Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2013-05-14

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
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00:36 gtodd p5eval: use autobox ;
00:36 p5eval gtodd: ERROR: Can't locate autobox.pm in @INC (@INC contains: /lib) at (eval 7) line 1.BEGIN failed--compilation aborted at (eval 7) line 1.
00:36 gtodd :-)
00:37 fgomez joined #perl6
00:38 * gtodd wonders if there's a perl5i compiler bot along with p5eval, rakudo, niecza
00:40 diakopter p5eval: use perl5i::2;
00:40 p5eval diakopter: ERROR: Can't locate perl5i/2.pm in @INC (@INC contains: /lib) at (eval 7) line 1.BEGIN failed--compilation aborted at (eval 7) line 1.
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00:47 diakopter gtodd: oh, I presume perl5i uses autobox...
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02:22 dalek perl6-bench: 75540d3 | (Geoffrey Broadwell)++ | timeall:
02:22 dalek perl6-bench: Properly handle best_times() and subtract_times() for scalable tests in timeall
02:22 dalek perl6-bench: review: https://github.com/japhb/perl6-bench/commit/75540d3d13
02:22 dalek perl6-bench: 796439f | (Geoffrey Broadwell)++ | analyze:
02:22 dalek perl6-bench: Refactor options processing in analyze
02:22 dalek perl6-bench: review: https://github.com/japhb/perl6-bench/commit/796439f995
02:22 dalek perl6-bench: d58e086 | (Geoffrey Broadwell)++ | analyze:
02:22 dalek perl6-bench: Factor analyze_timings_files() out of analyze MAIN()
02:22 dalek perl6-bench: review: https://github.com/japhb/perl6-bench/commit/d58e086f3b
02:22 dalek perl6-bench: e21737c | (Geoffrey Broadwell)++ | analyze:
02:22 dalek perl6-bench: Begin fixing analyze to handle new scaled timings files from timeall: handled ungrouped compiler info
02:22 dalek perl6-bench: review: https://github.com/japhb/perl6-bench/commit/e21737c653
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04:45 diakopter .tell moritz I *love* the collapsed join/part msgs; nice!
04:45 yoleaux diakopter: I'll pass your message to moritz.
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07:16 moritz good morning
07:16 yoleaux 04:45Z <diakopter> moritz: I *love* the collapsed join/part msgs; nice!
07:16 * moritz too
07:16 sorear good morning moritz.
07:17 FROGGS morning
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07:42 lizmat morning #perl6!
07:43 FROGGS morning lizmat
07:43 lizmat 1 spectest failure after my :delete :exists fixes, checking now
07:44 dalek v5: 15fab88 | (Tobias Leich)++ | lib/Perl5/ (2 files):
07:44 dalek v5: dispatch prefix:<local> to prefix:<temp>
07:44 dalek v5: review: https://github.com/rakudo-p5/v5/commit/15fab88e7a
07:44 sorear morning lizmat!
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07:58 lizmat so what is the right way of running a single spectest test-file?
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07:58 tadzik ./perl6 t/spec/test/file?
07:59 nwc10 I thought ./perl6 -Ilib path/to/it
07:59 tadzik or prove -e perl6 (...)
07:59 tadzik but fudge it first
07:59 lizmat you mean, run the .rakudo version?
07:59 tadzik yeah
08:00 lizmat the thing is, if I run this inside the spectest, I get this:
08:00 lizmat t/spec/S03-feeds/basic.rakudo ............................. All 19 subtests passed
08:00 lizmat (less 5 skipped subtests: 14 okay)
08:00 lizmat if I run it separately, I get: # Looks like you planned 19 tests, but ran 21
08:00 lizmat # FUDGED!
08:01 FROGGS make sometests TESTFILES=t/spec/...
08:01 moritz so, it complains about a wrong test plan, or that it ran too many tets
08:01 FROGGS this will fudge too, and then  I usually run the .rakudo test directly, to get some output
08:02 lizmat Parse errors: Bad plan.  You planned 19 tests but ran 21.
08:02 lizmat FROGGS++ that generates the test summary report
08:02 lizmat and indeed… 2 errors
08:03 lizmat seems it is getting too many "ok 15 - # SKIP double-ended feeds" now
08:03 lizmat hmmm...
08:05 lizmat it says that is both ok, and failed? https://gist.github.com/lizmat/5574406
08:06 moritz where does it say it's ok?
08:07 moritz all subtests passing is not sufficient for a test file passing
08:07 moritz you also need to satisfy the test plan, and exit with a return code of 0
08:07 dalek v5: 630b49f | (Tobias Leich)++ | STATUS.md:
08:07 dalek v5: status update
08:07 dalek v5: review: https://github.com/rakudo-p5/v5/commit/630b49f160
08:08 lizmat aha… ok
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08:12 lizmat in the section marked "#?rakudo skip 'double-ended feeds'" I only see 2 times is(), yet it generates 4 "ok N - # SKIP double-ended feeds"
08:13 lizmat is that expected?
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08:15 moritz lizmat: there are two sections that are skipped with 'double-ended feeds', and each contains two tests
08:16 lizmat grrr… duh
08:16 lizmat so the plan just seems to be wrong
08:17 moritz $ ack '\b(is|ok|lives_ok|dies_ok)\b' S03-feeds/basic.t|wc -l
08:17 moritz 24
08:18 moritz that's what my manual counting also produces
08:18 moritz @data ==> grep {/<[aeiouy]>/} ==> is($(*), $(@out), 'basic test for $(*)');
08:18 moritz I'm pretty sure fudged won't recognize lines like these as tests
08:20 lizmat grrr: Parse errors: Bad plan.  You planned 24 tests but ran 21.
08:20 lizmat ok, will look at this after fitness, afk for a few hours
08:23 dalek roast: bb94740 | moritz++ | S03-feeds/basic.t:
08:23 dalek roast: fix test plan, rakudo fudging
08:23 dalek roast:
08:23 dalek roast: also move a block to the end of the file, because
08:23 dalek roast: providing a #?DOES seems to confuse fudge for the subsequent blocks
08:23 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/bb94740cb3
08:23 moritz lizmat: fixed it for you, that one was a bit tricky
08:24 lizmat ok, cool, running spectest while doing fitness  :-)
08:24 lizmat moritz++
08:24 dalek v5: 9ef59dc | (Tobias Leich)++ | README.md:
08:24 dalek v5: added installation instruction and updated description
08:24 dalek v5: review: https://github.com/rakudo-p5/v5/commit/9ef59dc83d
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08:36 moritz http://perlweekly.com/archive/94.html I wonder if "punpking" is a typo, a pun, or both :-)
08:39 shachaf Perhaps it's all three!
08:39 moritz this is starting to be become recursively recursive
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08:42 * labster reads
08:42 labster Whoa, how did I explain why companies switch to Python?
08:44 moritz no
08:44 moritz because they have trouble finding good perl programmers?
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08:50 tadzik python is easier, there are more python programers, so using python is cheaper for them
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09:29 moritz http://terralang.org/ seems interesting
09:29 moritz the front page is a bit weak
09:30 moritz but it seems to be designed for code generation
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09:44 nwc10 but which Python?
09:45 moritz python 5.7 of course -- the best of 2.7 and 3.0 combined!
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09:58 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: cdbb9d1 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/ (2 files):
09:58 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: Avoid an apparent invokedynamic bug.
09:58 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support:
09:58 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: Seems that optional args to the resolver can somehow get "lost" in a
09:58 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: sufficiently large class file. Weird.
09:58 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/cdbb9d1896
09:58 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: 5eac9c8 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/jast2bc/JASTToJVMBytecode.java:
09:58 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: Correct an error.
09:58 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/5eac9c843d
09:59 hoelzro why is it that there hasn't been a * release since February? is it because the next one will be with a JVM Rakudo?
09:59 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: 35d1f37 | jnthn++ | src/Perl6/World.nqp:
09:59 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: A couple of portability tweaks to module loading.
09:59 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/35d1f37fd1
09:59 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: a3a2574 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/rakudo/ (2 files):
09:59 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: Implement optional parameter binding.
09:59 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/a3a2574dc3
09:59 nwc10 hoelzro: I believe that it's been mentioned on the list (shock, horror!)
09:59 jnthn hoelzro: No, it's 'cus the relesae candidates so far have had failing module tests, iirc.
09:59 * hoelzro looks
09:59 hoelzro oh, I see
09:59 nwc10 because there isn't (yet) a continuious integration process to spot this earlier.
10:00 jnthn *nod*
10:00 nwc10 or however it's spelled
10:01 hoelzro alright
10:01 hoelzro seems reasonable
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10:27 lizmat is there a way to have multiple MMD candidates share the same code block?
10:27 jnthn no
10:27 lizmat too bad  :-)
10:28 lizmat I guess this is really an optimisation issue, to be handled by the optimiser?
10:29 jnthn Well, depends what you're optimizing for.
10:29 lizmat in this case memory, I would think?
10:29 jnthn If it can look at the arguments it's getting to each one and do some inlining specific to each of them, you could potentially come out ahead on speed.
10:30 jnthn So, it's probably a trade-off.
10:30 jnthn (The optimizer already potentially can do that kind of inlining, fwiw.)
10:30 jnthn (Though it can't do dupe code elimination yet.)
10:31 lizmat well, if the code gets serialized, it would mean smaller bytecode files, so faster startup  :-)
10:31 moritz fwiw we once had a syntax   sub f (signature 1) | (signature 2) { ... }
10:31 lizmat I guess that becomes less of an issue with SSD's
10:31 moritz that allowed two multi candidates to share the same code
10:33 lizmat I think it would be an optimizer thing: developers may not see that the code is the same many times
10:34 lizmat otoh, it would mean less maintenance (and less chance of fixing one place where it needed to be fixed in two)
10:34 lizmat anyways, just making sure I'm not forgetting obvious things to do
10:35 lizmat jnthn: would "multi method at_key(Any:U \SELF: $key) is rw {" not also be a candidate for adding a "Mu" type to $key ?
10:35 jnthn lizmat: Hmm...I guess that's the auto-viv one...
10:36 jnthn lizmat: I suppose yes.
10:36 lizmat will do and test
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10:42 Juerd lizmat: Serialised code for faster startup? Not just with SSDs, but with even with a network filesystem that doesn't sound like a useful optimization. Anything will do at least 10 MB/s now. That's a shitload of code. If you have more than that, the startup overhead is probably the least of your worries.
10:42 Juerd s/S/Smaller s/
10:43 Juerd lizmat: Also, caching will take care of the 2nd and consequent runs.
10:44 Juerd I've seen servers with crashed RAID arrays that continued to serve websites perfectly because everything was in cache :)
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10:52 kresike hello all you happy perl6 people
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11:03 colomon \o
11:06 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: 0de5175 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/ (2 files):
11:06 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: Initial bits of SC repossession support.
11:06 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support:
11:06 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: This doesn't serialize/deserialize the repossessions, but at least
11:06 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: should mean we start to detect and record them.
11:06 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/0de5175d23
11:06 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: a0f9501 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/sixmodel/SerializationWriter.java:
11:06 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: Serialize repossessions table.
