Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2013-08-16

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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Time Nick Message
00:02 lizmat_ joined #perl6
00:02 BenGoldberg While I realize that .infinite is part of the spec, it seems to me that a more perl6-ish way to identify (in)finiteness would be to have to separate roles, one called List::Finite (or perhaps finte-list) and the other called List::Infinite (or infintite-list)... to mark a gather/take as finite or infinite, one would then use 'gather ... but infinite-list'.  This would also allow multi method
00:02 BenGoldberg dispatch based on whether or not a list is finite.
00:03 BenGoldberg r: say (^Inf)[^10].infinite
00:03 camelia rakudo 5f4601: OUTPUT«Nil␤»
00:03 BenGoldberg r: say (^Inf).infinite
00:03 camelia rakudo 5f4601: OUTPUT«True␤»
00:04 BenGoldberg r: say (^10).infinite
00:04 camelia rakudo 5f4601: OUTPUT«False␤»
00:04 BenGoldberg n: say (^Inf)[^10].infinite
00:04 camelia niecza v24-88-g1f87209: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Unable to resolve method infinite in type Parcel␤  at /tmp/4g37q1oGA3 line 1 (mainline @ 3) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 4579 (ANON @ 3) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 4580 (module-CORE @ 576) ␤  at …
00:05 BenGoldberg Also... if an infinite list is sliced by a finite list, the result should be finite, not Nil/unknown
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02:12 slavik what does '-->' mean? (example: int --> int, CArray[int] --> int), is that the lazy iterator?
02:14 benabik slavik: sub (--> int) is a sub that returns an int.
02:14 slavik ahh
02:14 benabik Parameters before, return type after.
02:14 slavik oh, I see
02:14 slavik ok
02:14 slavik like haskel :D
02:14 slavik ty
02:25 JimmyZ or sub() returns int { }
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03:08 * colomon is having problems building jakudo at the moment.  :\
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04:58 Mouq S05 (Match Objects): “In boolean context it evaluates as true or false (i.e. did the match succeed?):
04:58 Mouq if /pattern/ {...}
04:58 Mouq # or:
04:59 Mouq /pattern/; if $/ {...}”
04:59 Mouq Shouldn't that be m/pattern/ ? I'm only reading S05 now, so I'm not sure
05:00 Mouq r: $_ =  'abcd'; if /qwerty/ { say "Hi there" }
05:00 camelia rakudo 144a3f:  ( no output )
05:01 Mouq r: $_ =  'abcd'; if m/qwerty/ { say "Hi there" }
05:01 camelia rakudo 144a3f:  ( no output )
05:01 Mouq Hm
05:01 Mouq n: $_ =  'abcd'; if /qwerty/ { say "Hi there" }
05:01 camelia niecza v24-88-g1f87209:  ( no output )
05:02 Mouq Oh! “Specifically, a /.../ matches immediately in a value context” :p
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05:49 moritz good morning
05:49 moritz http://tirania.org/blog/archive/2013/Aug-15.html # this reminded me about jnthn++'s talk about threads and async in Perl 6
05:50 moritz (at yapc::eu)
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05:53 lizmat_ good *, #perl6!
05:55 lizmat_ packing up in Kiev
05:55 moritz \o lizmat_
05:56 moritz .oO( don't forget to pack your underscore )
05:56 lizmat my underscore just got worn out :-)
05:57 moritz yesterday the flight from Kiev to Vienna got delayed by an hour
05:57 moritz luckily we had enough time to catch the connection
05:58 * lizmat is lucky to have a direct flight
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06:42 dalek rakudo/nom: c20be1f | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | src/core/ (2 files):
06:42 dalek rakudo/nom: Reliably handle mixins with is_default and is_dynamic
06:42 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/c20be1f21b
07:21 timotimo o/
07:30 FROGGS moin timotimo
07:33 daxim joined #perl6
07:36 timotimo for some reason, riding trains across the country always makes me super excited
07:37 timotimo in a mixed-good-and-bad way
07:51 tadzik hello #perl6
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07:56 masak morning, #perl6
08:00 moritz morning, masak | tadzik | *
08:00 moritz erm, that should have been & :-)
08:00 masak eww, a junction of a whatever... :P
08:01 timotimo if you junction in a *, it should take every object that it can find in the running program and cram it in there
08:03 masak like a black hole.
08:03 masak tadzik: want to meet up for more tourism?
08:03 timotimo i really need to get playing with the async stuff
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08:05 dalek rakudo/nom: 10b9ac4 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | src/core/ (2 files):
08:05 dalek rakudo/nom: Hmmm... seems I broke it, so reverting
08:05 dalek rakudo/nom:
08:05 dalek rakudo/nom: This reverts commit c20be1f21b69c3eb61c1795fbe04ecab6cd2a0fc.
08:05 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/10b9ac4c88
08:06 tadzik masak: sure thing :)
08:06 tadzik I'm ready (almost) when you are
08:06 masak tadzik: I suggest metro to avoid sunburn.
08:06 tadzik I have to checkout within an hour or so
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08:06 masak tadzik: we're heading down to lobby now, I think. we can wait for you.
08:07 dalek Perlito: 267ef7e | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | / (5 files):
08:07 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - js - fix string conversion, string increment and decrement
08:07 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/​Perlito/commit/267ef7efbc
08:07 tadzik masak: ok, I will slowly progress in your direction
08:07 lizmat decommuting&
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08:07 masak tadzik: sounds good.
08:09 woolfy left #perl6
08:11 * timotimo dumps lots of todos for rakudo into questhub
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08:31 timotimo i'm getting lots of errors like this:   symbol:   class LexoticInstance
08:31 timotimo location: package org.perl6.nqp.sixmodel.reprs
08:31 timotimo src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/per​l6/rakudo/RakOps.java:59: error: cannot find symbol
08:31 timotimo what do i have to do to fix this? or does somebody have a known good jakudo commit?
