Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2012-11-15

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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02:55 Guest58684 should <alpha> match greek letters?
02:59 sorear it should, yes
03:00 Guest58684 does it depend on ICU?
03:00 sorear rn: say ?( "α" ~~ /<alpha>/ )
03:00 sorear yes, you need ICU
03:00 p6eval rakudo c82d10, niecza v22-32-gee5dcf1: OUTPUT«True␤»
03:00 Guest58684 ok.
03:00 sorear looks like there is agreement
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04:34 shinobicl hi
04:34 shinobicl what do you usually use to debug your perl6 programs?
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04:55 shinobicl how do i exit from a "for"?
04:57 shinobicl r: for (1..10) -> $val{ if ($val == 3) { say "(found 3!.... exiting.)"; } else { say "-"} }
04:57 p6eval rakudo c82d10: OUTPUT«-␤-␤(found 3!.... exiting.)␤-␤-␤-␤-␤-␤-␤-␤»
04:57 shinobicl r: for (1..10) -> $val{ if ($val == 3) { say "(found 3!.... exiting.)"; break; } else { say "-"} }
04:57 p6eval rakudo c82d10: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤CHECK FAILED:␤Undefined routine '&break' called (line 1)␤»
04:57 doy r: for (1..10) -> $val{ if ($val == 3) { say "(found 3!.... exiting.)"; last; } else { say "-"} }
04:58 p6eval rakudo c82d10: OUTPUT«-␤-␤(found 3!.... exiting.)␤»
04:58 shinobicl "last" it was.. thanks!
04:59 doy and there's a debugger here https://github.com/jnthn/rakudo-debugger
05:02 sorear shinobicl: I mostly use print statements because I'm not cool enough for the debugger
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05:14 shinobicl r: my $x = -1; try { warn "Bad data" if $x < 0; CONTROL { say "x is now 0"; $x = 0 } }; say $x;
05:14 p6eval rakudo c82d10: OUTPUT«x is now 0␤Bad data  in block  at /tmp/vjUP4tk9x3:1␤␤0␤»
05:15 shinobicl i have a very similar structure in a module i wrote... but the "CONTROL" part is never reached...
05:15 shinobicl the difference is that the "warn" is inside a "for" loop
05:22 shinobicl r: my @data = <A B E D>; try { for (@data) -> $val { if ($val ne any(<A B C D>)) { warn "wrong char. assuming defaults"; last; }} CONTROL{ @data = <A B C D>; }};say @data.perl;
05:22 p6eval rakudo c82d10: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Unable to parse expression in block; couldn't find final '}' at line 2, near "for (@data"␤»
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05:29 shinobicl r: my @data = <A B E D>;try { for @data -> $val { if ($val ne any(<A B C D>)) { warn "wrong char. assuming defaults"; last; }; }; CONTROL{ @data = <A B C D>};}; say @data.perl;
05:29 p6eval rakudo c82d10: OUTPUT«wrong char. assuming defaults  in block  at /tmp/WciqV8ylOR:1␤␤Array.new("A", "B", "C", "D")␤»
05:30 shinobicl this same logic does not work inside a module :S
05:30 shinobicl anyway, it's late.. good night everyone!
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08:35 Su-Shee good morning everyone..
08:35 moritz \o
08:35 Su-Shee do I want star or the monthly release?
08:37 moritz star
08:37 moritz that's monthly release + debugger + modules
08:37 Su-Shee yeah I know, I was asking more along the lines of "monthly is a little experimental these days because we added..." :)
08:38 Su-Shee ok, I'm just greedy for the bleeding edge. :)
08:40 nwc10 surely, if you want the bleeding edge you go for git://github.com/rakudo/rakudo.git ?
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08:45 sorear good morning Su-Shee
08:46 sorear moritz: is the categorical rewrite in a star yet?
08:46 sorear good morning nwc10 too :D
08:46 sorear good to see you about
08:47 sorear hopefully soon niecza will have a bleeding edge again
08:47 moritz Su-Shee: star is no less experimental than the compiler release :-)
08:48 moritz sorear: no, categorical rewrite is only in git right now
08:48 sorear what's the opposite of experimental?  dogmatic?
08:48 sorear theoretical?
08:49 nwc10 "special biologist word" ?
08:49 Su-Shee orthodox :)
08:49 moritz conservative
08:49 brrt what moritz says
08:49 sorear .oO( Perl6 is experimental.  It stopped being theoretical *years* ago. )
08:49 * sorear is thinking physics
08:50 brrt applied!
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09:00 kresike hello all you happy perl6 people
09:00 brrt hi kresike
09:01 kresike brrt, o/
09:11 jnthn mornin' o/
09:16 nwc10 jnthn: in multidispatch.c, I can't see anything that ever frees the memory allocated for Rakudo_md_cache *cache in Rakudo_md_candidate_info
09:19 jnthn The cache isn't referenced from Rakudo_md_candidate_info, no?
09:20 * jnthn looks
09:21 jnthn No, it hangs off Rakudo_Code's dispatcher_cache slot, via a level of indirection.
09:21 nwc10 it returns cache->candidates, which (as best I can work out) is owned by that structure
09:21 nwc10 but it will leak if the owner PMC is ever freed?
09:23 jnthn Yes, looks like.
09:23 sorear heya, jnthn
09:23 jnthn OTOH, most multis live "forever".
09:23 jnthn o/ sorear
09:24 nwc10 the code for sorting is only tightly coupled with the code for adding to the cache via the structure  Rakudo_md_candidate_info
09:25 nwc10 Rakudo_md_candidate_info.constraints appears not be used once sorting is done.
09:26 jnthn Correct.
09:26 nwc10 so, potentially, sort code that returned a massive flat list of PMCs could be called, and the caller process that flat list into the existing structure.
09:27 jnthn Once, a while ago, the multi-dispatcher did use that list of candidates at dispatch time.
09:28 jnthn Now just bind_check matters
09:28 jnthn One important detail on data structure is that the list of candidates is terminated by two NULLs, with an inner NULL delimiting a group of candidates that are equally narrow.
09:28 nwc10 I see accesses to all structure members except constraints in the rest of the code
09:29 jnthn Yeah. It could be moved into Rakudo_md_candidate_graph_node if it's only used in the sort.
09:30 nwc10 aha. good plan. I'd not thought of doing it like that.
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09:46 FROGGS for the rakudo release: should I update it to use parrot 4.9.0 or should I stay at 4.4.0?
09:47 FROGGS (I guess I know the answer already)
09:48 bonsaikitten FROGGS: both should work, I prefer new things as they have usually more bugfixes than regressions
09:49 FROGGS hmmm, I remember this IO-rewrite they did in parrot that made some trouble. I thought that we use 4.4.0 because that is right before these changes...
09:50 bonsaikitten yes, that sounds familiar
09:51 FROGGS and since I dont know how to test if these problems still exist...
09:51 brrt iirc, they had to do with readline not being nice
09:51 brrt if we don't have tests for that it is un-awesomeness from all sides
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09:58 jnthn Yes, it was IO-rewrite related
09:58 nwc10 you'd be best asing Pm, I think. But I think it's issues https://github.com/parrot/parrot/issues/860 (now closed) and https://github.com/parrot/parrot/issues/847 (still open)
09:59 jnthn Ah
09:59 jnthn If there's tickets still open then that answers the question, I think.
10:00 FROGGS ya, and I have a testcase now to prove ;o)
10:00 FROGGS thank you all ;o)
10:00 nwc10 jnthn: but from skimming #847 it's not clear to me whether it's closeable yet
10:01 jnthn nwc10: If it's not closed I'd rather be cautious and go with depending on a known good release.
10:02 nwc10 agree. I more meant - "it's not clear to me what the parrot folks still think that they need to do"
10:02 jnthn Ah, OK.
10:02 jnthn We can always bump to latest after this month's Rakudo release so those using bleeding edge Rakudo from Git will see the issues and we'll have time to know about them (or lack of them) well before a release.
10:03 FROGGS k
10:03 nwc10 that seems wise
10:11 FROGGS jnthn: is that multi trait_mod:<is> merge problem solved yet? (using NativeCall and Inline::C, and just getting trait_mod:<is> from the last-imported module)
10:11 jnthn FROGGS: Not yet
10:12 FROGGS can I inspire you (via paypal) to have a look at it? ;o)
10:14 jnthn I'll get there, it's just that I want to understand another pre-comp/import issue first, since the solution for that may impact the solution for this...
10:14 FROGGS ahh, okay
10:15 jnthn Looking at that is already about top of my todo list.
