Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2013-10-12

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
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00:24 * [Coke] stares blankly at the remaining opcodes.
00:24 diakopter what are they
00:26 [Coke] https://gist.github.com/coke/6799633
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00:27 diakopter I don't understand these
00:27 [Coke] the opcodes, or the way in which they are presented?
00:27 diakopter the last section means there are ops that are documented that don't exist in moar?
00:27 [Coke] diakopter: yes
00:27 [Coke] or my code isn't finding where they are defined.
00:28 [Coke] and I've only documented ops that exist somewhere. (usually nqp-jvm)
00:28 diakopter jnthn: so all I need to do is implement the bottom section of [Coke]'s gist? :)
00:29 [Coke] no. that's doesn't count things that aren't documented. :)
00:29 [Coke] they'll probably help, though, sure.
00:30 jnthn diakopter: we'll need msot of those, yeah
00:33 [Coke] if someone groks the lex opcodes, this would be a great list to write up some ops for. If someone gets me the basics, I can format it all properly.
00:33 [Coke] https://gist.github.com/coke/6944137
00:38 jnthn what, you mean the names aren't, like, totally logical? :D
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00:38 diakopter they're completely descriptive.
00:38 jnthn [get|bind]lex[_\w]? are all just normal lexical lookup
00:38 jnthn bindlexdyn/getlexdyn just walk the caller chain
00:39 jnthn getlexcaller walks the caller chain but at each step walks the lexicals from that frame's point of view
00:39 jnthn getlexouter is normal lexical lookup but skips the current frame
00:39 jnthn getlexrel* do lexical/dynamic/caller lookup relative to the specified ctx
00:40 jnthn lexotic is something else altogether
00:40 jnthn It's used to implement return
00:48 [Coke] danke
00:48 [Coke] I'll see if I can convert that into docs.
00:49 jnthn pzh
00:52 jnthn 'night o/
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01:15 dalek specs: fd70666 | grondilu++ | S99-glossary.pod:
01:15 dalek specs: MRO in S99
01:15 dalek specs:
01:15 dalek specs: adding "Method Resolution Order" for MRO
01:15 dalek specs: review: https://github.com/perl6/specs/commit/fd706661fd
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02:11 ammoun $row =~ s/$clitic//g; I want to substitute anything in $clitic with nothing, means just remove it
02:12 ammoun $clitic = "(’|:|-|’S|’D|’M|’LL|’RE|’VE|N’T|’s|’d|’m|’ll|’re|’ve|n’t)";
02:12 ammoun Do you guys see any reason why this doesn't work?
02:14 diakopter ammoun: this channel is for Perl 6 questions, but I think you need //eg instead of //g
02:16 geekosaur I don't think /e helps there at all
02:16 ammoun e stands for expression right?
02:16 diakopter <- kinda dull; ignore me
02:16 geekosaur it stands for eval
02:17 geekosaur you should ask in #perl. expect them to want to see more than 2 lines of your script (please use the paste site from the /topic)
02:17 ammoun Thank you guys
02:18 * diakopter tries to understand why someone would want to remove contraction suffixes
02:18 diakopter hm, I guess for dictionary generation
02:18 diakopter er, wordlist
02:20 geekosaur I thought aspell had a dictionary generation mode, seems like a good idea to farm that out to something with a couple years' worth of intelligence in it
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06:25 moritz \o
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07:07 FROGGS[mobile] o/
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12:08 masak good day, #perl6
12:08 masak quiet today, huh_
12:08 masak ?
12:08 jnthn shhh!
12:09 nwc10 good day to write a FAQbot? :-)
12:16 masak heh.
12:17 masak no, I'm still on t4 reviews, thank you very much.
12:24 colomon \o
12:25 masak jnthn++ # http://6guts.wordpress.com/2013/10/11/nqp-gets-moarvm-support-cursor-reduction-and-other-news/
12:26 masak jnthn: oh, and in case you were wondering "Allocating Less Cursors" -- that would be a good time to use "fewer", since "cursor" is not used as a mass noun there.
12:26 colomon masak++
12:29 jnthn masak: That distinction is probably gone by the next generation, much like whom is mostly gone to mine. :)
12:29 masak please, no karma. I feel bad enough already being a grammar nazi... :)
12:30 jnthn So by getting it "wrong" I'm simply ahead of my time :P
12:30 masak jnthn: I'm a firm believer of language being a flexible, evolving thing. but that argument is silly, and I hope you realize that.