08:38 timotimo i wanted to play with the threading stuff :(
08:39 timotimo oh, that looks like not my rakudo, but my nqp version is wrong
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08:47 timotimo still can't get it to work :(
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08:58 moritz timotimo: are you trying with nqp/master?
08:59 timotimo yes
09:00 * moritz tries too
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09:25 moritz huh, I get
09:25 moritz ./perl6 --target=jar --output=blib/Test.jar lib/Test.pm
09:25 moritz ===SORRY!===
09:25 moritz org.perl6.nqp.runtime.UnwindException
09:39 mathw o/
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09:46 timotimo huh
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10:30 colomon moritz: That's what I got when I tried to build jakudo last night.
10:31 timotimo in my new tablebgrammar it is allowed to have more than one space in your columns if they are below an explicit header
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11:14 not_gerd r: my %h = <a 1 b 1 c 2>; %().push(%h.invert).perl.say
11:14 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«("1" => ["a", "b"], "2" => "c").hash␤»
11:14 not_gerd is there a less obscure way to do that?
11:16 * moritz isn't aware of one
11:19 not_gerd perhaps classify could take an optional argument that transforms the value is stores?
11:19 not_gerd %h.classify(*.value, :map(*.key))
11:21 moritz is Hash.classify still specced?
11:22 moritz r: say Hash.^can('classify')
11:22 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«classify␤»
11:22 moritz hm
11:22 moritz not_gerd: seems like it should be easy to map yourself before classifying
11:22 moritz or after, depending on what you want
11:23 moritz remember that map allows funny stuff with closures that expect multiple arguments, so that's non-trivial to replicate inside another function
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11:30 not_gerd r: my %h = <a 1 b 1 c 2>; %h.classify(*.value).pairs.map({ ; .key => .value>>.key }).hash.perl.say
11:30 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«("1" => $("a", "b"), "2" => $("c",)).hash␤»
11:30 not_gerd I wouldn't call that easy exactly
11:30 not_gerd ot do I miss something obvious?
11:31 not_gerd ^or
11:31 not_gerd r: my %h = <a 1 b 1 c 2>; %h.classify(*.value).pairs.map({ ; .key => .value.map(*.key).item }).hash.perl.say
11:31 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«("1" => ().list.item, "2" => ().list.item).hash␤»
11:31 not_gerd ^bug?
11:32 moritz I don't know Hash.classify enough to know
11:33 not_gerd moritz: I suspect it's the map within a map that causes the problem
11:33 not_gerd see that it works when replacing .map(*.key) with >>.key
11:38 not_gerd r: my @a = [<1 2 3>], [<4 5 6>]; @a.map({ .map(* + 1).item }).perl.say
11:38 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«((2, 3, 4).list.item, (5, 6, 7).list.item).list␤»
11:38 not_gerd ^ works, so it might indeed be classify-related
11:41 moritz r: my %h = <a 1 b 1 c 2>; %h.classify(*.value).perl.say
11:41 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«("1" => ["a" => "1", "b" => "1"], "2" => ["c" => "2"]).hash␤»
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11:42 slavius perl6:   say "Hello slavi"
11:42 camelia rakudo 10b9ac, niecza v24-88-g1f87209: OUTPUT«Hello slavi␤»
11:42 bearman joined #perl6
11:43 slavius perl6:   say "Nice :-)"
11:43 camelia rakudo 10b9ac, niecza v24-88-g1f87209: OUTPUT«Nice :-)␤»
11:44 slavius left #perl6
12:00 not_gerd rn: printf '%1$i', 1, 2, 3
12:00 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«'$' is not valid in sprintf format sequence '%1$'␤  in sub sprintf at src/gen/CORE.setting:3154␤  in sub printf at src/gen/CORE.setting:3159␤  in block  at /tmp/4N73w6DT_m:1␤␤»
12:00 camelia ..niecza v24-88-g1f87209: OUTPUT«1»
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12:04 FROGGS not_gerd: I'm going to work on that sprintf issue
12:06 not_gerd ++FROGGS
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12:13 itz is there anyway of running the jvm port persitantly as a server to avoid startup hit?
12:14 moritz itz: the test suite uses a small hack to do that
12:15 itz ah cool I'll have a look
12:20 FROGGS I think it is called evalserver
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12:31 grondilu rn: for <a b c> { .print; FIRST print '!' }
12:31 camelia niecza v24-88-g1f87209: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m��Action method statement_prefix:FIRST not yet implemented at /tmp/0AcpNBOyOx line 1:�------> [32mfor <a b c> { .print; FIRST print '!' [33m�[31m}[0m��Unhandled exception: Unable to resolve method statement_level in type A…
12:31 camelia ..rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«!abc»
12:32 * grondilu was expecting a!bc
12:33 grondilu rn: for <3 1 4 1 5> { .print; FIRST print '!' }
12:33 camelia niecza v24-88-g1f87209: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m��Action method statement_prefix:FIRST not yet implemented at /tmp/HKf5yAyAll line 1:�------> [32mr <3 1 4 1 5> { .print; FIRST print '!' [33m�[31m}[0m��Unhandled exception: Unable to resolve method statement_level in type…
12:33 camelia ..rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«!31415»
12:33 grondilu r: for <3 1 4 1 5> { .print; FIRST print '.' }   # http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Pi#Perl_6
12:33 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«.31415»
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12:37 FROGGS grondilu: did you mean 'once' ?
