Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2012-06-17

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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Time Nick Message
00:26 fgomez joined #perl6
00:26 pmichaud I don't think my first talk has made it to YouTube yet.
00:26 pmichaud I'm really eager/hoping to see the lightning talk make it.
00:26 pmichaud For the blacked out parts, my slides are available at http://pmichaud.com/2012/pres/ if it helps.
00:27 pmichaud afk # sleep or something like that
00:27 sorear pmichaud: why blackouts?
00:27 sorear copyright zealotry?
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00:38 colomon what was the lightning talk on?
00:48 cog__ pmichaud, thx for the links
00:49 sorear o/ kst
01:08 cog__ pmichaud, I don't understand this slide.  http://pmichaud.com/2012/pres/yapcna-lists-1/slides/slide42g.html#end
01:09 cog__ how come it does not always say "cherry"?
01:12 cog__ ok, I got it. the container is replaced by a value. But the container content is unchanged.
01:13 cog__ bedtime overdue, I am becoming dense.
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01:43 [Coke] Perl6-Slurp-0.051000 [Download] [Browse] 14 Jun 2012
01:43 [Coke] (dconway)
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01:55 [Coke] we need this: ghci's ":info (+)
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02:13 alester So did I recall pmichaud saying that Perl 6 was almost half C now?
02:13 alester s/Perl6/Rakudo/
02:14 sorear o/ alester
02:14 alester hiya
02:17 quietfanatic I I recall his pie chart correctly, it's about a third C, a third NQP, and a third Perl 6
02:17 quietfanatic *If I recall
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02:19 quietfanatic alester: http://pmichaud.com/2012/pres/yapcna-perflt/slides/slide37.html
02:19 alester That's a lot of C for me to play with.
02:19 alester I like C.
02:19 alester I can instrument it.
02:20 alester mmmm.
02:20 quietfanatic C is nice.
02:20 quietfanatic but can't really be ported to VMs I think
02:20 quietfanatic This
02:20 quietfanatic C is mostly extensions to Parrot, I believe
02:21 JimmyZ_ alester: the most C code is 3rdparty
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02:21 alester Did I miss two parties already?
02:22 JimmyZ_ alester: most c code is here https://github.com/perl6/nqp/tree/master/3rdparty, I think ;)
02:22 alester aha
02:22 alester I didn't realize that rakudo and nqp were two different projects
02:23 sorear forgivable, they are both pmichaud/jnthn projects
02:23 alester Clearly I have been out of p6 land for a while
02:23 sorear and they are much more tightly coupled to each other than either is to Parrot
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02:47 dalek niecza/non-bootstrap: 412d3a1 | sorear++ | lib/ (4 files):
02:47 dalek niecza/non-bootstrap: Actions pt 10
02:47 dalek niecza/non-bootstrap: review: https://github.com/sorear/niecza/commit/412d3a15e4
03:16 pmichaud I didn't count 3rdparty in that pie chart
03:17 pmichaud the pie chart is nqp-specific code
03:17 pmichaud the 3rdparty libraries are separate from that (just as I wouldn't include the line counts for icu, parrot, etc.)
03:17 pmichaud alester: ^^^
03:18 pmichaud the c code in nqp could use some love, yes.  we get a fair number of gcc warnings from the code (primarily because jnthn++ develops in a windows environment)
03:18 alester My ack -f --cc | xargs wc -l only comes up with 3477 lines.
03:18 alester gcc warngings?!?!
03:19 pmichaud it's entirely possible that my script counted the wrong things
03:19 alester COMPILER WARNING SILENCER MAN TO THE RESCUE
03:19 pmichaud alester: let me know if you need any commit bits (I suspect you already have them)
03:19 pmichaud let me re-run my counter
03:19 alester on rakduo/raukudo?
03:19 pmichaud oh!
03:20 pmichaud no, the counts were for rakudo/rakudo and perl6/nqp combined
03:20 pmichaud perl6/nqp is the one that gives us all the compiler warnings
03:21 alester ok
03:22 alester YAPC always makes me so inspired to want to work on stuff.
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03:38 alester aww man I actualy have to install Parrot?
03:39 alester Man, I haven't been paying attention.  All these new nicks I've never heard before.
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03:45 pmichaud git://gist.github.com/2943337.git   # list of files by repo and source code type
03:45 pmichaud oops
03:45 pmichaud https://gist.github.com/2943337  # with the correct protocol :-)
03:46 pmichaud it's entirely possible that this list includes some sources we aren't actually using
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05:04 sorear n: sub foo($ [] []) { }
05:04 p6eval niecza v18-7-ga660099: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m��Cannot have more than one sub-signature for a pparameter at /tmp/pucIJ3bafx line 1:�------> [32msub foo($ [] [[33m�[31m]) { }[0m��Potential difficulties:�  &foo is declared but not used at /tmp/pucIJ3bafx line 1:�------> …
05:04 sorear n: :([] [])
05:04 p6eval niecza v18-7-ga660099: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m��Cannot have more than one sub-signature for a pparameter at /tmp/Ck7sL3mslB line 1:�------> [32m:([] [[33m�[31m])[0m��Action method fakesignature not yet implemented at /tmp/Ck7sL3mslB line 1:�------> [32m:([] [][33m�[…
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05:35 sorear o/ mberends
05:35 mberends o/ sorear
05:36 mberends ok, moritz++ is now even more married than he was already :-)  Great party!