12:31 jnthn masak: I wasn't being entirely serious about the second bit, but there's at least a grain of truth in the first.
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12:32 masak there are certainly "less/fewer" fights not worth having. such as ss/6 items <(or less)>/or fewer/ -- see http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/003775.html
12:33 masak but in the case of "less cursors", that just sounds wrong to me because the distinction makes sense to uphold.
12:34 JimmyZ are you talking about designing english?
12:34 nwc10 masak: I also thought this
12:35 nwc10 https://encrypted.google.com/search?q=10+items+or+fewer&amp;gbv=1&amp;source=lnms&amp;tbm=isch&amp;sa=X&amp;ei=80FZUsTZJsLG4gSbs4GwBg&amp;ved=0CAcQ_AUoAQ
12:35 masak JimmyZ: no, just following it in its current implementation.
12:35 jnthn JimmyZ: No, just about a non-native speaker being upset about a construction a native speaker knows is technically wrong, but would never actually react to or intuitively feel is wrong.
12:35 masak :P
12:35 masak jnthn: oh, get off your low horse.
12:36 jnthn When I saw the "5 items or less" article I was like..."so what's wrong with it" :)
12:36 masak me too.
12:36 masak that, to me, is over-reacting.
12:37 masak hm, interesting. I would want it as "5 or fewer items", not "5 or less items". but "5 items or less" is fine to me.
12:38 masak which means that the "or less" probably refers to a *hidden mass noun* of some sort. not the items, but (maybe) the amount representing the items.
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12:46 JimmyZ to avoids this, you could 'use chinese;'
12:49 dalek rakudo/moar-support: e1056ec | jnthn++ | src/vm/moar/ModuleLoaderVMConfig.nqp:
12:49 dalek rakudo/moar-support: First pass at a ModuleLoaderVMConfig for Moar.
12:49 dalek rakudo/moar-support: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/e1056ec0b0
12:49 dalek rakudo/moar-support: af53dfe | jnthn++ | src/Perl6/ModuleLoader.nqp:
12:49 dalek rakudo/moar-support: Make ModuleLoader.nqp Moar friendly.
12:49 dalek rakudo/moar-support: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/af53dfea7d
12:49 dalek rakudo/moar-support: aeb4e8b | jnthn++ | / (2 files):
12:49 dalek rakudo/moar-support: Stub configure/makefile for MoarVM building.
12:49 dalek rakudo/moar-support:
12:49 dalek rakudo/moar-support: Doesn't even get passed the first file yet, and will want various
12:49 dalek rakudo/moar-support: things fixing along the way, but enough to start the porting work.
12:49 dalek rakudo/moar-support: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/aeb4e8b8db
12:49 jnthn uh, get *past*
12:49 masak JimmyZ: :P
12:50 masak JimmyZ: what, because it's impossible to make grammatical errors in Chinese? um, yeah, that totally aligns with my studies of the language. :)
12:51 jnthn masak: Maybe there's fewer opportunities for them :P
12:51 * masak .oO( it's not funny when you use a grammatical construction *correctly*... ) :P
12:52 masak jnthn: s/NFa/NFA/ at some point in the post.
12:52 jnthn I'm quite sure if it wasn't for the preceding discussion I'd have written "less" there :P
12:53 jnthn Fixed the NFa thing, thanks
12:54 masak "less opportunity" is fajn, fwiw.
12:54 tadzik fajn, haha
12:54 JimmyZ masak: it's possible. but not 'less or fewer' part
12:55 masak oh, granted.
12:56 JimmyZ masak: if you grammatical errors in Chinese, you could { use english; .... }
12:56 masak tadzik: pre-emptive https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muphry%27s_law :P
12:56 masak JimmyZ: the important thing is keeping track of which language you're in. :P
12:56 jnthn "if you grammatical errors" :D
12:57 jnthn .oO( autopun? )
12:57 JimmyZ by use '{ }'
13:00 masak jnthn: I'm not sure it's an autopun if it's completely unintenional...
13:02 LylePerl joined #perl6
13:03 masak that is, the utterer doesn't have to be aware, but at least the messenger has to be.