11:06 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/a0f9501adc
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11:44 FROGGS r: my $a = "abc"; say $a ~~ s/b//
11:44 camelia rakudo 2a04f2: OUTPUT«True␤»
11:47 FROGGS r: my $a = "abc"; say $a ~~ s/c$//
11:47 camelia rakudo 2a04f2: OUTPUT«True␤»
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11:54 FROGGS r: my $RS = 'c'; sub my_chomp(*@s is rw) { for @s -> $s is rw { say "s: $s"; if $s ~~ s/$RS$// { say $RS } } }; my $a = "abc"; my_chomp($a); say "a: $a"
11:54 camelia rakudo 2a04f2: OUTPUT«s: abc␤a: ab␤»
11:56 FROGGS r: sub my_chomp(*@s is rw) { for @s -> $s is rw { say "s: $s"; if $s ~~ s/c// { say "did it!" } } }; my $a = "abc"; my_chomp($a); say "a: $a"
11:56 camelia rakudo 2a04f2: OUTPUT«s: abc␤a: ab␤»
11:56 FROGGS RAKUDOBUG
11:56 FROGGS r: sub my_chomp(*@s is rw) { for @s -> $s is rw { say "s: $s"; say $s ~~ s/c// } }; my $a = "abc"; my_chomp($a); say "a: $a"
11:56 camelia rakudo 2a04f2: OUTPUT«s: abc␤False␤a: ab␤»
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11:58 FROGGS r: my $a = "abc"; for $a -> $s is rw { say $s ~~ s/b// }; say $a
11:58 camelia rakudo 2a04f2: OUTPUT«False␤ac␤»
11:59 FROGGS a bit shorter
12:00 colomon n: my $a = "abc"; for $a -> $s is rw { say $s ~~ s/b// }; say $a
12:00 camelia niecza v24-50-gba63d9a: OUTPUT«True␤ac␤»
12:01 FROGGS nr: my $a = "abc"; for $a -> $s is rw { say $s ~~ /b/; say $/ };
12:02 camelia rakudo 2a04f2, niecza v24-50-gba63d9a: OUTPUT«「b」␤␤「b」␤␤»
12:02 FROGGS nr: my $a = "abc"; for $a -> $s is rw { say $s ~~ s/b//; say $/ };
12:02 camelia niecza v24-50-gba63d9a: OUTPUT«True␤「b」␤␤»
12:02 camelia ..rakudo 2a04f2: OUTPUT«False␤(Any)␤»
12:02 FROGGS substitution only
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12:17 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: 2416ad0 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/sixmodel/SerializationReader.java:
12:17 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: Basic repossession handling on deserialize.
12:17 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/2416ad0a14
12:17 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: a7f1e8b | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/sixmodel/SerializationWriter.java:
12:17 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: Fix buffer resize fail.
12:17 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/a7f1e8b111
12:17 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: bf18546 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/sixmodel/reprs/NFA.java:
12:17 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: Quieten NFA serialize NYI.
12:17 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/bf18546955
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12:34 * [Coke] should add a star continuous build, eh?
12:36 FROGGS r: multi sub test { say CALLER::<$_> }; $_ = "hello"; ::("&test")()
12:36 camelia rakudo 2a04f2: OUTPUT«(Any)␤»
12:37 FROGGS r: multi sub test { say CALLER::<$_> }; $_ = "hello"; test()
12:37 camelia rakudo 2a04f2: OUTPUT«hello␤»
12:37 FROGGS jnthn: do you have a hint what is going wrong there?
12:37 * FROGGS fears that jnthn is saying "you can't do it that way"
12:40 jnthn I can guess, at lesat.
12:40 FROGGS \o/
12:40 jnthn CALLER:: looks a frame out.
12:40 jnthn When you call a multi then you are actually calling a proto which then does the multi-dispatch.
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12:41 jnthn Really doing that gets costly, though, so a bunch of the time we inline that proto.
12:41 jnthn An indirect call through ::(...) thwarts the optimizer, however. So you have to go via the proto.
12:41 jnthn So in that case there's 2 frames there, not one.
12:41 FROGGS I see
12:42 jnthn Maybe try DYNAMIC:: instead of CALLER::
12:42 jnthn Or CALLER::DYNAMIC::<$_>
12:42 FROGGS r: multi sub test { say DYNAMIC::<$_> }; $_ = "hello"; test()
12:42 camelia rakudo 2a04f2: OUTPUT«(Any)␤»
12:42 FROGGS r: multi sub test { say CALLER::DYNAMIC::<$_> }; $_ = "hello"; test()
12:42 camelia rakudo 2a04f2: OUTPUT«hello␤»
12:42 FROGGS r: multi sub test { say CALLER::DYNAMIC::<$_> }; $_ = "hello"; ::("&test")()
12:42 camelia rakudo 2a04f2: OUTPUT«hello␤»
12:42 FROGGS r: multi sub test { say CALLER::DYNAMIC::<$_> }; $_ = "hello"; test() # took long
12:42 camelia rakudo 2a04f2: OUTPUT«hello␤»
12:43 FROGGS okay, just was a hickup
12:43 FROGGS jnthn++ # thanks!
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12:43 jnthn Hm, the setting currently loads as far as line 4445, where it ties to construct a Pair and then has a sad...
12:43 jnthn Well, with local patches.
12:44 jnthn Somebody may wish to look at constant folding the ~ operator, BTW.
12:44 jnthn Or why the current folder doesn't manage it.
12:44 FROGGS timotimo: a job for you! :P
12:45 FROGGS but getting to line 4445 sounds pretty cool actually
12:46 [Coke] I don't know what the rollup summary would look like, but at this point, would a daily dump of the build output from a star build be sufficient?
12:46 jnthn Well, we don't run that much up to that point.
12:46 moritz jnthn: prefix ~ or infix ~ ?
12:46 jnthn [Coke]: Pushed to github each day like the roast ones would be awesome, then we can use diff
12:46 jnthn moritz: infix
12:47 jnthn moritz: I noticed 'cus one bit of the setting does a bunch of ~s (in class Str) and it calls infix:<~> for all of them.
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12:47 moritz jnthn: iirc I had some bootstrappy issues with some few operators
12:47 * jnthn currently has epic reams of debugging output.
12:47 [Coke] jnthn: ok. I can have a shell of that done during my lunch break, and finalize it tonight.
12:47 jnthn [Coke]++!
12:47 [Coke] jnthn: do we want the *whole* build output? just the test output?
12:47 jnthn oh...it explodes when making a Pair 'cus I didn't implement named arg binding. It even tells me that :)
12:47 [Coke] (split into files?)
12:48 jnthn [Coke]: The test output sounds like the useful bit, though if the build fails that is also useful....
12:48 moritz jnthn: iirc multiple ~ in one expression are compiled to a listop call; so if one of them isn't known at compile time, nothing is constant folded
12:48 [Coke] "thanks jnthn from several days ago!"
12:48 jnthn moritz: Hm. But all these ones are.
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12:48 jnthn moritz: Maybe it's 'cus it's in the setting or maybe 'cus of the list assoc.
12:48 * jnthn wants to focus on setting loading for now ;)
12:49 moritz oh, it's not marked as 'is pure'
12:49 moritz so I'll try to mark it as that, and then look if the setting still compiles :-)
12:50 jnthn moritz++
12:50 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: b546d47 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/sixmodel/reprs/P6Opaque.java:
12:50 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: Add missing get_storage_spec in P6opaque.
12:50 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/b546d47359
12:50 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: 34dd073 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/runtime/Ops.java:
12:50 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: Missing deconts in istype.
12:50 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/34dd07342b
12:50 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: b4d48e2 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/runtime/Ops.java:
12:50 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: Revise smart_stringify a bit.
12:50 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/b4d48e28db
12:50 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: bb9f52a | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/runtime/Ops.java:
12:50 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: inf/neginf/nan/isnanorinf ops.
12:50 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/bb9f52a108
12:51 moritz stage optimize finished
12:51 moritz that's a good sign
12:52 moritz fwiw ilbot6 on postgresql has been happily logging for a day now
12:54 arnsholt \o/
12:54 * [Coke] sees "Quieten" go by in the logs, and misreads it as "Quoten"
12:54 arnsholt moritz: Have you tracked memory usage?
12:55 * [Coke] assumes that a daily build of star should just use the versions of nqp/parrot in the repo.
12:56 [Coke] (... or maybe master, but I doubt it)
12:56 moritz arnsholt: it's at 695MB :/
12:56 moritz arnsholt: don't know what it started with
12:57 kst joined #perl6
12:57 FROGGS moritz: so you can still burn it on cd! \o/
12:57 arnsholt Yeah. I suspect a long-running Zavolaj process will leak memory steadily
12:57 arnsholt It's an unfortunate limitation of the conservative internals we have ATM
12:57 moritz arnsholt++ # making me look at htop found that I had an unnecessary memcached running on my workstation
12:58 arnsholt ^_^
12:58 * jnthn sees his face in a conf brochure and realizes he really had better figure out what to talk about there :)
12:58 arnsholt =D
12:58 jnthn oh, but it's in November. I've got a bit :)
13:00 arnsholt Plenty of time! =)
13:00 lizmat jnthn: who knows what will happen in the mean time!
13:00 rindolf joined #perl6
13:05 * [Coke] decided he's not going to YAPC::NA this year, folks. I'll trying to be online during the hackathons, though.
13:06 moritz then at leastn I'm not the only one missing from the party :-)
13:06 [Coke] *try to be
13:08 _daniel-s__ joined #perl6
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13:12 daxim joined #perl6
13:13 * pmichaud is sad Coke++ won't be at yapc::na.
13:13 pmichaud good morning, #perl6
13:14 lizmat morning pmichaud!
13:14 jnthn o/ pmichaud
13:15 FROGGS hi pmichaud
13:15 rindolf joined #perl6
13:15 FROGGS [Coke]: ó.ò
13:16 [Coke] If only I could somehow use perl in my Java-only work environment...
13:16 [Coke] then maybe I could justify the expense :)
13:16 FROGGS moritz: we still need to find a new date for our mini hackathon :o)
13:16 pmichaud [Coke]: you need to come to the conference to learn about Perl 6 on the JVM.  :)
13:16 jnthn pmichaud: "might it be better to simply change the existing candidates to be :$delete where ?$delete"
13:17 jnthn pmichaud: It would not because the multi-dispatcher can deal with the "required named arg is missing" path rather cheaply.
13:17 lizmat jnthn: this is about my pull request?
13:17 pmichaud jnthn: I'm talking about the case where the named are is present but false.
13:18 pmichaud *named arg
13:18 jnthn pmichaud: Yes, but you removed the !
13:18 jnthn pmichaud: Was that deliberate?
13:18 pmichaud yes.
13:18 pmichaud I'm removing the candidate.
13:18 [Coke] hurm. "make modules-tests" in star doesn't actually error out when there are errors.
13:18 pmichaud I'm removing the !candidate
13:18 pmichaud I'm leaving the existing candidate but making it  :$delete where ?$delete"
13:18 pmichaud so that it's only called if :delete exists and is true.
13:19 pmichaud otherwise, it should fall back to the case of ... oh, wait.
13:19 jnthn Yes but then you force a bind check and invocation of the where block.
13:19 Targen joined #perl6
13:19 pmichaud aren't we doing that in the "where 0" case anyway?
13:20 lizmat I was going for making the special case special
13:20 lizmat and the normal case easier, hence no where for the other case
13:20 leprevost joined #perl6
13:20 lizmat was that a bad idea?
13:20 jnthn If the multi-dispatcher sees :$delete! then it can quickly look and see if we've any matching named arg, and then just disregard the candidate.
