| Time |
Nick |
Message |
| 00:06 |
|
raiph joined #perl6 |
| 00:09 |
|
lue joined #perl6 |
| 00:10 |
|
cognominal joined #perl6 |
| 00:13 |
LlamaRider |
nqp: say(x("abc",7)); |
| 00:13 |
p6eval |
nqp: OUTPUT«Could not find sub &xâ¤current instr.: '' pc 47 ((file unknown):168622262) (/tmp/1FJdsaPZxO:1)â¤Â» |
| 00:18 |
|
kurahaupo joined #perl6 |
| 00:29 |
|
cognominal joined #perl6 |
| 00:33 |
diakopter |
nqp: say(nqp::x("abc",7)); |
| 00:33 |
p6eval |
nqp: OUTPUT«abcabcabcabcabcabcabcâ¤Â» |
| 00:33 |
diakopter |
nqp-jvm: say(nqp::x("abc",7)); |
| 00:33 |
p6eval |
nqp-jvm: OUTPUT«abcabcabcabcabcabcabcâ¤Â» |
| 00:47 |
|
cognominal joined #perl6 |
| 00:48 |
|
anuby joined #perl6 |
| 01:03 |
|
cognominal joined #perl6 |
| 01:14 |
|
dayangkun joined #perl6 |
| 01:29 |
colomon |
rn: say 1701/60 |
| 01:29 |
p6eval |
rakudo 2a41b3, niecza v24-35-g5c06e28: OUTPUT«28.35â¤Â» |
| 01:29 |
colomon |
so, my current STEP file read has been running for 28.35 hours, and now is taking up 36 gigs of memory. |
| 01:29 |
colomon |
also, my new linux box is swapping like crazy. |
| 01:30 |
|
hypolin joined #perl6 |
| 01:42 |
FROGGS |
jnthn: how do I locate where this happens? https://gist.github.com/FROGGS/5b821ff471cf0bcb049f |
| 01:42 |
FROGGS |
btw, sleep well #perl6 |
| 02:14 |
|
kurahaupo joined #perl6 |
| 02:41 |
|
LlamaRider joined #perl6 |
| 02:56 |
|
FROGGS_ joined #perl6 |
| 03:03 |
|
orafu joined #perl6 |
| 03:10 |
|
FROGGS_ joined #perl6 |
| 03:10 |
diakopter |
colomon: /o\ |
| 03:10 |
colomon |
\o/ |
| 03:11 |
diakopter |
it finished? |
| 03:11 |
colomon |
nah, I'm just in a good mood |
| 03:11 |
diakopter |
or were you celebrating the fact that it hadn't crashed yet? :) |
| 03:11 |
colomon |
that too. :) |
| 03:13 |
sorear |
:D |
| 03:16 |
* diakopter |
listens as colomon tests his hdd's MTBF |
| 03:17 |
colomon |
yeah, having stepped back into the office and listened to the hard drive, I'm thinking maybe I should kill the process. |
| 03:17 |
colomon |
wish I had some idea how close it was to being done... |
| 03:18 |
diakopter |
computing eventual termination of nondeterministic programs is especially hard.. |
| 03:19 |
|
toddr_ joined #perl6 |
| 03:19 |
diakopter |
hi toddr_ |
| 03:20 |
colomon |
killed |
| 03:20 |
toddr_ |
howdy. Was checking ig the topic has a YAPC talks plug or not. |
| 03:20 |
diakopter |
..if you can fit it in there.. ;) |
| 03:21 |
geekosaur |
plenty of room left |
| 03:22 |
|
Topic for #perl6 is now »ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | http://perl6.org/ | evalbot usage: 'perl6: say 3;' or rakudo:, niecza:, std:, or /msg p6eval perl6: ... | irclog: http://irc.perl6.org/ | UTF-8 is our friend! | YAPC::NA talk submissions due end of Month. Have you submitted your talk? |
| 03:23 |
toddr_ |
thanks |
| 03:24 |
diakopter |
actually I think you can /topic here without being op; oh well |
| 03:25 |
toddr_ |
huh. Freednode confuses me compared to most irc systems. Their privs a definitely weird. |
| 03:28 |
|
census joined #perl6 |
| 03:44 |
|
ponbiki joined #perl6 |
| 04:00 |
|
dwoldrich joined #perl6 |
| 04:02 |
|
jaldhar_ joined #perl6 |
| 04:07 |
japhb |
jnthn, I'm trying to figure out a loop in my DUMP work. In Parcel.pm, I have a multi method DUMP(Parcel:D:) in which I've added debugging output, and confirmed that the next thing to dump recursively (the $!storage) attribute, is an RPA. I then call DUMP($!storage), which calls the sub DUMP(|) in Mu.pm, which starts with my Mu $args := pir::perl6_current_args_rpa__P(); my Mu $topic := nqp::shift($args); If I now pir::typeof__SP($topic), |
| 04:07 |
japhb |
I now see a Parcel instead of an RPA; since Parcel fails nqp::islist(), I fall through to calling $topic.DUMP(), and loop. Why the change of type, given all the attempts to avoid coercion, and how do I fix this? |
| 04:07 |
japhb |
* (the $!storage attribute) # Damn parens moved on me |
| 04:08 |
* japhb |
goes to watch a movie and clear his head |
| 04:08 |
japhb |
& |
| 04:13 |
|
loops joined #perl6 |
| 04:19 |
|
xilo_ joined #perl6 |
| 04:27 |
|
cibs joined #perl6 |
| 04:43 |
|
preflex_ joined #perl6 |
| 04:51 |
loops |
howdy, any tips on how to build Rakudo HEAD? Building git download doesn't seem to build latest even when i configure with --gen-parrot=master --gen-nqp=master |
| 04:56 |
loops |
Am trying to grab fixes announced yesterday here... http://is.gd/AGAFwo |
| 04:58 |
tadzik |
it should Just Work, if you do have rakudo HEAD cloned |
| 04:59 |
loops |
tadzik, hmm.. k... --version shows its using older commits from parrot and nqp |
| 04:59 |
loops |
and testing the examples given on that web page don't work... |
| 04:59 |
loops |
but i'm probably doing something daft |
| 04:59 |
|
kaleem joined #perl6 |
| 05:00 |
tadzik |
loops: ah yes, it will use older Parrot/nqp |
| 05:00 |
tadzik |
this NQP which is in NQP_REVISION (rakudo repo), and this Parrot which is in PARROT_REVISION (nqp repo) |
| 05:01 |
tadzik |
anything in particular that doesn't work? |
| 05:01 |
loops |
my $nonsense = 'asdf'; say "OK" if "ADSF" ~~ m:i/$nonsense/; |
| 05:01 |
loops |
from that web page link i gave above... from yesterday |
| 05:02 |
loops |
the case insensitive matching |
| 05:02 |
tadzik |
r: my $nonsense = 'asdf'; say "OK" if "ADSF" ~~ m:i/$nonsense/ |
| 05:02 |
p6eval |
rakudo 2a41b3: ( no output ) |
| 05:08 |
tadzik |
loops: you can always build nqp separately, and have everything fresh |
| 05:08 |
loops |
tadzik can i just change NQP_REVISION in rakudo repo? |
| 05:08 |
tadzik |
not _really_ separately. Now that you've done --gen-nqp, you can just cd nqp && git pull and stuff |
| 05:09 |
tadzik |
loops: that'd work too |
| 05:09 |
loops |
oh.. so it'll use master, just list version incorrectly? |
| 05:09 |
tadzik |
it'll list version alright |
| 05:09 |
tadzik |
nqp --version will be alright |
| 05:09 |
loops |
k.. will give it a go and see how it works... but even the local bot didn't get it correct i see |
| 05:09 |
tadzik |
local bot is correct. It relies on NQP_REVISION |
| 05:09 |
tadzik |
if it's not bumped then maybe there's a reason |
| 05:10 |
loops |
well i meant it got the example you pasted wrong... no output instead of OK |
| 05:15 |
loops |
