Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2013-05-31

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:07 lue r: say (^10)».msb».base(2)
00:07 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«0 1 1 10 10 10 10 11 11␤»
00:13 lue S32::Numeric details lsb and msb. They return the *position* of the most/least significant set bit.
00:15 diakopter what's this about samba?
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01:53 lizmat good * from Austin, TX,  #perl6!
01:54 diakopter HOWDY
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01:54 grondilu say .WHAT given (my @ = ^10).list;
01:54 grondilu rn: say .WHAT given (my @ = ^10).list;
01:54 camelia rakudo cd5ca7, niecza v24-55-g7942a09: OUTPUT«(Array)␤»
01:54 * grondilu is confused by .list returning an Array :/
01:57 grondilu rn: say .WHAT given list(my @ = ^10);
01:57 camelia rakudo cd5ca7, niecza v24-55-g7942a09: OUTPUT«(List)␤»
01:59 colomon lizmat: woah, you're there very early!
02:00 lizmat we like to see a bit of the surroundings before indulging in a conference :-)
02:00 lizmat slash hackathon
02:05 pmichaud lizmat: Howdy!  Welcome to Texas!
02:05 lizmat hi pmichaud!
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02:05 pmichaud I'm currently about 700km  (ahem, we use *miles* here, so 435 mi) north of you.
02:06 lizmat well, that's more than we drove today…
02:06 pmichaud oh, wait.
02:06 lizmat if you'd be in Amsterdam, we'd be in mid France
02:06 pmichaud that's round-trip distance.
02:06 pmichaud 350km  (217 mi)
02:07 lizmat ah. that's more like: if we would be at home, you would be in Groningen…  about the max distance you can do in the Netherlands  :-)
02:07 pmichaud right.
02:07 pmichaud if you go due south, then in about 325 miles you finally hit the Mexico border.
02:08 pmichaud lesson:  Everything's Big in Texas.  :)
02:08 pmichaud anyway, glad you arrived safely.
02:08 pmichaud I look forward to seeing you this weekend.
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02:09 colomon I'll get there Saturday around dinner time, I think.
02:09 pmichaud I don't know exactly when I'll arrive on Saturday, I'd like to get an early start, but I have to make sure everything is well-set at home before departing.
02:10 pmichaud I think I'll try to arrive by 8pm or so, which is when I think jnthn/masak/others will likely be arriving.
02:10 lizmat looking forward to that!
02:10 pmichaud I might not be able to get there until midnight, though.
02:11 pmichaud I'll /msg folks my cell # so you can call and find out where I'm at.
02:11 pmichaud or maybe I'll find a way to send my current location via twitter or a location app or something.
02:13 * pmichaud checks weather
02:13 lizmat ~34±1
02:13 pmichaud yeah
02:14 pmichaud looks like the forecast got warmer since I last looked
02:14 pmichaud but Texas weather is very unpredictable.
02:14 pmichaud as of two days ago, we were forecast for a sunny weekend, now we're forecast for rain+storms on the weekend
02:16 pmichaud btw, if you find nothing to do on Saturday, the Texas Linux Fest is taking place in Austin on Saturday.  http://2013.texaslinuxfest.org/
02:30 * colomon is planning on going to the pub to play some Irish tunes on Sunday night.
02:33 colomon http://thesession.org/sessions/269
02:34 sorear lookin forward to seein y'all
02:34 sorear i'm arriving at 1705 in AUS
02:34 sorear Sat
02:35 * diakopter tries to remember the times and who of the 8 people I offered to pick up at the airport Saturday
02:35 * diakopter gives up immediateliy
02:36 sorear I'm arriving with gdey
02:40 colomon sorear: 1732 for me.
02:40 * sorear ponders sticking around and waiting for people
02:42 lizmat fwiw, we have a minivan, max 7 people… so we could pick up at least the people staying at the Doubletree
02:43 lizmat afk to do some shopping
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02:44 sorear I have no idea what gdey's plans for post-arrival are
02:49 dalek star: 7b615e3 | pmichaud++ | modules/perl6-http-easy:
02:49 dalek star: Update HTTP::Easy module for 2013.05 release.
02:49 dalek star: review: https://github.com/rakudo/star/commit/7b615e3c02
02:52 diakopter lizmat: heh, I have a minivan too
02:52 diakopter from Alamo
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02:55 pmichaud The Alamo is 79 mi (127km) from the Doubletree in Austin.  :-P
02:55 pmichaud Remember that.  :-P
02:57 sorear the city or the theatre?
02:57 pmichaud the monument
02:57 pmichaud the mission in downtown San Antonio
03:01 sorear I see
03:01 pmichaud the site of the battle that inspired the "Remember the Alamo" phrase
03:01 pmichaud you know... "The Alamo".  :-)
03:02 sorear yeah, "remember the alamo" is basically all I remember from that day in grade-school US history :[  wikipedia to the rescue!
03:02 shachaf Remember "Remember the Alamo!"!
03:03 pmichaud don't worry about it too much; I had a girlfriend from Sacramento who was visiting San Antonio with me, and she saw a sign with directions to "The Alamo" and asked... "oh, is there a plaque or something there?"  :-P
03:05 pmichaud (note to non-Texans:  It's a Spanish Mission with a chapel (the iconic building) and tours.
03:06 diakopter and it's backwards/inside-out from what you'd expect to be fought from behind
03:07 diakopter that was the best english sentence evar.
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03:23 dalek star: 6bab91c | pmichaud++ | tools/star/release-guide.pod:
03:23 dalek star: Add myself to release history; update release-guide reminder for that.
03:23 dalek star: review: https://github.com/rakudo/star/commit/6bab91cc4b
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03:55 dalek specs: 20dd0dc | (Brent Laabs)++ | S32-setting-library/IO.pod:
03:55 dalek specs: S32::IO fix layout, bump version
03:55 dalek specs: review: https://github.com/perl6/specs/commit/20dd0dc6b4
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04:04 pmichaud Rakudo Star 2013.05 released.
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04:07 sorear "\o/ " x 20
04:09 bonsaikitten /o\
04:11 labster \\o//
04:16 dalek star: a78540d | pmichaud++ | tools/star/release-guide.pod:
04:16 dalek star: Add Wikipedia to the list of places to update.
04:16 dalek star: review: https://github.com/rakudo/star/commit/a78540d47c
04:18 atroxaper WoW WoW!!!
04:20 atroxaper Even for windows! Thanks a lot, pmichaud!
