Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2015-03-09

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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Time Nick Message
00:04 Mouq raydiak: We already removed a lot that were parrot-only, but there are still more
00:05 Mouq raydiak: Re: prioritization, there is a section in "edit search" to change that… and I think it's a very good idea to look into applying it
00:06 ShimmerFairy I still wonder how helpful it may be to have our own separate RT instance for rakudo. (At least, it feels interesting to me to have P5 and P6 bugs share the same space)
00:08 Mouq ShimmerFairy: Well it might be helpful with organization. There's a lot of different regions of the Perl 6 language and the Perl 6 compiler, and we really don't (can't?) organize our tickets into these regions effectively
00:09 ShimmerFairy I know we've talked of moving before, and I thought "our own RT" might be a happy medium between "keep RT" and "use github issues"
00:09 ShimmerFairy (and maybe we could use something other than bitcard, something that actually supports Unicode :P)
00:09 timotimo raydiak: allegedly angular 1.3 got a whole lot of performance improvements over 1.2; i'm not sure which version we're using for the profiler
00:10 * raydiak would strongly prefer to be using github issues, as he has several problems with rt usage including repeated mysterious breakage of his account where he does not have access to view bugs when he is logged in, which was supposedly fixed by [Coke]++ once or twice alraedy
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00:10 timotimo but maybe updating that can lead to a nice performance boost?
00:10 raydiak timotimo: yep good call, looks like 1.2.21
00:10 ShimmerFairy raydiak: perhaps that could be fixed by not using bitcard? (AFAIK bitcard is not a part of RT)
00:10 Mouq timotimo: Err, that's about Angular, not RT, right?
00:11 Mouq oh lol
00:11 raydiak ShimmerFairy: I didn't see another option when I went to create an account
00:11 timotimo yeah, we're using angular 1.2 there
00:11 Mouq sorry, I lost the thread of the convo :)
00:11 ShimmerFairy raydiak: yeah, but if we were to set up our own RT, we could choose to not use bitcard to handle accounts for the system :)
00:11 timotimo i have no idea how uch would have to change to get from 1.2 to 1.3
00:12 timotimo all i know is for big-ish profiles, i have to click "don't kill this tab yet, please" twenty times and then chrome says "oops, this tab crashed!" anyway ;(
00:12 ShimmerFairy I used to be against RT too, but not so much anymore. I appreciate strongly that it lets you submit bugs without an account, and if we would just add in a web-based "new bug" entry form (instead of only having email), it'd be fine by me.
00:14 raydiak timotimo: yeah half or more of what I have on the ecosystem brings it to its knees
00:14 raydiak even in the smallest test runs
00:15 raydiak (considering that raytracing a single pixel doesn't give you much of a functional test)
00:15 timotimo not that terrible for me, but i often do things with not too many different routines
00:16 Mouq ShimmerFairy: Also, I have no idea how to/if you can do formatting on RT
00:17 ShimmerFairy I will say though, that github issues doesn't look/feel as powerful as RT or other systems. I could easily be wrong on that, though.
00:17 raydiak timotimo: I've been trying to do things in nice manageable chunks, but apparently most of what I want to do just necessarily involves nested potentially long-running loops and so forth
00:17 Mouq ShimmerFairy: OTOH, think there's a lot to be said for the power of good UI :P
00:17 raydiak not that much of that couldn't be at least improved by a marginal reduction in my laziness :)
00:19 ShimmerFairy Perhaps instead of angularjs, you could turn to server-side scripting, like *cough* Perl 6? :)
00:20 ShimmerFairy Mouq: it's certainly not a binary choice between RT and GI, but I do think we need our own, separate bug tracker. (And I also still feel like GI doesn't have as much manipulexity as other systems, and perhaps not enough for our needs)
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00:25 Mouq ShimmerFairy: +1
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00:27 ShimmerFairy I feel like something that lets you submit bugs without an account would be nice (esp. considering we're working on a compiler, so we could reasonably assume lots of people will only ever have one bug to report), but I don't know how many bug trackers do that.
00:28 ShimmerFairy I also don't know if other people here like the sound of that so much :)
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00:43 raydiak afaik we have no desire to limit or prevent bug reports, though I suspect such a thing could be accomplished on github too (albeit with some extra work on our own e-mail relay and/or submission form)
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00:47 raydiak wrt js (angular or otherwise), I am not so sure about requiring a local webserver just to view the results of your profile run, but it is possible that we might be able to move more of the processing from the js to the nqp which builds it
00:48 dalek roast: 0cc81eb | Mouq++ | S32-io/io-handle.t:
00:48 dalek roast: Add test for RT #123888
00:48 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/0cc81eb5c1
00:48 synopsebot Link: https://rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Display.html?id=123888
00:48 raydiak I'll know more when I look in detail; today is mostly just having a strategy meeting with myself
00:49 Mouq It's unfortunate that https://github.com/camelia is taken :9
00:52 raydiak heh you saw right where I was going with that :) kinda wonder if it isn't one of us who reserved it
00:54 timotimo the biggest problem with our profiler data blobs is currently that we put the complete call tree in there
00:55 timotimo it's potentially ginormous
00:55 timotimo there's a branch in which i tried to "compress" the call-tree as it's being filled with data by the low-level moarvm-internal profiling instructions
00:55 timotimo but it gives wrong results and i haven't had the tenacity to figure out what wrongs it
00:57 raydiak compress as in get rid of unneeded data, or as in lossless compression?
00:58 timotimo collapsing all nodes below a given node into a single node
00:58 timotimo before creating the nodes below that note
00:58 raydiak oh yes I remember this
00:58 timotimo "finite_callgraph_depth" is the name of the branch
01:00 timotimo oh, my explanation was wrong
01:00 timotimo this happens after the nodes have been created
01:00 timotimo the code runs where the internal data is turned into the data structure that is going to be json-dumped later on
01:02 raydiak it'd definitely be nice to have, though I don't think there is going to be any getting around the need to make the JS more robust in the long run
01:03 raydiak but...gotta run, sorry to ditch out in the middle of this :)
01:03 raydiak o/ #perl6
01:03 retupmoca .botsnack
01:03 yoleaux :D
01:04 timotimo it doesn't seem like any breaking changes between 1.2 and 1.3 would have an impact on our profiler app
01:04 timotimo bye raydiak :)
01:04 timotimo hello retupmoca
01:06 retupmoca hello
01:11 timotimo it seems like just changing from 1.2 to 1.3 makes sorting by exclusive time more than twice as fast
01:11 timotimo however, the pages of the profiler are no longer exclusively visible, they are now all visible at the same time
01:11 timotimo likely due to a change in expressions?
01:12 timotimo ng-show="Tab == 'Overview'" is how we did that
01:12 dalek roast: 1aa7d9d | Mouq++ | S05-grammar/parse_and_parsefile.t:
01:12 dalek roast: Add a test for RT111768
01:12 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/1aa7d9d576
01:15 timotimo errors.angularjs.org is down, and so i cannot figure out what this exception is supposed to mean >:(
01:39 TimToady Mouq: that test is...deliciously perverse :)
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02:27 japhb .ask jnthn In your OO::Monitors module, is there any attempt to support inheritance heirarchies, in which all classes are monitors?  In other words, can it handle: monitor A { method foo }; monitor B is A { method bar };  and keep foo and bar mutexed?
02:27 yoleaux 7 Mar 2015 10:39Z <jnthn> japhb: $*SCHEDULER.uncaught_handler = -> $ex { #`( do something ) }
02:27 yoleaux japhb: I'll pass your message to jnthn.
02:30 japhb .tell jnthn Yeah, shortly after I .asked you, someone (timotimo?) pointed out the workaround of setting uncaught_handler *after* creating the new $*SCHEDULER, because of the "BUILD from a composed Role gets smashed" problem.
02:30 yoleaux japhb: I'll pass your message to jnthn.
02:30 japhb .tell jnthn But even so, I'm unable to figure out how to *trigger* an uncaught exception that .uncaught_handler *does* catch.
02:30 yoleaux japhb: I'll pass your message to jnthn.
02:31 japhb Man, I'm really tired of TZ skew.
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04:03 ugexe then ill just fatpack that bitch into a standalone
04:03 ugexe oops...
04:12 avuserow .ask FROGGS I'm looking at a bug in nqp-j (https://github.com/perl6/nqp/issues/224) and saw you did some work with eof. I'm testing a patch, but was curious if there's any reason you didn't use fc.size() rather than getc?
04:12 yoleaux avuserow: I'll pass your message to FROGGS.
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05:03 * raydiak drops a pin
05:04 TimToady ow!
05:04 * raydiak picks up said pin and offers TimToady a band-aid with apologies for his carelessness
05:06 avuserow o/ raydiak
05:07 raydiak heya avuserow
05:07 avuserow how's it going?
05:07 * avuserow is waiting on a jvm spectest :|
05:08 raydiak eh, won't complain, everything I'm working on atm is going fairly well...how about you?
05:08 * TimToady is still failing lots of JVM tests
05:08 raydiak due to...???...
05:09 avuserow just hopping around on various ideas, trying to see where I get stuck and reporting bugs as possible
05:09 avuserow yeah, JVM looks pretty unhappy so far for me :(
05:09 * raydiak has been worrying about the state of our jvm backend vs tuits
05:10 TimToady only fails about 64 test files...
05:10 TimToady well, some of them are unexpectedly succeeding TODOs
05:11 avuserow both jvm and moar have distinct failure modes for my current idea. the JVM issue appears fixable with my skillset though
05:12 raydiak avuserow: what is your current idea?
05:12 avuserow I have a lot of large .sql backups from an old project, and I want to convert it to an incremental format to deduplicate some data. First step is parsing 4-5 GB .sql files.
05:13 avuserow (this being the more fun course of action, rather than just adjusting my data hoarding habits, of course)
05:14 raydiak ow...I can feel your pain from here...large datasets seems to be one of our weaknesses for the time being
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05:15 avuserow I think the JVM can parse about 1 file in a half hour or so, which is viable
05:15 avuserow moar would be faster but I run out of memory
05:15 raydiak (faster :) )
05:15 avuserow and once I get things working, I can potentially improve the grammar
05:16 raydiak how so?
05:16 avuserow one thing I have to match is a string that may include backslashed quotemarks. I had a really difficult time figuring out how to do this, so my strategy might be wasteful
05:17 raydiak may I see?
05:18 avuserow https://gist.github.com/avuserow/3e02faf868f743de03ef
05:18 TimToady [ <-["]> | \\'"' ]* is the normalish way
05:19 TimToady though might be faster with ||
05:19 avuserow I'm hoping to make a full-ish SQL grammar someday
05:19 TimToady since most chars are not \\"
05:19 ShimmerFairy TimToady: I assume it's <-["]> and not . to account for a closing " ?
05:20 TimToady er, <-[\\"]> maybe
05:20 TimToady if there's anything else that can be backslashed, the <-\\"]> | \\(.) or so
05:20 avuserow somehow I was able to have a simple-string rule and a string-with-escapes rule, and it picks the right one... not sure if that works universally, but it made the smaller benchmarks about 3x faster to have both rules
05:21 TimToady er, only spelled right
05:22 TimToady or you can do [ <-[\\"]>+ || \\(.) ]* with the + to collect more non-specials in one match
05:23 avuserow I tried something like that but couldn't get it to work. I'll have to try that again
05:23 ShimmerFairy I would probably do  / ['\' <[nt\\'"]> | .]* /  or similar (for backslash sequences of \n, \t, \\, \', and \")
05:24 avuserow but yeah, actually writing the grammar was a fun experience. obviously I didn't start with a formal definition of SQL, which I plan on revisiting, but it was still nice how fast I got the basic parser up and running
05:25 avuserow once I get a full end to end parse on this file, I'm planning a writeup
05:27 TimToady doing it with . means you're definitely relying on LTM, so || wouldn't work
05:27 TimToady well, it might in that order, but certainly not in the other order
05:27 TimToady but if someone backwhacks something you're not anticipating, the . could end up eating a single backslash, which might be surprising
05:29 * raydiak worked on something long long ago in his abused intern years, never released, called morphbase, which grappled with similar issues and several more...though that was written in core p5, no grammars/Parse::RecDescent/etc
05:29 raydiak but in any case, it relied on even vs odd number of backslashes
05:30 raydiak b/c the even cuonts can always be ignored as N number of literal Q«\»
05:30 raydiak *counts
05:30 avuserow I wrote a p5 script to change strings down to a single letter, and had several issues with getting _that_ right
05:31 ShimmerFairy TimToady: sure, it's hard to write something like that in a general sense, without letting some potential issues through.
