Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #perl6, 2014-05-04

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo | Niecza | Specs

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00:57 skids r: say ((0,1,2).map: { last($_) }).perl
00:57 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«().list␤»
00:57 camelia ..rakudo-parrot fd5f8e: OUTPUT«(0,).list␤»
00:57 camelia ..rakudo-jvm fd5f8e: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Failed to load config.properties␤  in  (gen/jvm/stage2/NQPHLL.nqp:8)␤  in  (gen/jvm/stage2/NQPHLL.nqp:8)␤  in  (gen/jvm/stage2/NQPHLL.nqp)␤  in  (src/vm/jvm/ModuleLoader.nqp:78)␤  in load_module (src/vm/jvm/ModuleLoader.nqp:60…»
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03:11 benabik Hmmmm…  Optimizer fail.
03:12 benabik Compiling RESTRICTED.setting with rakudo-parrot started failing at 1775172: “Various return typecheck/decont optimizations.”
03:12 benabik git-bisect++
03:13 benabik Merft.  And the revert has merge conflict, so I can’t test that.
03:16 benabik Blarg.  Can’t login to RT.  Don’t have time to sort this out and file a proper bug report.  Hopefully someone can find this in the clogs.
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03:44 BenGoldberg m: say first-index { $_ > 5 }, 2..7;
03:44 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«4␤»
03:44 BenGoldberg m: say first-rindex { $_ > 5 }, 2..7;
03:44 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«5␤»
03:44 * BenGoldberg wonders why first-rindex is not named 'last-index'
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03:45 * moritz wonders that too
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03:56 * grondilu saw the lines about last-index
03:57 * grondilu was about to ask why there is not a 'last' command that would work as 'first'
03:57 * grondilu remembered having thought about it once and concluded that it was not useful, but forgot why :-)
04:00 grondilu m: sub Last(&f, *@a) { .[.end] given @a ...^ {!.&f} }; say Last * < 6, ^10;
04:00 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«5␤»
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04:16 BenGoldberg Well, 'last' by itself could be mistaken for a loop control statment ;)
04:16 BenGoldberg But last-index ought to be fine.
04:18 BenGoldberg m: sub last-index(&f, *@a) { first { f($a[$_]) }, reverse 0 .. @a-1 }; say last-index { * eq 'c' }, 'a'..'e';
04:18 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m Error while compiling /tmp/lgBe1dYnIbâ�¤Variable '$a' is not declaredâ�¤at /tmp/lgBe1dYnIb:1â�¤------> [32mb last-index(&f, *@a) { first { f($a[$_][33mâ��[31m) }, reverse 0 .. @a-1 }; say last-index[0mâ�¤    expecting any…»
04:18 BenGoldberg m: sub last-index(&f, *@a) { first { f(@a[$_]) }, reverse 0 .. @a-1 }; say last-index { * eq 'c' }, 'a'..'e';
04:18 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«4␤»
04:19 BenGoldberg Hmm, not quite what I wanted.
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07:49 moritz http://kresimirbojcic.com/2013/02/24/​perl-6-the-holy-grail-or-utopia.html # found just now in my twitter stream
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08:06 FROGGS nice post indeed :o)
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08:21 Topic for #perl6 is now »ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | http://perl6.org/ | evalbot usage: 'perl6: say 3;' or rakudo:,  niecza:, std:, or /msg camelia perl6: ... | irclog: http://irc.perl6.org | UTF-8 is our friend!
08:35 grondilu "I pity them because Python feels like jail to me since it has all of those “purity”, “sanity” (however you want to call them) constraints."   LoL  I wouldn't dare state something like that but I do think something similar.
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08:49 jnthn I was amused by the comment about learning Perl 6 before it became cool :)
08:49 jnthn Anyway, yes, nice read :)
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09:05 * grondilu made a joke on http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Self-hosting_compiler.  I hope that won't bother anyone or anything ;-)
09:08 grondilu I was trying to be sarcastic though, because the idea of self-hosting compiler is not trivial, and 'eval slurp' really is a Perl 6 compiler written in Perl 6.
09:11 masak grondilu: maybe I'm a bit picky, but that does not qualify as a "self-hosting compiler" to me.
09:12 grondilu it's more of an interpreter than a compiler if that's what you mean.  But there's not much difference.
09:13 masak if someone asks you to implement binary search, and you call a function that does binary search, you have not implemented binary search.
09:13 masak if someone asks you to implement a self-hosting compiler, and you call 'eval', you have not implemented a self-hosting compiler.
09:14 grondilu masak: if to implement a language you're allowed to use parts of that language, then there is no reason to exclude any of these parts.
09:16 moritz the specs don't mandate that the compiler must be self-hosting; so a call to eval might or might not call into a self-hosting compiler
09:19 vendethiel (shouldn't that be EVAL ?)
09:19 grondilu oh yeah I forgot about the change in casing
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09:20 nwc10 also, semantics here, isn't the question "implement" rather than "provide"? ie implied is "not using a builtin"
09:21 masak my point.
09:21 grondilu everything at some point calls a builtin.
09:21 nwc10 yes, agree, your point, but I was trying to be annoyingly clearer (and probably failing)
09:22 masak yes. thank you. :) I'm glad someone agreed.
09:22 masak &
09:23 xiaomiao more important: how big is the smallest quine?