13:20 pmichaud lizmat: to me, the special case is  :delete  :-)
13:20 pmichaud jnthn: I understand that part.
13:21 jnthn If you make it :$delete then it's an optional named so the fast-path won't work.
13:21 pmichaud okay, I meant   :$delete! where ?$delete then
13:21 pmichaud I was thinking of the wrong !
13:21 pmichaud (I was thinking  :$delete where !$delete)
13:21 pmichaud Yes, there should be a ! after :$delete
13:21 * pmichaud adds to ticket.
13:21 jnthn phew :)
13:22 dalek v5: c0120c2 | (Tobias Leich)++ | / (2 files):
13:22 dalek v5: let chomped do what it is meant for
13:22 dalek v5: review: https://github.com/rakudo-p5/v5/commit/c0120c2079
13:22 pmichaud lizmat: I tend to think of  :!delete  or :delete(0) as being the default case (normally we aren't deleting), with :delete being the special case.
13:23 pmichaud thus  :!delete  or :delete(0) should do exactly the same thing as when :delete isn't present at all.
13:23 lizmat the thing is that I found out the hard way, you can't do a "where True"
13:23 pmichaud right, thus ?$delete
13:23 lizmat ah, good point
13:24 lizmat ok, so lose the where 0 candidate, and make the other "$delete! where $delete
13:24 pmichaud well, not yet :)
13:24 lizmat that makes sense to me...
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13:24 lizmat ah…  :-(
13:24 pmichaud there's a problem with my fallback approach in that if the other candidates don't have a named :$delete arg they'll never match (when we convert postcircumfix to be a sub instead of a method)
13:25 pmichaud unless we add *%_ to all of the candidates.
13:25 pmichaud (well, all of the fallback ones)
13:25 pmichaud jnthn: opinion on ^^^^
13:27 [Coke] https://github.com/rakudo/star/issues/21 - there's some low hanging p5 fruit.
13:27 jnthn We could add a *% without hosing the inline, I *think*.
13:27 [Coke] anyone wants to help get a star release out the door, there's your chance. :)
13:28 rindolf joined #perl6
13:28 pmichaud [Coke]++   oooh, nice.
13:29 pmichaud btw, I'm looking for my p6 tuit level to spike dramatically upward in a week.
13:29 [Coke] \o
13:29 pmichaud (it will be essentially zero after today, though)
13:29 pmichaud lizmat: okay, I'd say go with the fallback approach for now.
13:30 pmichaud as in,  lose the where 0 candidate, and make the existing ones  :$delete! where ?$delete
13:30 lizmat ok, will do that
13:31 lizmat this also fixes my question of sharing code blocks between candidates, btw, at least in this case
13:32 FROGGS (in a week)++
13:33 lizmat pmichaud: hmmm… actually, that won't work  :-(
13:34 * pmichaud adds an "easy" label to star issue #21
13:34 pmichaud lizmat: won't work because...?
13:34 pmichaud (what did I overlook?  ;-)
13:35 lizmat for exists: then the fall back will not revert the meaning SELF.exists
13:35 lizmat so maybe just have one candidate, and handle the value inside the candidate
13:35 lizmat would that make more sense then?
13:35 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: 71263c6 | jnthn++ | src/core/Stash.pm:
13:35 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: Thinko spotted while debugging.
13:35 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/71263c6583
13:35 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: 63e5222 | jnthn++ | src/ (2 files):
13:35 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: Set up boxing to Perl 6 types.
13:35 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/63e5222095
13:35 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: f7ac11d | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/rakudo/Binder.java:
13:35 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: Implement named (non-slurpy) binding.
13:35 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/f7ac11dc3e
13:35 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: 89aec58 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/rakudo/Ops.java:
13:35 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: Implement nqp::p6listitems.
13:35 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/89aec58e17
13:36 * lizmat was under the impression that having more candidates would allow more work to be done at compile time
13:36 mtk joined #perl6
13:36 pmichaud ah, yes... exists changes meaning here.  for :exists I'm fine with either separate candidates or a single candidate that handles it
13:36 lizmat and being able to select candidates for :delete, :exists and :!exists at dompile time
13:36 lizmat *compile
13:37 pmichaud while they're methods we can't do much in the way of compile-time evaluation, but when they become subs we will be able to.
13:37 pmichaud at the moment it might be a slighly premature optimization to try to figure out the best way to go there, though.
13:37 dmol joined #perl6
13:38 lizmat ok, fair enough, I guess I assumed we were further along then we are in that respect
13:38 lizmat the exists candidate now becomes: SELF.exists($key) ?^ $exists
13:39 lizmat !(SELF.exists($key) ?^ $exists)
13:39 lizmat actually
13:39 moritz erm
13:39 lizmat ?
13:39 moritz shouldn't it more like $exists ? SELF.exists($key) : SELF.at_key($key)  ?
13:39 moritz wait, I guess I should backlog first
13:39 * moritz goes into hiding again
13:40 lizmat no, $!exists is now specced to return true if it doesn't exist
13:40 lizmat :-)
13:40 lizmat :!exists rather
13:40 moritz (too many bangs (for the buck) confuse everybody, right? :-)
13:41 * PerlJam just got here and is already confused  :)
13:41 PerlJam good $localtime all
13:41 pmichaud also,   can   %h{@keys}:kv($kv)   be written as   %h{@keys}:$kv ?    (just curious)
13:41 rindolf joined #perl6
13:41 pmichaud std:  my %h;  say %h{@keys}:$kv
13:41 camelia std b33d8e0: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤Variable @keys is not predeclared at /tmp/3RjxgEQE0W line 1:â�¤------> [32mmy %h;  say %h{[33mâ��[31m@keys}:$kv[0mâ�¤Variable $kv is not predeclared at /tmp/3RjxgEQE0W line 1:â�¤------> [32mmy %h;  say %h{@keys}:[33mâ��[31m$kv[0mâ�¤Check fa…
13:41 lizmat r: my %h; say %h<a>:!exists   # should become true
13:42 camelia rakudo 2a04f2: OUTPUT«False␤»
13:42 jnthn std: my %h; my @keys; my $kv; say %h{@keys}:$kv
13:42 pmichaud std:  my %h; my @keys; my $kv;   say %h{@keys}:$kv
13:42 camelia std b33d8e0: OUTPUT«ok 00:00 44m␤»
13:42 camelia std b33d8e0: OUTPUT«ok 00:00 44m␤»
13:42 jnthn r: my %h; my @keys; my $kv; say %h{@keys}:$kv
13:42 camelia rakudo 2a04f2: OUTPUT«␤»
13:42 jnthn yay, we parse it already too :)
13:42 lizmat pmichaud: another good point...
13:42 jnthn Darn, that adverb parsing was hard work to get right...
13:42 jnthn :)
13:42 pmichaud I'm fine with  :kv($kv)...   I was just curious if :$kv would work there or not.  Go with whatever is easiest to read.
13:43 pmichaud I suspect that trying to figure out adverb parsing cost me about four months in 2005.
13:43 pmichaud I finally made progress when I decided to not figure it out.
13:44 lizmat actual, those :kv fixes were collateral "damage"
13:44 lizmat in preparation on fixing :p / :k / :kv / :v
13:44 lizmat once we have clarity on that
13:45 pmichaud yeah, I wonder if  :p(0)  should be the same as "not present" also.
13:45 pmichaud so that it can just be the  :$p! where $?p   thingy
13:45 lizmat also, I do think there is a point with having :delete:p
13:46 lizmat it would easy slicing out pairs from one hash to another
13:46 lizmat or is there another idiom for that already?
13:46 pmichaud don't know of one... and that one seems "natural"
13:46 jnthn pmichaud: Ouch. It didn't take me that long, though I put it off for at least that long. ;)
13:47 jnthn pmichaud: I had STD to steal from, at least. IN 2005 you didn't so...argh.
13:47 pmichaud right
13:47 jnthn The way it works is, um, special.
13:47 pmichaud I finally decided I couldn't block on it anymore if we were going to get anywhere.
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13:50 moritz std: my %h; %h<a b>:p:delete
13:50 camelia std b33d8e0: OUTPUT«ok 00:00 43m␤»
13:50 pmichaud okay, I have to get to my other tasks... bbl
13:50 rindolf joined #perl6
13:50 lizmat pmichaud++
14:03 rindolf joined #perl6
14:07 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: bf28293 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/rakudo/Ops.java:
14:07 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: Implement nqp::p6arrfindtypes.
14:07 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/bf28293169
14:07 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: b7c3801 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/rakudo/Ops.java:
14:07 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: Implement nqp::p6shiftpush.
14:07 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/b7c3801323
14:17 rindolf joined #perl6
14:17 * FROGGS .oO( nqp::p6shush / nqp::p6pift ? )
14:19 * lizmat represses a Dr. Seuss reference
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14:24 lizmat fwiw, I had to code the :delete candidate as ":$delete! where so $delete"
14:24 dmol joined #perl6
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14:25 lizmat without the "so", that candidate would also be selected with :delete(0)
14:25 tadzik doesn't that make ! redundant?
14:25 lizmat the where?  or the so?
14:25 moritz no
14:25 tadzik ah, no, ok
14:26 lizmat not sure whether that is a problem in the selection logic or the smartmatching
14:26 dalek rakudo/nom: a9f3c63 | moritz++ | src/core/Stringy.pm:
14:26 dalek rakudo/nom: constant-fold infix:<~>
14:26 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/a9f3c63d3a
14:26 dalek rakudo/nom: 0d3c9b0 | moritz++ | src/core/Stringy.pm:
14:26 dalek rakudo/nom: potentially constant-fold more stringy operators
14:26 snarkyboojum_ joined #perl6
14:26 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/0d3c9b08fd
14:27 FROGGS_ joined #perl6
14:27 moritz git grep 'proto sub' | grep -v 'is pure' # potential gold mine for 'is pure' annotations
14:29 * moritz wonders if &defined can be made to constant-fold
14:30 lizmat I'm not sure you would have many real life situations where that would work
14:30 * moritz neither
14:31 sivoais_ joined #perl6
14:31 arnsholt It'd depend on how good the rest of the constant-folding is, I suppose
14:32 lizmat so, I have a test that blows up: want to mark it as todo, but even with that, it will make the script die and this fail that file
14:32 moritz #?rakudo skip 'oh noes, it dies'
14:32 arnsholt But yeah, in most cases the programmer probably knows if it'll always be undef
14:32 rindolf joined #perl6
14:33 lizmat moritz++
14:34 moritz I actually thought constant-folding &defined wouldn't easily work, because &defined is, well, defined so early
14:34 baest_ joined #perl6
14:34 moritz so it might not be easy to apply traits
14:34 Kelder joined #perl6
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14:37 arnsholt Ah, right. That I have no idea about
14:37 FROGGS_ std: use v5; $/ = \3; my %stuff = (1..4); say @stuff{1, 3}
14:37 Tene_ joined #perl6
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14:38 FROGGS std: hello?
14:38 jercos_ joined #perl6
14:39 lizmat seems like a netsplit pb to me
14:40 GlitchMr joined #perl6
14:40 FROGGS must be, yeah
14:40 sivoais joined #perl6
14:43 lizmat hmmm… so I've written some spectests, how do I push those (from my cloned repo?)
14:43 BooK joined #perl6
14:43 FROGGS git remote add ... ?