12:37 FROGGS rn: for <a b c> { .print; once { print '!' } }
12:37 camelia niecza v24-88-g1f87209: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤â�¤Undeclared routine:â�¤     'once' used at line 1â�¤â�¤Unhandled exception: Check failedâ�¤â�¤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/boot/lib/CORE.setting line 1502 (die @ 5) â�¤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/src/STD.pm6 line 1147 (P6.comp_unit @ 36) â�¤  at /hom…
12:37 camelia ..rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«a!bc»
12:38 grondilu FROGGS: I did not know this one.  (I guess I need to read S04 again)
12:38 grondilu ty
12:39 FROGGS you're welcome
12:39 grondilu r: for <3 1 4 1 5> { .print; once print '.' }
12:39 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«3.1415»
12:39 * grondilu was just checking if he had to use {}
12:40 FROGGS yeah
12:49 colomon has anyone gotten jakudo to build today, or is it just me and moritz having issues?
12:52 FROGGS I can try...
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13:01 FROGGS I get the following when making rakudo: src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/rakudo/Binder.java:5: error: package org.perl6.nqp.runtime does not exist
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13:29 FROGGS nqp-jvm: say("1.01".WHAT)
13:29 camelia nqp-jvm: OUTPUT«␤»
13:29 masak oh hai from l'airport!
13:30 FROGGS hi masak
13:30 TimToady oh hai from l'ome
13:30 FROGGS o/
13:30 TimToady or would that be oh 'ai? :)
13:31 * TimToady was never particularly noted for consistency though...
13:31 masak moritz: I think Hash.classify got un-spec'd, but it may not have got un-impl'd.
13:32 FROGGS o' 'ai froḿ l'ome
13:34 TimToady when I try to make rakudo/jvm, I get: make: *** No rule to make target `src/Perl6/ConstantFolder.nqp', needed by `blib/Perl6/ConstantFolder.jar'.  Stop.
13:34 huf accent on an 'm'?! that's going too far!
13:35 FROGGS :o)  I just wanted to "say" it nasal
13:36 FROGGS is "nasal" the right word?
13:36 TimToady well, English speakers should probably not be making fun of other people's orthographic systems, glass houses and all that...
13:36 huf m is already pretty nasal :)
13:36 TimToady yes, "nasal" is a perfectly good linguistics word :)
13:36 FROGGS k
13:37 huf TimToady: i found interspel the other week. it's pretty clever and would let english speakers throw those glass houses around
13:37 TimToady that 'ouses to you :P
13:37 huf you mean "huss", surely
13:37 [Coke] TimToady: when you say rakudo/jvm do you mean the jvm branch?
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13:38 TimToady yes
13:38 [Coke] (should be using nom)
13:38 [Coke] it's all nom these days.
13:38 TimToady my nom has defaulted to jvm for a few weeks now
13:38 TimToady but maybe that came unstuck somehow
13:39 TimToady attempting to reconf nqp to see if it helps
13:44 masak was just gonna suggest that.
13:44 FROGGS my nqp/head+rakudo/nom is broken too
13:45 FROGGS err, nqp/master... both HEAD
13:45 FROGGS I might clean up nqp just to maske sure
13:45 TimToady nqp rebuilt fine, now for rakudo
13:49 FROGGS no, mine still dies with: src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/rakudo/Binder.java:5: error: package org.perl6.nqp.runtime does not exist
13:51 TimToady now compiling lib/Test.pm I get: org.perl6.nqp.runtime.UnwindException
13:51 TimToady did you re-install the nqp?
13:51 FROGGS I did
13:51 TimToady and reconfig rakudo with that nqp?
13:52 FROGGS hmmm, no, I did that before reinstalling...
13:52 TimToady did yours die before or after compiling the setting?  mine was after
13:52 FROGGS k, did git clean -dxf, configured, made, but it explodes the same
13:53 FROGGS mine earlier
13:53 FROGGS perl -MExtUtils::Command -e mkpath bin
13:53 FROGGS javac -source 1.7 -cp /nqp-runtime.jar:/asm-4.1.jar:/​asm-tree-4.1.jar:/jline-1.0.jar -g -d bin src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/rakudo/*.java
13:53 FROGGS src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/rakudo/Binder.java:5: error: package org.perl6.nqp.runtime does not exist
13:53 FROGGS pretty early actually
13:53 TimToady yeah, mine got further for some reason
13:53 TimToady 32 or 64-bit?
13:53 TimToady mine's 64
13:54 FROGGS mine too (ubuntu)
13:54 TimToady did pull right before too, so we should have the same codebase
13:54 FROGGS Today
13:54 FROGGS 13:51 UTC We are currently investigating problems with GitHub.com. We'll provide an update once we have more information.
13:54 FROGGS -.-
13:54 * TimToady never did the clean though
13:55 TimToady so maybe something got cleaned out too much
13:55 FROGGS yeah, and I wanted to have a look at the latest commits, because I think grondilu said he has problems for two days now
13:56 * TimToady tries again with 'make clean'
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13:56 tadzik wow, Borispol has a working free wifi
13:57 TimToady FROGGS: are you up-to-date on your java version?
13:58 TimToady javac 1.7.0_25
13:58 FROGGS java version "1.7.0_25"
13:58 FROGGS OpenJDK Runtime Environment (IcedTea 2.3.10) (7u25-2.3.10-1ubuntu0.13.04.2)
13:58 FROGGS OpenJDK 64-Bit Server VM (build 23.7-b01, mixed mode)
13:58 FROGGS yeah
13:59 TimToady 4gig memory here, if it makes a difference
14:00 masak there's some trouble building rakudo-jvm in the backlog. not exactly the same as yours, but build problems.
14:00 masak the solution there was rebuilding the nqp dependency, I think.
14:00 TimToady strange, the parse went from 83 to 98 seconds
14:01 TimToady masak: we both rebuilt our nqp
14:01 FROGGS I've got 8gig
14:01 TimToady same failure in Test.pm for me
14:01 masak ok, then I think we're in bisect land.
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14:04 FROGGS masak: how do I get a gommit id from a week ago?
14:04 FROGGS (without a working github website)
14:05 masak FROGGS: git show master@{one week ago}
14:05 FROGGS that sounds a bit like a joke, problem is, I trust you
14:06 FROGGS fatal: ambiguous argument 'master@{one': unknown revision or path not in the working tree.
