Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2012-06-15

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:00 lichtkind shit my net is so crappy today
00:01 adu where is the ephasis?
00:01 adu nee-EH-cha? or nee-eh-CHA?
00:02 adu NEE-eh-cha?
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00:13 adu wow
00:14 adu I just installed niecza
00:14 adu and libgdiplus didn't crash during installation :)
00:14 adu last time, it did
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00:47 sorear adu: nee-EH-cha for me.  I'll have to ask masak later.
00:48 adu cool
00:49 adu btw, since I'm familiar with Japanese, I think Rakudo is RAH-koo-DOH
00:49 adu but I think the English pronunciation would be rah-KOO-doh
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00:51 [Coke] that's about right.
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00:59 adu this should be on Perl6.org
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03:39 moritz it should be rakudo.org :-)
03:39 adu hi moritz
03:40 adu I feel like the language should be named Rakudo too
03:40 adu or maybe tintin is rubing off on me
03:41 adu I think the whole "incompatible?!?!?!?" reaction is common
03:41 adu but what do I know
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04:11 moritz it would be highly ironic to rename Perl 6 to Rakudo after we've explained for years that Rakudo is the name of a compiler, and Perl 6 is the language
04:13 dalek faq: 047e157 | moritz++ | answers.md:
04:13 dalek faq: explain why named attributes cannot be set from .new by default, and how to make it work anyway
04:13 dalek faq: review: https://github.com/perl6/faq/commit/047e157f26
04:32 adu moritz: sorry, don't listen to me
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05:03 dalek niecza/non-bootstrap: 060605f | sorear++ | lib/ (3 files):
05:03 dalek niecza/non-bootstrap: Port NieczaPassSimplifier
05:03 dalek niecza/non-bootstrap: review: https://github.com/sorear/niecza/commit/060605f783
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05:19 adu sorear: you awake?
05:19 Woodi morning everyone
05:20 adu morning
05:20 tyatpi joined #perl6
05:20 adu btw, this is around when I sleep, I'm just delaying the inevitable
05:23 Woodi pmichaud++: slies with startup times was just shocking :)
05:24 Woodi if rakudo/niecza perform well in similiar benchmarks vs ruby|python we should call Perl6 "OOP language of choice for everyone" :)
05:25 adu Woodi: I still think we need a JVM impl
05:25 Woodi -adu-: I still think we NEED C imp :)
05:25 adu well JVM and X86
05:26 Woodi and perl6 build into browsers without JS :)
05:26 adu there are lots of things in Perl6 that I think most C compilers wouldn't be able to pick up on
05:26 adu Woodi: hahaha like dart?
05:27 adu like how x86 has a strchr instruction (in a matter of speaking)
05:27 Woodi yea, replace JS :)
05:28 Timbus replace it with a bytecode already
05:28 adu I don't think the world can agree on bytecode
05:28 adu JS was hard enought for the world to agree on
05:28 Timbus i never agreed to it
05:29 Timbus :[
05:29 Woodi -adu-: new C++ standard and maybe C too gives few features for use in Perl6 compiler
05:29 adu neigher did I but JS is much better than C imho
05:29 Timbus of course
05:29 adu Woodi: I was thinking about about to compile Perl6 to C++ just yesterday
05:29 adu perhaps it's a common thought
05:30 adu because no one should ever manually, intentionally write C++
05:30 Timbus i keep telling myself to try to port nqp to llvm and then see who will help me make a 'lakudo'
05:30 Timbus but then i remember i have a full time job :(
05:30 Woodi -adu-: for many programs it will be enought but sometimes you need to include v6 parser...
05:30 adu Timbus: I was also thinking about a PBC to LLVM compiler
05:31 adu you guys are inside my head… stop it!
05:31 adu :)
05:31 Woodi hmm, interesting...
05:31 Timbus pbc to llvm was something many have thought of but.. i think it needs to break away from parrot entirely
05:31 adu PBC => M0 => LLVM?
05:31 Timbus parrot is great and all but, parrot sucks.
05:32 adu Timbus: please explain
05:32 sorear adu: I am awake.
05:32 Woodi lets invent shared programming language for teams... :)
05:32 Woodi then chinase army can do good work :)
05:32 Timbus the idea is great, the motive of interop is great, also the compiler tools are great (well they used to be..)
05:32 adu I just heard from someone in #osdev that Parrot sucks because of TLB cache misses and register spills and RAM rollbacks, and some such technobabble
05:32 Timbus but the implementation is slow, the bits are rotting
05:33 Timbus i feel the project lacks motivation i guess.
05:33 adu I think someone should re-engineer Parrot
05:33 adu I'm motivated
05:33 Woodi for me parrot is at least two things: libperl6-reinvented and VM...
05:33 adu and I have time
05:34 adu I am in love with Parrot and Perl6
05:34 Timbus aw cute
05:34 adu for me Parrot should be an interface, but perhaps that's what M0 was supposed to be
05:34 Timbus id prefer if you riupped out the good bits of paarrt and mixed them into llvm
05:34 adu :D
05:34 sorear adu: I suspect whoever you talked to in #osdev has no relevant recent experience with Parrot
05:34 adu sorear: probably
05:35 sorear it sucks, but not for those reasons
05:35 adu o
05:35 adu and I have a karma of 10 :)
05:36 adu which is why you should vote for adu to lead the Parrot steering committee
05:37 adu sorear: why do you think it sucks?
05:37 Timbus i also think parrot doesnt know what it's for. it has pmc's but you are meant to make your own. it has a huge set of opcodes that no one uses? im not too sure on this but I also believe it has multidispatch that rakudo doesn't even use... and does it even need to be built on continuations?
05:37 Timbus then again i havent used parrot in over a year so
05:37 adu Parrot seems pretty nice to me, lots of builtins, somewhat documented, and extensible (both dynops and dynpmc's whatever they are)
05:38 sorear Timbus: continuations are one of parrot's best points imo.
05:38 sorear far too many application VMs force a stack paradigm
05:38 adu but there is one thing that seems missing
05:38 adu threads
05:38 Timbus i thought parrot got green/hybrid threads of some sort
05:38 adu Timbus: I think threads were implemented as dynops
05:38 adu i.e. not core
05:39 sorear core vs not is a complete red herring
05:39 moritz the reasons that parrot is slow is 1) calling conventions that produce too many objects which the GC has to consider and 2) lack of a JIT
05:39 adu ok
05:39 adu what do I know
05:39 adu i've only been in this chat room a month
05:39 moritz adu: everything shipped with parrot is 'core', basically
05:40 sorear what does matter is that the thread implementation Parrot has settled on involves 1. memory cannot be shared between threads 2. message queues 3. transparent proxy objects
05:40 Timbus im worried about 1
05:40 sorear it's extremely... policy
05:40 Timbus please tell me its not like perl 5
05:40 sorear in the mechanism vs policy sense
05:40 Timbus oh good
05:40 adu moritz: I was just reading about LuaJIT, maybe we could use some of those ideas in Parrot?