04:20 lizmat diakopter: great minds think alike  :-)  ours is also from Alamo  :-)
04:20 lizmat and now off to bed, it was a looooong day
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04:36 atroxaper Is it right that new R* use Parrot 5.2 like described in http://rakudo.org/2013/05/31/r​akudo-star-2013-05-released/? I thought it will be 5.3.
04:39 sorear 1. R* uses stable parrots
04:40 sorear 2. we've had a lot of issues with an IO refactor that parrot did, and for a while (possibly extending to now?) we weren't able to upgrade
04:44 atroxaper I just thought that https://github.com/rakudo/star/commit/1​631f371f2d3818d35850fdc20669d92ce3a1223 make R* is used 5.3 Parrot. Am i wrong?
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05:07 pmichaud oh, it is 5.3.0
05:08 pmichaud the announcement is wrong.
05:08 pmichaud fixing.
05:08 pmichaud I thought I updated the announcement, but apparently I failed.
05:08 tadzik oooh. We should have a "wars" and a "trek" branches in star
05:08 tadzik so dalek would report that as star/trek
05:08 tadzik (good morning, #perl6)
05:10 dalek star: 56fe546 | pmichaud++ | docs/announce/2013.05.md:
05:10 dalek star: Correct announcement to read Parrot 5.3.0 .
05:10 dalek star: review: https://github.com/rakudo/star/commit/56fe5467a8
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05:12 pmichaud we can also have "gate", "crossed", "man", etc.  :-)
05:14 tadzik now we only need to find a purpose. Or rather, excuse :)
05:14 pmichaud oh, if I thought there'd be enough of them, we could use them as release nicknames.
05:14 pmichaud like we do .pm cities for the compiler
05:14 sorear hey gdey.
05:15 pmichaud star/kindustries  ;_0
05:16 * pmichaud still hasn't seen Iron Man 3 yet :-/
05:16 pmichaud nor Star Trek: Into Darkness
05:17 tadzik same here
05:17 tadzik but I think they're both available in 3d-only
05:17 pmichaud oh, I'm sure they're available 2d here.
05:18 pmichaud yeah, 2d here for ST:ID
05:18 pmichaud and IM3
05:18 pmichaud (3d is available, but 2d is available too)
05:19 tadzik ha, ST is available apparently
05:19 tadzik in 2D
05:19 tadzik Iron Man isn't though
05:19 gdey hey sorear
05:21 * tadzik ponders going to see ST today
05:21 sorear looks like DFW has free wifi so we can discuss this later if needed
05:21 sorear but diakopter and lizmat are apparently running van pools out of AUS, do you have plans on that front?
05:27 pmichaud bedtime -- back tomorrow.
05:27 Teratogen night
05:28 atroxaper night
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06:51 FROGGS o/
06:52 atroxaper 0/
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06:56 sorear ō
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07:16 labster ó
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07:45 Topic for #perl6 is now »ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | http://perl6.org/ | evalbot usage: 'perl6: say 3;' or rakudo:,  niecza:, std:, or /msg camelia perl6: ... | irclog: http://irc.perl6.org/ | UTF-8 is our friend!
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08:10 hoelzro new Rakudo *!
08:10 hoelzro \o\
08:10 hoelzro /o/
08:11 hoelzro unfortunately building it has killed my VM =(
08:12 hoelzro at least I wasn't building it on a real machine =)
08:12 bonsaikitten worksforme
08:13 bonsaikitten hoelzro: ulimit to the rescue ;)
08:13 hoelzro I thought ulimit didn't work for memory on Linux? (I assume that's the issue)
08:13 hoelzro ouch; I even gave the VM 2GB of RAM
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08:15 moritz why shouldn't ulimit work?
08:15 moritz you just have to be careful which memory you limit (hint: ulimit -v is most often what you want)
08:15 bonsaikitten it does
08:16 bonsaikitten ulimit -m  256000 # 256 metric Mibblibytes
08:16 bonsaikitten and if you have multiple processes ... cgroups are fun (although the memory cg is usually disabled)
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08:33 hoelzro I thought I read somewhere that ulimit doesn't work for memory usage on limit
08:33 hoelzro but maybe that's out of date
08:33 hoelzro *on Linux
08:33 bonsaikitten ??
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08:42 moritz hoelzro: maybe you've read that, but it's wrong :-)
08:42 hoelzro it's something I'm happy to be wrong about =)
08:42 hoelzro either way, my VM is quite angry.
08:42 hoelzro and I *really* don't want to pull the plug =(
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09:03 masak morning, #perl6
09:05 atroxaper masak, morning! But in my Siberia is 6am already ^^
09:06 atroxaper Not 6, but 4am )
09:07 atroxaper I'm not used to using short time-style.
09:07 jnthn .oO( nor am vs pm )
09:08 atroxaper Oh... It's lol! am == pm)
09:08 bonsaikitten 5pm here in China
09:15 * masak waves to atroxaper-in-the-future
09:19 * atroxaper advises masak to be careful with time travel
09:19 moritz it's ALWAYS morning in Universal Greeting Time!
09:20 masak moritz++
09:21 atroxaper :D
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09:38 smash pmichaud++ # rakudo release
09:38 tadzik smash! \o/
09:39 smash tadzik: o/
09:42 hoelzro damn
09:43 hoelzro my package building script for Rakudo * doesn't work with 2013.05 =(
09:59 hoelzro what's the deal with 721f127?
09:59 hoelzro (on nqp)
09:59 hoelzro that commit threw out code that was necessary for building packages
10:01 hoelzro is jnthn around?
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10:27 colomon Looks like three modules (File::Direcotry::Tree, IO::Path::More, and Test::Junkie) started working in the last two days!
10:27 FROGGS O.o
10:27 FROGGS just like that?
10:28 colomon FROGGS: well, I fixed Test::Junkie.  Dunno what happened to the other two.
10:28 colomon File::Directory::Tree was blocking on IO::Path::More.
10:29 colomon Looks like labster++ made changes to IO::Path::More.
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12:10 masak wow, https://www.cs.ucf.edu/~dcm/Teaching/CO​T4810-Fall%202012/Literature/Backus.pdf is a really interesting observation, considering that it comes all the way from 1978.
12:10 masak much of what it points out as disadvantages is still very much "unsolved".
12:10 masak well, unless you're a full-time Haskell programmer. but most of us aren't.
12:12 masak there are some silver linings even in the industry: things like LINQ, and Rx, and various non-mainstream languages (Scala, CLojure, F#) nibbling away at how to do things nicely with FP.