14:43 xilo joined #perl6
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14:48 lizmat but git remote add upstream git://github.com/rakudo/rakudo.git would be the wrong repo, no?
14:49 rking1 joined #perl6
14:49 lizmat as t/spec doesn't live there
14:49 lizmat perl6/roast.git I assume
14:49 sivoais joined #perl6
14:49 PerlJam lizmat: yes.
14:50 FROGGS right
14:53 lizmat so should I clone perl6/roast and submit a pull request?
14:53 jnthn You should already have a commit bit for that, I think.
14:55 lizmat it appears so
14:56 rindolf joined #perl6
14:58 FROGGS lizmat: you can work with pull requests but it might be handier if you just add perl6/roast as a remote and push directly to it
14:58 camelia joined #perl6
14:58 FROGGS camelia: \o/
14:58 FROGGS std: use v5; $/ = \3; my %stuff = (1..4); say @stuff{1, 3}
14:58 lizmat trying to do so, have some kind of permission issue
14:59 camelia std b33d8e0: OUTPUT«ok 00:01 54m␤»
14:59 kaare__ joined #perl6
15:00 arnsholt lizmat: Maybe your remote is set up to talk to the GitHub HTTPS part?
15:00 sivoais joined #perl6
15:00 arnsholt If you started out with a RO checkout you may have to twiddle that
15:00 lizmat twiddling  :-)
15:01 dalek roast: 5c7b4be | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S09-hashes/objecthash.t:
15:01 dalek roast: Tests for %h{Mu} support
15:01 dalek roast:
15:01 dalek roast: One test is dying badly still.  No idea to fix that.  Marked as "skip"
15:01 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/5c7b4be948
15:02 lizmat success!
15:02 lizmat arnsholt++
15:02 FROGGS lizmat++ # successfully twiddled :o)
15:02 FROGGS 'oh noes, it dies' *g*
15:05 dalek v5: 02ca4a1 | (Tobias Leich)++ | lib/Perl5/Terms.pm:
15:05 dalek v5: fixed slurp' paragraph mode, and added todo about slurp mode
15:05 dalek v5: review: https://github.com/rakudo-p5/v5/commit/02ca4a1df6
15:05 dalek v5: 7ba8e2c | (Tobias Leich)++ | / (3 files):
15:05 dalek v5: make qw() return an array instead of a string
15:05 dalek v5: review: https://github.com/rakudo-p5/v5/commit/7ba8e2c2d4
15:06 rindolf joined #perl6
15:06 FROGGS r: say (304 * 100 / 40185) ~'% v5 spectests pass'
15:06 camelia rakudo 2a04f2: OUTPUT«0.756501% v5 spectests pass␤»
15:06 tadzik \o/
15:06 FROGGS meh, should be the other way around
15:06 FROGGS (some day)
15:07 FROGGS ohh, and not to forget the bunch of test file which dont have a parseable plan :/
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15:26 FROGGS r: say &infix:<==>(1, 2)
15:26 camelia rakudo 0d3c9b: OUTPUT«False␤»
15:26 FROGGS r: say &infix:<==>(1, 1)
15:26 camelia rakudo 0d3c9b: OUTPUT«True␤»
15:26 FROGGS r: say &infix:{"=="}(1, 1)
15:26 camelia rakudo 0d3c9b: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤You can't adverb thatâ�¤at /tmp/i_ErpzjVDp:1â�¤------> [32msay &infix:{"=="}[33mâ��[31m(1, 1)[0mâ�¤    expecting any of:â�¤        postfixâ�¤        statement endâ�¤        statement modifierâ�¤        statement modifier loopâ�¤        horizontal w…
15:27 FROGGS hmmm
15:27 hugme joined #perl6
15:28 FROGGS r: say ::("&infix:<==>")(1, 1)
15:28 camelia rakudo 0d3c9b: OUTPUT«True␤»
15:28 FROGGS okay
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15:43 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: b051ece | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/runtime/ (3 files):
15:43 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: Cloning of container lexicals (state to come).
15:43 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/b051ece0f2
15:43 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: f8886f7 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/sixmodel/reprs/P6Opaque.java:
15:43 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: Make auto-viv'd attributes stick around.
15:43 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/f8886f73b4
15:45 ggoebel joined #perl6
15:47 dalek rakudo/nom: b41219e | moritz++ | src/core/Mu.pm:
15:47 dalek rakudo/nom: potentially constant-fold &defined
15:47 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/b41219e4f0
15:49 dmol joined #perl6
15:54 cognominal what is 'is pure'? It's not specced. Does it mean sub without side effects?
15:54 tadzik yeah
15:55 tadzik it's not a spec thing, it's Rakudo-specific, a hint to the optimizer
15:55 tadzik (or so I think)
15:57 cognominal it would be nice to have it as a spec (perhaps as a fun keyword instead of sub). I like code as documentation.
15:59 dalek v5: 914696f | (Tobias Leich)++ | t/test.pl:
15:59 dalek v5: fixed cmp_ok
15:59 dalek v5: review: https://github.com/rakudo-p5/v5/commit/914696f7cc
15:59 dalek v5: 7f9a3b6 | (Tobias Leich)++ | t/test.pl:
15:59 dalek v5: indentation
15:59 dalek v5: review: https://github.com/rakudo-p5/v5/commit/7f9a3b665e
15:59 dalek v5: d9849d7 | (Tobias Leich)++ | / (2 files):
15:59 dalek v5: make shift() use @_ when no arg is supplied
15:59 dalek v5: review: https://github.com/rakudo-p5/v5/commit/d9849d71b2
15:59 FROGGS r: say (357 * 100 / 40185) ~'% v5 spectests pass'
15:59 camelia rakudo 0d3c9b: OUTPUT«0.888391% v5 spectests pass␤»
16:00 FROGGS almost one percent *g*
16:00 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: 08f65ec | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/rakudo/ (2 files):
16:00 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: Named slurpy binding.
16:00 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/08f65ecf93
16:00 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: 3a27ac5 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/rakudo/ (2 files):
16:00 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: Implement nqp::p6bindattrinvres.
16:00 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/3a27ac5722
16:00 moritz note that rakudo's notion of 'is pure' doesn't quite fit the normal one
16:00 moritz in rakudo's world, a function marked as 'is pure' is still allowed to die or warn
16:00 FROGGS one percent in two months, that is like 198 months to go?
16:01 moritz (otherwise most string and numeric operators wouldn't be constant-foldable, because they nearly all coerce, and coercion can warn)
16:02 frdmn joined #perl6
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16:03 FROGGS[mobile] joined #perl6
16:05 [Coke] lizmat: objecthash.t - pugs says:   TODO passed:   26-28
16:06 [Coke] lizmat++ for thinking to pre-fudge for pugs
16:07 thou joined #perl6
16:08 rindolf joined #perl6
16:09 frdmn|afk joined #perl6
16:11 lizmat [Coke]  you're welcome  :-)
16:13 tadzik FROGGS[mobile]: I think shift() should also look in @ARGV when it's not inside a sub
16:17 rindolf joined #perl6
16:26 lizmat n: my %h= <a b c> Z 1..3; say %h
16:26 rindolf joined #perl6
16:26 camelia niecza v24-50-gba63d9a: OUTPUT«{"a" => 1, "b" => 2, "c" => 3}␤»
16:27 lizmat pugs: my %h= <a b c> Z 1..3; say %h
16:27 camelia pugs: OUTPUT«*** Odd number of elements found where hash expected: VList [VStr "a",VStr "b",VStr "c"]␤    at /tmp/WFU7R9RETK line 1, column 1-22␤»
16:27 * lizmat now understands crummy setup in hash test
16:28 domidumont joined #perl6
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16:37 FROGGS joined #perl6
16:39 lizmat n: my @a= <a b c>; say @a[1]:delete; say @a
16:39 camelia niecza v24-50-gba63d9a: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Excess arguments to KERNEL Array.postcircumfix:<[ ]>, unused named delete␤  at <unknown> line 0 (KERNEL Array.postcircumfix:<[ ]> @ 1) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 179 (postcircumfix:<[ ]> @ 5) ␤  at /tmp/pF0PmBHJv2 …
16:40 lizmat r: my @a= <a b c>; say @a[1]:delete; say @a  # rakudo is silent again, but doesn't delete
16:40 camelia rakudo b41219: OUTPUT«b␤a b c␤»
16:42 lizmat S32/Containers:666 reads "his adverb may be applied to any subscripting operation.  The operation returns the elements normally, but reads them out destructively."
16:42 lizmat I assume that is a case of NYI in rakudo?
16:45 colomon lizmat: I'm not sure it's intended to work that way.
16:45 rindolf joined #perl6
16:45 lizmat "destructively"
16:46 lizmat I guess that doesn't make it clear whether the result would be "a,"c" or "a",Any,"c", right?
17:21 _ilbot joined #perl6
17:21 Topic for #perl6 is now »ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | http://perl6.org/ | evalbot usage: 'perl6: say 3;' or rakudo:,  niecza:, std:, or /msg camelia perl6: ... | irclog: http://irc.perl6.org/ | UTF-8 is our friend!
17:21 colomon TimToady: don't get me started on shanties...
17:22 [Coke] sergot: are you actively running something on feather or is that a background job?
17:24 dalek roast: 95ecaba | (Solomon Foster)++ | S02-types/ (4 files):
17:24 dalek roast: Add tests for Set, Bag, etc. default method.
17:24 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/95ecabaa1d
17:24 [Coke] ... and it's gone.
17:26 dalek roast: 6d719f1 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S32-hash/delete_adverb.t:
17:26 dalek roast: More or less complete tests for :delete adverb on hashes
17:26 dalek roast:
17:26 dalek roast: Lot's of cases not tested before.
17:26 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/6d719f15fd
17:26 dalek roast: 99587bb | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S32-hash/delete_adverb.t:
17:26 dalek roast: Removed bogus Scalar :delete test
17:26 dalek roast:
17:26 dalek roast: This wasn't testing :delete at all, just the failure of adverbing a scalar
17:26 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/99587bbdb9
17:29 Chillance joined #perl6
17:30 lizmat pugs: my %h=a=>1; say %h{*}:delete
17:30 camelia pugs: OUTPUT«pugs: Named argument found where no matched parameter expected: (delete,Val (VBool True))␤»
17:31 lizmat pugs: my %h=a=>1; say %h<a>:delete
17:31 camelia pugs: OUTPUT«pugs: Named argument found where no matched parameter expected: (delete,Val (VBool True))␤»
17:33 dalek roast: 82b2f2d | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S32-hash/delete_adverb.t:
17:33 dalek roast: Some pugs fudging, as pugs apparently doesn't know adverbs
17:33 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/82b2f2d424
17:33 lizmat afk for 2 hours or so
17:34 colomon r: my $a = set<a b c>; say $a.default
17:34 camelia rakudo b41219: OUTPUT«No such method 'default' for invocant of type 'Parcel'␤  in block  at /tmp/FPAXhg2R3W:1␤␤»
17:34 colomon er?
17:34 colomon n: my $a = set<a b c>; say $a.default
17:34 camelia niecza v24-50-gba63d9a: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Unable to resolve method default in type Parcel␤  at /tmp/4Oi6XOiUCb line 1 (mainline @ 5) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 4327 (ANON @ 3) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 4328 (module-CORE @ 582) ␤  at /…
17:34 colomon rn: my $a = set<a b c>; say $a.WHAT
17:34 camelia rakudo b41219, niecza v24-50-gba63d9a: OUTPUT«(Parcel)␤»
17:35 * colomon is apparently very dense this morning.