05:41 moritz adu: it's not lack of ideas that's holding back JIT on parrot
05:41 adu sorear: sounds reasonable
05:41 sorear Timbus: it's not like perl 5 at all!  you see, parrot will have transparent proxy objects to hide the heap split
05:41 adu sounds a lot like Go
05:42 adu with thread-local default
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05:43 adu moritz: what do you think the bottleneck is?
05:43 Timbus sorear, wait doesn't perl 5 do that using threads::shared? the difference being perl 5 copies everything else not shared and its basically dumb as heck
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05:44 moritz adu: developer time
05:44 adu oh
05:44 adu then the solution is more adu!
05:44 sorear Timbus: I should stop talking now
05:44 Timbus :L
05:45 moritz adu: parrot seems to be down to just a handful of regular contributors, many of whom just do small fixes here and there but lack enough tuits to attack the central problems
05:45 Timbus did i miss your carsasm
05:45 moritz well, rakudo also just a handful of regular contributors
05:46 moritz but still, feels like more visible progress
05:46 * moritz -> afk
05:46 adu I've been working on grammrs (p6-xml, and p6-go) because that seems to most well documented to be, but perhaps I should work more on parrot
05:46 sorear everything seems like more progress if you're in the middle of it.
05:46 adu s/be/me
05:47 sorear adu: you are free to spend your time however you wish.
05:47 * tadzik ponders a thought of recording his pronounciation of "niecza" and putting it somewhere
05:48 tadzik good morning folks
05:48 sorear I am feeling that it is not my place to give advise
05:49 adu tadzik: Niecza = nee-EH-cha, Rakudo = RAH-koo-DOH
05:49 sorear us customary phonologies suck.
05:49 adu tadzik: I must be dreaming ;)
05:49 sorear I mean, phonological writing
05:49 sorear far too ambiguous
05:50 adu sorear: would you prefer IPA?
05:50 tadzik adu: "niecza" is completely unambiguous for me
05:50 tadzik however you write unambiguous
05:50 sorear adu: if I said that I'm about equally likely to say ニエッカ or ニエッチャ, would that help? :D
05:51 sorear adu: IPA would be awesome.  Unfortunately, I have not yet learned it.
05:51 adu sorear: yes, in fact
05:52 adu katakana is my second language
05:52 adu ɾakudo, nietʃa
05:52 adu I think that was IPA
05:53 sorear however, since it is constructed from Polish word fragments, I consider tadzik to be more correct than myself on this
05:53 sorear adu: ISTR you saying you were Japanese
05:53 adu sorear: no, I was born in Florida
05:53 adu I grew up in Japan, that's all
05:54 sorear oh.  military kid?
05:54 adu kinda, my mom is an English teacher
05:54 sorear my father spent a few years in Japan when his father was stationed
05:54 huf haha
05:54 sorear do you live there now?
05:54 * sorear wonders what huf found funny
05:54 adu I live in DC
05:55 adu well, Maryland
05:55 sorear oh, right
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05:55 huf sorear: the military/teacher thing
05:55 Timbus just got my 2nd dan karate belt. now i can finally teach math
05:56 sisar joined #perl6
05:56 sisar o/
05:56 fhelmberger joined #perl6
05:57 adu huf: there are only 3 reasons to for Americans to be in Japan: Military, English teaching, or you're f***ing crazy
05:57 Timbus my old roommate moved there and yeah, i guess he fits the last description
05:57 sorear adu: do I have to be f***ing crazy to attend YAPC::Asia in Tōkyō?
05:57 huf adu: :)
05:57 sorear adu: or is this only a residency classification?
05:57 adu I fell into tha last 2 categories
05:58 adu sorear: well, travelers are pretty crazy
05:58 sorear (actually, this might be moot, because if I'm entirely lucky my visits to YAPC::Asia will be as a Swede)
05:58 adu I've never spent any sizable amount of time in tokyo
05:58 adu most of my life in Japan was in Osaka
05:58 tadzik a Swede?
05:58 bonsaikitten hrm, that sounds like a nice excuse to visit japan
05:59 * sorear wonders how well adu can cope with kanji
05:59 adu sorear: I know about 200 kanji off the top of my head
05:59 sorear tadzik: a citizen of Sweden.  masak really, really wants to hire me
05:59 adu sorear: literacy requires 1800 kanji
05:59 sorear adu: about the same as me
06:00 adu sorear: sugoi
06:00 sorear (I think I'm closer to 300, but that's not particularly useful)
06:01 adu I used to know how to say "my resume needs to be updated" on paper
06:01 adu but I've forgotten the kanji for that
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06:03 adu sorear: do you know Japanese?
06:03 sorear Yes
06:03 adu cool
06:03 adu we should practice sometime
06:03 adu wait, are you in Japan now?
06:05 sorear circumlocutions ftw. やれる物と歴史の手紙は新しくしなくちゃいけない。
06:05 sorear no.
06:06 tadzik sorear: are you planning to move?
06:06 sorear tadzik: to Japan? no.
06:06 tadzik no, to Sweden
06:06 sorear tadzik: I wouldn't say planning, but I am toying with the idea
06:07 tadzik that sounds like a cool idea
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06:10 sorear hmm, probably ~新しくされなくちゃ~ better
06:10 adu sorear: the first phrase sounds like a really long definition of "Bachelor party"
06:11 sorear my vocabulary is as bad as my kanji repertoire
06:11 adu "やれる物" might be translated as: job, wife, or whore
06:12 sorear I was trying for skills D:
06:12 adu haha
06:12 adu sorear: it means "that which you do"
06:14 * sorear tries 知っている単語は知っている漢字にように少ないです。
06:18 adu given the words you know and the kanji you know, converting between them doesn't always work?
06:18 sorear I was practicing words earlier today and can't get my de:Sprach to stop rhyming with en:crack
06:19 adu hahaha
06:19 sorear de is my highest priority to learn currently
06:19 adu ok
06:19 moritz sorear: why?
06:19 adu がんばって
06:20 sorear moritz: Frankfurt, Malmö
06:20 moritz sorear: oh :-)
06:20 moritz sorear: /join #perlde on irc.perl.org :-)
06:21 sorear moritz: I want to get the sounds straight before I start reading practice
06:22 sorear moritz: I probably will, sometime in the next few weeks :)
06:22 adu sorear: Sprechen Sie deutsch?
06:22 bonsaikitten sorear: "ch" in german is not a "k" sound ...
06:23 bonsaikitten actually in some parts of switzerland every K is a ch :)
06:23 moritz kcwu: I'm pretty sure sorear is aware of that ("can't get [...] to stop")
06:24 moritz sorry, meant bonsaikitten
06:24 moritz wow, how did I mis-tab a 'b' to 'k'?
06:24 sorear bonsaikitten: I know!  My mom says it right, but when I try to imitate her, it just sounds like retching.