13:03 masak LylePerl! \o/
13:03 LylePerl hi
13:03 LylePerl Just a quick visit unfortunately
13:03 LylePerl http://www.linkedin.com/groupItem?view=&amp;srchtype=discussedNews&amp;gid=106254&amp;item=5794320781450162176&amp;type=member&amp;trk=eml-anet_dig-b_pd-ttl-cn&amp;fromEmail=&amp;ut=0AQoVClIbbmBY1
13:03 LylePerl sorry for the long url
13:04 LylePerl there is a Perl 6 thread on linked in, which could probably do with a knowledgeable response
13:04 LylePerl I thought we had a bot that automatically shortened urls?
13:04 masak long ago, I think.
13:08 LylePerl how are you masak? Enjoying married life?
13:08 masak :)
13:09 clkao 11
13:10 dalek nqp: 60a7992 | jnthn++ | src/vm/moar/QAST/QASTOperationsMAST.nqp:
13:10 dalek nqp: Map nqp::bindhllsym on MoarVM.
13:10 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/60a7992e6c
13:13 Ulti am I the only person who gets angry when seeing the phrase "in production" in relation to Perl5 or Perl6? no one asks how many people use BASH in production or sed, awk or any other language like tool that's just useful regardless... a better question is anyone using Perl6 for something useful thats hard to accomplish in Perl5, if that question isnt yes who cares if its used in production if there isn't a benefit to doing so!
13:14 masak Ulti: many people are not early adopters.
13:14 masak Ulti: they basically want an answer to the question "did someone else do something serious with it yet?"
13:14 masak I can see where they're coming from.
13:14 Ulti plenty of things are really specific too, lisp in the form of CLIPS is used "in production" for hardware control systems specific to space flight... is that interesting?
13:15 Ulti masak: sure but the problem is everyone else isn't vocal in the perl world
13:15 masak what's that got to do with anything?
13:15 Ulti I've taught about ten people Perl in just the last few years, none of them use the "community" or would think to talk about the tools they use
13:15 Ulti its not something they care about
13:15 Ulti they just assume software tools are like hammers
13:15 Ulti they will always be around in one form or another
13:16 Ulti perl6 could have a thousand early adopters and you wouldnt know unless they were financially invested in everyone else using perl6
13:16 masak to some people, Perl 5 is exactly that: a hammer. they don't go to hammer conferences or workshops -- the entire notion of doing that is meaningless to them.
13:17 Ulti but thats my point perl5 is never going to die, its just become a hammer instead of some luxury gadget worth chatting about
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13:20 dalek nqp: 60e2222 | jnthn++ | src/vm/moar/ModuleLoader.nqp:
13:20 dalek nqp: Bring MoarVM module loader in line with others.
13:20 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/60e2222a9e
13:20 Ulti if Perl6 is the next version of Perl I dont get why anyone would expect it to suddenly generate startups wanting flashy hip devs
13:20 masak Ulti: hm, interesting point.
13:20 masak Ulti: I think we're far from that time yet, though. of Perl 5 becoming just a hammer.
13:21 Ulti I'd say Perl is essentially expected to exist on any UNIX system like awk and sed
13:21 * Ulti is trying to remember if his raspberry pi had Perl... my NAS did
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13:23 Ulti the tiny embedded swarm robot I used for my research had perl which I used with swig to write my controllers :S
13:24 Ulti and if in production means Perl6 takes the place of Perl5 to that level its a long long way away just because of lag in all the different people who will have to package it
13:43 Ulti if anyone has the latest Rakudo* installed, could you try doing 'panda install LWP::Simple' and see if you get: No such method 'postcircumfix:<( )>' for invocant of type 'Signature'
13:46 LylePerl checkout my new hammer
13:49 Ulti if the swiss army made hammers it would be perl6
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13:55 diakopter Ulti: japhb__ mentioned here the other day he used rakudo-jvm to parallelize something nifty at his Googler job
13:56 diakopter sounded like a personal tool (not critical path of delivery of service to customer) for syseng stuff
13:57 Ulti yeah I've played at doing the same though I haven't used all the nice regexes Util made for me yet
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13:58 Ulti my use case for perl day to day usually involves using GNU parallel alongside, it would be nice to have simple built in syntax for doing a lot of that
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14:45 timotimo r: grammar Nazi { }
14:45 camelia rakudo 50cecf: ( no output )
14:48 tadzik :D
14:51 tadzik oh wow. I found a website that's giving hugs: http://thenicestplaceontheinter.net/
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14:53 pmurias [Coke]++ # awesome op docs
14:55 timotimo those docs are op!