So maybe that web page i was reading doesn't actually reflect what has been committed to master. Is my first time having a go with perl6 |
| 05:15 |
loops |
Maybe it's just in glitchmr's repo alone |
| 05:19 |
tadzik |
I think it's possible that the changes in nqp are there but Rakudo hasn't caught up or so |
| 05:19 |
loops |
okay.. am giving it a compile now with parrot and nqp head just to see |
| 05:19 |
tadzik |
oh, better avoid Parrot head |
| 05:20 |
tadzik |
while using nqp head is safe, there's a reason why we use almost a year-old parrot in PARROT_REVISION |
| 05:20 |
loops |
yeah? okay.. will kill it and start over if you think that's all i need |
| 05:20 |
tadzik |
thing may break |
| 05:20 |
tadzik |
yeah, Parrot doesn't really influence rakudo these days |
| 05:21 |
tadzik |
r: say "OK" if 'a' ~~ /:i 'A'/; |
| 05:21 |
p6eval |
rakudo 2a41b3: OUTPUT«OKâ¤Â» |
| 05:21 |
* tadzik |
commutees |
| 05:21 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 05:22 |
benabik |
... Parrot 4.11 is a year old? |
| 05:22 |
loops |
is it possible that web page i was reading just had a typo with the syntax? |
| 05:23 |
loops |
http://glitchmr.github.com/perl-6-changes-2013W11.html was the actual source of that example |
| 05:23 |
benabik |
And I hope NQP grabs a more recent version of Parrot soon, with the fixes for read all and the IO buffers. :-/ |
| 05:29 |
loops |
If my computer wasn't powered by lethargic mice this would be compiled by now |
| 05:29 |
|
raiph_ joined #perl6 |
| 05:31 |
raiph |
loops: do you know about the evalbots on channel? |
| 05:31 |
raiph |
r: my $nonsense = 'asdf'; say "OK" if "ASDF" ~~ m:i/$nonsense/; # fixed typo |
| 05:31 |
p6eval |
rakudo 2a41b3: OUTPUT«OKâ¤Â» |
| 05:32 |
raiph |
loops: the two strings don't match asdf / ADSF |
| 05:33 |
loops |
omg lol |
| 05:33 |
raiph |
;) |
| 05:33 |
raiph |
GlitchMr++ # for doing the changes report (and -- for the typo :) |
| 05:34 |
loops |
apparently i have undiagnosed dyslexia |
| 05:36 |
loops |
thanks raiph... probably saved me some anguish about what i was doing wrong with the compile process |
| 05:37 |
loops |
thanks to you too tadzik... cheers |
| 05:38 |
raiph |
yw |
| 05:38 |
raiph |
are you new to p6? |
| 05:39 |
|
SamuraiJack joined #perl6 |
| 05:41 |
loops |
yeah.. first day :o) |
| 05:41 |
loops |
just giving it a look.. pretty new to perl in general actually.. |
| 05:54 |
raiph |
loops: what langs are you familiar with? what are you thinking you might do with perl? |
| 06:01 |
loops |
raiph, Fortran, COBOL, C.. been doing this a lot of years ;o) did a fair bit of sys admin over the years and kinda kick myself for doing so much in shell instead of perl |
| 06:01 |
loops |
awk and sed.. what a misery |
| 06:01 |
loops |
Just wrote a web scraper in P5 and it was a revelation... so much handled easily by CPAN |
| 06:02 |
raiph |
heh. presumably you know perl started as a replacement for sed, awk, and shell |
| 06:02 |
loops |
Am often doing things where perl would be better than shell, but that's my comfort zone |
| 06:02 |
loops |
yeah :o) |
| 06:03 |
loops |
I dunno why i never took the time to dig into it 15 years ago |
| 06:03 |
|
FROGGS joined #perl6 |
| 06:03 |
sorear |
were you even on unix at the time? |
| 06:04 |
sorear |
even today, perl 5's support for VMS is ... not great |
| 06:04 |
loops |
yeah, lots of the time was on Xenix, and other Unix boxes |
| 06:04 |
loops |
yeah, i started on VMS |
| 06:05 |
loops |
well actually i started on a Commodore PET 40 character green screen with 32K RAM |
| 06:05 |
loops |
but that's another story ;o) |
| 06:06 |
raiph |
heh. sinclair zx80 for me. 1kb. :) |
| 06:06 |
loops |
doh.. u have me beat ;) |
| 06:06 |
raiph |
perl5 and perl6 are very, very different animals at the moment |
| 06:07 |
loops |
yeah.. i found learning about their differences a nice way to learn about P5 as much as anything |
| 06:07 |
loops |
but the P6 features are really intriguing... |
| 06:07 |
raiph |
if you assume p6 is 1000x slower, you might be pleasantly surprised |
| 06:08 |
loops |
Was just reading this is the year of performance for P6, so who knows :o) |
| 06:08 |
sorear |
it was 1000x slower in mid-2010 |
| 06:09 |
sorear |
that's how much ng sucked ;) |
| 06:09 |
loops |
anyway, when you spend 3 hours not noticing ASDF ADSF difference... speed may not be my biggest problem |
| 06:09 |
raiph |
lol |
| 06:11 |
raiph |
cpan (p5) has over 100K modules and many are very robust. |
| 06:11 |
raiph |
p6 has about a hundred small to very small modules in its ecosystem |
| 06:12 |
loops |
yeah, i read the whole p6 list.. it's a huge difference for sure.. CPAN really rocks. |
| 06:12 |
loops |
perl seems as mutable as lisp |
| 06:13 |
loops |
and P6 even more so, which would be really powerful if it can be performant |
| 06:13 |
bonsaikitten |
well, p6 is still young ... once someone writes the next web 2.0 framework in it it'll take over ;) |
| 06:13 |
loops |
lol true |
| 06:14 |
|
sftp joined #perl6 |
| 06:14 |
loops |
Pearls on Perl |
| 06:15 |
loops |
more dyslexia |
| 06:22 |
raiph |
because it's not there yet, perl6 in 2013 (and probably 2014 too) is mostly about building a tool for getting stuff done, not for actually getting stuff done. for that latter, think and use perl5 |
| 06:25 |
raiph |
all imo of course. goodnight #perl6 |
| 06:28 |
loops |
night raiph |
| 06:30 |
|
FROGGS joined #perl6 |
| 06:37 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 06:45 |
|
kaleem joined #perl6 |
| 06:49 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 06:59 |
tadzik |
benabik: uh, no it's not :) For some reason I thought it's 4.1 |
| 07:03 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 07:09 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 07:09 |
loops |
date |
| 07:13 |
rindolf |
loops: what about date? |
| 07:21 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 07:35 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 07:47 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 07:55 |
|
markov joined #perl6 |
| 07:55 |
|
markov left #perl6 |
| 08:00 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 08:08 |
|
domidumont joined #perl6 |
| 08:08 |
|
cognominal joined #perl6 |
| 08:09 |
|
markov joined #perl6 |
| 08:10 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 08:14 |