10:16 FROGGS the offer still holds
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10:16 dalek Perlito: e107c18 | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | / (5 files):
10:16 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - parser - add "glob variable"
10:16 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/​Perlito/commit/e107c18970
10:17 jnthn FROGGS: The problem isn't a financial one, more that I'm currently in preparation for 2 solid weeks of travel/teaching/conference speaking, which is a small distraction from hacking on Rakudo. :)
10:18 FROGGS I dont mean that I want it done tomorrow ;o)
10:18 jnthn :-)
10:21 FROGGS its just that I got some spare time in december, and my modules (Inline::C, SDL, Games::BubbleBreaker) depend on that
10:21 sorear sleep&
10:22 FROGGS gnight
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10:27 * nwc10 wonders if the regulartory hurdles would be any less complex for online payment in BEER rather than cash. Different, yes. But "beer laundering"?
10:29 jnthn :D
10:29 jnthn What a concept...
10:35 nwc10 with rakudo, is there a way with Configure.pl to cause --gen-parrot *not* to build parrot with --optimize? I want -g for all the C files, to get debugging
10:36 jnthn --parrot-options lets you pass options through to Parrot's Configure
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10:37 nwc10 Unknown option: parrot-options
10:37 nwc10 whose Configure.pl takes that?
10:38 arnsholt NQP, I assume
10:38 nwc10 nope. not their either
10:38 nwc10 gah. there.
10:38 nwc10 where is my brain?
10:39 tadzik sorry, I took it yesterday, forgot to tell you :/
10:39 * FROGGS .oO( brainzzzz, eating brainzzzzz )
10:49 masak g'day, #perl6
10:50 jnthn good aftOH^Wmorning, masak
10:50 masak made it just before the meridian. :P
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10:55 FROGGS hi masak
11:02 masak aloha.
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11:22 Woodi hallo today
11:23 masak good'di Woo'di.
11:24 Woodi I tried to make some bindings to C func like set_opt( void *v ) using CArray[int] but it errors with: Unknown type* Positional* used in native call
11:25 jnthn It'd be easiest if you could paste the signature
11:25 jnthn But my first guess is that you wrote CArray[int] @foo, not CArray[int] $foo
11:26 Woodi yyy, yes...
11:26 jnthn :)
11:26 Woodi I thinked I followed tests...
11:26 jnthn It's consistent with rest of Perl 6, fwiw
11:26 jnthn sub foo(Array @x) { } means "a Positional that holds Arrays"
11:27 Woodi checking
11:29 Woodi passed to next line ! :) however next line is error check... will see...
11:35 nwc10 jnthn: parrot-option  (ie singular)
11:35 nwc10 use the source, luke
11:35 jnthn nwc10: oh! Sorry.
11:36 nwc10 still not sure if it's actually adding -g, as I see lots of -O2 flying past
11:36 jnthn nwc10: (use the source) of perl Configure.pl -h :)
11:37 nwc10 CONFIG_ARGS     = "--optimize=-g" "--optimize" "--prefix=/Volumes/Stuff/Perl/rakudo/install"
11:37 nwc10 mmm. :-/
11:37 jnthn Did you try --parrot-option='--debugging' ?
11:37 jnthn er, or something like that :)
11:37 nwc10 nope, not yet
11:41 Woodi decisively things move forward :) thanx jnthn++
11:42 jnthn np :)
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12:33 moritz [Coke]++ #going through the perl6 RT queue
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13:02 bbkr_ r: =pod
13:02 p6eval rakudo c82d10: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Preceding context expects a term, but found infix = instead␤at /tmp/eqe30h6iti:1␤»
13:02 bbkr_ std: =pod
13:02 p6eval std 04216b1: OUTPUT«ok 00:00 40m␤»
13:03 bbkr_ which one is incorrect? should bare =pod (without closing =end tag) be allowed?
13:05 masak I don't think STD does any Pod parsing.
13:06 bbkr_ then it's LTA rakudo message, right?
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13:07 masak possibly.
13:08 * bbkr_ reports
13:08 masak I'd like to hear what tadzik has to say about it.
13:09 masak the above should count as "abbreviated block" syntax, I think. as far as I see, it shouldn't need an ending delimiter, because abbreviated blocks auto-close.
13:11 bbkr_ so it should just work without failure?
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13:14 masak as far as I can see, yes.
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13:35 * [Coke] yawns from the office.
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13:40 isBEKaml hola, #perl6!
13:42 isBEKaml https://gist.github.com/4078709 # any way I can improve this?
13:43 masak indent looks weird on line 8.
13:44 isBEKaml yeah, hit tab accidentally. :)
13:44 isBEKaml not very comfortable with form entries that take tabs.
13:45 isBEKaml masak: I don't like the $^a in map:, anyway I can just say that once?
13:45 masak .comb(/./) better written .comb
13:45 masak isBEKaml: I was thinking of that. :)
13:45 masak @nums>>.chr.map( * xx 2 )
13:45 masak but it felt like a micro-optimization, so I didn't mention it.
13:46 isBEKaml r: my @nums = 1,2,3; @nums>>.chr.map(* xx 2);
13:46 p6eval rakudo c82d10:  ( no output )
13:46 masak indent problems at line 19, too.
13:46 isBEKaml masak: now I know that it's my editor. notepad++ (not cool, np, not cool)
13:47 jnthn notepad++ doesn't screw up my indenting :P
13:47 masak $dict_size is not really necessary, since it's a loop invariant that it tracks +%dictionary
13:48 isBEKaml jnthn: smart indents seems to do it. I think it got confused between 8 and 4 char tabs.
13:48 jnthn Anything with smart in the name usually isn't... :)
13:48 masak any technology... what jnthn said.
13:49 isBEKaml jnthn: so I'll warn others about smartcards. :P
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13:49 masak we don't call them that here. :)
13:50 masak we just call them "cards".
13:50 isBEKaml masak: hey, they carry that big label "SMART CARDS"!
13:51 isBEKaml calling them "cards" would confuse people. :)
13:51 masak ours don't.
13:51 masak guess we're too smart to label them that :P
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13:52 jnthn Yeah. We'd never give them some funny name like yoyo card... :)
13:53 masak jnthn: that was an eerily prescient move, IMO. sometimes the system is up, sometimes down...
13:53 jnthn masak: That was *exactly* my first thought when I saw the name :D
13:53 masak (it's our local train and bus traffic here in southern Sweden)
13:53 masak http://www.skanetrafiken.se/templa​tes/InformationPage.aspx?id=26853
13:54 isBEKaml yoyo card for bus/train ticketing system in .se?
13:54 masak aye.
13:54 jnthn To be fair...the machines that update the cards, sell tickets etc actually *are* much more reliable, in my experience anyway, than the trains themselves :)
13:54 masak no doubt.
13:54 jnthn Which is quite amazing given they run Windows CE :P
13:55 masak funnest thing I've managed to do so far with the machines was to try to refill a limited-time summer offer card.
13:55 masak produced a number of "null" values in various fields in the machine.
13:55 jnthn :D
13:55 masak but it did survive.
13:55 moritz though when I travelled to Perl and missed the first connection, the vending machine told me "no connections found"
13:56 jnthn d'oh
13:56 jnthn That's one of those times when you really hope it's wrong.
13:56 masak that's just a statement about the vending machine... :)
13:56 moritz so I went into the customer service office, and their computer found one
13:57 isBEKaml .oO(moritz usually finds a connection. He worked on DBIsh, no? )
13:57 masak :P
13:57 jnthn moritz: Still no home internets?
13:57 moritz jnthn: no
13:57 jnthn awww
13:58 * masak hugs moritz
13:58 moritz it seems that the new internet connection uses VDSL, and our modem only supports ADSL.*
13:58 moritz so, new router ordered
13:58 masak isBEKaml: nice to have you back. I hear there are 80-ish testneeded RT tickets... :)
13:58 moritz with a bit of luck it'll arrive on Saturday; with bad luck it'll be Monday
13:59 * jnthn crosses fingers
13:59 FROGGS moritz: sad that you dont live neer to me, I have some modems lying around...
13:59 isBEKaml masak: testneeded? I'll look in.. :)
14:00 moritz FROGGS: and can they speak VDSL?
14:01 masak there's a handy testneeded url somewhere, but I don't know where...
14:01 moritz FROGGS: most can't, and those that do are expensive-ish
14:01 moritz rakudo.de/testneeded iirc
14:01 jnthn https://rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Search/Simple​.html?Query=%20%20%28%20%20Status%20=%20%27ne​w%27%20OR%20Status%20=%20%27open%27%20%29%20A​ND%20Queue%20=%20%27perl6%27%20AND%20%27CF.{Tag}%27%20LIKE%20%27%testneeded%%27
14:01 jnthn er, moritz wins :)
14:01 isBEKaml jnthn: do you usually have this long url somewhere?