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06:14 avuserow \o/ parsed the file completely after patching a bug in nqp-j. now to submit a PR, and refactor to actually use the information
06:28 masak good morning, #perl6
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06:47 perl6_newbee morning or night respectively
06:57 [Tux] Mouq, awake?
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07:00 perl6_newbee all are sleeping :-)
07:01 [Tux] .tell Mouq https://gist.github.com/Tux/3efcf2bbcb859a27ef6a <= RT#123888 is incomplete. reopen?
07:01 synopsebot Link: https://rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Display.html?id=123888
07:01 yoleaux [Tux]: I'll pass your message to Mouq.
07:02 [Tux] note that there is no newline *at all* in my example, incontrast to the example that shows the current fix
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07:09 perl6_newbee [Tux]: when I want to make a sugegstion, can I create a ticket via rakudobug@perl6.org with the tag [SUGGESTION] or should I use [bug]? What do you think?
07:09 [Tux] If I am unsure (like you are) I ask here, and I am a perl6 newbee too
07:09 perl6_newbee :-)
07:10 [Tux] I am a seasoned perl5 programmer
07:10 [Tux] feeling like a bulldozer trying to map my thoughts into this new language
07:11 perl6_newbee Hmm perl5 is cool and I think it should not be too hard to understand perl6 with perl5 skills, is it?
07:11 [Tux] right *and* wrong at the same time
07:11 [Tux] it is a completely different language
07:13 perl6_newbee agree. I have been playing with perl6 for about one month and I like perl6 even more than perl5 because it does many things better
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07:22 masak perl6_newbee: maybe start by making the suggestion here? perl6-language is another possible forum.
07:22 masak (I usually start here, then go to p6l if the issue seems "big" enough.)
07:23 perl6_newbee hi masak.
07:23 masak hi hi
07:24 perl6_newbee The topic is the BOM issue I raised last friday here. I read the commecnt from jnthn and got the feeling it would be possible. so I thought I have to create a ticket in order to prevent it from forgetting.
07:25 masak don't know exactly what that's about
07:25 masak but if it's something that could be improved, then it probably deserves to be in RT
07:26 perl6_newbee I encountered the problem on Windows that the Notepad.exe saves the BOM at the start of the text. Perl6 read in the file but does not remove the BOM flag
07:26 perl6_newbee That is not intuitive from my point of view. If I have to handle this flag for myself
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07:27 perl6_newbee so I ask here and at least jnthn said it could be implemented at the right place without side effects.
07:28 perl6_newbee I created a ticket. If it is not important or wrong someone will close it, I think.
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07:38 masak it removes it when it's the source code, I'm pretty sure.
07:38 masak but a good argument could be made that it should remove it for (text) input files, too.
07:38 masak perl6_newbee++
07:41 Mouq [Tux]++
07:41 yoleaux 07:01Z <[Tux]> Mouq: https://gist.github.com/Tux/3efcf2bbcb859a27ef6a <= RT#123888 is incomplete. reopen?
07:41 synopsebot Link: https://rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Display.html?id=123888
07:41 Mouq I'll reopen and update the ticket :)
07:41 [Tux] thanks
07:42 [Tux] http://tux.nl/Files/20150309084206.png <= this is what made me re-check
07:43 perl6_newbee masak: :-)
07:47 Mouq [Tux]: It doesn't seem to be about the newlines, it seems to be about supplying perl6 with a file for STDIN instead of directly to STDIN
07:47 [Tux] ok
07:48 [Tux] so my bug report was actually touching TWO buglets?
07:48 DrForr For those who may be concerned: http://rakudo.org/how-to-get-rakudo responds with a 500 error over Firefox.
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07:52 Mouq DrForr: And so everyone on the channel visits that page :P
07:52 Mouq (DrForr++ of course :)
07:54 DrForr Well, of *course*. It's the Internet equivalent of a 'WET PAINT' sign.
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07:57 Mouq And [Tux], I don't think so… I'm pretty sure it was one bug disguised as another, in this case something going wrong with $*IN when it's secretely a filehandle
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07:57 [Tux] whatever, thanks for looking into them and fixing
07:58 Mouq For now, sleep &
07:58 * [Tux] thinks that in 5 month /me has TWO favorite languages
07:58 [Tux] if only speed speed speed
08:00 DrForr Ah, it's accessible again.
08:00 dalek nqp: a27f52e | (Adrian Kreher)++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/io/FileHandle.java:
08:00 dalek nqp: Fix EOF with newlines on 32k byte boundaries
08:00 dalek nqp:
08:00 dalek nqp: Fixes #224 by changing the EOF checking to use the size of the file
08:00 dalek nqp: rather than attempting to read a character using getc(). This fixes a
08:00 dalek nqp: problem which happens when a line ends on a multiple of 32768 bytes.
08:00 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/a27f52ed03
08:00 dalek nqp: a0dbe4f | FROGGS++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/io/FileHandle.java:
08:00 dalek nqp: Merge pull request #225 from avuserow/master
08:00 dalek nqp:
08:00 dalek nqp: Fix EOF with newlines on 32k byte boundaries
08:00 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/a0dbe4f727
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08:24 perl6_newbee cu guys, gotta go
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08:36 DrForr 'my $i = UndeclaredClass.new;' properly throws an error, but it includes 'UndeclaredClass used at line 3' instead of 'UndeclaredClass used\nat /full/path/to/file.t:3'. Another bug?
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08:41 DrForr (moarVM on latest rakudo)
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08:45 FROGGS m: my $i = UndeclaredClass.new;
08:45 yoleaux 04:12Z <avuserow> FROGGS: I'm looking at a bug in nqp-j (https://github.com/perl6/nqp/issues/224) and saw you did some work with eof. I'm testing a patch, but was curious if there's any reason you didn't use fc.size() rather than getc?
08:45 camelia rakudo-moar cd7c31: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/GeW8HECuxX␤Undeclared name:␤    UndeclaredClass used at line 1␤␤»
08:45 FROGGS DrForr: yes, it is a bug that -e in camelia here is not mentioned
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08:46 DrForr Should I rakudobug that as well?
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08:54 FROGGS DrForr: yes, please do
08:57 torbjorn is there any chance we could have the perl6 eval bot in #oslo.pm at irc.perl.org?
08:57 FROGGS torbjorn: I already talked to moritz++ about that
08:57 FROGGS but, let me try something...
08:57 torbjorn oh cool
08:57 moritz you don't already?
08:58 DrForr Will do.
08:58 torbjorn same nick on irc.perl.org?
08:58 moritz torbjorn: p6eval on magnet, iirc
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08:58 dalek evalbot: 0756169 | FROGGS++ | irc.perl.org.conf:
08:58 dalek evalbot: send camelia to #oslo.pm
08:58 dalek evalbot: review: https://github.com/perl6/evalbot/commit/0756169fbf
08:59 FROGGS p6eval: restart
08:59 moritz FROGGS: won't work that way
08:59 moritz FROGGS: have to pull first :-)
08:59 torbjorn its in oslo, not oslo.pm
09:00 FROGGS evalbot: control pull
09:00 torbjorn oh its in the git pull
09:00 FROGGS evalbot: control restart
09:00 FROGGS hmmmm
09:00 moritz FROGGS: don't
09:00 moritz FROGGS: that's the wrong instance you're trying to restart
09:00 * moritz does it on the command line
09:00 FROGGS ohh, I thought there is just one :o)
09:01 moritz nope, separate process per server
09:01 FROGGS moritz++
09:01 Ven o/, #perl6
09:01 moritz Mar 09 10:01:20 ns1 bash[1059]: Can't read configuration in perl.org.conf: No such file or directory
09:01 FROGGS hi Ven
09:01 * moritz dumb
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09:02 FROGGS it does not like the dot?
09:02 moritz no
09:02 FROGGS ohh, it is called irc.perl.org.conf
09:02 moritz I tried to start the wrong instance
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09:16 masak (camelia going places)++
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09:24 DrForr Error report sent, perl #124027 filed.
09:24 synopsebot Link: https://rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Display.html?id=124027
09:26 DrForr Again pretty trivial, just basically making stupid mistakes and seeing if the errors make sense :)
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09:47 Ulti can I suggest comments are removed and turned off for the majority of rakudo.org pages?
09:48 Ulti stuff like the bottom of this page for example just look really bad http://rakudo.org/how-to-help/
09:48 moritz +1
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10:33 donaldh lizmat++ for looking at JVM but it's still broken...
10:33 yoleaux 7 Mar 2015 11:31Z <lizmat> donaldh: seems like I fixed the JVM build
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10:36 FROGGS donaldh: what is broken?
10:38 donaldh I'm still getting lots of test failures, as also reported by TimToady++
10:39 FROGGS donaldh: spectest failures or module test failures?
10:39 donaldh And it looks to me like the culprit is the nqp::index fix I applied, to unbust TimToady's grammar change on JVM.
10:39 donaldh spectest failures
10:39 FROGGS ohh
10:40 FROGGS then we should fix the fix :o)
10:41 donaldh Well I can't just back out the fix in nqp/jvm, without also applying a workaround in the rakudo grammar
10:41 donaldh First I'll spend some tuits to see if I can understand the regression in nqp/jvm
10:42 donaldh It looks like something in nqp's JVM backend was relying on the broken behaviour of nqp::index
10:42 FROGGS hmmm, that sounds hard to believe
10:44 moritz and the broken behavior was to throw an exception?
10:44 moritz or return the wrong value?
10:45 ab5tract lizmat++ # i was actually working an an s/at_pos/at-pos/ patch on friday night, but i like the the all-caps variant even better!
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10:46 donaldh I think it was throwing an exception that was being caught in nqp. Seems to cause behaviour change in the resulting runtime, regardless of the nqp::index behaviour in that runtime.
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10:55 |Tux| WTF. Who is to blame for test-x           50000    35.280    35.059
10:55 yoleaux 7 Mar 2015 18:33Z <nine_> |Tux|: the performance regression is not caused by Inline::Perl5 but by Rakudo. I suspect it's jnthn++'s native work.
10:55 |Tux| not only first time below 36, but way below 36
10:56 |Tux| you guys rock!
10:56 masak we're only getting started!
10:56 |Tux| I still need a factor 900 to match XS though
10:57 |Tux| 904.615
10:57 masak a noble goal.
10:57 |Tux| :)
10:58 moritz |Tux|: do you have a comparison to a pure-perl implementation?
10:58 |Tux| https://gist.github.com/Tux/82b5aa66cc168c90ebd3
10:59 |Tux| top 6 are perl5
10:59 |Tux| rest is perl6
10:59 |Tux| ask!
11:00 |Tux| test-pp is Text::CSV_PP which is the pure-perl5 version of Text::CSV_XS
11:00 moritz why is csv-easy-pp so much faster than csv-test-pp?
11:00 |Tux| the first two are included for compare only: they do not support options and crash on every invilid CSV
11:01 |Tux| test-pp has all the options that test-xs also supports. Checking options costs performance
11:01 moritz m: say 38.777 / 6.793
11:01 camelia rakudo-moar cd7c31: OUTPUT«5.708376␤»
11:02 moritz m: say 38.777 / 0.513 # that's the one that actually interests me, I guess
11:02 camelia rakudo-moar cd7c31: OUTPUT«75.588694␤»
11:02 moritz pure p5 vs. pure p6
11:02 |Tux| that one is a state machine in perl6 that has NO options and also does not support multi-character EOL or SEP
11:02 |Tux| the 6.7 version that is
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11:03 moritz but apples:apples comparison is 38.777 vs. 0.513, right?