masak |
greetings, #perl6 |
| 08:18 |
moritz |
\o masak |
| 08:18 |
tadzik |
hey hey masak |
| 08:18 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 08:19 |
* masak |
is teaching today |
| 08:19 |
* moritz |
will be teaching git for three hours in the afternoon |
| 08:21 |
tadzik |
fun stuff |
| 08:21 |
* tadzik |
hums "Code Monkey" |
| 08:21 |
hoelzro |
ahoy #perl6 |
| 08:24 |
masak |
hoelzro! \o/ |
| 08:25 |
hoelzro |
o/ masak |
| 08:27 |
FROGGS |
morning |
| 08:27 |
masak |
FROGGS! \o/ |
| 08:27 |
FROGGS |
:o) |
| 08:28 |
sorear |
\o/ |
| 08:28 |
masak |
sorear! \o/ |
| 08:29 |
tadzik |
\o/ |
| 08:29 |
FROGGS |
hehe, what a nice community :o) |
| 08:30 |
* masak |
starts le teaching |
| 08:31 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 08:35 |
|
domidumont joined #perl6 |
| 08:42 |
hoelzro |
I had a thought on my way to work this morning |
| 08:43 |
hoelzro |
META.info currently uses an array of strings for dependencies |
| 08:43 |
hoelzro |
perhaps it could also allow hashes on that array? |
| 08:44 |
hoelzro |
ex. { "name" : "NativeCall", "version" : "0.1.0", "for" : "Testing Stuff" } |
| 08:44 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 08:45 |
tadzik |
sure |
| 08:46 |
|
kurahaupo joined #perl6 |
| 08:46 |
tadzik |
it's quite easy to introduce, I'd say |
| 08:46 |
tadzik |
well, if we plan to ignore the special information at first :) |
| 08:47 |
tadzik |
we'll need that eventually anyway, I think |
| 08:58 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 09:05 |
hoelzro |
\o/ |
| 09:06 |
hoelzro |
also, there was talk of adding POSIX errno values to NQP in addition to nqp_posixerrno |
| 09:06 |
|
daxim joined #perl6 |
| 09:06 |
tadzik |
heh, spectest on TEST_JOBS=6 is pretty awesome |
| 09:06 |
hoelzro |
what would be the best way to expose that to NQP? nqp_posixerrnovalues -> Hash? |
| 09:06 |
tadzik |
errno values as in strings descriptions? |
| 09:07 |
tadzik |
like perror(), sort of? |
| 09:07 |
|
lustlife joined #perl6 |
| 09:12 |
hoelzro |
well, it would be something like %errno-values<ENOMEM> -> whatever ENOMEM is on that platform |
| 09:13 |
|
kaleem joined #perl6 |
| 09:16 |
|
fhelmberger joined #perl6 |
| 09:20 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 09:22 |
|
kresike joined #perl6 |
| 09:22 |
kresike |
hello all you happy and/or unhappy perl6 people |
| 09:24 |
FROGGS |
hehe |
| 09:24 |
FROGGS |
helllo kresike |
| 09:24 |
FROGGS |
-l |
| 09:26 |
|
wk_ joined #perl6 |
| 09:27 |
kresike |
FROGGS, o/ |
| 09:27 |
kresike |
had to make it more generic, people were complaining ☺ |
| 09:29 |
|
lustlife joined #perl6 |
| 09:31 |
tadzik |
md-nqp seems not slower than nom here |
| 09:31 |
tadzik |
on spectest, at least |
| 09:32 |
tadzik |
(https://gist.github.com/tadzik/5185967) |
| 09:35 |
jnthn |
japhb: If an RPA is returned by a method, it's automatically marshalled into a Parcel. In general, Rakudo tries fairly hard to not let Parrot types leak into Perl 6 land... |
| 09:37 |
FROGGS |
jnthn: morning |
| 09:37 |
FROGGS |
<FROGGS> jnthn: how do I locate where this happens? https://gist.github.com/FROGGS/5b821ff471cf0bcb049f |
| 09:39 |
tadzik |
FROGGS: try --ll-exception maybe |
| 09:39 |
|
dakkar joined #perl6 |
| 09:39 |
tadzik |
or is that it already? :) |
| 09:40 |
moritz |
that won't help |
| 09:40 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 09:40 |
moritz |
FROGGS: binary search: comment out large chunks of code, recompile |
| 09:40 |
jnthn |
I've no idea what NQP code you wrote to get that error... |
| 09:40 |
FROGGS |
tadzik: make is already the borke |
| 09:41 |
moritz |
if the error disappears, you know it's in the newly commented-out code |
| 09:41 |
moritz |
nqp: say() := 42 |
| 09:41 |
p6eval |
nqp: OUTPUT«Error while compiling block : Error while compiling op bind: First child of a 'bind' op must be a QAST::Varâ¤current instr.: '' pc 46234 (src/stage2/QAST.pir:16986) (src/stage2/QAST.nqp:2783)â¤Â» |
| 09:41 |
jnthn |
And yeah, there's not much better for it than what moritz said, other than when you do find it file a ticket so we can catch the issue at NQP level |
| 09:41 |
jnthn |
Hm :) |
| 09:41 |
FROGGS |
jnthn: it is within my added code, I was hoping there is a trick to get the line number |
| 09:42 |
jnthn |
oh, I guess NQP must not validate the LHS of the bind at all |
| 09:42 |
moritz |
well, we could also try to track down source location for errors from the QAST compiler |
| 09:42 |
FROGGS |
+1 |
| 09:42 |
FROGGS |
moritz: now? :P |
| 09:42 |
moritz |
FROGGS: maybe you're trying to bind to $.var or so? |
| 09:42 |
moritz |
FROGGS: I'm at $work now, doing $work things :( |
| 09:42 |
FROGGS |
moritz: might be the case, let me check |
| 09:43 |
moritz |
FROGGS: but one thing you can do in QAST::Compiler is simply print out $qast.node.Str when that error is thrown |
| 09:43 |
moritz |
maybe that makes it easier for you to find the location of the error |
| 09:52 |
FROGGS |
moritz: thanks! |
| 10:00 |
|
SamuraiJack joined #perl6 |
| 10:03 |
moritz |
FROGGS: did it help? |
| 10:06 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 10:07 |
FROGGS |
moritz: $work got me, I'll get to it in a bit |
| 10:09 |
|
nyuszika7h joined #perl6 |
| 10:22 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 10:28 |
|
cognominal joined #perl6 |
| 10:41 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 10:55 |
|
pmurias joined #perl6 |
| 10:56 |
pmurias |
would cloning rake in Perl6 be a good way to move away from makefiles? |
| 10:58 |
arnsholt |
Not sure if I'd prefer a dependency on Ruby over make. Are the makefiles a problem? |
| 10:58 |
tadzik |
do we have a problem with makefiles? |
| 10:58 |
tadzik |
well, I guess it'll be more of Porting to Perl6 rather than Depending on Ruby |
| 10:59 |
tadzik |
but I think they're fine. They serve only as a developer tool now, the end-user solutions don't use makefiles anyway |
| 10:59 |
tadzik |
(at least in the module ecosystem) |
| 11:01 |
arnsholt |
Oh, right. That kind of clone. I guess it's not a bad idea, although I'll probably stick with make =) |
| 11:03 |
pmurias |
tadzik: re problem with makefiles, they I really hate them, they are ugly and copy & pasted |
| 11:05 |
tadzik |
oh well |
| 11:05 |
tadzik |
