Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2012-09-23

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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All times shown according to UTC.

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04:49 moritz good morning
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05:01 sorear good morning moritz
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06:46 dalek niecza: b344401 | sorear++ | lib/ (2 files):
06:46 dalek niecza: ThawBuffer knows its setting
06:46 dalek niecza: review: https://github.com/sorear/niecza/commit/b344401edd
06:46 dalek niecza: d8852de | sorear++ | lib/ (2 files):
06:46 dalek niecza: Fix over-eager caching of method handlers, colomon++
06:46 dalek niecza: review: https://github.com/sorear/niecza/commit/d8852de8b0
06:46 sorear phenny: tell colomon the bug you found while trying to enhance "cmp" is fixed now
06:46 phenny sorear: I'll pass that on when colomon is around.
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07:30 dalek Perlito: bd673d3 | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | / (15 files):
07:30 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - add "Javascript3" backend (containers are objects)
07:30 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/Perlito/commit/bd673d3000
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07:40 dalek Perlito: ad58fdb | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | / (2 files):
07:40 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - Javascript3 - fix method names
07:40 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/Perlito/commit/ad58fdb2ae
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08:12 masak morning, #perl6
08:15 sorear o/
08:16 dalek Perlito: bb527ad | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | / (4 files):
08:17 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - js3 - add make build-5js3
08:17 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/Perlito/commit/bb527ad3a4
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09:13 cognominal nqp: say(?$/)
09:13 p6eval nqp: OUTPUT«(signal SEGV)»
09:13 cognominal keeping at breaking things
09:13 FROGGS morning
09:13 cognominal morning
09:28 masak nqp: ?$/
09:28 p6eval nqp: OUTPUT«(signal SEGV)»
09:29 masak nqp: $/
09:29 p6eval nqp:  ( no output )
09:29 masak nqp: say $/.WHAT
09:29 p6eval nqp: OUTPUT«Confused at line 2, near "say $/.WHA"␤current instr.: 'panic' pc 19999 (src/stage2/gen/NQPHLL.pir:7315) (src/stage2/gen/NQPHLL.pm:324)␤»
09:29 masak hm :)
09:30 dalek Perlito: 9e72206 | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | / (2 files):
09:30 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - js3 - fix list interpolation
09:30 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/Perlito/commit/9e72206537
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09:55 dalek Perlito: 5640877 | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | / (3 files):
09:55 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - js3 - fix "our" variables
09:55 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/Perlito/commit/5640877535
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10:02 dalek Perlito: 7f2e5dc | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | / (2 files):
10:02 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - js3 - fix die()
10:02 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/Perlito/commit/7f2e5dca9c
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10:16 felher I guess I am just blind, but where is specified what happens if you C<use> a file that is just a normal file, not a module, not a package?
10:20 tadzik nqp: say($/.WHAT)
10:20 p6eval nqp: OUTPUT«(signal SEGV)»
10:20 tadzik nqp: say($/)
10:20 p6eval nqp: OUTPUT«Null PMC access in get_string()␤current instr.: '' pc 791 (src/stage2/gen/NQPCORE.setting.pir:363) (src/stage2/NQPCORE.setting:321)␤»
10:23 jnthn felher: S11 notes that EXPORT is a lexical installed in UNIT. Thus exports working out is orthogonal to what module/class is actually declared inside the file.
10:23 jnthn It's just convention (though a good one) to match file name and path with having a module of that name declared inside the file.
10:25 felher jnthn: ah, a UNIT is a compilation unit. And files are compilation units, so they get their EXPORT automatically.
10:25 felher jnthn: thnx a lot :)
10:26 jnthn np :)
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10:36 Ulti this is a good talk http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tCel6lpDTZI
10:42 felher yeah, the rakudo speekup is really great :)
10:43 Ulti yeah its very noticable, even if I haven't done much p6 programming I've built each release of star for the last couple of years and its gotten a lot better
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10:46 felher indeed :)
10:50 leont Last question of this interview is interesting for us too: http://www.codeguru.com/cpp/article.php/c18357/An-Interview-with-C-Creator-Bjarne-Stroustrup.htm
10:50 jnthn Time to head to the airport. Back in ~20 hours, in a timezone far, far away. &
10:51 leont jnthn: YAPC::Asia?
10:52 doy leont: that seems about equally relevant to perl 5 and perl 6
10:52 doy (:
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11:21 dalek Perlito: 283f52b | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | / (2 files):
11:21 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - js3 - fix container stringification
11:21 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/Perlito/commit/283f52b3e7
11:32 dalek Perlito: 5ff149c | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | / (2 files):
11:32 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - js3 - fix warn()
11:32 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/Perlito/commit/5ff149cee4
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11:49 dalek Perlito: aa057ce | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | t5/01-perlito/19-local.t:
11:49 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - more tests
11:49 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/Perlito/commit/aa057ceacc
12:20 dalek Perlito: 469a34f | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | / (4 files):
12:20 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - js3 - fix local(), more tests
12:20 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/Perlito/commit/469a34f158
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13:51 dalek Perlito: df13543 | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | / (3 files):
13:51 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - js3 - add @_ aliasing
13:51 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/Perlito/commit/df13543e46
14:36 dalek Perlito: 62131aa | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | / (3 files):
14:36 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - js3 - increment/decrement
14:36 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/Perlito/commit/62131aa9b6
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14:55 masak obviously, the NP-oracle looks at prime candidates and says "sorry kid, but you're not the one".