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12:24 mathw hybrid languages are where it's going to be for a good while I think
12:25 mathw there are some astonishingly powerful ideas floating around in the Haskell world these days, but I'm not convinced Haskell itself is the right language to bring those wonderful things to the world at large with
12:25 mathw I hope to see Microsoft do more with F#, the level of tooling in Visual Studio for it really relegates it to a second-class citizen
12:26 mathw They don't bother providing tools for things like ASP.NET MVC projects in F# because their position is that it's not meant for that kind of work. Why, I ask, can't it be?
12:26 mathw It does support all the necessary behaviours after all
12:26 masak *nod*
12:26 mathw It's still cheating, but it's closer...
12:27 mathw I must admit to really missing Haskell typeclasses though
12:27 mathw wonderful, wonderful things
12:27 mathw It's like if C# let you add an interface implementation to an object without having the ability to modify its class
12:27 mathw and yes there are extension methods, but they're not the same either
12:28 mathw I want... roles!
12:28 masak Go seems to do something similar-ish with its interfaces.
12:28 masak it's an idea whose time has come.
12:29 masak inheritance hierarchies are so 20th century. :)
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12:31 mathw definitely
12:31 mathw I use inheritance less and less
12:31 mathw heck, I use objects less and less
12:31 mathw my C# code is now strewn with static classes
12:32 mathw objects have their place, but so much can be done with other ways and it seems to work better
12:32 mathw if I have to make an instance of some object in order to do something like a data transform I tend to start turning my nose up
12:32 mathw and plotting to write a wrapper function that hides the mess
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12:36 mathw probably the thing that distresses me most in C# programming is where you're in the shiny new world of LINQ and pseudo-functional programming and you run headlong into a library you can't avoid that's designed like something from Java 1.2
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14:21 * diakopter holds his breath
14:21 masak calm before the storm... :)
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14:26 moritz diakopter: breathe again, please!
14:29 * masak .oO( moar breathing plz )
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14:30 grondilu DUMP is not documented yet?  Will it be a full ASCII serialization?
14:31 grondilu r: say <foo bar>.DUMP
14:31 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«Parcel<1>(:$!storage(RPA<2>(␤    "foo",␤    "bar"␤)))␤»
14:31 moritz grondilu: I guess it will mostly be a debugging tool
14:32 grondilu ok
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14:38 timotimo r: say (1, 2, 3, 4).>>WHAT
14:38 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤Confusedâ�¤at /tmp/dBzLDn0SWI:1â�¤------> [32msay (1, 2, 3, 4).[33mâ��[31m>>WHAT[0mâ�¤    expecting any of:â�¤        dotty method or postfixâ�¤Â»
14:38 timotimo :(
14:39 timotimo r: say (1, 2, 3, 4)>>.WHAT
14:39 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«(Parcel)␤»
14:39 timotimo :(
14:39 moritz r: say (1, 2, 3, 4).map: *.WHAT
14:39 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«No such method 'count' for invocant of type 'Whatever'␤  in method reify at src/gen/CORE.setting:5783␤  in method reify at src/gen/CORE.setting:5700␤  in method reify at src/gen/CORE.setting:5700␤  in method gimme at src/gen/CORE.setting:6131␤  in method eager at s…
14:39 moritz can't prime macro methods, it seems
14:39 grondilu rn: say (^5)».WHAT
14:39 camelia niecza v24-55-g7942a09: OUTPUT«(Int) (Int) (Int) (Int) (Int)␤»
14:39 camelia ..rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«(Range)␤»
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14:46 [Coke] r: say (1, 2, 3, 4).map: { $_.WHAT }
14:46 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«use of uninitialized value of type Int in string context  in block  at /tmp/e1dukKeIVT:1␤␤use of uninitialized value of type Int in string context  in block  at /tmp/e1dukKeIVT:1␤␤use of uninitialized value of type Int in string context  in block  at /tmp/e1dukKeIV…
14:51 Ulti is there a tutorial for using perl6 to make your own DSL? something a bit like this video of using Python's parsimonious grammar engine http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1h1mM7VwNGo
14:54 tadzik I think there was an advent calendar post
14:54 tadzik also a masakism task
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14:59 Ulti http://perl6advent.wordpress.com/200​9/12/21/day-21-grammars-and-actions/ I guess this
15:00 * diakopter passed out from no oxygen
15:01 tadzik Ulti: http://perl6advent.wordpress.com/2012/12/20​/day-20-dynamic-variables-and-dsl-y-things/
15:02 tadzik that's what google "perl 6 dsl advent" said, at least ;)
15:08 Ulti yeah thats not really what I mean, its not parsing anything you've just made some method calls that look like the language you wanted and its executed as perl6 immediately
15:08 Ulti p. neat though
15:10 tadzik well, what kind of tutorial would you want with that?
15:10 tadzik seems pretty straightforward :)
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15:11 Ulti like if you defined a custom string with a sub language tied to a grammar that parsed the _ and O to create a tree of execution for all that it would be what I mean.. obviously over kill for that task
15:11 Ulti I assume thats how regex is implemented in perl6?
15:12 Ulti with regex being a sublanguage with the perl5 and perl6 versions having their own grammar classes
15:14 * Ulti wanders off to finish his thesis so he can actually play with perl6 properly later ;___;
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15:46 masak TimToady: http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Caesar_cipher#Perl_6 is yours -- I checked. I'm not 100% sure this is an error, but I'm wondering if strdup() really outputs the string, as the output seems to imply.
15:46 masak ergh, bad link, sorry. meant http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Call_a​_foreign-language_function#Perl_6
15:48 jnthn masak: I think the puts does the output
15:48 jnthn And then returns a result code which is on the next line
15:50 masak oh, d'oh!
15:50 masak yes.
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16:24 masak "Here we arbitrarily show as many lines of output as there are lines in the program. :-)" -- hah! http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Count_in_octal#Perl_6
16:27 * diakopter wakes up from passed out, and starts holding his breath again
16:29 Ulti masak: this is a cleaner implementation http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Count_in_octal#LOLCODE
16:30 masak Ulti: :)
16:30 Ulti I can only imagine octocat from github saying that when I read it
16:31 Ulti <octocat> IM IN YR octalizer
16:31 * masak revels in the pure anachronicity of http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Creat​e_a_file_on_magnetic_tape#Perl_6
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16:33 pmichaud anyone know how to find the number of RT tickets closed in the perl6 queue since Jan 1?
