Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2014-04-18

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:01 Mouq lue: Rakudobrew?
00:01 lue I do not know what that is. /me checks
00:02 timotimo you're in for a nice surprise
00:03 lue Nah, won't work for me, I don't do --gen-*
00:04 lue (and besides, I would hope panda/rakudo would be able to take care of what (at least for the non-precomp'd files) is way too granular a versioning scheme :/)
00:06 timotimo the things refer to each other with "cuids", so that's problematic
00:07 lue ooc, any reason rakudobrew is being remarkably un-Perl6 with its non-use of MAIN?
00:09 Mouq lue: Well, it's p5…
00:10 lue that would explain it :)
00:11 lue But like I said, it won't work for me, I like taking care of the build process and everything myself, it's just that panda should be smarter about this "upgrading" thing.
00:19 dalek rakudo/nom: 6ab0e24 | (Tim Smith)++ | src/core/Main.pm:
00:19 dalek rakudo/nom: Simplify program name in $?USAGE if in PATH
00:19 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/6ab0e2491b
00:19 dalek rakudo/nom: 7cf9cad | (Alexander Moquin)++ | src/core/Main.pm:
00:19 dalek rakudo/nom: Merge pull request #265 from softmoth/usage-prog-name
00:19 dalek rakudo/nom:
00:19 dalek rakudo/nom: Simplify program name in $?USAGE if in PATH
00:19 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/7cf9cad990
00:20 Mouq thou++ # scratching itches
00:21 thou Thanks, Mouq!
00:21 Mouq thou: Thank you!
00:29 * lue afk
00:37 Mouq std: .say for"a".."z"
00:37 camelia std e347792: OUTPUT«ok 00:01 123m␤»
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03:49 adu Mouq++
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04:12 Mouq r: say (:a<4>,:b<7>,:c<4>).min(*.value)
04:12 camelia rakudo-parrot 7cf9ca, rakudo-jvm 7cf9ca, rakudo-moar 7cf9ca: OUTPUT«"a" => "4"␤»
04:12 Mouq r: say (:c<4>,:b<7>,:a<4>).min(*.value)
04:12 camelia rakudo-parrot 7cf9ca, rakudo-jvm 7cf9ca, rakudo-moar 7cf9ca: OUTPUT«"c" => "4"␤»
04:13 TimToady r: say (:a<4>,:b<17>,:c<4>).min(*.value)
04:13 camelia rakudo-parrot 7cf9ca, rakudo-jvm 7cf9ca, rakudo-moar 7cf9ca: OUTPUT«"b" => "17"␤»
04:13 TimToady n: say (:a<4>,:b<17>,:c<4>).min(*.value)
04:13 camelia niecza v24-109-g48a8de3: OUTPUT«"a" => 4␤»
04:16 Mouq I feel like I'm just going to keep wanting to solve 2d problems with complex numbers until we have [1;2] semantics in place in Rakudo
04:16 Mouq *solve all
04:16 lue Complex numbers are a nice way to do 2D though :)
04:17 Mouq lue: They really are :)
04:17 lue .oO( @grid{1+2i} )
04:20 Mouq TimToady: Is [1;2] supposed to be eqv to [$((1,),(2,))]?
04:20 lue heh, good thing I decided on a last-minute better test file for a fix to rakudo :)
04:20 TimToady Mouq: depends on what you mean by eqv
04:21 TimToady is more like [lol (1,), (2,)]
04:21 Mouq Okay
04:21 TimToady or [$(1,), $(2,)]
04:22 TimToady but with some knowledge that it actually is a 2-dimensional subscript
04:22 lue I don't suppose there's a way to test if I'm in a delimited code block (vs. paragraph or abbreviated) without adding a new dynvar, right?
04:22 TimToady so just passing a list of slices is not quite good enough
04:22 lue (the existing CODE_BLOCK just distinguishes between explicit/implicit)
04:23 Mouq so then multi postcircumfix:<[ ]> should have a (LoL @) candidate?
04:23 Mouq r: say lol((1,), (2,)).perl
04:23 Mouq n: say lol((1,), (2,)).perl
04:23 camelia rakudo-parrot 7cf9ca, rakudo-jvm 7cf9ca, rakudo-moar 7cf9ca: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m Error while compiling /tmp/tmpfileâ�¤Undeclared routine:â�¤    lol used at line 1. Did you mean 'log'?â�¤â�¤Â»
04:23 camelia niecza v24-109-g48a8de3: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤â�¤Undeclared routine:â�¤    'lol' used at line 1â�¤â�¤Unhandled exception: Check failedâ�¤â�¤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/boot/lib/CORE.setting line 1502 (die @ 5) â�¤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/src/STD.pm6 line 1147 (P6.comp_u…»
04:24 Mouq /o\
04:24 Mouq lue: What do you mean?
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04:24 Mouq lue: In Perl6::Grammar.nqp?
04:24 lue Mouq: yes
04:24 Mouq Uhh, why?
04:24 TimToady that's really the only reason for having that type
04:24 TimToady otherwise it would be pure structure
04:24 TimToady rakudo doesn't really do lol yet
04:24 TimToady and .tree behaves rather like .lol is supposed to
04:25 Mouq TimToady: Okay, thank you for clearing that up for me :)
04:25 lue Mouq: explicit code block with multiline formatting code with lines starting with a pod directive causes errors where not surrounding the same in a formatting code works.
04:25 lue (well, "warnings", but the output formatting ends up being not-totally-right)
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04:26 Mouq r: =begin code :allow<B>␤B< a b␤c d e␤f g>␤=end code
04:26 camelia rakudo-parrot 7cf9ca, rakudo-jvm 7cf9ca, rakudo-moar 7cf9ca: ( no output )
04:27 Mouq r: =begin code :allow<B>␤B< a b␤=para␤c d e␤␤f g>␤=end code
04:27 camelia rakudo-parrot 7cf9ca, rakudo-jvm 7cf9ca, rakudo-moar 7cf9ca: OUTPUT«Potential difficulties:â�¤    Pod formatting code B missing endtag '>'.â�¤    at /tmp/tmpfile:2â�¤    ------> [32mB< a b[33mâ��[31m<EOL>[0mâ�¤Â»
04:27 Mouq :/
04:28 Mouq Have fun with that :P
04:29 Mouq We can just make it so directives are always allowed in formatting codes in an =code-type context
04:29 lue Mouq: I had it, I just needed to introduce a new dynamic variable to distinguish between =begin code and =for code/=code, because otherwise you could do =for code :allow<B>\nB<line 1\n=head1 line2>  which is inconsistent with non-fc'd stuff in =for code
04:29 Mouq Yeah
04:29 Mouq Well lue++ :)
04:31 lue *sigh* panda's being the most annoying part of this :/ (I could just use --doc, but it's so much easier to see what goes on in the test file with --doc=HTML)
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04:31 Mouq lue: say $=pod.perl?
04:32 lue Mouq: seeing =head1 commands that are either plaintext and bold or big blue headers is much faster :P
04:32 Mouq lue: Fair point
04:34 thou Anyone here that can merge into evalbot & restart?
04:34 thou https://github.com/perl6/evalbot/pull/5
04:35 Mouq thou++
04:37 Mouq looks solid
04:38 thou *NB* I tested the format_names() sub, but not full evalbot!
04:39 Mouq thou: I'll merge it and take the blame if it doesn't work :) Though I'm pretty sure it does
04:39 dalek evalbot: 1a8a83e | (Tim Smith)++ | evalbot.pl:
04:39 dalek evalbot: Combine eval names sharing prefix & rev
04:39 dalek evalbot: review: https://github.com/perl6/evalbot/commit/1a8a83e55d
04:39 dalek evalbot: 0ef6d11 | (Alexander Moquin)++ | evalbot.pl:
04:39 dalek evalbot: Merge pull request #5 from softmoth/combine-eval-names
04:39 dalek evalbot:
04:39 dalek evalbot: Combine eval names sharing prefix & rev
04:39 dalek evalbot: review: https://github.com/perl6/evalbot/commit/0ef6d119e9
04:41 dalek rakudo/nom: e63497d | lue++ | src/Perl6/Grammar.nqp:
04:41 dalek rakudo/nom: Fix pod directives formatting codes in delimited code blocks.
04:41 dalek rakudo/nom:
04:41 dalek rakudo/nom: This makes handling of pod directives in code blocks consistent whether
04:41 dalek rakudo/nom: or not you've wrapped it in a multi-line (and :allow'd) formatting code.
04:41 dalek rakudo/nom:
04:41 dalek rakudo/nom: In delimited code blocks, the only pod directive that can't be stuffed
04:42 dalek rakudo/nom: in formatting codes is the same one that can't be in a delimited code
04:42 dalek rakudo/nom: block in the first place: =end code. For other code blocks and that pod
04:42 dalek rakudo/nom: directive in particular, you'll need to keep = from being the first
04:42 dalek rakudo/nom: non-whitespace character, same as before.
04:42 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/e63497d3e6
04:42 lue I lost a preposition the summary :)
04:44 Mouq lue++
04:45 Mouq Much message. Very git. Six.