09:29 moritz xiaomiao: the empty string
09:29 xiaomiao ah, stabbed by a definition ...
09:29 xiaomiao I bleed happily ;)
09:29 moritz print slurp $*PROGRAM;
09:29 moritz m: say $*PROGRAM
09:30 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Dynamic variable $*PROGRAM not found␤»
09:30 moritz m: say $*PROGRAM_NAME
09:30 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«/tmp/ZlHCnt85d7␤»
09:30 moritz ok, s/PROGRAM/PROGRAM_NAME/
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09:43 moritz what's the R* release blocking on?
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09:49 jnthn moritz: Uploading the last RC I put out to the proper place and sending announcements
09:50 jnthn I gotta leave in 10 mins for a train...
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12:18 lizmat BenGoldbeg / moritz: the reason I called it first-rindex, was because of rindex on strings
12:18 lizmat last-index actually makes a lot of sense to me, I just didn't think about it that way
12:18 lizmat wrt to last{ &code ), that should work, no, signature wise ?
12:36 dalek roast: e344eb2 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S17-supply/grab.t:
12:36 dalek roast: Add tests for Supply.grab
12:36 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/e344eb26bf
12:43 dalek rakudo/nom: 90e6e84 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | t/spectest.data:
12:43 dalek rakudo/nom: Make sure we do the Supply.grab tests
12:43 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/90e6e84490
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12:44 nwc10 jnthn: "imitation is the scincerest form of flattery" - is anything other than Perl 6 flattering C#'s concurrency (not-)primitives to the same degree?
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13:02 dalek specs: 419d760 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S17-concurrency.pod:
13:02 dalek specs: Spec Supply.(sort|reverse)
13:02 dalek specs: review: https://github.com/perl6/specs/commit/419d76011a
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13:20 dalek roast: 61c77b9 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S17-supply/ (2 files):
13:20 dalek roast: Add tests for Supply.(reverse|sort)
13:20 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/61c77b92dd
13:27 dalek rakudo/nom: f557986 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | / (2 files):
13:27 dalek rakudo/nom: Implement Supply.(sort|reverse), make sure we test
13:27 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/f557986286
13:28 lizmat cycling&
13:35 PerlJam p6: say $*OUT: "foo"
13:35 camelia rakudo-{parrot,moar} fd5f8e: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m Error while compiling /tmp/tmpfileâ�¤Two terms in a rowâ�¤at /tmp/tmpfile:1â�¤------> [32msay $*OUT[33mâ��[31m: "foo"[0mâ�¤    expecting any of:â�¤        postfixâ�¤        infix stopperâ�¤        infix or meta-i…»
13:35 camelia ..niecza v24-109-g48a8de3: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0mâ�¤â�¤Invocant handling is NYI at /tmp/tmpfile line 1 (EOF):â�¤------> [32msay $*OUT: "foo"[33mâ��[31m<EOL>[0mâ�¤â�¤Unhandled exception: Check failedâ�¤â�¤  at /home/p6eval/niecza/boot/lib/CORE.setting line 1502 (die …»
13:35 camelia ..rakudo-jvm fd5f8e: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Failed to load config.properties␤  in  (gen/jvm/stage2/NQPHLL.nqp:8)␤  in  (gen/jvm/stage2/NQPHLL.nqp:8)␤  in  (gen/jvm/stage2/NQPHLL.nqp)␤  in  (src/vm/jvm/ModuleLoader.nqp:78)␤  in load_module (src/vm/jvm/ModuleLoader.nqp:60…»
13:35 Woodi hi
13:36 FROGGS o/
13:37 Woodi m:  my  %d = <1 a 2 b 3 c 4 d 5 e 6 f 7 g 22 s 23 t 31 u>; my $ds = 2; my $de = 4; say %d.keys.sort({ $^a <=> $^b }).grep( $ds .. $de );
13:37 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«2 3 4 22 23 31␤»
13:38 Woodi how to get list items only in range ?
13:38 vendethiel m:  my  %d = <1 a 2 b 3 c 4 d 5 e 6 f 7 g 22 s 23 t 31 u>; my $ds = 2; my $de = 4; say %d.keys.sort()[$ds .. $de]
13:38 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«22 23 3␤»
13:39 vendethiel m:  my  %d = <1 a 2 b 3 c 4 d 5 e 6 f 7 g 22 s 23 t 31 u>; my $ds = 2; my $de = 4; say %d.keys.sort(&infix:{'<=>'})[$ds .. $de]
13:39 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m Error while compiling /tmp/kNyjK_vSgNâ�¤You can't adverb thatâ�¤at /tmp/kNyjK_vSgN:1â�¤------> [32m$de = 4; say %d.keys.sort(&infix:{'<=>'}[33mâ��[31m)[$ds .. $de][0mâ�¤    expecting any of:â�¤        postfixâ�¤        st…»
13:39 Woodi and "sort :num" would be nice...
13:39 vendethiel m: say &infix:<<=>>
13:39 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«sub infix:<=> (\a, \b) { #`(Sub|140296936880832) ... }␤»
13:39 vendethiel :[
13:40 vendethiel m: say &infix:<<<=>>>
13:40 jnthn nwc10: Well, the Rx stuff has been ported all over the place. The only reason .Net got it first was 'cus the guy who came up wiht it was working at Microsoft at the time. Nowadays he regards the Java/Scala Rx implementations as leading the way, afaict.