11:03 |Tux| so yes, pure-perl vs pure perl6 is a factor 75
11:03 moritz not good, but we've done much worse on that in the past
11:03 |Tux| yes, first measurements were about 260 seconds :)
11:04 |Tux| so having 35 now is GOOD
11:04 |Tux| don't compare to test. compare to test-x
11:04 moritz is test-x merged in master?
11:05 * moritz doesn't even know what test-x is, just assumes it's a branch
11:05 |Tux| test is a reference for myself: it is to ensure that test-x does not slow down compared to test
11:05 |Tux| test-x is my working version of Text::CSV on https://github.com/Tux/CSV
11:09 |Tux| FWIW the ip5 versions will probably go back to around 8.2 again (Inline::Perl5 versions of test-xs and test-pp)
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11:24 dalek nqp: 1dfa4ca | donaldh++ | src/vm/jvm/QAST/Compiler.nqp:
11:24 dalek nqp: Unbust nqp on JVM
11:24 dalek nqp:
11:24 dalek nqp: Was relying on nqp::index returning 0 for empty search string.
11:24 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/1dfa4ca7ee
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11:41 colomon .u °
11:41 yoleaux U+00B0 DEGREE SIGN [So] (°)
11:43 donaldh CallFrame on JVM sometimes returns with no 'line' annotation. It looks like Moar always returns 'line' => "1" in these cases.
11:43 donaldh This makes Test.pm noisy on JVM.
11:47 donaldh I'm guessing callframe.line should always return a value ?
11:47 yqt joined #perl6
11:53 donaldh Or should Test.pm just be defensive ?
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12:01 coffee` joined #perl6
12:03 * moritz doesn't know
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12:09 masak .u ∘
12:09 yoleaux U+2218 RING OPERATOR [Sm] (∘)
12:09 masak .u ⊚
12:09 yoleaux U+229A CIRCLED RING OPERATOR [Sm] (⊚)
12:10 masak .u ≗
12:10 yoleaux U+2257 RING EQUAL TO [Sm] (≗)
12:10 masak lots of Unicode custom operator potential here... :)
12:10 nine_ Unicode operators would be much more fun if they were easier to type
12:12 masak nine_: here's a nickel. buy yourself a decent text editor.
12:12 masak :P
12:13 |Tux| https://gist.github.com/Tux/6a740c1b2a7455361cfd - Unicode OPERATOR's
12:13 masak srsly, though. computers are programmable. if iPhones can be made to show custom keybords, then so can your laptop or desktop.
12:14 nine_ masak: is vim decent?
12:14 masak nine_: yes.
12:14 masak nine_: ^K ftw
12:15 masak nine_: Emacs is also decent. there's an input method module called LEIM.
12:15 nine_ niiiiice
12:15 |Tux| ~/.XCompose is also decent :P
12:15 masak I don't know about all these other newfangled things, though. people are all sublime textmates these days.
12:16 moritz ~/.XCompose has the advantage that it works in every application
12:16 * masak should ~/.XCompose more, clearly
12:16 |Tux| <Multi_key> <C> <equal>                 : "€"   U20a0 # EURO-CURRENCY SIGN
12:16 |Tux| <Multi_key> <c> <equal>                 : "€"   U20a0 # EURO-CURRENCY SIGN
12:16 |Tux| <Multi_key> <equal> <C>                 : "€"   U20a0 # EURO-CURRENCY SIGN
12:16 |Tux| <Multi_key> <equal> <c>                 : "€"   U20a0 # EURO-CURRENCY SIGN
12:16 masak :)
12:16 masak |Tux|: but what about lower-case euro? :P
12:17 |Tux| I don't ever use it :P
12:17 nine_ Now if only there was an easy way to type in unicode characters to search in vim's digraph list :P
12:17 lizmat FROGGS: should I bump NQP_REVISION ?
12:17 abraxxa CTRL-K does nothing in my vim
12:17 masak nine_: after a while you kind of just pick up the principle of it all
12:17 masak abraxxa: `help digraphs`
12:18 masak abraxxa: `:help digraphs`
12:22 nine_ And of course » is just ^K>> :)
12:22 abraxxa masak: thanks, reading
12:23 masak nine_: see? you're already picking it up :)
12:23 masak nine_: similarly, Greek letters all have a '*' in them
12:24 moritz because the Greek conquered the stars.
12:24 nine_ Σ FTW :)
12:24 masak Cyrillic all have a '=' in them. because the Russians conquered... equality?
12:27 |Tux| I always missed the IOTA SUBSCRIPTUM in greek, then I could have written T\N{IOTA SUBSCRIPTUM}o for a new type Toyota: the subscriptum
12:28 |Tux| Τῳ
12:28 |Tux| .u Τῳ
12:28 yoleaux U+03A4 GREEK CAPITAL LETTER TAU [Lu] (Τ)
12:28 yoleaux U+1FF3 GREEK SMALL LETTER OMEGA WITH YPOGEGRAMMENI [Ll] (ῳ)
12:29 Ugator joined #perl6
12:33 * masak .oO( I don't always type the Greek small letter omega -- but when I do, I type it with ypogegrammeni )
12:35 smls What's the difference between replies and comments on rt.perl.org?
12:36 moritz replies go to the requestor
12:36 nine_ smls: RT is a system for help desks. Comments are internal (for the team) while replies also go to the customer
12:37 smls so which is preferred in rakudo bugs?
12:37 nine_ I'd use reply
12:38 nine_ Even if the reply does not actually help the requestor, it at least shows some activity.
12:44 masak heh. in all my years with RT, I hadn't bothered learning the difference. :)
12:44 masak but yeah, I always "Reply", too.
12:47 Ven .tell eli-sde https://github.com/pixie-lang/pixie
12:47 yoleaux Ven: I'll pass your message to eli-sde.
12:47 kjs_ joined #perl6
12:47 Ven .tell eli-se https://github.com/pixie-lang/pixie
12:47 yoleaux Ven: I'll pass your message to eli-se.
12:51 brrt joined #perl6
13:12 lizmat FROGGS: FWIW, after an NQP bump, JVM is still distinctly unhappy
13:13 brrt joined #perl6
13:17 FROGGS ahh sorry, was distracted
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13:21 moritz http://news.perlfoundation.org/2015/03/taking-part-in-outreachy.html should we try to get some Perl 6 ideas and mentors in there?
13:21 donaldh lizmat: did you try my last commit?
13:21 lizmat donaldh: probably not, is it a pull request ?
13:22 nine_ moritz: we definitely should!
13:22 donaldh lizmat: I've commited a change to nqp.
13:22 lizmat and I locally raised NQP_REVISION to that
13:23 lizmat testing with 2015.02-79-g1dfa4ca
13:24 * donaldh will test from clean again
13:28 dalek rakudo/nom: b8a4665 | lizmat++ | t/01-sanity/22-KEY.t:
13:28 dalek rakudo/nom: Add Set/Bag/Mix(Hashes) sanity tests
13:28 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/b8a466574f
13:29 masak sanity++ lizmat++
13:32 lizmat re #124023, I wonder whether this should be fixed at the rakudo level, or lower?
13:32 synopsebot Link: https://rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Display.html?id=124023
13:33 lizmat aka, automatic \n conversion to \r\n on Win in nqp / Moar ?   Or will we do this in sub say ?
13:33 moritz first we should have a consensus how it should look at the Perl 6 level
13:33 moritz and then we should think about where to implement it
13:33 * moritz wonders if IO layers a la perl 5 are a good idea
13:34 lizmat something like a my constant EOL = $*DISTRO.is-win ?? "\r\n" !! "\n"
13:34 lizmat would be a runtime assignment, even in the settings, afaik
13:34 lizmat I think nwc10 has some ideas about it (as in, please don't :-)
13:34 moritz I thought constants were evaluated at compile time
13:35 brrt moritz, i wonder that too, and i'm not sure
13:35 lizmat I thought so too, but some of my recent forays into the $?DISTRO area, have taught me differently
13:35 lizmat perhaps wrongly  :-
13:35 lizmat )
13:35 brrt on the one hand, all the big boys (java, perl5) are doing it
13:36 lizmat let me rephrase that
13:36 brrt on the other hand, there's... more than one way to do it? consider the pervasive io.Reader, io.Writer interfaces in go
13:38 lizmat ok, perhaps it just doesn't work in the setting
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13:43 psch \o
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13:56 cdc Hello #perl6
13:57 cdc perl6: my $sub = &die; say ~$sub
13:57 camelia rakudo-moar b8a466: OUTPUT«Code object coerced to string (please use .gist or .perl to do that)  in block <unit> at /tmp/tmpfile:1␤␤die␤»
13:57 donaldh lizmat: 19 test failures after a clean and build of nqp + rakudo
13:57 ab5tract cdc
13:58 ab5tract it looks like you mean to EVAL there
13:58 ab5tract ?
13:58 donaldh lizmat: nqp version 2015.02-79-g1dfa4ca built on JVM
13:58 lizmat what OS ?
13:58 cdc ab5tract: I want to get the name of the sub
13:58 smls m: my $sub = &die; say $sub.name
13:59 camelia rakudo-moar b8a466: OUTPUT«die␤»
13:59 cdc smls: thanks!
14:01 donaldh lizmat: OSX
14:01 lizmat ok, same as me then
14:01 lizmat trying a clean build and spectest now as well
14:02 psch i'm running jvm spectest on hack right now fwiw
14:02 psch somewhere in S32 by now
14:04 psch which on it's own has at least ~50 failures o.o
14:04 donaldh All the "TODO passed" in https://gist.github.com/donaldh/0c29448d08a92294d6e9 - are they tests that can be unfudged?
14:04 * lizmat gives up on implementing $?DISTRO and $?VM again
14:04 * psch caught bits of what's wrong there in the clog
14:06 FROGGS donaldh: your patch to nqp seems to fix the jvm issues on my linux box too
14:06 donaldh psch: Does it look a bit like this: https://gist.github.com/donaldh/6c1076d6a801995d952c - output I captured three days ago
14:06 lizmat m: my constant $?FOO = 42   # what would be needed to make this work?
14:06 camelia rakudo-moar b8a466: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/uJpZHilGdA␤Twigil-Variable constants not yet implemented. Sorry. ␤at /tmp/uJpZHilGdA:1␤------> 3my constant $?FOO = 427⏏5   # what would be needed to make this w␤»
14:07 timotimo o/
14:07 psch donaldh: spectest is still running.  i assume you suspect a out-of-date nqp version?
14:07 FROGGS m: my $?FOO = 42
14:07 camelia rakudo-moar b8a466: ( no output )
14:07 FROGGS m: my $?FOO = 42; $?FOO+
14:07 camelia rakudo-moar b8a466: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/doLcUAXrR0␤Bogus statement␤at /tmp/doLcUAXrR0:1␤------> 3my $?FOO = 42; $?FOO+7⏏5<EOL>␤    expecting any of:␤        prefix or term␤        prefix or meta-prefix␤»
14:07 FROGGS m: my $?FOO = 42; $?FOO++; say $?FOO
14:07 camelia rakudo-moar b8a466: OUTPUT«43␤»
14:07 salva joined #perl6
14:07 FROGGS hmmm
14:07 lizmat m: say $?TABSTOP; $?TABSTOP=4; say $?TABSTOP
14:07 camelia rakudo-moar b8a466: OUTPUT«8␤4␤»
14:08 donaldh psch. yes. lizmat++ has bumped NQP_REVISION locally but not committed it.
