Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2012-05-14

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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Time Nick Message
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00:34 diakopter Guest84531: you around?
00:35 diakopter whiteknight: you around?
00:36 Guest84531 yessir
00:36 diakopter I tried out your patches for nqp&rakudo for PackfileView
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00:37 wknight8111 they need work, I'm re-doing them
00:37 diakopter oh
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00:40 wknight8111 what did you see with them?
00:41 diakopter I manually applied each change so as not to get the whitespace & stage0 changes; it passed all tests in nqp, then tried to build rakudo with that nqp (also applying the changes to rakudo), and it failed many spectests
00:43 diakopter see https://github.com/diakopter/rakudo/commit​/bbf0170df9f91112998dad46222bbafe18b5f5c9 and https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/d3​a9cc242f306ebb88b5a312ea7d331ad7bb8d93
00:46 diakopter afk&
00:47 wknight8111 okay, thaks
00:48 wknight8111 thanks
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01:22 skids r: (1, (4,4), h => (3,3)).perl.say;
01:22 p6eval rakudo aeca2f: OUTPUT«(1, (4, 4), "h" => $(3, 3))␤»
01:23 skids Why the $ nowadays?
01:24 sorear the right side of => has been forced to be an item
01:25 skids thanks.
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01:52 skids sorear: may want to fix the url in the niecza release announcements to include the 'v' in the newer download url.
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01:56 sorear skids: hmm?  github changed something?
01:57 sorear ah, I see
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04:48 adu diakopter?
04:48 phenny adu: 13 May 17:28Z <moritz> tell adu that .join is a method on lists, not strings, so it won't appear in S32::Str
04:49 adu o right
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05:21 diakopter adu
05:21 adu hi
05:22 adu i was  going to tell you about the man/boy test
05:22 diakopter oh?
05:22 adu droscheme maxes out at about 15
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05:25 adu I just learned something very interesting from rosettacode.org
05:26 adu Grammar.parse takes an action argument!
05:26 adu I wish I had known that earlier
05:29 moritz adu: we have the man-or-boy test in the official Perl 6 test suite, integration/man-or-boy.t
05:30 adu moritz: I'll check it out
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05:55 TimToady it's also on rosettacode.org
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07:11 Timbus a
07:14 sorear b
07:15 tadzik c
07:16 tadzik r: say DateTime.new('2012-05-14T12:53:20').posix
07:16 p6eval rakudo aeca2f: OUTPUT«1337000000␤»
07:16 Timbus heh
07:18 mikec_ hehe
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07:31 jnthn oh shark, #perl6
07:32 moritz shark it's jnthn!
07:32 tadzik shark shark
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07:43 sergot hi o/
07:44 sorear o/
07:47 tadzik \o
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08:32 moritz http://sayspy.blogspot.de/2012/05/my​-very-shallow-thoughts-on-dart.html
08:33 moritz quite a refereshingly different perspective from the usual "OMG Dart sucks" rants on the internez
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08:57 dalek roast: 11ffc02 | moritz++ | S16-filehandles/chmod.t:
08:57 dalek roast: remove a test that is just duplicated inside an eval
08:57 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/11ffc0239a
08:59 dalek rakudo/nom: a144e29 | moritz++ | / (3 files):
08:59 dalek rakudo/nom: implement chmod as a function
08:59 dalek rakudo/nom:
08:59 dalek rakudo/nom: because a test file wants it that way :-). Run that test file
08:59 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/a144e29b70
08:59 * jnthn will be curious to run that one on Windows this evening :)
09:00 moritz it checks $*OS and does a skip_all; exit
09:00 jnthn ah :)
09:02 tadzik moritz: what's that change in
09:02 tadzik tools/update_passing_test_data.pl
09:02 tadzik ?
09:03 moritz tadzik: that was accidental :(
09:04 dalek roast: 470da6d | moritz++ | S14-roles/super.t:
09:04 dalek roast: remove test for SUPER::, which has been unspecced
09:04 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/470da6d0c9
09:05 tadzik yeah, I asked Justin Case
09:06 moritz tadzik: yes, thanks
09:06 moritz tadzik: though I consider leaving it in
09:06 moritz basically it reduced the output
09:06 moritz which was fine when we had many test files which we didn't run
09:09 dalek roast: 21f9cd3 | moritz++ | S06-signature/multidimensional.t:
09:09 dalek roast: remove a wrong test, update test plan
09:09 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/21f9cd3e3b
09:09 dalek rakudo/nom: 4ea6d60 | moritz++ | t/spectest.data:
09:09 dalek rakudo/nom: run another test file
09:09 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/4ea6d60824
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09:13 dalek roast: 59ce8bb | moritz++ | S12-methods/lvalue.t:
09:13 dalek roast: fix lvalue method tests
09:13 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/59ce8bb4a2
09:14 moritz colomon: that commit might lead to some passing TODOs in niecza (because the tests were simply wrong before)
09:16 dalek rakudo/nom: 56e86dd | moritz++ | t/spectest.data:
09:16 dalek rakudo/nom: run method lvalue tests
09:16 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/56e86dd27c
09:18 moritz p6: eval 'END { say "its over" }'; say 'end of main line';
09:18 p6eval pugs, rakudo a144e2, niecza v17-4-ge5b869e: OUTPUT«end of main line␤its over␤»
09:19 dalek roast: 4ba3eed | moritz++ | S04-exceptions/die-and-end.t:
09:19 dalek roast: remove a wrong, short test file that is not easy to fix
09:19 dalek roast:
09:19 dalek roast: in particular it assumes that END blocks inside an eval run when the eval
09:19 dalek roast: is returned, but they are truly run as late as possible.
09:19 dalek roast: Probably needs testing with Test::Util
09:19 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/4ba3eed517
09:50 moritz r: say zip((1, 2); (8, 9))
09:50 p6eval rakudo a144e2: OUTPUT«1 8 2 9␤»
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10:09 moritz r: say [1, 2, 3] Z <a b>
10:09 p6eval rakudo a144e2: OUTPUT«1 a 2 b␤»
10:09 moritz I'm pretty sure that's wrong
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10:12 dalek roast: a42f0a6 | moritz++ | S32-container/roundrobin.t:
10:12 dalek roast: redo roundrobin tests; delete tests for unspecced features
10:12 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/a42f0a6fc7
10:12 colomon moritz: worrong how?
10:12 colomon wrong how?
10:13 moritz colomon: simply confused variables/values
10:13 moritz copy/paste errors
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10:13 colomon moritz: no, I meant the 1 a 2 b.  (But thanks for the heads up on the other thing!)
10:14 moritz [1, 2, 3] is a single item
10:14 moritz zip shouldn't flatten it
10:19 dalek rakudo/nom: abb8f3a | moritz++ | / (2 files):
10:19 dalek rakudo/nom: basic implementation of &roundrobin; tests
10:19 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/abb8f3ab03
10:30 dalek roast: 31af067 | moritz++ | S (2 files):
10:30 dalek roast: fix some uses of eval
10:30 dalek roast:
10:30 dalek roast: those were still assuming that eval catches exceptions
10:30 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/31af067f97
10:30 moritz there might be some niecza unfudges possible after this commit too
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10:40 not_gerd r: say +<foo bar>.grep({$_ ~~ "foo"}); say +<foo bar>.grep(* ~~ "foo")
10:40 phenny not_gerd: 12 May 15:20Z <[Coke]> ask not_gerd if there's a ticket for the intval/opcode_t bug in parrot
10:40 p6eval rakudo 56e86d: OUTPUT«1␤0␤»
10:40 not_gerd bug?
10:42 jnthn r: say (* ~~ "foo").WHAT
10:42 p6eval rakudo 56e86d: OUTPUT«Bool()␤»
10:42 not_gerd phenny: tell [Coke] the intval/opcode_t but is filed as https://github.com/parrot/parrot/issues/705
10:42 phenny not_gerd: I'll pass that on when [Coke] is around.
10:43 jnthn Seems ~~ doesn't auto-curry...
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10:43 jnthn Wonder if it's spec'd as not doing so or if this is a bug.
10:44 tadzik it's certainly confusing
10:48 not_gerd any comments on https://gist.github.com/2693261
10:48 not_gerd it's a version of the regex-dna benchmark that works on current Rakudo by not using .subst()
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10:54 colomon moritz: you were right about niecza passing todos in lvalue.t.  :)
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11:00 dalek perl6-examples: 220cec7 | (Gerhard R)++ | shootout/regex-dna.p6-v2.pl:
11:00 dalek perl6-examples: [shootout/regex-dna] add version that works on Rakudo
11:00 dalek perl6-examples:
11:00 dalek perl6-examples: the .subst() call is what causes the excessive memory consumption
11:00 dalek perl6-examples: of the original version
11:00 dalek perl6-examples: review: https://github.com/perl6/perl​6-examples/commit/220cec796d
11:03 * bbkr does not understand this "but" magic in this regexp
11:05 jnthn bbkr: It mixes in a method Str that returns the string after the but.
11:07 bbkr thanks, looks like I have to re-read spec about "but" operator
11:10 bbkr rakudo: my $x = 1 but "foo"; say +$x;
11:10 p6eval rakudo 56e86d: OUTPUT«foo␤»
11:10 Timbus butt operator
11:10 Timbus
11:10 bbkr hm, why it invoked mixed-in Str method in numeric context?