14:56 jnthn No longer must we put op with undocumented ops!
14:56 [Coke] there are about 500 failing op tests still!
14:57 jnthn aww
14:57 jnthn :)
14:57 jnthn Still a big improvement ;)
14:57 pmurias how do you generate the list of ops?
14:58 moritz jnthn++ # blog post
14:59 [Coke] pmurias: t/docs/opscodes.t - I dig through the source of each vm and look for where ops are added.
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15:02 [Coke] bindlex takes a long, a callframe, and an int - lexes are stored by position, not name/
15:02 [Coke] ?
15:02 [Coke] (what's the int index into the callframe? level up?)
15:03 jnthn [Coke]: nqp::bindlex takes a name and an obj
15:03 jnthn [Coke]: But there are overloads used by QAST::Var compilation
15:03 jnthn [Coke]: Those ones calculate indexes and number of frames out
15:06 Grrrr jnthn++ for submitting an NPW2013 talk
15:07 jnthn Grrrr: It's pretty convenient for me to attend this year :)
15:07 Grrrr jnthn: well, somewhat less so than 2 years ago, I am sure ;)
15:08 jnthn Grrrr: True, though I was doing a little more than attending 2 years ago ;)
15:18 [Coke] ... ok. documenting these not as easy as it seems, then. :)
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15:25 dalek Heuristic branch merge: pushed 220 commits to nqp/nativecall-jvm by jnthn
15:26 jnthn arnsholt: I merged latest master into nativecall-jvm
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15:35 arnsholt jnthn: Excellent!
15:37 jnthn arnsholt: I had to change the r_atpos to atpos to get NativeCall to compiler on JVM; I think we can actually switch it to that without busting it on Parrot these days too
15:39 jnthn arnsholt: I can't seem to get t/nativecall/01-basic.t to work...
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15:40 arnsholt Hmm. That's not good...
15:40 arnsholt What kind of error do you get?
15:40 jnthn java.lang.UnsatisfiedLinkError: Unable to load library '': Native library (win32-x86-64/.dll) not found in resource path ([file:/C:/consulting/rakudo/nqp/, file:/C:/Program%20Files%20(x86)/QuickTime/QTSystem/QTJava.zip])
15:41 jnthn oh...
15:42 arnsholt Argh. That might be a bug in the test script
15:42 jnthn nah, it's looking for printf
15:42 jnthn And I guess trying to use the "current process" trick..
15:43 arnsholt Yeah, that's the idea
15:43 arnsholt Writing portable tests for NativeCall is really tricky
15:47 jnthn Yeah, the current process thing doesn't work on Windows...
15:47 jnthn Did the tests actually pass for you?
15:48 jnthn On non-Widnows?
15:48 masak those links, so unsatisfied...
15:48 arnsholt When I last worked on this it worked on Linux, yeah
15:49 arnsholt And they still do on Linux
15:49 jnthn Looks like JNA may give us a portable way...trying it.
15:50 jnthn load me...and then just link me...till I can get my satisfaction...
15:50 diakopter m
15:51 jnthn arnsholt: ooh, I managed to get it to do ok - printf :)
15:51 jnthn strdup ain't foudn though...grr
15:52 arnsholt Anyways, my plan forward was something like this:
15:53 jnthn oh...but if I make it _strdup it works :)
15:53 arnsholt 1) Get get_boxed_ref working, so that we can run the NativeCall test suite proper and see what happens
15:53 arnsholt 2) Fix the bugs that shakes out in the stuff that's already supposed to be working
15:54 arnsholt 3) CArray
15:54 arnsholt 4) CStruct
15:54 arnsholt 5) Callbacks
15:56 moritz 6) everything else :-)
15:56 arnsholt Yeah =)
15:56 arnsholt Perhaps an even more fruitful approach would be making 3) Whatever's needed to get DBIish working
15:58 moritz fwiw I'm not sure if DBIish on the JVM should also use NativeCall
15:58 moritz or rather the JDBC drivers
16:00 arnsholt That's a very good point
16:01 jnthn We'll still need NativeCall either way, though.