16:33 Ulti masak: the Racket code below that is even better
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16:34 geekosaur oh, hm, need an account to do a real search
16:35 masak pmichaud: Advanced Search, "Resolved", "After", "2013-01-01".
16:35 FROGGS pmichaud: 144
16:36 FROGGS I did "resolved after 2012-12-31" though
16:36 pmichaud maybe included rejected, also
16:36 masak yeah, also getting 144 resolved.
16:36 FROGGS it does, yeah
16:36 Ulti http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Parse_EBNF#Perl_6 wow a grammar of a grammar
16:36 FROGGS it maybe includes reopened ticket, though I dont think we did that
16:37 masak we did. once.
16:37 FROGGS tickets also*
16:37 masak or if there were more than one, we closed them again.
16:39 masak "This example is **incorrect**. It does not accomplish the given task." -- anyone know/see why? http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Currying#Perl_6
16:39 masak (I don't.)
16:43 geekosaur the "What is the task?" on the discussion page may be relevant
16:44 geekosaur (argubaly, assuming is *not* currying, it is partial application. Currying might be closer to using a capture to provide arguments?
16:45 masak yeah, the whole task description needs to be clarified.
16:53 bluescreen100 joined #perl6
16:54 colomon masak: I thought we worked out the other day that assuming(*, 0) doesn't actually work?
16:55 colomon at least, doesn't work in Rakudo or Niecza.
16:55 masak I, uh, I'm behind on my backlogging...
16:56 * lizmat knows the feeling
16:57 [Coke] r: sub f($a, $b) { $a - $b } ; say .(1) for &f.assuming(0), &f.assuming(*, 0)
16:57 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«-1␤Too many positional parameters passed; got 3 but expected 2␤  in sub f at /tmp/v1K6vRN4Fd:1␤  in sub CURRIED at src/gen/CORE.setting:2069␤  in block  at /tmp/v1K6vRN4Fd:1␤␤»
16:59 * colomon frequently gives up completely on backlogging, for what it's worth.  :)
17:01 colomon r: sub f($a, $b) { $a - $b } ; say .(1) for &f.assuming(0)
17:01 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«-1␤»
17:01 colomon r: sub f($a, $b) { $a - $b } ; say .(1) for &f.assuming(*,0)
17:01 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«Too many positional parameters passed; got 3 but expected 2␤  in sub f at /tmp/hEN7DT0JN6:1␤  in sub CURRIED at src/gen/CORE.setting:2069␤  in block  at /tmp/hEN7DT0JN6:1␤␤»
17:01 colomon r: sub f($a, $b) { $a - $b } ; say .() for &f.assuming(*,0)
17:01 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«Cannot call 'Numeric'; none of these signatures match:␤:(Mu:U \v: Mu *%_)␤  in method Numeric at src/gen/CORE.setting:865␤  in sub infix:<-> at src/gen/CORE.setting:2987␤  in sub infix:<-> at src/gen/CORE.setting:2985␤  in sub f at /tmp/xFdmbq7FDR:1␤  in sub CURRIE…
17:04 konundra joined #perl6
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17:08 lizmat afk for some sight seeing
17:09 masak lizmat: o/ enjoy!
17:15 gdey joined #perl6
17:23 spanner joined #perl6
17:25 * masak gently suggests jnthn's one-liner solution should be in http://rosettacode.org/wik​i/Execute_Brain****/Perl_6
17:27 * [Coke] wonders if next R* will have some jvm.
17:27 * [Coke] hasn't kept up with recent commits, and should try to at least build stuff this weekend.
17:28 * [Coke] also wants to get rakudo-jvm into the daily roasts sooner than later.
17:28 cognominal joined #perl6
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17:35 PerlJam [Coke]: were you going to YAPC this year?
17:39 masak Teratogen: (topic lifted over from #masakism): is Perl 6 becoming an academic language? no. it's not done primarily in academia. nor is it shifting into academia. did you have some other definition of "academic language"?
17:40 Vlavv joined #perl6
17:40 Teratogen masak!
17:40 Teratogen =(
17:41 FieldsaBB joined #perl6
17:42 _ilbot joined #perl6
17:42 Topic for #perl6 is now »ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | http://perl6.org/ | evalbot usage: 'perl6: say 3;' or rakudo:,  niecza:, std:, or /msg camelia perl6: ... | irclog: http://irc.perl6.org/ | UTF-8 is our friend!
17:42 nwc10 [Coke]: http://jnthn.net/papers/2013-plpw-rakudo-jvm.pdf alledges on page 52: The June compiler release of
17:42 nwc10 Rakudo
17:42 nwc10 will be the first
17:42 nwc10 gee, thanks firefox
17:42 nwc10 with some level of JVM support
17:42 nwc10 one line would have been better
17:43 [Coke] PerlJam: I cannot justify the cost, no.
17:43 colomon [Coke]: :(
17:44 PerlJam [Coke]: That's what I thought.  I will be sad to miss you :(
17:44 jnthn nwc10: That's mostly just a branch merge at this point, alas I've not really been in a fit state to see to it in the last few days. I'll hopefully manage at YAPC.
17:44 nwc10 jnthn: get well soon
17:45 nwc10 I've been out with a bad cold for most of the previous 3 days
17:45 jnthn If only that's all that was with me... :/
17:45 jnthn But anyway, get well
17:45 [Coke] FYI, getting something like mojo6 running on the jvm would certainly help me justify the cost a bit. :)
17:46 [Coke] hugme: hug jnthn
17:46 * hugme hugs jnthn
17:46 dalek perl6-roast-data: 502b111 | coke++ | / (4 files):
17:46 dalek perl6-roast-data: today (automated commit)
17:46 dalek perl6-roast-data: review: https://github.com/coke/perl6​-roast-data/commit/502b1119af
17:48 [Coke] all three implementations now dirty.
17:48 pmichaud I don't expect R* to have jvm until july at earliest.
17:48 pmichaud with emphasis on "at earliest"
17:49 jnthn pmichaud: I've had R* more like September
17:49 pmichaud jnthn: that works for me, too.
17:49 [Coke] once it's at a point it can run *any* spec tests, I'll probably add it to the roast figures.
17:49 pmichaud R* wants stability more than anything else, and it's not just the compiler but the modules that would want some working out.
17:50 [Coke] then you can get a pretty picture of what happens when you add some bit.
17:50 pmichaud we'll likely spend a good part of midsummer figuring out what modules R* really ought to have.