05:37 sorear wow.  I knew I hadn't seen you for a while, but dec 5?
05:37 * sorear hugs mberends
05:37 * mberends hugs sorear back
05:39 mberends sorear: some backlogs suggested you're thinking of dropping out of your studies. Please don't, I carry a deep regret for a similar mistake.
05:43 sorear it really, really sucks to make a difficult decision and then have people you thought were your friends complain about it.
05:46 mberends I'm sorry to upset you, but I care too much to stand idly by.
05:47 sorear I suspect that our circumstances are radically different
05:48 sorear mine has everything to do with a crashing state education budget adding two years to my transfer time
05:48 sorear i'd be perfectly happy to resume education in a place with actually working schools
05:49 mberends that is a big problem, and I saw that you had given it plenty of hard thought
05:51 mberends I keep desiring to catch up the qualification deficit afterwards, and get blocked by tuit shortage. Next week I'll be seeing a university college in London with the same purpose again.
05:51 sorear right now half the internet is telling me that an AS is not worth three years of my life, and the other half is saying it is
05:51 sorear so I'm just going to ignore the internet and follow my heart
05:51 mberends ok, I won't nag
06:05 sorear sorry for reacting so harshly.
06:07 mberends no worries, you'll be fine, me too :-)
06:13 dalek niecza/non-bootstrap: fbfdda5 | sorear++ | lib/ (3 files):
06:13 dalek niecza/non-bootstrap: Actions pt 11
06:13 dalek niecza/non-bootstrap: review: https://github.com/sorear/niecza/commit/fbfdda5888
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06:37 moritz \o
06:38 sorear o/ moritz
06:38 moritz star: use JSON::Tiny; say from-json($_).perl for '[]', '[ ]'
06:38 p6eval star 2012.05: OUTPUT«[]␤[]␤»
06:38 moritz sisar: ^^
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06:39 sisar moritz: ah. thanks.
06:44 sisar nr: https://gist.github.com/2943732
06:44 p6eval rakudo a2bacb: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Colons may not be used to delimit quoting constructs at line 5, near ":to 'END';"␤»
06:44 p6eval ..niecza v18-7-ga660099: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: open may not be used in safe mode␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 0 (open @ 0) ␤  at <unknown> line 0 (ExitRunloop @ 0) ␤  at <unknown> line 0 (&open @ 0) ␤  at /tmp/TUdbQ70YaL line 3 (mainline @ 4) ␤  at /home/p6eval/nie…
06:45 sisar the gist ^^ is just a copy of https://github.com/colomon/panda/blob/master/make-bootstrap.pl
06:45 sisar rakudo gets the line number wrong.
06:46 sisar and interestingly, leaving aside the 'open' error, niecza doesn't complain at all about 'colons may not...'.
06:47 sisar honestly, i don't know whether rakudo is correct or niecza
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06:51 sorear r: say q:to 'END'␤moo␤
06:51 p6eval rakudo a2bacb: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Colons may not be used to delimit quoting constructs at line 2, near ":to 'END'\n"␤»
06:51 sorear n: say q:to 'END'␤moo␤
06:51 p6eval niecza v18-7-ga660099: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m��Ending delimiter END not found at /tmp/OEg_NdBCJi line 2:�------> [32m<BOL>[33m�[31mmoo[0m��Parse failed��»
06:51 sorear n: say q:to 'END'␤moo␤END␤
06:51 p6eval niecza v18-7-ga660099: OUTPUT«moo␤␤»
06:51 sorear r: say q:to 'END'␤moo␤END␤
06:51 p6eval rakudo a2bacb: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Colons may not be used to delimit quoting constructs at line 2, near ":to 'END'\n"␤»
06:52 sorear sisar: looks like rakudo just doesn't handle here docs
06:53 sisar sorear: oh. ok. Then the wrong line no. may be forgiven until it has support for heredocs.
06:53 sisar sorear: thanks for looking into it :)
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08:59 sorear sleep&
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09:32 sergot hi o/ :)
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09:51 sergot ą̉
09:51 sergot ó̉̉̉̉̉
09:51 sergot ³̉
09:51 sergot ½¾
09:51 sergot sorry for that... :)
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10:36 * colomon is more than a little surprised he used qq:to from a distance of four months after the fact....
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10:41 Juerd O hai. feather1 had an extremely high load average.
10:41 Juerd I saw no other solution than to reboot it.
10:42 Juerd Cause: unknown. If you happen to know what caused it, please take measures to prevent it from happening again :)
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10:48 tadzik feather getting ddosed again?