13:40 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m Error while compiling /tmp/rrh7bum3HUâ�¤Two terms in a rowâ�¤at /tmp/rrh7bum3HU:1â�¤------> [32msay &infix:<<<=>>>[33mâ��[31m<EOL>[0mâ�¤    expecting any of:â�¤        postfixâ�¤        infix stopperâ�¤        infix or me…»
13:40 jnthn m: say &infix:<< <=> >>
13:40 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«sub infix:<<=>> (Any, Any $?) { #`(Sub+{<anon>}|140034408264448) ... }␤»
13:40 Woodi hmm, @a[ $low .. $min ] should work ?
13:42 vendethiel m: say (^50)[10..15] # it should
13:42 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«10 11 12 13 14 15␤»
13:42 jnthn Or figure out how to type guillemots
13:42 jnthn uh
13:42 jnthn guillemets... :)
13:43 Woodi thanx vendethiel
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14:06 timotimo did the mystery of why the star would try to use the binary "nqp"?
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14:15 skids timotimo: Well, no, but I did get things functional.
14:16 skids Oh, well, yes that part.
14:16 timotimo OK
14:16 skids Or part of it was I was using PREFIX= instead of --prefix.
14:17 skids So I actually wasn't installing anything.
14:18 skids Sorry just woke up.  A bit incoherent.
14:18 timotimo oh
14:19 timotimo we may want to check for PREFIX being set and warn?
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14:20 skids That would probably speed things up for a few old C jockeys like me :-)
14:22 skids Today's problem is golfing a bug that only happens 1/N times I run a program under moar.
14:22 skids Which my hunch is, is MMD related.
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15:13 timotimo old C jockeys don't read the readme, so our tools need to be a bit more careful :P
15:15 skids No, I read the readme and did it anyway out of habit :-)
15:16 timotimo :D
15:16 timotimo hmm
15:16 timotimo maybe we could learn a little something from rakudobrew
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15:17 timotimo maybe scripts "justbuild-moar", "justbiald-parrot", "justbuild-jvm" that behave more like traditional things, with PREFIX and stuff
15:18 timotimo doesn't sound too helpful, on second thought
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15:20 skids Nah best to break the old bad habits.
15:20 skids Damn.  I golfed away the bug, then put back what I took out and its still gone.  Grr.
15:31 dalek rakudo-star-daily: c7a16e4 | coke++ | log/ (3 files):
15:31 dalek rakudo-star-daily: today (automated commit)
15:31 dalek rakudo-star-daily: review: https://github.com/coke/rakudo​-star-daily/commit/c7a16e456e
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15:56 skids timotimo: alternative explanation for slowness at high number of iterations if it did not turn out to be 32768: CPU thermals.
15:57 skids Was just noticing that hapenning here.
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16:19 skids Ah my bug golf just got to a manageable size: https://gist.github.com/skids/f55b1106964e500f5d60
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16:28 timotimo ah, hmm.
16:28 moritz skids: I think that's related to MoarVM moving objects around in memory
16:28 moritz skids: compacting GC and all that
16:29 skids It's definitely racy.
16:29 moritz which means the memory address changes, and thus the default stringification of an object
16:29 moritz m: say (class Foo { }).new
16:29 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«Foo.new()␤»
16:29 moritz m: say ~(class Foo { }).new
16:29 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«Foo<139707849948776>␤»
16:31 skids moritz: are objects as keys still stringified in MOARVM?
16:31 timotimo m: say (my %foo).perl
16:32 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«().hash␤»
16:32 timotimo m: say (my %foo).WHAT.perl
16:32 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«Hash␤»
16:32 timotimo the default for a hash is to stringify strings
16:32 timotimo unless you define it thusly:
16:32 timotimo m: my %foo{Any}; %foo{Int} = 1; say %foo.keys>>.WHAT;
16:32 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«(List)␤»
16:32 timotimo m: my %foo{Any}; %foo{Int} = 1; say %foo.keys.perl;
16:33 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«(Int,).list␤»
16:33 timotimo m: my %foo{Any}; %foo = 1; say %foo.keys.perl;
16:33 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«Odd number of elements found where hash expected␤  in method STORE at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:9315␤  in block  at /tmp/ThAF3_0u_5:1␤␤»
16:33 timotimo what did i just do
16:33 benabik %foo = 1  Forgot a key?
16:33 timotimo m: my %foo; %foo{Int} = 1; say %foo.keys.perl;
16:33 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«use of uninitialized value of type Int in string context␤("",).list␤»
16:33 timotimo yes, i removed the wrong {} :)
16:33 timotimo look how it stringified Int in that context, but not in the first one
16:38 skids I updated the gist.  Switching to my %store{Any} still metastable.
16:39 timotimo ah, that's not good
16:39 timotimo can you output the contents of the hash a bit more precisely?
16:39 timotimo perhaps even with .DUMP?
16:40 skids I can try, but depending on where you put the "say" the bug will dissapear.
16:40 timotimo hah! :)
16:40 timotimo that sucks
16:52 skids Well, I can get the bug to happen while saying %store.keys, and they stringify to C.new(), and I say they because sometimes there are two which should not happen.
16:52 skids (gist updated)
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17:19 skids Grr the more I golf the harder it is to make the bug appear.  But it is often still there, just not statitstically likely.
17:22 masak maybe it's size-related?