06:24 bonsaikitten konsaibitten? ;)
06:24 bonsaikitten sorear: so you can speak dutch properly ;)
06:25 bonsaikitten the dutch "g" is about the hardest sound to reproduce
06:25 moritz the konsai was bitten?
06:25 bonsaikitten that's why I prefer flemish, it's a lot more "flat"
06:25 adu bonsaikitten: I disagree, I think the Farsi "q" is the hardest
06:25 sorear bonsaikitten: I'd lose my voice pretty quickly if I had to mock retch for every 'ch'
06:25 bonsaikitten adu: hmm. maybe. I lack references to compare
06:25 adu you basically have to pretend you're choking for 1/10 of a second
06:26 adu Farsi is a dialect of Arabic
06:26 bonsaikitten what about the clock sound found in some african languages?
06:26 sorear mm, esophogeal plosives?
06:26 bonsaikitten click, not clock. stupid fingers!
06:26 moritz sounds are best learned below the age of 6 or so, but with proper instruction can be learned later too
06:27 moritz but clocks make click sounds!
06:27 sorear moritz: finding 'proper instruction' seems non-trivial
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06:28 moritz sorear: usually at university language courses (at least in .de :-)
06:29 adu http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qoph
06:30 sorear moritz: I want a way to do that without committing to eight weeks of grammar lessons I don't really need
06:30 moritz sorear: ah, that's less trivial then :(
06:33 adu alright, melatonin is calling me
06:33 adu good night
07:20 tadzik melatonin, heh. I was taking this drug for some time in my life :)
07:22 bonsaikitten tadzik: good results?
07:23 tadzik bonsaikitten: suprisingly, yes. I was sleeping normally for the first time in my life, and I stopped taking the pills after 2 or 3 years and I tend to sleep normally most of the time now
07:24 tadzik unless I purposedly stay awake all night to do something
07:24 bonsaikitten tadzik: hmm, that is quite beneficial
07:24 tadzik but it's still better than it was
07:24 tadzik which one?
07:24 bonsaikitten well, I sleep normally too, jus tthat I run at offset of +4h to local time
07:24 tadzik heh
07:25 tadzik I sometimes sleep at n+1 offset
07:25 tadzik so, one hour later each day
07:25 tadzik but that's when I really stay up all night
07:25 sorear now that I'm not having to put up with classes, I'm toying with the idea of getting back on biphase
07:25 tadzik well, if you know what I mean
07:26 bonsaikitten tadzik: I tend to do that until daylight "catches" me
07:26 bonsaikitten then I sometimes do 22h days to rewind
07:26 tadzik sorear: did it work for you?
07:27 bonsaikitten I spent most of last year biphasic, that was nice
07:27 tadzik the idea sounds quite good, but I feel that my sleeping habits are too fragile even for normal, monophasic sleep
07:28 sorear tadzik: yes, it worked
07:28 bonsaikitten I can stay stable monophasic *if* I am allowed to sleep when I'm tired
07:29 sorear wooh, success
07:30 sorear with Ich and Sprach
07:30 tadzik :)
07:30 moritz now sorear just needs to learn that 'Sprach' isn't a German word :-)
07:30 tadzik is that the same 'ch'?
07:30 tadzik I though Ich is more like Iś
07:30 moritz yes
07:31 tadzik but it's possible that Sprechen is actually Spreśen :)
07:31 moritz ('Sprache' would be correct, for 'language' or 'speech')
07:31 * moritz doesn't know how tadzik pronounces ś
07:31 sorear :-) 1 hurdle down, N-1 to go.
07:31 tadzik moritz: like in Sośnierz :)
07:32 sorear I'll probably just stick with tad zick to start
07:32 moritz it's the same soft ch that the Scottish use for 'loch' and such lovely words
07:32 tadzik it works for most people
07:32 * sorear wonders if that is a German z
07:32 tadzik the trick is that 'dzi' is actually one sound
07:33 shachaf moritz: What's the soft ch? Is it the same as the one in my name?
07:33 sorear moritz: I never correctly said 'loch' before today either :-)
07:33 moritz shachaf: I don't know how you pronounce your name either :-)
07:33 shachaf Voiceless uvular fricative.
07:33 sorear Sprache is velar
07:34 sorear Ich is palatal
07:34 sorear voiceless fricatives, though
07:34 * moritz didn't know that the two ch's were pronounced differently :-)
07:34 shachaf Ugh, velar fricatives.
07:34 * shachaf tends to hear things as uvular.
07:35 shachaf I also usually think that "alveolar trills" are uvular.
07:35 sorear http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germa​n_phonology#Ich-Laut_and_ach-Laut
07:35 sorear seems to be a regional thing?
07:36 bonsaikitten well, in bavaria the "ch" in "ich" is mute anyway ;)
07:43 moritz oh indeed, when listen carefully to me speaking I can hear the difference
07:43 moritz *when I
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08:00 asogani perl6: say 'hi there'
08:00 p6eval rakudo a3407d, niecza v18-7-ga660099, pugs: OUTPUT«hi there␤»
08:02 asogani joined #perl6
08:06 anant rakudo: say 'hi there'
08:06 p6eval rakudo a3407d: OUTPUT«hi there␤»
08:07 anant rakudo: say 3 + 7
08:07 p6eval rakudo a3407d: OUTPUT«10␤»
08:08 sorear hello anant.
08:08 sorear are you new?
08:08 sorear welcome.
08:08 tadzik r: "welcome anant".say
08:08 p6eval rakudo a3407d: OUTPUT«welcome anant␤»
08:08 anant yes :)
08:09 anant thank you
08:10 anant Is 'a3407d' the build number of rakudo?
08:10 sorear Sort of.
08:10 sorear It is a specific version.