14:01 jnthn isBEKaml: Open in a browser tab that I've had open for like 5 months or something :)
14:02 isBEKaml jnthn: I just found out my muscle memory typed in rakudo.do than rakudo.de. :P
14:03 FROGGS moritz: I've got a dlink modem that does adsl2+ (up to 24mbit/s), it looks like VDSL2 is the same standard
14:03 masak isBEKaml: [Coke]++ has done a nice job closing some of these in the past few days. it's nice to see that queue shrink.
14:03 FROGGS moritz: so even if you ordered >24mbit, it should work at 24mbit/s
14:04 isBEKaml masak: some of them are NPMCA bugs, can we close them?
14:05 masak don't think so.
14:05 jnthn NPMCA ones should even get a test to check they do what they're supposed to do or that they give a good error, possibly adding a typed exception along the way.
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14:06 moritz FROGGS: oh, that's interesting
14:06 moritz FROGGS: then tonight I'll call the telekom technicians and complain again :-)
14:06 * jnthn takes another look at RT#112626
14:08 masak https://rt.perl.org/rt3/Tic​ket/Display.html?id=112626
14:08 moritz that's the one that blocks colomon++'s ABC module from running on rakudo, iirc
14:08 jnthn yeah
14:08 masak funny to see ufo in a bug report ;)
14:09 isBEKaml masak: the lzw entry with @nums>>.chr.map: { * xx 2 } led to too many Whatever<foo> entries.
14:09 Woodi ok, I have few (native)bindings and want to move them to module.pm. so module namename { ...  } and then *always* namename::sub_name( ... ) ? or with class make methods to  every native sub ?
14:09 isBEKaml masak: so I just reduced it to @nums>>.chr.map: { $^a xx 2 }
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14:09 masak isBEKaml: that's because you did both {} and *
14:09 masak isBEKaml: I did () and *
14:10 masak isBEKaml: * implies {} already.
14:10 jnthn Woodi: Or mark them "is export", so a "use" statement will import them.
14:10 Woodi ok. thanx again :)
14:10 isBEKaml masak: so * usable only in a blockoid. Whatever blockoid. I see...
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14:12 Woodi btw. there is some thing that could be put into FAQ. technical like: Data::Dumper answer and .base(x) and few more
14:13 masak isBEKaml: any expression containing * as a term turns into a closure, auto-creating {} around it, and turning the *s into $^a, $^b, etc. (conceptually)
14:13 masak Woodi: what FAQ about .base(x)? I haven't heard that one.
14:14 isBEKaml the nascent faq.perl6.org, probably.
14:14 masak yes, but what is the question people frequently ask about .base(x)?
14:14 Woodi masak: I am sure you answered it few times probably :)
14:15 masak maybe so, but what is it?
14:15 isBEKaml Woodi: do you mean that we can do :8(x) :10(x) :16(x) and others?
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14:15 masak rn: say Inf.base(16)
14:15 p6eval niecza v22-32-gee5dcf1: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Unable to resolve method base in type Num␤  at /tmp/ogVolikEst line 1 (mainline @ 3) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 4211 (ANON @ 3) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 4212 (module-CORE @ 578) ␤  at /home/p…
14:15 p6eval ..rakudo c82d10: OUTPUT«Type check failed in assignment to '$int_part'; expected 'Int' but got 'Failure'␤  in method base at src/gen/CORE.setting:2920␤  in block  at /tmp/teecyNeIC5:1␤␤»
14:15 masak rn: say 16.base(Inf)
14:15 p6eval niecza v22-32-gee5dcf1: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: base must be between 2 and 36, got Inf␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 1443 (die @ 5) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 842 (Int.base @ 6) ␤  at /tmp/_sApkhBW_U line 1 (mainline @ 3) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niec…
14:15 p6eval ..rakudo c82d10: OUTPUT«base must be between 2 and 36, got Inf␤  in method gist at src/gen/CORE.setting:10149␤  in sub say at src/gen/CORE.setting:7460␤  in block  at /tmp/CbpqvO0iRC:1␤␤»
14:16 Woodi isBEKaml: hmm, I was looking and found only faq with political q&a's
14:16 masak Woodi: what do people often ask about .base(x)?
14:16 masak I'm curious.
14:16 jnthn .oO( who are it belong to? )
14:16 isBEKaml Woodi: political questions? I don't understand, I only found language and general questions there.
14:17 Woodi sec pls :)
14:17 colomon jnthn++ # RT#112626
14:17 masak r: my $pls = 1; say sec($pls)
14:17 p6eval rakudo c82d10: OUTPUT«1.85081571768093␤»
14:17 masak r: my $pls = 1; say sec $pls # :)
14:17 p6eval rakudo c82d10: OUTPUT«1.85081571768093␤»
14:17 * isBEKaml groans
14:17 Woodi first result on google :)  http://www.perl6.org/archive/faq.html
14:18 Woodi not quite political but not technical either
14:18 xdbr joined #perl6
14:18 masak Woodi: my question wasn't "where is the FAQ?". my question was "what is it that people are asking about .base(x)?"
14:18 Woodi sec pls
14:18 isBEKaml masak: no, no no....  :)
14:18 skids joined #perl6
14:18 masak r: my $pls = 1; say tan $pls # :)
14:19 p6eval rakudo c82d10: OUTPUT«1.5574077246549␤»
14:19 Woodi masak: from 2009 probably: 20:59 < LlamaRider> I couldn't find info on switching number systems, hex/oct/binary in Perl6 and what does mean for the types
14:19 Woodi and it is frequently asked question on that channel :)
14:19 masak if you say so.
14:20 isBEKaml do people read logs from the waybackmachine to judge language usability?
14:20 masak so the question wasn't about .base(x) (which I think is fairly straightforward, myself), the question was about how to represent numbers in binary, octal, and hexadecimal in Perl 6 source?
14:21 Woodi masak: 20:59 < moritz> nom: say 1234.base(16)  :)
14:22 Woodi and another "is there Data::Dumper in Perl6 available maybe ?" :)
14:22 Woodi masak: 21:00 < LlamaRider> seriously now...
14:22 isBEKaml .oO (is Woodi now a collage artist? )
14:23 GlitchMr joined #perl6
14:23 Woodi isBEKaml: hmm, I collect jokes if it qualifies as art...
14:24 GlitchMr return 1 if $n < 2;
14:24 GlitchMr fact($n - 1) * $n;
14:24 GlitchMr oops
14:24 GlitchMr Accidental paste of wrong thing
14:24 GlitchMr "is there Data::Dumper in Perl6 available maybe ?"
14:24 GlitchMr Isn't it called .perl?
14:25 PerlJam or .pretty
14:25 PerlJam (probably still conjectural, but I like it :)
14:25 Woodi yes GlitchMr :)
14:26 [particle] joined #perl6
14:27 masak PerlJam: I thought .pretty ended up being spelled .gist
14:28 PerlJam oh, maybe so.
14:28 PerlJam They occupy different areas of my brain if so.
14:33 isBEKaml Woodi: I was referring to how you paste content from backlogs to add to conversation. Sticky paste things. :)
14:33 isBEKaml masak: gist updated.
14:34 GlitchMr perl6: gist [1, 2, 3]
14:34 p6eval rakudo c82d10, niecza v22-32-gee5dcf1:  ( no output )
14:34 GlitchMr perl6: say gist [1, 2, 3]
14:34 p6eval rakudo c82d10, niecza v22-32-gee5dcf1: OUTPUT«1 2 3␤»
14:36 GlitchMr This is the reason I don't see reason for .gist
14:36 isBEKaml r: [1,2,3].pretty.say;
14:36 p6eval rakudo c82d10: OUTPUT«No such method 'pretty' for invocant of type 'Array'␤  in block  at /tmp/7Olv2ElDS2:1␤␤»
14:37 GlitchMr Empty array looks identically to empty string
14:37 isBEKaml r: [1,2,3].perl.say;
14:37 p6eval rakudo c82d10: OUTPUT«[1, 2, 3]␤»
14:37 GlitchMr I really don't know what is .gist useful for
14:37 GlitchMr For user, the is a .Str method. For debugging, there is a .perl method.
14:38 dalek Perlito: daea592 | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | / (13 files):
14:38 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - add more "use strict"
14:38 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/​Perlito/commit/daea592131
14:38 bbkr_ gist word is some kind of acronym?