17:25 jnthn I think it's the same issue we have on the JVM with .WHICH: they value can change over time for the same object.
17:25 skids Might be optimizability related.
17:25 jnthn *the
17:26 timotimo aye, the pypy people have some wild things with "id" and dictionaries using ids as keys
17:26 thou I think I spy an obscure typo in S05:1884; Need a space before foo in:      / (<* <foo bar baz> >) /  Otherwise <foo bar baz> is parsed as <foo(/bar baz/)>, and intention is to parse it as [ 'foo' | 'bar' | 'baz' ].
17:26 synopsebot Link: http://perlcabal.org/syn/S05.html#line_1884
17:26 thou Can anyone confirm I'm reading the spec right?
17:28 timotimo but it's inside <*   >
17:28 timotimo does that make a difference?
17:28 skids (The reason for the object hash is just a workaround for the diamond composition problem, and will go away eventually)
17:29 thou Not as I read it. "A leading * indicates that the following pattern allows a partial match." -- <foo bar baz> is interpreted as a pattern.
17:30 timotimo oh, ok
17:31 timotimo i didn't even know about <* >, do we implement that yet?
17:31 thou Dunno. :-)
17:31 timotimo does it mean hitting eof will not cause an error condition?
17:32 thou Yes. "It always succeeds."
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17:42 dalek specs: dc55e28 | (Tim Smith)++ | S05-regex.pod:
17:42 dalek specs: Fix syntax of example <* < foo bar  baz > >
17:42 dalek specs: review: https://github.com/perl6/specs/commit/dc55e28c91
17:43 thou OK, I am pretty sure I'm right, so I fixed it. :-)
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18:19 timotimo thanks
18:29 timotimo i'm still wondering what we'd need to do to get .WHY on most things in the setting if we have a repl session
18:29 tadzik there was an idea to lazy load them from what p6doc uses
18:30 tadzik because putting all the things in the setting would be meh
18:30 tadzik maybe one day we'll be so fast and tiny that it won't be :)
18:31 tadzik but now, /me is building rakudo-jvm to see if he can afford more than one bullet in his game until collision detection becomes unbearably slow
18:33 tadzik uhh, what does "This representation can not unbox another" mean? :o
18:36 raydiak pleasant prenoon, perl people
18:37 tadzik hello raydiak
18:37 raydiak \o tadzik...working on cool game stuff?
18:37 tadzik yep :)
18:37 tadzik I've sort of hit the performance limits
18:37 tadzik and it makes me sad
18:38 tadzik because even if I use proper and clever algorithms it will still be too slow, I estimated
18:38 tadzik so I have to drop lots of things to C
18:38 tadzik at which points it makes more sense to just have box2d do it all
18:38 tadzik which is probably a good idea anyway
18:39 raydiak yeah me too...was going to enter that contest, but only got through the window to run at a single-digit FPS
18:39 tadzik but I'll definitely write some pure-p6 benchmark related to it, so I can notice if one day it becomes alrighty fast
18:39 tadzik uhh, really?
18:39 raydiak aye
18:39 tadzik that shouldn't happen
18:39 tadzik what machine is that?
18:39 raydiak even on half-decade+ old laptops?
18:39 tadzik ah, hm
18:40 tadzik I could check that on my half-decade old laptop :P
18:40 FROGGS tadzik: even Perl 5 was too slow to do things in P5 directly
18:40 tadzik or on that P4 computer nearby
18:40 tadzik FROGGS: wow, really?
18:41 tadzik even with proper quadtrees and all that?
18:41 FROGGS yes, that is why I wrote that LayerManager in XS for example
18:41 tadzik hm :) That boosted my morale a bit
18:42 FROGGS no quadtrees involved, but we calculate only the areas that have changes, so there is less to update on screen
18:42 tadzik but really, I have a pretty good i5 in this laptop, and it can't really handle checking one bullet against 20 ships in reasonable time
18:42 FROGGS changed*
18:42 tadzik so I don't think that building a proper tree and all that will make it any better
18:42 tadzik if it can't handle 120 &infix:<<=>'s basically
18:45 tadzik but well, for this week I have animations, gamepad support (if it's the xbox pad) and more niceness
18:45 tadzik so maybe people will forgive me that they need insane computing power to run it :o
18:47 FROGGS *g*
18:47 FROGGS tadzik++
18:47 tadzik I wonder what would happen if I threw more threads on
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18:49 FROGGS you'd have a bigger knot
18:50 tadzik http://perlcabal.org/syn/S17.html#line_809
18:50 tadzik shouldn't that be "Supplies"?
18:51 tadzik FROGGS: well, not so sure
18:51 tadzik there are a lot of things that can be done independently
18:51 FROGGS yes, sure
18:51 FROGGS I was just kidding :o)
18:52 tadzik I really need to catch up with all that nice threading stuf
18:53 tadzik https://github.com/perl6/roast/blo​b/master/S17-lowlevel/thread.t#L98 is that the easiest way to "run this N things in parallel and wait until they all finish?"