08:11 sorear It references https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/​a3407dee0585c9788e54f778904f538f6ffca989
08:11 moritz r: say $*PERL<ver>
08:11 p6eval rakudo a3407d: OUTPUT«Any()␤»
08:11 moritz r: say $*PERL<compiler><ver>
08:11 p6eval rakudo a3407d: OUTPUT«2012.05-254-ga3407de␤»
08:11 brrt joined #perl6
08:11 sorear which is the most recent commit that p6eval has pulled and compiled
08:12 moritz and indeed HEAD
08:12 sorear usually p6eval is pretty timely :)
08:12 * sorear does not know anant's git-fu level
08:18 anant Is it possible to feed p6eval a gist.github.com link? Say this file:https://raw.github.com/gist/2935249/2c09b​506820a696e191b5ab30fa427929f7ad037/Perl6
08:19 sorear p6: https://raw.github.com/gist/2935249/2c09b5068
08:19 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT«*** ␤    Unexpected "//"␤    expecting "!", word character or "{"␤    at /tmp/MsXE7ZOrgW line 1, column 7␤»
08:19 p6eval ..niecza v18-7-ga660099: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤â�¤Confused at /tmp/W_iuIDX4nn line 1:â�¤------> [32mhttps[33mâ��[31m://raw.github.com/gi​st/2935249/2c09b5068[0mâ�¤â�¤Undeclared routine:â�¤       'https' used at line 1â�¤â�¤Parse failedâ�¤â�¤Â»
08:19 p6eval ..rakudo a3407d: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Confused␤at /tmp/GyafmEv3Hc:1␤»
08:19 sorear p6: https://gist.github.com/gist/2935249
08:19 p6eval niecza v18-7-ga660099: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤â�¤Confused at /tmp/WSHJoSCnL_ line 1:â�¤------> [32mhttps[33mâ��[31m://gist.github.​com/gist/2935249[0mâ�¤â�¤Undeclared routine:â�¤        'https' used at line 1â�¤â�¤Parse failedâ�¤â�¤Â»
08:19 p6eval ..pugs: OUTPUT«*** ␤    Unexpected "//"␤    expecting "!", word character or "{"␤    at /tmp/6bY_Nuzlqi line 1, column 7␤»
08:19 p6eval ..rakudo a3407d: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Confused␤at /tmp/147WfTubLt:1␤»
08:19 sorear p6: https://gist.github.com/2935249
08:19 p6eval niecza v18-7-ga660099: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Unable to locate module warnings in @path␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/boot/lib/CORE.setting line 1401 (die @ 5) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/src/NieczaPathSearch.pm6 line 23 (NieczaPathSearch.load_module @ 17) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/src/Ni…
08:19 p6eval ..rakudo a3407d: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Could not find strict in any of: /home/p6eval/.perl6/lib, /home/p6eval/nom-inst2/lib/parrot/​4.4.0-devel/languages/perl6/lib␤»
08:19 p6eval ..pugs: OUTPUT«pugs: *** Unsafe function 'use' called under safe mode␤    at /tmp/q19M8VlaGV line 1, column 1␤»
08:19 sorear that's a perl 5 script.
08:20 anant there were 2 files actually: one perl5 and the other my attempt at writing its perl6 equivalent
08:20 sorear oh, I see that now.
08:21 moritz iirc it always takes the first file in a gist
08:21 moritz and gist sorts them asciibetical by name
08:22 sorear :s is not doing you any favors
08:22 sorear but other than that I see no problems
08:23 sorear r: printf("g0/0/%-2d = %2d\n", 5, 6)
08:23 p6eval rakudo a3407d: OUTPUT«g0/0/5  =  6␤»
08:25 anant right, thanks!
08:25 sorear does it work?
08:32 anant I changed the file names so that p6eval gets the Perl6 file first. But now there are compilation errors. :(
08:33 sorear p6: https://gist.github.com/2935249
08:33 anant The program runs fine on my local machine though
08:33 p6eval niecza v18-7-ga660099: OUTPUT«Usage:␤  /tmp/i4VtQofr1P <file>␤»
08:33 p6eval ..pugs: OUTPUT«*** ␤    Unexpected "d"␤    expecting ":" or "("␤    at /tmp/3IqabMHNuj line 19, column 18␤»
08:33 p6eval ..rakudo a3407d: OUTPUT«Usage:␤  /tmp/9UIMahyNC8 <file> ␤»
08:33 sorear I don't see any compilation errors.
08:33 sorear r: https://gist.github.com/2935249
08:33 p6eval rakudo a3407d: OUTPUT«Usage:␤  /tmp/9KLsErw30O <file> ␤»
08:34 anant ah .. it was only pugs ... sorry
08:34 sorear moritz++ added 'rn' recently, I need to get in the habit of using that when I don't care to test pugs
08:42 sorear sleep &
08:42 dalek niecza/non-bootstrap: 43f7477 | sorear++ | lib/Actions.cs:
08:42 dalek niecza/non-bootstrap: Actions pt 7
08:42 dalek niecza/non-bootstrap: review: https://github.com/sorear/niecza/commit/43f7477cc8
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08:57 sergot hi o/
08:58 tadzik o/
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10:36 timotimo moritz: --gen-parrot=master worked like a charm
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10:55 tadzik English question, pardon me: "the more documents a term occurs in, the less discriminating it is." What does the "discriminating" mean in this context?
10:59 JimmyZ means "different meanings"?
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11:17 timotimo tadzik: i would think discriminating means "helpful in deciding what is meant"
11:17 timotimo like "the blue car" would be discriminative if you're standing in front of ten differently colored cars, but if you're on a field with a hundred blue cars, it's not particularly discriminating
11:18 pmichaud my rental car here is blue
11:19 pmichaud like, *blue*
11:19 tadzik so it has a similar meaning to "significant in a given context?"
11:19 pmichaud (good morning, #perl6)
11:19 tadzik good morning pmichaud
11:22 timotimo tadzik: if i'm correct, then yes
11:23 JimmyZ good morning, pmichaud
11:24 colomon \o
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11:35 GlitchMr http://modules.perl6.org/
11:35 GlitchMr ...uhmmm...
11:35 GlitchMr Why I only see panda badges?
11:36 GlitchMr And no logos
11:38 Facefox joined #perl6
11:38 mhasch the panda icon means a package conforms to the latest specs
11:42 daxim what about the medals?  I can't believe that each of the distros suddenly lost their README files
11:48 mhasch see http://modules.perl6.org/fame-and-profit
11:50 colomon yeah, something's wrong with the page
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13:16 * grondilu finally compiled rakudo, but from rakudo-star tarball.
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13:23 moritz might be that the script that compiles the stuff has github URL schemas harcoded
13:23 moritz if something changed there, the badges might not work anymore
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13:41 UncleFester6 So grondilu also still seems to be having trouble with the NQP build.  Nobody seemed interested last night but, one last time, the problem seems to start with tag: 0fde4a1e375a26da8d7b511aafdb6174e934b757
13:42 PerlJam What's the problem exactly?
13:42 PerlJam (or should I read scrollback?)
13:43 UncleFester6 invoke() not implemented when generating NQPCORE.setting.pir
13:48 UncleFester6 irc conversation here describes grondilu and araujo with same problem: http://irclog.perlgeek.de/​perl6/2012-06-10#i_5707703
13:49 * grondilu is glad to see he is not alone with this difficulty
13:51 UncleFester6 grondilu: I am not great with git but I did a "git reset --hard 5a415c993343cea899c10e52abd0cc0d76a90b37" which took me back just before the nqp change and I could build rakudo.
13:52 grondilu UncleFester6: thanks, I'll try that but I think I'll just use rakudo-star until the problem is resolved.
13:53 PerlJam grondilu: except that there isn't a problem for most of us.
13:53 PerlJam (no one is working on the problem they can't see)
13:53 UncleFester6 Should I file a rakudobug?
13:59 thou joined #perl6
14:03 * araujo looks in
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14:03 araujo i tried compiling yesterday, and it fails here with same problem yet
14:07 UncleFester6 I just filed the rakudobug.