14:38 moritz GlitchMr: if you have a large match object, you'll probably see that .Str isn't very informative, and .perl gives way too much information to be usful (most of the time)
14:38 moritz bbkr_: no, a gist is some kind of summary
14:39 masak isBEKaml: (0 .. ^$dict_size) better written (^$dict_size)
14:40 Woodi NativeCall could have some sugar for C '&' oprator. Now this need to be used for passing **ptr :  my OpaquePointer $ptr; my $array := CArray[OpaquePointer].new(); $array[0] = $ptr; ... here pass array to function; $ptr = $array[0];
14:40 masak isBEKaml: and I still think you don't even need to maintain that variable, as all it does is track the number of entries in %dictionary, which you can easily get through +%dictionary.
14:40 Woodi naybe assigment to $array can be avoided...
14:40 GlitchMr Ok, regular expression case makes sense
14:40 masak r: %d = <foo 1 bar 2 baz 3>; say +%d; %d<blah> = 4; say +%d
14:40 p6eval rakudo c82d10: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Variable %d is not declared␤at /tmp/bZHQaqquVE:1␤»
14:41 masak r: my %d = <foo 1 bar 2 baz 3>; say +%d; %d<blah> = 4; say +%d
14:41 p6eval rakudo c82d10: OUTPUT«3␤4␤»
14:41 masak isBEKaml: so ditch $dict_size, and just do +%dictionary on line 16.
14:41 isBEKaml masak: hmm, I knew I didn't have to do 0..^dict_size. :)
14:42 nyuszika7h joined #perl6
14:43 isBEKaml masak: does, %dictionary.elems do the same thing as +%dictionary?
14:43 moritz aye
14:43 nyuszika7h joined #perl6
14:44 isBEKaml moritz: danke
14:47 [Coke] I am pretty sure that .perl is for computers, .gist is for people, and ~ is the default. (not sure which market the default is for.)
14:47 masak stringy people.
14:47 isBEKaml or stingy ones.
14:48 Woodi isBEKaml: http://pastebin.com/JDe4icdc :)
14:50 dalek Perlito: dcde2e3 | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | / (4 files):
14:50 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - add more "use strict"
14:50 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/​Perlito/commit/dcde2e3dd3
14:53 dalek Perlito: 1395266 | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | TODO-perlito5:
14:53 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - TODO update
14:53 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/​Perlito/commit/1395266e58
14:54 [Coke] Is there a reason aside from inertia for rakudo to stick with RT?
14:54 [Coke] (note: this is a HUGE reason that should absolutely be respected.)
14:54 isBEKaml [Coke]: I know I asked this question too. The answer(back then) was: I know it sucks, but I can live with it.
14:54 PerlJam [Coke]: what would you propose as an alternative?
14:55 moritz [Coke]: apart from inertia, just the desire to open tickets by email
14:55 isBEKaml why not github?
14:55 moritz [Coke]: which other bug trackers can do, but github can't, and parrot's what-was-it-name installation couldn't do it well either
14:55 isBEKaml trac
14:55 moritz right
14:56 masak an intricate autopun: https://twitter.com/jackson​h/status/269046172239417345
14:57 masak [Coke]: I know others hate RT search, but I actually love it. I'd call it codependency if it weren't that I actually reliably find stuff with it. and as far as I know, I can explain how to others.
14:58 masak [Coke]: so for me (a frequent user of RT), the reason to stick with it is "it works".
14:58 moritz masak: is it really an autopun? it's not obvious to me
14:58 arnsholt Your relationship with RT sounds like me and TeX/LaTeX =)
14:58 masak moritz: yes. it combines use and mention.
14:59 kaare_ joined #perl6
14:59 moritz masak: what does it use?
14:59 moritz (sorry, I know it sucks to explain jokes)
14:59 masak no prob. let's test this.
15:00 masak moritz: mention: ".mobi". use: "people who use this TLD on mobile platforms -- the target group of the .mobi TLD -- will actually have a harder time[, sort of defying the purpose]"
15:00 PerlJam isn't that more of a meta-use?
15:00 moritz masak: I don't see how it's a use
15:00 [Coke] The search is an issue. the fact that you can comment on tickets and no email is generated is painful. (we're not using RT as an internal/external tool like some do). I often have issues where I can only have one search going at a time. (testneeded versus all of perl6).
15:01 moritz masak: it would be a use if he mis-typed .mobi, or something
15:01 masak moritz, PerlJam: see your point.
15:01 masak "I meant to type .mobi, but it was too long and my mobile devide didn't accept a four-letter TLD..."
15:02 [Coke] I'm not pushing for a switch, I'm just wondering if there are reasons to stay other than that we've always been at war with Eurasia.
15:02 masak s/see your point/I see your point/
15:02 [Coke] but "it works and we use it" seems to be the prevailing thought. No worries.
15:03 PerlJam [Coke]: This war is the least-suffering war  :)
15:03 masak [Coke]: I use a lot of other issue trackers besides RT. none of them give me the warm fuzzies like RT does. I think the warm fuzzies come from email reporting and flexible search.
15:04 PerlJam masak: either you've found the zen of RT or you have more RT-fu than most.  I always find RT awkward.
15:05 [Coke] I would argue with your use of the word flexible, but understand your meaning.
15:05 masak note that I didn't say "obvious" or "simple". :)
15:07 masak PerlJam: fwiw, how to find a Perl 6 ticket: (1) search for the most relevant/precise term that's bound to be in the ticket title, (2) switch to "Advanced search", and add "queue: perl6" to the search, (3) profit!
15:08 masak it also helps if (0) masak submitted it, because then the ticket will actually have whatever term in the subject line. :)
15:08 Woodi arnsholt: maybe you have idea how to push NULL in place of CArray[type] ? some sugar for this or just CArray[type].new() ?
15:08 isBEKaml masak: RT feels like a duck barking at me. :P
15:08 PerlJam isBEKaml: hahaha
15:08 masak :D
15:08 PerlJam masak: ah ... (0) is, I think, the important bit.
15:08 jnthn Woodi: Just pass some type object, I think
15:09 jnthn Woodi: As in, pass CArray[type] itself as the argument
15:09 Woodi k
15:09 jnthn Type objects should become nulls.
15:11 stopbit joined #perl6
15:17 isBEKaml r: my @foo = 101..107; my %props = @foo>>.chr.map(* xx 2); %props.say;
15:17 p6eval rakudo c82d10: OUTPUT«No such method 'count' for invocant of type 'List'␤  in method reify at src/gen/CORE.setting:5467␤  in method reify at src/gen/CORE.setting:5390␤  in method reify at src/gen/CORE.setting:5390␤  in method gimme at src/gen/CORE.setting:5768␤  in method eager at src/g…
15:21 isBEKaml r: my @foo = 101..107; my %props = @foo>>.chr.map: { $^a xx 2}; %props.say;
15:21 p6eval rakudo c82d10: OUTPUT«("e" => "e", "f" => "f", "g" => "g", "h" => "h", "i" => "i", "j" => "j", "k" => "k").hash␤»
15:21 isBEKaml Was the first approach wrong in any way?
15:23 jnthn Looks like xx doesn't auto-curry
15:23 moritz no, because xx * means the same as xx Inf
15:24 jnthn ah, that's a good reason
15:24 jnthn also xx is a bit special 'cus it thunks its LHS
15:25 isBEKaml then, surely the error message is misleading.
15:26 jnthn Maybe map should only take a Callable.
15:26 isBEKaml maybe something like "no term found to repeat" is more useful given the special nature of xx.
15:28 jnthn The problem wasn't with xx
15:28 jnthn The xx did its thing fine, then map got a List.
15:29 isBEKaml do we still distinguish List and Array? I thought we gave that up...
15:30 jnthn No, we never gave that up. Seq is what went away.
15:35 dalek nqp: b571803 | jnthn++ | src/6model/serialization.c:
15:35 dalek nqp: Detect object conflicts during deserialization.
15:35 dalek nqp:
15:35 dalek nqp: If two pre-compiled modules both tried to replace an object or STable
15:35 dalek nqp: with their own updated view of it, the latest one would always just
15:35 dalek nqp: win. This creates the "disappearing symbol" issue. This patch detects
15:35 dalek nqp: that it's going on and complains, rather than leaving a weird failure
15:35 dalek nqp: later on (the actual fix will be to replace the exception thrown with
15:35 dalek nqp: a hook to allow the module loader to do some smarter merging).
15:35 dalek nqp:
15:35 dalek nqp: Breaks no NQP tests or Rakudo spectests; does correctly pick up the
15:35 dalek nqp: RT#112626 case.
