Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2015-11-27

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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Time Nick Message
00:00 [Coke] gfldex: what day?
00:00 zacts_ joined #perl6
00:01 gfldex [Coke]: it's pretty much finished, just has to be turned into html, so day 2 will do
00:01 [Coke] gfldex: edit the schedule here: https://github.com/perl6/mu/tree/master/misc/perl6advent-2015
00:02 dalek mu: b981588 | (Wenzel P. P. Peppmeyer)++ | misc/perl6advent-2015/schedule:
00:02 dalek mu: Update schedule
00:02 dalek mu: review: https://github.com/perl6/mu/commit/b9815883c2
00:02 gfldex [Coke]: done
00:03 * gfldex .oO( Was I just overtaken by a bot? )
00:03 [Coke] so, the official release date is the 17th. I suspect that, combined with a need to cram as much dev & testing time, alnog with advent, along with style points, we should aim for the 25th instead, yes?
00:03 [Coke] I'll probably be able to handle the compiler release that day, we'll see what my personal schedule looks like. might have to do it from the car.
00:04 gfldex i suspect that the 17th was chosen to hit the 25th :)
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00:04 [Coke] it was just based on the old formula, nothign special.
00:06 n0xff joined #perl6
00:16 [Coke] .ask lizmat - should we again remove all deprecations before xmas?
00:16 yoleaux [Coke]: I'll pass your message to lizmat.
00:19 doublec joined #perl6
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00:34 grondilu m: multi infix:<*>($r, @a) { $r Z* @a }; say pi * [1, 1];
00:34 camelia rakudo-moar 39869f: OUTPUT«(3.14159265358979)␤»
00:35 * grondilu was expecting (pi, pi)
00:35 grondilu oh wait
00:35 abaugher joined #perl6
00:35 grondilu I should have used X*.  My bad.
00:36 TimToady .tell jnthn I rejected RT #120916 because it suffices to stub the accessor instead.
00:36 yoleaux TimToady: I'll pass your message to jnthn.
00:37 cognominal joined #perl6
00:37 [Coke] Speaking of speed (in review) I'll craft something in the compiler release announcement about speed.
00:38 [Coke] Haters gonna hate, but we can try to get in front of it.
00:42 Hotkeys are there functions that do the same as some of the operators?
00:42 Hotkeys not sure where it would be useful
00:42 Hotkeys for example +
00:42 TimToady the operators *are* functions
00:42 Hotkeys er
00:42 TimToady m: say &infix:<+>(1,2)
00:42 camelia rakudo-moar 39869f: OUTPUT«3␤»
00:42 TimToady m: say infix:<+>(1,2)
00:42 camelia rakudo-moar 39869f: OUTPUT«3␤»
00:42 Hotkeys I meant like
00:43 Hotkeys is there an add(...) function as well or is the operator the only function that does this
00:43 Hotkeys as well as '+'
00:43 Hotkeys (I realize I could just define one but I don't actually need one)
00:43 TimToady infix:<+> is its proper name
00:43 Hotkeys alright
00:43 TimToady though in this one case there does happen to be a sum function
00:43 Hotkeys oh
00:43 TimToady but that's so we can optimize Range.sum
00:43 Hotkeys right
00:44 TimToady in general, we dont go out of our way to come up with letter-only names for our operators
00:44 TimToady many of them do call into methods though
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01:14 dalek rakudo/nom: f6b3bf3 | coke++ | docs/announce/2015.12.md:
01:14 dalek rakudo/nom: Add preliminary xmas release announcement
01:14 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/f6b3bf32ae
01:14 Zoffix w00t
01:14 Zoffix So close now \o/
01:14 Zoffix We're actually gonna call it "коледа"? :)
01:14 Zoffix mmmkay :)
01:15 Zoffix Sounds totally weird to my Cyrillic ear, but I don't mind.
01:15 [Coke] Zoffix: I'm open to suggestions.