05:11 Mouq r: class Foo { has @.board; method at_pos (Complex $c) is rw { @.board[$c.re][$c.im] } }; Foo.new[4i] # :(
05:12 camelia rakudo-jvm 7cf9ca: OUTPUT«Cannot call 'Real'; none of these signatures match:␤:(Mu:U \v: *%_)␤  in any  at gen/jvm/BOOTSTRAP.nqp:1212␤  in sub infix:<<> at gen/jvm/CORE.setting:4222␤  in sub infix:<<> at gen/jvm/CORE.setting:4222␤  in sub postcircumfix:<[ ]> at gen/jvm/COR…»
05:12 camelia ..rakudo-moar 7cf9ca: OUTPUT«Cannot call 'Real'; none of these signatures match:␤:(Mu:U \v: *%_)␤  in sub infix:<<> at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:4222␤  in sub infix:<<> at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:4222␤  in sub postcircumfix:<[ ]> at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:2405␤  in block  at /tm…»
05:12 camelia ..rakudo-parrot 7cf9ca: OUTPUT«Cannot call 'Real'; none of these signatures match:␤:(Mu:U \v: *%_)␤  in any  at gen/parrot/BOOTSTRAP.nqp:1219␤  in method Real at gen/parrot/CORE.setting:1032␤  in sub infix:<<> at gen/parrot/CORE.setting:4226␤  in sub infix:<<> at gen/parrot/…»
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05:14 lue #perl6 o/
05:15 Mouq 'night lue! sleep well
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05:58 masak sending p6c announcement now.
06:01 masak sent.
06:01 masak updating Wikipedia page.
06:07 masak updated.
06:07 masak this concludes the release process. thank you all, especially PerlJam++.
06:08 * masak celebrates with the appropriate amount of breakfast
06:09 masak though the final run of stresstest seems to be stuck on this part of the JVM tests:
06:10 masak t/spec/S17-concurrency/supply.rakudo.jvm ..................... 12/36
06:11 Mouq masak++
06:11 * masak tries to run it outside of the test harness
06:14 masak outside of the test harness, it gets past 12, but it currently seems stuck after 34...
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06:24 sergot morning o/  !
06:25 FROGGS_ morning
06:35 dalek rakudo/nom: 921615b | (Tobias Leich)++ | tools/build/NQP_REVISION:
06:35 dalek rakudo/nom: bump nqp rev for jvm buf16.decode fix
06:35 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/921615b60a
06:39 FROGGS_ hmmm, I killed camelia >.<
06:39 FROGGS_ moritz: halp ó.ò
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06:52 masak consistently on my box, `./perl6-j -Ilib t/spec/S17-concurrency/supply.rakudo.jvm` hangs after 'ok 34'.
06:52 masak can anyone duplicate that?
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07:13 FROGGS_ masak: I also had a hanging test about S17... I'll check if it is that one after breakfast
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07:18 masak FROGGS_: nice.
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07:58 dalek evalbot: 28fad69 | (Tobias Leich)++ | evalbot.pl:
07:58 dalek evalbot: declare loop variable $p
07:58 dalek evalbot:
07:58 dalek evalbot: this hopefully unbreaks the evalbot
07:58 dalek evalbot: review: https://github.com/perl6/evalbot/commit/28fad69b10
07:59 nwc10 masak: yes, I can duplicate it
08:09 FROGGS_ is here somebody else who can pull camelia on featherX and the start it?
08:10 nwc10 sshd───bash─┬─emacs └─make───perl─┬─java───50*[{java}] └─perl
08:10 nwc10 oops
08:10 nwc10 let's try that again without irssi being helpful
08:10 FROGGS_ hmmm, that looks kinda interesting :o)
08:10 nwc10 sshd───bash─┬─emacs
08:10 nwc10 └─make───perl─┬─java───50*[{java}]
08:11 nwc10 └─perl
08:11 nwc10 but anway, 50 is too many to try using strace to work out what they are up to
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08:11 nwc10 but whatever it is, it's not using CPU
08:11 * nwc10 suspects deadlock of some sort
08:12 FROGGS_ yeah, it hangs when cleaning up and shutting down the threads I guess
08:12 apejens related to the concurrecny tests hanging maybe?
08:13 FROGGS_ it is a concurrency test, aye
08:13 FROGGS_ bbiab
08:25 Ven_ perl6: my @a = <a b c>; @a Z[~=] <x y z>; say @a
08:26 Ven_ oh, camelia is down
08:31 Ven_ what's the difference between `$v <<[==]>> @set` vs `$v <<[Z==]>> @set` ?
08:33 Ven_ (and between `$v ==  any(@a)` and `$v <<[==]>> @a`)
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09:03 moritz m: say 42
09:03 camelia rakudo-moar 921615: OUTPUT«42␤»
09:03 Ven_ perl6: my @a = <a b c>; @a Z[~=] <x y z>; say @a
09:04 camelia rakudo-jvm 921615: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
09:04 camelia ..rakudo-{parrot,moar} 921615, niecza v24-109-g48a8de3: OUTPUT«ax by cz␤»
09:04 Ven_ bracketed++
09:05 moritz j: say 1
09:05 camelia rakudo-jvm 921615: OUTPUT«1␤»
09:12 sergot j: print 1 for ^100;
09:12 camelia rakudo-jvm 921615: OUTPUT«11111111111111111111111111111​111111111111111111111111111111111111​11111111111111111111111111111111111»
09:13 sergot j: print '' for ^100;
09:13 camelia rakudo-jvm 921615: ( no output )
09:13 sergot j: print '' for ^10000;
09:13 camelia rakudo-jvm 921615: ( no output )
09:14 sergot j: my @a = <a b c>; @a Z[~=] <x y z>; say @a
09:14 camelia rakudo-jvm 921615: OUTPUT«ax by cz␤»
09:17 Ven_ stress-testing r-j
09:18 Ven_ .oO( was `EVAL` made uppercase for golfing ? )
09:18 moritz masak++ # Rakudo release, "Really"
09:19 Ven_ Seems like I'm the only one who didnt set up his name on github, eh
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09:19 moritz Ven_: lue hasn't either, iirc
09:20 moritz it's fine by us if you want to stay anonymous/pseudonymous
09:20 moritz just if you want to contribute to rakudo on a larger scale, you'll need to submit a signed CLA
09:25 Ven_ Yeah. bad things happened last time I put my name up somewhere, so I'll leave it as that for now
09:25 Ven_ (I get the need for a CLA, though, obviously)
09:35 timotimo tadzik: you'll have to build a bunch more stuff for steroids if you want to present it :P
09:36 tadzik timotimo: I know :P
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09:39 Woodi hallo :)
09:39 Woodi masak++  # R*++
09:40 Woodi btw. anyone remembers that link to Rakudo Easter Eggs page ?
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10:56 timotimo happy ishtar, friends
11:10 woolfy1 Have a nice weekend
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11:15 jnthn o/
11:19 nebuchadnezzar joined #perl6
11:39 JimmyZ \o
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11:48 moritz Woodi: https://rt.perl.org/ # rakudo easter eggs documented here
11:50 Woodi oo, Bitcard, look nice :)
11:51 Woodi jnthn++ also !
11:52 Ven joined #perl6
11:54 Woodi btw. I wonder if we (IT) are reinventing processes with infrastructure in threads with stuff form...
11:56 * moritz can't make sense of "with stuff form"
11:57 Woodi moritz: just some bad "poetic" description... excuse for not being precise realy :)
11:57 Ven m: say ("a".."z).roll(1) x 5
11:57 camelia rakudo-moar 921615: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m Error while compiling /tmp/9Bc6tKm0Zxâ�¤Unable to parse expression in double quotes; couldn't find final '"' â�¤at /tmp/9Bc6tKm0Zx:1â�¤------> [32msay ("a".."z).roll(1) x 5[33mâ��[31m<EOL>[0mâ�¤    expecting any of:â�¤   …»
11:57 Ven m: say ("a".."z").roll(1) x 5
11:57 camelia rakudo-moar 921615: OUTPUT«ccccc␤»
11:58 moritz m: say ("a".."z").roll(1) xx 5
11:58 camelia rakudo-moar 921615: OUTPUT«y b k u n␤»
11:58 Ven mmh, I guess it makes sense for x not to "thunk" (correct word here ?)
11:58 moritz right
11:59 Ven just a bit of a surprise
12:02 * Ven just convinced 2 new friends of how expressive perl 6 is
12:02 Ven Well, it's not like it's any hard :-)
12:03 Ven I just show them "$a == 1 | 3" and they're "OH WOW - That's right, we're in 2014 !"
12:09 Ven uuh, is perl6.org down ?
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12:10 jnthn works for me
12:10 dalek star: b1fd704 | moritz++ | tools/star/Makefile:
12:10 dalek star: [Makefile] bump some revisions
12:10 dalek star: review: https://github.com/rakudo/star/commit/b1fd70421c
12:10 moritz jnthn++ is signed up as R* release manager, I'm just doing some initial preparations
12:11 jnthn Go for it! :)
12:12 Ven uuuh wat
12:12 Ven Works with curl, but chrome fails
12:12 * jnthn just got it in chrome...
12:13 huf works in chrome from here...
12:13 moritz Ven: maybe IPv4/IPv6 issue?
12:13 jnthn Hmm...current HEAD of Rakudo fails some spectests in stuff related to usage message generating.
12:13 Ven Works it in safari, and I don't get it with chrome. WAT.
12:13 huf welp, stop using chrome, it's not a very good browser anyway :D
12:13 moritz Ven: try curl -4 and curl -6
12:13 Ven curl -6 fails
12:14 moritz argl
12:14 moritz we have recursive submodules in star
12:15 nwc10 you mean mutually recursive dependencies?
12:15 moritz now modules/panda says that ext/File__Find and ext/JSON__Tiny have new commits
12:15 moritz I guess that means we shouldn't update them, because they are under panda's control, right?