14:08 raiph joined #perl6
14:09 lizmat to 2015.02-79-g1dfa4ca
14:09 psch ah, i must've missed that while backlogging.  i'll build nqp HEAD and rerun
14:10 donaldh psch: make sure you clean
14:10 diana_olhovik joined #perl6
14:10 FROGGS m: my constant $FOO = 42
14:10 camelia rakudo-moar b8a466: ( no output )
14:10 FROGGS m: my constant $FOO = 42; $FOO++
14:10 camelia rakudo-moar b8a466: OUTPUT«Cannot assign to an immutable value␤  in sub postfix:<++> at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:5708␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/gNpb0xZtWr:1␤␤»
14:12 FROGGS $ perl6-m -e 'my constant $?FOO = 42; try $?FOO++; say $?FOO'
14:12 FROGGS 42
14:12 yqt joined #perl6
14:13 dalek rakudo/nom: e592605 | lizmat++ | src/core/Str.pm:
14:13 dalek rakudo/nom: Make $?TABSTOP immutable
14:13 dalek rakudo/nom:
14:13 dalek rakudo/nom: One could argue, the wrong way, but at least it is now immutable
14:13 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/e592605438
14:13 FROGGS I bet this is the wrong approach for some reason that's not known to me yet: https://gist.github.com/FROGGS/edc3d153de7d1221b09b
14:14 donaldh :) I was thinking along the same lines
14:14 FROGGS :o)
14:14 moritz what rule is that patch in?
14:15 FROGGS method type_declarator:sym<constant>($/) {
14:15 moritz patch looks good to me
14:15 * lizmat tries
14:16 FROGGS my guess is also that it should be pretty safe to do for ?-twiggled vars
14:16 FROGGS it is just that I have a little jnthn on my other shoulder which says that he imagines a different way of handling these cases :o)
14:17 moritz WWJD :-)
14:17 FROGGS exactly :P
14:18 * FROGGS takes a walk
14:19 lizmat my constant $?TABSTOP now compiles fine in the setting with that nqp patch
14:19 lizmat spectesting now
14:19 lizmat FWIW, the JVM spectest seems as dirty as it was before  :-(
14:20 donaldh how very odd
14:21 lizmat donaldh: gist forthcoming
14:22 FROGGS weird
14:23 FROGGS I wonder if this passes: perl6-j t/spec/S03-operators/is-divisible-by.rakudo.jvm
14:24 lizmat All tests successful.
14:24 lizmat Files=1, Tests=15,  5 wallclock secs ( 0.02 usr  0.01 sys +  0.02 cusr  0.01 csys =  0.06 CPU)
14:25 FROGGS and that failed for me before
14:25 FROGGS 9 %% 0 failed correctly, but throws_like did not recognize it as a failure
14:25 lizmat grrr.. ctrl-zing the spectest, broke something, need to rerun  :-(
14:26 FROGGS eww
14:27 dalek rakudo/nom: 99147fc | lizmat++ | src/Perl6/Actions.nqp:
14:27 dalek rakudo/nom: Allow "my constant $?FOO" the naive way, FROGGS++
14:27 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/99147fc05f
14:27 dalek rakudo/nom: e361659 | lizmat++ | src/core/Str.pm:
14:27 dalek rakudo/nom: Make $?TABSTOP a constant properly
14:27 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/e361659047
14:31 lizmat afk for a bit&
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15:52 J-L Hi, I was wondering if I can slurp() a binary data file directly into a Perl6 Buf object.  (Apparently I can spurt() a Buf object to a binary file, but I can't figure out how to do the same with slurp().)
15:52 psch m: my $x = slurp $*IN, :bin; say $x.WHAT
15:52 camelia rakudo-moar e36165: OUTPUT«(Buf[uint8])␤Saw 1 call to deprecated code during execution.␤================================================================================␤slurp($handle,...) called at:␤  /tmp/FcKy0epHDy, line 1␤Deprecated since v2014.10, will be removed with …»
15:52 psch not sure what the not-deprecated incantation would be
15:53 psch but i suppose that's just a limitation in the demonstration
15:53 psch in short, slurp takes :bin
15:53 retupmoca m: my $x = $*IN.slurp(:bin); say $x.WHAT;
15:53 camelia rakudo-moar e36165: OUTPUT«(Buf[uint8])␤Saw 1 call to deprecated code during execution.␤================================================================================␤Method slurp (from IO::Handle) called at:␤  /tmp/yurAovvFyo, line 1␤Deprecated since v2014.10, will be r…»
15:54 timotimo we've discussed that the semantics of slurp on an opened handle are dubious
15:54 psch ah, right, i remember that bit
15:54 psch 'cause slurp implies open and close before and after, respectively
15:56 jnthn evening o/
15:56 yoleaux 02:27Z <japhb> jnthn: In your OO::Monitors module, is there any attempt to support inheritance heirarchies, in which all classes are monitors?  In other words, can it handle: monitor A { method foo }; monitor B is A { method bar };  and keep foo and bar mutexed?
15:56 yoleaux 02:30Z <japhb> jnthn: Yeah, shortly after I .asked you, someone (timotimo?) pointed out the workaround of setting uncaught_handler *after* creating the new $*SCHEDULER, because of the "BUILD from a composed Role gets smashed" problem.
15:56 yoleaux 02:31Z <japhb> jnthn: But even so, I'm unable to figure out how to *trigger* an uncaught exception that .uncaught_handler *does* catch.
15:56 jnthn argh!
15:56 psch o/ jnthn
15:56 lizmat jnthn o/
15:56 muraiki joined #perl6
15:57 J-L Thanks, psch.  This works for me:  my $x = slurp "file.dat", :bin;  Apparently all that I was missing was the ":bin".
15:57 moritz m: say slurp 'stdin', ':bin'
15:57 camelia rakudo-moar e36165: OUTPUT«Too many positionals passed; expected 1 argument but got 2␤  in method slurp at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:17851␤  in sub slurp at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:18171␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/ZGd9V9AvY4:1␤␤»
15:57 moritz m: say slurp 'stdin', :bin
15:57 camelia rakudo-moar e36165: OUTPUT«Failed to open file: no such file or directory␤  in method open at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:16998␤  in method open at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:17534␤  in method slurp at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:17853␤  in sub slurp at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:18171␤  in…»
15:57 nwc10 jnthn: what is this cause of this UGT heresy?
15:57 jnthn .tell japhb No, I didn't attempt that (I wrote it in about 2 hours flat ;)). Please file a ticket, though, as it's a good idea.
15:57 yoleaux jnthn: I'll pass your message to japhb.
15:58 J-L How do I append a value to a Buf?  I can do:   $x ~= Buf.new(65);  but I was wondering if there's a simpler way.
15:58 moritz m: say slurp '/home/camelia/evalbot/stdin', :bin
15:58 camelia rakudo-moar e36165: OUTPUT«Buf[uint8]:0x<43 c3 a9 61 64 20 73 6c c3 a1 6e 20 61 67 20 73 6c c3 a9 69 62 68 74 65 20 6d 61 6f 72 67 61 20 43 68 6f 6e 74 61 65 20 44 68 c3 ba 6e 20 6e 61 20 6e 47 61 6c 6c 0a 41 67 75 73 20 64 68 c3 a1 20 63 68 c3 a9 61 64 20 73 6c c3 a1 6e 20 61 67 20…»
15:58 timotimo m: say slurp '<stdin>', :bin;
15:58 camelia rakudo-moar e36165: OUTPUT«Failed to open file: no such file or directory␤  in method open at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:16998␤  in method open at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:17534␤  in method slurp at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:17853␤  in sub slurp at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:18171␤  in…»
15:58 timotimo hm
15:58 jnthn .tell japhb You'd probably have to .cue code directly to get it to hit that; Promise.start will have the Promise itself catch the exception and store it.
15:58 yoleaux jnthn: I'll pass your message to japhb.
15:59 jnthn nwc10: I dunno. I blame insufficient beer.
15:59 geekosaur I don't think stdin is a stringy name? you want a slurp method on a handle?
15:59 geekosaur (well, there's /dev/stdin or /dev/fd/0 on sufficiently unixy systems)
16:00 dalek rakudo/nom: 6f9c64c | lizmat++ | docs/ChangeLog:
16:00 dalek rakudo/nom: Add some achievements for 2015.03
16:00 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/6f9c64cce8
16:00 timotimo i saw something about "opening special file handles" somewhere that seemed like it would allow using '<stdin>' as a special argument to open the actual stdin
16:00 geekosaur oh, if such exists it may be in newio branch
16:00 geekosaur (if it is implemented yet at all)
16:01 moritz open('-') and open('-', :w) have (for a time a least) opened stdin/stdout
16:02 FROGGS it still does that
16:02 timotimo there is a problem with perl6 at the moment
16:02 timotimo perl6 parsing*
16:02 FROGGS timotimo: example?
16:02 timotimo where sub calls are wrongly erroring out with "list ops like $name-of-sub need whitespace before their arguments (or use parens)" where there is clearly whitespace
16:02 timotimo http://testers.p6c.org/reports/23093.html
16:02 dalek Heuristic branch merge: pushed 26 commits to rakudo/newio by lizmat
16:03 timotimo wasn't able to properly reproduce it with a small test case yet
16:03 timotimo hits breakdancer, too, for example
16:03 timotimo could have something to do with passing blocks as arguments?
16:03 moritz looks like it
16:03 moritz that has some special casing for gobbling up blocks, no?
16:04 moritz erm, preventing that
16:04 FROGGS m: proto sub task(|) is export { * }
16:04 camelia rakudo-moar e36165: ( no output )
16:04 FROGGS m: multi sub task(Str $name, &body) {
16:04 camelia rakudo-moar e36165: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/wh393b9FeG␤Unable to parse expression in block; couldn't find final '}' ␤at /tmp/wh393b9FeG:1␤------> 3multi sub task(Str $name, &body) {7⏏5<EOL>␤»
16:04 FROGGS m: multi sub task(Str $name, &body) { }
16:04 camelia rakudo-moar e36165: ( no output )
16:04 moritz m: sub task($, $) { }; task 1, { my $x = 42 };
16:04 camelia rakudo-moar e36165: ( no output )
16:04 moritz m: sub task($, $) { }; task 1, { my $x = 42 }
16:04 camelia rakudo-moar e36165: ( no output )
16:06 nwc10 jnthn: how is your beer fridge?
16:07 jnthn nwc10: It's in Lund, and I'm in Oslo. So...distant? :)
16:07 FROGGS m: my $t = task "fred", { $x = "meth"; }
16:07 camelia rakudo-moar e36165: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/VnwHU1uyFn␤Variable '$x' is not declared␤at /tmp/VnwHU1uyFn:1␤------> 3my $t = task "fred", { $x7⏏5 = "meth"; }␤    expecting any of:␤        postfix␤»
16:07 FROGGS m: my $t = task "fred", { "meth"; }
16:07 camelia rakudo-moar e36165: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/0T5qOGaTZD␤Undeclared routine:␤    task used at line 1␤␤»
16:08 FROGGS so far so good
16:08 nwc10 jnthn: that sounds like bad planning. Hopefully they also sell beer in Oslo.
16:08 timotimo thank you all for taking a bit of your time to look into this <3
16:08 * timotimo AFK
16:09 J-L I found that to append a value to a Buf object, I can do:  $x[+*] = value;
16:10 telex joined #perl6
16:11 dalek rakudo/newio: b694705 | lizmat++ | src/core/IO.pm:
16:11 dalek rakudo/newio: Fix some stray at_pos/exists_key
16:11 dalek rakudo/newio: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/b694705be0
16:11 dalek rakudo/newio: 9e2c657 | lizmat++ | src/core/IO/Dup.pm:
16:11 dalek rakudo/newio: Allow warningless IO::Dup.slurp (for $*IN.slurp)
16:11 dalek rakudo/newio: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/9e2c657ac0
16:11 FROGGS m: proto sub task(|) is export { * }; multi sub task(Str $name, &body) { }␤my $t = task "fred", { my $x = "meth"; }␤$t.execute
16:11 camelia rakudo-moar 6f9c64: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/QewTpyrqBe␤A list operator such as "task" must have whitespace before its arguments (or use parens)␤at /tmp/QewTpyrqBe:3␤------> 3my $t = task "fred", { my $x = "meth"; }7⏏5<EOL>␤»
16:11 FROGGS m: proto sub task(|) is export { * }; multi sub task(Str $name, &body) { }␤my $t = task "fred", { my $x = "meth"; };␤$t.execute
16:11 camelia rakudo-moar 6f9c64: OUTPUT«No such method 'execute' for invocant of type 'Any'␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/oDpwIPE2D8:3␤␤»
16:12 FROGGS the ENDSTMT is buggy or what it is called
16:13 psch m: say -Inf.WHAT
16:13 camelia rakudo-moar 6f9c64: OUTPUT«(Num)␤»
16:13 psch m: say -Inf // "mu"
16:13 camelia rakudo-moar 6f9c64: OUTPUT«-Inf␤»
16:18 lizmat m: say Inf // "mu"
16:18 camelia rakudo-moar 6f9c64: OUTPUT«Inf␤»
16:18 lizmat hmmm...