I neither write them nor read them, so I don't have a problem with them |
| 11:05 |
tadzik |
I once reimplemented ufo in Pure Perl 6, it was awful :P |
| 11:05 |
cognominal |
proposed a pull request for nqp... |
| 11:06 |
cognominal |
https://github.com/perl6/nqp/pull/84 |
| 11:07 |
pmurias |
tadzik: does panda handle the precompilation for modules? |
| 11:07 |
tadzik |
pmurias: yes |
| 11:08 |
tadzik |
the logic is mostly cargo-culted from ufo |
| 11:08 |
tadzik |
but it's not using makefils |
| 11:09 |
cognominal |
ufo-culted, then... |
| 11:11 |
arnsholt |
cognominal: FWIW, I write lots of makefiles without copy-pasting =) |
| 11:12 |
pmurias |
arnsholt: that was aimed at me? |
| 11:13 |
arnsholt |
Oh, indeed it was |
| 11:15 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 11:15 |
FROGGS |
moritz: I believe it is something like this: |
| 11:15 |
FROGGS |
nqp: my $x; my $y; ($x, $y) := (1,1); |
| 11:15 |
p6eval |
nqp: OUTPUT«Error while compiling block : Error while compiling op bind: First child of a 'bind' op must be a QAST::Varâ¤current instr.: '' pc 46234 (src/stage2/QAST.pir:16986) (src/stage2/QAST.nqp:2783)â¤Â» |
| 11:16 |
jnthn |
That's never going to work in NQP, but we can try and do a better error for it. |
| 11:18 |
FROGGS |
jnthn: np, I'll just fix my grammar |
| 11:20 |
|
xinming_ joined #perl6 |
| 11:22 |
jnthn |
FROGGS: Please file an nqp ticket about getting a better error though... |
| 11:22 |
jnthn |
I want to improve that. |
| 11:22 |
jnthn |
NQP may be limited, but it should know its limits :) |
| 11:22 |
FROGGS |
jnthn: k, will do |
| 11:31 |
|
woolfy joined #perl6 |
| 11:32 |
|
jaldhar_ joined #perl6 |
| 11:32 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 11:39 |
|
mberends joined #perl6 |
| 11:48 |
hoelzro |
Parrot_pmc_new(interp, enum_class_Hash) creates a PMC that I may call Parrot_hash_* functions on, yes? |
| 11:48 |
FROGGS |
nqp: my $x; my $y; $x := $y := 1; |
| 11:48 |
p6eval |
nqp: ( no output ) |
| 11:50 |
FROGGS |
nqp: if my $x := 1 { say("ya"); } |
| 11:50 |
p6eval |
nqp: OUTPUT«yaâ¤Â» |
| 11:52 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 12:01 |
FROGGS |
moritz: $node.dump seems helpful |
| 12:06 |
|
census joined #perl6 |
| 12:14 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 12:23 |
FROGGS |
./perl6 -e 'my $a = slurp "src/Perl6/P5Actions.pm"; my %meth = $a.lines.map( { /(method) \s+ (\S+)/ ?? $1 => 1 !! () } ); my $g = slurp "src/Perl6/P5Grammar.pm"; my %decl = $g.lines.map( { /(token|rule) \s+ (\S+)/ && !%meth{$1} ?? $1 => 1 !! () } ); say %decl' |
| 12:24 |
FROGGS |
haha, I'm using Perl 6 to implement Perl 5 within Perl 6 |
| 12:28 |
|
mtk joined #perl6 |
| 12:30 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 12:33 |
|
SmokeMachine joined #perl6 |
| 12:40 |
|
rindolf joined #perl6 |
| 12:50 |
dalek |
perl6-roast-data: 408e358 | coke++ | / (4 files): |
| 12:50 |
dalek |
perl6-roast-data: today (automated commit) |
| 12:50 |
dalek |
perl6-roast-data: review: https://github.com/coke/perl6-roast-data/commit/408e358b14 |
| 12:50 |
[Coke] |
rakudo testing clean again. niecza up to 102 failures. |
| 13:03 |
hoelzro |
you can't use #define's in ops files? =( |
| 13:04 |
jnthn |
hoelzro: Yes, only up in the prelude |
| 13:04 |
hoelzro |
oh, I see |
| 13:04 |
hoelzro |
hmm |
| 13:04 |
jnthn |
nqp.ops does it |
| 13:13 |
hoelzro |
ok, that should work |
| 13:13 |
hoelzro |
so I'm thinking of pushing my pygments lexer upstream soon; one of the problems is "role q { ... }" doesn't parse correctly. Is it special enough of a case to ignore? |
| 13:14 |
hoelzro |
because I've been thinking, and it would be non-trivial to parse correctly |
| 13:15 |
tadzik |
literally 'role q { }'? |
| 13:15 |
hoelzro |
it's in Grammar.pm |
| 13:15 |
hoelzro |
which one, I cannot recall... |
| 13:15 |
hoelzro |
it parses it as a string |
| 13:15 |
PerlJam |
hoelzro: the other quoters too, or just that one? |
| 13:15 |
hoelzro |
which is incorrect, but it doesn't break the rest of the parse, so I'm inclined to leave it broken |
| 13:16 |
hoelzro |
PerlJam: probably qq as well |
| 13:16 |
FROGGS |
hoelzro: leave it broken then |
| 13:16 |
FROGGS |
there will be always room for improvement :o) |
| 13:16 |
hoelzro |
yeah, I figure it's probably good enough for upstream |
| 13:17 |
PerlJam |
hoelzro: seems like you could special-case "role\s+<quoter>" though |
| 13:17 |
hoelzro |
hmm |
| 13:17 |
PerlJam |
hoelzro: but if not, I'm with FROGGS; leave it be for now. |
| 13:17 |
hoelzro |
I'll consider that |
| 13:17 |
hoelzro |
I was hoping to avoid a special case, but it's not so bad |
| 13:19 |
lizmat |
PerlJam: shouldn't that be "role<ws><quoter>" |
| 13:21 |
|
xinming joined #perl6 |
| 13:22 |
PerlJam |
lizmat: sure. I'm still in P5 mode this morning :) |
| 13:22 |
hoelzro |
well, it *is* using Python regexes =P |
| 13:23 |
* hoelzro |
thinks it's funny that his largest contribution to Perl 6 so far has been writing Python |
| 13:26 |
|
bluescreen10 joined #perl6 |
| 13:26 |
|
toddr_ left #perl6 |
| 13:27 |
|
SmokeMachine joined #perl6 |
| 13:36 |
|
PacoAir joined #perl6 |
| 13:43 |
|
stevan_ joined #perl6 |
| 13:54 |
|
skids joined #perl6 |
| 14:08 |
|
domidumont joined #perl6 |
| 14:10 |
FROGGS |
Method '!cursor_init' not found for invocant of class 'NQPMu' |
| 14:10 |
FROGGS |
well, better than nothing :o) |
| 14:11 |
|
benabik joined #perl6 |
| 14:20 |
dalek |
roast: e08d8f4 | (Solomon Foster)++ | S03-operators/range-basic.t: |
| 14:20 |
dalek |
roast: Skip new tests on Niecza. |
| 14:20 |
dalek |
roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/e08d8f482a |
| 14:21 |
|
jnthn joined #perl6 |
| 14:23 |
|
dakkar joined #perl6 |
| 14:26 |
|
Liz joined #perl6 |
| 14:27 |
|
jdv79 joined #perl6 |
| 14:28 |
|
Psyche^ joined #perl6 |
| 14:29 |
jdv79 |
is there a way to see the parse tree for a piece of doce or a dump of the reconstituted code? i saw that blurb about a bad parse in the last Perl 6 Changes post and i wanted to see it but couldn't figure it out |
| 14:29 |
jdv79 |
i thought maybe putting that in a sub and calling .perl on it would do something useful but nope |
| 14:29 |
jdv79 |
*code |
| 14:30 |
FROGGS |
jdv79: you can do: ./perl6 --target=ast -e 'say 1' |
| 14:30 |
FROGGS |