18:55 FROGGS no, normally you write 'await' before the loop, and 'start' within the loop
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18:55 FROGGS Thread.start is like something internal that should normally not be used
18:56 tadzik right, hence "lowlevel" probably :)
18:56 FROGGS perhaps you read http://jnthn.net/papers/2014-nlpw-reactive.pdf
18:56 tadzik I didn't immediately find the idiomatic way in neither spec nor tests
18:57 FROGGS wait... there were better slides
18:57 raydiak tadzik: checked just FYI, and the laptop is a 1.7 GHz 32-bit Pentium M w/a 533 MHz FSB...so probably a couple notches below most of your target audience :)
18:58 FROGGS tadzik: ahh, have you read jnthn++'s latest blög? 6guts.wordpress.com
18:58 tadzik raydiak: well, I'd like my target audience to be as broad as possible
18:58 tadzik besides, it's a side-scrolling jumping game
18:59 tadzik it's a bit embarassing that you need a fluid-cooled quadcore beast to run it smoothly
18:59 tadzik FROGGS: I probably did, but I may not remember all of it :) Will look, thansk
18:59 tadzik ah, that's nice indeed :)
19:00 raydiak agreed...I just mean a lot of modern stuff is painful on this thing
19:00 tadzik I can make steroids torment 4 cores instead of one
19:00 FROGGS tadzik: there is "the idiom" and also a nice explanation (including a must-know)
19:03 tadzik Unhandled exception: When invoking protect, Provided outer frame 0x36e27e0 (MVMStaticFrame protect) does not match expected static frame type 0x36e2540 (MVMStaticFrame )
19:03 tadzik oh nice :)
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19:19 FROGGS uff
19:27 tadzik ah damnits
19:27 tadzik if it wasn't for the PLPW talk I'll probably have just thrown it all to the trash can and forgot about the games thingy
19:28 FROGGS :/
19:31 timotimo aye, perl6 performance can be a frustrating thing :|
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19:31 timotimo you can program stuff that's kinda performant in nqp ... but then you get almost no sugar
19:33 lizmat indeed
19:33 lizmat oops
19:33 lizmat tadzik: don't use Thread, use Promises
19:34 lizmat or simpler:   start { };
19:34 lizmat which gives a promise
19:34 tadzik yeah, I went for start {}s :)
19:34 tadzik timotimo: well, performance is one thing
19:35 tadzik but I keep noticing that I keep getting things more or less wrong from place to place
19:35 * lizmat is hoping we can tap graphics cards processors transparently in Perl 6 soon
19:35 tadzik :o
19:35 timotimo i'm also afflicted by an insufficient amount of practice writing actual perl6 code rather than rakudo guts
19:36 tadzik for instance, I just tried making physics (velocity) dependent on the actual time that passed since last frame
19:36 tadzik and it's all broken
19:36 timotimo oh, apologies
19:36 tadzik mostly on the user side in this case, not on the framework side
19:36 tadzik but the fact that I'm making this kind of mistakes makes me thing that there are a lot of hidden bugs in there :)
19:36 lizmat tadzik: is there no way that you can use Promises to generate frames async?
19:37 tadzik lizmat: not exactly, they all depend on the previous ones
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19:37 lizmat is there rendering involved after a frame is done?
19:37 lizmat can you offload that to a Promise ?
19:37 tadzik yes, but the cost of rendering is infinitesimal compared to actual computation
19:38 tadzik or so I think :)
19:38 lizmat Benchmark it, I would say  :-)
19:38 tadzik but the rendering step is basically dropping everything to SDL, which is doing things in roughly 0 time
19:38 timotimo well, the rendering is in C, handled by sdl, afaict, and hardware-accelerated
19:38 tadzik well, the state changing step is the biggest dealbreaker
19:38 lizmat perhaps the dropping can be offloaded?
19:39 lizmat I mean, Perl 6 *is* doing something to make it so SDL can work with it ?
19:39 tadzik mostly collision detection recently
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19:39 timotimo aren't the things you're giving to sdl CStruct repr'd objects
19:39 timotimo ?
19:40 tadzik they are
19:40 timotimo that means the "dropping to sdl" stuff is spread all over the code
19:40 timotimo wherever you $my_object.x += 5 it'll "do that
19:40 timotimo "
19:40 timotimo :\
19:41 tadzik no, no
19:41 tadzik the C-repr'd objects basically never change
19:42 tadzik you query them sometimes though
19:42 timotimo oh
19:42 timotimo in that case i don't know how things are offloaded onto sdl
19:43 tadzik well, the entire rendering is "take @!entities and .draw() them all"
19:43 tadzik where draw is "give SDL $!tex, $!x and $!y and tell it to draw it"
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19:45 lizmat could you do it without gather / take ?
19:45 lizmat that's known to be a performance bottleneck, is it not?
19:46 timotimo ah, hmm.
19:46 timotimo i think he didn't mean "take" as in "take"
19:47 tadzik no, there's no take
19:47 tadzik I'll just show you the code
19:47 tadzik it'll be a pre-release :o
19:47 dalek specs: 6f87cb5 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S17-concurrency.pod:
19:47 dalek specs: s/C<Supply>s/Supplies
19:47 dalek specs: review: https://github.com/perl6/specs/commit/6f87cb52c3
19:48 tadzik lizmat++
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19:50 tadzik https://github.com/tadzik/steroids/bl​ob/master/lib/Steroids/State.pm#L103 this is how drawing is done
19:50 tadzik should be fairly easy to measure how much time it takes, I'll do that
19:53 tadzik well, it reaches 10ms if GC comes by, but it's usually 1ms
19:53 tadzik I wonder, if I'll put enough \'s in arguments list, will it never trigger GC? :o
19:54 tadzik more generally: what can I do to avoid allocating new objects whenever possible
19:55 tadzik yeah, I should probably follow setting's footsteps
19:55 tadzik I almost never need the containers
19:55 tadzik ...does it sound like it makes any sense?