16:02 arnsholt Oh, definitely!
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16:03 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: ddb9cd4 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/runtime/NativeCallOps.java:
16:03 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: Some NativeCall error handling tweaks.
16:03 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/ddb9cd4f3a
16:03 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: a37b601 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/runtime/NativeCallOps.java:
16:03 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: Do "current process" loading in a portable way.
16:03 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/a37b601226
16:03 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: 20c10a9 | jnthn++ | t/nativecall/01-basic.t:
16:03 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: NativeCall test tweak; now passes on Windows.
16:03 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/20c10a9caf
16:03 nwc10 there's a DBD::JDBC and a DBD::ODBC for Perl 5, so it would make sense to have JDBC style drivers also available for Rakudo on the JVM, even if the "usual" is "direct"
16:03 pmurias arnsholt: nqpy has been suspended?
16:04 jnthn arnsholt: Well, now I have those passing on Windows I can no I didn't bust it too badly :)
16:05 jnthn *know
16:05 dalek rakudo-js: f345298 | (Pawel Murias)++ | / (2 files):
16:05 dalek rakudo-js: Update the nqpjs to the new code organisation.
16:05 dalek rakudo-js: review: https://github.com/pmurias/rakudo-js/commit/f345298760
16:05 dalek rakudo-js: 6d08ea0 | (Pawel Murias)++ | bin/nqp-js.nqp:
16:05 dalek rakudo-js: Use HLLBackend::JavaScript from nqp-js.nqp.
16:05 dalek rakudo-js: review: https://github.com/pmurias/rakudo-js/commit/6d08ea0ba0
16:05 dalek rakudo-js: fff8aba | (Pawel Murias)++ | / (5 files):
16:05 dalek rakudo-js: Emit modules instead of .js files so that ender doesn't cause problems.
16:05 dalek rakudo-js: review: https://github.com/pmurias/rakudo-js/commit/fff8abafed
16:05 dalek rakudo-js: e088488 | (Pawel Murias)++ | / (13 files):
16:05 dalek rakudo-js: fixjsstyle --strict --nojsdoc nqp-runtime-core/bootstrap.js nqp-runtime-core/code_ref.js nqp-runtime-core/ctx.js nqp-runtime-core/hash.js nqp-runtime-core/helpers.js nqp-runtime-core/null.js nqp-runtime-core/reprs.js nqp-runtime-core/runtime.js nqp-runtime-core/serialization_context.js nqp-runtime-core/serialization.js nqp-runtime-core/serialization_writer.js nqp-runtime-core/sixmodel.js
16:05 dalek rakudo-js: review: https://github.com/pmurias/rakudo-js/commit/e08848869e
16:05 dalek rakudo-js: f33afda | (Pawel Murias)++ | nqp-runtime-core/ (6 files):
16:05 dalek rakudo-js: Fix some errors reported by make lint (gjslint).
16:08 arnsholt pmurias: Not really, but I've been busy with article writing and such at work lately
16:09 arnsholt jnthn: Still work on Lunix. Hooray! \o/
16:09 jnthn \o/
16:10 jnthn arnsholt: OK, I'll have a crack at (1)
16:12 arnsholt Cheers. That's the hardest one from my perspective
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16:18 arnsholt pmurias: So if you want to hack on it, feel free. There are some bugs in the grammar that need sorting, but I mostly know how to if you're interested in hacking on it
16:19 timotimo http://repast.sourceforge.net/repast_3/repastpy/nqpy.html - this nqpy?
16:19 timotimo :P
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16:23 arnsholt Heh, name's already taken ^_^
16:23 arnsholt Should've seen that one coming =)
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16:35 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: ca138b9 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/ (4 files):
16:35 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: Hold native callsite info at an extra indirection.
16:35 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm:
16:35 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: This will help support inlining it into a P6opaque.
16:35 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/ca138b973d
16:35 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: 43567c3 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/sixmodel/reprs/NativeCall.java:
16:35 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: Teach NativeCall REPR how to inline itself.
16:35 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm:
16:35 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: Note that there's not currently a way to get hold of the inlined thing
16:35 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: so NativeCall can use it; that will come next.