17:42 dalek rakudo/nom: 1708566 | (Solomon Foster)++ | src/core/ (2 files):
17:42 dalek rakudo/nom: Add default method for Set, KeySet, Bag, and KeyBag.
17:42 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/17085660c9
17:42 masak_ oh hai, oh hai, dear #perl6
17:46 TimToady std: my $a = set<a b c>; say $a.WHAT
17:46 camelia std b33d8e0: OUTPUT«ok 00:00 43m␤»
17:46 TimToady I guess that isn't one that carps about having no args
17:47 TimToady since set() is just ∅
17:48 TimToady but set<a b c> is going to be a common mistake
17:48 colomon rn: my $a = set(<a b c>); say $a.WHAT
17:48 camelia rakudo b41219, niecza v24-50-gba63d9a: OUTPUT«(Set)␤»
17:48 colomon rn: my $a = set <a b c>; say $a.WHAT
17:48 camelia rakudo b41219, niecza v24-50-gba63d9a: OUTPUT«(Set)␤»
17:48 colomon yeesh
17:49 * colomon is always delighted to have TimToady explain how colomon is being dense.  :)
17:49 masak labster++ # http://blog.brentlaabs.com/2013/05/porting-module-to-perl-6.html
17:49 TimToady maybe I could add 'set' and 'bag' to the category of functions that require an argument, since set() defeats that warning
17:50 masak "Now that I've written this, I've realized that my own project is a microcosm of the Perl 6 saga.  Making a better codebase takes a lot of time, but it ultimately seems worth the effort." -- labster++
17:50 TimToady std: say<a b c>
17:50 camelia std b33d8e0: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m�Unsupported use of bare 'say'; in Perl 6 please use .say if you meant $_, or use an explicit invocant or argument at /tmp/e8wl57bRHS line 1:�------> [32msay[33m�[31m<a b c>[0m�Check failed�FAILED 00:00 41m�»
17:50 TimToady like that
17:50 masak TimToady: +1
17:50 PerlJam TimToady: +1
17:50 moritz joined #perl6
17:51 TimToady we had many of those errors in early pugs code too
17:51 dmol joined #perl6
17:54 PerlJam I just know that it took me a little bit to figure out what colomon was doing wrong.  Anything that minimizes the  "Huh?" factor is a good thing.  :)
17:57 colomon rn: say [(|)] set <a b c>, set <a b d>, set <a d g>
17:57 camelia niecza v24-50-gba63d9a: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: No value for parameter '$b' in 'infix:<(|)>'␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 0 (infix:<(|)> @ 1) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 2658 (reduceop @ 12) ␤  at /tmp/Grdwz9eGgL line 1 (mainline @ 6) ␤  at /hom…
17:57 camelia ..rakudo b41219: OUTPUT«Too many positional parameters passed; got 5 but expected 2␤  in sub infix:<(|)> at src/gen/CORE.setting:13075␤  in sub  at src/gen/CORE.setting:13910␤  in block  at /tmp/8vS6PdbMHl:1␤␤»
17:57 masak lizmat: re http://irclog.perlgeek.de/perl6/2013-05-14#i_7064076 -- I unspec'd multiple signatures per routine body a year and a half ago. rationale here: https://github.com/perl6/specs/commit/9950d83ede3d1aa77a96ad83fd7549a69fc9e4a5
17:57 SamuraiJack_ joined #perl6
17:58 PerlJam r: sub foo(::T where *.does(R)) { ... }
17:58 camelia rakudo b41219: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤Cannot do non-typename cases of type_constraint yetâ�¤at /tmp/djU_uHnr55:1â�¤------> [32msub foo(::T where *.does(R)[33mâ��[31m) { ... }[0mâ�¤    expecting any of:â�¤        argument listâ�¤        postfixâ�¤Â»
17:59 masak lizmat: in real Perl 6 code I would delegate all the different candidates to a common helper sub, and hide the helper sub as appropriate.
17:59 PerlJam std: sub foo(::T where *.does(R)) { ... }
17:59 camelia std b33d8e0: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤Undeclared name:â�¤    'R' used at line 1â�¤Check failedâ�¤FAILED 00:00 45mâ�¤Â»
17:59 TimToady colomon: note that set is a listop, so each set is counting the following sets as sub-arguments
17:59 PerlJam std: role R {};  sub foo(::T where *.does(R)) { ... }
17:59 camelia std b33d8e0: OUTPUT«ok 00:00 45m␤»
17:59 colomon TimToady: wondered about that.  but it should work either way...
18:00 TimToady not if we make sets of sets work right
18:00 TimToady PerlJam: why not just 'where R' ?
18:00 PerlJam Just didn't think of it that way.
18:00 colomon TimToady: that's not allowed by the current spec, is it?
18:01 TimToady I believe current spec doesn't allow sets to flatten in list context
18:01 TimToady and the constructor should not be flattening sets either
18:01 colomon TimToady: I take it back, current spec does not address this at all, at least not in S32
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18:02 colomon TimToady: it's nothing to do with flattening.  set function absorbs the keys or values of collections, including Sets
18:02 TimToady see line S32/Containers:1112
18:03 TimToady but it's also the case that the constructors should be treating the incoming elements as items
18:04 colomon TimToady: I assume you mean "Sets and Bags do not flatten into list context."  ?
18:04 TimToady in general, items should stay items
18:04 TimToady they show up as $@keys, not @keys, basically
18:04 colomon that's very much not how it is implemented
18:04 * masak .oO( what happens in Vega$ stays in Vega$ )
18:05 colomon rn: say set(<a b c>, <d e f>)
18:05 camelia rakudo b41219, niecza v24-51-g009f999: OUTPUT«set(a, b, c, d, e, f)␤»
18:05 TimToady yes, I know, since I was one of the people who originally thought the dwimming was cute, until it wasn't
18:05 masak colomon: but those are parcels, not sets and bags.
18:05 TimToady yes, parcels can flatten in list context by default
18:05 colomon rn: my $a = set <a b c>; my $b = set <d e f>; say set($a, $b)
18:06 camelia rakudo b41219, niecza v24-51-g009f999: OUTPUT«set(a, b, c, d, e, f)␤»
18:06 masak colomon: known, RT'd, deplored.
18:06 TimToady likewise, if you really want to incorporate one set in another, the you can use (|) or set <a b c>, $otherset.keys
18:06 colomon rn: my @a = <a b c>; my @b = <d e f>; say set(@a, @b)
18:06 camelia rakudo b41219, niecza v24-51-g009f999: OUTPUT«set(a, b, c, d, e, f)␤»
18:07 TimToady or ∪ if we ever arrive in the 21st century...
18:07 sftp joined #perl6
18:08 * masak .oO( ∪∩icode )
18:09 * colomon feels like he's going insane.
18:11 * masak hugs colomon
18:12 colomon if someone cares to explain what the rules for set / bag construction are actually meant to be (preferably in spec), I'll try to get around to fixing roast and both compilers....
18:12 TimToady we've been talking about how to write sets of sets for some months now, but I will see if I can enhance the specs in that regard
18:13 colomon and the production code I've written which relies on the current behavior...
18:13 rjbs the spec will metasetize
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18:15 masak colomon: let me try and summarize the situation. @ or % sigil? flatten. $ sigil? don't flatten. <> or () lists? flatten. [] array? don't flatten. a set or a bag, constructed in-place with 'set' or 'bag'? don't flatten.
18:15 masak TimToady: hope I got that right.
18:15 colomon masak: I have no idea how to write code to support that
18:16 masak colomon: well, if it turns out to be *impossible* to implement, we must do something about that.
18:16 masak colomon: but so far it has seemed quite sane to me.
18:16 sjohnson joined #perl6
18:16 masak colomon: basically, some things act as flattenable lists, and others act as items. sets and bags act as items.
18:17 colomon masak: how do you write a slurpy sub which can distinguish whether its arguments were $ or @/%?
18:18 masak hm.
18:20 masak rn: say $_ ~~ Positional for Set, Bag; say $_ ~~ Associative for Set, Bag
18:20 camelia rakudo 170856, niecza v24-51-g009f999: OUTPUT«False␤False␤True␤True␤»
18:23 masak colomon: I'm not at the point where I'm saying "oh gosh, you're right, this is impossible" yet -- but I do see the problem. lemme think some more.
18:25 masak rn: sub foo(*@x) { say @x.elems }; my @y = 1, 2, 3; foo(@y); foo @y
18:25 camelia rakudo 170856, niecza v24-51-g009f999: OUTPUT«3␤3␤»
18:25 jnthn That's the **@foo vs *@foo distiction in part, no?
18:26 colomon masak: also, those rules seem to ignore (possibly intentionally) the current rules for handling associative / pairs (use keys only)
18:27 colomon jnthn: I thought **@foo was how you sent a variable number of lists?
18:27 jnthn colomon: It means "don't flatten any of the incoming things"
18:28 jnthn nqp: say(nqp::replace('abc', 'x', 0, 0))
18:28 camelia nqp: OUTPUT«Error while compiling block : Error while compiling op call (source text: "nqp::replace('abc', 'x', 0, 0)"): Error while compiling op replace (source text: "nqp::replace('abc', 'x', 0, 0)"): No registered operation handler for 'replace'␤current instr.: '' pc 48591 (src/stage…
18:28 jnthn oh..
18:28 jnthn nqp: say(pir::replace__Sssii('abc', 'x', 0, 0))
18:28 camelia nqp: OUTPUT«error:imcc:The opcode 'replace_s_sc_sc_ic_ic' (replace<5>) was not found. Check the type and number of the arguments␤       in file '(file unknown)' line 39␤»
18:29 jnthn nqp: say(pir::replace__Sssii('abc', 0, 0, 'x'))
18:29 camelia nqp: OUTPUT«error:imcc:The opcode 'replace_s_sc_s_ic_i' (replace<5>) was not found. Check the type and number of the arguments␤ in file '(file unknown)' line 161304349␤»
18:29 jnthn nqp: say(pir::replace__Ssiis('abc', 0, 0, 'x')) # sigh
18:29 camelia nqp: OUTPUT«xabc␤»
18:29 jnthn nqp: say(pir::replace__Ssiis('abc', 0, 1, 'x')) # sigh
18:29 camelia nqp: OUTPUT«xbc␤»
18:29 jnthn nqp: say(pir::replace__Ssiis('abc', 1, 1, 'x')) # sigh
18:29 camelia nqp: OUTPUT«axc␤»
18:29 jnthn ah...
18:31 dalek specs: 221b79f | larry++ | S32-setting-library/Containers.pod:
18:31 dalek specs: sets and bags are object based, use === semantics
18:31 dalek specs: review: https://github.com/perl6/specs/commit/221b79f028
18:35 nyuszika7h joined #perl6
18:39 dalek specs: 0380487 | larry++ | S32-setting-library/Containers.pod:
18:39 dalek specs: more set/bag list clarifications
18:39 dalek specs:
18:39 dalek specs: We're not trying to override explicit @ or .keys here, merely the
18:39 dalek specs: implicit policy for a default of item in list context.
18:39 dalek specs:
18:39 dalek specs: Also, set/bag constructors are simply slurpies, and shouldn't care at all
18:39 dalek specs: what was passed as the objects in those slurpies.  Generally one should
18:39 dalek specs: be using "union" to combine sets or bags anyway, not relying on implicit
18:39 dalek specs: constructor semantics to do that.