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19:56 lizmat some
19:57 lizmat maybe events inner loop could be better as a map ?
19:58 lizmat no, that's bogus
19:58 tadzik could it? I don't need the results
19:58 tadzik I could have a map in animations() maybe
19:58 jnthn for uses map...
19:59 lizmat also, I wonder whether we could use a better idiom for "@!entities.=grep(* !=== $d);"
20:00 tadzik something like Array.remove
20:01 lizmat perhaps, or maybe just :delete the element you want removed ?
20:01 tadzik ..oh
20:01 tadzik yeah, that makes sense :)
20:02 lizmat or turn @entities into a hash ?
20:02 tadzik wait, is that perl6?
20:02 lizmat and just :delete on key
20:02 tadzik r: my @a = 1, 2, 3; @a[1]:delete; @a.perl.say
20:02 lizmat not sure how many sprites we're talking about here
20:02 camelia rakudo-{parrot,moar} fd5f8e: OUTPUT«Array.new(1, Any, 3)␤»
20:02 camelia ..rakudo-jvm fd5f8e: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Failed to load config.properties␤  in  (gen/jvm/stage2/NQPHLL.nqp:8)␤  in  (gen/jvm/stage2/NQPHLL.nqp:8)␤  in  (gen/jvm/stage2/NQPHLL.nqp)␤  in  (src/vm/jvm/ModuleLoader.nqp:78)␤  in load_module (src/vm/jvm/ModuleLoader.nqp:60…»
20:02 tadzik well, sort of
20:03 tadzik is there something like .indexof()?
20:03 lizmat first-index ?
20:03 tadzik http://doc.perl6.org/type/Array doesn't mention it
20:04 lizmat @entities[first-index( * === $d )]:delete
20:04 tadzik r: my @a = 1, 2, 3; say @a.first-index(2)
20:04 camelia rakudo-{parrot,moar} fd5f8e: OUTPUT«1␤»
20:04 camelia ..rakudo-jvm fd5f8e: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Failed to load config.properties␤  in  (gen/jvm/stage2/NQPHLL.nqp:8)␤  in  (gen/jvm/stage2/NQPHLL.nqp:8)␤  in  (gen/jvm/stage2/NQPHLL.nqp)␤  in  (src/vm/jvm/ModuleLoader.nqp:78)␤  in load_module (src/vm/jvm/ModuleLoader.nqp:60…»
20:04 BenGoldberg r: my @a = 'a'..'d'; say @a.first-index('c')
20:04 camelia rakudo-{parrot,moar} fd5f8e: OUTPUT«2␤»
20:04 camelia ..rakudo-jvm fd5f8e: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Failed to load config.properties␤  in  (gen/jvm/stage2/NQPHLL.nqp:8)␤  in  (gen/jvm/stage2/NQPHLL.nqp:8)␤  in  (gen/jvm/stage2/NQPHLL.nqp)␤  in  (src/vm/jvm/ModuleLoader.nqp:78)␤  in load_module (src/vm/jvm/ModuleLoader.nqp:60…»
20:04 tadzik yeah, and then 'next unless $_' in the entities loops
20:05 BenGoldberg m: my @a = 'a'..'d'; say @a[@a.first-index('c')]:delete; say @a
20:05 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«c␤a b (Any) d␤»
20:05 lizmat perhaps: next unles nqp::exists or something, lemme check
20:05 BenGoldberg m: my @a = 'a'..'d'; say @a[@a.first-index('c')]:splice; say @a
20:05 camelia rakudo-moar fd5f8e: OUTPUT«Unexpected named parameter 'splice' passed␤  in sub postcircumfix:<[ ]> at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:2432␤  in block  at /tmp/LcGz_SKN55:1␤␤»
20:06 tadzik Any's false, it shouldn't be necessary
20:07 tadzik but removing sprites doesn't happen very often, I don't think it's the most costly thing
20:07 tadzik right now, apparently NativeCalls is diffent on each backend
20:07 tadzik and my code only works on moar
20:07 lizmat :-(
20:08 tadzik I wonder when did that happen
20:08 jnthn Probably tells us we need more NativeCall tests...
20:09 tadzik now I have to reduce this beast to a small testcase :o
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20:20 dalek roast: 7267957 | (David Warring david.warring@gmail.com)++ | integration/advent2012-day24.t:
20:20 dalek roast: adding 2012 advent day 24
20:20 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/726795735c
20:22 tadzik oh, actually it's not nativecall
20:22 tadzik or not entirely
20:22 tadzik https://github.com/tadzik/steroid​s/blob/master/lib/Steroids.pm#L35 this breaks on parrot
20:26 tadzik I assume this also breaks on JVM, but silently
20:26 dalek roast: d99bd72 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S17-lowlevel/ (2 files):
20:26 dalek roast: Discourage use of these tests as inspiration
20:26 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/d99bd72cd6
20:27 tadzik :)
20:27 tadzik this should keep me away :P
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20:27 tadzik lizmat++
20:28 tadzik jnthn: re nativecall, JVM says "This representation can not unbox another"
20:28 tadzik https://github.com/tadzik/steroid​s/blob/master/lib/Steroids.pm#L19 here
20:28 tadzik same when I substitute the variables with values
20:32 dalek specs: 9878e9a | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S17-concurrency.pod:
20:32 dalek specs: Fix uniq () glitch
20:32 dalek specs: review: https://github.com/perl6/specs/commit/9878e9ae0d
20:33 jnthn tadzik: Please can you file a ticket on NativeCall for that?