16:35 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/43567c3b1d
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16:40 jnthn arnsholt: Would Rakudo need another thing in the classpath for JNA to work?
16:40 jnthn Seeing java.lang.NoClassDefFoundError: com/sun/jna/NativeLibrary
16:40 jnthn ah, jna.jar...
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16:42 arnsholt Yeah, unless the nqp JAR includes the third part stuff inside it'll need that, yeah
16:42 kurahaupo joined #perl6
16:42 jnthn k
16:43 arnsholt We should probably set up nqp.jar like that at some point, actually
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16:44 dalek zavolaj: b946f3f | jnthn++ | lib/NativeCall.pm6:
16:44 dalek zavolaj: .exists => :exists
16:44 dalek zavolaj: review: https://github.com/jnthn/zavolaj/commit/b946f3fe5b
16:47 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: 0040bf6 | jnthn++ | tools/build/Makefile-JVM.in:
16:47 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: Install jna JAR.
16:47 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/0040bf6f67
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17:00 jnthn Time to sort out some dinner. bbl :)
17:02 timotimo "NQP is Copyright (C) 2013 by Paweł Murias." wat :)
17:02 moritz it's not? :-)
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18:02 pmurias timotimo: ?
18:03 timotimo says so on the bottom of your readme; i'm confused about that
18:04 timotimo your readme == the one in rakudo-js
18:06 dalek rakudo-js: e0ad3d3 | (Pawel Murias)++ | README.markdown:
18:06 dalek rakudo-js: Fix README.
18:06 dalek rakudo-js: review: https://github.com/pmurias/rakudo-js/commit/e0ad3d3134
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18:26 masak whoa, t4 is so deep-and-subtle.
18:30 moritz that's why I didn't find a good solution to it :-)
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18:35 dalek Perlito: a3e2348 | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | / (2 files):
18:35 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - perl6 - special var
18:35 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/Perlito/commit/a3e2348f41
18:42 kurahaupo joined #perl6
18:47 pmurias arnsholt: do we rename nqpy?
18:49 arnsholt I have no objections to a rename
18:49 arnsholt Open to suggestions for a better name =)
18:49 lue .oO(It's too bad Blender doesn't allow scripting for Perl 6. t4 would've been obvious then.)
18:50 pmurias arnsholt: inventing a new name is the hard part ;)
18:50 arnsholt Yup
18:51 arnsholt Which is why I went with NQPy in the first place. Very little invetiveness required =)
18:52 lue PythoNQPythoNQP... ?
18:52 pmurias arnsholt: snake?
18:53 arnsholt Ooh, not bad
18:56 arnsholt Snake in turn tempts me to suggest something like badger or mushroom, but snake is probably better =)
18:59 pmurias badger and mushroom will be the qast ruby and php implementations ;)
19:00 arnsholt =D
19:03 rurban who is working on the libuv cygwin issues? My branch is at https://github.com/rurban/libuv/tree/cygwin but __io_poll is missing
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19:10 jnthn rurban: Apparently, you're working on it ;)
19:15 pmurias arnsholt: do we have dalek hooks for nqpy/snake?
19:16 arnsholt Not yet
19:17 arnsholt What's needed to set that up?
19:17 pmurias https://github.com/perl6/mu/blob/master/misc/dalek-push.txt
19:18 pmurias (I can't do that as I have no access to the Admin panel of nqpy repo)
19:22 pmurias arnsholt: it's mostly clicking around on github and copy and pasting a url
19:25 arnsholt Indeed it is
19:25 * arnsholt goes to rename
19:26 pmurias arnsholt: do we implement python 3 or python 2?
19:28 arnsholt 3
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19:30 arnsholt The section numbering in Grammar.nqp follows the numbering in http://docs.python.org/3/reference/
19:32 kurahaupo joined #perl6
19:32 arnsholt pmurias: While we're on the topic, do you know if there's something like a spectest suite for Python?
19:33 arnsholt I've looked around a bit but haven't found anything yet
19:33 grondilu we can ask #python
19:33 pmurias arnsholt: found it
19:34 pmurias Lib/test in the python repo
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19:37 arnsholt Ah, brilliant!