01:15 * [Coke] hurls https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Koliada
01:16 Zoffix Oh, k, my ear would hear it as "коляда" then :) That sounds OK :)
01:16 [Coke] I might have picked the serbian one. I reserve the right to change which one i use. :)
01:17 Zoffix :P sounds good to me
01:23 TEttinger followed one day later by EMERGENCY KWANZAA BUGFIX release
01:24 TEttinger fitting since kwanzaa is on the 26th
01:24 Hotkeys I'd like to suggest aiming for the 23rd and calling it the Festivus release
01:25 TEttinger for the rest of us
01:25 Zoffix [Coke], there's a typo on line 66 fwiw: s/insure/ensure/; https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/f6b3bf32ae#diff-2da02ce361ccee00e5de8de605e63be3R66
01:25 Zoffix We also got superscript powers, tho I guess that's covered by "see doc/ChangeLog"
01:25 Zoffix m: say ⅓⁶
01:25 camelia rakudo-moar 39869f: OUTPUT«0.001372␤»
01:25 TEttinger no way
01:25 * Zoffix 'll never get tired of playing with that :P
01:26 TEttinger m: say 2⁶
01:26 camelia rakudo-moar 39869f: OUTPUT«64␤»
01:26 Zoffix m: say 2⁶⁶
01:26 camelia rakudo-moar 39869f: OUTPUT«73786976294838206464␤»
01:26 TEttinger ha nice
01:26 Zoffix :)
01:26 TEttinger u: superscript 9
01:27 TEttinger m: say "\C[SUPERSCRIPT NINE]"
01:27 camelia rakudo-moar 39869f: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/XmyDkTcawV␤Unrecognized backslash sequence: '\C'␤at /tmp/XmyDkTcawV:1␤------> 3say "\7⏏5C[SUPERSCRIPT NINE]"␤    expecting any of:␤        argument list␤        double quotes␤        term␤»
01:27 Hotkeys
01:27 Zoffix m: say "\c[SUPERSCRIPT NINE]"
01:27 camelia rakudo-moar 39869f: OUTPUT«⁹␤»
01:27 Hotkeys .u superscript 9
01:27 yoleaux No characters found
01:27 TEttinger sah
01:27 Zoffix .u ⁹
01:27 yoleaux U+2079 SUPERSCRIPT NINE [No] (⁹)
01:27 dalek rakudo/nom: 1ae6805 | coke++ | docs/announce/2015.12.md:
01:27 dalek rakudo/nom: remove leftovers from previous release note
01:27 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/1ae680522a
01:27 Hotkeys ah
01:27 Hotkeys 'nine'
01:27 [Coke] Zoffix: removed.
01:27 TEttinger m: say 9⁹
01:27 camelia rakudo-moar 39869f: OUTPUT«387420489␤»
01:28 Hotkeys instead of 9
01:28 Zoffix :S
01:28 Zoffix hehe OK :)
01:28 doublec joined #perl6
01:28 Zoffix I'm excited \o/
01:29 TEttinger * contributed? but that guy's horrible
01:29 Zoffix :P
01:30 [Coke] Whatever.
01:30 TEttinger haha
01:30 Hotkeys 6.xisnunsla anyone?
01:30 * Hotkeys lojbans it up
01:30 TEttinger * is in prison for every crime ever committed by a living person convicted of a crime
01:31 Hotkeys but * is also praised for all the good anyone has ever done
01:32 TEttinger the weight of *'s soul(s) must be weighed against a feather or they get eaten by a crocodile
01:32 TEttinger "can it be a very large feather?"
01:33 Hotkeys but what is heavier
01:33 Hotkeys a pound of soul or a pound of feather
01:33 Hotkeys ???
01:33 TEttinger I dunno, soul can get pretty heavy, like much R&B as well
01:33 doublec_ joined #perl6
01:34 Hotkeys gotcha
01:34 Hotkeys oldest trick in the book
01:34 Hotkeys a pound of feathers is always lighter
01:34 Zoffix Hotkeys, a pound of feather, 'cause souls don't exist!@
01:34 Zoffix :)
01:34 Hotkeys yes but if we had an existant pound
01:35 TimToady r: say "a" ~~ m/<![a]>/
01:35 TEttinger it depends I suppose on the density
01:35 camelia rakudo-moar 1ae680, rakudo-jvm f6b3bf: OUTPUT«False␤»
01:35 Hotkeys of soulstuff
01:35 Hotkeys (existent?)