20:34 tadzik jnthn: sure, as soon as I find out what exactly happens :)
20:35 tadzik I'd feel bad about "here, this monstrosity that takes 10 seconds to compile is broken":)
20:35 jnthn yes, a golf is appreciated
20:35 jnthn arnsholt++ may look into it given it's a NativeCall on JVM issue, if he's the tuits :D
20:36 tadzik who parrots the parrots/
20:36 tadzik I mean, who'll look into the parrot issue? :P
20:38 jnthn On NativeCall, not immediately sure. The recent build breakage on Parrot wants looking into. I think somebody bisected it earlier...will have to look when I've tuits
20:38 dalek roast: fcb68fb | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | integration/advent2012-day24.t:
20:38 dalek roast: Add a plan
20:38 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/fcb68fbe05
20:39 tadzik no, it's not nativecall
20:39 dalek rakudo/nom: 424d99c | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | t/spectest.data:
20:39 dalek rakudo/nom: Add missing advent2012 tests to roast
20:39 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/424d99c11c
20:39 tadzik https://github.com/tadzik/steroid​s/blob/master/lib/Steroids.pm#L35 this results in Can not bind attribute '$!game' declared in class 'Steroids::State' with this object
20:39 lizmat dwarring++
20:40 tadzik so nqp::bindattr bails out when asked to set a private attr on other class
20:40 lizmat could it be the :: in Steroids::State ?
20:40 lizmat aka, shouldn't that just be State ?
20:40 tadzik hmm
20:41 tadzik then it says Undeclared name: State
20:42 lizmat how is Steroids::State defined?   class Steroids::State {} ?  or class Steroids { class State {} } ?
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20:50 tadzik Steroids::State
20:51 lizmat then, the way I understand things, that's the right class to specify in bindattr
20:51 lizmat mayby jnthn can chime in?
20:52 jnthn yes, agree it's the right thing.
20:53 jnthn Try an nqp::decont($state) as the first arg to nqp::bindattr
20:53 jnthn On MoarVM the signature binding lowerer sometimes optimizes away containers when it believes it can get away with it.
20:54 jnthn But it's "get away wiht it" in the "using Perl 6 syntax" sense, and using nqp:: ops might well expose the difference.
20:55 tadzik heh, the bug is actually with exporting
20:55 tadzik (the nativecall one)
20:55 tadzik I'll try the bindattr in a second
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20:58 tadzik bug reported
20:59 tadzik jnthn: yes, decont makes thins work :)
20:59 tadzik (very slowly)
20:59 jnthn MoarVM runs it faster than Parrot, huh... :)
21:00 tadzik heheh
21:00 tadzik my $key = nqp::p6box_i($k) but role { method Str { $str } };
21:00 tadzik this makes Parrot react funny
21:00 * jnthn has started on the next round of MoarVM speedup work also :)
21:00 tadzik \o/
21:01 vendethiel yay :-)
21:01 dalek specs: 6499b5c | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S32-setting-library/Containers.pod:
21:01 dalek specs: Rename first-rindex to last-index
21:01 dalek specs:
21:01 dalek specs: This makes much more sense  :-)
21:01 dalek specs: review: https://github.com/perl6/specs/commit/6499b5c2e6
21:02 tadzik p: my int32 $k = 7; my $key = nqp::p6box_i($k) but role { method Str { $str } }
21:02 camelia rakudo-parrot fd5f8e: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m Error while compiling /tmp/4SKRt5l9LPâ�¤Variable '$str' is not declaredâ�¤at /tmp/4SKRt5l9LP:1â�¤------> [32mp6box_i($k) but role { method Str { $str[33mâ��[31m } }[0mâ�¤    expecting any of:â�¤        postfixâ�¤Â»
21:02 lizmat moritz++ and others++
21:02 tadzik p: my int32 $k = 7; my $key = nqp::p6box_i($k) but role { method Str { 'yak' } }
21:02 camelia rakudo-parrot fd5f8e: ( no output )
21:02 tadzik p: my int32 $k = 7; my $key = nqp::p6box_i($k) but role { method Str { 'yak' } }; say $key
21:02 camelia rakudo-parrot fd5f8e: OUTPUT«yak␤»
21:02 tadzik huh
21:03 tadzik there is something weird about lexicals and nativecalls and this "but role"
21:04 tadzik https://github.com/tadzik/steroids/b​lob/master/lib/Steroids/State.pm#L19 -- if I don't do assignment to $str and just use the SDL call in the method Str { }, the code dies with Lexical with name '$k' has wrong type
21:05 tadzik this also breaks on parrot even with the $str assignment
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21:18 dalek rakudo/nom: 5622537 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | / (2 files):
21:18 dalek rakudo/nom: Rename first-rindex to last-index
21:18 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/5622537f47
21:19 dalek roast: d8fdf05 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S32-list/ (2 files):
21:19 dalek roast: Rename first-rindex.t - last-index.t
21:19 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/d8fdf0560c
21:19 dalek roast: 41b1391 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S32-list/last-index.t:
21:19 dalek roast: Rename first-rindex to last-index
21:19 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/41b139167f
21:19 lizmat I figured since first-rindex was not in last month's release, I could change it now without a deprecation cycle
21:20 jnthn lizmat: yeah, it only went in a couple of days ago, right?
