvendii but if $a is a more complicated expression…
17:17 benabik A complex expression that returns a lvalue?
17:17 Radvendii yes
17:17 benabik I'd probably do something like `my $a := complex-expression(); $a == 2 or $a = 5
17:18 Radvendii yeah… maybe i should let up on the code golfing :P
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17:46 sisar moritz: can i have commit bit for github.com/perl6/features/ ? #want to fix a typo
17:46 sisar github ID is 'Siddhant'
17:48 TimToady looks like you're alreayd there
17:49 TimToady if you have a perl6 commit bit, you should already be able to edit features
17:50 sisar strange, just a while back i did not see 'edit this file'
17:51 sisar TimToady: do have some mystical powers ? :p
17:52 TimToady well, I just use the command line on a cloned repo; don't know nuttin' abou the web interface really
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17:56 dalek features: 24e3424 | (Siddhant Saraf)++ | features.json:
17:56 dalek features: typo: printf => sprintf
17:56 dalek features: review: https://github.com/perl6/f​eatures/commit/24e3424d02
17:57 benabik But there is a printf...
17:57 benabik nom: printf "foo %s baz", 'bar'
17:57 p6eval rakudo 42695e: OUTPUT«foo bar baz»
17:57 sisar what ?
17:58 sisar oh noez
17:58 sisar sprintf and .fmt are (almost) the same, right ?
17:59 benabik That I don't know.
18:01 sisar benabik: any idea where is printf specced ? its not in S32.
18:02 colomon sisar:
18:02 colomon method fmt(Str $format = '%s') {
18:02 colomon sprintf($format, self);
18:02 colomon }
18:03 flussence S32/IO:472, S32/Str:403
18:03 colomon that's in niecza's Cool class.
18:03 flussence printf isn't really specced, but sprintf is
18:04 colomon sisar: it's not exact, some classes have more specialized versions of .fmt
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18:04 sisar colomon: i know. that is why i said almost above ^.
18:05 TimToady composite types tend to iterate the format as needed
18:06 TimToady perl6: say %*ENV.fmt("%s -> %s")
18:06 * sisar scratches his head
18:06 p6eval rakudo 42695e: OUTPUT«PERLBREW_VERSION -> 0.24␤USER -> p6eval␤MAIL -> /var/mail/p6eval␤SHLVL -> 1␤OLDPWD -> /home/p6eval␤HOME -> /home/p6eval␤PERLBREW_ROOT -> /home/p6eval/perl5/perlbrew␤LOGNAME -> p6eval␤_ -> ./run.sh␤TERM -> screen␤PATH_WITHOUT_PERLBREW -> /home/p6eval/rakudo/parrot:/…
18:06 p6eval ..pugs b927740: OUTPUT«*** Insufficient arguments to sprintf␤    at Prelude.pm line 668, column 13-53␤»
18:06 p6eval ..niecza v15-3-g1c4b5a7: OUTPUT«LANG -> en_US.UTF-8␤TERM -> screen␤SHELL -> /bin/bash␤SHLVL -> 1␤MAIL -> /var/mail/p6eval␤HOME -> /home/p6eval␤PATH_WITHOUT_PERLBREW -> /home/p6eval/rakudo/parrot:/home/p6eval​/rakudo/parrot:/usr/local/bin:/usr/bin:​/bin:/usr/local/games:/usr/games␤OLDPWD -> …
18:07 TimToady perl6: say %*ENV.sort.fmt("%s -> %s");   # curious
18:07 p6eval pugs b927740: OUTPUT«*** Insufficient arguments to sprintf␤    at Prelude.pm line 750, column 18-81␤       Prelude.pm line 668, column 13-53␤»
18:07 p6eval ..rakudo 42695e: OUTPUT«HOME -> /home/p6eval LANG -> en_US.UTF-8 LOGNAME -> p6eval LS_COLORS -> rs=0:di=01;34:ln=01;36:mh=00:pi=40;33:so=01;35:do​=01;35:bd=40;33;01:cd=40;33;01:or=40;31;01:su=37;​41:sg=30;43:ca=30;41:tw=30;42:ow=34;42:st=37;44:e​x=01;32:*.tar=01;31:*.tgz=01;31:*.arj=01;31:*.…
18:07 p6eval ..niecza v15-3-g1c4b5a7: OUTPUT«HOME -> /home/p6eval LANG -> en_US.UTF-8 LD_LIBRARY_PATH -> /usr/local/mono-2.10.1/lib LOGNAME -> p6eval LS_COLORS -> rs=0:di=01;34:ln=01;36:mh=00:pi=40;33:so=01;35:​do=01;35:bd=40;33;01:cd=40;33;01:or=40;31;01:su​=37;41:sg=30;43:ca=30;41:tw=30;42:ow=34;42:st…
18:08 TimToady \o/
18:08 sisar if there is nothing no printf in the spec, why is there a printf in rakudo ?
18:08 TimToady flussence just pointed you to printf in the spec
18:08 * sisar looks
18:21 sisar well, maybe i should just change the line in question to " printf, sprintf, .fmt " ?
18:24 * sisar afk
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18:24 Radvendii hey guys
18:24 Radvendii i found a (maybe) bug
18:25 Radvendii nom: my $a="foo"; 0 && $a="bar";
18:25 p6eval rakudo 42695e: OUTPUT«Cannot assign to a non-container␤  in block <anon> at /tmp/N7zBzIaBSN:1␤␤»
18:25 Radvendii nom: my $a="foo"; 0 && ($a="bar");
18:25 p6eval rakudo 42695e:  ( no output )
18:25 Radvendii shouldn't = be lower precidence than &&?
18:25 benabik it is.
18:26 benabik So (0 && $a) = 'bar'
18:26 Radvendii sorry
18:26 colomon which is 0 = 'bar'
18:26 Radvendii i meant higher precidence
18:26 benabik no...
18:26 benabik $a = $foo && $bar
18:26 Radvendii oooh
18:26 Radvendii good call
18:26 benabik There's `and` and `or` for low prec versions
18:27 Radvendii and you can't have different precidence for lvalue and rvalue?
18:27 benabik nom: my $a = 'foo'; 0 and $a = 'bar'; say $a
18:27 p6eval rakudo 42695e: OUTPUT«foo␤»
18:27 Radvendii benabik: ah! thanks, that helps.
18:27 Radvendii :D
18:27 benabik I supposed you _could_ have different precedence for l and r sides...  but I think that would get more confusing than needed.
18:28 Radvendii yeah
18:28 Radvendii i think you're right
18:31 Radvendii am i guaranteed that .grep will run through a list in order?
18:31 Radvendii or is that subject to different implimentations?
18:32 Radvendii wait… grep is lazy, so if i do @list.grep(...)[0] it will go through the list in order until it finds a match…
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18:34 TimToady grep is ordered by default unless you put it into a hyper context (or the new race context, which also unorders the results)
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19:05 japhb In the JSON::Tiny module, there is a commit by colomon that split 'rule array' into two rules, array and arraylist, and said that while this should be equivalent, in practice Niecza is much happier with the split rules.  Does anyone remember what that was about?
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20:41 colomon japhb: it was a niecza bug, AFAIK
20:53 lue hello world o/
20:53 mathw o/
21:04 colomon \o
21:09 sorear goodm * #perl6
21:09 colomon o/
21:09 sorear o/ colomon
21:10 colomon sorear: how are things?
21:10 * colomon is back from whirlwind trip to Toronto
21:11 sorear Mixed
21:13 sorear back from $event
21:16 lue could somebody reset my password on feather? It's been ages since I last used it and now I can't remember it :)
21:17 sorear lue: pm me what you want it reset to.
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21:37 moritz hugme: add Siddhant to perl6
21:37 hugme moritz: You need to register with freenode first
21:37 moritz dang
21:37 moritz hugme: add Siddhant to perl6
21:38 * hugme hugs Siddhant. Welcome to the perl6 github organization
21:38 * moritz -> sleep
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23:24 japhb colomon, do you remember if that Niecza bug was fixed?
23:24 japhb colomon, the one causing the array/arraylist rule split, I mean
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