14:08 UncleFester6 It might be nice if either araujo or grondilu could confirm that the git reset fixes the problem for them too.
14:11 UncleFester6 araujo: can you give it a try
14:15 dalek rakudo/nom: a2bacb6 | duff++ | CREDITS:
14:15 dalek rakudo/nom: update to github username
14:15 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/a2bacb6196
14:16 grondilu UncleFester6: Ok I'll try at once
14:17 araujo UncleFester6, not now, but, it was working fine for me like 1 week ago, so, if that commit is from 1 week or so ago, sure it will work
14:17 UncleFester6 grondilu: thanks
14:19 grondilu after executing the reset line, I ran "cd /usr/local/src/rakudo/; git pull ; perl Configure.pl --gen-parrot;"  It's ok, right?
14:19 UncleFester6 that looks right
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14:20 UncleFester6 umm wait.  Your ran git pull * after * doing the reset?
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14:30 grondilu Compilation failed again :(
14:30 grondilu the error is a bit different, though:  invoke() not implemented in class '$type'
14:31 UncleFester6 grondilu: did you do a "git pull" after doing the reset?  that could be the problem
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14:43 birdwindupbird I am looking through bug #113552 now. According message history on the page it seems to be fixed now. But when i try to
14:45 grondilu compilation worked with the --reset command!
14:48 UncleFester6 grondilu: thanks.  The bug report points to this conversation including your verification.
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15:02 harmil Hey all
15:03 harmil Anyone know, before I publish my own, if there's an extant logging module for Perl 6?
15:03 mike89_ joined #perl6
15:03 mike89_ hello
15:03 harmil hey mike89_
15:04 mike89_ have some questions
15:04 harmil have some answers. Shall we see if you hashes have matching keys?
15:04 mike89_ i would like to install MiniDBI
15:04 harmil s/you/our
15:04 harmil Hmm… not familiar with that one, go on
15:05 mike89_ using Rakudo so I could connect to mysql
15:05 mike89_ using Perl6
15:05 harmil sure
15:05 mike89_ but since you are not familiar with this one maybe you have something else to ofer?:)
15:06 Facefox joined #perl6
15:06 harmil 100 km above sea level at the equator of the Earth is officially, "outer space"
15:06 harmil Does that help
15:06 harmil ?
15:06 Facefox joined #perl6
15:07 mike89_ this stuff I allready now;)
15:07 harmil heh
15:07 harmil I'm looking at MiniDBI now… what was your question?
15:07 mike89_ ok, let me start again...:)
15:08 mike89_ my task is to write a http app using Perl Rakudo
15:08 mike89_ but I have problems installing modules
15:08 mike89_ its not as easy as with cpan and perl5
15:08 harmil Are you checking out Rakudo directly or using Rakudo Star?
15:08 mike89_ star
15:08 harmil Ok, good
15:09 harmil platform?
15:09 mike89_ fedora
15:09 harmil OK, so what do you do and what happens?
15:09 mike89_ fedora 16 to be precise
15:09 harmil I'll assume that's relatively current. I'm not a Fedora guy, though I use it sometimes at work
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15:11 mike89_ Yes fedora 16 is fairly new and stable...
15:11 mike89_ tell me how do you install modules for perl6
15:11 harmil ok
15:12 moritz mike89_: with   panda install modulename
15:12 harmil ^
15:12 mike89_ panda??
15:12 harmil panda comes with R*
15:12 mike89_ its like cpan??
15:12 moritz not quite as good yet
15:12 harmil it's the cpanalike in a way, though newer
15:12 harmil what mortiz++ said
15:13 moritz but it does resolve dependencies for you
15:13 mike89_ oh great
15:13 mike89_ so i will use it
15:13 mike89_ another question
15:13 harmil I'm just getting the hang of the facilities myself, so I was making sure I knew how to correctly invoke panda before answering
15:14 harmil sure
15:14 mike89_ this app of mine...
15:15 mike89_ i would like to use some catalogs and few files so it would look good and here comes the question
15:15 mike89_ how to use method described in other file??
15:15 harmil "use modulename"
15:16 harmil This assumes that your other file is named "modulename.pm6"
15:16 crab2313 mike89_: and -I XXX
15:16 mike89_ and if it is deep in the catalog
15:16 mike89_ ??
15:16 mike89_ catalog tree
15:17 harmil I'm not 100% sure what "catalog" in this context, means. Do you mean directory tree?
15:17 mike89_ yes
15:18 harmil So, :: is used to separate module hierarchies which are represented on the FS as directories. … however
15:20 harmil I wonder what your goal is, here. If it's to be an early adopter in P6-land, then you're on the right track. If it's to just get something done, then P6 may not be quite at the point that you think it is. I don't want to dissuade you, because new users are a good thing, but I want you to understand what using a language that isn't yet fully released entails...
15:20 mike89_ let me supprise you
15:21 harmil surprise away ;)
15:21 mike89_ i am writhing a thesis about Parrot and Perl6
15:21 harmil Ah, OK. Good stuff
15:21 mike89_ indeed
15:22 harmil Like I said, I just wanted to make sure you knew which bar you walked into :-)
15:22 harmil We're a "welcome anyone who wants to be here" sort of crowd, as I understand it
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15:22 mike89_ oh now I know... and i must stay in here for a while
15:24 harmil well, then welcome
15:24 mike89_ and it looks like fun aspecially after I read this:
15:24 mike89_ http://strangelyconsistent.o​rg/blog/perl-6-is-my-mmorpg
15:24 harmil yeah, so "use X::Y" becomes "open X/Y.pm6 and import its goodness"
15:24 mike89_ "goodness" you say:)
15:25 mike89_ ok, and there does not need to be whole tree... main directory of the program is root in this case??
15:25 harmil Where 'goodness' is defined (by me) as "the things that it exports"
15:26 harmil The root(s) of the tree are contained in the PERL6LIB environment variable, which looks a lot like the UNIX PATH (or PERL5LIB) plus some defaults. I believe "." is one of those defaults.
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15:28 harmil heya adu
15:28 mike89_ so to do it nicely I have to add path to my program in PERL6LIB environment variable
15:28 mike89_ ??
15:28 harmil The path to the root of any modules that your program wants to include, yes.
15:29 mike89_ superb
15:29 harmil Much like you would in Perl 5
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15:30 mike89_ well the fun part is that i don't know Perl5 or Perl6
15:30 harmil ah, OK
15:30 mike89_ so it's a great adventure for me
15:30 harmil yeah, there will be some learning curve, here, but it's worth it, I think
15:31 mike89_ my opinion as well
15:31 mike89_ any hints with writing http apps??
15:32 crab2313 harmil: "." isn't one of those default in rakudo start 2012.05
15:33 crab2313 star*
15:34 [Coke] (which bar) ... is this some sort of parrot joke? :)
15:34 brrt joined #perl6
15:35 [Coke] LIB defaults have also changed 2x, recently.