that's not for a piece of code though |
| 14:32 |
jdv79 |
cool, thanks |
| 14:46 |
|
jpnk joined #perl6 |
| 14:47 |
|
kivutar joined #perl6 |
| 14:48 |
|
slavik joined #perl6 |
| 15:06 |
jpnk |
hi. is there a way to access a variable inside a native library? NativeCall seems to focus solely on functions. |
| 15:06 |
jnthn |
jpnk: Believe there's not a way to do that yet. |
| 15:07 |
jpnk |
just what i thought:( thanks anyway. |
| 15:15 |
|
domidumont joined #perl6 |
| 15:16 |
|
zos joined #perl6 |
| 15:34 |
|
am0c joined #perl6 |
| 15:38 |
|
LlamaRider joined #perl6 |
| 15:39 |
LlamaRider |
I've seen the examples of connecting to native subs with NativeCall/zavolaj -- But how do I connect to native variables? |
| 15:39 |
LlamaRider |
also, o/ #perl6 |
| 15:41 |
jnthn |
Is this a conspiracy where if enough people ask that question on the same day, it might be implemented? :D |
| 15:41 |
* LlamaRider |
hasn't read the backlogs yet |
| 15:42 |
masak |
LlamaRider! \o/ |
| 15:42 |
jnthn |
LlamaRider: Somebody asked exactly the same about 30 minutes ago. :) |
| 15:42 |
hoelzro |
and I asked the same on Saturday |
| 15:42 |
jnthn |
And that. |
| 15:42 |
jnthn |
OK, I get the hint. :) |
| 15:42 |
hoelzro |
(to be fair, errno is not a normal variable, and probably wouldn't work) |
| 15:42 |
masak |
is there a way to connect to native vars with zavolaj? :P |
| 15:43 |
jnthn |
masak: In step 1, you hassle one of the people who knows about Zavolaj to implement it :P |
| 15:43 |
jnthn |
I guess we want to be able to set them as well as get them? |
| 15:43 |
masak |
I'm just cargo-culting the question, but I'm guessing "yes". |
| 15:44 |
jnthn |
yes, I was asking generally... |
| 15:44 |
jnthn |
I'm going to be doing a bunch of container stuff refactors soon anyways. The stuff to enable is rw and native types to get along. |
| 15:44 |
jnthn |
I'll get I can get this to work off the same kind of mechanism. |
| 15:44 |
jnthn |
*bet |
| 15:44 |
masak |
++jnthn |
| 15:45 |
TimToady |
native containers are usually called "pointers" :) |
| 15:45 |
masak |
whoa. |
| 15:45 |
jnthn |
TimToady: Yeah, but in the case of lexicals it's a pointer that needs to keep alive the callframe it's pointing into, for example. :) |
| 15:46 |
TimToady |
the actual container, of course, is the memory cell, but a pointer is necessary to get to the address |
| 15:46 |
TimToady |
or a register number :) |
| 15:46 |
* masak |
decommutes |
| 15:46 |
jnthn |
What I want is to factor it in a way where we take out some kind of managed pointer, but if we inline stuff later it can collapse back down to something cheap. |
| 15:52 |
jpnk |
anyone knows why panda is taking so long to start when installing from a local directory? anything i can tweak? |
| 15:54 |
LlamaRider |
jnthn: I see, thanks for looking into adding the feature then :) |
| 15:58 |
jpnk |
nevermind my question, gotta go:) bye. |
| 15:59 |
hoelzro |
I hope jpnk comes back |
| 15:59 |
hoelzro |
we need more curious folk =) |
| 16:14 |
|
tyion joined #perl6 |
| 16:17 |
diakopter |
nqp-jvm: ($_,) := 4 # golfed |
| 16:17 |
p6eval |
nqp-jvm: OUTPUT«First child of a 'bind' op must be a QAST::Var⤠in <anon>⤠in <anon>⤠in compile_op⤠in as_jast⤠in as_jast⤠in <anon>⤠in compile_all_the_stmts⤠in as_jast⤠in as_jast⤠in <anon>⤠in compile_all_the_stmts⤠in as_jast⤠in as_jast⤠in <anon>⤠in compile_all… |
| 16:18 |
diakopter |
nqp-jvm: ($_ := 5) := 4 # maybe related |
| 16:18 |
p6eval |
nqp-jvm: OUTPUT«First child of a 'bind' op must be a QAST::Var⤠in <anon>⤠in <anon>⤠in compile_op⤠in as_jast⤠in as_jast⤠in <anon>⤠in compile_all_the_stmts⤠in as_jast⤠in as_jast⤠in <anon>⤠in compile_all_the_stmts⤠in as_jast⤠in as_jast⤠in <anon>⤠in compile_all… |
| 16:18 |
diakopter |
oh. |
| 16:18 |
diakopter |
you're an as_jast |
| 16:19 |
benabik |
I don't think NQP support binding to parcels. |
| 16:19 |
jnthn |
Correct. |
| 16:19 |
jnthn |
But we should really catch it higher level. |
| 16:19 |
jnthn |
Rather than exploding at code-gen time over badly formed QAST |
| 16:22 |
japhb |
jnthn, This wasn't a return value getting marshalled; it was an argument to a sub, which I thought had less marshalling magic, when you go through the pir:: raw argument contortions. If that's not the case, is there any way for code in the setting to intentionally not marshal arguments (or return values)? |
| 16:22 |
jnthn |
japhb: Oh, going through the raw arg thing shoulda prevented it |
| 16:23 |
japhb |
Yeah, that's why I was confuzzled |
| 16:23 |
jnthn |
Unless it happened somehow before then. |
| 16:24 |
japhb |
I'm not sure where it would have been; I check type just before the sub call, and then I check type in the sub right after the raw arg handling, and they're different. |
| 16:24 |
diakopter |
nqp-jvm: say((my $a := 4) === 6) # jnthn here's one |
| 16:24 |
p6eval |
nqp-jvm: OUTPUT«Redeclaration of symbol $a at line 2, near ":= 4) === "⤠in panic⤠in variable_declarator⤠in !reduce⤠in !cursor_pass⤠in variable_declarator⤠in declarator⤠in scoped⤠in scope_declarator:sym<my>⤠in !protoregex⤠in scope_declarator⤠in term:sym<scope_declar… |
| 16:24 |
diakopter |
nqp: say((my $a := 4) === 6) |
| 16:25 |
p6eval |
nqp: OUTPUT«Redeclaration of symbol $a at line 2, near ":= 4) === "â¤current instr.: 'panic' pc 14698 (src/stage2/gen/NQPHLL.pir:5229) (src/stage2/gen/NQPHLL.pm:278)â¤Â» |
| 16:25 |
jnthn |
At least it's consistent :) |
| 16:25 |
diakopter |
=== doesn't exist, right? |
| 16:25 |
jnthn |
Right |
| 16:25 |
jnthn |
I thought not, at least |
| 16:26 |
diakopter |
nqp: say(5 === 5) |
| 16:26 |
p6eval |
nqp: OUTPUT«Confused at line 2, near "say(5 === "â¤current instr.: 'panic' pc 14698 (src/stage2/gen/NQPHLL.pir:5229) (src/stage2/gen/NQPHLL.pm:278)â¤Â» |
| 16:26 |
jnthn |
japhb: I can take a look at what you wrote and see if I spot anything |
| 16:27 |
japhb |
OK, give me a sec ... |
| 16:27 |
diakopter |
nqp: $_ == 5 |
| 16:27 |
p6eval |
nqp: OUTPUT«Null PMC access in get_number()â¤current instr.: '' pc 43 ((file unknown):39) (/tmp/8aYQplJAi8:1)â¤Â» |
| 16:28 |
diakopter |
nqp: $_ |
| 16:28 |
p6eval |
nqp: ( no output ) |
| 16:28 |
diakopter |
nqp: say($_) |
| 16:28 |
p6eval |
nqp: OUTPUT«Null PMC access in get_string()â¤current instr.: '' pc 828 (src/stage2/gen/NQPCORE.setting.pir:372) (src/stage2/NQPCORE.setting:649)â¤Â» |