01:35 TimToady I have a fix for this one for moar, but not for jvm
01:35 TEttinger if if souls are extremely non-dense, then they might weigh less than the feather by extending above the scale and out of earth orbit
01:36 TEttinger to the heavens, as it were
01:36 Hotkeys lol
01:36 Zoffix TEttinger, a pound is a pound, bruh, extending or not :P
01:36 TEttinger but a pound only makes sense in context of earth's gravity
01:36 TEttinger weightless in space
01:37 Hotkeys what is more massful
01:37 Zoffix no, it doesn't :) A pound of mass is a pound of mass anywhere
01:37 Hotkeys a kilogram of souls
01:37 TEttinger haha
01:37 Hotkeys or a kilogram of feathers
01:37 Hotkeys :p
01:37 Hotkeys Zoffix: depends if it's a unit of mass or weight
01:37 Zoffix :o
01:37 Zoffix :)
01:37 TEttinger morality, in this case
01:37 TEttinger in the ancient egyptian sense
01:37 Hotkeys it's immoral to use the imperial system
01:38 TEttinger the weight of a soul vs. a feather is a concept in the ancient egyptian mythological afterlife
01:38 TEttinger I think that croc was far
01:38 TEttinger fat
01:38 doublec joined #perl6
01:39 TEttinger it's interesting reading about rarely-mentioned mythologies. it makes you wonder about rarely-mentioned programming language concepts
01:40 pierre-vigier joined #perl6
01:40 Hotkeys completely unrelated but often unmentioned
01:40 Hotkeys I'm a fan of conlangs
01:40 Hotkeys (constructed languages)
01:40 TEttinger https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shamanism_among_Eskimo_peoples#Secrecy_.28or_novelty.29_and_the_neutralizing_effect_of_publicity
01:40 Hotkeys (human languages not programming ones)
01:41 TEttinger it's interesting that many northern north american people believed in almost a formal set of rules for the supernatural
01:42 Hotkeys some people really dislike conlangs but idk why
01:42 Hotkeys I don't like them for their use
01:42 TEttinger in western belief, magic is the "rule-breaker" typically
01:42 TEttinger i like conlangs
01:42 Hotkeys I know esperanto or lojban will likely never be used
01:42 Hotkeys or in the extreme
01:42 Hotkeys ithkuil
01:42 Hotkeys (my fav)
01:42 TEttinger oh that one is familiar
01:42 Hotkeys I don't really know any ithkuil
01:43 Hotkeys I just like it in concept
01:43 Hotkeys it's so dense
01:43 Hotkeys "Tram-mļöi  hhâsmařpţuktôx." translates to "‘On the contrary, I think it may turn out that this rugged mountain range trails off at some point.’ "
01:44 Hotkeys oops I copied the quotes
01:45 Timbus_ oh cool. spoken APL
01:45 Hotkeys the first word is On ... that
01:45 TEttinger could also be perl
01:45 Hotkeys and the second is this ... point.
01:45 Hotkeys (i am lazy)
01:46 Hotkeys it isn't that they are defined as those things specifically
01:46 Hotkeys like in a dictionary
01:46 TEttinger conjugated?
01:46 Hotkeys it's just a highly agglutinative/synthetic languages
01:46 Hotkeys language**
01:46 TEttinger or agglutinated like german?
01:46 TEttinger ah
01:46 Hotkeys http://www.ithkuil.net/00_intro.html
01:46 Hotkeys scroll down a bit
01:46 Hotkeys it breaks down the sentence
01:47 TEttinger neat
01:48 Hotkeys root stems in ithkuil are each clusters of 1-5 consonants
01:48 Hotkeys :D
01:48 Hotkeys wonderfully ridiculous
01:49 Hotkeys also it, according to wikipedia, has 92 grammatical cases
01:49 uruwi joined #perl6
01:50 Hotkeys would be wonderful for telegrams
01:50 cognominal joined #perl6
01:50 Hotkeys assuming you had an extended morse code for all the characters
01:52 AlexDaniel .u …
01:52 yoleaux U+2026 HORIZONTAL ELLIPSIS [Po] (…)
01:53 AlexDaniel no character with two dots?