17:51 jnthn [Coke]: Getting into the daily roast, once it can do that, would be great.
17:52 * colomon is hoping YAPC::NA hackathon includes some stints of getting the core up and running on jvm...
17:53 pmichaud the YAPC::NA hackathon is going to be interesting on many levels.
17:54 jnthn .oO( The hackathon rooms are on differnet floors? )
17:54 nwc10 will there be a downloadable Rakudo JAR soon? :-)
17:54 atroxaper left #perl6
17:54 jnthn colomon: I expect to spend some tuits on Rakudo JVM, for sure.
17:55 adu joined #perl6
17:55 colomon jnthn: didn't specifically mean you.  or is it not ready for the rest of us to hack on yet?
17:56 jnthn colomon: Ah. I suspect there'll be LHF-ish things.
17:56 jnthn There's plenty of tricky things, though.
17:56 colomon not that I've got anything against you working on it, mind you.  ;)
17:56 * PerlJam wonders how long before we have other Rakudo distributions (e.g., biorakudo  :)
17:56 jnthn colomon: Well, I do prefer it when things are not depending one me, though. :)
18:04 [Coke] if hacking on jvm-for-rakudo, which branches do we want?
18:04 jnthn jvm-support in Rakudo, rak-jvm-support in NQP
18:04 btyler joined #perl6
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18:20 hoelzro jnthn: I saw that you removed a commit of mine from NQP =(
18:20 hoelzro er, reverted.
18:21 jnthn hoelzro: Does it look intentional or accidental? If intentional, the revert commit should say why.
18:21 hoelzro hang on
18:21 hoelzro digging it up =)
18:21 hoelzro 721f127
18:21 nwc10 "Toss code that does nothing."
18:21 nwc10 use more tests!
18:21 hoelzro reverting that broke packaging =(
18:26 grondilu joined #perl6
18:33 dukeleto joined #perl6
18:33 dukeleto o/
18:34 pmichaud o/
18:34 masak o/
18:39 * diakopter is very dead from lack of oxygen
18:40 colomon \o
18:40 masak diakopter: dude, we told you to breathe hours ago.
18:42 * [Coke] wonders if diakopter is waiting for someone to ask what the problem is.
18:44 nwc10 diakopter: have you trained up your replacement yet? If not, you're not permitted to die.
18:55 japhb_ joined #perl6
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19:06 dukeleto joined #perl6
19:15 * FROGGS thinks that everyone is silent because of working on the slides
19:15 diakopter prolly not that
19:16 * FROGGS (for a specific group of ppl called everyone)
19:16 flussence .oO( they're all holding their breath )
19:16 diakopter *gasp*
19:16 FROGGS :o)
19:16 * masak is holding his breath too!
19:17 masak ...as if there will be something MOAR happening tonight...
19:17 * jnthn blogged http://6guts.wordpress.com/2013/05/31/moa​rvm-a-virtual-machine-for-nqp-and-rakudo/
19:17 masak jnthn++! \o/
19:17 FROGGS O.o
19:17 masak ok, it's ON.
19:18 * TimToady starts holding his breath now...
19:20 diakopter graphs page is awesome
19:21 * [Coke] crosses sixparrot off his ever-growing todo list.
19:21 diakopter less awesome graph: http://i.imgur.com/7ZAFb7U.png    NO MOAR PEOPLE PLZ
19:22 masak diakopter: avoid success at all costs. :P
19:22 diakopter https://github.com/MoarVM/MoarVM/contributors
19:23 masak yay, the camel has two humps, and so does masak! :P
19:23 bluescreen10 joined #perl6
19:25 raiph joined #perl6
19:26 FROGGS wow
19:26 * FROGGS has just finished reading
19:26 masak lol, I blogged! http://strangelyconsistent​.org/blog/a-vm-for-6model
19:26 TimToady wow, you write fast :)
19:27 masak as a Perl 6 historian, I have to stay one step ahead! :P
19:27 colomon wow
19:27 Teratogen I liked when Perl 5 had an option to call the c preprocessor
19:27 * colomon has not finished reading
19:27 Teratogen I think it was perl -P
19:27 Teratogen but they got rid of it =(
19:28 * Teratogen likes the simplicity and elegance of the C Preprocessor
19:28 masak Teratogen: you've harped on this topic before: http://irclog.perlgeek.de/​perl6/2012-02-19#i_5174077
19:28 masak Teratogen: many times, in fact.
19:29 Teratogen my conscience
19:29 Teratogen =)
19:29 masak Teratogen: I think we can take it as established now that you like the simplicity of the bloody C preprocessor.
19:29 [Coke] we can also take it as granted that masak is constantly searching the backlog to beat people over the head with it. :)
19:30 masak I told you, I'm a Perl 6 historian.
19:30 flussence some people like the simplicity of using regex on arbitrary html...
19:30 diakopter argh.
19:30 diakopter I accidentally it an announcment
19:30 masak I find patterns in things.
19:30 * [Coke] wonders if there is a perl6 program that is beeping at masak as he complains about how many times he's had to rewrite partcl from the ground up. :)
19:30 * colomon 's mind has been blown
19:30 * FROGGS .oO( I! *hit* told! *hit* you! *hit* ... )
19:30 Teratogen Parsing HTML with Perl Regexes for Fun and Profit
19:30 Teratogen I should write that book
19:31 PerlJam Teratogen: tchrist already beat you to it
19:31 Teratogen wow blast from the past
19:31 PerlJam (Well, almost anything he writes resembles a book anyway  ;)
19:31 Teratogen tchrist?  that is efnet #perl circa 1996
19:31 * [Coke] supposes he will have to submit a patch for moarvm shortly.
19:31 Teratogen the apostrophic jihad!
19:32 Teratogen where did everyone in efnet #perl go to?
19:32 Teratogen they all up and left one day
19:32 PerlJam Still there.
19:32 Teratogen I guess one too many takeovers
19:32 PerlJam (I'm still on it in fact)
19:32 Teratogen wonder if I am still banned there
19:32 diakopter [Coke]: pull request currently I think
19:32 PerlJam no traffic really, but every once in a while it perks up
19:32 dukeleto joined #perl6
19:33 PerlJam Teratogen: I really didn't think you and I had been interacting for so long.
19:33 kbenson1 joined #perl6
19:34 masak r: loop { say "jnthn++" }
19:34 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«(timeout)jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn+​+␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnth​n++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jn​thn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤​jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn+​+␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤…
19:35 FROGGS hehe
19:35 PerlJam masak: btw, I like how every time someone mentions JIT, it's always in the future.