| 16:28 |
diakopter |
nqp: say($_ := 66) |
| 16:28 |
p6eval |
nqp: OUTPUT«Lexical '$_' not foundâ¤current instr.: '' pc 43 ((file unknown):42) (/tmp/ZlSzFbfS4N:1)â¤Â» |
| 16:28 |
jnthn |
I think $_ only exists in NQP if there's something to bind it. |
| 16:29 |
diakopter |
nqp: say(my $_ := 66) |
| 16:29 |
p6eval |
nqp: OUTPUT«66â¤Â» |
| 16:29 |
diakopter |
okay.. |
| 16:29 |
jnthn |
Though it should probably be giving an undeclared error. Or just being 6ier. |
| 16:29 |
diakopter |
your mom is 6ier |
| 16:29 |
jnthn |
NQP tends to do less magical things, though. |
| 16:30 |
jnthn |
Heh, that's funnier in Swedish than English :P |
| 16:30 |
diakopter |
also, your mom does less magical things |
| 16:30 |
diakopter |
what is it in Swedish |
| 16:30 |
diakopter |
do I want to know? |
| 16:31 |
jnthn |
en: six == se: sex :P |
| 16:32 |
dalek |
rakudo/extend-dump: 6531d86 | (Geoffrey Broadwell)++ | src/core/ (5 files): |
| 16:32 |
dalek |
rakudo/extend-dump: First snapshot of DUMP extension work; lots of debug output trying to track down apparent marshalling issue. |
| 16:32 |
dalek |
rakudo/extend-dump: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/6531d86292 |
| 16:32 |
* jnthn |
makes a final push on $dayjob stuff before doing dinner and Perl 6 stuffs |
| 16:33 |
japhb |
jnthn, see above mini-branch |
| 16:33 |
diakopter |
commode, er I mean commone, er I mean commune, er, I mean commute & |
| 16:38 |
|
japhb_ joined #perl6 |
| 16:38 |
japhb_ |
jnthn, I forgot to mention the one-liner I was using to sanity check my work: perl6 -e 'class Foo { has $!bar = "bar"; has $.quux = 1..10; has $!foo = < a b c d >; }; my Foo $foo .= new; say DUMP($foo)' |head -50 |
| 16:39 |
japhb_ |
That ought to show sane-ish stuff for the first couple attributes, and then go to crazy town on $!foo . |
| 16:40 |
jnthn |
$attr.get_value(self) |
| 16:40 |
jnthn |
I wonder if it's that get_value call that does it |
| 16:41 |
jnthn |
(when you get the Parcel storage) |
| 16:42 |
|
kaare_ joined #perl6 |
| 16:43 |
jnthn |
try it as nqp::findmethod($attr, 'get_value')(($attr, self) |
| 16:45 |
japhb_ |
I'm not sure that's in the line of code that's the problem. See this output: |
| 16:45 |
japhb_ |
https://gist.github.com/anonymous/2c714262390b18b06b4e |
| 16:46 |
japhb_ |
Start on line 23, when it starts looking at $!foo |
| 16:47 |
|
kivutar joined #perl6 |
| 16:47 |
japhb_ |
As soon as we hit Parcel.DUMP(), we start looping between Parcel.DUMP and Mu::DUMP; Mu.DUMP is out of the picture at that point. |
| 16:48 |
jnthn |
oh, it's overridden in Parcel... |
| 16:48 |
jnthn |
hm |
| 16:51 |
jnthn |
japhb_: ooh... |
| 16:51 |
jnthn |
I was wrong about that op |
| 16:51 |
japhb_ |
oh? |
| 16:51 |
jnthn |
It does map, it just doesn't panic if it can't. |
| 16:52 |
jnthn |
oh... |
| 16:52 |
jnthn |
You can use the capture processing ops I added when porting the multi-dispatcher. |
| 16:53 |
japhb_ |
Ah, cool. Which ones, and where should I look for example usage? |
| 16:53 |
jnthn |
nqp::captureposarg(nqp::usecapture(), 0) # for example |
| 16:53 |
japhb_ |
Oh, nice. |
| 16:53 |
jnthn |
Well, you can look in the multi-dispatch (in BOOTSTRAP.pm) for examples too :) |
| 16:53 |
kresike |
bye folks |
| 16:54 |
|
pupoque joined #perl6 |
| 16:54 |
|
Harzilein joined #perl6 |
| 16:54 |
Harzilein |
hi |
| 16:55 |
PerlJam |
Harzilein: greetings |
| 16:55 |
Harzilein |
hmm... should $.something.WHAT work in perlito? is it even valid perl6? |
| 16:55 |
arnsholt |
o/ |
| 16:55 |
jnthn |
It's certainly valid Perl 6 |
| 16:57 |
japhb_ |
jnthn, OK, thank you. Starting a build with the pir:: -> nqp:: change (it will take a while), and I'll let you know if that fixes it. :-) |
| 16:57 |
* japhb_ |
is also happy that the fix may be "get rid of pir:: in favor of the portable solution" |
| 16:58 |
|
Chillance joined #perl6 |
| 16:59 |
jnthn |
Yes, that pir op in general can go away for this more portable solution. |
| 16:59 |
jnthn |
It's already supported in JVM land. |
| 17:04 |
arnsholt |
jnthn: In the head commit at vmarray-list I changed some atpos_s to plain atpos in NQPMu. Should that kind of thing generally be ok? |
| 17:04 |
|
cognominal joined #perl6 |
| 17:05 |
jnthn |
arnsholt: Probably; I'd be curious if it looks the same in nqp-jvm's NQPMu |
| 17:05 |
moritz |
atpos_s? |
| 17:05 |
moritz |
sounds scary :-) |
| 17:06 |
Harzilein |
*sigh* |
| 17:07 |
arnsholt |
jnthn: Looks like they're all plain atpos, so that should be good |
| 17:07 |
jnthn |
*nod* |
| 17:09 |
Harzilein |
http://paste.debian.net/242593 :( |
| 17:10 |
moritz |
maybe $foo.WHAT works in perlito? |
| 17:11 |
Harzilein |
no, i tried that too |
| 17:11 |
moritz |
then... tough luck |
| 17:11 |
Harzilein |
http://paste.debian.net/242594 |
| 17:13 |
moritz |
then I'd recommend you work with rakudo or niecza instead |
| 17:14 |
|
SamuraiJack joined #perl6 |
| 17:14 |
Harzilein |
moritz: i can't install those on the target system. it's not imperative i can use perl6 but i thought it'd be neat. |
| 17:22 |
diakopter |
Harzilein: what's the target system? can you install mono? |
| 17:25 |
japhb_ |
jnthn, success! |
| 17:25 |
japhb_ |
jnthn++ # Much thanks |
| 17:27 |
Harzilein |
diakopter: it's a debian-based appliance that says it does not support upgrades. so installing debian packages is a bit like using private apis ;) |
| 17:27 |
dalek |
rakudo/extend-dump: b69e0c8 | (Geoffrey Broadwell)++ | src/core/Mu.pm: |
| 17:27 |
dalek |
rakudo/extend-dump: Replace broken pir::perl6_current_args_rpa__P() call with nqp:: equivalent, stopping RPA -> Parcel looping |
| 17:27 |
dalek |
rakudo/extend-dump: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/b69e0c836c |
| 17:28 |
Harzilein |
diakopter: well, so is installing perl scripts, but i think they'd need to actively sabotage their appliance for those to break things |
| 17:29 |
jnthn |
japhb_: yay :) |
| 17:32 |
Harzilein |
apropos marrokko |
| 17:32 |
Harzilein |
ewin |
| 17:32 |
|
spider-mario joined #perl6 |
| 17:36 |
|
rjbs joined #perl6 |
| 17:37 |
|
cognominal joined #perl6 |
| 17:39 |
rjbs |
2/lm |
| 17:40 |
rjbs |
(oops) |
| 17:42 |
|
wk joined #perl6 |
| 17:43 |
masak |
===SORRY!=== Undeclared routine: lm used at line 1. Did you mean '&lc'? |