12:16 dalek star: 55ec7c1 | moritz++ | modules/doc:
12:16 dalek star: Update modules/doc
12:16 dalek star: review: https://github.com/rakudo/star/commit/55ec7c1672
12:19 Ven r: / : /
12:19 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 921615: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤Unrecognized regex metacharacter : (must be quoted to match literally)â�¤at /tmp/tmpfile:1â�¤------> [32m/ :[33mâ��[31m /[0mâ�¤Unrecognized regex metacharacter   (must be quoted to match literally)â�¤at /tm…»
12:19 Ven std: / : /
12:19 camelia std e347792: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m�Backtrack control ':' does not seem to have a preceding atom to control at /tmp/qkzhi2_drm line 1:�------> [32m/ :[33m�[31m /[0m�Parse failed�FAILED 00:01 122m�»
12:19 Ven https://rt.perl.org/Public​/Bug/Display.html?id=77786 seems that is (at least) fixed ?
12:20 moritz yes, can be fixed with unit tests
12:21 Ven Ohhh, now I get a bunch of nullchars on perl6.org. Progress !
12:21 moritz m: try EVAL q[/:/]; say $!.perl
12:21 camelia rakudo-moar 921615: OUTPUT«X::Syntax::Regex::Unre​cognizedMetachar.new(metachar => ":", filename => "eval_0", line => 1, column => Any, modules => Array.new(), is-compile-time => 1, pre => "/:", post => "/", highexpect => Array.new("statement list", "prefix or term", "prefix or meta-…»
12:23 dalek star: db23938 | moritz++ | docs/announce/2014.04:
12:23 dalek star: Draft release announcement 2014.04
12:23 dalek star: review: https://github.com/rakudo/star/commit/db23938695
12:26 moritz does anybody know the package name of the openjdk 7 JDK on RedHat/Fedora/CentOS?
12:29 dalek star: 6abe271 | moritz++ | / (2 files):
12:29 dalek star: udpate README, and version in Makefile.in
12:29 dalek star:
12:29 dalek star: README is still not quite tristar ready
12:29 dalek star: review: https://github.com/rakudo/star/commit/6abe2713be
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12:42 dalek star: 4d33dbc | moritz++ | Configure.pl:
12:42 dalek star: [Configure.pl] support --backends=all
12:42 dalek star: review: https://github.com/rakudo/star/commit/4d33dbcf8c
12:43 Ven r: my %h = a => 1; say %h{a};
12:44 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 921615: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m Error while compiling /tmp/tmpfileâ�¤Undeclared routine:â�¤    a used at line 1â�¤â�¤Â»
12:44 Ven oh, perl5
12:44 moritz Ven: use %h<a> to get automatic quoting
12:45 Ven moritz: No no, I was just weirded out from a change then I realized it was  Configure.pl and it was perl5
12:45 moritz R*'s --gen-moar doesn't seem to work
12:46 moritz ah no, I forgot to specify --gen-moar
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12:49 dalek roast: 195d9c0 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S17-concurrency/supply.t:
12:49 dalek roast: Fudge Supply.merge test for JVM also
12:49 dalek roast:
12:49 dalek roast: So at least we know the problem is in rakudo, not in the VM (most likely)
12:49 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/195d9c0dec
12:51 treehug88 joined #perl6
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12:55 dalek rakudo/nom: 1b47edb | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | src/core/Supply.pm:
12:55 dalek rakudo/nom: Don't hide problems in Supply.mergs -> more handling
12:55 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/1b47edb602
12:56 xenoterracide does p6 have any kind of "namespace" support? I don't think that it does...
12:57 xenoterracide r: module Foo; class Bar { }
12:57 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 921615: ( no output )
12:57 xenoterracide not sure that that would actually be DWIM
12:58 mtj_ joined #perl6
12:58 lizmat r: package Zop {}; grammar DonkeyKong {}
12:58 Ven m: module Foo { our $bar = 1; }
12:58 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 921615: ( no output )
12:58 camelia rakudo-moar 921615: ( no output )
12:58 Ven m: module Foo { our $bar = 1; }; say Foo::$bar;
12:58 camelia rakudo-moar 921615: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m Error while compiling /tmp/3KPyYnh5wiâ�¤Two terms in a rowâ�¤at /tmp/3KPyYnh5wi:1â�¤------> [32mmodule Foo { our $bar = 1; }; say Foo::[33mâ��[31m$bar;[0mâ�¤    expecting any of:â�¤        postfixâ�¤        infix stopper…»
12:58 jnthn Wants to be $Foo::bar
12:58 Ven m: module Foo { our $bar = 1; }; say $Foo::bar;
12:58 camelia rakudo-moar 921615: OUTPUT«1␤»
12:59 * Ven kinda guessed so, but wasn't sure
12:59 lizmat jnthn: when using the EnumMap variant of "on"
12:59 lizmat we somehow lose the supply being passed to the "more" code
12:59 lizmat resulting in this:
12:59 lizmat https://gist.github.com/lizmat/11042880
12:59 jnthn lizmat: On JVM and Moar, or just on Moar?
13:00 lizmat apparently on both, since the same test hangs on the JVM, as masak found out
13:00 jnthn ah
13:00 lizmat the CATCH was hiding the problem, which is another issue we need to think about, I guess
13:03 LLamaRider joined #perl6
13:03 * Ven somehow got on a oct2000 perl6 thread
13:03 lizmat jnthn: feels a bit like an over-eager optimization to me
13:04 jnthn lizmat: Not sure how, in so far as the CATCH appears to propagate the error...
13:04 jnthn lizmat: Optimization at what level?
13:04 lizmat rakudo level
13:05 lizmat wrt to the CATCH: without  https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/1b47edb602
13:05 lizmat you don't see the problem at *all*
13:05 lizmat which caused me quite some headbanging in the past days :-(
13:05 xenoterracide r: module LM::Model; class Activity is export { }
13:05 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 921615: ( no output )
13:07 jnthn lizmat: The problem isn't there. The problem is that whatever subscribed to the supply doesn't throw.
13:07 jnthn uh, tapped it, even.
13:08 jnthn Supply.tap, in the absence of a "quit" handler, should probably add a default one that dies with anything it receives.
13:09 jnthn lizmat: I mean in Supply.pm, around line 21
13:09 jnthn method tap(&more, :&done, :&quit) {
13:09 jnthn Could be more like
13:09 jnthn method tap(&more, :&done, :&quit = { die $_ }) {
13:10 Ven m: sub foo(&bar) { bar?() }; foo(-> {say 'a'})
13:10 camelia rakudo-moar 921615: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m Error while compiling /tmp/9KT04iri12â�¤Two terms in a rowâ�¤at /tmp/9KT04iri12:1â�¤------> [32msub foo(&bar) { bar[33mâ��[31m?() }; foo(-> {say 'a'})[0mâ�¤    expecting any of:â�¤        argument listâ�¤        postfix…»
13:10 lizmat trying that
13:11 moritz why not &quite = &die ?
13:11 jnthn lizmat: Not sure if it'll work right off, but I think we want to have a general fix for not dropping errors on the floor.
13:11 jnthn moritz: uh, 'cus i didn't think of it :)
13:11 jnthn moritz: That's better :)
13:13 lizmat Type check failed in binding &quit; expected 'Callable' but got 'Sub+{<anon>}'
13:13 lizmat guess not better :-(
13:14 jnthn wtf...
13:14 lizmat r: my &foo = &die
13:15 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 921615: OUTPUT«Type check failed in assignment to '&foo'; expected 'Callable' but got 'Sub+{<anon>}'␤  in block  at /tmp/tmpfile:1␤␤»
13:15 lizmat seems pretty consistent  :-)
13:16 lizmat wouldn't :&quit = {.throw} be better ?
13:16 jnthn Wouldn't work on a string error, is all
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13:16 moritz the +{<anon>} likely comes from the is hidden_from_backtrace
13:17 moritz but it shouldn't type-check fail
13:17 lizmat r: sub a is hidden_from_backtrace {}; my &b = &a
13:17 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 921615: ( no output )
13:24 dalek rakudo/nom: 2180049 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | src/core/Supply.pm:
13:24 dalek rakudo/nom: Properly throw exceptions in taps
13:24 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/21800496f2
13:26 dalek roast: 20aa4f3 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S17-concurrency/supply.t:
13:26 dalek roast: Better guard supply tests against hangs
13:26 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/20aa4f38a8
13:31 lizmat jnthn: fwiw, I'm at a loss to fix the "on" EnumMap case problem, so would appreciate any feedback  :-)
13:33 jnthn lizmat: I don't immediately see what's going on either
13:34 jnthn lizmat: I'll have to dig a bit deeper
13:36 lizmat ok, I'll focus on getting other Supply methods working
13:38 jnthn OK, great. I'm currently taking a look at timers, and getting rid of the last JVM-specific bits in ThreadPoolScheduler.
13:40 lizmat timers would be cool  :-)
13:40 jnthn Yeah. Doing the nqp:: abstraction stuff first.
13:40 jnthn And then will look at the Moar impl.
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13:48 lizmat r: Exception.die
13:48 camelia rakudo-jvm 1b47ed: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
13:48 camelia ..rakudo-{parrot,moar} 1b47ed: OUTPUT«No such method 'die' for invocant of type 'Exception'␤  in block  at /tmp/tmpfile:1␤␤»
13:49 lizmat jnthn: any objections on adding a "method die { die(self) }" to src/core/Exception ?