19:35 colomon PerlJam: I'm sure we'll get it done just in time.
19:36 PerlJam colomon++  :)
19:36 PerlJam JIT is like flying cars.
19:36 masak PerlJam: let me just say that based on what I know about Parrot and Moar, my personal priors are higher that there'll be a useful JIT this time.
19:36 masak quite a bit higher, in fact.
19:37 nyuszika7h joined #perl6
19:38 kbenson1 So, I submitted jnthn's blog to HN in case anyone has an account and wants to vote it up or comment: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5800775
19:38 diakopter r: say 'jnthn++'for^Inf
19:38 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«(timeout)jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn+​+␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnth​n++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jn​thn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤​jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn+​+␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤jnthn++␤…
19:38 PerlJam masak: There's a select group of people I have in mind that if someone from the list says "I/we will create X", my confidence that X will actually exist at some point is in the area of 90%.
19:39 * masak upvotes
19:39 kbenson1 getting it past the initial hump of obscurity (WRT HN )might yield a nice discussion there
19:39 masak PerlJam: aye.
19:39 masak kbenson1++
19:40 PerlJam oddly, most of those people are on #perl6 ;)
19:40 * PerlJam upvotes
19:41 * colomon too
19:42 masak 13th place on the main page.
19:43 kbenson1 It was 16th with 4 points, and is 13th with 5.  A few more within the next couple of minutes and it will probably reach the top 5, if not #1.
19:44 Martin_Zaremba joined #perl6
19:45 colomon MoarVM doesn't build on darwin yet.  :(
19:45 kbenson1 .oO( I never realized it was so easy to seed a from page event )
19:45 [Coke] colomon: working on that.
19:45 * smace saying hi to everybody (Perl stranger)
19:46 PerlJam smace: greetings!
19:47 PerlJam smace: What's your interest in Perl 6? Want to contribute?  Or do you just want to lurk and learn?
19:47 PerlJam smace: or ... are you here by mistake?  ;)
19:47 smace Lurk and learn, convinced by friend.
19:48 REPLeffect joined #perl6
19:48 kbenson smace: That sounds like a good friend.  You should keep 'em. :)
19:48 PerlJam smace: excellent!  and what kbenson said too  :)
19:48 smace Have some background in Python, but he told me about great community out there ;))
19:50 GlitchMr Well, relatively small, but active community :-).
19:50 GlitchMr Ok, perhaps not "small".
19:50 GlitchMr (but compared to RoR or Python community, it is small)
19:50 PerlJam GlitchMr: all of the Perl 5 community is part of the Perl 6 community, only most of them don't know it yet  ;)
19:51 Teratogen Perl 5 is under ferocious development right now
19:51 Teratogen what are they up to, Perl 5.12?
19:52 colomon 5.16
19:52 Teratogen christ on a bun!
19:52 kbenson 5.18
19:52 nwc10 higher!
19:52 nwc10 er, higher than 5.16
19:52 GlitchMr The problem with Perl 5 is that nearly nobody understands its source code.
19:52 * colomon apparently needs to upgrade
19:52 TimToady well, it has a couple other problems as well...
19:52 masak smace: welcome!
19:52 kbenson It's a regular release cycle now, so there's less wow features per release, but more steady improvement at a scale you can actually appreciate on a regular basis
19:53 rjbs I am reading http://6guts.wordpress.com/2013/05/31/moa​rvm-a-virtual-machine-for-nqp-and-rakudo/
19:53 GlitchMr I've 5.18.0 on my computer, but 5.10.1 on my VPS
19:53 rjbs Oh, nevermind.  My question has answered itself.
19:53 masak \o/
19:53 rjbs (I couldn't find the author, btu now I see that 6guts is *always* jnthn)
19:53 flussence 5.18 is the one where they realised most of the backported Perl 6 stuff doesn't make sense and added E_DEPRECA...^W on-by-default warnings to all of them, right?
19:53 GlitchMr Yeah
19:54 PerlJam rjbs: and here I thought you were like me annoyed that you had to scroll all the way to the bottom to get at the github URL  :)
19:54 GlitchMr ~~, given, when, ...
19:54 GlitchMr But not say.
19:54 shinobicl joined #perl6
19:54 smace So, better choice to dive into 6?
19:54 shinobicl rakudo: my @suits  = <♣ ♢ ♡ ♠>;my @ranks  = 2..10, <J Q K A>;my @deck = @ranks X~ @suits;my %points = @deck Z @( (2..10, 10, 10, 10, 11) Xxx 4 );@deck .= pick(*);my @hand = @deck.splice(0, 5);say ~@hand;say [+] %points{@hand};
19:54 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«5♢ 4♡ A♢ 3♠ 10♡␤33␤»
19:54 GlitchMr Oh, and my $_ has E_DEPRECATED now too.
19:54 census joined #perl6
19:54 PerlJam smace: "better" along which axes?  ;)
19:55 flussence smace: do both. If you get annoyed with one, you can skip it and come back later
19:55 rjbs GlitchMr: It's experimental, not deprecated, meaning we're hoping to "fix" rather than remove it.
19:55 masak smace: Perl 5 gets you "done" faster. Perl 6 is fun in indescribable ways.
19:55 smace PerlJam, just for fun and love ;)
19:55 diakopter updated my talk to reflect it: http://www.yapcna.org/yn2013/talk/4734
19:55 prammer joined #perl6
19:55 GlitchMr Not sure if ~~ even could be fixed.
19:55 masak diakopter++
19:55 PerlJam smace: oh, that's *definitely* perl 6
19:56 GlitchMr And my $_ simply doesn't make sense.
19:56 rjbs diakopter: Glad to finally know what that talk was/is.
19:56 PerlJam rjbs: Are you hoping to pick up sane smartmatch semantics here?  ;)
19:56 rjbs PerlJam: No, I'm quite happy with the ones we sorted out last year.
19:56 * masak loves guerilla-injecting the 蝶 tag into all the conferences he goes to :>
19:57 PerlJam rjbs++ good deal.  I stopped paying attention when p5p went crazy over smartmatch semantics.
19:57 [Coke] .u 蝶
19:57 shinobicl left #perl6
19:57 yoleaux No characters found
19:57 * TimToady wondered briefly what a "leaf bug" was, then said "duh"
19:57 GlitchMr my $_ doesn't make currently any sort of sense. I would expect it to either fail, or remove magic.