14:55 arnsholt =D
14:57 masak <moritz> öööööööööööööööööl˜ 5~
14:58 masak luckily, that means "oil" in German, not "beer" as in Swedish.
14:59 masak I'm all for bringing up Ronja in the Linux hacker tradition, but beer can probably wait a few more years... :P
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16:18 dalek Perlito: fdcaf07 | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | / (4 files):
16:18 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - js3 - impl PUSH - this will be used by tied arrays someday
16:18 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/Perlito/commit/fdcaf07868
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16:39 diakopter TimToady: I let it run through base 22 - bases 19-22 aren't anywhere close to as big as 18
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16:42 dalek Perlito: 6b80f2a | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | / (3 files):
16:42 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - js3 - more tied methods
16:42 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/Perlito/commit/6b80f2a8cc
16:45 diakopter bases 3-22: Execution time: 36531.603 s
16:45 diakopter so around 10 hours
16:46 diakopter 9.5 of that being base 18 I'm sure
16:46 * [Coke] blahs at the partcl nqp conversion effort.
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17:12 * [Coke] tries to figure out the QAST syntax for calling a sub and passing it arguments
17:17 [Coke] if I want to see what PIR is generated with some QAST, is there a way to do that?
17:17 [Coke] (in lieu of more docs on QAST)
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17:26 [Coke] phenny: ask jnthn how one is supposed to invoke a named sub from QAST. QAST::Op.new( :op<call>, :name<invoke> ); complains that it cannot find a sub called "invoke" (There's one at program top level, and one in the actions class, since I don't know where it's looking)
17:26 phenny [Coke]: I'll pass that on when jnthn is around.
17:36 GlitchMr https://github.com/sorear/niecza/commits/master
17:36 GlitchMr this commit history starts to annoy me
17:37 GlitchMr Why commit made 5 days ago would be before commit made a day ago?
17:37 [Coke] I'll bite, why does that commit history annoy you?
17:37 [Coke] ... because you can commit things whenever you like locally, reorder them, and then push them.
17:37 GlitchMr Fix over-eager caching of method handlers, colomon++: sorear authored 11 hours ago
17:37 GlitchMr ThawBuffer knows its setting: sorear authored 5 days ago
17:37 [Coke] Sure.
17:37 GlitchMr Add BigInteger handling in ln: colomon authored a day ago
17:38 [Coke] the order the commits are in in history isn't necessarily the order commits are in when you committed them.
17:38 GlitchMr 5 days is shorter period than 1 day or what
17:38 [Coke] GlitchMr: stop typing and read what I wrote.
17:39 GlitchMr This is... confusing
17:39 [Coke] this is... git
17:41 dalek glitchmr.github.com/perl6-changes: a5ffc5d | GlitchMr++ | _posts/2012-09-23-perl-6-changes-2012W38.md:
17:41 dalek glitchmr.github.com/perl6-changes: Actually, it's fourth Thursday, not third.
17:41 dalek glitchmr.github.com/perl6-changes: review: https://github.com/GlitchMr/glitchmr.github.com/commit/a5ffc5d316
17:41 dalek glitchmr.github.com/perl6-changes: d3761af | GlitchMr++ | _posts/2012-09-23-perl-6-changes-2012W38.md:
17:41 dalek glitchmr.github.com/perl6-changes: Upload Perl 6 changes for 2012W38
17:41 dalek glitchmr.github.com/perl6-changes: review: https://github.com/GlitchMr/glitchmr.github.com/commit/d3761af6b8
17:41 [Coke] you don't even have to reorder - I do a commit locally. I sit on it for a week. you do a commit and push it today, all at once. I am reminded to push my commit - I rebase, and push. your commit is in first, but mine is older.
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com: d721657 | GlitchMr++ | _posts/2012-09-23-perl-6-changes-2012W38.md:
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com: Placeholder Perl 6 changes for 2012W38 page
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com:
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com: Currently, not much was mentioned on this page, but I've made this
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com: branch so you can read it and report any bugs with this list if you
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com: will find any (like spelling errors or factual errors).
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com: review: https://github.com/GlitchMr/glitchmr.github.com/commit/d7216570f7
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com: 8179af9 | GlitchMr++ | _posts/2012-09-23-perl-6-changes-2012W38.md:
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com: Add more Perl 6 changes to blog article.
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com:
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com: Currently, the changes aren't too exciting compared to previous week,
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com: but we still have three days - who knows what will happen then...
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com: Besides, isn't Rakudo Star release awesome enough - I mean, it brings
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com: newest changes to useful and usable distribution of Perl 6 - you know,
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com: without installing Panda :-).