13:50 btyler joined #perl6
13:53 jnthn lizmat: There's already a .throw?
13:53 lizmat jnthn: another datapoint: changed signature from "sub ($val) {...}" to -> ($val) {...}, gives:
13:53 anaeem1_ joined #perl6
13:53 lizmat Not enough positional parameters passed; got 0 but expected 1 in sub-signature
13:53 lizmat (https://gist.github.com/lizmat/11042880)
13:54 jnthn lizmat: Uh, why the parens?
13:54 lizmat ah, copy pasto
13:55 jnthn :)
13:55 FROGGS[mobile] joined #perl6
13:55 jnthn The "in sub-signature" was probably the best clue :)
13:55 lizmat There's an Exception.throw, if that is what you meant
13:56 lizmat changing it to -> $var gives the same error  :-)
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14:06 dalek rakudo/nom: 99ff702 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | src/core/Exception.pm:
14:06 dalek rakudo/nom: Implement Exception.die for convenience in handlers
14:06 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/99ff702ba7
14:08 jnthn lizmat: scheduler.t doesn't seem to compile?
14:08 jnthn Two terms in a row
14:08 jnthn at t\spec\S17-concurrency\scheduler.t:103
14:08 jnthn Near some cas thingy?
14:09 lizmat ah, those tests are skipped now, right?
14:09 lizmat so I didn't see any errors...  lemme check
14:09 jnthn They're skipped on Moar.
14:10 jnthn JVM doesn't have any skips in there
14:10 jnthn Anyway, it's certainly a syntax error
14:10 jnthn I guess missing semi?
14:11 dalek roast: 6a7443a | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S17-concurrency/scheduler.t:
14:11 dalek roast: Fix compilation typo
14:11 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/6a7443a9be
14:11 lizmat should compile now
14:14 FROGGS_ r: say nqp::p6box_s(nqp::decode(Buf.new(0x03, 0x26), "utf16"))
14:14 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 1b47ed: OUTPUT«☃␤»
14:14 jnthn It does, though fails
14:14 jnthn #      got: '1scatch2s'
14:14 jnthn # expected: '1s1scatch2s'
14:15 lizmat hmmm...
14:15 jnthn Lemme check it' snot my changes though
14:16 FROGGS_ jnthn: I updated https://gist.github.com/FR​OGGS/0ea5537eb675588baaa2 (MIME::Base64 passes now on jvm too)
14:16 lizmat looks to me like the "more" is not done in the "die" case
14:17 lizmat scratch that
14:18 lizmat looks like the die is preventing the cas from completion ?
14:18 jnthn yeah, I got something wrong...
14:18 jnthn lizmat: of course it will
14:18 timotimo do we package perl6/docs within star, btw?
14:19 jnthn lizmat: The die happens while computing the new value to cas
14:19 jnthn The die should be outside of the block passed to cas, as a statement after it, I think?
14:19 jnthn { cas $tracker, {$_ ~ '1s'; die } },
14:19 jnthn should be
14:19 jnthn { cas $tracker, {$_ ~ '1s' }; die },
14:20 lizmat yup, indeed
14:20 lizmat will fix
14:20 jnthn My second fail looks like a thinko in my changes to use nqp::timer
14:21 dalek roast: 0f2e91b | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S17-concurrency/scheduler.t:
14:21 dalek roast: Fix thinko, spotted by jnthn++
14:21 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/0f2e91b8d9
14:29 jnthn lizmat: That helps, but now I get:
14:29 jnthn not ok 24 - Cue on ThreadPoolScheduler with :times(10)
14:30 jnthn r: my $tracker; say $tracker.succ
14:30 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 1b47ed: OUTPUT«No such method 'succ' for invocant of type 'Any'␤  in block  at /tmp/tmpfile:1␤␤»
14:30 jnthn ah
14:31 dalek nqp/asyncops: d958b6b | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/QAST/Compiler.nqp:
14:31 dalek nqp/asyncops: Stub in timer and cancel ops on JVM backend.
14:31 dalek nqp/asyncops: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/d958b6b29e
14:31 dalek nqp/asyncops: 3b3ccda | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/runtime/ (2 files):
14:31 dalek nqp/asyncops: Partially implement nqp::timer.
14:31 dalek nqp/asyncops:
14:31 dalek nqp/asyncops: Missing cancellation-related bits so far.
14:31 dalek nqp/asyncops: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/3b3ccda971
14:32 dalek roast: 83438f8 | jnthn++ | S17-concurrency/scheduler.t:
14:32 dalek roast: Correct :times test to initialize $tracker.
14:32 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/83438f800a
14:32 lizmat jnthn++
14:33 dalek rakudo/async: a71eccd | jnthn++ | src/core/ThreadPoolScheduler.pm:
14:33 dalek rakudo/async: Switch ThreadPoolScheduler to use nqp::timer op.
14:33 dalek rakudo/async: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/a71eccdda1
14:33 jnthn That now fully passes scheduler.t on JVM.
14:33 anaeem1 joined #perl6
14:34 lizmat cool!
14:34 jnthn (And breaks Moar build for now, which is why it's in a branch.)
14:41 dalek rakudo/nom: 3922904 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | src/core/SupplyOperations.pm:
14:41 dalek rakudo/nom: Remove unneeded lexicals
14:41 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/39229049b2
14:42 anaeem1 joined #perl6
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15:05 hoelzro joined #perl6
15:05 hoelzro ahoy #perl6!
15:06 vendethiel o/ hoelzro
15:08 kaare__ joined #perl6
15:12 lizmat hoelzro, vendethiel  o/
15:18 [Coke] masak: (S17-concurrency) this test was hanging on the daily runs occasionally, yes.
15:19 hoelzro jnthn: are you around?
15:19 hoelzro I have some questions about your FOSDEM talk that I forgot to ask when I was UTC+1
15:21 FROGGS_ masak: it looks like test 15 hangs
15:21 dalek roast: 76dc363 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S17-concurrency/supply.t:
15:21 dalek roast: Use slightly more sensible variable names
15:21 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/76dc363a48
15:21 lizmat FROGGS_: S17 tests should not hang anymore: fail maybe, but not hang
15:22 FROGGS_ ahh, cool
15:22 FROGGS_ then I need to pull/rebuild
15:23 lizmat if a test fails because things that are being expected do not arrive, it should now wait at most 5 seconds
15:24 [Coke] lizmat: yay.
15:25 lizmat please let me know if I missed any hangs  :-)
15:25 [Coke] today's run is already running, we'll know tomorrowish.
15:26 [Coke] (I am adding in the ulimit timer now, will try another run sooner, actually)
15:26 jnthn hoelzro: Am now.
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15:34 hoelzro excellent =)
15:35 hoelzro so there's this syntax:
15:35 hoelzro method !calculate(YearlyStatistics: &thing-to-do)
15:35 hoelzro what's the colon mean there?
15:35 hoelzro oh
15:35 jnthn Invocant.
15:35 hoelzro or is it just calculate(YS :&thing-to-do)?
15:35 hoelzro hmm
15:36 jnthn No, it's for some reason specifying the invocant type explicitly.
15:36 hoelzro so if you specify the invocant, you don't need to specify the name, then?
15:36 jnthn No
15:36 hoelzro interesting
15:36 jnthn Well, same for any param really
15:36 jnthn r: sub foo(Int) { }; foo(42)
15:36 camelia rakudo-jvm 99ff70: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
15:36 camelia ..rakudo-{parrot,moar} 99ff70: ( no output )
15:37 hoelzro then there was this bit in the Grammar/actions
15:37 hoelzro $<observation>.map(*.ast).grep(*.value.none <= -99)
15:37 hoelzro that wildcard expr is awesome, but I couldn't figure out where none is coming from
15:38 jnthn Any
15:38 jnthn It's the method form of the none(...) sub
15:38 jnthn which constructs a junction.
15:38 hoelzro oooooohhhhh
15:38 hoelzro I see
15:38 hoelzro thanks =)
15:38 jnthn np :)
15:42 timotimo i could have answered all those questions :P
15:42 raiph m: say "hello world" #6now #helloworld (please ignore; I'm just cooking something up)
15:42 camelia rakudo-moar 99ff70: OUTPUT«hello world␤»
15:43 raiph http://irclog.perlgeek.de/​perl6/2014-04-18#i_8607530 #6now
15:44 timotimo you're tweeting everything with that hashtag automatically from the irclog? :)
15:44 timotimo and that hashtag is not yet taken for anything else?
15:49 timotimo 654s for moar
15:50 jnthn timotimo: To do what? :)
15:50 dalek perl6-examples: 4ac6dea | (Shlomi Fish)++ | euler/prob168-shlomif.p6:
15:50 dalek perl6-examples: [Euler] Add solution for #168.
15:50 dalek perl6-examples: review: https://github.com/perl6/perl​6-examples/commit/4ac6dea472
15:56 raiph timotimo: Tweeting is only a minor part (and my thinking is there'll be nothing automatic in that regard unless the exact right incantation comes from the TimToady nick). I'll explain what I'm thinking in a while.
15:57 [Coke] print "asdf\n" is better said as say "asdf" ^^
16:01 vendethiel r: 5.none
16:02 camelia rakudo-jvm 392290: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
16:02 camelia ..rakudo-{parrot,moar} 392290: ( no output )
16:02 vendethiel m: (5).none == 3
16:02 camelia rakudo-moar 392290: ( no output )
16:02 vendethiel m: say (5).none == 3
16:02 camelia rakudo-moar 392290: OUTPUT«none(False)␤»
16:02 vendethiel m: say (5).any == 3
16:02 camelia rakudo-moar 392290: OUTPUT«any(False)␤»
16:07 timotimo 965 for parrot
16:07 timotimo jnthn: a highly randomness-dependent benchmark
16:19 moritz Testing modules/zavolaj...