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10:52 Juerd tadzik: http://juerd.nl/i/70ff7fd45132d6a5cb06f6d55e499f3b.png
10:53 tadzik I see, thanks
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12:39 ggoebel perl6: "happy father's day".say
12:39 p6eval rakudo a2bacb, niecza v18-7-ga660099, pugs: OUTPUT«happy father's day␤»
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15:24 * [Coke] reads some real world haskell
15:25 pmichaud good morning, #perl6
15:27 moritz good am, pm
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15:47 [Coke] ~
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16:13 * [Coke] really doesn't have the mental energy to fix Pugs. blah.
16:13 [Coke] (at least not today)
16:14 pmichaud moritz: if I haven't done so already, blessing and congratulations to you (marriage).
16:14 moritz pmichaud: thank you
16:26 sorear good * #perl6
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16:54 moritz \o sorear
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17:06 sergot sorear: o/
17:22 [Coke] happy father's day to everyone so afflicted. ;)
17:27 [Coke] http://blogs.perl.org/users/martin_berends/2012/06/rakudo-perl-6-on-android-ics-403.html
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18:49 timotimo moritz: congratulations to the both of you :]
18:49 moritz timotimo: thank you
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19:51 lichtkind TimToady:  did you wrote most of the new text in the camel book?
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20:23 moritz I got the impression that TomC wrote most of the new text, and TimToady did much of the editing
20:36 raiph moritz: congrats
20:36 moritz raiph: thanks
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21:11 lichtkind moritz: thanks
21:15 lichtkind moritz: you wan't a coeditor?
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22:06 sergot good night! o/
22:06 tadzik o/
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22:41 japhb phenny, tell moritz Congrats!
22:41 phenny japhb: I'll pass that on when moritz is around.
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22:43 timotimo r: sub prefix:<#>($bar) { say "got $bar"; return $bar }; # "yoink"
22:43 p6eval rakudo a2bacb:  ( no output )
22:43 timotimo is # a comment character?
22:43 quietfanatic yes
22:43 * timotimo facepalms
22:44 timotimo can i override that with an is parsed macro or something?
22:44 quietfanatic though perhaps prefix:<#> ought to override it
22:44 timotimo if i want to write color values as literals?
22:44 quietfanatic I don't know
22:44 timotimo right, no worries :)
22:45 quietfanatic I prefer to write colors as hex integers and have the color class automatically convert from them
22:45 quietfanatic if you can do that in Perl 6 yet
22:45 quietfanatic though maybe that's not the best anyway
22:45 timotimo yeah, but then i have to write 0x before each :P
22:45 quietfanatic yeah yeah
22:45 timotimo with an is parsed macro, i can do that automatically
22:46 quietfanatic Well I don't know how to is parsed.
22:46 timotimo i'd like to write a crazy/crappy DSL
22:46 timotimo well, macros aren't there yet, so is parsed doesn't exist yet ;)
22:46 quietfanatic subs can be is parsed too, can't they?
22:46 timotimo no idea tbh
22:46 timotimo what would that do?
22:47 quietfanatic It would be like an is parsed macro but it would be a sub
22:47 quietfanatic I dunno
22:47 timotimo so it would get what's inside the brackets as a string?
22:48 timotimo i don't really know what exactly is parsed means
22:54 timotimo maybe i'll quickly describe my situation
22:54 timotimo our hackerspace is getting a new light installation with controllable RGB LEDs
22:54 timotimo i'm writing a high level protocol thingie in python currently and want to redo it from scratch (including new planning) in perl6 as a DSL
22:55 timotimo (why write control flow and label support yourself if you can use your host instead)
22:56 timotimo so there would be commands like "at the cursor position, insert N colors, move the cursor position N further" and at every place you could write "random" instead of a color or position and you would be able to add fading specifications etc etc
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23:21 flussence r: sub prefix:<#>($bar) { say "got $bar"; return $bar }; \# "yoink"
23:21 p6eval rakudo a2bacb:  ( no output )
23:21 flussence that one works for me locally... odd
23:21 flussence (though not the answer you wanted :)
23:22 flussence oh never mind... it's just returning "yoink" and the REPL prints that. Dunno why it does that though
23:23 raiph nr: sub prefix:<#> { say "foo" }; \#3; say "bar"
23:23 p6eval niecza v18-7-ga660099: OUTPUT«Potential difficulties:�  &prefix:<#> is declared but not used at /tmp/YnoeM6Hysx line 1:�------> [32msub prefix:<#> [33m�[31m{ say "foo" }; \#3; say "bar"[0m��»
23:23 p6eval ..rakudo a2bacb: OUTPUT«bar␤»
23:24 raiph nr: sub prefix:<#> { say "foo" }; \#3 say "bar"
23:24 p6eval rakudo a2bacb: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Confused␤at /tmp/Go5ZKaxsZi:1␤»
23:24 p6eval ..niecza v18-7-ga660099: OUTPUT«Potential difficulties:�  &prefix:<#> is declared but not used at /tmp/f9F1VBomMr line 1:�------> [32msub prefix:<#> [33m�[31m{ say "foo" }; \#3 say "bar"[0m��»

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