16:18 lizmat m: say Inf.defined
16:18 camelia rakudo-moar 6f9c64: OUTPUT«True␤»
16:19 psch m: print Inf
16:19 camelia rakudo-moar 6f9c64: OUTPUT«Inf»
16:19 psch hm
16:19 psch lizmat: that's S03-operators/minmax.t, from the looks of it that's in Test::<&is>, and not rakudo?
16:20 psch where the first "that's" means "what i'm looking at" and the second is "the reason the tests fail"
16:20 mr-foobar joined #perl6
16:20 lizmat is $got, $expected, $message
16:20 lizmat m: say Inf.Str
16:20 camelia rakudo-moar 6f9c64: OUTPUT«Inf␤»
16:20 lizmat m: say -Inf.Str
16:20 camelia rakudo-moar 6f9c64: OUTPUT«-Inf␤»
16:21 psch maybe there's a bug in signatures from jvm, i've mostly copied what moar does for the smiley annotations
16:21 lizmat if $expected is a type object (aka undefined), then === is used to compare
16:21 psch m: use Test; is "foo" min -Inf, -Inf, "good"
16:21 lizmat afk for a bit&
16:21 camelia rakudo-moar 6f9c64: OUTPUT«ok 1 - good␤»
16:22 psch and i suspect jvm has to do it a bit different in a spot that i hadn't seen
16:29 TimToady m: say index('foo',''); nqp::index('foo','')
16:29 camelia rakudo-moar 6f9c64: OUTPUT«0␤»
16:29 TimToady m: say index('foo',''); say nqp::index('foo','')
16:29 camelia rakudo-moar 6f9c64: OUTPUT«0␤-1␤»
16:30 TimToady nqp::index disagrees with both p5 and p6
16:30 yqt joined #perl6
16:31 jnthn Which is odd given I'd have thought p6 index would be implemented *using* nqp::index...
16:31 spider-mario joined #perl6
16:34 donaldh Well I changed JVM nqp::index to align with moar.
16:35 TimToady which is what was bothering me :)
16:35 TimToady I think we need to make sure we don't feed '' to that call
16:35 donaldh index is implemented using nqp::index but checks edge cases itsefl
16:36 jnthn Maybe if we align the op with the desired semantics, it won't have to check 'em :)
16:36 TimToady well, I think '' gets the degenerate case wrong
16:36 TimToady er nqp
16:36 donaldh if $needle eq '' { my $chars = self.chars;  return $pos < $chars ?? $pos !! $chars; }
16:37 TimToady m: say substr('foo',0,0) eq ''
16:37 camelia rakudo-moar 6f9c64: OUTPUT«True␤»
16:37 TimToady that is the degenerate case
16:41 cognominal joined #perl6
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16:43 donaldh Do you want '' to be found in a string?
16:43 donaldh To basically return the starting index?
16:44 dalek rakudo/nom: ab55cb7 | TimToady++ | src/Perl6/Grammar.nqp:
16:44 dalek rakudo/nom: don't feed '' to nqp::index
16:44 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/ab55cb75a0
16:44 TimToady donaldh: yes, that is the correct degenerate behavior
16:45 psch m: for Inf, +Inf, -Inf { .say }
16:45 camelia rakudo-moar 6f9c64: OUTPUT«Inf␤Inf␤-Inf␤»
16:46 psch $ ./perl6-j -e'for Inf, +Inf, -Inf { .say }'
16:46 psch Inf␤0␤-Inf
16:46 psch math /o\
16:55 * psch builds a fix
16:57 TimToady m: say UInt(-42)
16:57 camelia rakudo-moar 6f9c64: OUTPUT«Cannot invoke this object (REPR: Uninstantiable, cs = 0)␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/DwlZXYAKvK:1␤␤»
16:57 TimToady m: say (-42).UInt
16:57 camelia rakudo-moar 6f9c64: OUTPUT«Coercion to UInt out of range. Is: -42, should be in 0..Inf␤  in method gist at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:15250␤  in sub say at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:18073␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/7M7WfaBCOq:1␤␤»
16:58 donaldh &
16:58 timotimo maybe we shouldn't call it "incompatibility change", but "incompatible change" in the changelog %)
17:01 rindolf Hi all.
17:01 timotimo greetings rindolf
17:01 Celelibi joined #perl6
17:01 rindolf timotimo: sup?
17:02 perl6_newbee joined #perl6
17:06 timotimo notmuch :)
17:07 timotimo .o( now what's the right incantation for "and you?" )
17:08 timotimo AFK
17:11 vendethiel joined #perl6
17:11 raydiak o/
17:12 tbrowder joined #perl6
17:24 avuserow \o raydiak, #perl6
17:27 cognominal joined #perl6
17:31 rindolf o/
17:33 kjs_ joined #perl6
17:36 dalek rakudo-star-daily: a7abab4 | coke++ | log/ (9 files):
17:36 dalek rakudo-star-daily: today (automated commit)
17:36 dalek rakudo-star-daily: review: https://github.com/coke/rakudo-star-daily/commit/a7abab440e
17:36 dalek perl6-roast-data: 37de2f8 | coke++ | / (9 files):
17:36 dalek perl6-roast-data: today (automated commit)
17:36 dalek perl6-roast-data: review: https://github.com/coke/perl6-roast-data/commit/37de2f8bfb
17:37 cognominal joined #perl6
17:37 [Coke] rakudo-jvm has 273 failures, someone broke something.
17:38 [Coke] moar, moar-jit have two that have been failing for a while.
17:40 [Coke] rakudo's a99a572 was "ok" for jvm. the next day, rakudo's db49f3b had the failures.
17:41 [Coke] I'll bisect.
17:43 timotimo fosdem hasn't released froggs' talk recording :(
17:45 diana_olhovik joined #perl6
17:50 vendethiel joined #perl6
18:00 J-L Question:  How do I iterate over all the elements of a Buf?  I came up with this, but it uses the range operator:  $x[$_].say for 0 .. $x.end;
18:00 jercos J-L: I'd probably use .list
18:00 J-L I tried:   for @$x -> $c { .say }    but that just prints Nils.
18:01 jercos well first off, $c.say
18:01 PerlJam aye, that's probably the error
18:01 yoleaux 7 Mar 2015 09:17Z <nine_> PerlJam: muraiki's segfault was caused by PERLINC pointing to modules for a different perl version. I guess your case is different?
18:01 jercos m: for "Hello, world!".encode.list { .say }
18:01 camelia rakudo-moar ab55cb: OUTPUT«72␤101␤108␤108␤111␤44␤32␤119␤111␤114␤108␤100␤33␤»
18:01 J-L Wow... you're right, it IS $c.say .  It's funny how I miss tiny things like that while learning a new language.
18:02 jercos Yup yup. It's easy to miss details when troubleshooting what seems like a huge problem :)
18:02 J-L And .list works, too.  But I don't see .list mentioned in the Buf documentation at http://doc.perl6.org/type/Buf .  Is it mentioned somewhere else?
18:03 PerlJam J-L: .list isn't a Buf only thing.  It's what makes @() work
18:03 PerlJam @($buf) (or @$buf) is the same as $buf.list
18:03 moritz huh
18:03 moritz it comes from Any
18:03 dalek nqp: 832c331 | peschwa++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/runtime/Ops.java:
18:03 dalek nqp: Properly recognize +Inf in coerce_s2n and thus smart_numify.
18:03 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/832c331399
18:03 moritz but doc.perl6.org doesn't show it
18:04 J-L PerlJam, if there's a webpage out there on it, I'd love to read it.
18:04 moritz because it assumes that whatever class a role is composed into will inherit it from Any
18:04 moritz but that happens implicitly
18:04 [Sno] joined #perl6
18:05 jercos That seems like something worth explicitly mentioning for Buf...
18:05 jercos I mean, .list on a scalar value will just make a one-item list usually, right?
18:05 PerlJam J-L: aye
18:06 psch m: "aaa" ~~ /./; say $/.list
18:06 camelia rakudo-moar ab55cb: OUTPUT«␤»
18:06 PerlJam er, jercos
18:06 psch m: "aaa" ~~ /(.)/; say $/.list
18:06 camelia rakudo-moar ab55cb: OUTPUT«「a」␤»
18:06 psch m: "aaa" ~~ /(.)+/; say $/.list
18:06 camelia rakudo-moar ab55cb: OUTPUT«「a」 「a」 「a」␤»
18:06 perl6_newbee nine_: are you on
18:06 cognominal joined #perl6
18:06 psch .list on a scalar container does what the type contained does
18:07 psch m: class A { method list { <foo bar baz> } }; say A.new.list
18:07 camelia rakudo-moar ab55cb: OUTPUT«foo bar baz␤»
18:07 skids joined #perl6
18:07 PerlJam oh ... /me was having some scalar/item confusion
18:07 PerlJam jercos: .list on an item will make a one-item list :)
18:08 psch m: .say for [1,2,3].list
18:08 camelia rakudo-moar ab55cb: OUTPUT«1␤2␤3␤»
18:08 dalek rakudo/nom: 5f9243c | TimToady++ | src/core/Cool.pm:
18:08 dalek rakudo/nom: rely on nqp for correct index semantics
18:08 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/5f9243ceb1
18:08 psch now i'm getting insecure :)
18:08 J-L So here's a Str/Buf question:  I'm reading in a (technically binary) file into a Buf object.  However, this file happens to have an ASCII header that I parse through with a regular expression.  At the end of the header, the binary data begins.  What I'm asking is:  How do I use regexps on a Buf object as if the start of it were a string?
18:09 psch PerlJam: .list on an item still depends on what the item wants to do in list context, doesn'it?
18:09 psch *doesn't it
18:09 TimToady .list is not really list context
18:09 kjs_ joined #perl6
18:09 TimToady slurpy is list context
18:10 psch oh
18:10 * jercos makes a note to drop by 7-11
18:10 psch i think that ties in with the trouble with «for m:g//»?
18:10 TimToady and slurpy respects item, while .list doesn't
18:10 psch that we decided not to have
18:10 TimToady yeah
18:11 TimToady that's why I decided it was bad to return a $/ where a flattenable list was desirable
18:11 Foxcool joined #perl6
18:11 psch right, thanks
18:16 J-L Hey, when I run:   pack('N2 C5', 1 .. 10);   I get a Buf of only 5 elements.  Shouldn't it be 7 elements?  Using a pack string of 'NN CCCCC' gives me 7 elements, but 'N2 C5' does not.  Is this normal?
18:16 J-L I'm sorry... instead of 7 elements, it should be 13 elements.
18:17 J-L In other words, pack('N2 C5', 1 .. 10).elems gives me 5, whereas pack('N N CCCCC', 1 .. 10).elems gives me 13.
18:18 J-L Maybe I'm missing something, but that doesn't look right to me.
18:20 geekosaur I think pack and unpack are known to be not fully implemented?
18:20 geekosaur yet
18:21 eli-se joined #perl6
18:23 retupmoca J-L: looks like the count is ignored for everything but 'A' 'a' and 'x'
18:23 retupmoca J-L: see https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/blob/nom/src/core/Buf.pm#L284
18:25 raydiak J-L: you could extract a portion of the Buf using subbuf, then use .decode to turn it into a string
18:25 raydiak r: my $b = Buf.new: 97..122; say $b.subbuf(0,3).decode;
18:26 camelia rakudo-moar ab55cb: OUTPUT«abc␤»
18:29 raiph joined #perl6
18:29 J-L raydiak:  Yes, I could, but I don't know the length of the string until I process through it (which is easy to do with a regular expression).  I suppose I could .decode it into a Str, then process the Str, find its length, and then process the binary portion after that.
18:29 b2gills Shouldn't there be a submethod BUILD for Signature?
18:30 cognominal joined #perl6
18:30 J-L Say, I see that I can use splice() on Buf objects, but I can't seem to use the last argument to replace.  For example:
18:31 J-L my $x = Buf.new(1 .. 10);  splice(@$x, 0, 5, ());  # doesn't actually remove the first five elements
18:32 J-L That is, the first five elements are returned, but $x remains unchanged.
18:33 skids That's because you are splicing $x, you are splicing a list you created from $x.
18:33 skids erm not splicing $x
18:33 J-L Is there any way to splice $x?
18:34 PerlJam J-L: implement splice for Buf?  :)
18:34 skids m: my $x = Buf.new(1 .. 10);  subbuf-rw($x, 0, 5) = Buf.new(); $x.say # but this will be very slow in tight loops.
18:34 camelia rakudo-moar ab55cb: OUTPUT«Buf:0x<06 07 08 09 0a>␤»
18:35 retupmoca m: my $b = buf8.new(1 .. 10); say $b.subbuf(0, 5); $b .= subbuf(5); say $b;
18:35 camelia rakudo-moar ab55cb: OUTPUT«Buf[uint8]:0x<01 02 03 04 05>␤Buf[uint8]:0x<06 07 08 09 0a>␤»
18:36 J-L buf8?  Is that a shortcut for Buf[uint8] ?
18:36 skids yes
18:36 J-L Neat!
18:36 retupmoca m: buf8.new.say; buf16.new.say; buf32.new.say; # other sizes available as well
18:36 camelia rakudo-moar ab55cb: OUTPUT«Buf[uint8]:0x<>␤Buf[uint16]:0x<>␤Buf[uint32]:0x<>␤»
18:37 J-L Is there a way to junk remove the first n elements of a Buf object?
18:37 J-L I mean, an efficient way?
18:38 dalek nqp: 986c397 | TimToady++ | / (2 files):
18:38 dalek nqp: revert jvm index semantics, plus new tests
18:38 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/986c39788e
18:38 retupmoca I usually do '$buf .= subbuf($n);' but I'm not really sure how efficient it is
18:38 PerlJam retupmoca: it uses a Proxy, so if he's doing it often, probably not so much
18:39 PerlJam J-L: why are you concerned with efficiency?
18:39 skids Right now (unless I missed something) subbuf-rw uses inefficient proxy objects and it is the only way I think to alter the buf directly, if it even actually does that and does not just lie and swap in a newly created buf.
18:40 skids J-L: if you do not need effeciency right now it is probably easiest to ignore all that.
18:40 dalek rakudo/nom: db60501 | TimToady++ | src/core/Cool.pm:
18:40 dalek rakudo/nom: fix rindex too, duh
18:40 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/db60501949
18:40 raydiak PerlJam: subbuf (not -rw) uses a proxy?
18:41 PerlJam raydiak: ah, no, I was getting the two examples confused.
18:41 Vlavv joined #perl6
18:41 skids not-rw would create a new buf, so if you are shaving 3 bytes of a 4MB buffer...
18:41 timotimo subbuf-rw uses a proxy, subbuf doesn't, i believe
18:42 raydiak yes it uses more memory and less cpu, that's the tradeoff retupmoca was suggesting I think
18:42 skids m: my @x := Buf.new(1 .. 10); @x[1]:delete; @x.say; # bummer, well I tried
18:42 camelia rakudo-moar 5f9243: OUTPUT«Can not remove elements from a Buf␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/nXmm5lQ3Oz:1␤␤»
18:42 krakan joined #perl6
18:42 J-L I'm porting over a Perl5 script of mine to Perl6, and it uses substr on a binary data string.  I've discovered that certain things can take about 64 seconds on Perl6 that took about 1 second on Perl5.  But make a little tweak, and Perl6 can go down to 1 or 2 seconds.
18:44 raydiak I don't think we are, for the most part, claiming to be anywhere near the execution speed of p5 yet; that said, it sounds kinda extreme and if you can golf the slow part down, I'll bet someone here would enjoy improving it
18:44 skids Although --- wait actuall not-rw would not necessarily create a new buffer if its coded right.
18:45 raydiak skids: even though Buf is mutable?
18:45 colomon raydiak: I’ve got to say, going from 60x slower than p5 to 1.5x slower with some simple tweaks sounds about right to me.  :)
18:46 skids As long as you don't mutate it.
18:46 raydiak copy on write I guess
18:46 skids No not even I think...
18:47 retupmoca looks like non -rw is going to be faster, as .subbuf-rw is a proxy that calls .subbuf() three times
18:47 raydiak colomon: good news :)  wasn't the case last time I compared...suppose I ought to stop spouting outdated information
18:47 retupmoca and .subbuf does create a full copy of the object
18:47 colomon raydiak: I certainly don’t want to say everything is comperable in speed now!
18:48 colomon raydiak: just that much slower still happens, while there are certain areas where the speeds are quite comperable.
18:49 raydiak colomon: oh no that's totally what you said dude, I'm holding you to it ;)
18:49 travis-ci joined #perl6
18:49 travis-ci NQP build failed. TimToady 'revert jvm index semantics, plus new tests'
18:49 travis-ci http://travis-ci.org/perl6/nqp/builds/53689750 https://github.com/perl6/nqp/compare/832c33139963...986c39788e6f
18:49 travis-ci left #perl6
18:50 skids m: my @x := Buf.new(1 .. 10); my @y := @x.subbuf(0,5); @y.say; @x[2] = 42; @y.say; # so the question is what SHOULD happen here.
18:50 camelia rakudo-moar 5f9243: OUTPUT«Buf:0x<01 02 03 04 05>␤Buf:0x<01 02 03 04 05>␤»
18:50 raydiak nah but really, I know what you mean...notice sometimes if I adjust just the right things, I stumble upon something which is much appreciated by the optimizer or the jit or whatever
18:52 krakan Hello everybody! Does anyone know how to run an external command with a pipe to write to it? I seem to be unable to get it right ...
18:53 PerlJam krakan: It may not be invented.
18:53 moritz krakan: http://doc.perl6.org/type/Proc::Async see the example with :w
18:55 eli-se I like how class names in PHP are case-insensitive, so if a library has an ugly class name like HttpRequest, you can still refer to it nicely as HTTPRequest. :P
18:55 yoleaux 12:48Z <Ven> eli-se: https://github.com/pixie-lang/pixie
18:55 PerlJam moritz++
18:57 b2gills m: say index 'abc','d'; say rindex('abc','d').^name
18:57 camelia rakudo-moar 5f9243: OUTPUT«(Int)␤Failure␤»
18:59 krakan moritz: Thank! I'll check that out right away - I've been trying with pipe, open and IO::Pipe so far with no luck.
19:00 eli-se .tell Ven I don't like it. :(
19:00 yoleaux eli-se: I'll pass your message to Ven.
19:00 krakan hm - "Thank!" is that like "Thanks!" but just one? - Anywa, I meant "many thanks" of course. ;)
19:01 moritz :-)
19:03 vendethiel joined #perl6
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19:04 b2gills J-L: perhaps the fastest way to remove the first n elements is to read them in separately
19:04 b2gills m: say $*IN.read(5); say $*IN.read(5)
19:04 camelia rakudo-moar 5f9243: OUTPUT«Buf[uint8]:0x<43 c3 a9 61 64>␤Buf[uint8]:0x<20 73 6c c3 a1>␤»
19:07 b2gills m: $*IN.seek(5,0); say $*IN.read(5)
19:07 camelia rakudo-moar 5f9243: OUTPUT«Buf[uint8]:0x<20 73 6c c3 a1>␤»
19:07 FROGGS joined #perl6
19:07 yqt joined #perl6
19:08 Sir_Ragnarok joined #perl6
19:09 FROGGS o/
19:11 moritz krakan: it seems that pipe() currently ignores :w, and always opens the program for reading
19:12 dalek nqp: 5b5c74f | TimToady++ | tools/build/MOAR_REVISION:
19:12 dalek nqp: bump moar rev
19:12 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/5b5c74f853
19:14 mglass joined #perl6
19:15 FROGGS m: multi sub task(|) { }␤my $t = task "foo", { }␤$t
19:15 camelia rakudo-moar db6050: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/sBkxjb8hYb␤A list operator such as "task" must have whitespace before its arguments (or use parens)␤at /tmp/sBkxjb8hYb:3␤------> 3my $t = task "foo", { }7⏏5<EOL>␤»
19:15 FROGGS m: multi sub task(|) { }␤my $t = task "foo", { };␤$t
19:15 camelia rakudo-moar db6050: ( no output )
19:15 FROGGS TimToady: do you have a clue what's going on here?
19:16 FROGGS (or what change could introduced that?)
19:16 FROGGS perhaps kok?
19:17 FROGGS ahh nice, release is next week
19:18 TimToady that's very odd
19:18 FROGGS m: multi sub task(|) { }␤my $t = task "foo", { }␤say 42
19:18 camelia rakudo-moar db6050: OUTPUT«42␤»
19:18 FROGGS that's odd :o)
19:18 timotimo maybe using a Blob instead of a Buf would make things better?
19:18 timotimo because those are, IIRC, immutable?
19:19 TimToady m: multi sub task(|) { }␤my $t = task "foo", { }␤$t;
19:20 camelia rakudo-moar db6050: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/imrh5V3CDV␤A list operator such as "task" must have whitespace before its arguments (or use parens)␤at /tmp/imrh5V3CDV:3␤------> 3my $t = task "foo", { }7⏏5<EOL>␤»
19:20 TimToady m: multi sub task(|) { }␤my $t = task "foo", { }␤+$t;
19:20 camelia rakudo-moar db6050: OUTPUT«use of uninitialized value of type Any in numeric context  in block <unit> at /tmp/bUrxVMstXM:3␤␤»
19:21 TimToady m: multi sub task(|) { }␤my $t = task "foo", { }␤*;
19:21 camelia rakudo-moar db6050: ( no output )
19:21 FROGGS m: multi sub task(|) { }␤my $t = task "foo", { }␤"42"
19:21 camelia rakudo-moar db6050: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/rlAwsBJvrv␤A list operator such as "task" must have whitespace before its arguments (or use parens)␤at /tmp/rlAwsBJvrv:3␤------> 3my $t = task "foo", { }7⏏5<EOL>␤»
19:21 FROGGS heh
19:22 kjs_ joined #perl6
19:23 travis-ci joined #perl6
19:23 travis-ci NQP build failed. TimToady 'bump moar rev'
19:23 travis-ci http://travis-ci.org/perl6/nqp/builds/53694815 https://github.com/perl6/nqp/compare/986c39788e6f...5b5c74f853d7
19:23 travis-ci left #perl6
19:25 skids Ooh, a drive-by bot :-)
19:27 amaliapomian joined #perl6
19:29 FROGGS I guess '<args(1)>' eats the newline?
19:31 TimToady it's just bogus logic there, fixing
19:32 FROGGS $<args> is ' "foo", { }␤' fwiw
19:33 dalek rakudo/nom: d2a17d1 | TimToady++ | src/Perl6/Grammar.nqp:
19:33 dalek rakudo/nom: don't test for listop ws if there were args!
19:33 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/d2a17d15e8
19:35 J-L joined #perl6
19:35 J-L By the way, when someone starts text with "m: ", what does that mean?
19:36 kaare_ joined #perl6
19:36 FROGGS ohh, that would have shown nicely wich commit was to blame: http://testers.p6c.org/dist/S/sake/Jonathan%20Scott%20Duff%20%3Cduff@pobox.com%3E.html
19:36 FROGGS J-L: it is about rakudo for the Moarvm backend
19:36 avuserow m: say "Hello J-L from Perl6 on Rakudo on MoarVM!"
19:36 camelia rakudo-moar db6050: OUTPUT«Hello J-L from Perl6 on Rakudo on MoarVM!␤»
19:37 krakan moritz: yes, that's what I found too. Proc::Async works great though.
19:38 FROGGS TimToady++ # sake (and a lot other modules) are fixed
19:42 dalek nqp: ce657bf | TimToady++ | tools/build/MOAR_REVISION:
19:42 dalek nqp: bump moar
19:42 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/ce657bf0de
19:43 raydiak camelia: help
19:43 camelia raydiak: Usage: <(nqp-js|star-m|p5-to-p6|rakudo-moar|rakudo-jvm|nqp-moarvm|nqp-jvm|star-p|debug-cat|pugs|star-j|prof-m|std|niecza|nqp-parrot|nqp-m|m|rn|n|rPn|p56|sp|rakudo|rnP|p6|nom|rm|sm|nqp-q|Prn|r|Pnr|nrP|nqp|nPr|star|P|r-m|r-jvm|nqp-mvm|nqp-j|j|nqp-p|perl6|rj|nr|r-j)(?^::\s) $perl6_program>
19:43 larion joined #perl6
19:44 raydiak J-L: ^ are the evalbot prefixes for various implementations, backends, etc
19:46 raydiak p56: my @a = (1,2,3); $a[-1] = 1;
19:46 camelia p5-to-p6 : OUTPUT«my @a = (1, 2, 3);␤@a[* - 1] = 1␤»
19:47 raydiak neat
19:47 FROGGS ohh, nice
19:48 travis-ci joined #perl6
19:48 travis-ci NQP build passed. TimToady 'bump moar'
19:48 travis-ci http://travis-ci.org/perl6/nqp/builds/53699256 https://github.com/perl6/nqp/compare/5b5c74f853d7...ce657bf0de5a
19:48 travis-ci left #perl6
19:49 * raydiak is off the eat his first meal in 2 days and go for a walk
19:51 FROGGS first meal in two days? WAT?
19:51 dalek doc: 65c7cab | moritz++ | lib/Type/Routine.pod:
19:51 dalek doc: Routine: document trait hidden_from_backtrace
19:51 dalek doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/65c7cabd96
19:51 * jnthn doesn't make a pun about walking fast...
19:51 raydiak FROGGS: the walk is across town to the social services office to renew the foodstamps :P
19:52 FROGGS O.o
19:52 vendethiel joined #perl6
19:53 * FROGGS really hopes that this is a joke
19:53 raydiak kinda broke in the head several years back and haven't substantially worked since, but I try not to talk about it much here, I'm kinda a ranting lunatic as it is
19:53 FROGGS ahh
19:54 raydiak on the up side, if the talk with my girlfriend goes well tonight, I won't be homeless tomorrow...
19:55 FROGGS okay, in retrospect, my day was not that bad after all
19:56 jnthn raydiak: Hope all will go well.
19:56 [Coke] raydiak: best of luck.
19:58 raydiak thank you everyone, it means a lot to me...y'all are in many ways the closest acquaintances I have
19:58 J-L Thanks for all your help, raydiak.
19:58 nwc10 raydiak: good luck
20:00 raydiak while I'm on the subject, might as well mention if anyone needs a half-crazy but somewhat clever programmer on their payroll, I could live more comfortably with only the wages of e.g. coders in india and pakistan :)
20:01 FROGGS :o)
20:01 dalek nqp: 27bc873 | TimToady++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/runtime/Ops.java:
20:01 dalek nqp: handle off the end start in jvm's index/rindex
20:01 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/27bc873706
20:01 raydiak I dropped out of high school, never went to college, have barely known any other programmers, and generally have a hard time getting anyone around here (here geographically) to take me seriously, don't know all the secret "I went to college" handshakes or something
20:01 J-L Where do you live, raydiak?  Like, what country, what state?
20:01 raydiak WA state US
20:02 dalek rakudo/nom: a49900a | TimToady++ | tools/build/NQP_REVISION:
20:02 dalek rakudo/nom: bump nqp
20:02 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/a49900aa98
20:02 J-L Hmm... not near me.  What other programming languages do you know?
20:02 raydiak Lua, p5, all the common web stuff
20:03 J-L What about C++ & Qt?
20:03 J-L Ruby?  Ruby on Rails?
20:03 raydiak no but I learn anything kinda really fast...at my internship I ended up being the only (and unpaid) developer on the core product, and didn't even know perl when I started a few months before
20:03 raydiak "internship" being a flexible term here :)
20:04 raydiak I worked basically for room and board on and off for about 9 years, between factory jobs and dishwashing and fast food and such
20:04 raydiak longest shift I ever pulled was 84 hours
20:04 raydiak not that we had a timeclock, of course
20:05 flussence raydiak: be careful what you wish for; my last coding job paid peanuts, and that wasn't anywhere near well enough to make up for all the other tolls it took in the long run... I think most people here are worth much, much more than that :)
20:05 kjs_ joined #perl6
20:06 J-L Do you mind stating what city you're in?  Don't if you're not comfortable telling.
20:06 raydiak wSpokane
20:06 J-L (Meant for radiak.)
20:06 raydiak erm, without the w :)
20:07 J-L I'll pass the word along, but I can't guarantee anything.
20:07 masak it's classier with the w
20:07 raydiak flussence: thanks, I'll keep that in mind; the grass is always greener and all that.  I have found, though, that doing a brain-sapping repetitve task for 8 hour 5-day weeks to barely scratch a living out also has it's tolls
20:08 raydiak thank you J-L, I seriously appreciate your help whether anything materializes or not!
20:08 jnthn masak: heh, I parsed it as Polish "in", helped by the e at the end :P
20:08 raydiak hehe
20:09 raydiak most things around here are named after native american people and words
20:09 J-L Another Perl6 question... Is there a Perl6 equivalent to truncated an array like Perl5's    $#array = 5;   ?
20:09 masak jnthn: oh, right! that's it!
20:10 J-L You're welcome, raydiak.  I know someone in Washington, but he's not there permanently, and I don't know if he knows of a position.  But I'll check.
20:10 grondilu joined #perl6
20:10 TimToady m: my @array = 1..10; @array.end = 4; say @array
20:10 camelia rakudo-moar d2a17d: OUTPUT«Cannot modify an immutable Int␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/5TESdQSfOC:1␤␤»
20:10 * grondilu had no idea $#array = 5 was a thing.  I'd use splice.
20:10 masak J-L: maybe `@array.=[^5]` ?
20:10 TimToady masak: the point would be to trim it in place
20:11 J-L I already tried    @array.end = 4;   but I get this error:  Cannot modify an immutable Int
20:11 TimToady m: my @array = 1..10; @array.splice(5); say @array
20:11 camelia rakudo-moar a49900: OUTPUT«1 2 3 4 5␤»
20:11 TimToady that's probably being smart
20:11 masak m: my @array = 1..10; @array .= [^5]; say @array
20:11 camelia rakudo-moar a49900: OUTPUT«No such method '&postcircumfix:<[ ]>' for invocant of type 'Array'␤  in method dispatch:<.=> at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:1355␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/CZE0HBLqlG:1␤␤»
20:12 J-L @array.=[^5]    gives me:   Cannot use .= on a non-identifier method call
20:12 masak o.O
20:12 raydiak thank you all again so much for your support...done eating, really afk for the walk now :)
20:12 breinbaas joined #perl6
20:12 TimToady std: my @array = 1..10; @array .= [^5]; say @array
20:12 J-L But this works:  @array.splice(5);
20:12 camelia std 28329a7: OUTPUT«Potential difficulties:␤  Unsupported use of .= as append operator; in Perl 6 please use ~= at /tmp/5Lxqh8cU0k line 1:␤------> 3my @array = 1..10; @array .=7⏏5 [^5]; say @array␤ok 00:01 140m␤»
20:12 TimToady std: my @array = 1..10; @array.=[^5]; say @array
20:12 camelia std 28329a7: OUTPUT«ok 00:00 140m␤»
20:13 J-L my @array = 1..10; @array .= [^5]; say @array;    gives me:  Method '&postcircumfix:<[ ]>' not found for invocant of class 'Array'
20:14 grondilu wouldn't @array .= [^5] less efficient than using splice?
20:14 TimToady I just said that
20:14 eli-se joined #perl6
20:14 TimToady or maybe my client ate that remark
20:15 grondilu seems so
20:15 masak < TimToady> masak: the point would be to trim it in place
20:15 TimToady that were it
20:15 grondilu ok
20:15 * masak .oO( let me backlog that for you ) :P
20:15 TimToady along with "that's probably being smart"
20:16 masak probably
20:16 TimToady now you're just being smart
20:17 * masak shifts away, quietly, awkwardly
20:17 Mouq https://rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=120383
20:18 vendethiel joined #perl6
20:18 moritz masak: now you're just ebing awkward
20:18 TimToady probably better than sedward
20:18 moritz perlward would be even better :-)
20:18 * masak .oO( Look to Sedward )
20:19 * masak enjoys being smart, which sometimes gets awkward
20:20 masak in other news, I notice I've started commenting lines of code that exceed a certain threshold of unreadableness, or rather non-at-sight-understandability.
20:21 moritz you could simplify them instead.
20:21 masak here is a recent example: https://github.com/masak/007/blob/master/lib/_007/Test.pm#L101-L108
20:21 masak two commented lines.
20:21 masak I guess I could refactor both those lines into well-named subs, or whatever.
20:22 masak but, like... meh.
20:22 masak I put the comments there instead.
20:22 [Coke] sedward sqrtpants
20:22 * masak .oO( we are put here on this urth, not to be gods or masters of nature, but to be sedwards )
20:23 [Coke] Java HotSpot(TM) 64-Bit Server VM warning: ignoring option MaxPermSize=200m; support was removed in 8.0
20:24 masak also, in that sub, I kinda wish there were a nice way to quickly create a "virtual file system", and run the Unix command on it. instead of messing with /tmp, which isn't so nice to non-Unix platforms and stuff.
20:25 masak whoever writes the "temporarily `cd` into a virtual file system" module, that works on all platforms, gets a beer from me :>
20:25 moritz masak: fwiw $*TMPDIR exists
20:25 masak ooh
20:25 masak still, I'm not really interested in files here at all
20:25 masak I do that because I have to
20:26 [Coke] tclsh let you create an in memory FS. something like that?
20:26 masak or I could re-implement `diff` in pure Perl 6.
20:26 masak [Coke]: yes, I think so.
20:26 timotimo we do have a diff in pure perl
20:26 masak troo
20:26 timotimo Text::Diff uses Algorithm::Diff which, i believe, is both pure perl6
20:26 timotimo but the tests for Text::Diff seem to be having a tiny bit of trouble
20:27 timotimo the error about listops needing whitespace or parens has been fixed, right?
20:30 dalek roast: bcbe584 | TimToady++ | S32-str/ (2 files):
20:30 dalek roast: fix off-the-end index/rindex tests
20:30 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/bcbe58473f
20:32 virtualsue joined #perl6
20:32 TimToady t/spec/S02-lexical-conventions/comments.rakudo.moar appears to be looping
20:33 darutoko joined #perl6
20:34 * lizmat is now starting on the P6 Weekly
20:34 TimToady my $a = q# 32 #;   <-- this is what's looping
20:35 TimToady probably recursive throw
20:35 TimToady I'll let someone else look at that, gotta finish packing for .hu and .ro
20:36 huf you're coming here? what's here?
20:37 TimToady they're trying to restart PM in Budapest
20:37 huf ooh!
20:38 TimToady so there's a conference Thu evening
20:38 b2gills m: say index('abc','d').^name; say rindex('abc','d').^name; say index('abc','').^name; say rindex('abc','').^name
20:38 camelia rakudo-moar a49900: OUTPUT«Int␤Failure␤Int␤Int␤»
20:38 huf TimToady: where can i find more info on it?
20:43 nine_ .seen Tux
20:43 yoleaux I haven't seen Tux around.