14:06 masak FROGGS: is that Rakudo? then it's nom, not master
14:06 FROGGS nqp
14:07 FROGGS I'm on master fwiw
14:07 masak ah, I needed to do `git show 'master@{one week ago}'`
14:07 FROGGS awesome # masak++
14:10 tadzik bah, I can't confinve NQP::Configure to like my --gen-nqp on JVM
14:10 tadzik convince, even
14:11 rindolf joined #perl6
14:11 TimToady did you mean --gen-parrot?
14:11 TimToady oh, nm
14:11 TimToady if you mean on nom, I use --with-nqp
14:12 FROGGS yeah, --with-nqp ~/dev/nqp-jvm/install/nqp  # or so
14:12 * TimToady goes to get more coffee, at this point more a necessity than a luxury...
14:12 FROGGS yeah, --with-nqp=~/dev/nqp-jvm/install/nqp  # <---
14:12 tadzik yeah, I wanted it to DTRT for --gen-nqp
14:12 tadzik but it seems to hang on git-fetch somehow
14:12 tadzik I eventually gave up ;)
14:12 tadzik I blame airport wifi
14:12 FROGGS tadzik: github has problems
14:12 tadzik ah
14:13 tadzik maybe I shouldn't have git checkout -f'd my changes
14:15 FROGGS AHHHHHHHHHH
14:16 FROGGS it fails so early when I do: perl ConfigureJVM.pl --with-nqp=~/..., I really have to supply an absolute path
14:18 FROGGS stage parse 56s, I love it
14:18 FROGGS (that is both nqp and rakudo from a week ago)
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14:32 alexghacker [Coke]: yesterday you said that NFG / graphemes are not currently the default (which is viewed as a bug, or at least a missing feature), but it occurs to me that maybe there is a way to get NFG semantics if I ask perl6 nicely
14:38 [Coke] if by that you mean "write your own code", sure.
14:38 [Coke] but SFAIK, there's nothing baked into the language at this point, in any impl.
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14:41 TimToady FROGGS: so, did your build get past Test.pm?
14:42 FROGGS TimToady: yes, the versions from a week ago made and installed fine
14:42 nyuszika7h joined #perl6
14:42 FROGGS but bisecting is hard because ops got added
14:43 TimToady ah, you were doing from a week ago
14:44 FROGGS now I am on nqp HEAD, and try to bisect rakudo, starting at HEAD
14:44 * TimToady doesn't know whether to hope it fails :)
14:45 FROGGS well, I hope rakudo/HEAD fails here :o)
14:45 TimToady FROGGS++ for bisecting this
14:46 FROGGS np
14:46 TimToady or at least monosecting it so far :)
14:46 FROGGS hehe
14:46 benabik joined #perl6
14:46 FROGGS monosecting sounds more like niecza
14:46 * TimToady looked through the git logs, but didn't see anything obvious
14:48 FROGGS ./perl6 --target=jar --output=blib/Test.jar lib/Test.pm
14:48 FROGGS ===SORRY!===
14:48 FROGGS org.perl6.nqp.runtime.UnwindException
14:48 FROGGS so far so good
14:50 TimToady that looks familiar :)
14:57 * TimToady is looking at the palindrom detector containing .flip eq $_ and thinking, wouldn't it be nice if we could write that .flip eq ._ or some such
14:58 TimToady just to keep the parallelism
14:58 TimToady *literary parallelism
14:59 FROGGS what about .flip eq .Str ?
14:59 geekosaur ._ looks kinda off conceptually, though. seems like * would be a better fit somehow?
14:59 geekosaur hm, .id
14:59 TimToady well, it's the identi...yeah
14:59 geekosaur or maybe that's what ._ is
15:00 TimToady and ._ would basically just a different name for $_ :)
15:00 TimToady as a term
15:01 TimToady I dunno if it's really an improvement, but we should probably have an identity method in any case
15:01 rjbs Another day answering encoding questions on p5p, another day longing for Buf.
15:01 TimToady nodnod
15:03 TimToady or maybe even nodnodnod
15:04 rjbs The good part is that I felt really really good about my answer and providing it has improved my day already.
15:04 TimToady rjbs++
15:04 rjbs I may reward myself by turning my ZSCII p6 library into a proper module and putting it in the ecosystem.
15:04 rjbs You know, for all those p6 Z-Machine emulators we're expecting.
15:05 TimToady now where have I heard this before...
15:06 rjbs Yow, looks like I haven't backported 90% of ZMachine::ZSCII to my write-z5.p6 code.  So there are two parts to do.
15:06 FROGGS what is a Z-Machine?
15:06 rjbs perl6++ # hyphen-minus in identifiers!
15:06 rjbs FROGGS: It's the VM from the mid-80's on which Zork and friends ran.
15:07 TimToady geekosaur: but we can't afford to use up the .id method, since that's too useful in userland
15:07 rjbs FROGGS: ZSCII is its bizarre charset and encoding.
15:07 rjbs ("pronounced to rhyme with xyzzy")
15:07 FROGGS rjbs: I've heard about a Z80 chip... is it that one?
15:07 rjbs No, totally unrelated.
15:07 FROGGS ahh, okay
15:07 rjbs The Z-Machine is more like the JVM. :-)
15:07 FROGGS ahh, I see
15:07 rjbs It's actually a fun little machine, read the spec someday if you're bored.
15:08 FROGGS ahh, now I read the VM bit.... :o)
15:08 FROGGS rjbs: I have two kids, sooo........ :P
15:08 TimToady you are in a maze of twisty little adventure games, all the same...
15:08 rjbs FROGGS: So you'll need to show them Zork anyway... :)
15:08 FROGGS *g*
15:08 FROGGS someday, yes
15:08 TimToady well, first adventure, since that predated everything else :)
15:08 rjbs TimToady: Ovid has just written a p5 'terp for the Scott Adams games, too...