18:39 dalek specs: review: https://github.com/perl6/specs/commit/038048739f
18:39 denisboyun joined #perl6
18:43 colomon TimToady: can you add explicit .Set .Bag etc conversion functions to the spec as well?  This change makes them much more important....
18:46 dalek specs: 1e7aec4 | larry++ | S32-setting-library/Containers.pod:
18:46 dalek specs: say how to turn pairs/hashes into sets/bags
18:46 dalek specs: review: https://github.com/perl6/specs/commit/1e7aec467b
18:47 TimToady uh, just did
18:47 TimToady well, mentioned them, anyway...
18:47 TimToady as the new way to deal with pairs or hashes that want to become sets/bags
18:48 betterworld joined #perl6
18:49 colomon TimToady: I was thinking Set.Bag and combinations like that, but it's good to have them on Hash, too.
18:49 colomon though perhaps a bit vague.
18:50 TimToady I usually just assume there are appropriate coercers where they make sense :)
18:51 TimToady but in this case it seems good to distinguish coercion from composition
18:51 frdmn joined #perl6
18:51 TimToady "this already looks kinda like a bag, so make it moreso"
18:52 colomon it's important because the established way of doing it was via constructor, and you just eliminated that.  :)
18:52 TimToady which is what we both realized simultaneously :)
18:54 colomon the relevant spectests are now badly broken.  I should probably do some paying $work now, but will take a look at cleaning it up soon.
18:54 TimToady though in the case of Set => Bag, a constructor works just as well as long as you say @set rather than $set
18:54 TimToady thanks!
18:55 colomon also at fixing set operators so they work right in reduce metaop
18:55 colomon because that just got more important as well.
18:55 colomon (indeed, ABC will have issues if I don't fix that the same time I change the constructors.)
18:56 TimToady I realized several months ago when we had an RC task that wanted sets of sets that we were about to laughed out of the stadium by mathematicians if we didn't fix this...
18:57 * TimToady wonders what kind of stadum mathematicians come in...
18:57 TimToady *dium
18:57 colomon bah, didn't we learn our lesson 100+ years ago?  Sets of sets are dangerous things.
18:57 colomon very large football stadiums, in my case.  ;)
18:57 TimToady but...we want P6 to be dangerous...
18:58 masak it's not sets of sets that are dangerous. ZFC is full of them (and *nothing else*).
18:58 * PerlJam now pictures that TimToady quote showing up on twitter out of context.
18:58 masak it's non-wellfoundedness we should look out for.
18:58 TimToady it's sets defined in terms of themselves that are the problem
18:58 berekuk joined #perl6
18:59 TimToady We want Perl 6 to be the safest dangerous language, and the most dangerous safe language.
18:59 * colomon hopes masak  and TimToady don't spend the rest of the day trying to figure out how to implement a set that contains itself....
19:00 TimToady r: my @a = <a b c>; @a[3] := @a; say @a
19:00 camelia rakudo 170856: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
19:00 FROGGS hehe
19:02 masak r: my $s = set; multi sub infix:<(elem)>(Set $r, Set $l) { $r === $s && $l === $s ?? True !! nextsame }; say $s (elem) $s
19:02 camelia rakudo 170856: OUTPUT«True␤»
19:02 masak \o/
19:03 * masak admires the horribleness of that
19:03 masak in fact,
19:03 masak r: my $s = set; multi sub infix:<(elem)>(Set $r, Set $l) { $r === $s && $l === $s || nextsame }; say $s (elem) $s
19:03 colomon somebody else can be responsible for coming up with set of sets tests for roast....
19:03 camelia rakudo 170856: OUTPUT«True␤»
19:06 colomon shouldn't we be working on number theory today, considering all the interesting announcements?
19:07 moritz like the prove for the weak Goldback hypothesis?
19:07 sorear wait, what?
19:08 colomon sorear: odd nums > 5 are the sum of 3 primes, that one
19:09 colomon it's not confirmed yet, but there's supposed to be a 130 page proof.
19:10 colomon also, there are an infinite number of pairs of primes within 70,000,000 of each other.
19:10 moritz https://plus.google.com/u/0/114134834346472219368/posts/8qpSYNZFbzC
19:10 colomon two separate proofs
19:10 moritz http://arxiv.org/abs/1305.2897 is the paper for the Goldbach one
19:10 masak it's a good day to be prime.
19:11 colomon https://plus.google.com/u/0/114134834346472219368/posts/XESxA9bL5um talks about the other result
19:11 dalek std: e2a36d8 | larry++ | STD.pm6:
19:11 dalek std: disallow set<a b c>
19:11 dalek std:
19:11 dalek std: A (beneficial?) side effect is that you may no longer say 'set'
19:11 dalek std: to mean ∅.  You must say 'set()' instead.  Which is perhaps clearer...
19:11 dalek std: review: https://github.com/perl6/std/commit/e2a36d8620
19:12 moritz quick, let's do some RSA with expmod :-)
19:12 PerlJam wikipedia says odd nums > 7 for the goldbach conjecture: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goldbach's_weak_conjecture
19:12 PerlJam (and, as we all know, wikipedia is infallible ;)
19:12 colomon PerlJam: 2 + 2 + 3 = 7
19:14 PerlJam 2 is not an odd number last time I checked  :)
19:14 moritz 2 is the oddest prime :-)
19:14 masak PerlJam: that's not relevant.
19:14 TimToady 2 is the only prime that is not the sum of 3 primes if we allow 1 to be a prime :)
19:14 masak it's the sum that should be odd.
19:14 TimToady well, and 1
19:15 dalek perl6-bench: 53be1bb | (Geoffrey Broadwell)++ | analyze:
19:15 dalek perl6-bench: Calculate peak rates per perl in analyze compare_scaled_times()
19:15 dalek perl6-bench: review: https://github.com/japhb/perl6-bench/commit/53be1bb39d
19:15 dalek perl6-bench: b3a904a | (Geoffrey Broadwell)++ | analyze:
19:15 dalek perl6-bench: More analyze changes for scaled times: fix enabled_perls() and start fixing summarize_results_text()
19:15 dalek perl6-bench: review: https://github.com/japhb/perl6-bench/commit/b3a904acc8
19:15 PerlJam masak: and we're back to what wikipedia says ...  "Every odd number greater than 7 can be expressed as the sum of three odd primes."
19:15 colomon TimToady: I did find it interesting that weak Goldbach seems like it is more naturally stated if 1 is prime.  :)
19:16 colomon PerlJam: wikipedia is weird
19:16 PerlJam I don't know that that's Goldbach's weak conjecture or not, but it's certainly different than "every odd number greater than five is the sum of three primes"
19:16 masak PerlJam: well, if you require the primes to be odd, then you'd lose 7, yes.
19:16 PerlJam right.
19:16 moritz PerlJam: I guess there are several competing phrasings of that conjecture, all of which boil down to the same interesting question
19:16 masak besides that, it's not clear to me that the claims are equivalent.
19:17 moritz because it's easy to prove it for any arbitrary limit you set yourself
19:17 colomon PerlJam: check out the summary to http://arxiv.org/abs/1305.2897
19:20 sorear looks like this isn't the first purported proof of the WGC that's too long to quickly verify
19:20 sorear and it probably won't be the last. sorry.
19:20 PerlJam sorear: all the hard problems are.
19:21 moritz though the good sign is that the same author previously published an accepted proof for a weaker formulation
19:21 dmol joined #perl6
19:21 moritz time will tell.
19:23 autark joined #perl6
19:24 PerlJam Remember the hubub around the proof of Fermat's Last Theorem?  Took a couple of years to work out if the proof was a proof.
19:24 masak my latest "wow" moment related to mathematics was learning (on Wikipedia) that the fundamental theorem of finitely generated abelian groups is directly related to the Chinese remainder theorem.
19:26 masak I have a special sweet spot for the latter, because of a program involving numbers modulo 3, 5, and 7 found in this book: http://www.amazon.com/BASIC-Computer-Games-Microcomputer-Edition/dp/0894800523/
19:28 cooper joined #perl6
19:30 nyuszika7h joined #perl6
19:30 masak I should totally blog about that one at some point.
19:35 PerlJam I have a book by the same author called "The Texas Instruments Home Computer Idea Book"   I gather he was prolific in BASIC books  :)
19:41 masak those BASIC games meant a lot to my early growth as a programmer. not because they were of excellent design, but because they were fun, and interesting to try to reverse-engineer.
19:41 masak and it's kind of rewarding when you reverse-engineer a number guessing game and find the Chinese remainder theorem. :P
19:43 _ilbot joined #perl6
19:43 Topic for #perl6 is now »ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | http://perl6.org/ | evalbot usage: 'perl6: say 3;' or rakudo:,  niecza:, std:, or /msg camelia perl6: ... | irclog: http://irc.perl6.org/ | UTF-8 is our friend!
19:43 FROGGS std: use v5; require v5.0.0
19:43 camelia std e2a36d8: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m�Number contains two decimal points (missing 'v' for version number?) at /tmp/XMkktheIyn line 1:�------> [32muse v5; require v5.0.[33m�[31m0[0m�Parse failed�FAILED 00:01 52m�»
19:44 masak er.
19:44 masak confused STD is confused.
19:45 FROGGS ya, but we can help it out there :o)
19:45 moritz joined #perl6
19:47 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: 41e4fb0 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/runtime/Ops.java:
19:47 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: Fix nqp::div_In.
19:47 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/41e4fb0f43
19:47 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: fc571c1 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/runtime/Ops.java:
19:47 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: Implement nqp::replace op.
19:47 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/fc571c1d94
19:50 autark` joined #perl6
19:50 dalek std: 4dc2553 | (Tobias Leich)++ | STD_P5.pm6:
19:50 dalek std: allow: require VERSION
19:50 dalek std:
19:50 dalek std: Found in Perl5's testsuite in t/comp/require.t.
19:50 dalek std: review: https://github.com/perl6/std/commit/4dc2553cbf
19:54 dalek perl6-roast-data: 14f41d4 | coke++ | / (4 files):
19:54 dalek perl6-roast-data: today (automated commit)
19:54 dalek perl6-roast-data: review: https://github.com/coke/perl6-roast-data/commit/14f41d44ed
19:56 [Coke] niecza has been dirty for 301 days. pugs has been clean for 1 day. rakudo has been dirty for 10 days. # yay, pugs is clean again.
19:56 FROGGS ó.ò
19:56 FROGGS I wish I could reproduce that rakudobug
19:56 [Coke] Happy to test proposed fixes for rakudo on feather, since that's the only place it seems to be exploding on that test.
19:56 [Coke] FROGGS: do you have an account on feather?