15:35 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/b5718034e4
15:36 shinobicl joined #perl6
15:36 isBEKaml jnthn: I vaguely remember Pm's docs talking about losing the differences between List and Array. I see that things have changed. :)
15:37 * isBEKaml is happy reading rakudo source after a long gap.
15:38 moritz isBEKaml: an Array ist just a LIst where every element is a Scalar container
15:38 moritz (unless you bind to an array element, in which case it might not be a container anymore)
15:38 isBEKaml moritz: Is that the mutable/immutable difference ?
15:39 isBEKaml moritz: List -> immutable, Array -> mutable.
15:40 moritz isBEKaml: well, Array elements are always replacable. List elements only if they happen to be containers
15:43 isBEKaml moritz: I see, thank you.
15:44 * PerlJam reminds everyone of the advent calendar again.
15:44 PerlJam https://github.com/perl6/mu/tre​e/master/misc/perl6advent-2012
15:45 GlitchMr Now, where is dalek?
15:46 dalek mu: 38786a1 | (Конрад Боровски)++ | misc/perl6advent-2012/topic-brainstorming:
15:46 dalek mu: Change "Rosettacode" to "Rosetta Code"
15:46 dalek mu: review: https://github.com/perl6/mu/commit/38786a1a19
15:46 GlitchMr oh, ok
15:47 jnthn eek, I'm the only person who signed up for any slots!
15:47 moritz jnthn: don't worry, I will too
15:47 jnthn phew :)
15:47 Su-Shee left #perl6
15:47 jnthn But I hope there'll be more than two of us. :)
15:47 PerlJam jnthn: I'll probably do a couple too, I'm just more of a last-minute kind of guy :)
15:47 jnthn OK :)
15:47 GlitchMr Perhaps I could actually write an article about sub MAIN
15:48 jnthn +!
15:48 jnthn er, +1
15:48 moritz I think we had that in the previous years
15:49 GlitchMr We did?
15:49 GlitchMr I will look, ok
15:49 moritz http://perl6advent.wordpress.com/2010/12/02/day-2-​interacting-with-the-command-line-with-main-subs/
15:49 GlitchMr Well, too bad
15:50 PerlJam Surely there's something new to cover in that arena?
15:50 GlitchMr I actually think that sub MAIN is one of best Perl 6 features
15:50 GlitchMr It allows you to make scripts quickly.
15:50 domidumont joined #perl6
15:53 PerlJam could talk about  sub MAIN ( :foo($bar) ) { ... }
15:54 masak sure.
15:57 domidumont joined #perl6
15:58 dalek mu: c1f455c | (Carl Mäsak)++ | misc/perl6advent-2012/schedule:
15:58 dalek mu: [perl6advent-2012/schedule] claim four spots
15:58 dalek mu: review: https://github.com/perl6/mu/commit/c1f455c3e2
16:02 jnthn \o/
16:02 jnthn r: say 25 - 7
16:02 p6eval rakudo c82d10: OUTPUT«18␤»
16:04 GlitchMr glitchmr@feather ~> perl6 -e 'sub MAIN (*@blah) {say "ok"}' a
16:04 GlitchMr ok
16:04 GlitchMr glitchmr@feather ~> perl6 -e 'sub MAIN (*@blah) {say "ok"}' --
16:04 GlitchMr Usage:
16:04 GlitchMr -e '...' [<blah> ...]
16:04 GlitchMr Is it a bug?
16:05 GlitchMr -- should work as end of argument list, shouldn't it?
16:06 GlitchMr glitchmr@feather ~> perl6 -e 'sub MAIN { %_.perl.say }' --
16:06 GlitchMr ("-" => Bool::True).hash
16:06 GlitchMr - option? Why?
16:07 tadzik say about what?@:)
16:08 jnthn r: =pod
16:08 p6eval rakudo c82d10: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Preceding context expects a term, but found infix = instead␤at /tmp/PuDUJrM8wj:1␤»
16:08 jnthn tadzik: That :)
16:09 tadzik yeah, bare =pod is amroght
16:09 tadzik a'right *
16:09 tadzik like =head1 for example
16:10 tadzik r: =begin pod
16:10 p6eval rakudo c82d10: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Preceding context expects a term, but found infix = instead␤at /tmp/kcKlWjHGkq:1␤»
16:10 tadzik hm, I thought that dies in a nicer way
16:10 moritz r: =begin pod␤
16:10 p6eval rakudo c82d10: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤=begin without matching =end␤at /tmp/06PvqPrGAg:1␤»
16:10 tadzik maybe p6eval's fault
16:10 tadzik ah, there we go
16:10 tadzik moritz++
16:10 moritz it's the missing newline, not p6eval ;-)
16:11 kresike bye folks
16:11 masak r: =pod␤
16:11 p6eval rakudo c82d10:  ( no output )
16:11 masak so, no bug.
16:11 * masak closes ticket
16:12 tadzik jnthn: is today's nqp commit possibly fixine the Bailador bug I sent you once?
16:12 jnthn tadzik: Very possibly.
16:12 tadzik \o/
16:12 tadzik can't wait to get back home
16:13 tadzik the commit message is promising :)
16:13 isBEKaml r: say $_!X::a;
16:13 p6eval rakudo c82d10: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Cannot call private method 'a' on package X because it does not trust GLOBAL␤at /tmp/GrO7Ezc_sX:1␤»
16:14 pmurias jnthn: should contextuals be renamed in nqp to dynamic variables?
16:14 jnthn tadzik: oh, wait...that commit won't fix it
16:14 jnthn tadzik: I'm working on a fix.
16:15 jnthn tadzik: That commit is just about detecting the underlying problem. Now I can reliably detect it, I'm working on the stuff to deal with it.
16:15 jnthn pmurias: Probably
16:15 * [Coke] gets an idea for a perl6 module and sees it was done 2 years ago.
16:15 masak GlitchMr: feel free to submit a bug report about --
16:15 * [Coke] will catch up eventually.
16:15 masak [Coke]: what module, ooc?
16:15 jnthn pmurias: Just dates back to when we called them contextuals ;)
16:16 [Coke] masak: one of yours.
16:16 * masak thought so ;)
16:16 masak then the chance is high that it needs refreshing or de-dusting.
16:17 tadzik what modue, ooc? :)
16:17 tadzik jnthn: aha, I see
16:18 tadzik so atm it just complains. Still good :)
16:20 [Coke] masak: is yapsi dead?
16:20 masak very dormant, at least.
16:21 masak I've learned enough about compilers since last touching it that it would probably benefit from another complete rewrite. :)
16:21 spider-mario joined #perl6
16:22 [Coke] if I clone it, run "ufo && make", I see no yapsi. :(
16:22 masak hm.
16:22 masak there should be one in bin/yapsi
16:22 [Coke] er, sorry: Could not find Yapsi in any of: /home/coke/.perl6/lib, /home/coke/sandbox/installed_rakudo/install​/lib/parrot/4.7.0-devel/languages/perl6/lib
16:23 masak you probably still have to set PERL6LIB to ./lib
16:23 masak I usually do.
16:23 isBEKaml [Coke]: IIRC, there was a make install step or atleast one step that would copy over Yapsi.pm to your PERL6LIB.
16:24 [Coke] masak: yup, just tried that; nice if that was in the readme.
16:24 masak I'd apply that patch.
16:24 [Coke] isBEKaml: I'd rather run it locally if I'm going to do something evil with it.
16:25 perigrin joined #perl6
16:25 GlitchMr https://rt.perl.org/rt3/Publi​c/Bug/Display.html?id=115744
16:25 isBEKaml [Coke]: I don't understand, read your msg like 5 times and see no relation to what I said. :)
16:26 dalek Perlito: 5f528ed | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | TODO-perlito5:
16:26 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - parser - more TODO special cases
16:26 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/​Perlito/commit/5f528ed8b2
16:26 masak [Coke]: Yapsi was very much -Ofun. this is one of the most tongue-in-cheek things I've ever written: https://github.com/masak/yapsi/b​lob/master/doc/announce/2011.03
16:29 isBEKaml masak: Yeah, I went over your announce messages and sort of wondered at the striking references to HHGTTG.
16:29 masak :)
16:30 isBEKaml masak: At first, it read like the announce made to destroy earth for the super highway on the notice board at the end of the galaxy or a longer vogon poetry. :P
16:31 masak I wonder if I wrote this before or after I had read "Quicksilver" by Neal Stephenson.
16:34 isBEKaml Where would tests for #115308 go? S32-exception, I believe?