| 17:51 |
|
PacoAir joined #perl6 |
| 17:55 |
masak |
today's autopun: "haiku's inventory / must have had seven fingers / on his middle hand" |
| 17:55 |
masak |
g'ah, inventor* |
| 17:56 |
jnthn |
hm, somehow that one doesn't feel too autopunny... |
| 17:57 |
masak |
another one: "why the Japanese / think seventeen syllables / are enough is a" |
| 17:57 |
masak |
I think that one qualifies more :) |
| 18:06 |
|
fgomez joined #perl6 |
| 18:21 |
|
gdey joined #perl6 |
| 18:36 |
|
arlinius joined #perl6 |
| 18:45 |
pmichaud |
good morning, #perl6 |
| 18:46 |
PerlJam |
good afternoon, pmichaud |
| 18:50 |
jnthn |
hi, pmichaud |
| 18:50 |
pmichaud |
oh, I guess it is afternoon. |
| 18:51 |
pmichaud |
I spent much of the night regretting some things I ate over the weekend. :-/ |
| 18:51 |
jnthn |
:( |
| 18:55 |
|
FROGGS joined #perl6 |
| 18:57 |
[Coke] |
:( |
| 18:58 |
masak |
:( |
| 19:00 |
FROGGS |
:( |
| 19:00 |
FROGGS |
what's up? |
| 19:01 |
* masak |
.oO( weekend's food ) |
| 19:01 |
|
SmokeMac_ joined #perl6 |
| 19:02 |
* jnthn |
groans at masak |
| 19:02 |
* masak |
attempts to blame rindolf |
| 19:02 |
* skids |
stops looking for ill-looking unicode smileys. |
| 19:03 |
* masak |
.oO( PILE OF FOOD ) |
| 19:04 |
pmichaud |
actually, it didn't come up. My system simply has difficulty processing certain foods at times (broccoli in this case) |
| 19:05 |
|
fgomez joined #perl6 |
| 19:05 |
huf |
do these times happen to coincide with the time you eat those foods? |
| 19:05 |
pmichaud |
heh |
| 19:06 |
|
cognominal joined #perl6 |
| 19:07 |
masak |
only a programmer would ask that. :P |
| 19:07 |
huf |
debugging! :) |
| 19:07 |
FROGGS |
masak: food is up? is that an idiom? |
| 19:08 |
* PerlJam |
only eats broccoli after it's been preprocessed into the muscle tissue of some animal. |
| 19:08 |
masak |
FROGGS: no, but it's not so difficult to assign meaning to it. |
| 19:08 |
PerlJam |
Much safer that way :) |
| 19:08 |
masak |
PerlJam: you're like the dual of a vegetarian! |
| 19:08 |
PerlJam |
s/like// |
| 19:08 |
PerlJam |
:) |
| 19:09 |
masak |
:) |
| 19:09 |
pmichaud |
it was often an interesting challenge to find eating places that had PerlJam and vegans in the dining group. :) |
| 19:09 |
masak |
it's horrible, my very first thought was "let PerlJam eat the vegans". |
| 19:09 |
masak |
I'll go have my brain checked now. |
| 19:10 |
PerlJam |
masak: well ... they eats what food eats. ;> |
| 19:10 |
masak |
exactly. |
| 19:11 |
* rindolf |
takes the blame for all the world's ailments. |
| 19:11 |
rindolf |
Blame it all on me. |
| 19:11 |
rindolf |
All problems go away when you find someone to blame. |
| 19:11 |
* PerlJam |
blames rindolf |
| 19:12 |
PerlJam |
nope ... problems are still there. |
| 19:12 |
* PerlJam |
blames rindolf *harder* |
| 19:12 |
masak |
empiricism. it works, baby. |
| 19:12 |
* rindolf |
blames himself the hardest-most-awesomest-greatest-bestest-hippest-something! |
| 19:12 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: I am the Omega of scapegoats! |
| 19:13 |
* PerlJam |
wonders if early british misunderstood the meaning of "empiricism" |
| 19:13 |
rindolf |
LOL. |
| 19:13 |
rindolf |
I think I'll make a fortune out of this conversation. |
| 19:14 |
rindolf |
fortune cookie. |
| 19:14 |
rindolf |
I'm unlikely to sell it on E-bay and get rich. |
| 19:14 |
* rindolf |
wonders how much he can sell the word «hello» for. |
| 19:14 |
masak |
PerlJam: "empiricism" seems to etymologize back to Gr "peirân", "to attempt". |
| 19:15 |
rindolf |
Now on bargain! Only $39.99! Get your own copy of «hello» now. |
| 19:15 |
rindolf |
masak: Greek? |
| 19:15 |
rindolf |
masak: ah, sounds logical. |
| 19:16 |
rindolf |
masak: wasn't ancient Greek very ambiguous? Like Ancient Hebrew? |
| 19:16 |
|
cognominal joined #perl6 |
| 19:17 |
masak |
rindolf: not that I know. |
| 19:17 |
rindolf |
Well, I know Carpe from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carpe_diem (which is Latin) meant much more than "Seize". |
| 19:17 |
rindolf |
masak: ah. |
| 19:17 |
masak |
well, it's common for verbs to have many meanings :) not just in Latin. |
| 19:17 |
rindolf |
masak: did you read Aesop, Plato, Aristotle, etc. in the original Greek? |
| 19:17 |
rindolf |
masak: ah. |
| 19:17 |
rindolf |
masak: yeah, maybe. |
| 19:18 |
masak |
rindolf: no, I didn't. but that sounds kinda wonderful. |
| 19:18 |
jnthn |
.oO( Do fishermen say "carp diem"? ) |
| 19:18 |
rindolf |
masak: I only read translations and adaptations. |
| 19:19 |
rindolf |
masak: there's http://classics.mit.edu/ which contains translations of Greek and Latin stuff to English. Somewhat archaic ones though. |
| 19:19 |
masak |
rindolf: case in point: "take" on dictionary.com seems to have 126 definitions. |
| 19:19 |
rindolf |
masak: I gave up on Aristotle's Prior Analytics and Posterior analytics. |
| 19:19 |
* masak |
.oO( Aristotle's Posterior Analytics can kiss my ass ) |
| 19:20 |
rindolf |
masak: yes, but a lot of that is stuff like "take on", "take out", "take in", etc. |
| 19:20 |
rindolf |
Which I'm not sure existed like that in Latin. |
| 19:20 |
rindolf |
masak: but point taken. |
| 19:20 |
masak |
:) |
| 19:20 |
PerlJam |
"take out" probably didn't :) |
| 19:20 |
masak |
yeah, Latin is more ablative-based :P |
| 19:21 |
rindolf |
masak: wasn't it Socrates who decided that philosophy can and should be done in prose instead of in verse? |
| 19:21 |
rindolf |
masak: which was considered profane back then. |
| 19:22 |
rindolf |
masak: well, it's hard to sing a conversation. |
| 19:22 |
rindolf |
prose is much more expressive than poetry/verse. |
| 19:23 |
PerlJam |
rindolf: Tell that to Dr Seuss |
| 19:23 |
PerlJam |
or Shakespeare |
| 19:23 |
rindolf |
I was told prose is a left-hemisphere function while poetry, song and music are right hemisphere functions. |
| 19:23 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: heh. |
| 19:23 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: Shakespeare wrote a lot of prose. |
| 19:24 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: there is this video of Elton John composing a song with the instructions of the visitor's new oven. |
| 19:24 |
masak |
rindolf: your counterargumentor is broken. :) |
| 19:24 |