16:19 moritz t/01-argless.t ......... /bin/sh: 1: PREFIX: not found
16:19 moritz (in star 'make module-test')
16:19 moritz the tests pass anyway
16:22 retupmoca m: say $*VM<config><ldflags> # pretty sure this is where that comes from
16:22 camelia rakudo-moar 392290: OUTPUT« -O1 -DNDEBUG -Wl,-rpath,$(PREFIX)/lib␤»
16:24 FROGGS_ yes
16:24 FROGGS_ I thought I fixed that though...
16:29 moritz the LWP::Simple tests fail on the JVM
16:29 moritz java.lang.NullPointerException in sub scheme_port at /home/moritz/p6/star/rakudo-star-2014.04/inst​all/languages/perl6/lib/URI/DefaultPort.pm:32
16:30 FROGGS_ moritz: here is the test out: https://gist.github.com/FR​OGGS/0ea5537eb675588baaa2
16:31 FROGGS_ (stripped down to failures)
16:32 moritz why the heck do the DBIish mock tests fail on the JVM, when they are the ones that should be most platform independent?
16:33 retupmoca moritz: none of the other tests actually run unless you have the right environment set up for them
16:33 retupmoca moritz: otherwise they just skip(), iirc
16:35 moritz retupmoca: ah, fair point
16:42 dalek star: a6cac5b | moritz++ | tools/build/modules-test.pl:
16:42 dalek star: Include $perl6 in testing output
16:42 dalek star: review: https://github.com/rakudo/star/commit/a6cac5b692
16:43 FROGGS_ moritz / retupmoca: the warnings about PREFIX are gone now
16:43 retupmoca FROGGS++
16:43 moritz FROGGS_: what did you patch?
16:43 FROGGS_ see #moarvm
16:44 moritz ah, so in the next release
16:44 FROGGS_ we need to bump revisions though
16:44 FROGGS_ yes
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16:52 timotimo that benchmark i had used was the rosettacode task "Brownian Tree", btw
16:53 timotimo i would have liked it to be much faster, but whatevs :)
16:54 TimToady it would seem like a random walk algorithm would not be sufficiently predictable to serve as a decent benchmark, but maybe with enough points...
16:56 moritz or with fixed srand()
16:58 xenoterracide__ joined #perl6
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17:08 timotimo that's right. though, if moar was 10x faster than rakudo, it'd still be visible :P
17:08 Mouq joined #perl6
17:08 timotimo or 100x
17:08 timotimo er, faster than parrot i meant
17:09 timotimo well, i did turn off spesh, because locally i have the not-yet-functional named-to-positional branch
17:10 Mouq is this R* realease going to include all the backends? :#
17:10 Mouq :3
17:11 vendethiel .u ☃
17:11 yoleaux U+2603 SNOWMAN [So] (☃)
17:11 FROGGS_ Mouq: it will be more likely be r-p* and r-m*
17:12 Mouq FROGGS_: Sweeeeet :) What's wrong with r-j*?
17:16 anaeem1 joined #perl6
17:17 FROGGS_ Mouq: see https://gist.github.com/FR​OGGS/0ea5537eb675588baaa2
17:19 Mouq FROGGS_: I see :| Thanks!
17:22 arturo joined #perl6
17:24 arturo hello #perl6. I was wondering, how does one become a perl6 rakudo contributor? As in, someone who works on implementing the rakudo itself?
17:27 jnthn arturo: Find something interesting (to you) to work on - probably something smallish at first. And then dig in, ask questions, etc. The compiler tools and overall internals can be learned through the course material at https://github.com/edumentab/r​akudo-and-nqp-internals-course
17:29 anaeem1 joined #perl6
17:33 lizmat then fork rakudo and create pull requests, right?
17:34 jnthn Right. :)
17:34 arturo jhthn: Thanks! Is there a developer guide or "getting started" document?
17:35 xinming joined #perl6
17:36 lizmat jnthn: ^^^  :-)
17:37 jnthn arturo: Well, the course I linked to is by far the best set of documentation on how stuff works.
17:37 jnthn arturo: It was created explicitly to help people get into working on Rakudo.
17:38 timotimo oh
17:38 xenoterracide__ joined #perl6
17:39 timotimo we neglected to mention that there's also good performance improvements on non-moarvm rakudos in this release
17:39 jnthn timotimo: Well, can mention it in the Star announce :)
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17:41 timotimo aye
17:44 arturo jhthn: I didn't notice it was a course. Thanks so much, I'll take a look and get involved.
17:45 lizmat arturo welcome!
17:46 lizmat arturo: it's jnthn , not jhthn by the way  :-)
17:46 arturo lizmat: I know, I typed too fast :-P
17:46 lizmat helps getting someone's attention if you spell the name right
17:46 lizmat most IRC clients have auto-completion on names
17:46 lizmat jn<TAB> is usually enough
17:47 arturo lizmat: cool! This is my first time using IRC, tab expansions is definitely helpful.
17:47 arturo expansion*
17:49 vincent21 joined #perl6
17:56 Mouq arturo: Welcome :) Something that helped me when I first joined was watching commits flow and trying to understand what they did and how
17:56 Mouq I don't know if that's helpful anyone besides myself
17:57 Mouq (a simple one: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/99ff702 )
17:58 FROGGS_ also it might be easier for some ppl to start by fixing bugs, that is by looking at rt.perl.org
17:58 FROGGS_ others might want to implement something, these could make use of https://github.com/rakudo/r​akudo/blob/nom/docs/ROADMAP
17:59 raiph joined #perl6
17:59 raiph timotimo: https://questhub.io/realm/perl/​quest/53516384bbd0beef19000022
18:04 Rotwang joined #perl6
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18:18 timotimo mhm mhm
18:23 lizmat guten Appetit!
18:33 cognominal G grand a petit
18:33 treehug88 joined #perl6
18:34 treehug88 joined #perl6
18:39 vendethiel what
18:39 arturo Mouq: thanks, thats a good idea. I'll keep an eye on those
18:42 vincent21 joined #perl6
18:43 raiph timotimo: I'm not sure if it's obvious to others based on my notes in that quest, but my intent is that these one liners serve many purposes: becoming a complement to roast; being a pedagogy DB; being a FAQ DB; being a source for the one liner videos if you/someone wants to do them; for attracting folk to #perl6 now via twitter; and more
18:45 cognominal a data point: when bzip2-ed  the moar core setting drops from ~10MB to ~1.5MB
18:47 timotimo aye
18:50 * TimToady blames all the inlining, or maybe Unicode, or maybe something else :)
18:50 dalek rakudo/nom: 9ce36b9 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | src/core/Supply (2 files):
18:50 dalek rakudo/nom: Implement Supply.uniq
18:50 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/9ce36b9461
18:50 btyler I know folks here have generally enjoyed SpaceX streams -- there's a launch going off in 35 minutes
18:50 dalek roast: 647d15e | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S17-concurrency/supply.t:
18:50 dalek roast: Reorganize tests, add tests for Supply.uniq
18:50 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/647d15efd2
18:52 raiph timotimo: was that aye addressed to cognominal++ or me? if me, are you saying the five purposes all made good sense to you?
18:52 dalek rakudo/nom: 647a777 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | docs/ChangeLog:
18:52 dalek rakudo/nom: Update ChangeLog
18:52 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/647a77749d
18:53 cognominal ralph, I like the idea of a Perl 6 twitter feed composed of oneliners.
18:55 TimToady well, tweets don't have to be one line
18:56 raiph what about being a complement to roast?
18:56 cognominal on the other hand, some very short tweets can be explained in one tweet.
18:57 raiph one of the ideas is that the tweet links back to the irclog
18:57 raiph and on channel context and discussion explains the tweet
18:57 raiph and/or a short khan academy like video explains it
18:58 timotimo raiph: applicable to both :)
18:59 raiph i've written up a quest that tries to explain how easily we could do this and how many things we could get out of it
18:59 raiph https://questhub.io/realm/perl/​quest/53516384bbd0beef19000022
19:02 tadzik oh-oh, https://github.com/hoelzro/sahara-sync
19:04 raiph cognominal, timotimo: as TimToady notes this isn't really just about one liners either (our evalbots take gists, tweets can link)
19:04 timotimo right
19:04 timotimo and my videos can have more stuff than just a single line in them :)
19:04 raiph right
19:05 raiph a key thing is it's initially just some simple conventions for comments so we could start doing it today
19:06 hoelzro tadzik: ?
19:06 tadzik hoelzro: I like that :)
19:06 hoelzro thanks =)
19:07 hoelzro I was thinking about it today, and I had some pretty good ideas
19:07 hoelzro too bad I stopped working on it when I moved to Europe =/
19:07 lizmat now you're back in the US, do you have time for it now ?
19:07 dalek Perlito: f4c2b3e | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | src5/lib/Perlito5/Grammar/Regex5.pm:
19:07 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - Perlito5::Grammar::Regex5 more details
19:07 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/​Perlito/commit/f4c2b3e73c
19:09 raiph i have to run for an hour or three but I'd really appreciate knowing that at least two folk have read ALL of my quest -- it's not really that long or complicated -- *especially* if one of them were TimToady and he gave it his blessing and/or commented on it.