20:43 nine_ .seen |Tux|
20:43 yoleaux I saw |Tux| 12:28Z in #perl6: <|Tux|> .u Τῳ
20:44 mohij joined #perl6
20:46 masak (famous last words)
20:49 dalek Inline-Perl5: c840b8d | (Stefan Seifert)++ | / (3 files):
20:49 dalek Inline-Perl5: First support for passing file handles from Perl 6 to Perl 5
20:49 dalek Inline-Perl5: review: https://github.com/niner/Inline-Perl5/commit/c840b8d1bd
20:49 nine_ .tell |Tux| I seem to remember you expressing interest in passing file handles to P5 code. https://github.com/niner/Inline-Perl5/commit/c840b8d1bd may be of interest to you.
20:49 yoleaux nine_: I'll pass your message to |Tux|.
20:50 lizmat my $a = q##  # also hangs
20:51 FROGGS nine_++
20:51 felher joined #perl6
20:55 FROGGS m: my $i = UndeclaredClass.new;
20:55 camelia rakudo-moar a49900: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/HMEaDsiUV6␤Undeclared name:␤    UndeclaredClass used at line 1␤␤»
21:00 lizmat m: q##
21:00 lizmat already hangs  :-(
21:00 camelia rakudo-moar a49900: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
21:00 lizmat looks like ab55cb75a06abe765 is the first failing commit
21:02 skids https://gist.github.com/skids/d7dac1c5f6921f430f64 # drive-by summary/followup thoughts on "the role debate."  But I'll be afk, so feel free to call me names in the backlog :-)
21:04 moritz skids: names!
21:04 masak 'night, #perl6
21:07 coffee` joined #perl6
21:17 donaldh joined #perl6
21:17 Hor|zon joined #perl6
21:23 MadcapJake joined #perl6
21:31 japhb .oO( masak is sleeping earlier these days ...)
21:31 yoleaux 15:57Z <jnthn> japhb: No, I didn't attempt that (I wrote it in about 2 hours flat ;)). Please file a ticket, though, as it's a good idea.
21:31 yoleaux 15:59Z <jnthn> japhb: You'd probably have to .cue code directly to get it to hit that; Promise.start will have the Promise itself catch the exception and store it.
21:32 japhb .tell jnthn OK, I filed a GHI for the inheritable monitors request
21:32 yoleaux japhb: I'll pass your message to jnthn.
21:32 japhb Looks like an interesting backlog, from a quick skim.
21:32 * japhb ponders whether to sink time into backlogging today
21:33 lizmat https://p6weekly.wordpress.com/?p=425&amp;shareadraft=54fe11833d5f4   # this weeks P6Weekly draft
21:34 jnthn lizmat: apostrophe cotastrophe!
21:34 yoleaux 21:32Z <japhb> jnthn: OK, I filed a GHI for the inheritable monitors request
21:34 jnthn ("videos" :))
21:34 hoelzro lizmat++
21:34 hoelzro I find it great that there's not just a single person maintaining P6weekly
21:34 hoelzro it's a hard job, but that'll keep it going!
21:34 lizmat jnthn++
21:35 japhb Yeah, lizmat++ and timotimo++ for sharing that responsibility.
21:35 jnthn lizmat: That aside, I don't see anything to quibble about
21:36 jnthn lizmat++
21:36 lizmat feels like I'm missing a bunch
21:36 jnthn I feel like I did bugger all in the lsat week on Perl 6 :/
21:36 jnthn *last
21:36 lizmat my main source of info was really the git log this time
21:37 lizmat backlogging the past week (again) would have taken too much time
21:37 jnthn On the upside, I'm about to write the final slide for a course I've been working on for the last ages :)
21:37 bowtie joined #perl6
21:37 jnthn lizmat: Oh, I did do something!
21:38 lizmat .oO( note to self: keep list of P6W worthy things in backlog, even when not doing the P6W)
21:38 jnthn lizmat: I fixed most cases (afaik) of the pesky "Expected Array[Str] but got Array[Str]" bug.
21:38 lizmat jnthn: do tell!
21:39 japhb Any new thoughts on the role BUILD problem since skids++'s summary at https://gist.github.com/skids/d7dac1c5f6921f430f64 ?  This one is near and dear to my heart right now.  :-)
21:39 jnthn lizmat: Also some small optimization work to improve native ++/-- code-gen (and probably other is rw native things too)
21:39 donaldh lizmat: is it worth mentioning the steady increase in voices on #perl6 ?
21:39 lizmat donaldh: do we have stats on that somewhere ?
21:39 PerlJam donaldh: you mean we should call out all those P5 people who hang out here now? P)
21:39 PerlJam er :)
21:40 donaldh lizmat: also jnthn++'s gc crash fixes that unblocked nine
21:40 donaldh I don't know of any stats.
21:41 donaldh Just a perception
21:41 brrt joined #perl6
21:41 lizmat jnthn: the native int ++ codegen improvement still does not make it faster than using Int's
21:41 japhb Could probably be calculated from the irclog; moritz++ may already be doing this.
21:42 lizmat so I wonder whether I should mention that
21:42 jnthn lizmat: Correct; it's an improvement, not all the improvements we need :)
21:42 lizmat if we have a page I could link to, I would  :-)
21:42 jnthn lizmat: The other bug fix I did, and what donaldh++ mentioned, are more significant. :)
21:43 * jnthn forget the GC bug fix :)
21:43 jnthn *forgot
21:43 donaldh maybe some wonderful person will graph the irclogs :)
21:43 b2gills lizmat: perhaps we could `.tell p6weekly ...` when something interesting happens, then when creating a p6weekly post you just switch to that nick, and type .botsnack
21:43 jnthn nine++ did the hard work in figuring out what needed fixing
21:43 lizmat b2gills: excellent suggestion :-)
21:44 b2gills may have to do something to keep someone else from registering it
21:45 donaldh what drives the irclog summary mechanism?
21:45 avuserow lizmat: I fixed a bug in nqp-j regarding EOF being wrongly set (https://github.com/perl6/nqp/issues/224 if you want a link)
21:46 donaldh .seen [Coke]
21:46 yoleaux I saw [Coke] 20:26Z in #perl6: <[Coke]> tclsh let you create an in memory FS. something like that?
21:47 donaldh .tell [Coke] There's a bunch of JVM tickets that could be closed but I don't have permissions
21:47 yoleaux donaldh: I'll pass your message to [Coke].
21:48 avuserow donaldh: IIRC there used to be a way to select messages for the irclog summary. I think moritz and maybe raiph would know?
21:48 avuserow oh, it's still there, you just click "enable summary mode"
21:49 donaldh avuserow: oh, it's summary mode, right there on the irclog
21:49 donaldh 'Enable summary mode'
21:51 ab5tract anyone know where i can find a code example of using Supply as a role?
21:52 donaldh jnthn: do you have any thoughts about http://irclog.perlgeek.de/perl6/2015-03-09#i_10245999
21:53 jnthn ab5tract: Most of the built-in methods on supplies are implemented by having a class that does the role
21:53 jnthn ab5tract: See SupplyOperations.pm
21:53 donaldh When I get "TODO passed" in spectest output, does that mean a test can be unfudged?
21:53 lizmat ab5tract: check out src/core/SupplyOperations.pm
21:54 ab5tract thanks jnthn, lizmat
21:54 jnthn donaldh: Not really; I'd need to look closer at what's going on, and I can't do that right now.
21:56 donaldh jnthn: np, I'll park it for now.
21:57 vendethiel [Coke]: ping lets you create a FS as well :-P
22:02 pecastro joined #perl6
22:05 lizmat https://p6weekly.wordpress.com/2015/03/09/2015-10-fosdem-videos-and-role-conflicts/   # published P6W
22:06 avuserow lizmat++
22:06 brrt yay lizmat++
22:09 dolmen joined #perl6
22:09 ab5tract NativeCall C++? Is that for real? :D
22:10 ab5tract lizmat++ # p6weekly
22:10 vendethiel lizmat++ :-)
22:11 lizmat ab5tract: yes, if I may believe FROGGS++
22:11 vendethiel I don't understand ovid's complaint in "role inheritance"
22:11 vendethiel the "foo" inherited method is always the "outermost", what's the issue? if the role is called A or B, that doesn't matter Oo
22:13 vendethiel (where outermost = most derived)
22:15 japhb Where are the FOSDEM slide decks?  I just got to the point in tadzik++'s talk where the mic cuts out, and I'd rather just read through the rest of the slides at full speed, since I can't hear him talk.  :-)
22:15 sjn lizmat++ # great to see a p6weekly update
22:17 raiph joined #perl6
22:17 ab5tract robust and easy C++ support has been relatively fleeting from dynamic languages, as I understand it
22:17 colomon lizmat++ indeed
22:19 geekosaur the notion that C++ *can* be supported is still new to many people
22:20 geekosaur even though it's been possible since C++11
22:21 * sjn got the impression that C++ was nigh-impossible to "nativecall"
22:22 geekosaur it used to be
22:22 * sjn wonders what "the trick" to make it work is
22:22 geekosaur in order to allow different C++ compilers to interoperate, C++11 required that each arch/platform define an official ABI
22:23 geekosaur once that ABI exists, you can also use it to FFI
22:23 * lizmat takes all the ++'s and goes to sleep &
22:24 geekosaur prior to C++11, every C++ compiler did its own thing and was not required to document what it did, which is why your only option was extern "C" from C++ --- things could and did change with every compiler release
22:24 sjn right
22:40 raydiak idk who this "Mai L." guy is or how he got an e-mail account on my server, but man...if his inbox is any indication, *all* the girls want him :)
22:40 telex joined #perl6
22:44 vendethiel joined #perl6
22:48 timotimo might be worth pointing out that there's at least the froggs talk about nativecall missing from the fosdem list and that at least tadzik's talk is missing about 3/4 of its audio
22:52 itz https://twitter.com/olegwant/status/573365880127680512/photo/1
22:54 * TimToady sitting at SFO
22:54 raydiak timotimo: sorry you're not feeling well; nothing serious I hope
22:54 raydiak lizmat++ # weekly
22:54 raydiak itz: nice :)
22:58 * raydiak wonders where TimToady is heading
22:58 TimToady Budapest, via LHR
22:59 Yeyo joined #perl6
22:59 raydiak wow, neat
23:00 raydiak the pictures sure are pretty
23:03 jnthn TimToady: Save travels, and hope LHR will be unchaotic. :)
23:06 jnthn uh, safe
23:06 jnthn .oO( and to think I'm currently reviewing stuff for typos... )
23:10 timotimo raydiak: it'll be all right
23:11 raydiak glad to hear it
23:13 dalek rakudo/nom: e395707 | TimToady++ | src/Perl6/Grammar.nqp:
23:13 dalek rakudo/nom: quick bandaid for q##
23:13 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/e395707f7e
23:14 tadzik japhb: not sure if I uploaded my slides, can do it now :)
23:14 tadzik or put them somewhere[tm]
23:15 TimToady not sure that's the best place to fix q##, but it works for now
23:15 cognominal joined #perl6
23:16 TimToady m: q
23:16 camelia rakudo-moar a49900: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/_vwpDPLy9c␤Undeclared routine:␤    q used at line 1␤␤»
23:16 timotimo colomon: would you believe me if i told you you've been running a process with t/02-timeout.t again for a long time?
23:16 timotimo colomon: it has now accumulated 376 cpu-time hours
23:16 timotimo also ... two "moar" processes that have accumulated 125 cpu-time hours each :)
23:17 tadzik oh, feather's HTTP is down? :(
23:17 timotimo ah, they are running t/02-timeout.t, too
23:20 integral joined #perl6
23:20 integral joined #perl6
23:23 pecastro joined #perl6
23:27 * raydiak runs his domain through some random appraisal site and is amused to see it guess a category of "Education -- College" given his earlier rant
23:28 TimToady historically on Windows, \n to \r\n mapping has happened down in the stdio layers when you open a text file
23:30 TimToady boarding, catch you on the flip side
23:31 TimToady afg &
23:31 raydiak o/
23:32 timotimo i'm glad you're safe to fly again
23:48 vendethiel joined #perl6

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