19:38 kurahaupo joined #perl6
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19:40 pmurias arnsholt: one problem with that is that those tests seem rather complex (we would have to implement classes and a lot of other stuff to get any of them to pass/run)
19:42 pmurias arnsholt: so we will have to write/find a set of "sanity" tests
19:45 arnsholt Yeah, can't be avoided I guess
19:45 grondilu what's t4?
19:47 felher grondilu: https://github.com/masak/p6cc2012 -- part 4 of the last p6cc
19:48 grondilu oh, ok
19:52 pmurias arnsholt: you changed the repo name?
19:53 pmurias found it
19:53 arnsholt Yeah, sorry I forgot to tell you
19:55 moritz if you want to have some fun, we can move it into the perl6 organization :-)
19:55 kurahaupo joined #perl6
19:58 pmurias arnsholt: did you add the dalek hooks?
19:58 arnsholt 'sec. Got sidetracked
19:59 pmurias np
19:59 dalek snake: 0f9e071 | (Arne Skjærholt)++ | src/NQPy/Grammar.nqp:
19:59 dalek snake: Handle comments properly in ws.
19:59 dalek snake: review: https://github.com/arnsholt/snake/commit/0f9e071226
19:59 dalek snake: 58db12f | (Pawel Murias)++ | / (12 files):
19:59 dalek snake: Rename nqpy to snake.
19:59 dalek snake: review: https://github.com/arnsholt/snake/commit/58db12fb08
19:59 dalek snake: 5e0b0a8 | (Pawel Murias)++ | / (2 files):
19:59 dalek snake: Add simplest test possible, add test target target to Makfile.
19:59 dalek snake: review: https://github.com/arnsholt/snake/commit/5e0b0a8dd4
20:00 arnsholt It's a snake!
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20:05 * jnthn won't badger anyone about Python commit messages on #perl6, 'cus they won't take up mush room...
20:06 arnsholt =D
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20:10 rurban jnthn: yes, but my io_poll idea looks awful. just duplicate the windows io_poll. maybe not_gerd or jimmyz got better ideas
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20:17 * felher looks at a review of t1: "Not sure type1, type2, type3, and type4 conveys the maximal amount of information to the interested reader."... hihi, priceless
20:18 dalek snake: 85167cd | (Arne Skjærholt)++ | src/Snake/ (2 files):
20:18 dalek snake: Make indentation handling less broken.
20:18 dalek snake:
20:18 dalek snake: We're probably not all the way there just yet, but at least it's less
20:18 dalek snake: hilariously broken this way than it was.
20:18 dalek snake: review: https://github.com/arnsholt/snake/commit/85167cd64d
20:19 dmol joined #perl6
20:19 colomon snake?
20:20 timotimo ah, snake is not "translate nqp to python", it's a python implementation in nqp
20:20 colomon arnsholt++
20:21 arnsholt Yeah. Fallout from me reading the RaNIW notes =)
20:21 lue arnsholt: is that what I keep referring to as "the slides" ?
20:22 arnsholt I'd assume so, yeah
20:22 lue (specifically the "learn how to NQP" slides)
20:22 arnsholt Yup. That's the stuff
20:23 * colomon will be very happy when he can find the time to read / play with those slides
20:23 dwarring I've been been extending the rubyish example from RaNIW
20:23 dwarring been a lot of fun
20:24 dwarring README summarises progress https://github.com/dwarring/nqp-rubyish
20:25 diakopter dwarring: feel free to submit a pull request; I'm sure someone will want it somewhere
20:25 moritz and here I was hoping that the RaNIW attendees actually hack on nqp and parrot
20:25 dwarring it's still all just in a single source file
20:25 moritz :-)
20:25 diakopter parrot?
20:26 dwarring nqp
20:26 dalek specs: 919626d | Mouq++ | S99-glossary.pod:
20:26 dalek specs: Add LTM and NFG to S99
20:26 dalek specs: review: https://github.com/perl6/specs/commit/919626d047
20:26 diakopter I thought LTM was already on there
20:28 arnsholt moritz: Well, I didn't actually attend O=)
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20:29 arnsholt But I'm mulling over some NQP work as well, partially as fallout from the Python stuff
20:30 * grondilu reads S99 and wonder if EPIC FAIL needs to be there.
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20:33 dwarring not sure where to put rubyish - do we need a perl6/nqp_examples?
20:34 dwarring or a perl6/perl6_examples/nqp?