15:09 TimToady .oO(That adventure game, it's so derivative. :)
15:09 ajr joined #perl6
15:09 rjbs At OSCON, I tried to sit at any of the "topic tables" that weren't what I do.
15:09 TimToady I have a radio in my brain!
15:10 rjbs So I sat down with the "UX Designers" table and found out the guy next to me was trying to learn programming and had just written a text adventure in Python (or was it Ruby?).
15:10 rjbs I totally geeked out and showed him the state of the art for writing them.  Fun!
15:10 dalek Perlito: b3566a1 | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | / (3 files):
15:10 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - grammar - simplify the grammar compiler
15:10 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/​Perlito/commit/b3566a10ab
15:11 rjbs TimToady: Um... I hope that is an allusion that was lost on me!
15:11 TimToady well, then there was DDL "Dungeon Definition Language", which was kind of a Lisp variant, as I recall
15:11 TimToady "You're in the COSMIC ALL!  How did you get here?!?"
15:11 TimToady (sez the room contain all the other rooms)
15:11 TimToady *taining
15:13 FROGGS when rakudo gets a bit faster this year I'm going to port my games to Perl 6 too (because I really don't wanna write Perl 5 anymore for some reason)
15:13 rjbs Right, I know a little about DDL.
15:13 rjbs It was an MDL variant, of course.
15:14 rjbs Later it became ZIL, the Zork Implementation Language, which is mostly lost to time, but we have some fragments.
15:14 TimToady the allusion was to Bureaucracy, btw
15:14 rjbs Ah!
15:14 rjbs I have not played that one yet.
15:14 TimToady it was an Amiga game
15:14 rjbs About a year ago I promised myself I would play through all of them in order.
15:14 rjbs Amiga was an Infocom game, so it plays on any Z-Machine!
15:14 rjbs Including the one that will be written for p6. :)
15:14 rjbs Er, s/Amiga/Bureaucracy
15:15 TimToady it was a Douglas Adams game
15:15 rjbs Yeah.  I've heard it stank. :(
15:16 TimToady I never solved it, so maybe it did. :)
15:16 rjbs http://rjbs.manxome.org/rubric/~rjbs/int-fiction <-- haven't made progress on "The Great Infocom Replay" since February!
15:16 rjbs I'll surely make some on the flights to/from YAPC::Asia, anyway.
15:29 FROGGS TimToady: this one is the bad commit: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/​144a3f87f58e576159c1dea7b6a8854f2bdc1e86
15:29 FROGGS lizmat reverted a commit, but it looks like she reverted the wrong one
15:29 FROGGS so, this one is the last that is okay: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/​5f460187c89ec42b98925dccebe1962b5efdbc60
15:31 FROGGS but btw, my changes to nqp::sprintf seems to work (specifying parameter index using 1$, 3$, ...)
15:41 slavik joined #perl6
15:48 * TimToady wonders if the right way to make p5 interoperate with NFG is to give p5 an NFG implementation in parallel with its utf8 implementation...
15:49 TimToady then p6 could call into p5 without translating to utf8 and back
15:51 slavik nfg?
15:51 TimToady one step beyond NFC, where we synthesize codepoints for missing precomposed chars
16:05 pmurias joined #perl6
16:05 pmurias TimToady: re give p5 and NFG, can it be done without a slowdown?
16:06 pmurias s/slowdown/paying the price of a check on every string operation/?
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16:16 diakopter r: [say $]
16:16 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m Error while compiling /tmp/cNQK4oKRMGâ�¤Non-declarative sigil is missing its nameâ�¤at /tmp/cNQK4oKRMG:1â�¤------> [32m[say [33mâ��[31m$][0mâ�¤    expecting any of:â�¤        argument listâ�¤        prefix or termâ�¤        prefix or meta-prefixâ�¤â€¦
16:16 diakopter r: [say $$]
16:16 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m Error while compiling /tmp/VtkPbhWkNyâ�¤Non-declarative sigil is missing its nameâ�¤at /tmp/VtkPbhWkNy:1â�¤------> [32m[say $[33mâ��[31m$][0mâ�¤    expecting any of:â�¤        argument listâ�¤        prefix or termâ�¤        prefix or meta-prefix…
16:17 diakopter r: [say my $]
16:17 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«(Any)␤»
16:17 diakopter std: [say my $]
16:17 camelia std c2215f0: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m�Unsupported use of $] variable; in Perl 6 please use $*PERL_VERSION at /tmp/6oNqrbC5vP line 1:�------> [32m[say my $][33m�[31m<EOL>[0m�Parse failed�FAILED 00:00 44m�»
16:17 diakopter mwahaha
16:18 colomon joined #perl6
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16:21 gfldex is there video evidence for jnthn's concurrency YAPC talk?
16:23 dmol joined #perl6
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16:27 grondilu rn: say max :by(*.elems), ().list
16:27 camelia rakudo 10b9ac, niecza v24-88-g1f87209: OUTPUT«-Inf␤»
16:28 * grondilu does not understand where that -Inf comes from :/
16:28 diakopter probably that's the default the algorithm starts with
16:29 grondilu still, it's supposed to sort by length (so ok the default is -Inf), but the result should be a member of the list, not a length.
16:30 grondilu so I would have expected (), Nil or something.
16:31 grondilu not a number anyway, even infintely small.
16:32 grondilu in case you're wondering, I come up with this issue while trying to write code for http://rosettacode.org/wiki/L​ongest_increasing_subsequence
16:36 colomon -Inf isn't infinitely small, it's infinitely big and negative.