rindolf |
masak: what? |
| 19:25 |
rindolf |
masak: there's also how the Jewish Bible is recited in Jewish ceremonies. Oh my God, what braindamage! |
| 19:26 |
PerlJam |
rindolf: would it have been better had I said "tell that to all the people listed here: http://www.poetrysoup.com/famous_poets/most_popular_famous_poets.aspx" ? :) |
| 19:26 |
masak |
rindolf: "Shakespeare wrote a lot of prose" isn't a counterargument to "Tell that to [Shakespeare] [who could write expressive poetry/verse]" |
| 19:26 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: heh, I just sang what you said to me. |
| 19:27 |
PerlJam |
rindolf: in english? |
| 19:27 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: yes! |
| 19:27 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: of course, I don't know the notes. |
| 19:28 |
* geekosaur |
is reminded of the opera quartet that sang the commentary to a french football (or was it rugby?) game for sky sports at one point |
| 19:28 |
PerlJam |
rindolf: you continue to prove your particular brand of weirdness to me :) |
| 19:28 |
masak |
I would *pay* to have the #perl6 logs sung to me. preferably in a Gillbert and Sullivan. |
| 19:29 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: I used to have good musical intuition and talent, but I've been out of practice for a long time. |
| 19:29 |
rindolf |
masak: heh. |
| 19:29 |
masak |
*style |
| 19:29 |
PerlJam |
I bet rhyming and verse were originally mnemonic devices anyway. Easier to remember those long stories back before the age of books. |
| 19:29 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: I cultivate my weirdness. I keep working on it. It requires constant care and maintenance. |
| 19:29 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: well, and now I'm a little hypomanic. |
| 19:30 |
PerlJam |
rindolf: you are doing a fine and excellent job! Keep up the good work! |
| 19:30 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: thanks! |
| 19:30 |
rindolf |
Soon I'll be the most eccentric person on earth. |
| 19:30 |
rindolf |
And then it's ... world domination! |
| 19:31 |
PerlJam |
rindolf: what's the metric by which you would measure "most eccentric"? |
| 19:31 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: I bought a webcam and a microphone and want to record some silly stuff and YouTube it. |
| 19:31 |
PerlJam |
eccentricities are all unique-ish as far as I can tell, ergo they are incomparable. |
| 19:32 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: yes, every eccentric person is a unique snowflake. |
| 19:32 |
PerlJam |
That sounded like "every SHA256 is a 16 bit CRC" |
| 19:32 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: thing is in real life, I appear like a normal guy, albeit somewhat dorky and geeky. |
| 19:33 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: even my name means Shalom-ful where Shalom is "well-being", "peace", "serenity", "tranquility", "harmony", "welfare", "safety", etc. |
| 19:34 |
masak |
"Which version you ought to use is mostly dependent on what you want to get done." -- http://wiki.python.org/moin/Python2orPython3 |
| 19:34 |
huf |
t...there's m..more than one way to do it? |
| 19:34 |
PerlJam |
masak: I wonder if we could get a whole bunch of "agnostic" quotes like that that were meant for other languages and put them on a Perl 6 page. |
| 19:35 |
masak |
PerlJam: clearly "most eccentric" means that the ratio of his major an minor axes exceeds anyone else's. |
| 19:36 |
masak |
huf: :) |
| 19:36 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: however, if you read my stories and other works of humour (and my essays/blog posts/etc.) you'll see some of the crazy stuff that goes below the surface. |
| 19:36 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: http://www.shlomifish.org/humour/Selina-Mandrake/ - this is my most farfetched story yet, and I actually feel it's my most honest one. |
| 19:37 |
masak |
"But wouldn't I want to avoid 2.x? It's an old language with many mistakes, and it took a major version to get them out." -- "Well, not entirely. Some of the less disruptive improvements in 3.0 and 3.1 have been backported to 2.6 and 2.7, respectively." |
| 19:37 |
masak |
this is highly interesting. |
| 19:37 |
PerlJam |
rindolf: um ... isn't that just Buffy but tweaked? |
| 19:37 |
huf |
rindolf: is that the one you sent an .ogg recording of to me? |
| 19:37 |
timotimo |
indeed, there were lots of improvements in 2.7 that make it nicer to use if you can't go to 3 outright |
| 19:38 |
PerlJam |
rindolf: I mean, your parody is "just" a parody |
| 19:38 |
PerlJam |
rindolf: it's not "out there" |
| 19:38 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: it's much more than that. |
| 19:39 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: first of all it's a parody/reflection/modernisation/interpretation/tribute/etc. |
| 19:39 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: and I convey a lot of my personal philosophy there. Some serious stuff. |
| 19:39 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: the screenplay takes itself very seriously. |
| 19:42 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: have you watched Buffy? |
| 19:43 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: my two other ideas for stories will be less farfetched. |
| 19:43 |
rindolf |
PerlJam: I mean my two next ones. |
| 19:43 |
rindolf |
http://www.shlomifish.org/humour/human-hacking/ - this is my most normal story yet. |
| 19:44 |
rindolf |
Kinda emulating a teen story, but much more than that. |
| 19:44 |
rindolf |
But the two main characters are based on Buffy and Faith from the show. |
| 20:01 |
pmichaud |
(gilbert and sullivan) now I'm tempted to make a song about the Perl 6 operators, in the style of Tom Lehrer's "The Elements" :-/ |
| 20:03 |
FROGGS |
++pmichaud |
| 20:03 |
FROGGS |
I'll buy that single :o) |
| 20:07 |
diakopter |
r: say e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e |
| 20:07 |
p6eval |
rakudo 2a41b3: OUTPUT«2.71828182845905â¤Â» |
| 20:08 |
diakopter |
n: say e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e:e |
| 20:08 |
p6eval |
niecza v24-35-g5c06e28: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY