Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #perl6, 2014-09-30

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo | Niecza | Specs

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02:32 [Coke] the rakudo.jvm tests for this morning are STILL running. they are easily 6-8 hours longer than previous runs.
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07:04 FROGGS [Coke]: and you think this is related to a recent change and not to the general host08 slowness?
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07:06 moritz is host08 generally slow?
07:06 moritz it shouldn't :-)
07:07 FROGGS moritz: isn't that the reason that camelia times out lately?
07:07 moritz though iirc it uses openjdk, whereas host07 hat the oracle JDK installed
07:07 moritz FROGGS: I don't think so
07:07 FROGGS ohh, my fault
07:07 moritz FROGGS: the commands themselves don't take long, when I run them in isolation on the host08 command line
07:07 moritz something else is fishy, though I don't know yet what
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07:20 dalek panda/CPAN: 683e0c0 | (Tobias Leich)++ | TODO:
07:20 dalek panda/CPAN: add CPAN related TODOs
07:20 dalek panda/CPAN: review: https://github.com/tadzik/panda/commit/683e0c08a5
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07:42 lizmat good *, #perl6!
07:43 brrt \o lizmat
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07:51 brrt maybe jnthn and masak should stop travelling
07:52 brrt everywhere they stay chaos breaks loose
07:59 dalek roast: f8e0c0d | usev6++ | S (2 files):
07:59 dalek roast: Moving test for RT #75370 to S12-enums/basic.t
07:59 dalek roast: it lived in S02-names/75370.t which was not included in t/spectest.data
07:59 dalek roast: test was added with https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/b​4fc0fe9f11bb34e4442da7e1f945e8740d07c7c
07:59 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/f8e0c0d9ed
07:59 synopsebot Link: https://rt.perl.org/rt3//Publ​ic/Bug/Display.html?id=75370
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08:00 lizmat m: say IO::Spec::Win32.rel2abs("C:foo\\bar")'
08:01 camelia rakudo-moar 264eaf: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
08:03 wolfram_ lizmat: In case it's still relevant: on my cygwin the first 'ls C:/' warns ' MS-DOS style path detected: C:/    Preferred POSIX equivalent is: /cygdrive/c'. After that both 'ls C:/' and 'ls C:\\' work
08:03 lizmat wolfram_: thanks
08:04 lizmat I get: $ 6 'say IO::Spec::Win32.rel2abs("C:foo\\bar")'
08:04 lizmat \Users\liz\Github\rakudo.moar\foo\bar
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08:04 lizmat which is clearly not right, or is it ?
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08:05 lizmat hmmm... I gues it expects a CWD value that also has a C:\ in it
08:06 lizmat $ 6 'say IO::Spec::Win32.rel2abs("C:foo\\bar","D:\\zip")'
08:06 lizmat D:\zip\foo\bar
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08:06 lizmat I guess you just can't win (pun intended)
08:07 moritz rel2abs should be a noop if the path is already absolute
08:07 moritz (IMHO)
08:07 lizmat C:foo isn't absolute
08:07 lizmat C:\foo is
08:08 lizmat or am I wrong ?
08:08 moritz wth does C:foo mean?
08:08 moritz does windows have a CWD per volume?
08:09 lizmat not sure anymore
08:09 lizmat anyway, S32-io/io-path-win.t tests for that
08:09 lizmat and I broke it
08:09 lizmat and trying to figure out how I broke it
08:14 brrt moritz - i think it does, yes
08:14 brrt it used to at any rate
08:16 wolfram_ on win7:
08:16 wolfram_ F:\>dir c:
08:16 wolfram_ Directory of c:\usr
08:16 wolfram_ F:\>dir d:
08:16 wolfram_ Directory of D:\tmp
08:16 wolfram_ F:\>dir d:Kon
08:16 wolfram_ Directory of D:\tmp\Kon
08:17 * lizmat feels that IO::Spec::Win32.rel2abs("C:foo\bar","D:\zip") should fail
08:17 brrt wolfram_++
08:17 lizmat you can't make sense of that one, and the result is most likely wrong
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08:31 moritz lizmat: correct
08:33 lizmat afk for a few hours&
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08:45 dalek roast: afc4d1e | usev6++ | S32-exceptions/misc.t:
08:45 dalek roast: Add test for RT #113680
08:45 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/afc4d1ee8a
08:45 synopsebot Link: https://rt.perl.org/rt3//Publ​ic/Bug/Display.html?id=113680
08:47 nine Good morning!
08:47 yoleaux 29 Sep 2014 22:42Z <carlin> nine: on OpenBSD a sub with an empty return; hangs. p5_av_top_index should return -1 with an empty return; but is returning 4294967295. Something somewhere unsigned that should be signed?
08:48 dalek Inline-Perl5: 885327a | nine++ | / (2 files):
08:48 dalek Inline-Perl5: Use correct int data types to avoid 32/64 bit issues
08:48 dalek Inline-Perl5:
08:48 dalek Inline-Perl5: Hopefully fixes the p5_av_top_index openBSD issue reported by carlin++
08:48 dalek Inline-Perl5: review: https://github.com/niner/Inl​ine-Perl5/commit/885327a1e9
08:48 nine carlin: ^^^ not unsigned, but using a 64 bit integer where I should have used 32. Thanks for digging this out!
08:51 nine I have to admit that I didn't give data types any thought during the first couple of days. Progress was everything...
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10:22 carlin nine: still hangs, making the p5_av_top_index sub return int32 fixes it
10:32 nine carlin: oh you mean in Perl5.pm6? Seems like that's exactly the only return value I missed when fixing the data types :/
10:32 dalek Inline-Perl5: bb1c7d5 | nine++ | lib/Inline/Perl5.pm6:
10:32 dalek Inline-Perl5: Fix return value of p5_av_top_index
10:32 dalek Inline-Perl5:
10:32 dalek Inline-Perl5: Thanks to carlin++ for pointing this out...again.
10:32 dalek Inline-Perl5: review: https://github.com/niner/Inl​ine-Perl5/commit/bb1c7d5ae6
10:35 carlin nine++
10:35 carlin tests clean on OpenBSD now
10:35 carlin when perl is built with -Uusemymalloc at least
10:43 nine carlin: have you tested without usemymalloc?
10:43 FROGGS -U is 'without', no?
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10:44 masak hello hey hey hi hi #perl6
10:44 nine carlin: then have you tested with usemymalloc?
10:44 FROGGS masak: hi, welcome to #perl6 :o)
10:44 masak :)
10:44 masak this is something that we could possibly learn from and be inspired by: https://github.com/jonathansl​enders/python-prompt-toolkit
10:46 FROGGS wow
10:47 FROGGS though, windows support would be rather essential
10:47 masak aye.
10:50 FROGGS ohh, he even said "Thank you" to my PR :o)
10:52 masak jonathanslenders++
10:53 FROGGS yeah
10:54 masak &
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11:29 carlin nine: perl's build defaults to usemymalloc on OpenBSD
11:30 carlin t/call_back.t ............. moar in free(): error: bogus pointer (double free?) 0x1b3e45a0cf10
11:30 carlin t/exceptions.t ............ 1/? moar in free(): error: bogus pointer (double free?) 0x11fb18e0c980
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11:35 perlgod does perl6 allow a problematics-oriented semi-meta programming model? i use this all the time in our web backend at work
11:36 moritz perlgod: what does that mean?
11:42 perlgod i thought it was common knowledge in the general perl scene, it's a techniqe derived from perl4 source that perl5 is especially gpod at
11:43 lizmat sorry, we're stupid perl 6 people around here
11:43 FROGGS perlgod: can you describe it?
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11:55 ecocode hmmm... problematics-oriented semi-meta programming model... sounds like something for Emacs ;)
11:56 tadzik buzzword overflow, does not compute
11:57 moritz we're good with meta, and with programming, but not so good with semi and with problematics
11:57 tadzik also, the nickname, the gateway, the question... are hugs in order? :)
11:57 * moritz hugs perlgod
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12:04 FROGGS btw, tadzik, you're coming to the APW too?
12:04 tadzik FROGGS: no :(
12:05 FROGGS :o(
12:16 dalek rakudo/nom: 70f4ff2 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | src/core/IO/Spec/Unix.pm:
12:16 dalek rakudo/nom: Some obvious optimizations
12:16 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/70f4ff210f
12:18 timotimo o/
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12:25 colomon lizmat: why the my @ =  in line 40 of that commit?  Is that a different way of getting the effect of "eager" or something?
12:26 lizmat that was the only way to satisfy the test #54 in t/spec/S32-io/io-spec-unix.t
12:26 lizmat .eager didn't cut it either  :-(
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12:31 timotimo maybe it's important to have a proper container is allocated or something like that
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12:38 dalek rakudo/nom: 3b9d0cd | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | src/core/IO/Spec/Win32.pm:
12:38 dalek rakudo/nom: Some more obvious optimizations
12:38 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/3b9d0cd1e0
12:40 sergot_ m: lines
12:41 camelia rakudo-moar 264eaf: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
12:42 sergot_ m: my $a = Promise.new; my $b = Promise.in(1); start { try EVAL "lines" }; await Promise.anyof($a, $b); say "alive!";
12:42 camelia rakudo-moar 264eaf: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
12:42 sergot_ shouldn't it end after 1 sec?
12:44 timotimo m: say "test"
12:44 camelia rakudo-moar 264eaf: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
12:44 timotimo m: 0
12:44 camelia rakudo-moar 264eaf: ( no output )
12:44 timotimo huh, that's interesting
12:44 sergot o0
12:44 sergot indeed :)
12:45 sergot m: 0 for ^10;
12:45 camelia rakudo-moar 264eaf: ( no output )
12:45 sergot m: say "test";
12:45 camelia rakudo-moar 264eaf: OUTPUT«test␤»
12:45 sergot m: say "test"
12:45 camelia rakudo-moar 264eaf: OUTPUT«test␤»
12:45 sergot m: my $a = Promise.new; my $b = Promise.in(1); start { try EVAL "lines" }; await Promise.anyof($a, $b); say "alive!";
12:45 camelia rakudo-moar 264eaf: OUTPUT«alive!␤»
12:46 timotimo something tells me, that host08 isn't completely happy
12:46 sergot m: try EVAL "say 1";
12:46 camelia rakudo-moar 264eaf: OUTPUT«1␤»
12:48 PerlJam m: use Test; %*ENV<PATH> = ""; my @want;  is_deeply(IO::Spec::Unix.path, @want, "There is no PATH");
12:48 camelia rakudo-moar 264eaf: OUTPUT«not ok 1 - There is no PATH␤␤# Failed test 'There is no PATH'␤# at /tmp/P30x8Fs5dZ line 1␤# expected: []␤#      got: $( )␤»
12:49 PerlJam lizmat: I think the else branch also wants a "my @"
12:49 lizmat oh?  hmmm... there's no test for that  :--)
12:49 PerlJam heh, true :)
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12:57 dalek roast: be2e100 | duff++ | S32-io/io-spec-unix.t:
12:57 dalek roast: Test the empty path too
12:57 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/be2e100193
12:59 dalek rakudo/nom: 5a02987 | duff++ | src/core/IO/Spec/Unix.pm:
12:59 dalek rakudo/nom: return the same type of thing in both execution paths
12:59 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/5a02987089
12:59 PerlJam (It was bothering me)
13:02 PerlJam Though maybe is_deeply isn't the right test anyway. It's looking for structural equivalence, and I think we only really care about functional equivalence here.
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13:13 lizmat PerlJam: maybe that would be the best fix: make the test just "is"
13:14 lizmat going to be afk for most of the rest of the day: AmsterdamX meeting with social before/afterwards
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13:33 [Coke] the tests didn't finish. on "integration/weird" now, with today's tests set to start in 2m.
13:35 * [Coke] delays today's run.
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13:39 FROGGS [Coke]: can you tell when the slowness started?
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13:47 gtodd nine: was there a github repo somewhere where you kept working sample code for I::P5 ? I see the tests of course but I thought you had a bunch of scripts somehwere?
13:48 gtodd nine: errm oops ignore that :-)
13:51 masak interesting technique, trying to out-technobabble #perl6. I wonder if perlgod quieted down because the channel's reaction was largely curiosity... :P
13:51 masak "semi-meta? what's that?"
13:53 [Coke] FROGGS: this is the first day it's been this slow.
13:53 FROGGS [Coke]: okay, that's something...
13:53 [Coke] yay, it finally finished.
13:54 dalek perl6-roast-data: 91ea7a8 | coke++ | / (5 files):
13:54 dalek perl6-roast-data: today (automated commit)
13:54 dalek perl6-roast-data: review: https://github.com/coke/perl6​-roast-data/commit/91ea7a8200
13:54 gtodd masak: maybe semi-meta is ancient perl4 slang
13:54 gtodd wait ... perl4 "slang" ... hmmm
13:54 FROGGS no.
13:54 FROGGS please
13:54 FROGGS *g*
13:54 gtodd hah
13:55 gtodd Inline::Perl4  :-)
13:55 FROGGS unlikely :o)
13:58 * [Coke] wonders if perlgod was some kind of meta troll.
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13:58 masak only a semi-meta troll.
13:58 masak the other half was genuinely curious whether we did that stuff :P
13:59 dalek rakudo-star-daily: 016f7c9 | coke++ | log/MoarVM-version.log:
13:59 dalek rakudo-star-daily: today (automated commit)
13:59 dalek rakudo-star-daily: review: https://github.com/coke/rakudo​-star-daily/commit/016f7c9feb
14:00 jnthn .oO( You do semi-meta programming with $obj.HᵔV of course... )
14:00 masak wouldn't a meta troll be kind of the Dexter Morgan of trolls? someone who only trolls trolls?
14:01 [Coke] maybe perl 6 is just a long running prank.
14:01 masak that would explain so much.
14:02 moritz [Coke]: the first prank is history for which two dynamic, virtual machines were written :-)
14:02 moritz (though now that I said it, maybe Brainfuck can compete on that level)
14:03 jnthn A bf vm has a little less to provide... :)
14:03 moritz I know :-)
14:03 jnthn Didn't I write us a bf interp here once? :)
14:04 masak a semi-meta troll (someone who goes up half a level and trolls from there) is a completely different beast from a meta-semi-troll (someone who half-trolls your half-troll)
14:04 masak jnthn: yes, you did. I challenged the channel to do it in one line of IRC evalbot.
14:04 masak jnthn: including the Hello World program.
14:05 jnthn haha :)
14:06 [Coke] j: say "why so slow?"
14:06 camelia rakudo-jvm 5a0298: OUTPUT«Can't call method "syswrite" on an undefined value at /home/p6eval/jvm-rakudo/eval-client.pl line 32.␤»
14:06 jnthn Good excuse... :P
14:06 masak both of these are distinct from a meta-troll-semi (the semifinals of meta-trolling)
14:07 * masak hugs himself, half-heartedly
14:07 * moritz one-and-a-semi hugs masak
14:08 moritz (with both arms, but only half of my tentacles)
14:08 masak I only need 51% of all the hugs to gain an absolute hug majority.
14:08 moritz "a little hug becomes huge instantly\n if you just add silent e" -- Tom Lehrer
14:09 nine masak: would you need 51 % or just > 50 %?
14:09 tadzik I wouldn't settle for half-solutions
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14:11 moritz if you won't settle, you'll have to sue!
14:11 moritz well, semi-sue :-)
14:12 gtodd [Coke]: ongoing host08 issues ?
14:13 masak nine: 50% plus one hug, yes. thanks.
14:13 PerlJam How do you know when you've reached 50%?
14:14 PerlJam I would figure that hugs are like love ... you can always just make more.
14:15 gtodd m: use v6; "perl5++".say ;
14:15 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«perl5++␤»
14:16 raiph I just semi met a semi troll asking "Why threads rather than forks?" http://www.reddit.com/r/perl/comme​nts/2h4ygn/perl_6_concurrency_make​s_progress_rakudo_moar_vm/ckwe4of
14:17 gtodd hmm  "perl5++".say ;    on a t-shirt
14:18 masak m: 5++
14:18 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«Cannot assign to an immutable value␤  in sub postfix:<++> at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:4862␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/pBZjr4eQns:1␤␤»
14:18 gtodd heh
14:18 gtodd that on a t-shirt would be better :)
14:20 PerlJam m: my $p = "perl5"; $p++; say $p;  #  ;P
14:20 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«perl6␤»
14:22 FROGGS m: 6;$_="perl5";.++;.say;#;P
14:22 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«perl6␤»
14:22 FROGGS \o/ We can do noise too! \o/
14:23 jnthn raiph: Threads are more portably supported for one. What's fork mean on Windows?
14:23 jnthn raiph: No reason you can't do a fork on a platform that supports it. But it's more an apples vs. oranges question to me. I'd use them to solve different problems.
14:24 PerlJam That's probably why I always wonder why people write/speak as if fork and threads are pitted against one another.
14:26 Woodi just processess have a fame to be outdated technology ;)
14:26 jnthn To handwave a lot, process = unit of memory protection, thread = unit of scheduling.
14:26 Juerd To whoever upgraded bash on feather: thanks :)
14:27 Woodi hallo today :)
14:27 Juerd Also, feather's going to be decomissioned and shut down soonish (in a few months)
14:27 moritz eeks.
14:27 Juerd There will be a new virtual machine specifically for running IRC clients
14:27 Woodi FROGGS: how it work ?? #  6;$_="perl5";.++;.say;
14:27 Juerd I'll announce it with more details in a week or so
14:28 moritz I'll ask my employer if they're willing to give us a machine for hosting the websites etc.
14:28 yeahnoob joined #perl6
14:28 PerlJam Woodi: .++  is the same as $_.++ and .say is the same as $_.say
14:28 yeahnoob joined #perl6
14:29 Woodi but .++ incrases string ?
14:29 FROGGS yes
14:29 moritz sure
14:29 moritz why not? :-)
14:29 Juerd feather's almost 10 years old and I'm no longer really in the web hosting business. At this point, I'm keeping a server running for a few open source and hobby projects.
14:29 FROGGS like: "foo".succ
14:29 FROGGS m: say "foo".succ
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14:29 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«fop␤»
14:30 Woodi is this a someones usecase ? :)
14:30 yeahnoob joined #perl6
14:30 Juerd moritz: I'm considering keeping feather2 around. It causes no trouble and needs only very little maintenance.
14:30 Juerd moritz: Likewise, I'll provide an alternative for feather1's primary use: irc clients in screen/tmux
14:31 PerlJam Woodi: $filename++ while -e $filename;  # one possible use
14:31 Juerd Heh, that's one place where I'd use "until not" :D
14:31 PerlJam er, sorry about the P5 there.  I still think that way :)
14:32 Woodi PerlJam: oki
14:33 Woodi but it's still race condition or something like that ;)
14:33 PerlJam not when there's only one runner.
14:33 Juerd Haha
14:33 Juerd "There's a race condition in your code." "Not without concurrency."
14:34 Juerd I have to remember that one.
14:35 carlin m: my $filename = "auth.log.0"; $filename++; say $filename
14:35 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«auti.log.0␤»
14:35 PerlJam carlin: you'll have to talk with TimToady about that as it is currently designed more for ...
14:35 Woodi but still nice to have example when just reading around
14:36 PerlJam m: my $fn = "pic1.jpg"; $fn++; say $fn;
14:36 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«pic2.jpg␤»
14:36 carlin that makes sense
14:37 Juerd m: my $fn = "pic9.jpg"; say ++$fn
14:37 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«pid0.jpg␤»
14:37 Juerd Meh.
14:37 gtodd oopsie
14:37 Juerd Smart increment is a bit too smart :P
14:37 carlin m: my $filename = "pic09.jpg"; $filename++; say $filename
14:37 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«pic10.jpg␤»
14:37 Juerd m: my $fn = "pic99.jpg"; say ++$fn
14:37 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«pid00.jpg␤»
14:38 Juerd :P
14:38 gtodd there must be away to dumb it down :)
14:38 Juerd use less <smart>;
14:38 PerlJam provide your own .succ
14:38 PerlJam or "manually" increment
14:38 Juerd PerlJam: That seems like a lot of trouble for not having to concatenate manually :P
14:39 gtodd sometimes a string is just a string .... (Freud)
14:41 PerlJam If we come up with good names for the various string incrementing semantics that people want, we can probably make some nice declarative way to say what you mean.
14:43 PerlJam Though it'll probably have to be something like  { use str-inc :dumb;  $filename++ } rather than $filename++:dumb    # (maybe)
14:43 gtodd m: "observer pattern is mathematically equivalent to the iterator pattern".succ
14:43 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: ( no output )
14:43 JimmyZ joined #perl6
14:44 gtodd m: "observer pattern is mathematically equivalent to the iterator pattern".succ.say
14:44 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«observer pattern is mathematically equivalent to the iterator pattero␤»
14:44 FROGGS pattero olé!
14:45 JimmyZ speaking fo https://github.com/jonathansl​enders/python-prompt-toolkit, windows support is not hard, since linenoise support windows, which we can learn from
14:45 erkan joined #perl6
14:45 erkan joined #perl6
14:45 JimmyZ the chinese input supporting is intersting
14:45 dalek rakudo/nom: b5032fc | (Tobias Leich)++ | src/core/Main.pm:
14:45 dalek rakudo/nom: re-add program name fiddling in $?USAGE
14:45 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/b5032fc5fa
14:46 carlin m: for <pic1.jpg> .. <pic9.jpg> { .say }
14:46 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«pic1.jpg␤pic2.jpg␤pic3.jpg␤pic4.jpg␤pi​c5.jpg␤pic6.jpg␤pic7.jpg␤pic8.jpg␤pic9.jpg␤»
14:46 FROGGS m: .say for [..] <pic1.jpg pic9.jpg>
14:46 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«pic1.jpg␤pic2.jpg␤pic3.jpg␤pic4.jpg␤pi​c5.jpg␤pic6.jpg␤pic7.jpg␤pic8.jpg␤pic9.jpg␤»
14:47 FROGGS I love it
14:47 gtodd nice
14:47 sjn that's cool
14:47 FROGGS (whoever invented REDUCE)++
14:47 gtodd what is [..] called
14:47 FROGGS reduce
14:47 gtodd infix reduce operator
14:47 gtodd ?
14:48 gtodd hehe
14:48 FROGGS infix reduce meta op
14:48 FROGGS or so
14:48 gtodd :-D
14:48 FROGGS because [ ] takes an existing op :o)
14:48 FROGGS (any existing infix)
14:48 PerlJam m: .say for [..] <pic8.jpg pic12.jpg>  # oops
14:48 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: ( no output )
14:48 JimmyZ m: .say for 'pic1.jpg1' ... 'pic9.jpg9'
14:48 gtodd so it is "meta"
14:48 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«(timeout)pic1.jpg1␤pic2.jpg1␤pic3.jpg1​␤pic4.jpg1␤pic5.jpg1␤pic6.jpg1␤pic7.jpg1␤pic8​.jpg1␤pic9.jpg1␤pid0.jpg1␤pid1.jpg1␤pid2.jpg1​␤pid3.jpg1␤pid4.jpg1␤pid5.jpg1␤pid6.jpg1␤pid7​.jpg1␤pid8.jpg1␤pid9.jpg1␤pie0.jpg1␤pie1.jp…»
14:49 gtodd m: .say for [++] <pic8.jpg pic12.jpg>
14:49 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«[31m===[0mSORRY![31m===[0m Error while compiling /tmp/Qflb0cPDMt�Preceding context expects a term, but found infix + instead�at /tmp/Qflb0cPDMt:1�------> [32m.say for [++[33m�[31m] <pic8.jpg pic12.jpg>[0m�»
14:49 sjn hehe
14:49 gtodd oops
14:49 gtodd hjahaha
14:49 FROGGS not an infix :o)
14:49 JimmyZ m: .say for 'pic1.jpg1' ... 'pic9.jpg9'
14:49 JimmyZ timeout?
14:49 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«(timeout)pic1.jpg1␤pic2.jpg1␤pic3.jpg1​␤pic4.jpg1␤pic5.jpg1␤pic6.jpg1␤pic7.jpg1␤pic8​.jpg1␤pic9.jpg1␤pid0.jpg1␤pid1.jpg1␤pid2.jpg1​␤pid3.jpg1␤pid4.jpg1␤pid5.jpg1␤pid6.jpg1␤pid7​.jpg1␤pid8.jpg1␤pid9.jpg1␤pie0.jpg1␤pie1.jp…»
14:49 FROGGS JimmyZ: because it will never hit 'pic9.jpg9'
14:49 FROGGS its infinite
14:50 PerlJam pic9.jpg9 is a *looooong* way from pic1.jpg1  :)
14:50 FROGGS it's*
14:52 treehug88 joined #perl6
14:52 carlin m: say ("jpg" .. "png").elems
14:52 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«4005␤»
14:52 gtodd 10^81 ??
14:52 FROGGS[mobile] joined #perl6
14:52 moritz it never increments the final 1
14:52 FROGGS exactly
14:53 FROGGS m: say ('pic1.jpg1' ... 'pic9.jpg9').elems
14:53 tony-o a boat load
14:53 gtodd haha
14:53 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
14:54 JimmyZ haha
14:54 gtodd camelia got mad at FROGGS
14:55 FROGGS[mobile] :o)
14:55 Woodi could we have grammars for generating output, not reading/parsing ? :)
14:56 PerlJam m: .say for "2x8" .. "3a3";  # this is another nice property of the existing Str.succ semantics
14:56 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«2x8␤2x9␤2y0␤2y1␤2y2␤2y3␤2y4␤2y5​␤2y6␤2y7␤2y8␤2y9␤2z0␤2z1␤2z2␤2z3␤2z4␤2​z5␤2z6␤2z7␤2z8␤2z9␤3a0␤3a1␤3a2␤3a3␤»
14:57 gtodd PerlJam:  hmmm good names for string incrementing  semantics ...
14:58 Woodi eg. software version numbers, complicated sequences of photo files for batch processing, etc :)
14:59 PerlJam Woodi: I think jnthn even did a talk on using grammars as generators
15:00 PerlJam Woodi: yeah ... http://jnthn.net/papers/2013​-yapcna-grammar-generate.pdf
15:00 gtodd m: .say for "a1" .. "h8";
15:00 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«a1␤a2␤a3␤a4␤a5␤a6␤a7␤a8␤a9␤b0␤b1␤b​2␤b3␤b4␤b5␤b6␤b7␤b8␤b9␤c0␤c1␤c2␤c3␤c4␤c5␤​c6␤c7␤c8␤c9␤d0␤d1␤d2␤d3␤d4␤d5␤d6␤d7␤d8␤d9​␤e0␤e1␤e2␤e3␤e4␤e5␤e6␤e7␤e8␤e9␤f0␤f1␤f…»
15:00 timotimo Woodi: jnthn wrote a module about it and a talk
15:00 timotimo ah, PerlJam already found it
15:02 gtodd hmm so can I tell .say for "a1" .. "h8"; to only do 8 numbers for each letter using .succ ?
15:02 PerlJam gtodd: not without writing your own .succ
15:03 gtodd chessboard
15:03 timotimo m: .say for ("a" .. "h") X~ (1..8)
15:03 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«a1␤a2␤a3␤a4␤a5␤a6␤a7␤a8␤b1␤b2␤b3␤b​4␤b5␤b6␤b7␤b8␤c1␤c2␤c3␤c4␤c5␤c6␤c7␤c8␤d1␤​d2␤d3␤d4␤d5␤d6␤d7␤d8␤e1␤e2␤e3␤e4␤e5␤e6␤e7​␤e8␤f1␤f2␤f3␤f4␤f5␤f6␤f7␤f8␤g1␤g2␤g3␤g…»
15:03 timotimo ^- much cleaner
15:03 timotimo IMO.
15:03 PerlJam and more Saying What You Mean too
15:03 gtodd timotimo: yeah ... I think I saw someone do that once :-)  I was just wondering what .succ was supposed to be able to do or control
15:04 timotimo succ is "smart"
15:04 timotimo it known about a lot of series that belong together
15:04 timotimo .u roman numeral
15:04 yoleaux U+2160 ROMAN NUMERAL ONE [Nl] (Ⅰ)
15:04 yoleaux U+2161 ROMAN NUMERAL TWO [Nl] (Ⅱ)
15:04 yoleaux U+2162 ROMAN NUMERAL THREE [Nl] (Ⅲ)
15:04 gtodd ah ok ... brute smartness :)
15:04 timotimo m: say "Ⅰ"..*
15:04 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«"Ⅰ"..Inf␤»
15:04 timotimo hah
15:04 timotimo m: say ("Ⅰ"..*)[50]
15:04 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«ⅣⅢ␤»
15:04 timotimo m: say ("Ⅰ"..*)[^50]
15:04 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«Ⅰ Ⅱ Ⅲ Ⅳ Ⅴ Ⅵ Ⅶ Ⅷ Ⅸ Ⅹ Ⅺ Ⅻ ⅠⅠ ⅠⅡ ⅠⅢ ⅠⅣ ⅠⅤ ⅠⅥ ⅠⅦ ⅠⅧ ⅠⅨ ⅠⅩ ⅠⅪ ⅠⅫ ⅡⅠ ⅡⅡ ⅡⅢ ⅡⅣ ⅡⅤ ⅡⅥ ⅡⅦ ⅡⅧ ⅡⅨ ⅡⅩ ⅡⅪ ⅡⅫ ⅢⅠ ⅢⅡ ⅢⅢ ⅢⅣ ⅢⅤ Ⅲ…»
15:04 PerlJam heh
15:04 timotimo not exactly correct, but you get the idea
15:05 timotimo m: say ("α"..*)[^50]
15:05 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«α β γ δ ε ζ η θ ι κ λ μ ν ξ ο π ρ σ τ υ φ χ ψ ω αα αβ αγ αδ αε αζ αη αθ αι ακ αλ αμ αν αξ αο απ αρ ασ ατ αυ αφ αχ αψ αω βα ββ␤»
15:05 timotimo m: say ("1"..*)[^50]
15:05 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50␤»
15:06 timotimo m: say ("①" .. *)[^50]
15:06 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«① ② ③ ④ ⑤ ⑥ ⑦ ⑧ ⑨ ⑩ ⑪ ⑫ ⑬ ⑭ ⑮ ⑯ ⑰ ⑱ ⑲ ⑳ ①① ①② ①③ ①④ ①⑤ ①⑥ ①⑦ ①⑧ ①⑨ ①⑩ ①⑪ ①⑫ ①⑬ ①⑭ ①⑮ ①⑯ ①⑰ ①⑱ ①⑲ ①⑳ ②① ②② ②③ ②④ ②⑤ …»
15:06 PerlJam m: say ("αⅠ"..*)[^50]
15:06 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«αⅠ αⅡ αⅢ αⅣ αⅤ αⅥ αⅦ αⅧ αⅨ αⅩ αⅪ αⅫ βⅠ βⅡ βⅢ βⅣ βⅤ βⅥ βⅦ βⅧ βⅨ βⅩ βⅪ βⅫ γⅠ γⅡ γⅢ γⅣ γⅤ γⅥ γⅦ γⅧ γⅨ γⅩ γⅪ γⅫ δⅠ δⅡ δⅢ δⅣ δⅤ δⅥ δ…»
15:06 PerlJam huh
15:07 PerlJam m: say ("α1"..*)[^50]
15:07 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«α1 α2 α3 α4 α5 α6 α7 α8 α9 β0 β1 β2 β3 β4 β5 β6 β7 β8 β9 γ0 γ1 γ2 γ3 γ4 γ5 γ6 γ7 γ8 γ9 δ0 δ1 δ2 δ3 δ4 δ5 δ6 δ7 δ8 δ9 ε0 ε1 ε2 ε3 ε4 ε5 ε6 ε7 ε8 ε9 ζ0␤»
15:08 PerlJam Is there something about the number 12 relating to roman numerals that I don't know about ?
15:08 leont Hours I guess
15:09 colomon PerlJam: clock face
15:09 PerlJam that's still weird
15:10 PerlJam unless that's where the unicode characters "overflow"
15:12 PerlJam huh, that *is* where they overflow
15:12 PerlJam stupid clock faces  ;)
15:13 tony-o weird
15:13 JimmyZ joined #perl6
15:14 Akagi201 joined #perl6
15:15 kaare_ joined #perl6
15:15 JimmyZ_ joined #perl6
15:16 kbaker joined #perl6
15:16 SamuraiJack_ joined #perl6
15:17 gtodd m: say ("🀰" ..*)[^10]
15:17 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«🀰 🀰 🀰 🀰 🀰 🀰 🀰 🀰 🀰 🀰␤»
15:18 Hor|zon joined #perl6
15:18 gtodd I thought dominoes could  form a sequence camelia
15:22 lichtkind joined #perl6
15:30 lichtkind the modules lsit omly contains 100 ?
15:30 gtodd m: .say for (1..Inf ==> grep(*.is-prime) ==> map({ "{++state $n}: $_" }) )[^10]
15:30 camelia rakudo-moar 5a0298: OUTPUT«1: 2␤2: 3␤3: 5␤4: 7␤5: 11␤6: 13␤7: 17␤8: 19␤9: 23␤10: 29␤»
15:41 FROGGS joined #perl6
15:57 treehug88 joined #perl6
16:03 tony-o lichtkind: it's paged now
16:05 lichtkind tony-o there are the page links?
16:07 brrt joined #perl6
16:08 Sqirrel joined #perl6
16:09 dalek panda/CPAN: bd34c5d | (Tobias Leich)++ | / (6 files):
16:09 dalek panda/CPAN: implement `panda --cpan update`
16:09 dalek panda/CPAN:
16:09 dalek panda/CPAN: This will download the list of packages/binaries/etc. We also download these when 24hours-ish
16:09 dalek panda/CPAN: have passed for commands like: --cpan install, --cpan search, etc.
16:09 dalek panda/CPAN: review: https://github.com/tadzik/panda/commit/bd34c5dc86
16:09 timotimo m: ((1..Inf ==> grep *.is-prime) Z=> 1..*)[^10].fmt("%02d: % 2d")
16:10 camelia rakudo-moar b5032f: ( no output )
16:10 timotimo m: ((1..Inf ==> grep *.is-prime) Z=> 1..*)[^10].fmt("%02d: % 2d").say
16:10 camelia rakudo-moar b5032f: OUTPUT«02:  1 03:  2 05:  3 07:  4 11:  5 13:  6 17:  7 19:  8 23:  9 29:  10␤»
16:10 timotimo gtodd: ^- you like?
16:11 gtodd :-)
16:13 gtodd I like feeds bit the use of  Z and .fmt("%02d: % 2d")  feels more perlish  ...
16:13 gtodd but
16:13 timotimo OK :)
16:13 gtodd hehe
16:14 gtodd the problem of course in learning perl6 is .. well it sort of is *already* is perl10 :-)
16:14 timotimo almost everything is version 10, given the right base
16:14 gtodd heheh
16:18 tony-o lichtkind: i didn't see any but i noticed the other day that the module list only
16:18 tony-o went to m
16:19 lichtkind to i actually
16:19 tony-o yea to i now
16:19 tony-o i had to search to get the module
16:27 raydiak joined #perl6
16:35 timotimo .tell japhb i really need a tool or something to figure out what makes perl6-bench discard data ... i have done a benchmark set for lots and lots and lots of releases now and all i get is a row of 100.0 for all of them :(
16:35 yoleaux timotimo: I'll pass your message to japhb.
16:36 spider-mario joined #perl6
16:38 erkan joined #perl6
16:41 _slade_ joined #perl6
16:43 M_o_C joined #perl6
16:44 anaeem1_ joined #perl6
16:45 _slade_ In Perl 6's synopses, is 'closure' used to refer to any block of code that creates a lexical scope?
16:47 _slade_ Nevermind, it makes sense. Just was a bit confused since the glossary doesn't provide a definition.
16:49 yeahnoob m: my $s; for 1..10000 {$s+=$_;} say $s;
16:49 camelia rakudo-moar b5032f: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
16:50 _slade_ m: [+] 1 .. 1e4
16:50 camelia rakudo-moar b5032f: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
16:50 yeahnoob the old problem from stackoverfow
16:51 yeahnoob p: my $s; for 1..10000 {$s+=$_}; say $s;
16:52 camelia rakudo-parrot b5032f: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
16:53 _slade_ m: $n = 1e4; $n*($n-1)/2;
16:53 camelia rakudo-moar b5032f: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
16:53 yeahnoob m: say "Better Now?";
16:53 camelia rakudo-moar b5032f: OUTPUT«Better Now?␤»
16:53 yeahnoob yun
16:57 yeahnoob m: say ("甲"..*)[^10]
16:57 camelia rakudo-moar b5032f: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
16:58 yeahnoob m: say ("壹"..*)[^10]
16:59 camelia rakudo-moar b5032f: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
16:59 _slade_ [^10] ?
17:04 treehug8_ joined #perl6
17:06 immortal joined #perl6
17:06 immortal joined #perl6
17:06 moritz [] is indexing
17:06 moritz and ^10 is like 0..9
17:07 yeahnoob joined #perl6
17:07 erkan joined #perl6
17:07 erkan joined #perl6
17:08 _slade_ moritz: th
17:08 _slade_ thanks*
17:10 Hor|zon joined #perl6
17:12 treehug88 joined #perl6
17:19 _slade_ Huh. ^^10 generates the same range as ^10.
17:19 _slade_ I was half expecting it to mean 0 ^..^ 10
17:20 colomon _slade_: I think it's probably ^(^10)
17:21 colomon and ^(@a) means 0 .. @a.length-1
17:21 _slade_ Isn't it .elems?
17:22 colomon _slade_: probably, I usually don't call it directly.  :)
17:24 PerlJam m: say ^^^^^^^10;   #  :)
17:24 camelia rakudo-moar b5032f: OUTPUT«0..^10␤»
17:24 Exodist joined #perl6
17:26 _slade_ colomon: my perl6 code is still pretty glossolalic so I use .elems a lot :)
17:27 Hor|zon joined #perl6
17:37 Mso150_g_s_s joined #perl6
17:37 japhb botsnack
17:37 yoleaux 16:35Z <timotimo> japhb: i really need a tool or something to figure out what makes perl6-bench discard data ... i have done a benchmark set for lots and lots and lots of releases now and all i get is a row of 100.0 for all of them :(
17:38 japhb timotimo: I'm about to head out, but you should be able to find the answers in `perldoc analyze`

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