15:35 [Coke] (though I think they're all in the latest * release)
15:35 moritz LWP::Simple is in Rakudo star
15:35 [Coke] star: use LWP::Simple;
15:35 p6eval star 2012.05: OUTPUT«(signal SEGV)»
15:35 [Coke] BWAHAHAHA
15:35 [Coke] ok, that shouldn't be that funny. but damn.
15:36 moritz r: use LWP::Simple; LWP::Simple.get('http://www.perl6.org');
15:36 p6eval rakudo a2bacb: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Could not find LWP::Simple in any of: /home/p6eval/.perl6/lib, /home/p6eval/nom-inst1/lib/parrot/​4.4.0-devel/languages/perl6/lib␤»
15:36 moritz star: use LWP::Simple; LWP::Simple.get('http://www.perl6.org');
15:36 p6eval star 2012.05: OUTPUT«(signal SEGV)»
15:36 moritz eeks
15:36 moritz that's the precompilation-in-wrong-order bug
15:36 harmil crab2313: sorry, my bad
15:36 harmil OK, so I have a DateTime::Utils question. When I try to panda install it, I get "Variable $.hour used where no 'self' is available"
15:37 harmil is this known working and I'm doing something wrong?
15:37 harmil or is there a newer alternative?
15:37 harmil I really need strftime
15:37 moritz and there's Bailador (a clone of Perl 5 Dancer) for the server side
15:37 moritz harmil: I think that's easily fixable
15:38 harmil OK, so it's not a problem in my setup
15:40 mike89_ ok, one more question and I have to go. Where I can find specs about how parrot is actually workig?? and please don' tell me parrot.org... :)
15:40 harmil moritz: you want I should fork and pull request a fix?
15:40 harmil Hmm… parrot.org? ;-)
15:40 harmil make89_: let me look
15:41 mike89_ I need it for theoretical part of the job to be done
15:42 harmil It's not a terrible idea to start with what's in https://github.com/parrot/parrot/tree/master/docs
15:42 harmil It's obviously not end-user documentation, but there's a good bit of detail in there.
15:43 harmil at the very least it's a good place to start asking questions. I'm not sure, but I think there's a parrot channel somewhere that's useful to ask such questions also.
15:44 mike89_ ok, honesty I havent tking of searching for parrot docs at github <stupid> <stupid> <stupid> ...;)
15:45 mike89_ *honestly
15:47 harmil moritz: oh, for some reason I thought Date::Time::Utils was yours
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15:49 mike89_ thanks for help, I will be back....
15:50 mike89_ ;p
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15:59 [Coke] (parrot docs) see also #parrot on irc.parrot.org
15:59 [Coke] alvis is working on trying to shape docs up.
16:13 adu harmil: hey :)
16:13 adu sorry for the delay :P
16:14 sorear good * #perl6
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16:42 harmil adu: no worries. we're in the same time-zone at least :)
16:42 moritz \o sorear
16:44 harmil So, to re-ask my question… is there a logging facility already? Because I wrote one last night, and I'm thinking about making it public
16:45 cognominal joined #perl6
16:45 moritz harmil: I'm not aware of any
16:46 geekosaur channel log?  see /topic
16:48 moritz geekosaur: I thought of a logger module
16:48 moritz I hope harmil did too :-)
16:48 harmil yes, that was what I was asking
16:49 harmil The one I wrote is kind of based on the Java/Python model, but without being as heavy-weight. It's just a tiny little thing for now, though I imagine it will grow some
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16:52 larks if there are any devs here, just wanna say thanks and keep up the good work
16:52 moritz there are. Thanks larks.
16:55 harmil rn: class A { our %.mapping = enum <<a b c>>; } ; say A.mapping<b>;
16:55 p6eval rakudo a2bacb: OUTPUT«No such method 'STORE' for invocant of type 'Any'␤  in <anon> at /tmp/IjlK1L07Wg:1␤  in block <anon> at /tmp/IjlK1L07Wg:1␤␤»
16:55 p6eval ..niecza v18-7-ga660099: OUTPUT«Use of uninitialized value in string context␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/boot/lib/CORE.setting line 1261 (warn @ 5) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/boot/lib/CORE.setting line 268 (Mu.Str @ 15) ␤  at <unknown> line 0 (ExitRunloop @ 0) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/src/Ni…
16:55 harmil am I doing that wrong?
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16:56 moritz harmil: 'our' and hash/list assignment doesn't mix well in rakudo
16:56 harmil hmm… ok
16:56 harmil What is the difference between my %.x and our %.x in a class definition. The syn doesn't seem too clear on that
16:57 moritz I don't know. Neither make much sense to me, but (maybe apart from sorear) the others disagree violently with me
16:58 harmil Well, what I need is a map of labeled constants associated with a class. If our %.mapping as above isn't the right way to do that, I'm open to suggestions.
16:58 flussence shouldn't that be "has %.x"?
16:58 moritz r: class A { our enum B <c d e> }; say A::B::e
16:58 p6eval rakudo a2bacb: OUTPUT«e␤»
16:59 harmil Ah, ok
16:59 moritz r: class A { our enum B (a => 4, e => 25) }; say A::B::e
16:59 p6eval rakudo a2bacb: OUTPUT«e␤»
16:59 harmil flussence: has defines an instance attribute. very different
16:59 moritz r: class A { our enum B (a => 4, e => 25) }; say +A::B::e
16:59 p6eval rakudo a2bacb: OUTPUT«25␤»
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17:00 sorear harmil: they're exactly the same, except that the our version is accessible from outside the class as %Classs::x
17:00 flussence oh, *that's* what the difference is.
17:00 sorear as well as Class.x
17:00 harmil sorear: yes, that's what I need
17:00 harmil I want to be able to get the value from that mapping without an instantiated object handy
17:01 harmil Specifically, because it's used in instantiating the object
17:01 mucker joined #perl6
17:01 harmil moritz: thanks
17:01 Facefox joined #perl6
17:01 sorear larks: thanks *bows*
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17:12 adu harmil: are you talking about 2 different objects?
17:35 felher Why does:
17:35 felher r: say ((1,2),(4,5)).reduce: -> $a, $b { say "$a"; say ">$b"; }
17:35 p6eval rakudo a2bacb: OUTPUT«1 2␤>4 5␤True␤»
17:35 felher do what i want, but
17:35 felher r: for ((1,2),(4,5)) -> $a { say "$a"; }
17:35 p6eval rakudo a2bacb: OUTPUT«1␤2␤4␤5␤»
17:35 felher doesn't?
17:36 felher I guess it's about flattening, which still confuses me quite often... :)
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17:37 not_gerd hello, #perl6
17:38 harmil adu: in what context? the initializer? No, I have a class which has an enum that describes one of the parameters to its constructor.