16:35 dalek roast: b5f8ab8 | GlitchMr++ | S06-other/main-usage.t:
16:35 dalek roast: Add tests for RT #115744
16:35 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/b5f8ab87eb
16:35 moritz isBEKaml: S32-exception/misc.t, or (preferrably) S12-methods/private.t
16:37 isBEKaml moritz: okay
16:37 * [Coke] points jnthn at the mailing list for a patch.
16:38 [Coke] nwc10++ # ooh, 2 patches today.
16:39 jnthn yeah, just looking at it
16:39 jnthn nwc10: about?
16:40 [Coke] +1 on the optimize patch from me, as ISTR that's bitten me at one point.
16:40 jnthn yeah, I'm +1 to that too
16:41 [Coke] seen au
16:41 aloha au was last seen in #perl6 2 days 6 hours ago joining the channel.
16:48 gdey joined #perl6
16:53 dalek nqp: 7a24af6 | jnthn++ | src/ (6 files):
16:53 dalek nqp: Make handlers for repossession conflicts possible.
16:53 dalek nqp:
16:53 dalek nqp: This allows a language where such issues may arise to provide its own
16:53 dalek nqp: handler for them. If it doesn't, we just flag up the error as before.
16:53 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/7a24af6367
16:57 dalek roast: 1ef7dda | isBEKaml++ | S12-methods/private.t:
16:57 dalek roast: Added test for RT #115308
16:57 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/1ef7ddacc8
16:57 isBEKaml moritz: please check my last commit. I'm not sure that's correct.
16:59 fgomez joined #perl6
17:05 dalek rakudo/nom: 55912f8 | jnthn++ | tools/build/NQP_REVISION:
17:05 dalek rakudo/nom: Bump NQP_REVISION for deserialization improvements.
17:05 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/55912f8659
17:05 dalek rakudo/nom: bfa208d | jnthn++ | src/Perl6/ (2 files):
17:05 dalek rakudo/nom: Handle Stash deserialization conflicts.
17:05 dalek rakudo/nom:
17:05 dalek rakudo/nom: This fixes RT#112626, and probably a bunch of other disappearing
17:05 dalek rakudo/nom: symbol in pre-compilation issues.
17:05 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/bfa208d4ec
17:08 isBEKaml rn: class A { state $b; };
17:08 p6eval niecza v22-32-gee5dcf1: OUTPUT«Potential difficulties:â�¤  $b is declared but not used at /tmp/fAs9b7g2pS line 1:â�¤------> [32mclass A { state [33mâ��[31m$b; };[0mâ�¤â�¤Â»
17:08 p6eval ..rakudo c82d10:  ( no output )
17:10 dalek roast: d0b57ce | isBEKaml++ | S12-class/attributes.t:
17:10 dalek roast: Added test for RT #114234
17:10 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/d0b57ceed2
17:10 Guest58684 joined #perl6
17:11 isBEKaml r: :(::T $x);
17:11 p6eval rakudo c82d10:  ( no output )
17:15 dalek roast: d20870d | isBEKaml++ | S12- (2 files):
17:15 dalek roast: Incremented plan count for two RT issues in previous commits.
17:15 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/d20870d0bc
17:19 jnthn std: sub infix:<> ( ){};
17:19 p6eval std 04216b1: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤Null operator is not allowed at /tmp/p0nC7uP2Sy line 1:â�¤------> [32msub infix:<>[33mâ��[31m ( ){};[0mâ�¤Other potential difficulties:â�¤  Pair with <> really means a Nil value, not null string; use :('') to represent the null string,â�¤  or…
17:20 jnthn ah...that's how it gets the better error...
17:20 jnthn std: :<>
17:20 p6eval std 04216b1: OUTPUT«Potential difficulties:â�¤  Pair with <> really means a Nil value, not null string; use :('') to represent the null string,â�¤  or :() to represent Nil more accurately at /tmp/zK3fncqXkh line 1:â�¤------> [32m:<>[33mâ��[31m<EOL>[0mâ�¤ok 00:00 41mâ�¤Â»
17:20 masak isBEKaml++ # writing tests
17:21 jnthn masak: bfa208d may well fix the pre-comp issue you ran into with Adventure::Engine.
17:22 jnthn phenny: suggest to tadzik that a module test run may be an idea, now I've fixed are pre-comp bug (hopefully without breaking anything else)
17:22 jnthn phenny: tell tadzik that a module test run may be a good idea, now I've fixed are pre-comp bug (hopefully without breaking anything else)
17:22 phenny jnthn: I'll pass that on when tadzik is around.
17:22 tadzik jnthn: I'm on it
17:22 phenny tadzik: 17:22Z <jnthn> tell tadzik that a module test run may be a good idea, now I've fixed are pre-comp bug (hopefully without breaking anything else)
17:22 jnthn \o/
17:22 tadzik phenny: why, thank you
17:23 tadzik good that I have fresh test results from ~monday
17:23 jnthn phenny is sufficiently smart, sometimes I forget I can't put <anything> <name> :)
17:24 masak jnthn: yay
17:24 masak jnthn: I'll try later tonight.
17:26 felher Any comments on https://gist.github.com/4079921 as a translation of/for http://rosettacode.org/wiki​/Bulls_and_cows/Player#Perl ?
17:27 MayDaniel joined #perl6
17:27 tadzik wow, I just got a segfault running panda
17:27 tadzik awesome :)
17:28 masak reproducible?
17:28 tadzik yes
17:28 tadzik but seems to have stopped after I removed /home/tadzik/src/parrot/install/li​b/4.8.0-devel/languages/perl6/site
17:29 masak felher: looks very nice.
17:30 masak my $loose = +$a.grep: { $_ == any @$b };
17:30 tadzik felher: that looks nice :)
17:30 masak could be shortened to +$a.grep: any @$b
17:30 tadzik ok, reproducible again
17:31 tadzik after bootstraping panda on rakudo HEAD, it always segfaults
17:31 jnthn fuck.
17:31 jnthn tadzik: It certainly isn't always segfaulting?
17:31 felher masak: of course, smartmatching. Thanks a lot :)
17:31 tadzik https://gist.github.com/4079963
17:31 jnthn tadzik: As in, simple perl6 -e "say 42" works?
17:31 tadzik panda bootstraped ok
17:32 tadzik that's a lot of perl6 already ran
17:32 jnthn Hm
17:32 tadzik the segfault is in the new-ish code
17:32 tadzik Serialization_deserialize
17:32 jnthn shit.
17:32 jnthn :/
17:32 tadzik :(
17:32 masak felher: the rest looks really nice.
17:33 jnthn The backtrace doesn't even have line numbers...guess it's not a debug build?
17:33 tadzik no :/
17:33 tadzik debug builds are awfully slow on this machine
17:33 tadzik I can do it though
17:33 tadzik it'll take ~30 minutes I think
17:33 tadzik do want?
17:33 felher masak: happy to hear that :)
17:34 dalek roast: 0b90fb4 | isBEKaml++ | S06-signature/type-capture.t:
17:34 dalek roast: Added test for RT #114216
17:34 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/0b90fb4b54
17:34 jnthn tadzik: Seeing if I can reproduce it here
17:34 tadzik ok
17:34 tadzik steps: bootstrap panda, run 'panda help' or whatever
17:35 masak felher: I tend to inline functions in their innermost relevant block nowadays. people's tastes vary, though.
17:36 Vlavv` joined #perl6
17:36 masak felher: I note that if you do that with score-correct (put it in the repeat while loop), it only needs one parameter, not four.
17:36 felher masak: this is an awsome idea :)
17:36 masak and read-score would need none.
17:37 jnthn *sigh* This is why I put off looking at pre-comp bugs. It's always hassle.
17:37 * masak .oO( first he breaks rakudo, now he complains? sheesh. ) :P
17:37 Chillance joined #perl6
17:37 tadzik hehe, that's about my stance about panda's bootstrap.pl
17:37 tadzik No! Don't touch this! Please! :(
17:38 masak hammer time.
17:38 tadzik Panda Stahp
17:38 isBEKaml .oO(alpha code don't play well with fire?)
17:39 masak "at least it works." oh wait.
17:41 jnthn how the hell is that thing NULL...
17:42 xilo joined #perl6
17:42 isBEKaml jnthn: just like my days back last year, "Of all the exceptions/errors out there, why did I have to get a friggin' NPE????"