01:53 AlexDaniel .u ᳞
01:53 yoleaux U+1CDE VEDIC TONE TWO DOTS BELOW [Mn] (◌᳞)
01:59 TEttinger AlexDaniel: there's at least 28, braille
02:00 Hotkeys also it has other things that let it be more annoying and dense
02:00 Hotkeys both tone and stress
02:06 AlexDaniel m: say join '', ((0..0x1FFFF ==> grep { .uniname ~~ m/BRAILLE/ }) ==> map { .chr })
02:06 camelia rakudo-moar 1ae680: OUTPUT«⠀⠁⠂⠃⠄⠅⠆⠇⠈⠉⠊⠋⠌⠍⠎⠏⠐⠑⠒⠓⠔⠕⠖⠗⠘⠙⠚⠛⠜⠝⠞⠟⠠⠡⠢⠣⠤⠥⠦⠧⠨⠩⠪⠫⠬⠭⠮⠯⠰⠱⠲⠳⠴⠵⠶⠷⠸⠹⠺⠻⠼⠽⠾⠿⡀⡁⡂⡃⡄⡅⡆⡇⡈⡉⡊⡋⡌⡍⡎⡏⡐⡑⡒⡓⡔…»
02:06 AlexDaniel well, here it is fully:â €â �⠂⠃⠄⠅⠆⠇⠈⠉⠊⠋⠌â �â Žâ �â �⠑⠒⠓⠔⠕⠖⠗⠘⠙⠚⠛⠜â �⠞⠟⠠⠡⠢⠣⠤⠥⠦⠧⠨⠩⠪⠫⠬⠭⠮⠯⠰⠱⠲⠳⠴⠵⠶⠷⠸⠹⠺⠻⠼⠽⠾⠿⡀â¡�⡂⡃⡄⡅⡆⡇⡈⡉⡊⡋⡌â¡�â¡Žâ¡�â¡�⡑⡒⡓⡔⡕⡖⡗⡘⡙⡚⡛⡜â¡�⡞⡟⡠⡡⡢⡣⡤⡥⡦⡧⡨⡩⡪⡫⡬⡭⡮⡯⡰⡱⡲⡳⡴⡵⡶⡷⡸⡹⡺⡻⡼⡽⡾⡿⢀â¢�⢂⢃⢄⢅⢆⢇⢈⢉⢊⢋â
02:07 dayangkun joined #perl6
02:07 AlexDaniel hhmm ⠔⠕⠖⠗⠘⠙
02:10 AlexDaniel actually, it is a bit too ordered. It is more fun if you add “.pick: *”
02:10 AlexDaniel ⣎⣃⢙⡛⠄⠳⠆⢫⠻⣈⡓⢝⡋⢃⢻⠕⡂⠃⢈⢯⠮⡡⠭⣛⢏⡨⡾⡊⡢⡰⡜⣒⢞⣗⢄⡼⡅⢀⢉⣫⡘⢅⠒⣋⢾⠉⢷⣠⡮⣴⣘⢍⠸⡤⡵⡫⡌⡻⣁⢜⢳⠱⣰⠵⣣⣷⡸⡝⢗⢒⣦⡲⣕⠬⣢⡄⢎⢤⢛⣚⡿⢶⣐⣧⣞⣻⡞⢇⡏⢌⣙⠢⣱⠁⣬⢴⠛⢿⠑⠲⢁⢡⢚⡈⠊⠏⠙⣇⡍⡶⣏⠺⢰⢘⣲⢓⡑⢖⠎⢋⠤⠌⡒⠰⢑⣨⣺⠧⢟⣸⢩⡭⡥⢢⣮⣂⣍⢊⡳⡙⣩⣑⣶⠓⠣⢵⠩⣝
02:12 AlexDaniel m: say +((0..0x1FFFF ==> grep { .uniname ~~ m/BRAILLE/ }) ==> map { .chr })
02:12 camelia rakudo-moar 1ae680: OUTPUT«256␤»
02:12 AlexDaniel so basically you can represent any byte stream with Braille
02:21 kaare_ joined #perl6
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02:28 AlexDaniel .u ⟩〉
02:28 yoleaux U+232A RIGHT-POINTING ANGLE BRACKET [Pe] (〉)
02:28 yoleaux U+27E9 MATHEMATICAL RIGHT ANGLE BRACKET [Pe] (⟩)
02:33 xpen joined #perl6
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02:38 TimToady AlexDaniel: a couple of the rosettacode entries use Braille graphics
02:40 TimToady http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Draw_a_clock#Perl_6
02:40 TimToady http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Draw_a_cuboid#Perl_6
02:41 TimToady http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Fibonacci_word/fractal#Perl_6
02:42 Actualeyes joined #perl6
02:45 TimToady somebody should turn that braille-graphics support code into a module
02:45 AlexDaniel cuboid does not compile
02:45 TimToady aww
02:45 AlexDaniel well, it says “niecza”…
02:46 AlexDaniel OH
02:46 doublec_ joined #perl6
02:46 AlexDaniel my Bool %t;
02:46 AlexDaniel change that to “my %t” and boom, it works
02:47 TimToady yup
02:48 psch m: my Bool %t; %t<a> = True;
02:48 camelia rakudo-moar 1ae680: ( no output )
02:49 psch oh
02:49 AlexDaniel psch: %t{$Y     }{$X + $_}
02:49 psch looks like that should be Hash[Bool] %t
02:49 AlexDaniel which doesn't really make any sense to me…
02:49 psch as in, hash of hash of bool
02:49 autarch handling pod would be _so_ much easier if the compiler generated start & end nodes for lists of items
02:49 AlexDaniel yeah, perhaps!