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com: review: https://github.com/GlitchMr/glitchmr.github.com/commit/8179af9724
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com: a5ffc5d | GlitchMr++ | _posts/2012-09-23-perl-6-changes-2012W38.md:
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com: Actually, it's fourth Thursday, not third.
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com: review: https://github.com/GlitchMr/glitchmr.github.com/commit/a5ffc5d316
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com: d3761af | GlitchMr++ | _posts/2012-09-23-perl-6-changes-2012W38.md:
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com: Upload Perl 6 changes for 2012W38
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com: review: https://github.com/GlitchMr/glitchmr.github.com/commit/d3761af6b8
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com: 9aca3c1 | GlitchMr++ | _posts/2012-09-23-perl-6-changes-2012W38.md:
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com: Merge branch 'perl6-changes'
17:42 dalek glitchmr.github.com: review: https://github.com/GlitchMr/glitchmr.github.com/commit/9aca3c1401
17:42 GlitchMr wow, I think merging is really spammy
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17:56 * moritz backlogs the summary
17:56 sorear good * #perl6
17:56 moritz \o sorear
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17:57 sorear [Coke]: and that's exactly what happened, I forgot to push my second-to-last commit until after colomon++ started doing the only functional changes of the release cycle
17:57 sorear o/ moritz
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18:05 colomon sorear: release is tomorrow?
18:05 phenny colomon: 06:46Z <sorear> tell colomon the bug you found while trying to enhance "cmp" is fixed now
18:09 colomon afk # but still interested in the answer...
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19:37 pmurias [Coke]: re seeing PIR for QAST, I wrote a Perl6 -> QAST dumper which can show you how a bit of Perl 6 code is represented as QAST
19:40 pmurias for getting PIR from QAST I would try using QAST::Compiler to get PIRT
19:40 pmurias and then maybe the .pir method to get pir from that
19:41 pmurias [Coke]: also take a look at nqp/t/qast
19:42 moritz pmurias: where's that dumper?
19:45 pmurias moritz: https://github.com/pmurias/rakudo-js/blob/master/bin/ast-dumper.nqp
19:45 pmurias it's a bit rough
19:47 moritz pmurias: thanks
20:01 GlitchMr perl6: for 1 .. 10 { .say; next + next + next + next }
20:01 p6eval rakudo 7d6aa0, niecza v21-23-gd8852de: OUTPUT«1␤2␤3␤4␤5␤6␤7␤8␤9␤10␤»
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20:12 colomon rn: say 1 cmp 5
20:12 p6eval rakudo 7d6aa0, niecza v21-23-gd8852de: OUTPUT«Increase␤»
20:12 colomon rn: say { foo => 1, bar => 2 } cmp  { bar => 2, foo => 5 }
20:12 p6eval niecza v21-23-gd8852de: OUTPUT«Same␤»
20:12 p6eval ..rakudo 7d6aa0: OUTPUT«Decrease␤»
20:13 colomon So... I've reworked niecza's infix:<cmp> to masak++'s suggestion for ordering hashes, and if I'm not mistaken, rakudo is doing it wrong.  (assuming, of course, masak's method is correct.)
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20:15 colomon (that is, go through the keys in order and compare their values.)
20:25 sorear colomon: hi.  release is tomorrow
20:25 colomon sorear: okay.  will try to have more useful stuff checked in by then.
20:39 sorear ++colomon
20:46 sorear so I have plans for the next month that involve some moderately serious (ab)use of the CLR assembly naming/resolution system and I'm concerned I might hit a Microsoft/Mono incompatibility
20:48 * colomon is ablaze with curiosity....
20:51 [Coke] pmurias: that test file does have lots of great examples of QAST, but not the nqp they would correspond to, which makes it slightly less useful. I'll see if I can tease out what I need from it,  though.
21:13 felher 'night, #perl6 :)
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21:40 leont libuv is a bit disappointing
21:41 leont They don't seem to know the rule #1 of callbacks in C: always include a void pointer for extra state
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21:44 sorear how does node work around that?
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21:52 leont Ah, I think I found it, there's a public data field in all request objects (that do get passed)
21:54 masak colomon: might well be that rakudo is wrong.
21:54 masak colomon: I'm still mulling over whether't's a good idea to compare hashes that way.
21:55 masak I'd be much more hesitant to do it with sets, for example. but hashes are not that different.
21:56 sorear o/ masak
21:56 masak \o
21:59 masak <GlitchMr> Why commit made 5 days ago would be before commit made a day ago?
21:59 masak because... that's what "before" means...?
22:00 masak but yeah, what [Coke] said. if you want your commits ordered *temporally*, you can do that. but that's not the interesting order.
22:01 masak 'night, #perl6
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22:10 leont Also, libuv's habit of not declaring variables in examples is profoundly annoying
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23:11 MikeFair o/ whiteknight
23:11 MikeFair n: 2.ln()
23:11 p6eval niecza v21-23-gd8852de:  ( no output )
23:11 MikeFair n: say 2.ln()
23:11 p6eval niecza v21-23-gd8852de: OUTPUT«0.69314718055994529␤»
23:12 MikeFair sorear: I'm not seeing the problem there... google's answer is: 0.69314718056
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