16:36 itz ==> Building Rakudo::Debugger
16:36 itz error:imcc:loadlib directive could not find library `perl6_group' in file 'perl6-debug.pir' line 1
16:37 colomon rn: say ().list.max(:by(*.elems))
16:37 camelia niecza v24-88-g1f87209: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Excess arguments to List.max, unused named by␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 0 (List.max @ 1) ␤  at /tmp/j9ZUzQRNqn line 1 (mainline @ 4) ␤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 4579 (ANON @ 3) ␤  at /home/p6eva…
16:37 camelia ..rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«-Inf␤»
16:37 colomon rn: say ().list.max()
16:37 camelia rakudo 10b9ac, niecza v24-88-g1f87209: OUTPUT«-Inf␤»
16:40 colomon Yeah, that's just the default "nothing to see here" value
16:41 colomon rn: say (().list).max()
16:41 camelia rakudo 10b9ac, niecza v24-88-g1f87209: OUTPUT«-Inf␤»
16:41 colomon rn: say [().list].max()
16:41 camelia rakudo 10b9ac, niecza v24-88-g1f87209: OUTPUT«-Inf␤»
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16:48 TimToady it's just the maximum of an an empty list in each case
16:50 TimToady r: say [min]()
16:50 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«Inf␤»
16:50 TimToady r: say [max]()
16:50 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«-Inf␤»
16:50 TimToady that one
16:51 TimToady you've just discovered there are many ways to write something that is a list of 0 elements :)
16:58 EvanTeitelman joined #perl6
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16:58 dmol r: say [+]()
16:58 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«0␤»
16:59 dmol r: say: [=]()
16:59 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m Error while compiling /tmp/G9wWm1kYyhâ�¤Two terms in a rowâ�¤at /tmp/G9wWm1kYyh:1â�¤------> [32msay[33mâ��[31m: [=]()[0mâ�¤    expecting any of:â�¤        argument listâ�¤        postfixâ�¤        infix stopperâ�¤        infix or meta-infixâ�¤       …
16:59 TimToady std: [=]()
16:59 camelia std c2215f0: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m�Cannot reduce with = because list assignment operators are too fiddly at /tmp/bhaci_efat line 1:�------> [32m[=][33m�[31m()[0m�Check failed�FAILED 00:00 42m�»
16:59 TimToady that's less LTA
16:59 TimToady r: say [||]()
16:59 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«False␤»
16:59 TimToady r: say [||]
16:59 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«False␤»
17:00 TimToady okay, don't need the () anymore, good
17:04 tadzik WAW! \o/
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17:06 geekosaur ן
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17:46 PerlJam when building rakudo-jvm, what's the solution to an "Could not reserve enough space for object heap"  error?
17:46 [Coke] looks like the rakudo.jvm build failure is tanking the spec today.
17:52 [Coke] arglebargle. my local copy of the daily run repo has a screwed up ysterday, looks like I never dealt with it.
17:53 diakopter oopsie
17:53 [Coke] and now removing it is a PITA because I have a valid today after it.
17:54 vk_ joined #perl6
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17:57 dalek perl6-roast-data: c4d33cd | coke++ | / (5 files):
17:57 dalek perl6-roast-data: today (automated commit)
17:57 dalek perl6-roast-data: review: https://github.com/coke/perl6​-roast-data/commit/c4d33cde2b
17:57 [Coke] saved the summary for yesterday, pretty sure we didn't have the .out files today.
17:57 [Coke] jnthn: rakudo.jvm now at 0% - update slides immediately!
17:58 diakopter heh
17:59 SamuraiJack joined #perl6
17:59 [Coke] diakopter: now is your chance for moar's come-from-behind victory
17:59 diakopter hah.
18:09 [Coke] seen lizmat
18:09 [Coke] .seen lizmat
18:09 yoleaux I saw lizmat 08:07Z in #perl6: <lizmat> decommuting&
18:09 preflex yoleaux: you have 2 new messages. '/msg preflex messages' to read them.
18:09 [Coke] .to preflex DIE DIE DIE
18:09 yoleaux [Coke]: I'll pass your message to preflex.
18:11 geekosaur is there actually consensus that preflex should not be here? if so I can talk to mauke about it
18:13 PerlJam geekosaur: preflex only seems to pipe up when yoleaux (another bot) speaks.
18:13 PerlJam geekosaur: it's annoying at the very least.
18:14 * geekosaur has no idea who/what put messages for one bot in the other. preflex is *supposed* to be silent most of the time
18:14 geekosaur but it has no idea that someone is trying to send messages to another bot via it
18:14 PerlJam aye.
18:15 PerlJam (I rarely notice it, but in the last few days either I've been paying better attention, or it's been happening more often)
18:15 geekosaur I mean, if that's the only issue, I can ask mauke to clear those messages (but if we don't know where they came from, what prevents it happening again?P
18:15 geekosaur otoh if there's no actual purpose being served by the bot, no reason for it to be here
18:17 [Coke] IWBNI preflex could keep track of bots and not bother passing along things for them." clearing out those messages would be a fine start, though.
18:18 [Coke] looking at the help for preflex, I see nothing in there we need that yoleaux isn't doing.
18:18 [Coke] can mauke tell us who asked for it to be in here and why? that'll also help.
18:20 tadzik after-landing push :)
18:20 dalek nqp/jvm-sockets: a81a89a | tadzik++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/runtime/Ops.java:
18:20 dalek nqp/jvm-sockets: Don't leave VMArray in a bogus state
18:20 dalek nqp/jvm-sockets: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/a81a89a831
18:23 [Coke] tadzik: I'll fix star tonight - which modules are replacing file tools?