17:39 not_gerd r: for ((1,2),(4,5)).lol -> $a { say "$a"; }
17:39 p6eval rakudo a2bacb: OUTPUT«1 2␤4 5␤»
17:39 adu harmil: oh, I would separate the two then
17:40 not_gerd felher: ^^
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17:40 moritz felher: in both cases the list flattens out
17:40 harmil adu: I don't see how that helps. I still have the same question
17:40 moritz felher: but a -> $a, $b  signature simply takes two values at a time
17:40 harmil that's more of just a style choice
17:41 moritz r: say (1, 2, 4, 5).reduce: -> $a, $b { say "$a"; say ">$b"; }
17:41 p6eval rakudo a2bacb: OUTPUT«1␤>2␤True␤>4␤True␤>5␤True␤»
17:41 felher not_gerd: yeah, i solved it with .tree. I still don't get it.
17:41 felher +though
17:41 moritz or not? hm, I'm confused too
17:41 felher \o/
17:41 * felher isn't alone, at least :)
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17:50 colomon say returns True, right?
17:51 harmil OK, https://github.com/ajs/perl6-log exists. Now back to shoveling some python around.
17:53 felher colomon: yes
17:53 colomon felher: I was trying to explain the reduce line.  though maybe I misunderstood the problem...
18:01 not_gerd msg pmichaud any progress on http://irclog.perlgeek.de/​perl6/2012-06-01#i_5667563 ?
18:01 not_gerd phenny, tell pmichaud any progress on http://irclog.perlgeek.de/​perl6/2012-06-01#i_5667563 ?
18:01 phenny not_gerd: I'll pass that on when pmichaud is around.
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18:06 felher colomon: could be. I don't see a relation between the return value of say and the problem :)
18:07 colomon what is the problem?
18:10 felher The problem ist, that reduce on ((1,2),(3,4)) gehts (1,2) and (3,4) in it's variables, while the for loop gets 1 and 2 and 3 and 4. I have expecetd reduce to get 1 in $a and 2 in $b int its frist, run, not (1,2) and (3,4). Just as the for loops gets 1 and 2 and 3 and 4 and not (1,2) and (3,4)
18:10 felher *is, *gets *its
18:10 * felher should _really_ read his line back before sending it.
18:15 felher and /me should highlight colomon
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18:24 colomon sorry, 3-year-old bathroom break interrupted.
18:25 colomon That sounds very much like what pmichaud++ was talking about in his talk yesterday
18:25 harmil that's a LONG bathroom break, colomon! See someone about that!
18:25 colomon for flattens and apparently reduce doens't.
18:26 colomon harmil: how do you think I found all this time to work on p6?  ;)
18:26 harmil hahaha
18:26 harmil I suppose you could have taken a break in a three year old bathroom to do it....
18:27 harmil So, tonight I'll want to follow up. Any advice on next steps for a module? Do I go through some sort of "get on the the panda radar" request process?
18:27 felher colomon: pm gave a talk yesterday?
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18:28 colomon yes, and he's giving another in 3 minutes (if I've got the timezones figured correctly)
18:28 colomon like all (?) of YAPC::NA, it's being livestreamed
18:28 felher colomon: link? :D
18:29 colomon http://ics.webcast.uwex.edu/mediasite/Viewe​r/?peid=0a53d661f99148e1ad3c9052032765da1d
18:29 felher colomon++ # thanks a lot :)
18:29 spaceships joined #perl6
18:29 colomon that's silverlight, and the instructions to strip it to a URL that mplayer or VLC can use are at http://mail.pm.org/pipermail/v​ienna-pm/2012-June/003125.html
18:30 felher colomon: you did read my mind, didn't you? :)
18:30 colomon that's the next question for like 90% of us.  (though today I'm running it on my Windows machine and the first link was all I needed.)
18:31 colomon doh, wrong link!
18:31 colomon that's not pmichaud's room
18:31 colomon http://ics.webcast.uwex.edu/mediasite/Viewe​r/?peid=db0df2d732cb49848ee72ed7ba593f451d
18:31 colomon should be correct
18:34 colomon and pmichaud has started
18:35 felher colomon: yeah, it got it :)
18:35 felher using http://video.ics.uwex.edu/db0df​2d7-32cb-4984-8ee7-2ed7ba593f45
18:35 felher with mplayer2 :)
18:36 PerlJam someon get Pm to put IRC on screen so I can heckle him from here ;)
18:37 PerlJam (although the streaming isn't workong so well today for some reason)
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18:40 colomon PerlJam: the talk is streaming fine for me (excepting a hum in the audio)
18:40 not_gerd same here
18:41 PerlJam I get snippets of audio, then it freezes.  Probably because I'm still using moonlight instead of a real windows box
18:42 flussence works pretty good in mplayer here
18:42 fgomez joined #perl6
18:42 PerlJam okay ... what's the thing for using it in mplayer again?
18:43 flussence the link felher gave
18:44 * PerlJam scrolls back just a bit
18:45 PerlJam Hrm.  audio comes through fine, video is wonky
18:45 cognominal joined #perl6
18:49 adu PerlJam: firefox works
18:50 flussence as long as your firefox has a plugin that can play Windows Media video, yes :)
18:52 colomon Chrome worked on my Mac, but not on my Windows box.  Sigh...
18:52 * not_gerd uses VLC on Win7
18:55 PerlJam I updated some codecs and it's fine
19:12 sirrobert joined #perl6
19:14 PerlJam tadzik: awake?
19:18 not_gerd bye, #perl6
19:18 not_gerd left #perl6
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19:28 felher pmichaud++ #talk
19:31 harmil It was a good talk, but after, "infinity will just take 2 more minutes," I had a hard time paying attention...
19:31 harmil It may have been the gufawing....
19:33 harmil ow! ow! ow! That hurts! massive screen garble on the live stream
19:35 patspam joined #perl6
19:36 flussence have they tried turning the video capture thing off and on again?
19:37 harmil dunno
19:39 sirrobert I'm getting an error:  perl6: error while loading shared libraries: libparrot.so.4.4.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory.
19:40 sirrobert Any ideas where I can look for resolution?
19:42 moritz sirrobert: did you install rakudo?
19:43 sirrobert yeah
19:43 sirrobert cloned from git, then perl ./Configure.pl, then make, then sudo make install
19:43 sirrobert it works from within the rakudo dir
19:43 vlixes joined #perl6
19:43 sirrobert but not from outside
19:44 sirrobert (also, it was working a few days ago... maybe a system update broke it?)
19:44 moritz what does   which perl6   say?
19:45 sirrobert hmm I had copied it to /usr/local/bin myself
19:45 sirrobert looking at the make install output now to see where it said it put it...
19:46 moritz into install/ in the rakudo dir
19:46 moritz (no need for sudo)
19:46 moritz so I guess you have a version mismatch between the copied and the install perl6 binary
19:46 sirrobert ah, I see it.  So I should just add .../rakudo/install/bin to $PATH
19:47 sirrobert or is something else better?
19:49 sirrobert Ok, I see how it's supposed to work.  Got it resolved (thanks)
19:50 sirrobert there was a version of parrot in ~/.perl6/bin and a different one elsewhere.