19:09 hoelzro lizmat: it wasn't a time thing in NL; it was a lack of need for it
19:09 hoelzro I only had my own laptop, so I had nothing to sync
19:09 hoelzro now I have 2 laptops and a desktop =/
19:10 hoelzro so I *do* have need for it now
19:10 hoelzro so I'm considering reviving it
19:10 lizmat hehe... ok
19:10 lizmat seems the world could be ready for it
19:10 timotimo hoelzro: will you work on the kate syntax highlighter first? :3
19:10 hoelzro hahahaha
19:10 hoelzro timotimo: yes
19:10 timotimo yay
19:10 hoelzro SS will be a huge time sink
19:10 hoelzro pun intended ;)
19:11 timotimo i'ven't done anything new with regards to qtcreator in the mean time :\
19:11 hoelzro that's cool; otherwise I'd feel guilty
19:11 timotimo it's just such a huge blob of work and i don't know where to grab it and i get discouraged
19:11 hoelzro I just rebuilt my machine last night
19:11 timotimo my desktop is due for a system re-install, too :|
19:11 hoelzro and I've been taking classes and playing Dragon's Crown/Rogue Legacy
19:11 hoelzro but I've beaten both of them now, so I should have time =)
19:12 timotimo haha, at first i read that as "taking classes on playing" :D
19:12 hoelzro hahaha
19:13 Mouq raiph++ :)
19:20 lizmat T minus 5
19:20 nwc10 T-5 minutes: http://www.spacex.com/webcast/
19:25 lizmat T minus 30 secs
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19:39 dalek Perlito: 3eecee9 | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | src5/lib/Perlito5/Grammar/Regex5.pm:
19:39 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - Perlito5::Grammar::Regex5 more details
19:39 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/​Perlito/commit/3eecee9ed1
19:40 kivutar joined #perl6
19:45 gaussblurinc_ joined #perl6
19:45 gaussblurinc_ hi! does perl 6 have stable version now?
19:45 gaussblurinc_ I want to write grammar parser with it
19:46 lizmat that should probably work  :-)
19:46 timotimo except for occasional bugs and a small amount of not yet implemented little things, you can already use rakudo
19:46 FROGGS_ gaussblurinc_: yes, it should work very well for that kind of thing
19:47 Mouq gaussblurinc_: Perl 6 grammars and regexes are very stable. Especially considering that Rakudo Perl 6 uses a Perl 6 grammar to parse Perl 6 programs
19:47 tadzik parsers are pretty well battle-tested
19:47 FROGGS_ there are parsers for Perl5, C99, JSON, XML, YAML and some more things already
19:47 jnthn Aye, grammars are one of the really stable bits in so far as little changes there any more, and we ue the same engine to parse Perl 6 programs also. :)
19:47 timotimo but the yaml parser doesn't run its tests because testml isn't working :P
19:47 jnthn *se
19:47 Mouq FROGGS_: No YAML Parser actually :(
19:47 FROGGS_ ewww :/
19:47 jnthn *use
19:48 FROGGS_ Mouq: ohh, okay
19:48 Mouq FROGGS_: Just a YAML Dumper
19:48 FROGGS_ k
19:48 _sri maybe you shouldn't oversell rakudo all the time, people will only end up disappointed
19:48 FROGGS_ _sri: did we?
19:49 gaussblurinc_ great one! and how about core modules like File::* ? They are good enough?
19:49 _sri can something be stable if you don't have any guaranteed backwards compatibility?
19:49 * vendethiel just sells perl6 to people, rakudo just happens to be here
19:49 _sri imo it's better to undersell and overdeliver
19:49 FROGGS_ _sri: just read what timotimo and jnthn said
19:50 FROGGS_ gaussblurinc_: stuff like File::Spec is built into the language... what else do you need?
19:50 FROGGS_ (and File::Slurp also fwiw)
19:50 tadzik gaussblurinc_: well, some of them work, some apparently have test failures
19:50 tadzik so: it varies
19:50 gaussblurinc_ File::Find
19:51 FROGGS_ File::Find is there in the ecosystem (modules.perl6.org)
19:51 _sri FROGGS: most people consider stable = i can bet my business on it, not stable = lots of stuff kinda works
19:51 FROGGS_ though, it is kinda slow I think
19:51 Mouq _sri: NQP's bootstrapping guarantees backwards compatibility pretty strongly :P
19:51 FROGGS_ _sri: that is what we said. there are bugs and NYI's but grammars work fine
19:52 FROGGS_ so one can judge on its own if that is enough or not
19:52 dalek rakudo-star-daily: 0c509c8 | coke++ | log/ (5 files):
19:52 dalek rakudo-star-daily: today (automated commit)
19:52 dalek rakudo-star-daily: review: https://github.com/coke/rakudo​-star-daily/commit/0c509c8fd9
19:52 timotimo Mouq: no, it does not. we sometimes do update the stage0s
19:52 FROGGS_ because there is no true answer when you do not really know what it the problem to solve
19:53 Mouq timotimo: I was being a little hyperbolic, but it still really disincentivizes breaking changes to grammars
19:54 lizmat regarding backwards compatibiity: we heve several "is DEPRECATED"| features already
19:54 lizmat and you can mark your own:
19:54 FROGGS_ heck, Perl 5 does not "guarantee" backwards compat to 100% there is a deprecation cycle (like for given/when)... but of course the deprecation cycle is shorter because the language itself is younger
19:54 FROGGS_ but this will grow and grow longer
19:54 lizmat r: sub a is DEPRECATED { say "foo" }; a
19:55 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 647a77: OUTPUT«foo␤Saw 1 call to deprecated code during execution.␤=====================================​===========================================␤Sub a (from GLOBAL) called at:␤  /tmp/tmpfile, line 1␤Please use something else instead.␤---------…»
19:55 timotimo that wouldn't catch semantic changes to rules, for example
19:55 _sri suggestion: adopt stability levels for features like node.js that are pointed out in documentation http://nodejs.org/api/http.html#http_http
19:55 lizmat r: sub a is DEPRECATED("b") { say "foo" }; a
19:55 timotimo which is the hardest piece to guard against
19:55 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 647a77: OUTPUT«foo␤Saw 1 call to deprecated code during execution.␤=====================================​===========================================␤Sub a (from GLOBAL) called at:␤  /tmp/tmpfile, line 1␤Please use b instead.␤----------------------…»
19:55 timotimo and we still have things that make you think a bit about the structure of your stuff
19:55 timotimo like recently we chagned that private attributes from inside roles get visible to the classes that the roles are applied to
19:56 FROGGS_ _sri: that is an excellent idea
19:56 lizmat let me just say that in Perl 6, we already anticipated changes to be made in the future
19:56 tadzik OOOH
19:56 tadzik did we finally?
19:56 timotimo tadzik: i think so
19:56 timotimo or something in that direction anyway
19:56 tadzik there is this refactoring of sets/bags that I started back on gpw 2012 or so
19:56 lizmat tadzik: only one level
19:57 tadzik probably someone else did it already though
19:57 FROGGS_ _sri: in fact we should mark all sections of the spec that way... @TimToady: do you agree? (because it might be your job then :O)
19:57 lizmat colomon did niecza, I did rakudo mostly
19:57 FROGGS_ err, :P even
19:57 * sjn wouldn't mind having made "is DEPRECATED" and such into a generic code annotation tool
19:57 timotimo r: role attrd { has $!foo }; class foo is attrd { method test { say $!foo } }; foo.new.test
19:57 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 647a77: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m Error while compiling /tmp/tmpfileâ�¤Attribute $!foo not declared in class fooâ�¤at /tmp/tmpfile:1â�¤------> [32mo is attrd { method test { say $!foo } }[33mâ��[31m; foo.new.test[0mâ�¤    expecting any of:â�¤â€¦Â»
19:57 timotimo i'm obviously wrong
19:57 btyler can "is DEPRECATED" point to the suggested newer alternative?
19:57 lizmat s/is/does ?
19:58 lizmat r: sub a is DEPRECATED("a NEWER alternative") { say "foo" }; a
19:58 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 647a77: OUTPUT«foo␤Saw 1 call to deprecated code during execution.␤=====================================​===========================================␤Sub a (from GLOBAL) called at:␤  /tmp/tmpfile, line 1␤Please use a NEWER alternative instead.␤----…»
19:58 tadzik sad panda
19:58 lizmat btyler: yes
19:58 retupmoca r: role attrd { has $!foo }; class foo does attrd { method test { say $!foo } }; foo.new.test
19:59 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 647a77: OUTPUT«(Any)␤»
19:59 sjn is FEATURE_FROM_VERSION("1.0")
19:59 FROGGS_ Mouq / lue: do we have background colouring in Pod? like in the spec pages?
20:00 jnthn sjn: They're just traits; you can define your own
20:00 sjn jnthn: yeah, I know
20:00 jnthn ah, k :)
20:00 sjn jnthn: I'm just contemplating if there's a generic code annotation feature hidden in there somewhere :)
20:00 gaussblurinc_ thanks for help, guys! good evening!