11:11 bbkr or my understanding of "but" operator is incorrect
11:11 not_gerd bbkr: + probably returned the original value as it still is numeric
11:12 Timbus r: my $x = 1; $x does role { method Str {"foo"} }; say +$x; say "$x";
11:12 p6eval rakudo 56e86d: OUTPUT«foo␤foo␤»
11:12 Timbus pf
11:13 bbkr looks like bug to me
11:14 jnthn What bit of spec is in not in line with?
11:14 Timbus my $x = 1 but "foo"; say $x.Int;
11:14 Timbus uh
11:14 Timbus r: my $x = 1 but "foo"; say $x.Int;
11:14 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«foo␤»
11:14 not_gerd r: my $x = 1 but "foo"; say $x * 1;
11:14 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«1␤»
11:14 jnthn Right, Int.Int is identify
11:15 not_gerd careful with optimizing the *1 away
11:19 not_gerd r: say +((42 but "foo") but role { method gist { self + 0 } })
11:19 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«42␤»
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11:21 colomon r: my $x = 1 but "foo"; say +$x
11:21 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«foo␤»
11:22 bbkr ok, now I understand this operator :)
11:22 bbkr thanks
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11:31 dalek roast: 9c53615 | moritz++ | S02-lexical-conventions/comments.t:
11:31 dalek roast: rakudo unfudge
11:31 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/9c5361568c
11:33 not_gerd r: +Int.^methods.grep(*.name eq "Str")
11:33 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«(signal SEGV)»
11:34 moritz SEGV is the new NPMCA :/
11:34 moritz r: say Int.^methods.WHAT
11:34 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«Parcel()␤»
11:34 moritz r: say Int.^methods[0].WHAT
11:34 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«Method()␤»
11:35 moritz r: say Int.^methods.map(*.WHAT).gist
11:35 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«Method 'count' not found for invocant of class 'Whatever'␤  in method reify at src/gen/CORE.setting:4818␤  in method reify at src/gen/CORE.setting:4743␤  in method reify at src/gen/CORE.setting:4743␤  in method gimme at src/gen/CORE.setting:5130␤  in method eager a…
11:35 moritz r: say Int.^methods.map({ say .name}).eager
11:35 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«Method 'gist' not found for invocant of class 'String'␤  in sub say at src/gen/CORE.setting:6630␤  in block <anon> at /tmp/bDS8a1geuo:1␤␤»
11:35 moritz ok, at some point it returns a parrot String instead of a Str
11:36 jnthn Method calls should auto-coerce return values though
11:36 jnthn I wonder if that's being missed out for the .foo form.
11:37 jnthn r: say Int.^methods.map({ say $_.name}).eager
11:37 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«Int␤Num␤Rat␤FatRat␤abs␤Bridge␤chr␤succ␤​pred␤sqrt␤base␤floor␤round␤ceiling␤sign␤conj␤r​and␤sin␤asin␤cos␤acos␤tan␤atan␤atan2␤sec␤asec␤​cosec␤acosec␤cotan␤acotan␤sinh␤asinh␤cosh␤acos​h␤tanh␤atanh␤sech␤asech␤cosech␤acosech␤cotanh␤​acotanh␤unpolar␤cis␤Complex␤log␤exp␤trunca…
11:37 jnthn Yes.
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11:40 not_gerd r: say Int.^methods.grep({ $_.name eq "Str"}).[0].(42)
11:40 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«42␤»
11:40 not_gerd what's the sane way to do that?
11:41 moritz 42.Str :-)
11:41 moritz or
11:41 moritz r: say Int.^can('Str')[0](42)
11:41 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«42␤»
11:42 moritz r: say Int.^find_method('Str')(42) # more efficient and less specced
11:42 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«42␤»
11:45 not_gerd r: my $foo = (42 but "foo") but role { method gist { Int.^find_method("Str").(self) } }; .say for $foo, +$foo, ~$foo
11:45 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«42␤42␤foo␤»
11:45 not_gerd bbkr, Timbus: ^^
11:47 Timbus hah
11:48 jnthn .^find_method will end up spec when I get around to spec'ing MOP bits, I suspect.
11:50 not_gerd r: my $foo = (42 but "foo") but role { method Numeric { self + 0 } }; .say for $foo, +$foo, ~$foo
11:50 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«foo␤42␤foo␤»
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12:18 bbkr not_gerd: thanks for nice example
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12:26 masak <Timbus> man domt tell me .* was re-specced
12:26 masak <Timbus> because that would pretty much ruin all of the things i did in perl 6 D:
12:26 masak (fortunately .* wasn't re-spec'd)
12:26 * Timbus peers in
12:26 Timbus excellent
12:26 masak protos were :)
12:27 masak but this brings up a risk that no-one ever brings up, I think:
12:27 masak as the totality of the spec congeals and solidifies.
12:27 masak we're ever more restricted in what changes we *can* bring in without losing downstream happy-appy peeps.
12:28 masak it's like we're building up a baggage of ecosystem, and we have to take care of it by not doing too much of the upheaval thing.
12:28 tokuhirom joined #perl6
12:29 Timbus well thats fine. i just dont want useful things to keep vanishing.
12:29 Timbus :I
12:29 masak that might be my single biggest critique of the OKness proposal -- it's not that it doesn't have good intentions, or even will lead to improvements in how the language works.
12:29 masak but to me it feels "too late" in some sense to introduce such a big change into the spec.
12:30 birdwindupbird joined #perl6
12:31 mikec_ i think as a user you accept that to some degree
12:31 jnthn masak: Yes, but by re-spec'ing protos the upshot is that the behavior of .* will be different on multis.
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12:31 masak jnthn: right but it's still not like Timbus' nightmare that it disappeared altogether. the code can probably be rewritten to still use .* in a way that works.
12:32 masak I'm sure TimToady++ has considered the delay that such a change would introduce to the whole universe of compilers and modules and apps. he seems to be more willing to take such a cost than I am.
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12:34 Timbus well it would be nice to have modules dispatching to events via some kind of.. existing dispatch mechanism. is all.. the larger scope and implications of this okness thing. waaay over my head
12:35 masak jnthn: wouldn't an appropriate proto in the base class make Timbus' code runnable again?
12:36 masak r: class A { multi foo(Int $b) { say $b } }; A.*foo("OH HAI")
12:36 p6eval rakudo abb8f3:  ( no output )
12:36 masak hm, why does this survive but Timbus' case die?
12:37 Timbus r: class A { multi foo(Int $b) { say $b } }; A.new.*foo("OH HAI")
12:37 p6eval rakudo abb8f3:  ( no output )
12:37 * Timbus shrugs
12:38 flussence r: class A { multi method foo(Int $b) { say $b } }; A.new.*foo("OH HAI")
12:38 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«Cannot call 'foo'; none of these signatures match:␤:(A , Int $b, Mu *%_)␤␤  in method foo at src/gen/CORE.setting:310␤  in method dispatch:<.*> at src/gen/CORE.setting:839␤  in block <anon> at /tmp/yYQz6hx3Rv:1␤␤»
12:38 Timbus oh
12:38 Timbus method
12:39 jnthn masak: 'cus you missed the method :)
12:39 jnthn masak: (appropriate proto) huh? protos don't disambiguate any more...
12:39 jnthn uh, serve as fallbacks I mean...
12:40 * [Coke] drinks coffee.
12:40 phenny [Coke]: 10:42Z <not_gerd> tell [Coke] the intval/opcode_t but is filed as https://github.com/parrot/parrot/issues/705
12:40 cognominal_ joined #perl6
12:40 masak whaddya mean "missed the method"? wasn't Timbus' case also just a failed signature binding?
12:41 jnthn masak: Timbus one also just had "multi", not "multi method"
12:41 jnthn flussence++ got it right :)
12:41 masak oh!
12:42 masak silly masak, missed typing "method".
12:42 masak jnthn: and you're saying adding a proto method won't fix that? :(
12:43 masak ok, let me broaden the question then: how should the base class look for Timbus-style hooks in deriving classes to be possible? without getting those failed signature binding errors.
12:44 masak [backlog] hm, should .trans have a case-insensitivity flag? or will that create more trouble than it soaks up?
12:44 jnthn masak: I don't get what you mean about "adding a proto method". There already *is* a proto method - the generated one.
12:45 jnthn If you want any dispatch to work out, just write in the base class a multi foo(|$) { }
12:45 masak ah. yes.
12:45 jnthn That'll sort looser than anything else.
12:45 masak \o/
12:46 jnthn You could probably even write a trait so you can do proto method foo(|$) is failless { * }
12:47 jnthn (and it just adds the candidate I suggested above)
12:47 masak r: sub foo(Bool $b = sub { False }) {}; say "alive"
12:47 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«alive␤»
12:48 masak jnthn: would it be possible to get a compiler warning (or even an error) for the case of non-smartmatching defaults?
12:48 jnthn r: sub foo(Bool $b = sub { False }) {}; foo(); say "alive"
12:48 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«Nominal type check failed for parameter '$b'; expected Bool but got Sub instead␤  in sub foo at /tmp/y1PGydjjlZ:1␤  in block <anon> at /tmp/y1PGydjjlZ:1␤␤»
12:48 jnthn phew
12:48 masak :)
12:48 jnthn masak: If you mean "non-typechecking"?