19:56 FROGGS ohh, I had once
19:57 FROGGS hmmm
19:57 TimToady std: set<a b c>;
19:57 camelia std e2a36d8: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤The 'set' listop may not be called without arguments (please use () or whitespace to clarify) at /tmp/PADZ4qSrTX line 1:â�¤------> [32mset[33mâ��[31m<a b c>;[0mâ�¤Potential difficulties:â�¤  Use of non-subscript <...> where postfix is expec…
19:58 frdmn_ joined #perl6
19:58 TimToady std: set;
19:58 camelia std e2a36d8: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m�The 'set' listop may not be called without arguments (please use () or whitespace to clarify) at /tmp/t3YsN5H42z line 1:�------> [32mset[33m�[31m;[0m�Check failed�FAILED 00:00 41m�»
19:58 TimToady std: set();
19:58 camelia std e2a36d8: OUTPUT«ok 00:00 41m␤»
19:59 masak TimToady++
20:00 masak rn: set<a b c>;
20:00 camelia rakudo 170856, niecza v24-51-g009f999:  ( no output )
20:00 * masak submits rakudobug
20:00 masak rn: set;
20:00 camelia rakudo 170856, niecza v24-51-g009f999:  ( no output )
20:01 FROGGS [Coke]: I've got a mail in my outbox about requesting an account on feather, but I cant remember if I already got one :/
20:01 FROGGS moritz: can you check that somehow?
20:02 gdey joined #perl6
20:04 [Coke] ~froggs exists.
20:05 [Coke] let me see if I can reset your password.
20:05 FROGGS cool
20:08 * [Coke] tries to figure out how to go to window 27 with an escape key in irssi.
20:08 moritz FROGGS, [Coke]: did the password reset work?
20:08 Tene "escape key"?
20:09 FROGGS moritz: it did
20:09 Tene [Coke]: /bind
20:10 [Coke] tene: ESC-7:/win 7::ESC-U:/win 17::ESC-??:/win 27
20:10 Tene [Coke]: yeah, just set it with /bind.  You can run /bind with no arguments to get a list of current bindings for examples.
20:11 Tene I have up to 33 bound, going down the keyboard through m
20:11 Util For the GSoC task "JavaScript backend for NQP (and Rakudo Perl 6)", benabik is listed as a possible mentor, but he is also listed on other tasks.
20:12 Util Any Rakudo people up for being mentor (or co-mentor or backup mentor) for that task?
20:12 [Coke] pmichaud had volunteered. I'm willing to if no one else does.
20:13 Tene [Coke]: Just make sure to /save when you've got it how you want.
20:15 DreamingInCode1 joined #perl6
20:15 Util [Coke]: yes, he did, and I did not see my note about it before asking. Thanks!
20:17 ajr joined #perl6
20:22 ajr_ I was just looking around the code for a place to maintain the record count $*IN.input_record_number() (rakudo/src/core/IO.pm ?) but then two thoughts occurred to me.
20:23 ajr_ First, this looks like a method, not a variable name.
20:23 FROGGS moritz / [Coke]: I cant install parrot, it tells me the disk is full O.o
20:24 ajr_ Second, how to maintain the value, associated with the file - what happens if there are multiple files in/out?
20:25 PerlJam ajr_: aye, it's a method.  Is that a problem?
20:26 ajr_ Well, the value has to be maintained somewhere.
20:26 masak ajr_: the method is just a way to return the value.
20:27 PerlJam ajr_: the value is kep in the object.
20:27 PerlJam s/kep/kept/
20:27 masak I don't know the answer to the "multiple files in/out" question. the question feels insufficiently specified.
20:28 ajr_ The fact it's a method may make the question redundant, though how is the method associated with a particular file?
20:29 [Coke] FROGGS: whoops. I'll see how much of that I can deal with.
20:29 ajr_ There might be a case where you're reading two files, and want the record count for each one.
20:29 masak ajr_: it's associated with a filehandle, like $*IO
20:30 masak ajr_: if you've opened your own file, and stored the filehandle in a variable $fh, it'd be $fh.input_record_number()
20:30 masak ajr_: I'm confused at your confusion :)
20:31 PerlJam ajr_: are you thinking of p5's automagic $ARGV switching when reading the ARGV handle?
20:31 ajr_ So $*IN.input_record_number() would return the count for STDIN?
20:31 masak aye.
20:32 dalek perl6-bench: a90094c | (Geoffrey Broadwell)++ | analyze:
20:32 dalek perl6-bench: More improvements to summarize_results_text() in analyze
20:32 dalek perl6-bench: review: https://github.com/japhb/perl6-bench/commit/a90094cd39
20:32 dalek perl6-bench: 4a29ed0 | (Geoffrey Broadwell)++ | analyze:
20:32 dalek perl6-bench: More tweaks to headers in summarize_results_text() in analyze
20:32 dalek perl6-bench: review: https://github.com/japhb/perl6-bench/commit/4a29ed04f4
20:32 * PerlJam notes that the $ARGV equivalent is to be determined in S28
20:32 * TimToady wonders if it would make more sense to send the line number with the line in question
20:34 ajr_ Is the same input method used for all files, including $IN*, or are there special ones?
20:34 PerlJam ajr_: "same input method"?
20:37 PerlJam TimToady: would that imply that the idiom for lines() would change?
20:37 ajr_ PerlJam: I'm trying to find the appropriate place to maintain a record count, which is presumably where the file is read?
20:37 PerlJam ajr_: the IO handle that's associated with the file seems like the right place to me.
20:38 PerlJam ajr_: are you asking if there are other IO thingies that read files that aren't also IO::Handles?
20:39 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: 2dc8c3a | jnthn++ | src/core/terms.pm:
20:39 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: Make %*ENV setup portable (hopefully).
20:39 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/2dc8c3a3a8
20:39 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: 7a2efe3 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/rakudo/Ops.java:
20:39 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: Missing null check.
20:39 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/7a2efe32af
20:39 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: 9412ca4 | jnthn++ | src/core/ (3 files):
20:39 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: Mark out a few things that explode on JVM.
20:39 dalek rakudo/jvm-support:
20:39 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: This gets the setting loadable, just about.
20:39 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/9412ca41ea
20:39 colomon \o/
20:39 ajr_ PearlJam: I think that's the question.
20:40 PerlJam ajr_: you could start with solving the problem for IO::Handle and then worry about other IO thingies if they happen to show up.
20:41 ajr_ OK, I'll look there.
20:44 donaldh_ joined #perl6
20:45 [Coke] FROGGS: you probably have enough room to build one parrot now, anyway.
20:46 donaldh joined #perl6
20:46 FROGGS [Coke]: yeah, currently trying... [Coke]++
20:52 jnthn $ perl6 -e "say 'omg something works on le jvm'"
20:52 jnthn omg something works on le jvm
20:52 donaldh jnthn++
20:52 jnthn That's probably about all that works, but... :P
20:53 donaldh heh
20:53 jnthn Gee, this startup time will want a little work :)
20:54 [Coke] Anyone who is using perlbrew on feather - please remove your build directories.
20:54 FROGGS jnthn++
20:54 [Coke] (azawawi is the one I found first, but that's pretty big)
20:55 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: 9d74404 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/sixmodel/reprs/P6Opaque.java:
20:55 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: Support nqp::isattrinit properly on P6opaque.
20:55 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/9d7440459c
20:55 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: 9db6da9 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/sixmodel/SixModelObject.java:
20:55 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: More informative errors.
20:55 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/9db6da99ec
20:57 [Coke] (I don't actually see an subcommand for perlbrew to do a cleanup. wonder if it's safe to just remove the build dir.)
21:00 FROGGS [Coke]: maybe it is blowing up because of the qemu vm
21:00 japhb__ What module in the Perl 5 world would create the closest equivalent of (simple variable) binding in Perl 6?
21:01 PerlJam someone could setup perlbrew system wide so that each version is only installed once ( that might mitigate the build dir size problem at least)
21:01 [Coke] FROGGS: are you seeing the failure now
21:01 sorear Data::Alias?
21:01 lizmat japhb_: Data::Alias provides an "alias" function
21:03 araujo joined #perl6
21:03 araujo joined #perl6
21:04 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: 33bc338 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/rakudo/ (3 files):
21:04 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: Add DEBUG_MODE flag for the reams of warnings.
21:04 dalek rakudo/jvm-support:
21:04 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: Turn them off by default, so "say 'hello'" doesn't give thousands of
21:04 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: lines of output.
21:04 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/33bc3386fb
21:04 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: 09ecb72 | jnthn++ | src/ (2 files):
21:04 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: Small tweaks to get 'hello world' working.
21:04 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/09ecb726c3
21:04 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: 5c82398 | jnthn++ | / (2 files):
21:04 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: Add CORE.setting to the build.
21:04 dalek rakudo/jvm-support: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/5c8239850f
21:04 FROGGS [Coke]: not yet
21:05 pmurias joined #perl6
21:05 pmurias Ulti: re mentors, pmichaud is mentioned in the
21:05 pmurias Ulti: "Possible Mentors" section
21:06 japhb__ lizmat, sorear, thank you.
21:11 [Coke] FROGGS: try the version in ~coke/sandbox/perl6pass/rakudo
21:11 FROGGS k, thanks
21:12 FROGGS I'm not sure my rakudo there is picking up the right nqp
21:12 [Coke] the build in my dir is whatever is recommended by the the nom branch.
21:13 ajr_ The lines method in IO.pm maintains a line count ($count) which could be stored, but slurp doesn't. Is it reasonable to expect a line count for a slurped file?
21:13 FROGGS ajr_: if you slurp a file at once, what do you need a line count for?
21:13 [Coke] .tell au - so far, you have the biggest directory on feather and we're tight on space. Anything you can clean up?
21:13 yoleaux [Coke]: I'll pass your message to au.
21:14 sorear au doesn't irc often, you ought to send an email too
21:15 ajr_ FROGGS: The number of lines (records) in the file might be significant; what if that's what interests you?
21:15 [Coke] If someone who knows her email addy could do that, I'd appreciate it.
21:15 FROGGS [Coke]: okay, I get the coredump with my freshly built rakudo too
21:15 lizmat ajr_: lines method is specced as only being applicable to lines red with "get" (S32/IO:202)
21:16 lizmat read
21:16 [Coke] FROGGS++
21:16 bruges joined #perl6
21:16 ajr_ OK, then the answer for slurp is no, it's not reasonable.
21:17 FROGGS r: say "abc\ndef\n".lines()
21:17 camelia rakudo 170856: OUTPUT«abc def␤»
21:17 FROGGS r: say "abc\ndef\n".lines().elems
21:17 camelia rakudo 170856: OUTPUT«2␤»
21:27 kurahaupo joined #perl6
21:32 ajr_ There's a method "ins" in S32 which looks as though it's meant to be what S28 has defined as input_record_number:
21:32 ajr_ $. $NR              $*IN.input_record_number()
21:32 ajr_ $/ $RS              $*IN.input_record_separator()
21:36 mtk joined #perl6
21:36 thou joined #perl6
21:44 lizmat is there a reason why Array.elems is not a left value ?
21:45 lizmat or do I have to use .splice to set the length of an array ?
21:45 japhb lizmat, diakopter++ pointed out that I should mention to you: I'm head down on my benchmarking talk, trying to give you, tadzik, FROGGS, etc. as much time as possible to hash out ecosystem thoughts, before I write my ecosystem talk.  diakopter helpfully pointed out that if I don't say it out loud, no one knows.  ;-)
21:46 FROGGS japhb: k, good to know :o)
21:46 lizmat which ecosystem talk?