21:20 lizmat I specced it on 28/04
21:20 jnthn yeah...just change it if it's that recent
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21:31 dalek roast: 7e5b462 | (David Warring david.warring@gmail.com)++ | integration/advent2012-day15.t:
21:31 dalek roast: fudged on jvm
21:31 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/7e5b46269a
21:34 dalek rakudo/nom: 8abc689 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | docs/ChangeLog:
21:34 dalek rakudo/nom: Added some ChangeLog entries
21:34 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/8abc689f87
21:36 lvfjf joined #perl6
21:36 jnthn lizmat: async sockets are missing :)
21:36 lizmat see, I forgot something   :-)
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21:41 lizmat Hmmm... shouldn't we call IO::Socket::Async.chars_supply just "receive" ?
21:42 lizmat jnthn ^^^
21:42 jnthn That feels too...synchronous-suggestive to me.
21:42 jnthn I'm not attached to the name
21:42 jnthn though chars_supply and bytes_supply are hard to beat on explaining what they are doing :)
21:43 lizmat yeah, but you don't call it "signal_supply" either
21:43 jnthn yeah
21:43 lizmat just "signal"
21:44 lizmat something to ponder  :-)
21:44 jnthn aye
21:45 dalek rakudo/nom: 5037864 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | docs/ChangeLog:
21:45 dalek rakudo/nom: Mention IO::Socket::Async additions
21:45 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/5037864ba1
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22:01 tadzik . o O ( Is this a real bug? Is it just fantasy? )
22:02 jnthn .oO( Caught an exception, can't belive it's reality )
22:03 lizmat .oO( Will you do the fandango ? )
22:03 tadzik this is crazy :S
22:04 tadzik but here's exception, so throw me maybe
22:04 jnthn open("gangnam-style")
22:05 tadzik but really, aargh
22:05 tadzik I have two subs, their &sub.WHICH is different
22:06 tadzik when passed to C, their address is the same
22:06 tadzik of course when I wrote a similar testcase in zavolaj's test suite it works like a charm
22:06 dalek roast: 3449e3b | (David Warring david.warring@gmail.com)++ | integration/advent2012-day14.t:
22:06 dalek roast: tidied. fudged on jvm
22:06 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/3449e3b074
22:07 jnthn tadzik: ah...are you doing closures?
22:07 tadzik yes
22:07 jnthn And passing differnet closures off to C-land?
22:07 jnthn ah...I hit issues there
22:07 tadzik :S
22:07 jnthn Is this wiht Moar?
22:07 tadzik https://github.com/tadzik/steroids/b​lob/master/lib/Steroids/State.pm#L17 this is the issue
22:07 tadzik yes
22:07 tadzik thing is, when activate() is called on a different object, C still gets the old &update_cb
22:07 tadzik C call in #49
22:08 tadzik jnthn: any workarounds?
22:08 jnthn https://gist.github.com/jnthn/f281ac967aabf9275a31
22:08 tadzik make just one global closure and change what it does?
22:08 woolfy So, when is Perl 6 going to run on a Raspberry Pi?  :-)
22:08 jnthn Try that patch
22:08 tadzik will do
22:08 jnthn woolfy: Potentially, when nwc10++ wakes up tomorrow morning, we'll learn it does ;)
22:09 dalek rakudo/nom: 0244475 | Mouq++ | src/core/ (2 files):
22:09 dalek rakudo/nom: Add List.rotor
22:09 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/02444755d5
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22:15 tadzik as a contrast to all the Space videos posted here, here's Dogecar: http://i.imgur.com/gr2q5aI.jpg
22:17 jnthn Such accelerate.
22:18 Mouq Very speed.
22:19 tadzik jnthn: yay, it helped :)
22:20 tadzik then it segfaulted, but it's probably my fault
22:21 tadzik or not
22:24 Timbus ahhaha the dogecoin car
22:24 Timbus [steering column rattle intensifies]
22:25 tadzik jnthn: backtrace: https://gist.github.com/ta​dzik/7dfdd5b6fb129371c296
22:25 tadzik I should make a debug build
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22:31 tadzik but it segfaults all the older games too
22:31 dalek rakudo/nom: beba99f | Mouq++ | src/core/List.pm:
22:31 dalek rakudo/nom: Make List.rotor more robust and lazy
22:31 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/beba99fe5b
22:42 lizmat Mouq++
22:42 lizmat Mouq: Supply.rotor will actually also send the last (incomplete) parcel, does List.rotot do that also?
22:42 lizmat *rotor
22:43 lizmat .oO( I just can't type rotot )
22:44 Mouq lizmat: perl6 -e'.say for (^10).rotor(3,0)'
22:44 Mouq 0 1 2
22:44 Mouq 3 4 5
22:44 Mouq 6 7 8
22:44 Mouq 9
22:46 lizmat I'll take that as a yes :-)
22:46 lizmat and on that note, I bid you all gnight!
22:47 Mouq 'night lizmat++ :)
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