19:58 rjbs GlitchMr: /me will resist the urge to "talk five."
19:58 [Coke] colomon: nearly there.
19:58 TimToady well, "flat bug"
19:58 colomon [Coke]++
19:58 kbenson diakopter: I was unsure as to whether to go to the perl6 vm talk, but I guess it's non-optional now. ;)
19:58 GlitchMr But then, somehow my $_ has magic in Perl 6.
19:59 masak TimToady: :D
19:59 GlitchMr But $_ doesn't mean the same thing in Perl 5 and Perl 6.
19:59 TimToady [Coke]: 蝶 蝶 [die2] /butterfly/
19:59 masak TimToady: been doing it for years, but only been attending YAPC::EUs and European workshops.
19:59 tadzik good evening #perl6
20:00 masak tadzik! \o/
20:00 dmol joined #perl6
20:00 TimToady GlitchMr: $_ is *always* lexical in Perl 6
20:00 masak tadzik: you... need to backlog. :)
20:00 colomon tadzik: o/
20:00 tadzik what the hell happenend
20:00 colomon masak: bit of an understatement there!  :)
20:00 masak I know :D
20:00 GlitchMr The difference is that in Perl 5, you write "say", in Perl 6 ".say".
20:00 colomon tadzik: masak has been hiding something from us.
20:00 tadzik there are things in my RSS that are sort of puzzling
20:00 masak channel is all a-frothy!
20:00 prammer joined #perl6
20:00 masak colomon: I so have!
20:00 GlitchMr The dot before "say" is explicit way of saying "$_.say".
20:00 tadzik this guy keeps doing that
20:00 raiph joined #perl6
20:01 GlitchMr But in Perl 5, $_ is explicit.
20:01 tadzik I guess I'll read stuff first
20:01 masak it wasn't my sekkrit project this time, though.
20:01 GlitchMr implicit*
20:02 * masak waits for tadzik to get far enough to come back and go "OMG"
20:03 masak Moar is on 8th place on the HN main page now.
20:03 * masak .oO( MOAR UPVOTES )
20:05 tadzik oh
20:05 masak 6th place.
20:06 masak tadzik: "...my god"? :)
20:06 * moritz just upvoted it
20:06 FROGGS masak: done
20:06 tadzik the heck did I read
20:07 espadrine rn: 0, {+!*} ... *
20:07 camelia rakudo cd5ca7, niecza v24-55-g7942a09:  ( no output )
20:07 diakopter tadzik: you're making me lolololololol
20:08 tadzik I must say I'm very much surprised
20:09 espadrine rn: say 0, {+!*} ... *
20:09 colomon tadzik: me too.  in a good way, mind you.
20:09 camelia niecza v24-55-g7942a09: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
20:09 camelia ..rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«0    ...␤»
20:09 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: c3cdeb6 | (Tobias Leich)++ | src/QRegex/P (2 files):
20:09 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: enable regex special characters as delimiters
20:09 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support:
20:09 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: Special chars like quantifiers or control characters can be used
20:09 dalek nqp/rak-jvm-support: as delimiters. If they are used as delims they cant be used for
20:10 dalek joined #perl6
20:10 espadrine shouldn't (0, {+!*} ... *) be the same as (0, 1, {$^b;$^a} ... *)?
20:11 moritz espadrine: {+!*} looks wrong to me
20:11 colomon espadrine: what are you trying to do?
20:11 masak espadrine: don't think so.
20:11 moritz espadrine: * creates a closure, and { } also creates a closure
20:11 masak espadrine: it's hard to read when you're writing the stuff so crowded, with '+!*'. what do you want that to mean?
20:11 moritz so, you have a closure that, when invoked, returns a closure
20:11 colomon espadrine: {^$b;$^a } takes two arguments, { +!* } only one
20:11 masak r: say +!5
20:12 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«0␤»
20:12 colomon oh, right, only non.
20:12 colomon none
20:12 espadrine I thought * served as an argument; I'm trying to convert 0 to 1 and back
20:12 moritz nah, {...} always takes an implicit $_
20:12 moritz even if you don't use it
20:12 masak espadrine: +!$x means "boolify, negate, numify".
20:12 masak espadrine: that is, &prefix:<+>(&prefix:<!>($x))
20:12 moritz r: say (0, +|*, ... *)[^10]
20:12 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤Comma found before apparent series operator; please remove comma (or put parens\n    around the ... listop, or use 'fail' instead of ...)â�¤at /tmp/dBJrQLVDyj:1â�¤------> [32msay (0, +|*,[33mâ��[31m ... *)[^10][0mâ�¤Â»
20:13 moritz r: say (0, +|* ... *)[^10]
20:13 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤CHECK FAILED:␤Undefined routine '&prefix:<|>' called (line 1)␤»
20:13 moritz r: say (0, +!* ... *)[^10]
20:13 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1␤»
20:13 moritz r: say (0, 1, {$^b, $^a} ... *)[^10]
20:13 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«0 1 1 0 0 1 1 0 0 1 1 0 0 1 1 0 0 1␤»
20:13 espadrine moritz: that's what I want!
20:13 moritz r: say (0, 1, {$^b, $^a} ... *).list[^10]
20:13 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«0 1 1 0 0 1 1 0 0 1 1 0 0 1 1 0 0 1␤»
20:13 moritz r: say (0, 1, {$^b, $^a} ... *).flat[^10]
20:13 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«0 1 1 0 0 1 1 0 0 1␤»
20:14 moritz espadrine: I'd write that as ( (0, 1) xx * ).flat
20:14 moritz espadrine: a bit more readable, IMHO
20:14 moritz especially more readable than +!*
20:14 colomon r: say ( (0, 1) xx * ).flat[^10]
20:14 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1␤»
20:15 espadrine how is {+!*} interpreted then? (purely for understanding)
20:15 moritz espadrine: a closure that returns a closure when invoked
20:15 espadrine moritz: oh, I see. thanks!