20:34 moritz dwarring: or you can put it into perl6/perl6-examples in an .nqp file
20:34 moritz dwarring: and maybe add a comment on top that it's actually nqp, not Perl 6
20:35 moritz dwarring: no need to create a separate repo for a single file unless that's what you want
20:36 dwarring moritz: makes sense
20:37 dwarring i'll add it there
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20:37 moritz dwarring: do you a commit bit already?
20:38 dalek specs: 465527e | grondilu++ | S99-glossary.pod:
20:38 dalek specs: defining sigil
20:38 dalek specs: review: https://github.com/perl6/specs/commit/465527e282
20:39 dwarring moritz: should have
20:40 jnthn grrr...I almost forgotted JVM bytecode
20:40 dwarring i've committed there before
20:44 arnsholt jnthn: Win32-API on JVM sounds awesome! \o/
20:44 dwarring grondilu: I'll add rubyish.nqp to perl6_examplkes/interpreters
20:44 arnsholt jnthn++
20:44 dwarring *examples
20:44 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: 764b127 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/ (3 files):
20:44 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: Make native call sites nested in P6opaque work.
20:44 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm:
20:44 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: With this, we can have NativeCall basically working on JVM (will need
20:44 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: work on CArray and CStruct before we have full support, though).
20:44 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/764b127a28
20:45 jnthn arnsholt: OK, that's (1) done and since the win32 example worked right off, probably (2) also :)
20:45 jnthn dwarring: Maybe it belongs as an NQP example in the NQP examples/ dir
20:45 jnthn arnsholt: I'm just gonna check that my patches to NativeCall.pm6 doesn't bust it on Parrot
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20:49 dwarring ok, i'll maybe add add to nqp/examples
20:50 arnsholt Ooh, that sounds very promising!
20:50 arnsholt I'll try to get some stuff done on it in the morrow
20:50 jnthn arnsholt: Great!
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20:54 grondilu dwarring: maybe it's best if you put it in perl6-examples/parsers
20:55 timotimo i misread "morrow" as "moarvm" and was like "wait, when did rakudo get onto moarvm already"
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20:59 jnthn arnsholt: grrr...nope, I busted arrays
21:00 grondilu dwarring: oops, haven't read enough.  nqp/examples it is, then.
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21:20 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: 10abc40 | jnthn++ | src/vm/parrot/pmc/sixmodelobject.pmc:
21:20 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: Add missing 6model v-table forwarders.
21:20 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm:
21:20 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: With this we can use the normal nqp::atpos_* with CArray. This means
21:20 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: NativeCall can be tweaked to build on JVM also without breaking it on
21:20 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: Parrot.
21:20 dalek nqp/nativecall-jvm: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/10abc4052f
21:20 jnthn arnsholt: Now that things work, is there any reason to keep this work in a branch?
21:20 jnthn arnsholt: If I merge it now I can just bump NQP_REVISION and update NativeCall, rather than have a branch there too...
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22:22 dalek nqp: 825038b | jnthn++ | src/vm/moar/QAST/QASTCompilerMAST.nqp:
22:22 dalek nqp: Remove leftover code from the Moar nqp-cc.
22:22 dalek nqp:
22:22 dalek nqp: This avoids loads of calls to nqp::getenvhash(...) in the eval-heavy
22:22 dalek nqp: t/qregex.
22:22 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/825038bfb6
22:26 lue Does anyone here with access to feather know why the percabal.org/syn and feather.perl6.nl/syn pages don't list the S99 entry? It bugs me that it's been missing for a while now.
22:35 grondilu Off Topic: guys, have you watched the latest spacex grasshopper test?  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ZDkItO-0a4
22:36 * grondilu was skeptical about this thing but he's beginning to be impressed.
22:37 kurahaupo joined #perl6
22:37 timotimo look at that plume(age)
22:38 timotimo that thing is crazy accurate
22:39 diakopter grondilu: that's truly amazing
22:40 xinming joined #perl6
22:41 benabik Shame the retrieval attempt on the v1.1 launch failed.
22:47 jnthn grondilu: wow!
22:47 jnthn Science/engineering win.
22:48 grondilu what are you guys waiting to build a rocket with a Perl6 control system?
22:48 grondilu :)
22:49 grondilu I'm kidding of course, what you guys do is almost as awesome as what SpaceX does :)
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