20:01 sjn that one could query
20:01 FROGGS_ o/
20:01 sjn or attach callbacks to
20:01 lue FROGGS_: the doc pages have it, but perlcabal.org/syn has yet to get the better stylesheet
20:01 lizmat in any case,I would like to point out that is DEPRECATED tells you *where* the deprecated code is called
20:01 tadzik sjn: maybe that can be done with #= somehow
20:01 FROGGS_ sjn: there is nothing specced/implemented like that yet
20:01 lizmat and what you should use instead
20:01 lizmat r: "foo".ucfirst.say
20:01 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 647a77: OUTPUT«Foo␤Saw 1 call to deprecated code during execution.␤======================================​==========================================␤Method ucfirst (from Cool) called at:␤  /tmp/tmpfile, line 1␤Please use 'tc' instead.␤------------…»
20:02 FROGGS_ lue: and so we can have sections in Pod like "stable"/"somethinginbetween"/"slushy" and "draft", which we can render then differently?
20:03 lue FROGGS_: there's nothing programmatically distinguishing things of various stableness, and I doubt anyone wants to try :)
20:04 timotimo retupmoca: thanks! i made a dumb mistake :)
20:04 FROGGS_ lue: no, I am more thinking of wrapping sections of Pod into some kind of layer, that gets the property (==CSS class) "stable" then
20:04 timotimo tadzik: no reason to be sad panda!
20:05 lizmat r: my $b = KeyBag.new; say $b
20:05 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 647a77: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m Error while compiling /tmp/tmpfileâ�¤Undeclared name:â�¤    KeyBag used at line 1â�¤â�¤Â»
20:05 lizmat hmmmm...
20:05 lue You'll have to see Pod::To::HTML about that. I know it at least does =Image and some generic <div> construct, but that's all I know.
20:06 FROGGS_ lue: kthx
20:06 lizmat r: my $b = <a b b c>.KeyBag; say $b
20:06 camelia rakudo-jvm 647a77: OUTPUT«BagHash.new(b(2), a, c)␤Saw 1 call to deprecated code during execution.␤======================================​==========================================␤Method KeyBag (from Any) called at:␤  /tmp/tmpfile, line 1␤Please use 'BagHash' instead.␤---…»
20:06 camelia ..rakudo-{parrot,moar} 647a77: OUTPUT«BagHash.new(a, b(2), c)␤Saw 1 call to deprecated code during execution.␤======================================​==========================================␤Method KeyBag (from Any) called at:␤  /tmp/tmpfile, line 1␤Please use 'BagHash' inst…»
20:06 FROGGS_ I am waiting for TimToady++ for his opinion first
20:08 lue it'd have to be something like =begin Css though, not CSS :)
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20:13 FROGGS_ k
20:14 lue Actually, if you just want to specify a rule for a stylesheet, some sort of :class<> attribute would work better.
20:15 gaussblurinc_ joined #perl6
20:16 lue Which AFAICT Pod::To::HTML supports for =pod but nothing else.
20:34 dalek Perlito: b9c2191 | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | src5/lib/Perlito5/Grammar/Regex5.pm:
20:34 dalek Perlito: Perlito5 - Perlito5::Grammar::Regex5 more details
20:34 dalek Perlito: review: https://github.com/fglock/​Perlito/commit/b9c219132f
20:37 vendethiel joined #perl6
20:39 Mouq FROGGS_: Pod-To-HTML::pod2html has a :head attribute that is used to pass style information
20:40 Mouq FROGGS_: And yeah, =pod supports a :class<> attribute
20:40 Mouq FROGGS_: That's it though
20:40 FROGGS_ atm I'd just add css classes to sections/paragraphs, and the external CSS should then format it nicely
20:40 lue Mouq: O_o why's it called :head?
20:41 FROGGS_ I do not want to embed CSS in Pod, just things that end up being class names
20:42 Mouq lue: as in pod2html $pod, :head(q[<link rel="blabla"/>]), :header(q[<p>An awesome page from my documentation:</p>])
20:42 lue ah, OK.
20:43 Mouq FROGGS_: Note that you can add arbitrary configuration info (like :stability<3>) and have a postprocessor do something with it
20:43 FROGGS_ Mouq: that sounds like the right thing todo :o)
20:44 Mouq It only sounds moderately painful :|
20:44 FROGGS_ we'll see
20:47 Mouq lue: Are there any blocking problems with pod-vvi that we could move the synopses to Pod6?
20:50 lue Mouq: not that I'm aware of. I don't think we need to update branch pod6ify that way though, but let me check
20:52 kivutar joined #perl6
20:55 lue Mouq: I'm in the process of merging right now, if it turns out to be too much of a headache then running pod-vvi on everything again would be the thing to do.
20:57 bluescreen10 joined #perl6
20:57 Mouq lue++
20:58 lizmat fg
20:58 lizmat oops
21:02 lue mergetool + kdiff3 makes this nice to do :)
21:05 lizmat r: sub a (:&b = &[===]) { b.gist.say }; a  # expected something like sub infix:<===>(Any $?, Any $?) { #`(Sub+{<anon>}+{Precedence}|4564337744) ... }
21:05 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 647a77: OUTPUT«True␤»
21:06 btyler lizmat: from earlier - cool! didn't know that about "is DEPRECATED" :)
21:06 dalek nqp/asyncops: 362e7a4 | jnthn++ | src/vm/moar/QAST/QASTOperationsMAST.nqp:
21:06 dalek nqp/asyncops: Map nqp::timer for MoarVM.
21:06 dalek nqp/asyncops: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/362e7a46f2
21:07 lizmat jnthn++
21:08 dalek rakudo/async: 3814ab3 | jnthn++ | src/core/ThreadPoolScheduler.pm:
21:08 dalek rakudo/async: Pass an arg for the async handle to nqp::timer.
21:08 dalek rakudo/async:
21:08 dalek rakudo/async: It's already required on Moar in order to use nqp::timer at all. Will
21:08 dalek rakudo/async: need some JVM work to get this in place also.
21:08 dalek rakudo/async: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/3814ab3346
21:08 lue .oO(This merge is showing how S11 has changed a bunch recently. I hope I don't accidentally leave in old-S11 cruft)
21:11 Mouq r: sub a (:&b = &[===]) { &b.gist.say }; a # FTFY
21:11 camelia rakudo-jvm 647a77: OUTPUT«sub infix:<===>(Any $?, Any $?) { #`(Sub+{<anon>}+{Precedence}|1173705505) ... }␤»
21:11 camelia ..rakudo-moar 647a77: OUTPUT«sub infix:<===>(Any $?, Any $?) { #`(Sub+{<anon>}+{Precedence}|140599306857920) ... }␤»
21:11 camelia ..rakudo-parrot 647a77: OUTPUT«sub infix:<===>(Any $?, Any $?) { #`(Sub+{<anon>}+{Precedence}|7813026685060425491) ... }␤»
21:16 lizmat Mouq: do you have an explanation for the difference?
21:18 Mouq lizmat: b vs &b. b calls &b()
21:18 BenGoldberg joined #perl6
21:20 lizmat ah, duh  :-)
21:24 raiph joined #perl6
21:29 dalek rakudo/nom: 22fbedc | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | src/core/Supply (2 files):
21:29 dalek rakudo/nom: Implement Supply.squish
21:29 dalek rakudo/nom:
21:29 dalek rakudo/nom: Although this does not seem to work without :with parameter: somehow the
21:29 dalek rakudo/nom: default &[===] does *not* get set.  Giving that up for now.
21:29 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/22fbedce3d
21:29 dalek roast: a902f51 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S17-concurrency/supply.t:
21:29 dalek roast: Tests for Supply.squish
21:29 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/a902f51b36
21:29 dalek perl6-roast-data: 5b1b6a5 | coke++ | bin/rakudo. (3 files):
21:29 dalek perl6-roast-data: standardize ulimit for rakudo
21:29 dalek perl6-roast-data: review: https://github.com/coke/perl6​-roast-data/commit/5b1b6a5d2f
21:29 dalek perl6-roast-data: d04eb61 | coke++ | bin/ (2 files):
21:29 dalek perl6-roast-data: no longer need a separate roast dir
21:29 dalek perl6-roast-data: review: https://github.com/coke/perl6​-roast-data/commit/d04eb610da
21:30 lizmat on that note: enough done for today, good *, #perl6!
21:30 FROGGS_ gnight lizmat
21:31 Mouq night lizmat++
21:31 [Coke] ~~
21:32 thou joined #perl6
21:37 jnthn 'night, lizmat++
21:38 [Coke] rakudobrew probably shouldn't be pushing -gen-moar=master, but relying on the last known good version from rakudo.
21:38 [Coke] (didn't actually broke a few weeks ago, yes?)
21:38 tadzik ah, yes
21:39 tadzik fixed
21:39 tadzik [Coke]++
21:41 [Coke] tadzik: rakudobrew list with nothing installed gives you a p5 error.
21:41 tadzik oh :)
21:42 tadzik on it
21:42 [Coke] rehash gives many more.
21:42 tadzik [Coke]: no it doesn't :)
21:42 tadzik git pull?
21:42 tadzik rehash does, yes
21:43 [Coke] killed a moar build so I could get your latest rakudobrew fix. now rakudobrew build moar dies with an error in the build (no clean target)
21:43 [Coke] make: *** No rule to make target `m-clean', needed by `clean'.  Stop.
21:43 [Coke] (I'll just remove moar-HEAD for now)
21:44 [Coke] tadzik: 'list' is still dying for me, tw.