21:46 lizmat nobody tells me anything ever  :-)
21:46 kurahaupo joined #perl6
21:46 lizmat rn: my @a; @a.elems=3
21:46 FROGGS lizmat: interesting idea
21:46 camelia niecza v24-51-g009f999: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Writing to readonly scalar␤  at /tmp/Zu4pfdqp6Q line 1 (mainline @ 4) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 4331 (ANON @ 3) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 4332 (module-CORE @ 582) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/li…
21:46 camelia ..rakudo 170856: OUTPUT«Cannot assign to a readonly variable or a value␤  in block  at /tmp/gsA4w0QamN:1␤␤»
21:47 lizmat $#array in perl 5 is also a left value, fwiw  :-)
21:47 FROGGS hehe
21:47 FROGGS it is somehow weird what I learn about perl 5 in this channel
21:48 lizmat he, you're reimplementing it, you should pick up *something*  :-)
21:48 tadzik japhb: hash out?
21:49 tadzik japhb: I can find my old ecosystem talk slides if you want them
21:49 tadzik japhb: the talk sucked though
21:49 [Coke] ah. the big space hog is in /data/var/spool
21:50 PerlJam lizmat: you don't have to use splice, you can just set @array[$index]
21:50 lizmat ??  you mean at initialization?
21:51 japhb tadzik, hash out = brainstorm/discuss/figure out/design ...
21:51 [Coke] will continue the hunt when I get home.
21:51 japhb lizmat, looking for talk on yapc site, hold
21:51 PerlJam r: my @array;  @array[57] = Nil; @array.elems
21:51 camelia rakudo 170856:  ( no output )
21:51 PerlJam r: my @array;  @array[57] = Nil; say @array.elems
21:51 camelia rakudo 170856: OUTPUT«58␤»
21:51 japhb lizmat: http://www.yapcna.org/yn2013/talk/4695
21:51 japhb Description written by diakopter.  ;-)
21:52 lizmat PerlJam: and now to make it smaller ?
21:52 PerlJam lizmat: do you want to limit the size of the array, or just extend it like you can in Perl 5?
21:52 lizmat I want to limit it
21:53 dalek perl6-bench: 594448e | (Geoffrey Broadwell)++ | analyze:
21:53 dalek perl6-bench: analyze: comment out unused line, improve HTML output
21:53 dalek perl6-bench: review: https://github.com/japhb/perl6-bench/commit/594448e3f7
21:53 dalek perl6-bench: 492eed3 | (Geoffrey Broadwell)++ | / (2 files):
21:53 dalek perl6-bench: Use Data::Alias to simulate binding on Perl 5; add to PREREQUISITES list in README
21:53 dalek perl6-bench: review: https://github.com/japhb/perl6-bench/commit/492eed3591
21:55 perlpilot joined #perl6
21:55 lizmat n: my @a= (1..10); @a[*]:delete; say @a
21:55 camelia niecza v24-51-g009f999: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Excess arguments to KERNEL Array.postcircumfix:<[ ]>, unused named delete␤  at <unknown> line 0 (KERNEL Array.postcircumfix:<[ ]> @ 1) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 179 (postcircumfix:<[ ]> @ 5) ␤  at /tmp/wvTQEKVp_w …
21:56 lizmat pugs: my @a= (1..10); @a[*]:delete; say @a
21:56 camelia pugs: OUTPUT«*** ␤    Unexpected ":delete"␤    expecting term postfix or operator␤    at /tmp/60aQ8LsoAm line 1, column 22␤»
21:56 PerlJam oh, then   my @array[15]; # will limit the size of the array, but it's NYI (I think)
21:56 lizmat yes, but that's compile time, I want runtime  :-)
21:58 perlpilot [Coke]: feather is pausing bizarrely for me.  I guess this is related to the almost-full disk?
21:59 FROGGS perlpilot: maybe [Coke] is running a treesize? I experience pauses too
22:01 lizmat pugs: my %h=a=>1; say %h{*}:delete
22:01 camelia pugs: OUTPUT«pugs: Named argument found where no matched parameter expected: (delete,Val (VBool True))␤»
22:01 lizmat n: my %h=a=>1; say %h{*}:delete
22:01 camelia niecza v24-51-g009f999: OUTPUT«(Any)␤»
22:02 sorear o/ perlpilot
22:04 dalek roast: 574c899 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S32-hash/delete_adverb.t:
22:05 dalek roast: Added Array:delete tests
22:05 dalek roast:
22:05 dalek roast: Also made sure that fudging Niecza and Pugs is hopefully correct, so that
22:05 dalek roast: syntax errors are "skip" rather than "todo"
22:05 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/574c899510
22:08 raiph am i right in understanding that jnthn++ has "hello world" working for rakudo on jvm?
22:08 FROGGS raiph: yes, look like
22:09 * lizmat thinks it was "omg something works on le jvm", and not "hello world"  :-)
22:09 FROGGS pedantic :P
22:10 lizmat that's my *middle* name
22:11 raiph lizmat: ??? i'm asking if he's saying that 'say "hello world"' works on his local rakudo on jvm.
22:12 diakopter yes
22:12 diakopter it does
22:13 diakopter 21:21 < jnthn> 23:33 < jnthn> $ perl6 -e "say 'omg something works on le jvm'"
22:13 diakopter 21:21 < jnthn> 23:33 < jnthn> omg something works on le jvm
22:13 lizmat http://irclog.perlgeek.de/perl6/2013-05-14#i_7068276
22:13 diakopter ohhh
22:13 diakopter lol.
22:13 diakopter now I get it. :)
22:14 raiph ohh, i missed that. just saw the later commit msg, thanks lizmat
22:17 lizmat I wonder how bad it would be to have a separate "multi method postcircumfix:<[ ]>(\SELF: $pos where $pos < 0) is rw {" candidate to fail
22:18 lizmat and remove the "fail if $pos < 0" from all the other candidates in Any
22:19 jnthn lizmat: Suspect that way spoils the cache's day too.
22:20 lizmat I guess the optimiser isn't smart enough to skip that candidate altogether when $pos is an uint ?
22:20 jnthn It can't do anything when it's a method call, which it is at the moment.
22:21 jnthn In the future, they'll be multi subs, and it'll be able to analyse them more, but it's likely to handle the way it is now better.
22:21 jnthn Or at least do so sooner.
22:21 FROGGS just to confirm: I cant export/import a variable from a module right now, or can I?
22:21 jnthn FROGGS: Only constants.
22:21 lizmat and I don't think you can do enums either
22:21 FROGGS :/
22:22 FROGGS I want to export %*ENV as %ENV to v5
22:22 lizmat not unless you make your own EXPORT sub
22:22 lizmat afaik
22:22 FROGGS doing that would be fine too, but it didnt work yesterday when I tried
22:23 jnthn You can do enums, it just doesn't export the elements.
22:23 jnthn As in, you have to longname 'em.
22:23 lizmat ah, yes, it exports the elements if you map $_ to "eval $_", if I remember correctly
22:24 FROGGS r: module A { sub EXPORT(|) { my %ex; %ex<%ENV> := %*ENV; %ex } }; import A; say %ENV
22:24 camelia rakudo 170856: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤Variable '%ENV' is not declaredâ�¤at /tmp/piquGLNSNU:1â�¤------> [32mV> := %*ENV; %ex } }; import A; say %ENV[33mâ��[31m<EOL>[0mâ�¤    expecting any of:â�¤        postfixâ�¤Â»
22:24 FROGGS should that work? (by spec?)
22:27 fgomez joined #perl6
22:28 prammer_ joined #perl6
22:28 lizmat sub EXPORT should be in UNIT
22:29 lizmat (before the "module")
22:29 * lizmat is just cargo-culting from code she made for the masakism workshop
22:29 donaldh jnthn: Trying to use HLL::Compiler.lineof but QAST::CompilerJAST is not an HLL::Compiler.
22:29 FROGGS okay, so it must be a separate file
22:30 donaldh jnthn: Can I get to the HLL::Compiler ?
22:30 lizmat possibly, not sure
22:30 jnthn UNIT implies separate file, yeah.
22:30 jnthn donaldh: I suspect so.
22:30 FROGGS ... because I cant import from a module I am in
22:31 FROGGS k, will try that after $short-sleep
22:31 FROGGS gnight all o/
22:31 jnthn donaldh: You may need a "use NQPHLL" or so.
22:31 jnthn 'night, FROGGS
22:31 donaldh ah.
22:31 jnthn donaldh: Which may also want a Makefile update to add the dep.
22:31 donaldh jnthn: I tried a use HLL::Compiler which blew up :)
22:31 lizmat 'night FROGGS
22:32 FROGGS HAH!! it is working!!
22:33 FROGGS I just had to move it before my "class Perl5::Terms;" declaration
22:33 FROGGS lizmit++ # should be lizmit**100
22:33 FROGGS \o/
22:34 donaldh jnthn++ use NQPHLL works
22:36 donaldh and Makefile dep appears to be there already.
22:38 jnthn oh :
22:38 jnthn :)
22:53 xilo joined #perl6
22:53 donaldh yay, part way there. I have line numbers for the starts of blocks.
22:54 jnthn \o/
22:54 donaldh The stack goes from NQPHLL.nqp -> t/nqp/01-literal.t -> NQPCORE.setting
22:55 donaldh I know it _should_ do that, but it's still surreal.
22:55 jnthn :)
22:55 jnthn This will be a big help. :)
22:57 [Coke] do we have any qmail admins here?
22:58 masak jnthn++ # hello world
22:58 * jnthn is almost done with a blog post :)
22:58 donaldh It, uh, isn't that friendly in the Eclipse debug view until you click on a line https://gist.github.com/donaldh/5580373
22:59 [Coke] jnthn++!
23:00 masak dang, now I gotta wait until jnthn posts his blog post until I can go to bed... :P
23:00 * lizmat can't wait for jnthn's blog post, but can't keep her eyes open so goes to sleep&
23:01 masak 'night, lizmat
23:01 jnthn o/ lizmat
23:01 masak dream about successful EXPORTs.
23:03 sjohnson joined #perl6
23:13 [Coke] we want mail to be working on feather, yes?
23:14 [Coke] I see undelivered git messages to audreyt from 2011, e.g.
23:14 lue Did I read that last rakudo/jvm-support commit from a while ago correctly? (Specifically, "I can use Rakudo on JVM... kinda")
23:15 [Coke] hello world works.
23:16 gdey joined #perl6
23:16 * lue goes to upgrade his icedtea then
23:17 * donaldh needs a faster computer
23:18 donaldh s/needs/wants/
23:19 [Coke] .ask juerd - feather ran out of disk space today- looks like messages are piled up in /var/qmail from (ever) and need to be delivered.
23:19 yoleaux [Coke]: I'll pass your message to juerd.
23:20 [Coke] .ask juerd - I'm out of my depth and don't know anything about qmail.
23:20 yoleaux [Coke]: I'll pass your message to juerd.
23:20 [Coke] (now might be a good time to create a .forward file if you don't have one.)
23:29 masak 'night, #perl6
23:30 TimToady o/
23:32 jnthn post: http://6guts.wordpress.com/2013/05/15/rakudo-on-jvm-progress-update-and-some-questions-answered/
23:34 TimToady \o/
23:34 DreamingInCode joined #perl6
23:35 sorear jnthn++
23:36 DreamingInCode joined #perl6
23:41 donaldh jnthn: I've sent a pull request for source annotations on rak-jvm-support
23:41 jnthn donaldh: Thanks; I'll take a look tomorrow.
23:42 donaldh g'night o/
23:42 jnthn Should rest now...need to make some vague attempt to get my body to sleep at normal-ish times given I gotta teach Thu/Fri...
23:42 jnthn 'night
23:51 [Coke] jnthn++

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