12:48 jnthn Then probably, yes.
12:49 jnthn If we know the type of the RHS, which we do in this case.
12:49 jnthn Guess an error is fine.
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12:49 masak aye.
12:49 jnthn I mean, if it's gonna fail anyway... :)
12:49 masak not necessarily.
12:49 masak not if you always call it with the argument provided.
12:49 masak but it's a ticking bomb, for sue.
12:49 masak sure*
12:50 * masak .oO( and some angry end user might sue, for sure )
12:50 masak jnthn: will you be helped by me submitting a TODO RT ticket 'bout it?
12:50 masak should I make a spec change saying that we should explicitly check for this?
12:50 masak s/we/compilers/
12:52 jnthn masak: We don't tend to spec such things as "must". But a TODO RT is fine.
12:52 jnthn Or just implement it...it's only gonna be 3 or so lines of code. :)
12:53 * masak submits TODO rakudobug, and might come around to implementing it leytur
12:53 jnthn (in parameter action method...you already have the nominal_type to hand, and can see if the default has a known compile time value, which we already consider anyway)
12:54 masak jnthn: that's cool. means I can probably do it all by myself ;)
12:56 pmurias joined #perl6
12:56 pmurias fglock: hi
12:57 pmurias fglock: i want to hook in an optimalisation pass/backend to Perlito5 as an external process what's the best way to do that?
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13:05 dalek tablets: a9ae891 | (Herbert Breunung)++ | docs/appendix-g-glossary.txt:
13:05 dalek tablets: polish entry for sigil
13:05 dalek tablets: review: https://github.com/perl6/tablets/commit/a9ae891e02
13:06 * masak .oO( many Polish entries )
13:08 pmurias shouldn't the tablets be linked to the spec?
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13:29 masak pmurias: by "be linked to", do you mean "link to"?
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13:37 skids joined #perl6
13:37 pmurias masak: yes
13:41 masak sure, why not?
13:45 tyatpi joined #perl6
13:49 pmurias i'm not volunteering for that just suggesting ;)
13:51 mikemol joined #perl6
13:53 fglock pmurias: hi
13:53 fglock I think you could use the -Cast-perl5 output
13:55 fglock alternately you need to plug it in at the compiler itself, in 2 places: perlito5.pl, and eval()
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13:59 pmurias fglock: what's i'm currently doing is adding an -Cast-hs option
13:59 pmurias i want to write the optimizer in haskell so i can't use the hoopl library
14:00 fglock you will probably want to read the AST back to emit code, it should be easy to add a new switch that does that
14:00 fglock nice
14:00 fglock or just run haskell!
14:01 fglock p5 -> AST -> haskell -> bootstrap :)
14:03 pmurias how will BEGIN block be handled in Perlito5?
14:05 fglock it is executed by eval(), and the result is serialized - the details are a bit more complicated, see README-perlito5-js#Compile-time / Run-time interleaving (TODO)
14:10 NamelessTee joined #perl6
14:11 fglock the -Cast-* output happens after all BEGIN and "use", it should be ready to run (but there is a long way ahead implementing all these)
14:13 pmurias BEGIN {$foo = create_a_complicated_object()} is most concerning thing
14:14 pmurias fglock: we will serialize the whole environment? (like kp6 used to do?)
14:16 fglock yes
14:17 fglock and if you need eval(), we throw in a compiler too
14:20 pernatiy joined #perl6
14:20 fglock (perlito is a kp6 without the slow parts)
14:40 [Coke] # 05/13/2012 - rakudo++ (22080); niecza (92.24%); pugs (35.26%)
14:40 masak p6: say (2, 3, 4) leg (2..4)
14:40 p6eval rakudo abb8f3, niecza v17-4-ge5b869e: OUTPUT«Same␤»
14:40 p6eval ..pugs: OUTPUT«0␤»
14:40 masak p6: say (2, 4) leg (2..4)
14:40 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT«1␤»
14:40 p6eval ..rakudo abb8f3, niecza v17-4-ge5b869e: OUTPUT«Decrease␤»
14:43 pernatiy joined #perl6
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14:57 dalek roast: 03de2f7 | (Kyle Hasselbacher)++ | S32-num/base.t:
14:57 dalek roast: [base.t] Test for RT 11290
14:57 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/03de2f7d0b
15:04 [Coke] hurm. I can't build rakudo with --gen-parrot behind work proxy.
15:04 moritz :(
15:04 moritz [Coke]: does 'git pull' work for both ssh and git:// URLs?
15:05 [Coke] git@github.com:rakudo/rakudo.git works. git:// does not.
15:05 [Coke] the former goes through the http proxy correctly.
15:06 masak [Coke]: I've had the same at times.
15:06 masak I just do the pull manually, and re-run the Configure.pl --gen-parrot
15:06 masak if it finds a new enough nqp and parrot, it doesn't try to git-pull it.
15:07 tadzik I can't use git protocol on my university either
15:07 moritz [Coke]: if you clone parrot once with the right URL yourself, rakudo will re-use the right URL
15:07 [Coke] I'd rather make the proxy work. ah well.
15:10 spaceships joined #perl6
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15:31 dalek roast: 8ba936c | (Kyle Hasselbacher)++ | S32-str/split-simple.t:
15:32 dalek roast: [split-simple.t] Test for RT 112868
15:32 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/8ba936c0f7
15:32 sisar joined #perl6
15:34 [Coke] if we switched to using git submodules, would git clean -xdf in rakudo not wipe out t/spec, nqp/, and parrot/ ?
15:36 masak does anyone actually use git submodules?
15:36 masak (honest question, not trying to be sarcastic)
15:37 masak r: class A { has $!x; submethod BUILD { my $!x = 42 }; method foo { say $!x } }; A.new.foo
15:37 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Cannot use ! twigil on my variable␤at /tmp/8Zmo0LUNcp:1␤»
15:37 masak :)
15:38 tokuhirom joined #perl6
15:38 masak b: class A { has $!x; submethod BUILD { my $!x = 42 }; method foo { say $!x } }; A.new.foo
15:38 p6eval b 922500: OUTPUT«42␤»
15:38 masak right.
15:39 [Coke] masak: I don't.
15:40 moritz there's a newish tool, 'git subtree', which supports a slightly different working style and which has been praised by many people
15:40 moritz I haven't used it myself, can't comment on how good or how fitting it is
15:40 tadzik masak: my coworker was using them some time ago, he was mostly cursing and getting rid of them
15:43 JimmyZ git subtree is a good tool
15:43 moritz but would it be a good fit for rakudo to include parrot and nqp as subtrees?
15:44 masak I've also heard about 'git subtree'. maybe worth checking out. but I'm not actually sure there's a problem there that particularly needs fixing.
15:45 masak I mean, company proxies will exist even if we employ 'git subtree'.
15:45 moritz troo
15:45 masak and otherwise things seem to be working pretty well.
15:45 paul_tyler joined #perl6
15:45 moritz because we've written our own tools, which we still need to maintain
15:45 masak yeah.
15:46 JimmyZ moritz: masak see https://github.com/zhuomingliang/skytools, there is a lib dir , but I don't how it works
15:47 cognominal joined #perl6
15:48 [Coke] rakudo seems happy enough building with perl 5.16
15:48 [Coke] (OS X 10.7.3)
15:48 moritz [Coke]++ for testing
15:48 cognominal___ joined #perl6
15:48 moritz I'm not surprised, our configure system doesn't do anything "fancy"
15:56 jnthn decommute, at last &
15:57 bbkr std: /[]/
15:57 p6eval std 8632387: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤Null pattern not allowed at /tmp/MMjcI7Gz6a line 1:â�¤------> [32m/[[33mâ��[31m]/[0mâ�¤    expecting regex atomâ�¤Parse failedâ�¤FAILED 00:00 41mâ�¤Â»
16:00 [Coke] building rakudo is probably the most complicated thing I use perl5 for in a week.
16:00 [Coke] *sadface*
16:00 goraki [Coke]: Do you not have problems building from nom on Lion?
16:01 [Coke] I'm using 10.7.3. I'm sorry, I have no idea if that's lion.
16:01 goraki os x, right?
16:02 [Coke] 11:48 < [Coke]> (OS X 10.7.3)
16:02 bbkr 10.7.x = Lion, 10.8.x = Mountain Lion
16:02 goraki yeah, that. (-: it's Lion, also the same subversion I'm running - which is why I asked.
16:03 [Coke] goraki: works fine here, using rakudo nom, i686-apple-darwin11-llvm-gcc-4.2 (GCC) 4.2.1
16:03 [Coke] you having a build issue?
16:03 goraki yeah.
16:03 goraki during the building of parrot it seems.
16:04 goraki (during perl Configure.pl --gen-parrot)
16:04 [Coke] throw the build log somewhere I can see it?
16:05 bbkr also tell us which XCode do you use
16:05 goraki XCode Version 4.3.2 (4E2002)
16:06 goraki build log coming.
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16:07 bbkr have you installed it directly from AppStore on clean system or over 4.2 standalone series?
16:08 goraki it wasn't a clean system I'm afraid.
16:08 [Coke] my gcc is from xcode 4.3 (4E109)
16:09 goraki this is an upgrade from a 10.6.x, and I've been upgrading Xcode since I got the machine (a couple of years ago).
16:12 masak niecza: say 4 ~~ Failure ?? 5 !! 42
16:12 p6eval niecza v17-4-ge5b869e: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤â�¤Expecting a term, but found either infix ?? or redundant prefix ?â�¤  (to suppress this message, please use space between ? ?) at /tmp/3SRuSARtcP line 1:â�¤------> [32msay 4 ~~ Failure ??[33mâ��[31m 5 !! 42[0mâ�¤â�¤Parse failedâ�¤â�¤Â»â€¦
16:12 masak sorear: why do I get this? Failure is a term, no?
16:12 masak std: say 4 ~~ Failure ?? 5 !! 42
16:12 p6eval std 8632387: OUTPUT«ok 00:00 41m␤»
16:12 * masak submits nieczabug
16:14 bbkr goraki: I remember that after Xcode 4.3 upgrade I had to explicitly select Xcode version to use (despite the fact that I uninstalled standalone 4.2). "sudo xcode-select -switch /Applications/Xcode.app/Contents/Developer/" - as far as I remember
16:15 goraki bbkr: I've uninstalled the old version, so in theory there should be no conflict.
16:15 goraki however I'll double check.
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16:16 cognominal___ joined #perl6
16:16 geekosaur in theory.  in practice, uninstalling doesn't remove saved state (like the xcode-select -switch value) etc.
16:16 geekosaur ...which will be /Developer if you have used an earlier Xcode
16:17 bbkr hence explicit selection of AppStore version in Applications/
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16:18 goraki right, going to check that now.
16:18 goraki in the mean time, here's the end of the build log.
16:18 goraki http://pastebin.com/NBnaQ24s
16:18 goraki I can post the rest of it if you like, but it's long, obviously.
16:19 sorear masak: Failure is an unknown name, so it's treated as a postdeclared listop ;)
16:19 cognominal joined #perl6
16:20 masak ah.
16:20 sorear masak: also, dunno if you saw, but you got the first link in announce.v17 wrong
16:20 masak :/
16:22 bbkr goraki: do you build 2012.04 release or HEAD version?
16:23 goraki bbkr: I can build 2012.04 fine. HEAD doesn't.
16:23 goraki bbkr: that's the odd thing.
16:23 dalek niecza: fe453ec | sorear++ | docs/release.txt:
16:23 dalek niecza: fix small glitch in release.txt skids++
16:23 dalek niecza: review: https://github.com/sorear/niecza/commit/fe453ec079
16:26 masak sorear: I'm not quite synched up with the backlog yet..
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16:29 masak sorear: ah. see https://github.com/sorear/niecza/commit/​b8fcf8502562cf1245dfaf3ed6a9ca72b2ac4a31 -- this was the only place where the release guide led me wrong. I could fix it in FETCH_URL -- didn't even think about the announcement, which was already sent at that point.
16:29 masak I don't remember exactly what it was about the release guide that was confusing. only that it was.
16:29 * jnthn home
16:30 masak jnthn! \o/
16:30 dalek tablets: 590b09c | (Herbert Breunung)++ | docs/appendix- (2 files):
16:30 dalek tablets: getting quoting terms in better shape
16:30 dalek tablets: review: https://github.com/perl6/tablets/commit/590b09ccf1
16:31 adu joined #perl6
16:31 masak greetings, adu.
16:31 colomon masak: no Failure in niecza
16:32 colomon niecza: Failure
16:32 p6eval niecza v17-4-ge5b869e: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤â�¤Undeclared name:â�¤ 'Failure' used at line 1â�¤â�¤Unhandled exception: Check failedâ�¤â�¤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/boot/lib/CORE.setting line 1364 (die @ 3) â�¤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/src/STD.pm6 line 1147 (P6.comp_unit @ 33) â�¤  at /home…
16:32 goraki bbkr: so far no joy switching the Xcode instance, I've done everything apart from reboot.
16:32 bbkr goraki: file from your backlog that causes trouble is in NQP, not Parrot
16:33 goraki ahhh, right, sorry.
16:33 masak colomon: yeah, sorear explained.
16:34 masak no &fail either, IIRC.
16:35 sorear o/ colomon
16:35 sorear [ good * #perl6 ]
16:35 [Coke] looks like one of the 3rd party libraries isn't quite up to date with latest xcode. wonder if there's a later version we can merge in.
16:36 jnthn [Coke]: Which one, ooc?
16:36 bbkr goraki: unfortunately I know very little about NQP :(
16:36 goraki bbkr: okay, well don't worry about it. (-:
16:37 goraki bbkr: before looking at it seriously I'm going to upgrade Xcode and double check that there is no legacy stuff hanging around, otherwise I could be chasing ghosts.
16:37 dalek tablets: 5eed3a4 | (Herbert Breunung)++ | docs/appendix-g-glossary.txt:
16:37 dalek tablets: prepare to wrap up argument related terms
16:37 dalek tablets: review: https://github.com/perl6/tablets/commit/5eed3a4a0b
16:37 jnthn [Coke]: ah, nm, just saw the link to the log
16:37 goraki bbkr++: thanks for your help.
16:38 jnthn Hmm. dyncall related...
16:39 * geekosaur is on his second "newer xcode breaks stuff" in 12 hours... increasingly glad he stayed at 4.2.1
16:39 geekosaur (mind, would be nice to be able to use it, but so much stuff still breaks...)
16:43 sorear why does xcode break stuff?
16:44 tadzik 'evening
16:44 sorear greetings tadzik.
16:45 masak tadziku! \o/
16:46 s1n joined #perl6
16:47 tadzik masaku, sorearze!
16:48 geekosaur sorear, Apple moved the internals of Xcode around in the 4.3 releases; a lot of stuff that refers to said internals has not caught up yet
16:48 sorear are those declensional endings?
16:48 * ingy waves
16:48 geekosaur ideally nothing would refer to them directly, in practice it's still necessary sometimes
16:48 tadzik sorear: yes
16:48 PacoAir joined #perl6
16:49 geekosaur although the changes in 4.3 should hopefully make it less necessary once stuff is rewritten to use it...
16:49 masak sorear: vocative.
16:49 tadzik if "declensional" is what I think it is :)
16:49 kaleem joined #perl6
16:50 masak yes.
16:51 havenn joined #perl6
16:51 masak there's a metaphor going on there, about how nouns are being "bent" (declined) for various purposes.
16:52 PerlJam masak: so ... someone who does that can be reasonably considered a "bender"?
16:53 derrazo_ joined #perl6
16:53 masak grammar. it's addictive.
16:53 dalek roast: efd9d5b | (Kyle Hasselbacher)++ | S05-mass/rx.t:
16:53 dalek roast: [S05-mass] Test for RT 112450
16:53 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/efd9d5baea
16:53 dalek roast: cb72ab0 | (Kyle Hasselbacher)++ | S05-mass/rx.t:
16:53 dalek roast: [S05-mass/rx.t] Test for RT 112454
16:53 dalek roast:
16:53 dalek roast: These are the only tests in this file that use $/, so maybe they should
16:53 dalek roast: be somewhere else.
16:53 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/cb72ab0184
16:53 sorear masak: What is 'sorearze
16:53 derrazo left #perl6
16:53 sorear masak: What is 'sorearze'?  w:Polish_morphology#Nouns doesn't mention -ze
16:54 az5112 joined #perl6
16:54 masak I bet it's also the vocative.
16:54 masak the vocative doesn't seem regular, though I bet there are patterns.
16:54 masak haven't figgered them out yet.
16:55 masak it's "masaku" and "tadziku" but "sergocie" and "sorearze".
16:55 sergot :)
16:57 sorear https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vocative#Polish
16:57 tadzik sorear: I can't really tell how this works. sorearze is like "boże" or "serze", "bóg" and "ser" being god and cheese consequently
16:57 * sorear nods
16:58 tadzik I have to admit that I never learned the rules behind those things, I just can use them properly
16:59 * masak decommutes
17:04 moritz http://moritz.faui2k3.org/tmp/changelog-lines.svg # number of changelog entries per rakudo release
17:05 moritz for that I've lumped the 2012.04.1 and the 2012.05 releases together
17:07 moritz https://gist.github.com/2695100 is what I used to extract that info
17:08 az5112 Funny, I have just checked and google translate thinks that both sorear and sergot are females :)
17:08 sorear does polish have the silly gramattical gender = social gender for humans thing?
17:09 moritz az5112: well, 'sorear' is neither a word nor a traditional name, and 'sergot' is a lst name
17:12 moritz jnthn++ # Grammar::Trace
17:12 az5112 Yeah, but I entered "My dear Sorear/Sergot" to force the translator to assign the gender (for the adjective), and it always picks the adjective form for the female; so I guess there must be some variable controlling political correctness somewhere in the translator :)
17:12 s1n joined #perl6
17:14 moritz :-)
17:18 az5112 Funny... It doesn't do that for French though...
17:19 az5112 My dear sorear is Mon cher sorear
17:20 az5112 Nor for Russian
17:20 Chillance joined #perl6
17:21 az5112 Nor for Slovak
17:21 az5112 Nor Slovenian!
17:22 az5112 So it's either the bug or they have a female programmer on the team! :D
17:22 spider-mario it’s a shame google can’t translate from or to lojban !
17:22 spider-mario -' '
17:22 spider-mario I’m too used to putting a space before “!”, “?”, “;” and “:”
17:22 spider-mario we do in French
17:23 spider-mario (a thin non-breakable space, more specifically)
17:23 jnthn moritz: Nice graph!
17:23 sorear it can't do Japanese either :|
17:24 dalek roast: a4148aa | (Kyle Hasselbacher)++ | S29-context/eval.t:
17:24 dalek roast: [eval.t] Test for RT 112472 -- bad error message for eval of bogus language
17:24 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/a4148aaec5
17:24 KyleHa joined #perl6
17:24 KyleHa Hi #perl6.
17:24 sorear graph? where?
17:24 tadzik hi KyleHa
17:24 sorear Hello, KyleHa
17:24 tadzik http://moritz.faui2k3.org/tmp/changelog-lines.svg
17:24 tadzik sorear: ^
17:25 jnthn o/ KyleHa
17:25 KyleHa Hey, jnthn, you can help me!
17:25 sorear masak: I have a vague desire to see that integrated.
17:25 KyleHa I put a test for this bug:  https://rt.perl.org/rt3/Tic​ket/Display.html?id=112472
17:25 sorear moritz: I have a vague desire to see that integrated.
17:26 KyleHa I want to know if the test is good enough to close the ticket, or if it needs to check more.
17:26 araujo joined #perl6
17:27 araujo joined #perl6
17:27 jnthn KyleHa: Looks decent to me.
17:27 KyleHa Thanks jnthn!
17:28 KyleHa Is Moritz in the house?
17:30 KyleHa My stomach is burning. I'll come back when I'm fed.
17:30 KyleHa left #perl6
17:30 jnthn ooh, getting fed is a good idea..
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17:41 havenn joined #perl6
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17:49 adu masak: greetings
17:50 * TimToady intercepts masak's greetings en passant and replies o/ on behalf of mashark^Wmasak
17:50 s1n joined #perl6
17:51 * TimToady is attempting to backlog with migraine jaggies, but at least they've moved off my fovea now
17:51 slavik1 joined #perl6
17:52 adu ooo the chess rule nobody knows about
17:53 adu I realize now that masak's hello was over an hour ago
17:54 adu TimToady: have you tried Aspirin?
17:56 slavik1 joined #perl6
17:56 TimToady I am not allowed to take aspirin; I get GI bleeding
17:56 TimToady no NSAIDs for me, except aceteminaphen
17:57 * TimToady doesn't really want to end up in the hospital again
17:57 geekosaur ...which isn;t an NSAID :p
17:57 PerlJam TimToady: Every time I hear about some health issue that you have, the more I think Perl a miracle.
17:57 TimToady geekosaur: it's non-steroidal, and it's somewhat anti inflammatory :P
17:58 sorear is it 'only' an antipyretic/analgesic?
17:58 TimToady fortunately this is (I hope) just an ophthalmic migraine
17:58 geekosaur (and it doesn't do anything noticeable to me unless I take so much that I'm risking worse liver problems than the stomach issues from NSAIDs...)
17:58 TimToady so while I have the "mean feeling" of a migraine, it doesn't really hurt
17:59 geekosaur ah, bodies.  more ways to be messed up than there are people...
17:59 TimToady well, eventually your doctors give you completely contradictory advice, and then you die :)
17:59 geekosaur they already have, a few times.
18:00 TimToady well, then you're gonna die :P
18:00 * geekosaur 's social circle somewhat encourages talking about  "the last time my doctor tried to kill me"
18:00 adu TimToady: like "get plenty of rest" while you're working 60-hour work weeks
18:01 TimToady sure, but they didn't tell you to work the 60-hour work week
18:02 TimToady I'm supposed to eat a low-fat diet because of family history, and I'm suppoed to eat a high-fat diet because of having had a partial gastrectomy
18:02 slavik1 TimToady: eat something in between?
18:02 slavik1 medium fat diet?
18:02 TimToady mostly I try to eat healthy fats along with the unhealthy ones :)
18:03 slavik1 potato chips for the win :)
18:03 [Coke] TimToady: bleargh. i do wish I could just have food handed to me. I do a terrible job picking out things that I should eat.
18:04 sorear Life with organs is hard.  Brain in a jar sounds like a pretty good deal to me.
18:04 TimToady except it's pretty hard to clone yourself without sacrificing brain tissue that way
18:07 TimToady plus bits of your brain can also be construed as organs
18:08 TimToady the problem isn't so much organs and organics...
18:08 ingy date +%s|cut -b1-4
18:08 TimToady s/and/as/
18:09 TimToady ingy++ is caught redhanded lurking
18:09 sorear Yeah.  Down with organics.
18:09 [Coke] ... if you're caught redhanded, does that make you move more gingerly next time?
18:10 sorear caught redheaded!
18:10 TimToady oddly, pipe organs are mostly not organic
18:10 TimToady but organ pipe cactuses are, go figure...
18:11 mucker joined #perl6
18:11 * [Coke] runs igny's command. nifty.
18:11 ingy It's 1337 week!
18:11 fglock joined #perl6
18:12 sorear o/ fglock
18:12 TimToady is this something intended to offset Mother's Day?
18:12 fglock o/
18:17 moritz niecza: say (4 ~~ Failure) ?? 5 !! 42
18:17 p6eval niecza v17-4-ge5b869e: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤â�¤Undeclared name:â�¤ 'Failure' used at line 1â�¤â�¤Unhandled exception: Check failedâ�¤â�¤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/boot/lib/CORE.setting line 1364 (die @ 3) â�¤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/src/STD.pm6 line 1147 (P6.comp_unit @ 33) â�¤  at /home…
18:17 moritz masak: ^^ Failure is simply not declared in niecza
18:17 TimToady Failure is not an option...
18:18 adu ingy: is that unix timestamp?
18:18 spider-mario r: (True ^^ True).perl.say
18:18 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«Nil␤»
18:18 masak moritz: yes, I know. sorear++ explained it.
18:18 cogno joined #perl6
18:18 masak and then colomon.
18:18 sorear adu: yes
18:18 masak it's quite amazing that Niecza is as developed as it is, and yet doesn't have the Failure type.
18:20 adu oo the second billenium is in 2033
18:21 fgomez joined #perl6
18:22 masak :P
18:23 adu we should plan a huge party somewhere
18:23 moritz wow, I've got a /msg on perlmonks "Perl6 grammar capability is simply beautiful!" about that gist that parses the ChangeLog
18:23 masak I'm reading the diakopter/gfldex discussion from yesterday, and I want to jump in and make all the miscommunication go away, but I can't because it happened in the backlog, not now.
18:23 adu moritz: well, it is
18:24 masak moritz: where's the gist? /me curious
18:24 moritz in the backlog :-) https://gist.github.com/2695100
18:24 gfldex masak: could we ease your pain by pretending it never happened? :->
18:24 moritz I used it to produce http://moritz.faui2k3.org/tmp/changelog-lines.svg
18:25 masak nah. I'm not wired that way.
18:25 masak but it would be interesting to heard what you learned from it.
18:25 jnthn hah, moritz++ also used Grammar::Tracer to debug it :D
18:25 shinobicl joined #perl6
18:26 masak gfldex: you held and defended a staunchly fixed and fiercly wrong opinion against a compiler implementor. what was the fallout of that?
18:26 masak moritz: thanks. I'm not done with the lackbog yet. :)
18:26 masak that's why I'm looking so confused and underinformed.
18:26 gfldex there was no fallout on my side, at least non that i could notice
18:27 moritz jnthn: heh, yes. My grammar worked from the very start, except that it failed at the very end of the string (because there's no newline after the last changelog entry)
18:27 jnthn moritz: oh :)
18:27 diakopter niecza: my $b = ->($a=->{}) { say $a }; $b($b)
18:27 p6eval niecza v17-4-ge5b869e: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Unable to resolve method Capture in class Block␤  at <unknown> line 0 (ExitRunloop @ 0) ␤  at /tmp/NBMArHlyvZ line 0 (ANON @ 1) ␤  at /tmp/NBMArHlyvZ line 1 (mainline @ 2) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 3842 (ANON @ 3) …
18:27 masak gfldex: hm, I just meant "fallout" as in "the world events that this resulted in". i.e. maybe you realized something.
18:28 moritz jnthn: and once I ran it with Grammar::Debugger, it took so long that I figured out the solution on my own before the run finished
18:28 masak <gfldex> $ is a marker for the compiler that tells it it's not a function
18:28 diakopter oh boy
18:28 masak gfldex: I actually see where you're coming from with this one.
18:29 masak gfldex: but you made a crappy job at explaining it so that diakopter understood the point of it :)
18:29 diakopter I understood the point; my point was the statement equally applies to %,@
18:30 masak granted.
18:30 masak gfldex's point seems to have been about sigils being noun markers.
18:30 dalek tablets: 9d0bd55 | (Herbert Breunung)++ | docs/appendix- (2 files):
18:30 dalek tablets: sharpening some bits
18:30 dalek tablets: review: https://github.com/perl6/tablets/commit/9d0bd55a8f
18:31 masak but he mucked it up by going on a tangent about holding function values at runtime.
18:32 gfldex because the person who asked the original question seam to have a fixation on types, what failed for him when he tried to understand $
18:33 sorear masak: see also me getting frustated with the direction the convo was going and leaving
18:33 masak aye.
18:34 masak sorear: but you got frustrated with Araq.
18:40 masak I'm surprised that the discussion mentioned "Perl 6 won't make sigils optional" without once mentioning the new \ sigil and how it makes sigils optional.
18:41 TimToady "won't make optional" is code for "won't banish them"
18:41 masak I guess.
18:42 TimToady but I'm also a bit surprised
18:42 s1n joined #perl6
18:42 masak when I see someone arguing for banishing sigils in Perl 6, I flip the bozo bit.
18:42 lichtkind joined #perl6
18:42 gfldex masak: i did mention \
18:42 lichtkind is it declaring to a .. or declaring as a .. ?
18:42 lichtkind ha
18:42 masak gfldex: oh! url?
18:43 masak lichtkind: what's the full sentence?
18:43 masak lichtkind: it's like asking "is it 'passing in a ...' or 'passing over a ...'?" both are correct.
18:43 gfldex http://irclog.perlgeek.de/​perl6/2012-05-13#i_5587077
18:43 lichtkind masak: the keyword role declares the following block to a role
18:44 gfldex and i would still like to know what parcel binding is for
18:44 masak gfldex: oh, I missed that because I was feeling sorry for diakopter at that point, who had to counter your strange arguments :)
18:44 TimToady for leaving out the sigil :)
18:44 gfldex that is just nasty!
18:45 masak don't do it, then.
18:45 TimToady in my experience, masak++ is much more interested in the truth than in being nasty
18:46 diakopter I didn't know about \
18:46 moritz gfldex: the idea is that you sometimes just want to pass something on without any modifications. But binding something to a sigiled variable always implies context
18:46 masak TimToady: oh, I thought "nasty" was a reaction to "for leaving our the sigil", not what I said.
18:46 TimToady maybe it was ;)
18:46 gfldex could very well be
18:47 masak :P
18:47 gfldex when you use the intarweb anything is possible!
18:47 masak in this instance I'm interested in doing an autopsy on a discussion with cross purposes and good intentions.
18:47 masak people who are benign can still fail to reach each other and make a genuine connection on IRC.
18:48 diakopter std: sub foo(label1: say 1; say 2) {}
18:48 p6eval std 8632387: OUTPUT«Use of uninitialized value $x in pattern match (m//) at STD.pm line 66537.�Use of uninitialized value $x in concatenation (.) or string at STD.pm line 66576.�[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m�In parameter declaration, typename 'label1' must be predeclared (or marked as …
18:48 masak diakopter: I never cease to admire the twistedness of your mind :)
18:49 diakopter stdbug
18:49 diakopter let
18:49 sorear masak: I can't say with certainty how much of my snapping was caused by Araq, how much was caused by gfldex, and how much was caused by RL stress
18:49 sorear n:  sub foo(label1: say 1; say 2) {}
18:49 p6eval niecza v17-4-ge5b869e: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m��In parameter declaration, typename 'label1' must be predeclared (or marked as declarative with :: prefix) at /tmp/5FRaY137_j line 1:�------> [32msub foo(label1[33m�[31m: say 1; say 2) {}[0m��Parse failed��»
18:49 diakopter stdbuglet being the unitialized $x warning
18:50 masak right.
18:50 masak diakopter: but signatures are their own slang. why would 'label1:' even make sense there?
18:50 diakopter sry; it doesn't...
18:50 masak that colon is bound to end up meaning 'invocant marker'.
18:50 diakopter I'm exploring semilist
18:50 masak ok.
18:51 masak I'm just assuming when I see that that you know something I don't :)
18:51 moritz r: say roundrobin(<a b c>; <d e>; <f g h i>)
18:51 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«a d f b e g c h i␤»
18:51 sorear std: say(label1: say 1; say 2)
18:51 p6eval std 8632387: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m�Undeclared routine:� 'label1' used at line 1�Check failed�FAILED 00:00 42m�»
18:51 TimToady ==SORRY!== A diakopterism has been discovered at line 42; please seek a bomb shelter at your earliest convenience.
18:51 sorear std: say[label1: say 1; say 2]
18:51 p6eval std 8632387: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m�Unsupported use of bare 'say'; in Perl 6 please use .say if you meant $_, or use an explicit invocant or argument at /tmp/RIf5LyAuDt line 1:�------> [32msay[33m�[31m[label1: say 1; say 2][0m�Check failed�FAILED 00:00 41m�»…
18:51 * geekosaur needs to figure out how to get x11-xchat to display higher unicode...
18:51 sorear std: die[label1: say 1; say 2]
18:51 p6eval std 8632387: OUTPUT«ok 00:00 41m␤»
18:51 colomon TimToady++
18:52 geekosaur (I did manage to get it to do the ANSI escapes... makes std and niecza errors more comprehensible)
18:52 sorear do you have a decision procedure for diakopterisms
18:53 TimToady well, first step would be to translate "Confused" to that, but it wouldn't help in this case...
18:54 diakopter niecza: 2[; 5[5]]
18:54 p6eval niecza v17-4-ge5b869e: OUTPUT«Use of uninitialized value in numeric context␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 1226 (warn @ 3) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 262 (Any.Numeric @ 6) ␤  at <unknown> line 0 (ExitRunloop @ 0) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.se…
18:54 TimToady diakopter: but yes, an arglist is not a statement or sequence of statements
18:55 diakopter k
18:57 TimToady what would foo(1,2,3 if $x) mean anyway?
18:58 TimToady same kinda issue
18:58 birdwindupbird joined #perl6
18:58 masak az5112: no, gender assignment doesn't have to have human intent behind it in Google Translate. it's all statistical translation based on large corpora of text. so if there's a lot of "my dear <female name>", maybe the algorithms catch on and think that's a rule.
18:58 masak az5112: there are funny cases of this. en fr "New York"? translating to "Paris" at some point, for example.
18:58 masak phenny: en fr "New York"?
18:58 phenny masak: "New York" (en to fr, translate.google.com)
18:59 masak now it gets it right :)
18:59 masak phenny: en sv "mockingbird"?
18:59 phenny masak: "glassbil" (en to sv, translate.google.com)
18:59 tadzik phenny: en pl "Homer Simpson"?
18:59 phenny tadzik: "Homer Simpson" (en to pl, translate.google.com)
18:59 masak *lol*
18:59 arnsholt Glassbil?!
18:59 masak that word in Swedish means "ice cream van".
18:59 masak how in the...?
18:59 * [Coke] hopes masak has seen http://translationparty.com/
19:00 tadzik . o O ( to kill an ice cream van )
19:00 cogno joined #perl6
19:00 masak [Coke]: ooh. no, I hadn't.
19:01 [Coke] to kill an ice cream van -> translation party -> To kill the ice cream fans
19:01 masak :P
19:01 tadzik Lasagna... working on my laptop, eat at the same time!
19:01 tadzik eat laptop?!?!?
19:02 arnsholt masak: But yes, Google translate is all based on statistics
19:03 tadzik all? So it reads webpages in two languages and compares them?
19:03 moritz basically, yes
19:03 tadzik amazing
19:04 moritz though it's much more sophisticated, of course :-)
19:04 * masak gets off this train, onto a bus, to eventually end up on another train. exciting!
19:04 [Coke] urk. why can I not select the text at the top block in perl6.org?
19:04 tadzik naturally
19:04 tadzik [Coke]: I can
19:04 moritz [Coke]: dunno. I can.
19:04 [Coke] ah. I can as well, but it is not showing as hilighted.
19:05 [Coke] bad css. no donut.
19:05 cogno I am trying to backlog. What is the okness proposal?
19:05 wolfman2000 joined #perl6
19:05 moritz cogno: it's a proposal by TimToady to overhaul the types that can indicate success and failure
19:06 * [Coke] translation party's the first sentence of perl6.org and gets:
19:06 [Coke] Hi, my name is Camelia. I'm the spokesbug for Perl 5, Perl 6, sexy sister.
19:06 moritz cogno: for example False, Failure, Nil and a fals Match object can express some kind of failed test/check
19:06 tadzik :)
19:07 moritz cogno: and TimToady wants to change that... somehow. The details were a bit scary to me, but I think I agree now with the overall goals
19:08 moritz there was a gist which summarized it all.. does anybody have the URL handy?
19:11 cogno I suppose that a smart compiler will eventually able weed out the uneeded part of the overloaded value. So if it makes life easier for the programmer I am all for that kind of thins
19:12 cogno Oops i am a loosy typist, but with the iPad it gets even worse.
19:13 TimToady https://gist.github.com/1828667
19:15 cogno Thx
19:15 TimToady getting a bit of "normal" migraine, so better go sleep it off... &
19:17 KyleHa joined #perl6
19:17 KyleHa Hi #perl6.
19:17 tadzik welcome back
19:18 KyleHa Thank you.
19:18 moritz \o KyleHa
19:19 KyleHa Moritz! Question for you... I see now that spectest .t files have numeric plans everywhere and 'done;' at the end. Did "plan *" and "done_testing;" have a problem?
19:20 sorear KyleHa: yes
19:20 sorear KyleHa: we need to be able to count tests without running them
19:20 moritz KyleHa: the main "problem" was that people wanted to know how many tests we had, and had a hard time figuring it out
19:21 KyleHa Spending a few minutes running the suite was not a good solution?
19:21 tadzik "few minutes", hehe
19:21 grondilu joined #perl6
19:21 sorear 1. the entire suite cannot be run
19:21 moritz KyleHa: so, not my decision, but I relented to the majority
19:21 sorear 2. I think you mean a few hours
19:21 moritz depens very much on the machine
19:21 * jnthn spectets in 3-4 minutes :)
19:22 moritz it's more like 5-10 minutes here on 4 cores
19:22 KyleHa I think it was less than ten minutes the last time I timed it, yesterday.
19:22 sorear good for you
19:22 flussence on my netbook it's most definitely >1h
19:23 KyleHa Do we still need "done;" if there's now a numeric plan?
19:23 moritz no
19:23 moritz just a left-over that wasn't removed
19:23 KyleHa OK.
19:25 KyleHa WOW, roast/TODO hasn't changed since I did some cursory update in 2011.
19:25 moritz it's probably very out of date now
19:30 libertyprime joined #perl6
19:39 cogno joined #perl6
19:40 dalek roast: 5b9b4c7 | (Solomon Foster)++ | S12-methods/lvalue.t:
19:40 dalek roast: Unfudge tests that now work in Niecza.
19:40 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/5b9b4c7424
19:43 penglin joined #perl6
20:03 dalek tablets: 612a102 | (Herbert Breunung)++ | docs/appendix-g-glossary.txt:
20:03 dalek tablets: explaining the term role, please check it
20:03 dalek tablets: review: https://github.com/perl6/tablets/commit/612a102bc5
20:06 NamelessTee joined #perl6
20:11 colomon perl6: say 'abc'.split('').perl
20:11 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT«("a", "b", "c")␤»
20:11 p6eval ..niecza v17-4-ge5b869e: OUTPUT«["", "a", "b", "c", ""].list␤»
20:11 p6eval ..rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«("a", "b", "c").list␤»
20:12 colomon spectests seem to now claim all these answers are wrong?
20:12 jnthn wat
20:12 moritz well
20:12 jnthn The pugs and Rakudo ones look reasonable.
20:13 moritz I think we have special-cased that in rakudo
20:13 KyleHa I wrote that test earlier today.
20:13 moritz so, what is expected now
20:14 KyleHa It was based on a ticket with a discussion in which TimToady had said "xyz".split('') should be ("", "x", "y", "z").
20:14 moritz there are more leading than trailing empty strings on a string? :-)
20:15 PerlJam trailing are elided, right?
20:15 moritz no
20:15 moritz anyway
20:15 moritz rakudo implements split with strings differently than split with regexes
20:15 moritz (ie uses index)
20:16 moritz so the only possible zero-width match there is ''
20:16 moritz so we special-case that anyway
20:17 moritz we can make it do whatever we want, but I don't see how ('', 'x', 'y', 'z') makes any more sense than any other option
20:18 KyleHa Here's the discussion I saw:  https://rt.perl.org/rt3/Tic​ket/Display.html?id=112868
20:20 moritz KyleHa: I see. I'm still not convinced. Maybe I'll be convinced tomorrow :-)
20:20 * moritz -> sleep
20:20 KyleHa Rules were made to be rewritten.
20:20 PerlJam I could argue that there are an infinite number of emptry strings between each character in a string too  ;)
20:21 jnthn moritz: Think I've got the roles pre-comp thing fixed locally. :)
20:21 KyleHa I hope we'd do that split lazily!
20:22 PerlJam I could also argue that split('') should elicit a warning and function as if it were split(/''/)
20:23 dalek nqp: 3ab8ab1 | jnthn++ | / (2 files):
20:23 dalek nqp: Add an OwnedResizablePMCArray, along the same lines as OwnedHash.
20:23 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/3ab8ab1f00
20:23 dalek nqp: 5308279 | jnthn++ | src/6model/serialization.c:
20:23 dalek nqp: Deserialize RPAs with their object ownership. This seems to fix the leak that saw parametric roles and pre-comp sometimes interact badly.
20:23 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/530827945a
20:29 colomon KyleHa: just reading that link you posted again, it's not clear to me what TimToady was trying to say.
20:30 colomon "arguably niecza is more consistent with how /''/ would split"
20:30 colomon perl6: say 'abc'.split(/''/).perl
20:30 p6eval niecza v17-4-ge5b869e: OUTPUT«["", "a", "b", "c", ""].list␤»
20:30 p6eval ..rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«("", "a", "b", "c", "").list␤»
20:30 p6eval ..pugs: OUTPUT«Error eval perl5: "if (!$INC{'Pugs/Runtime/Match/HsBridge.pm'}) {␤    unshift @INC, '/home/p6eval/.cabal/share/Pugs-6.2.​13.20120203/blib6/pugs/perl5/lib';␤    eval q[require 'Pugs/Runtime/Match/HsBridge.pm'] or die $@;␤}␤'Pugs::Runtime::Match::HsBridge'␤"␤*** Can't locate P…
20:31 * PerlJam wishes there was a way to say "perl6: ..." and only have the non-error ones output
20:32 colomon PerlJam: but errors are sometimes important too...
20:32 PerlJam colomon: sure.  I'm wishing for more, not less
20:32 colomon PerlJam: oh, gotcha.  perl6filtered: or something
20:32 PerlJam aye
20:33 KyleHa I think TimToady was saying that split('') should do the same thing as split(/''/) does, which produces a leading empty string.
20:33 PerlJam maybe "perl6!:"
20:33 PerlJam KyleHa: leading and trailing, yes?
20:34 PerlJam perl6: say "abc".split(/''/);
20:34 p6eval rakudo abb8f3, niecza v17-4-ge5b869e: OUTPUT« a b c ␤»
20:34 p6eval ..pugs: OUTPUT«Error eval perl5: "if (!$INC{'Pugs/Runtime/Match/HsBridge.pm'}) {␤    unshift @INC, '/home/p6eval/.cabal/share/Pugs-6.2.​13.20120203/blib6/pugs/perl5/lib';␤    eval q[require 'Pugs/Runtime/Match/HsBridge.pm'] or die $@;␤}␤'Pugs::Runtime::Match::HsBridge'␤"␤*** Can't locate P…
20:34 KyleHa Oh. Duh. How did I not see the trailing empty string ten times?
20:34 PerlJam perl6: say "abc".split(/''/).perl;
20:34 p6eval niecza v17-4-ge5b869e: OUTPUT«["", "a", "b", "c", ""].list␤»
20:34 p6eval ..rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«("", "a", "b", "c", "").list␤»
20:34 p6eval ..pugs: OUTPUT«Error eval perl5: "if (!$INC{'Pugs/Runtime/Match/HsBridge.pm'}) {␤    unshift @INC, '/home/p6eval/.cabal/share/Pugs-6.2.​13.20120203/blib6/pugs/perl5/lib';␤    eval q[require 'Pugs/Runtime/Match/HsBridge.pm'] or die $@;␤}␤'Pugs::Runtime::Match::HsBridge'␤"␤*** Can't locate P…
20:34 dalek rakudo/nom: d1f5db2 | jnthn++ | / (2 files):
20:34 dalek rakudo/nom: Bump NQP_REVISION to get bs fixes; a small tweak in Rakudo to account for the change too.
20:34 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/d1f5db2fa3
20:35 slavik1 doesn't that say that there is an assumed "" in the beginning of every string?
20:35 KyleHa I'll "fix" the test in a few minutes.
20:37 PerlJam slavik1: It's all somewhat arbitrary if you ask me.  Why do we care about certain zero-width assertions in regex, but not others?  Why are ^ and $ so important?
20:37 PerlJam Why not ^^ and $$ too?
20:37 dalek rakudo/nom: 570f2bb | jnthn++ | docs/ChangeLog:
20:37 dalek rakudo/nom: Few ChangeLog updates.
20:37 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/570f2bb599
20:37 PerlJam why not <ww> or <wb>?
20:42 dalek rakudo/nom: 7d33ee1 | kboga++ | / (2 files):
20:42 dalek rakudo/nom: Adds a slightly adjusted but mostly copy pasted version of ng's pack & unpack
20:42 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/7d33ee1c50
20:42 dalek rakudo/nom: f2e5c38 | jonathan++ | / (2 files):
20:42 dalek rakudo/nom: Merge pull request #66 from kboga/ng-pack-unpack
20:42 dalek rakudo/nom:
20:42 dalek rakudo/nom: Adds a slightly adjusted but mostly copy pasted version of ng's pack & unpack.
20:42 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/f2e5c38f87
20:42 sudokode joined #perl6
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20:44 dalek roast: 1641f44 | (Kyle Hasselbacher)++ | S04-phasers/end.t:
20:44 dalek roast: [S04-phasers/end.t] Test for RT 112408 -- Can use END as a bareword hash key
20:44 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/1641f444b2
20:44 dalek roast: 4e65cd6 | (Kyle Hasselbacher)++ | S12-methods/what.t:
20:44 dalek roast: [S12-methods/what.t] Test for RT 112364 -- Parse Foo:: correctly
20:44 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/4e65cd6130
20:44 dalek roast: fead744 | (Kyle Hasselbacher)++ | S32-str/split-simple.t:
20:44 dalek roast: [split-simple.t] Change test for RT 112868
20:44 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/fead744ef7
20:44 dalek roast: 01fd0e8 | (Kyle Hasselbacher)++ | S12-methods/lvalue.t:
20:44 dalek roast: Merge branch 'master' of github.com:perl6/roast
20:44 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/01fd0e8843
20:45 fibo joined #perl6
20:50 mathw joined #perl6
20:51 dalek rakudo/nom: eb05804 | jnthn++ | docs/ChangeLog:
20:51 dalek rakudo/nom: Note pack and unpack in ChangeLog.
20:51 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/eb0580491d
20:53 Woodi joined #perl6
20:54 Woodi hallo everyone
20:54 immortal joined #perl6
20:54 immortal joined #perl6
20:55 slavik1 PerlJam: I would say that ^ and $ anchors are special case for regex, since that is the notation for "begins with" and "ends with" vs. contains
20:57 geekosaur there's the whole huffmanization thimng, ^ and $ are extremely common
21:06 PerlJam slavik1: so why not ^^ and $$? Those are "begins with" and "ends with" for a line.
21:07 slavik1 PerlJam: are they the same for Perl5? this might be why I am confused (I haven't played with Perl6 much since rakudo* came out).
21:10 PerlJam r: say "".^methods.map(*.name);
21:10 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«BUILD Int Num chomp chop substr pred succ ll-match match-list ords lines samecase samespace trim-leading trim-trailing trim words encode capitalize trans indent WHICH Bool Str ACCEPTS Numeric gist perl comb match subst split␤»
21:11 PerlJam r: say rx/''/.^methods.map(*.name);
21:11 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«Unmarshallable foreign language value passed for parameter '$x0'␤  in block <anon> at /tmp/XI_iIC5rVM:1␤␤»
21:11 PerlJam That's not quite what I expected
21:12 PerlJam r: say rx//.^methods.map(*.name);
21:12 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Unrecognized regex metacharacter (must be quoted to match literally) at line 1, near ".^methods."␤»
21:12 PerlJam I guess the rx/''/ was split paranoia on my part
21:13 PerlJam r: grammar X { }; say X.^methods(:all).map(*.name);
21:13 p6eval rakudo abb8f3: OUTPUT«Method 'name' not found for invocant of class 'NQPRoutine'␤  in block <anon> at /tmp/NVxKNGVJ8g:1␤␤»
21:16 PerlJam So ... classes are fully Perl6ified, but grammars aren't I guess?  They still leak their implementation.
21:16 PerlJam n: say rx//.^methods.map(*.name);
21:16 p6eval niecza v17-4-ge5b869e: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤â�¤Null pattern not allowed at /tmp/aInKYKf0rS line 1:â�¤------> [32msay rx/[33mâ��[31m/.^methods.m​ap(*.name);[0mâ�¤â�¤Parse failedâ�¤â�¤Â»
21:16 PerlJam n: grammar X { }; say X.^methods(:all).map(*.name);
21:16 p6eval niecza v17-4-ge5b869e: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Unable to resolve method methods in class ClassHOW␤  at /tmp/s_QYhQBmzt line 1 (mainline @ 4) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 3842 (ANON @ 3) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 3843 (module-CORE @ 65) ␤  at …
21:16 jnthn PerlJam: It's not grammars at issue. It's code objects generally, I think.
21:16 PerlJam ok
21:17 jnthn Welcome to the exciting world of circularities.
21:18 PerlJam I had an idea to annotate strings with which grammar rules would match where, but if I can't get a list of rules, that makes it slightly more difficult.
21:19 jnthn Why can't you get a list of rules?
21:19 PerlJam I don't know how I guess.
21:19 * masak home
21:19 jnthn r: grammar Foo { token TOP { <foo> }; token foo { xxx } }; Foo.^methods(:local)>>.say
21:19 p6eval rakudo eb0580: OUTPUT«foo␤TOP␤»
21:20 jnthn shark, masak
21:20 masak orca!
21:21 * jnthn whales at the pun
21:21 PerlJam this obsession with sea creatures makes little sense to me too
21:21 jnthn PerlJam: I is a little bit fishy...
21:21 jnthn er, It is... :)
21:22 diakopter I won't carp about it
21:22 masak jnthn: neither the whale nor the orca are actually... oh, fuggedaboutit...
21:22 PerlJam I guess both orca and sharks are in the same phylum, so ... maybe there's some sense to be had.
21:22 masak heh.
21:23 masak PerlJam: your mom is in the same phylum!
21:23 PerlJam masak: as is yours!
21:23 masak :P
21:23 PerlJam one good fish deserves another
21:23 masak srsly toothless "your mom" insults, part 18.
21:24 * masak .oO( sushi: a dish best served cold )
21:26 diakopter you can't bait me to join the puns
21:27 masak hook, line, and sinker.
21:28 PerlJam diakopter: #perl6 casts a wide net.
21:29 PerlJam (though, if we were doing word association, "hook, line, and sinker." makes me immediatly think of "lock, stock, and barrel.")
21:30 PerlJam though it doesn't improve my spelling.
21:30 diakopter If this were #csharp I could make a pun on sealed
21:31 masak car repair guy: "looks like you've blown a seal" -- car owner: "hey, leave my personal life out of this!"
21:32 diakopter you otter keep that one to yourself
21:32 pmichaud jnthn: ping
21:33 masak diakopter: I'll keep things above the waterline from now on.
21:33 jnthn pmichaud: pong
21:34 alvis joined #perl6
21:34 masak .u 乒乓
21:34 phenny U+4E52 CJK UNIFIED IDEOGRAPH-4E52 (乒)
21:34 phenny U+4E53 CJK UNIFIED IDEOGRAPH-4E53 (乓)
21:34 pmichaud got your email -- I still plan to have mark commit done before release (which I know is Thursday)
21:35 spider-mario .u ௹
21:35 phenny U+0BF9 TAMIL RUPEE SIGN (௹)
21:35 PerlJam masak: just tread softly.
21:35 spider-mario .u ৳
21:35 phenny U+09F3 BENGALI RUPEE SIGN (৳)
21:35 pmichaud things here have been more-than-the-usual busy-ness... but nothing too problematic
21:35 jnthn pmichaud: ooh :)
21:35 jnthn pmichaud: OK :)
21:35 diakopter masak: I keep herring the puns wrongly
21:36 masak PerlJam: and carry a big floatation device? :)
21:36 PerlJam :)
21:37 masak diakopter: are you familiar with http://www.songlyrics.com/ki​p-addotta/wet-dream-lyrics/ ?
21:38 diakopter no
21:38 masak feels relevant.
21:38 diakopter haha
21:39 masak :)
21:45 bruges_ joined #perl6
21:46 erkan joined #perl6
21:47 pmichaud "Wet Dream" is an awesome song :)
21:57 diakopter in a coffee shop, whose rights prevail, the person who has a medically necessary dog, or the person with dog allergies?
21:58 diakopter the manager is negotiating with them now.
21:58 derrazo joined #perl6
21:58 diakopter that's California for you.
22:05 tadzik oh, precomp fixes
22:09 masak diakopter: seems a Solomonian problem. just cut the dog in half!
22:11 diakopter the person with the allergies won; seems the no-pets rule of the coffee shop can apply if the person is not waiting in line or for a drink.
22:12 masak 'night, #perl6
22:12 tadzik 'night
22:12 slavik1 diakopter: in other words, the dude who has not given his money away (yet) has right of way everywhere
22:12 slavik1 night
22:13 masak dream of medically necessary allergic dogs waiting in line for a drink.
22:13 slavik1 ...
22:15 diakopter well, technically Starbucks reserves the right to refuse service to anyone, but it also has a corporate image/goodwill to uphold.
22:17 slavik1 as in "don't do evil"?
22:17 diakopter anyone, *with some exceptions*.
22:18 diakopter http://www.legalzoom.com/us-law/e​qual-rights/right-refuse-service
22:20 am0c joined #perl6
22:21 geekosaur as in "getting a reputation as being assholes to special needs customers can hurt their business"
22:24 BlueT_ joined #perl6
22:25 skids joined #perl6
22:30 derrazo left #perl6
22:37 havenn joined #perl6
22:49 * jnthn -> sleep o/
22:52 cognominal joined #perl6
22:56 whiteknight joined #perl6
22:57 jaldhar joined #perl6
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23:06 s1n joined #perl6
23:09 integral joined #perl6
23:09 integral joined #perl6
23:09 cognominal about the okness gist. how do one compare a gist and a fork of that gist?
23:12 [Coke] cognominal: check them both out and do a diff is the low tech way, I guess.
23:17 cognominal :(
23:19 derrazo joined #perl6
23:19 derrazo left #perl6
23:19 dalek tablets: 49ac38e | (Herbert Breunung)++ | docs/appendix-g-glossary.txt:
23:19 dalek tablets: pilish role entry and add new
23:19 dalek tablets: review: https://github.com/perl6/tablets/commit/49ac38ee8a
23:22 geekosaur does seem like something github *ought* to provide, but I see no way to do it
23:23 geekosaur (also, the idea looks quite sane to me.  certainly no scarier than smartmatches already are...)
23:26 s1n joined #perl6
23:27 am0c cognominal, add forked gist remote, and pull to another branch. finally, diff two branches. (I guess)
23:27 mikemol joined #perl6
23:28 cognominal thx. I hoped that github would have helped here
23:29 cognominal github has some weird blind spots.
23:52 lestrrat joined #perl6
23:53 cognominal joined #perl6
23:55 baest joined #perl6
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