21:44 tadzik (╯‵Д′)╯彡┻━┻
21:44 tadzik the makefiles and clean things are such a mess
21:44 tadzik [Coke]: can you show me? I can't reproduce it
21:45 [Coke] $ rakudobrew list
21:45 [Coke] Use of uninitialized value $cur in string eq at /Users/willcoleda/.rakudobrew/bin/rakudobrew line 33. moar-HEAD
21:45 [Coke] I don't think you pushed
21:46 [Coke] last commit is "arglebargle"
21:46 tadzik nope
21:46 tadzik not yet
21:47 [Coke] btw, tadzik++ for doing this. I am now throwing away my ugly shell script that does something like this.
21:47 tadzik :)
21:47 [Coke] (and nowhere near as well. :)
21:47 tadzik [Coke]: pushed now
21:48 lue I hate how committing a merge assumes you want to go on if you back out of the message-writing step, unlike *every other commit I ever make*. (╯‵Д′)╯彡┻━┻
21:49 ggoebel111111 joined #perl6
21:50 [Coke] yes.
21:50 [Coke] I was bit by that doing some git-svn surgery yesterday!
21:51 [Coke] hurm. the list is now already showing moar-HEAD despite the fact it's not done building yet. :)
21:51 lue Fortunately git commit --amend lets me fix it.
21:51 lue ( I seriously wonder who on the git team thought such inconsistent behavior was a good thing :/ )
21:51 tadzik hehe
21:53 [Coke] arglebargle
21:53 [Coke] moar build still fails on osx with write error - fine when I'm doing it myself, redoing 'make' fixes it. not with rakudobrew...
21:55 FROGGS_ my bet is that it fails when it is invoked as a subprocess that redirects stdout/stderr
21:55 FROGGS_ or so
21:55 dalek Heuristic branch merge: pushed 71 commits to specs/pod6ify by lue
21:56 tadzik [Coke]: ah, that's probably because of realclean :/
21:56 tadzik well, you can go into the dir and 'make'
21:56 pippo joined #perl6
21:57 dalek perl6-roast-data: 9ab21f8 | coke++ | / (6 files):
21:57 dalek perl6-roast-data: today (automated commit)
21:57 dalek perl6-roast-data: review: https://github.com/coke/perl6​-roast-data/commit/9ab21f8439
21:59 [Coke] 'make -d' is -segfaulting.
21:59 colomon joined #perl6
22:00 timotimo the lead moarvm has is getting bigger and bigger o_O
22:00 * lue thinks he should probably merge into pod6ify a tiny bit more often :)
22:00 timotimo someone™ should port the unicode database to java
22:01 * FROGGS_ hides
22:01 tadzik hmm
22:01 lue The Oracle's a tough one to trick though; he's an, uh, oracle.
22:01 timotimo it has the weird thing with 16 bits going on
22:01 gaussblurinc_ joined #perl6
22:02 lue I blame UCS-2 for that :)
22:10 [Coke] googling for bugs in 'make' is not easy/ :P
22:10 tadzik hah
22:11 * [Coke] has to head out. laters.
22:11 [Coke] tadzik++ again.
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22:27 Mouq joined #perl6
22:30 xenoterracide__ joined #perl6
22:34 lue r: my regex foo { \N }; my regex bar { (<foo>)+ };  "ABC" ~~ /<bar>+/; say $_<foo> for $/;  # I assume there's a reason this doesn't work anymore?
22:34 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 22fbed: OUTPUT«(Any)␤»
22:37 lue r: my regex foo { \N }; my regex bar { (<foo>)+ };  "ABC" ~~ /<bar>+/; say $_<foo> for $<bar>; # *this* is the problem
22:37 camelia rakudo-moar 22fbed: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤postcircumfix:<{ }> not defined for type Array␤»
22:37 camelia ..rakudo-jvm 22fbed: OUTPUT«postcircumfix:<{ }> not defined for type Array␤  in method gist at gen/jvm/CORE.setting:12585␤  in sub say at gen/jvm/CORE.setting:13498␤  in block  at /tmp/tmpfile:1␤␤»
22:37 camelia ..rakudo-parrot 22fbed: OUTPUT«postcircumfix:<{ }> not defined for type Array␤  in method gist at gen/parrot/CORE.setting:12606␤  in method gist at gen/parrot/CORE.setting:1056␤  in sub say at gen/parrot/CORE.setting:13540␤  in block  at /tmp/tmpfile:1␤␤»
22:39 Mouq r: my regex foo { \N }; my regex bar { (<foo>)+ };  "ABC" ~~ /<bar>+/; say $_<foo> for @<bar>;
22:39 Mouq :/
22:39 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 22fbed: OUTPUT«(Any)␤»
22:39 Mouq r: my regex foo { \N }; my regex bar { (<foo>)+ };  "ABC" ~~ /<bar>+/; say $_»<foo> for @<bar>;
22:39 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 22fbed: OUTPUT«(Any)␤»
22:40 Mouq r: my regex foo { \N }; my regex bar { (<foo>)+ };  "ABC" ~~ /<bar>+/; say $_ for @<bar>;
22:40 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 22fbed: OUTPUT«「ABC」␤ 0 => 「A」␤  foo => 「A」␤ 0 => 「B」␤  foo => 「B」␤ 0 => 「C」␤  foo => 「C」␤␤»
22:40 lue r: my regex foo { \N }; my regex bar { (<foo>)+ };  "ABC" ~~ /<bar>+/; say $<bar>[0]<foo>
22:40 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 22fbed: OUTPUT«(Any)␤»
22:40 lue r: my regex foo { \N }; my regex bar { (<foo>)+ };  "ABC" ~~ /<bar>+/; say $<bar>[0][0]<foo>
22:40 camelia rakudo-moar 22fbed: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤postcircumfix:<{ }> not defined for type Array␤»
22:40 camelia ..rakudo-jvm 22fbed: OUTPUT«postcircumfix:<{ }> not defined for type Array␤  in method gist at gen/jvm/CORE.setting:12585␤  in sub say at gen/jvm/CORE.setting:13498␤  in block  at /tmp/tmpfile:1␤␤»
22:40 camelia ..rakudo-parrot 22fbed: OUTPUT«postcircumfix:<{ }> not defined for type Array␤  in method gist at gen/parrot/CORE.setting:12606␤  in method gist at gen/parrot/CORE.setting:1056␤  in sub say at gen/parrot/CORE.setting:13540␤  in block  at /tmp/tmpfile:1␤␤»
22:40 lue r: my regex foo { \N }; my regex bar { (<foo>)+ };  "ABC" ~~ /<bar>+/; say $<bar>[0][0][0]<foo>
22:40 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 22fbed: OUTPUT«「A」␤␤»
22:40 lue I refuse to believe two extra [0]'s is even close to correct.
22:41 Mouq And it failing like it does with $<bar>[0][0]<foo> is definitely wrong
22:42 lue r: my regex foo { \N }; my regex bar { (<.foo>)+ };  "ABC" ~~ /<bar>+/; say $<bar>[0][0][0]
22:42 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 22fbed: OUTPUT«「A」␤␤»
22:43 lue r: my regex bar { (\N)+ };  "ABC" ~~ /<bar>+/; say $<bar>[0][0][0]
22:43 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 22fbed: OUTPUT«「A」␤␤»
22:43 lue r: "ABC" ~~ /(\N)+/; say $0; say $0[0]; say $0[0][0]; # here you only need two subscripts (the implicit one in $0 counted)
22:43 camelia rakudo-{parrot,jvm,moar} 22fbed: OUTPUT«「A」␤ 「B」␤ 「C」␤␤「A」␤␤(Any)␤»
22:45 lue Nice to know it's not pod_vvi's fault itself is broken though :)
22:47 Mouq lue: See the difference between $/ in `my regex foo { \N }; my regex bar { (<foo>)+ };  "ABC" ~~ /<bar>+/;` and `"ABC" ~~ /$<bar>=[(<foo=[\N]>)+]+/;`
22:48 Mouq Oh, nvm
22:51 lue So, when a named rule of any kind (including $<foo>= , which I just checked locally) is involved, you need to subscript thrice, but if there is no name (just  (\N)+  for instance), then it takes two.
22:52 lue The thrice case includes (<.foo>)+, even though its eqv. to (\N)+
22:52 lue O_O        :$!list(Parcel<7>(:$!stora​ge(BOOTArray<8>(▶Array<9>(
22:53 lue Parcel of BOOTArray of Array ‽
22:54 lue (that's  ($<foo>=(\N))+  )
22:57 * lue will soon paste a gist showing off what all the DUMPs look like
23:11 lue Gah, I know where the third layer comes in now; it's from the + on <bar> (which is understandable)
23:15 lue Here's the script to test this with: https://gist.github.com/lue/11068143
23:20 lue I think I just found it. Am I right in seeing that Rakudo currently does    $<current_rule>[positional capture construct][construct capture no]    instead of $<current_rule>[rule-global capture no]
23:35 lue O_o I'm reading S05 and since when were $0 and $1 specced to hold an array of the construct's matches?
23:37 kurahaupo joined #perl6
23:39 lue Bisecting rakudo doesn't show me different results when I expect, which means I somehow managed to have code back in February that worked but doesn't now. Grah.
23:49 lue .ask TimToady I thought subpattern captures used to just fill up the array (  (\N)+ would fill $0, $1, $2, etc.  ), but now code of mine that assumes this (which worked in February) is broken and S05 has apparently been against this notion the whole time. I don't suppose you're to ask as to why this is?
23:49 yoleaux lue: I'll pass your message to TimToady.
23:51 lue .tell TimToady my discovery starts here, for reference: http://irclog.perlgeek.de/​perl6/2014-04-18#i_8609501
23:51 yoleaux lue: I'll pass your message to TimToady.

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