20:15 moritz r: my $cc = { +|* }; my $c = $cc(); say $c(1); say $c(09;
20:15 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤Unable to parse expression in argument list; couldn't find final ')'â�¤at /tmp/Qq1hExmovY:1â�¤------> [32m* }; my $c = $cc(); say $c(1); say $c(09[33mâ��[31m;[0mâ�¤    expecting any of:â�¤        postfixâ�¤Other potential difficulties:â�¤    Le…
20:15 moritz r: my $cc = { +!* }; my $c = $cc(); say $c(1); say $c(09;
20:15 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤Unable to parse expression in argument list; couldn't find final ')'â�¤at /tmp/ywY1mMhh4j:1â�¤------> [32m* }; my $c = $cc(); say $c(1); say $c(09[33mâ��[31m;[0mâ�¤    expecting any of:â�¤        postfixâ�¤Other potential difficulties:â�¤    Le…
20:16 moritz r: my $cc = { +!* }; my $c = $cc(); say $c(1); say $c(0);
20:16 camelia rakudo cd5ca7: OUTPUT«0␤1␤»
20:16 * moritz isn't very concentrated anymore
20:16 espadrine :)
20:17 moritz 8 hours work + 3 hours doing taxes and still not finished :(
20:18 jnthn awww :(
20:19 moritz well, have to do the rest tomorrow-ish
20:19 moritz (today is deadline, but they usually take about two weeks to send a demand note, and the first one is free :-)
20:20 Teratogen moritz do what I do, always do a 1040EZ
20:20 Teratogen and claim 1 deduction
20:20 Teratogen or 0 deductions
20:21 Teratogen you will always get money back
20:21 TimToady Teratogen: he's not a USian
20:21 Teratogen oh!
20:21 Teratogen well then!
20:21 TimToady and he has a family
20:22 [Coke] bah. I have to deal with taxes for work all the time, and now on perl6? ENOFUN. ;)
20:23 moritz [Coke]: sorry for brining it up
20:23 Teratogen yeah I guess a bachelor living in an apartment who owns no stocks or land or anything has a simpler tax picture!
20:23 * masak hugs [Coke]
20:25 * [Coke] is merely trolling and is in no way sad.
20:25 * [Coke] hopes your taxes are easier to file than my company's. :)
20:26 moritz [Coke]: I'm quite sure they are
20:26 pmichaud I spent much of yesterday and today filling out insurance applications.  Definitely easier than taxes, but still not fun.
20:27 moritz it's just annoying and fiddly work, not really complicated
20:28 supernovus joined #perl6
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20:29 kbenson TimToady: Darn families.  Always stealing time and attention, and only offering unconditional love in return...
20:31 supernovus In the release notes it says postcircumfix:<[ ]> and postcirumfix:<{ }> are becoming subs instead of methods. How does that work?
20:32 sorear why does TimToady have a hat today?
20:33 moritz supernovus: currently the methods dispatch to methods .at_pos and at_key
20:33 moritz supernovus: a sub can do that too
20:33 sorear supernovus: I'm told it works in approximately the way it's always worked in niecza
20:33 diakopter sorear: are you on yapc@pm.org or were you one of the multitudes who unsubscribed
20:33 moritz (first they do slicing and such, and then redispatch to at_pos)
20:33 s1n joined #perl6
20:34 sorear diakopter: i'm on it.  please do not ask for my opinion on moarvm, I will decide that tomorrow evening
20:35 diakopter sorear: I wasn't going to :P
20:35 sftp joined #perl6
20:36 supernovus How does the sub know what object instance called it?  Also, afaik 'self' is not available in a sub... I'm a bit confused. :/
20:37 jnthn supernovus: It's the first argument.
20:37 cognominal joined #perl6
20:37 PerlJam supernovus: it would be the first arg
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20:38 sorear supernovus: how does a postfix:<foo> sub get an argument?
20:39 masak rn: sub foo($object) { say "OH HAI, $object" }; "supernovus".&foo()
20:39 camelia rakudo cd5ca7, niecza v24-55-g7942a09: OUTPUT«OH HAI, supernovus␤»
20:39 supernovus Ah, so instead of method postcircumfix:<[ ]> ($offset) { ... } , I'd use sub postcircumfix:<[ ]> ($object, $offset) { ... } ?
20:40 moritz multi sub
20:40 TimToady well, subscripts can be more complicated than that, but essentially yes
20:40 moritz but yes, that's the general idea
20:40 supernovus the biggest difference I guess being that it can no longer access private variables...
20:41 TimToady it's likely to be a primitive that can access anything it jolly well pleases
20:41 jnthn supernovus: at_pos and at_key are typically better things to override
20:41 jnthn (They stay as methods.)
20:41 TimToady subscripting is an important optimization target
20:41 jnthn Yeah.
20:42 TimToady and having it as methods tends to work against that
20:42 supernovus Hmm, well, XML's tests still all pass, so I'm guessing this change hasn't happened quite yet?
20:42 jnthn I mean, if postcircumfix:<[ ]> is a sub, the inliner can inline it.
20:42 jnthn supernovus: No, it's upcoming.
20:43 jnthn supernovus: I'll see if there can be a decent migration path.
20:43 supernovus I'll try changing XML to use at_pos and at_key and see what happens.
20:43 TimToady and for known types, especially compact arrays, it can do much more
20:43 jnthn Right.
20:43 jnthn It was when I was thinking about compact arrays that I hit upon wanting this change.
20:44 diakopter sorear: as long as you don't critique my code in moarvm, I won't run away crying. we all know a C novice's code is going to not be superb. ;)
20:46 supernovus Yay, changing to at_pos and at_key worked great. Simpler to remember method names too :-)
20:48 SmokeMachine joined #perl6
20:50 supernovus Is there an underlying method for postcircumfix:<( )> ?
20:52 donaldh joined #perl6
20:53 moritz no
20:53 supernovus Is it changing to a sub too? I have at least one library that uses it.
20:54 moritz I don't think so, at least not for now
20:54 tadzik ehh, my nqp now reliably segfaults
20:54 moritz invocation is tricky
20:55 tadzik https://gist.github.com/tadzik/5687913
20:56 jnthn tadzik: try nuking any ModuleLoader.pbc in your Parrot install
20:56 tadzik I think I have my parrot install nuked :) will re-check
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23:17 dalek rakudo-star-daily: c9545f7 | coke++ | log/ (5 files):
23:17 dalek rakudo-star-daily: today (automated commit)
23:17 dalek rakudo-star-daily: review: https://github.com/coke/rakudo​-star-daily/commit/c9545f7dd4
23:17 leont joined #perl6
23:18 [Coke] who controls dalek?
23:18 Teratogen DOCTOR WHO
23:23 lue .oO(davros.feather.nl)
23:23 lue .oO(*davros.feather.perl6.nl)
23:32 dukeleto joined #perl6
23:49 masak 'night, #perl6
23:51 jnthn 'night, #perl6

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