17:44 grondilu joined #perl6
17:44 grondilu rn: my $x = 3; $x [R/]= 2; # meaning $x = $x R/ 2;
17:45 p6eval niecza v22-32-gee5dcf1:  ( no output )
17:45 p6eval ..rakudo bfa208: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Preceding context expects a term, but found infix = instead␤at /tmp/peySrlC51n:1␤»
17:45 grondilu r: my $x = 3; $x [R/]= 2; say $x;
17:45 p6eval rakudo bfa208: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Preceding context expects a term, but found infix = instead␤at /tmp/e9_RzXEwIm:1␤»
17:45 grondilu n: my $x = 3; $x [R/]= 2; say $x;
17:45 p6eval niecza v22-32-gee5dcf1: OUTPUT«0.66666666666666663␤»
17:45 grondilu n: my $x = 3; $x [R/]= 2 += 1; say $x;
17:46 p6eval niecza v22-32-gee5dcf1: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Writing to readonly scalar␤  at /tmp/iVbUO53CVY line 1 (mainline @ 3) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 4211 (ANON @ 3) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 4212 (module-CORE @ 578) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/li…
17:46 isBEKaml r: my $x = 3; $x R/= 2; say $x;
17:46 p6eval rakudo bfa208: OUTPUT«Cannot assign to a non-container␤  in block  at src/gen/CORE.setting:12308␤  in block  at src/gen/CORE.setting:12320␤  in block  at /tmp/3EQ00lUCDT:1␤␤»
17:46 grondilu n: my $x = 3; ($x [R/]= 2) += 1; say $x;
17:46 p6eval niecza v22-32-gee5dcf1: OUTPUT«1.6666666666666667␤»
17:46 jnthn Well, the bothersome thing is that it deferences the same thing later on, right after the code I added...
17:48 felher masak: I updated the version to declare the subs within the scope of repeat :)
17:48 felher masak: I think you are right. This looks neater :)
17:49 wk joined #perl6
17:51 masak felher: nice!
17:53 felher masak: ah, and since we have smartmatching and score-correct only has one argument left, one can shrink the ".= grep"-line :)
17:53 isBEKaml #114134 is an error originating in binder. does dies_ok fit the bill?
17:54 masak yeah :)
17:54 masak @candidates .= grep(&score-correct)
17:54 masak isBEKaml: should do, if the binding happens at runtime.
17:55 isBEKaml masak: nominal type check, unbound variable  - not compile time?
17:56 * masak looks
17:56 masak oh, that one.
17:58 masak no, that should be runtime, and should be perfectly testable with dies_ok.
17:59 [Coke] do we need "dies_with_isa" ?
17:59 [Coke] (or something much better named)
18:05 isBEKaml masak: I added two anyway. Hopefully, you or others can update it with a better test.
18:05 dalek roast: edf27d4 | isBEKaml++ | S32-exceptions/misc.t:
18:05 dalek roast: Added test for #114134
18:05 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/edf27d4634
18:08 benabik joined #perl6
18:10 isBEKaml g'night, #perl6! :)
18:11 [Coke] (or perhaps a multi of dies that takes an optional class)
18:11 [Coke] er, of dies_ok
18:14 pmurias jnthn: when do you plan to start porting nqp/rakudo to the jvm?
18:15 felher http://rosettacode.org/wiki/​Bulls_and_cows/Player#Perl_6
18:16 skids Is there a settled solution for using data file from t/ during tests -- e.g. how to find the path, given the cwd could be anywhere?
18:19 jnthn pmurias: I'm slowly chipping away at some initial design work.
18:22 wtw joined #perl6
18:23 wamba joined #perl6
18:29 * pmurias works on rakudo-js in a TDD manner, making things saner when it's required to pass tests ;)
18:30 jnthn :)
18:30 jnthn tadzik: OK, got it
18:30 tadzik \o/
18:30 jnthn Well
18:30 jnthn Got a fix.
18:30 dalek nqp: a827893 | jnthn++ | src/6model/serialization.c:
18:30 dalek nqp: Fix double-repossession.
18:30 dalek nqp:
18:30 dalek nqp: Not completely sure why that can happen just yet, but this should be
18:30 dalek nqp: enough to make it not be a problem.
18:30 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/a827893c9e
18:30 pmurias jnthn: that means we need to expand the nqp test suit at some point :)
18:30 jnthn Still wouldn't mind figuring out exactly why it's needed...
18:31 jnthn pmurias: I'm most certainly fine with expanding the NQP test suite. I know we're probably falling somewhat short on having good test coverage.
18:38 nwc10 jnthn: I'm sort of about, but I'm not sure when I'm going to fall asleep
18:39 jnthn nwc10: OK. The patches look good; on the multi one I'd have been tempted to pass the graph nodes rather than pass info and the constraints, but it's not a big thing.
18:39 jnthn nwc10: Do you have a commit bit?
18:39 nwc10 no
18:39 jnthn Hm
18:40 jnthn Do I have to worry about CLA stuff? :)
18:40 jnthn As in, does the thing you already have with TPF for Perl 5 mean we're good?
18:40 nwc10 I don't know and I don't know.
18:41 pmurias .WHAT returns the type object?
18:41 jnthn nwc10: Did you ever sign a CLA for TPF, e.g. http://www.perlfoundation.org/​contributor_license_agreement ?
18:41 jnthn pmurias: yes
18:41 nwc10 no, I have never signed a CLA for TPF.
18:41 jnthn Ah.
18:42 jnthn Oh, maybe the Perl 5 and Perl 6 copyright work different...
18:42 nwc10 well, TPF doesn't hold the copyright on Perl 5
18:42 jnthn That'd explain why you've not done a TPF CLA...
18:43 PerlJam nwc10: in any case, it can't hurt to submit a CLA  :)  http://www.perlfoundation.org/​contributor_license_agreement
18:43 diakopter yes, it can hurt
18:43 PerlJam diakopter: how?
18:43 diakopter if the person doesn't want to
18:43 nwc10 it can hurt.
18:44 PerlJam oh, then don't.  that's a "doctor it hurts when I do this" situation.
18:44 diakopter no, it isn't; he wasn't complaining about something that already happened or is happening
18:45 diakopter he was trying to ascertain whether it would hurt.
18:46 am0c joined #perl6
18:46 ggoebel Uniqueness and Reference Immutability for Safe Parallelism: http://robjsoftware.org/2012/1​1/02/a-publication-in-public/
18:46 diakopter skimmed it; it was interesting to me
18:47 nwc10 jnthn: I'd not considered passing the nodes. It would drop the parameters to that function, which seems like a better idea
18:47 nwc10 as the long-ish parameter list was bugging me a bit
18:47 nwc10 looked ugly
18:47 jnthn nwc10: Yes, keeping it to the two was my thought.
18:48 nwc10 will (try to) do that tomorrow
18:49 jnthn OK. I can apply the other one.
18:49 nwc10 cool, thanks
18:49 dalek rakudo/nom: ac77f28 | jnthn++ | tools/build/NQP_REVISION:
18:49 dalek rakudo/nom: Bump NQP_REVISION to get SC fix.
18:49 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/ac77f28cb2
18:49 jnthn Thank *you*. :)
18:50 jnthn tadzik: Give it another go :)
18:50 nwc10 more general thought was that the C code in multidispatch.c seems to be doing three things:
18:50 nwc10 1) converting Rakudo (well Parrot) data structures descripting subroutines into the C structs
18:51 nwc10 2) sorting them
18:51 nwc10 3) managing the cache
18:51 nwc10 and right now it has to be in that order, because the sorting is done in C using the C structs
18:52 jnthn There's a 4) based on given arguments, choosing the candidate
18:52 jnthn and 5) doing compile-time analysis of a dispatch
18:52 jnthn :)
18:52 nwc10 and a fanatical loyalty to the pope?
18:53 masak :)
18:53 jnthn No, just ruthless efficiency :P
18:54 pmurias subclassing now works in nqp-js :)
18:54 nwc10 :-)
18:54 tadzik jnthn: yep, doesn't segfault anymore :)
18:54 jnthn phew
18:54 jnthn nwc10: 1, 2 and 5 are not performance sensitive
18:55 jnthn nwc10: 4 sorta is BUT if a cache hit happens can be dealt with very swiftly
18:55 nwc10 I'd not identified what is doing (5). But that doesn't matter (yet).