18:23 tadzik [Coke]: Shell::Command and File::Find
18:23 tadzik thank you, [Coke]++
18:23 tadzik I can't grok submodules
18:23 [Coke] me neither, but I have a night off. ;)
18:23 tadzik hah :)
18:23 tadzik [Coke]: S:C depends on F:F
18:24 tadzik I need to read up on read() and recv() on sockets
18:24 tadzik oh, not specced. I can do what I want >:>
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18:37 dalek nqp/jvm-sockets: 0a65414 | tadzik++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/runtime/Ops.java:
18:37 dalek nqp/jvm-sockets: Fix a copy-pasto
18:37 dalek nqp/jvm-sockets: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/0a65414447
18:43 dalek nqp/jvm-sockets: 46d2162 | tadzik++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/runtime/Ops.java:
18:43 dalek nqp/jvm-sockets: Make nqp::accept() less wrong, and thus make it actually work
18:43 dalek nqp/jvm-sockets: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/46d2162d28
18:58 donaldh joined #perl6
18:58 tadzik fun fact: rakudo-jvm for $*OS returns 'Linux', which confuses roast, which expects 'linux', as Parrot does
18:58 tadzik I don't see a spec on this, I'll just make roast less stric
18:59 labster $*OS isn't specced, it's supposed to be $*KERNEL.
19:01 FROGGS r: say $*KERNEL
19:01 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«Dynamic variable $*KERNEL not found␤  in method gist at src/gen/CORE.setting:11391␤  in method gist at src/gen/CORE.setting:990␤  in sub say at src/gen/CORE.setting:12287␤  in block  at /tmp/TE9yOT7gq_:1␤␤»
19:03 labster Yeah, I'm well aware that no one actually implements it as $*KERNEL.  I get the feeling that changing it now would break a lot in DarkPAN6. :P
19:11 FROGGS r: say " " ~~ m:P5/[ ]/
19:11 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m Error while compiling /tmp/rL87SVXu5vâ�¤failed to parse character class; unescaped ']'?â�¤at /tmp/rL87SVXu5v:1â�¤------> [32msay " " ~~ m:P5/[[33mâ��[31m ]/[0mâ�¤    expecting any of:â�¤        colon pair (restricted)â�¤Â»
19:12 FROGGS r: say "1" ~~ m:P5/[1]/
19:12 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«「1」␤␤»
19:12 FROGGS r: say "1" ~~ m:P5/[1 ]/
19:12 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«「1」␤␤»
19:12 FROGGS r: say " " ~~ m:P5/[1 ]/
19:12 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«False␤»
19:12 FROGGS I call it a bug
19:19 dalek Perlito: c3449a4 | (Simon Bertrang)++ | t5-xs/ (41 files):
19:19 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - XS - organize tests a bit
19:19 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/​Perlito/commit/c3449a4001
19:20 berekuk joined #perl6
19:24 tadzik oh gosh, IO-Socket-INET.t is tricky
19:30 dalek nqp: 10db957 | (Tobias Leich)++ | src/QRegex/P5Regex/Grammar.nqp:
19:30 dalek nqp: whitespace is literal in P5 regexes
19:30 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/10db9576b1
19:32 dalek rakudo/jvm-sockets: e727960 | tadzik++ | / (3 files):
19:32 dalek rakudo/jvm-sockets: Add a crude IO::Socket(::INET) port to JVM, add to build
19:32 dalek rakudo/jvm-sockets: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/e727960a26
19:32 tadzik hi-ha
19:34 FROGGS cool :o)
19:41 tadzik if someone could actually make rakudo-jvm work outside the source directory (and load modules and stuff), that'd be super awesome :)
19:41 tadzik I expect that requires some CLASSPATH-fu or such
19:42 tadzik for now, when testing LWP::Simple I have to copy Test.pm to its lib/, otherwise -Ilib overwrites the path to the regular Test.pm
19:43 PerlJam tadzik: setting PERL6LIB doesn't work?
19:43 Mouq excuse me, but when are submethods useful?
19:45 PerlJam Mouq: for BUILD at least.
19:45 moritz when you understand them :-)
19:45 shinobicl_ joined #perl6
19:46 Mouq Hm. Alright thx :)
19:46 abnorman joined #perl6
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19:47 tadzik PerlJam: hmmm, didn't try :P
19:47 tadzik rebuilding now, will try in a sec
19:47 crab2313 joined #perl6
19:49 TimToady Mouq: more generally, submethods are in charge of the current class's part of the current object, and not in charge of other parts of the current object.
19:51 TimToady submethods are also restricted from (easily) calling virtual attribute names, to prevent accidental interference with other class's attributes before they are initialized (or after they're destroyed)
19:52 TimToady you still *can* call virtual methods, but the bare $.foo form is disallowed since it makes it too easy to initialize or finalize out of order
19:52 TimToady a submethod should generally only mess directly with $!foo storage
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20:00 Mouq Ahhh, okay; I begin to understand
20:04 TimToady maybe Promise.break should be renamed to Promise.bust
20:06 [Coke] only if we rename Promise to A-Move
20:08 dalek rakudo/jvm-sockets: fb42021 | tadzik++ | src/vm/jvm/core/IO/Socket.pm:
20:08 dalek rakudo/jvm-sockets: Unbust recv() and read(), a bit
20:08 dalek rakudo/jvm-sockets: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/fb4202110f
20:09 diakopter [Coke]: *groan*
20:09 diakopter [Coke]: what about Your-Chops
20:10 [Coke] if it's any consolation, that song snippet is now on infiloop in my brain
20:10 * TimToady wonders how this mutated into what kind of a bikeshed to put under the paint...
20:11 TimToady .oO(Bustoleum Paint)
20:11 diakopter I sorta wonder if the bikeshed should be hurricane and tornado proof, or at least infinitely heavy
20:12 TimToady It's really hard to paint an infinitely heavy bikeshed any color other than black...
20:13 * [Coke] wonders what color hawking radiation is.