19:50 sirrobert Removed the one elsewhere =)
19:51 jaldhar joined #perl6
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20:00 moritz yes, I put rakudo/install/bin into $PATH
20:03 patspam joined #perl6
20:06 perlenthusiast joined #perl6
20:07 perlenthusiast why don't they distribute a new perl which contains both perl6 and perl 5 binaries or code perl6 in such away that it would switch version according to the script
20:08 perlenthusiast that's easy.......otherwise stop calling it perl6 because this is cult behavior.....by believing on power and adoption of perl5 so much they refuse to let perl die so they call it perl6 to hook people in but say it's a development name
20:08 perlenthusiast that's dishonesty and dilute the spirit of hard working programmers out there
20:08 moritz who is "they"?
20:08 flussence I think implying you have some sort of "ownership" over the perl5 name is also cult behaviour.
20:09 moritz and I'd like to see back ups for the claim that it's "easier" to unify both perl 5 and perl 6 into the same binary
20:09 moritz (especially since there isn't one Perl 6 binary, but one for every compiler)
20:10 harmil really? We're feeding trolls, now?
20:10 perlenthusiast let me be clear....the wide adoption and philosophy of perl (many ways of doing things) are making it impossible to move forward perl6 or any perl past 5....we have a situation where developers have reached the limit of their brain power and can't move forward
20:11 perlenthusiast but they can't admit that new perl can't be backward compatible so they think and think and think
20:11 perlenthusiast but they're comfortable in saying or calling it perl6 just go get people hooked on perl
20:11 perlenthusiast was kicked by moritz: perlenthusiast
20:12 qsr1 joined #perl6
20:12 moritz harmil: you're right, thanks for the reminder
20:13 sirrobert is there a best practices document for starting a perl6 project?  like ... file structure, etc.?
20:13 moritz sirrobert: http://wiki.perl6.org/Create%​20and%20Distribute%20Modules
20:15 sirrobert Thanks
20:17 * [Coke] wonders who pe was.
20:19 brrt left #perl6
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20:25 flussence don't know or care myself, but if what google returned is an accurate indication, you can find out far too much on people from just an IPv4 address.
20:28 * [Coke] pokes around, and flussence is correct, there's some nifty stuff out there. ;)
20:36 patspam joined #perl6
20:40 pmichaud yay
20:40 phenny pmichaud: 18:01Z <not_gerd> tell pmichaud any progress on http://irclog.perlgeek.de/​perl6/2012-06-01#i_5667563 ?
20:44 qsr1 >linking to an irc log
20:44 qsr1 >in an irc chat room
20:44 qsr1 why not just use a forum?
20:44 qsr1 left #perl6
20:45 flussence two of them in one hour? we're busy tonight :)
20:47 patspam joined #perl6
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20:50 pmichaud phenny: tell not_gerd  no, and I had forgotten about it.  Thanks for the ping/reminder.  I'd be happy if a bug was filed and I was made the owner of the bug.
20:50 phenny pmichaud: I'll pass that on when not_gerd is around.
20:57 harmil moritz: no problem, it's easy to forget
21:00 harmil flussence: it was only one. qsr1 joined instantly after the other one was kicked
21:01 diakopter harmil: I don't think so. the first was from the web interface; the second wasn't
21:02 sporous joined #perl6
21:02 harmil diakopter: could be. could be that it's a bot that uses multiple entry-points.
21:08 MHMalony joined #perl6
21:10 harmil So, the panda docs say, "Ping someone on IRC (#perl6 at freenode) to either show you how to add your module to the https://github.com/perl6/ecosystem, or else ask them if they could please add it for you." … I hereby ping someone on IRC...
21:11 harmil PS: I'm fine if the response is, "I don't like the font. And what's with this color scheme?! And where is the coffee holder?!" I'd just like to get to that stage :-)
21:16 flussence got a github repo url for it? :)
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21:59 tadzik PerlJam: yep
21:59 tadzik just afking
22:12 sorear good * #perl6
22:18 stevan_ joined #perl6
22:30 sergot good * ! o/
22:33 pmichaud 17:35 <felher> r: for ((1,2),(4,5)) -> $a { say "$a"; }
22:33 pmichaud ...because method reduce appears to be defined with .list and not .flat
22:33 pmichaud method reduce(&with) { self.list.reduce(&with) }
22:34 pmichaud thus the parcels don't flatten.  I don't know if reduce _should_ be defined with .flat.
22:36 pmichaud there's some inconsistency in .list versus .flat in many of the builtins (and I'm not sure what the distinction ought to be)
22:37 _fall0ut_ joined #perl6
22:38 pmichaud it's also the case that some methods on Parcel should force .flat even if the ones in Any do not.
22:40 TimToady I would generally expect reduce to flatten
22:44 felher pmichaud: ah, okay. I did expect it to have the same behavior as .map does, which does flatten, iirc. :)
22:44 felher pmichaud: very interesting talk today, btw ;)
22:44 felher * :)
22:45 pmichaud felher: thanks!
22:47 harmil flussence: sorry, I was afk for $work
22:47 pmichaud the talks I did at this conference were some of the most fun ones to do
22:47 harmil yes, I have a repo at https://github.com/ajs/perl6-log
22:48 harmil pmichaud: you were doing the iterators talk, right?
22:48 pmichaud yesterday  lists and parcels.... today iterators
22:48 felher pmichaud: glad to hear that. :) I will watch your other talk as soon as the recordings are online :)
22:48 adu joined #perl6
22:48 pmichaud yes, I'm eager to see videos too
22:48 harmil The "I'll wrap up in 2 minutes, once I finish infinity" was one of the funniest lines I've ever heard in a technical talk
22:49 harmil Especially, given that the talk involved lots of details on iterators giving you slightly more than you asked for.
22:49 binary_ joined #perl6
22:50 adu harmil: lolol
22:50 pmichaud harmil: yes, it was a nice surprise.  improv is fun :)
22:50 harmil indeed
22:50 dalek ecosystem: 39b4778 | flussence++ | META.list:
22:50 dalek ecosystem: Add perl6-log
22:50 dalek ecosystem: review: https://github.com/perl6/e​cosystem/commit/39b477818e
22:50 flussence there you go
22:50 harmil woot! thank you
22:51 adu ecosystem?
22:51 flussence modules.* will take a while to show it, I think it's updated once an hour
22:51 harmil that's panda's view of where to get modules
22:52 adu flussence: when https://github.com/andydude/p6-xml grows up to be a polished module, can it join that list too?
22:53 harmil hmm… nothing from supernovus yet on Date::Time::Utils
22:53 harmil er DateTime::Utils that is
22:53 flussence adu: yes, just remind someone again when it's ready :)
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23:48 colomon adu: plenty of unpolished modules in the ecosystem, too!
23:48 adu colomon: :)
23:50 cognominal joined #perl6

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