18:56 nwc10 I can see how (2) and (1) have to happen before (3), and (3) before (4)
18:56 jnthn (5) is Rakudo_md_ct_dispatch
18:56 nwc10 aha. As it says in its docs - *at compile time*
18:59 jnthn Need to pop out for 10 minutes...bbs
19:02 HarryS joined #perl6
19:05 sorenso joined #perl6
19:11 * jnthn back
19:32 sizz_ joined #perl6
19:34 sorear good * #perl6
19:38 hash_table joined #perl6
19:39 Guest58684 joined #perl6
19:44 fgomez joined #perl6
19:47 masak sorear! \o/
19:52 sorear masak! \o/
19:54 benabik joined #perl6
20:00 [Coke] skids: when running files in t/ your cwd is pretty much always "the directory above t"
20:02 HarryS joined #perl6
20:24 benabik joined #perl6
20:30 cognominal joined #perl6
20:32 pnu joined #perl6
20:34 jnthn tadzik: Did it do much beyond "not segfault"? :)
20:34 tadzik jnthn: emmentaler is still running :)
20:34 tadzik patience, that's just good ol' core2duo :)
20:36 jnthn tadzik++
20:37 tadzik I'll probably make it to the shop before it finishes :)
20:37 tadzik . o O ( I hope something breaks, so I can show off difftool )
20:37 jnthn What if it fixes something?
20:37 jnthn Then you can also show off difftool :P
20:38 tadzik oh, right, right :)
20:41 dalek rakudo/nom: c58f4ce | nicholas++ | tools/lib/NQP/Configure.pm:
20:41 dalek rakudo/nom: Using --parrot-option should override the default option of '--optimize'
20:41 dalek rakudo/nom:
20:41 dalek rakudo/nom: Otherwise, it's possible neither to call Parrot's Configure.pl without
20:41 dalek rakudo/nom: enabling optimizations, nor to change the value of the --optimize option.
20:41 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/c58f4ce8a1
20:41 dalek rakudo/nom: a41a483 | jnthn++ | docs/ChangeLog:
20:41 dalek rakudo/nom: Update ChangeLog.
20:41 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/a41a48389a
20:41 GlitchMr I wonder how fast Perl 6 would be on CPU like... let's say... Pentium 133MHz
20:44 xilo would take ages just to compile it
20:45 masak it would still need at least 1 GB of RAM.
20:45 masak preferably 1.5 GB.
20:50 sorear rakudo today would, sure
20:51 sorear howefully be the time the P133 comes out we'll be able to make a leaner implementation
21:02 tadzik :D
21:04 tadzik jnthn: breakages :( https://gist.github.com/4081246
21:04 tadzik oh, wait
21:04 sorear o/ tadzik
21:04 tadzik sorear: o/
21:04 tadzik jnthn: actually, https://gist.github.com/4081251
21:05 tadzik may be unrelated to new rakudo commits, but still a green light :)
21:08 jnthn tadzik: hah, diff'd the wrong way round :P
21:08 jnthn .koń? horse? :)
21:09 jnthn tadzik: Thanks for testing
21:09 jnthn I think Game::Crypt was one of the modules with issues
21:09 tadzik yes, .koń is a horse :)
21:09 jnthn Close to the Slovak word :)
21:10 tadzik .dupa was taken :P
21:10 Guest58684 joined #perl6
21:10 masak hey! watch the language! :)
21:11 tadzik :P
21:11 * masak .oO( Polish that turd )
21:12 jnthn Well, I did for a moment worry that it wasn't horse, but a loan from French that would be a good match for dupa :P
21:12 tadzik ;)
21:13 masak the perils of knowing a bunch of languages... :)
21:13 tadzik cross-language puns
21:14 jnthn "knowing" :)
21:14 jnthn (in my case)
21:14 tadzik Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum videtur
21:14 masak indeed.
21:14 masak wow, I can still parse that, after all these years.
21:15 masak the passive should be a verb form in more languages... :)
21:16 masak phenny: "ĉio dirita en Esperanto aspektas amuza"?
21:16 phenny masak: "everything said in English looks fun" (eo to en, translate.google.com)
21:16 masak ahaha.
21:17 masak statistical translation. gotta love it.
21:17 tipdbmp How to match a non word character (\W), that is not a "space" character \S?
21:17 tadzik :D
21:17 tadzik my second favourite sentence now
21:17 masak tipdbmp: <-[\w\s]>
21:18 tadzik masak: is the pronounciation easy?
21:18 tipdbmp Hm, tnx.
21:18 masak tadzik: was just gonna say. I don't even have to tell you how to pronounce that.
21:18 tadzik hm
21:18 masak tadzik: penultimate-syllable stress, just like in Polish.
21:18 tadzik well, I'm the one who turns "ci" into "ć" and stuff
21:18 masak troo
21:19 tadzik tró
21:19 * Tene disappointed by recent nqp issue, "a strange loop"
21:19 diakopter :)
21:19 tadzik but well, I only once met a guy who knew latin and had to fix my pronounciation of the former sentence
21:20 diakopter Tene: what's disappointing about it? do you have any ideas what could be causing it?
21:20 * diakopter has no clue
21:21 jnthn It's because it doesn't do any optimization for while loops in sink context at code-gen time.
21:21 eternaleye joined #perl6
21:21 sorear phenny: fr en "Paris"?
21:21 phenny sorear: "Paris" (fr to en, translate.google.com)
21:22 jnthn And thus it needs to find a common register type between the condition and the body, and in the case without the line commented out that comes out as int.
21:22 masak tadzik: how to pronounce Latin phrases depends if you ask a Swede, a German, or an Italian.
21:22 Tene diakopter: There's a Douglas Hofstadter book titled "I Am A Strange Loop", which is sort of a followup to Godel, Escher, Bach
21:22 wamba joined #perl6
21:22 masak good book.
21:22 diakopter Tene: oh, yes, intentional allusion
21:23 masak phenny: la en "quid pro quo"?
21:23 phenny masak: "Grindhouse" (la to en, translate.google.com)
21:23 masak :D
21:23 masak at one point the translation was "What happens in Vegas"...
21:23 tadzik masak: I asked a student (or former student) of antique culture
21:25 diakopter Tene: but what's disappointing
21:26 Tene diakopter: that it wasn't about self-referential loops
21:27 sorear despite the efforts of conservatives, Latin pronunciation has changed quite a bit in the last 2,000 years
21:27 tadzik dead language, eh? :)
21:28 sorear there's been some interesting progress in the last couple decades based on using a comparative study of loanwords to tease out phonology from the old documents themselves
21:28 masak contemporary Latin isn't dead.
21:30 tadzik Latin Punks Not Dead!
21:31 masak ;)
21:37 benabik joined #perl6
21:53 marloshouse joined #perl6
21:57 masak phenny: en la "Latin Punks Not Dead!"?
21:57 phenny masak: "Latine Punks non est mortuus !" (en to la, translate.google.com)
21:58 tadzik I'll write that on some wall
22:00 Guest58684 joined #perl6
22:02 jnthn I thought you were meant to write ROMANES EUNT DOMUS on walls :P
22:03 benabik joined #perl6
22:03 tadzik :D:D:D
22:03 tadzik 100 times!
22:05 sorear phenny: "ROMANES EUNT DOMUS"?
22:05 phenny sorear: "ROMANESQUE EUNT DOMUS" (fr to en, translate.google.com)
22:05 sorear phenny: "romanes eunt domus"?
22:05 phenny sorear: "Roman domus eunt" (fr to en, translate.google.com)
22:05 sorear phenny: la en "romanes eunt domus"?
22:05 phenny sorear: "Romans go home" (la to en, translate.google.com)
22:25 masak 'night, #perl6
22:30 cotto ''ight, masak
22:42 cognominal joined #perl6
22:53 xilo joined #perl6
22:58 hash_table joined #perl6
23:02 grondilu joined #perl6
23:03 grondilu rn: my %h = 0 => 1, 1 => 0; say max(:by(*.value), %h); say %h.max(:by(*.value));
23:03 p6eval rakudo a41a48: OUTPUT«"0" => 1␤"1" => 0␤»
23:03 p6eval ..niecza v22-32-gee5dcf1: OUTPUT«"0" => 1␤Unhandled exception: Excess arguments to Any.max, unused named by␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 0 (Any.max @ 1) ␤  at /tmp/Ns7P8fgveK line 1 (mainline @ 7) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 4211 (ANON @ 3) ␤  at /hom…
23:04 * grondilu was expecting "0" => 1n"0" => 1
23:07 dalek perl6-roast-data: fb84488 | coke++ | / (4 files):
23:07 dalek perl6-roast-data: today (automated commit)
23:07 dalek perl6-roast-data: review: https://github.com/coke/perl6​-roast-data/commit/fb84488af9
23:19 ifim joined #perl6
23:25 ifim joined #perl6
23:28 cognominal joined #perl6
23:33 jnthn 'night, #perl6
23:49 skids joined #perl6
23:55 dalek book: 397fd9c | timo++ | src/regexes.pod:
23:55 dalek book: fix #78, thanks hbaragar (s/use/lose/)
23:55 dalek book: review: https://github.com/perl6/book/commit/397fd9c733

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