20:14 geekosaur whatever color it wants to be
20:14 TimToady for anything other than a microscopic black hole, the color is still going to be very, very, very dark
20:14 dalek nqp: 68ce715 | (Tobias Leich)++ | src/HLL/sprintf.nqp:
20:14 dalek nqp: added precision for s and d, also parameter index option
20:14 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/68ce715b92
20:15 TimToady stellar-sized black holes might emit a photon a year, or less, iirc
20:15 geekosaur ...and a microscopic one you still won;t be able to tell unless you're so far away you only see broad spectrum
20:17 diakopter EHEATDEATH
20:17 TimToady well, I bet the radiation is mostly gamma colored
20:18 [Coke] ah. My marvel history tells me gamma radiation is green. awesome.
20:18 TimToady glad we got that settled
20:20 diakopter +1up You Gained 1Googol J/K
20:20 TimToady but then, why aren't black lights green too?
20:21 diakopter EATTEMPTEDFREEASSOCIATIONWI​THNEGATIVEDEGREESOFFREEDOM
20:22 TimToady I hate it when that doesn't happen.
20:23 TimToady the nice thing about jet lag is that you can believe impossible things after breakfast as well
20:23 diakopter also, for breakfast.
20:25 TimToady free association is much more idealistic than open source association
20:25 diakopter EDETERMINISTICRANDDETECTED
20:26 TimToady EOVERUSEOFSNOWCLONEDETECTED
20:27 diakopter ^autopun
20:29 diakopter I'm finding it difficult to remove the image of a snowglobe from my mind
20:29 TimToady that's because it's deterministically random
20:30 TimToady you should have stored it in a variable instead of in a constant
20:31 diakopter my gc is really lazy
20:32 diakopter like, on strike.
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20:39 Ben_Goldberg joined #perl6
20:39 Ben_Goldberg r: say (^10).infinite, (^Inf).infinite, (^Inf)[^10].infinite;
20:39 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«FalseTrueNil␤»
20:44 Ben_Goldberg r: ((map { $_ }, ^Inf) but role { method infinite() { True } }).say
20:44 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«This type does not support elems␤  in method REIFY at src/gen/CORE.setting:7493␤  in method reify at src/gen/CORE.setting:6719␤  in method reify at src/gen/CORE.setting:6706␤  in method reify at src/gen/CORE.setting:6706␤  in method reify at src/gen/CORE.setting:68…
20:44 Ben_Goldberg n: ((map { $_ }, ^Inf) but role { method infinite() { True } }).say
20:44 camelia niecza v24-88-g1f87209: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
20:45 Ben_Goldberg r: ((map { $_ }, ^Inf) but role { method infinite() { False } }).say
20:45 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
20:46 Ben_Goldberg What's the proper way to tell perl that a particular list is finite or infinite?
20:46 Ben_Goldberg r: ((map { $_ }, ^Inf) but role { method infinite() { Mu } }).say
20:47 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
20:50 Ben_Goldberg r: ((map { $_ }, ^Inf)).print
20:50 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«(timeout)012345678910111213141516171819​2021222324252627282930313233343536373839404142​4344454647484950515253545556575859606162636465​6667686970717273747576777879808182838485868788​8990919293949596979899100101102103104105106107​108109110111112113114115116117118119120121…
20:50 Ben_Goldberg r: ((map { $_ }, ^Inf) but role {}).print
20:50 camelia rakudo 10b9ac: OUTPUT«This type does not support elems␤  in method REIFY at src/gen/CORE.setting:7493␤  in method reify at src/gen/CORE.setting:6719␤  in method reify at src/gen/CORE.setting:6706␤  in method gimme at src/gen/CORE.setting:7139␤  in method print at src/gen/CORE.setting:12…
20:51 Ben_Goldberg n: ((map { $_ }, ^Inf) but role {}).print
20:51 camelia niecza v24-88-g1f87209: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
20:52 * Ben_Goldberg is confused
20:52 Ben_Goldberg Why does mixing in an empty anonymous role cause rakudo to not like the list?
20:53 TimToady something relying on introspection that isn't properly heritable, maybe
20:58 Ben_Goldberg Like testing whether a list's class is exactly equal to some particular class?
20:58 TimToady something inspecting $!foo when it should inspect $.foo, is another way to say it
20:58 Ben_Goldberg Oh
20:58 TimToady anyway, it just feels like something of that nature, dunno for sure
20:59 Ben_Goldberg Perl6's guts might be cleaner than perl5's, but I still don't understand them fully, yet :)
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21:54 timotimo hi friends. what have i missed all day?
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22:05 timotimo dunno if anybody answered it yet, but itz: you can make Rakudo::Compiler compile by removing "perl6_group" from the Build.pm and running panda folder_it_is_in/
22:06 timotimo er, i mean panda install folder_it_is_in
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22:15 timotimo okay, backlogged
22:16 timotimo FROGGS++ # sprintf work, finding the commit that broke rakudotjvm
22:16 timotimo tadzik++ for work on sockets for the jvm! :D
22:16 timotimo rest++ for the inverse bikeshed painting %)
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22:39 * jnthn made it home safely from YAPC
22:39 yoleaux 02:15Z <JimmyZ> jnthn: I didn't see which one clones allocate object ...
22:39 yoleaux 02:24Z <JimmyZ> jnthn: re: dded to libuv structs probably makes teasing it apart a bit harder, it' won't be harder, just copy uv__fs_* part on *nix and fs__* part on windows to MoarVM
22:39 yoleaux 02:24Z <JimmyZ> jnthn: I think I can do it
22:39 yoleaux 15:28Z <JimmyZ> jnthn: I re-do libuv in libuv1 branch, without importing(patching) libuv
22:39 jnthn Hm, messages ain't sorted by channel :)
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23:30 [Coke] yoleaux--
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23:32 [Coke] do we want to do a star release this month?
23:33 dalek rakudo-star-daily: a0b5b81 | coke++ | log/ (5 files):
23:33 dalek rakudo-star-daily: today (automated commit)
23:33 dalek rakudo-star-daily: review: https://github.com/coke/rakudo​-star-daily/commit/a0b5b81a73
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23:51 [Coke] do we have anyone in the house who understands submodules?
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