02:49 AlexDaniel psch: actually, I've already edited it. Just removed the type alltogether
02:49 autarch otherwise you have to track a whole bunch of state to figure out when an item is part of an existing list vs a new list
02:49 psch AlexDaniel: yeah, that's probably fine too
02:49 autarch this is one place where Perl 5 POD is much easier to parse, although more painful to write
02:51 psch m: my %t of Hash of Bool # curious..
02:51 camelia rakudo-moar 1ae680: ( no output )
02:51 psch m: my %t of Hash of Bool; %t<f> = { a => True }
02:51 camelia rakudo-moar 1ae680: OUTPUT«Type check failed in assignment to %t; expected Hash[Bool] but got Hash␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/VDgF5nK_B3:1␤␤»
02:51 psch huh
02:51 psch so it does already work like that, neat
02:51 psch m: my %t of Hash of Bool; %t<f> = my % of Bool = a => True
02:51 camelia rakudo-moar 1ae680: ( no output )
02:52 psch m: my %t of Hash of Bool; %t<f> = my % of Bool = a => True ; say %t.perl
02:52 camelia rakudo-moar 1ae680: OUTPUT«(my Hash[Bool] % = :f((my Bool % = :a)))␤»
02:52 psch hm, that actually touches on something i often stumbled over
02:53 psch as in, the declarator (obviously) parses on-pass, but the actions kind of go RTL
02:53 psch ...not sure i can formulate that clearer right now :)
02:53 TimToady m: my Bool %t{Int;Int};
02:53 camelia rakudo-moar 1ae680: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/Gk0rPEIGTx␤coercive type declarations not yet implemented. Sorry. ␤at /tmp/Gk0rPEIGTx:1␤------> 3my Bool %t{Int;Int}7⏏5;␤    expecting any of:␤        constraint␤»
02:53 TimToady why does it think it's coercive?
02:54 psch s/on-pass/one-pass/
02:54 psch m: my Bool %t{Int}
02:54 camelia rakudo-moar 1ae680: ( no output )
02:54 psch i'd guess the slice (or multi-dim or whatwasit) is misparsed there..?
02:55 uruwi m: my Bool %t{Int}{Int};
02:55 camelia rakudo-moar 1ae680: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/YzzWWQiJ6q␤Multiple shapes not yet understood␤at /tmp/YzzWWQiJ6q:1␤------> 3my Bool %t{Int}{Int}7⏏5;␤    expecting any of:␤        constraint␤»
02:55 uruwi m: my Bool %t{Int,Int};
02:55 camelia rakudo-moar 1ae680: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/Mds3HRWOm3␤coercive type declarations not yet implemented. Sorry. ␤at /tmp/Mds3HRWOm3:1␤------> 3my Bool %t{Int,Int}7⏏5;␤    expecting any of:␤        constraint␤»
02:55 psch m: my Bool() $x
02:55 camelia rakudo-moar 1ae680: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/raz4GoBq0d␤Coercion Bool(Any) is insufficiently type-like to qualify a variable␤at /tmp/raz4GoBq0d:1␤------> 3my Bool() $x7⏏5<EOL>␤    expecting any of:␤        constraint␤»
02:56 psch anyway, gonna try and catch some shuteye o/
02:57 TimToady so if I fix the <![a]> bug at end-of-string in moarvm, I discover that <-[a]> has been relying on the bug not to match at the end, rather than actually checking its position
02:57 TimToady and if I fix that, the compiler loops compiling the setting, grr
02:58 raiph joined #perl6
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03:38 gfldex m: sub foo (::T $t, $not-T --> T) { ($not-T.comb>>.ord.sum / $not-T.chars).Int }; say foo(Int.new, 'abc');
03:38 camelia rakudo-moar 1ae680: OUTPUT«Type check failed for return value; expected T but got Int␤  in sub foo at /tmp/edZS5LRcfb:1␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/edZS5LRcfb:1␤␤»
03:39 gfldex are type captures for return types supposed to work?
03:43 gfldex m: sub foo (::T $t, $not-T) { my T $foo; my $type-string = $foo.WHAT.perl; ($not-T.comb>>.ord.sum / $not-T.chars)."$type-string"() }; say foo(Int.new, 'abc');
03:43 camelia rakudo-moar 1ae680: OUTPUT«98␤»
03:44 gfldex and is there a way to do a type cast to a type capture's type without fooling around with ."<type-name"() ?
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04:03 Hotkeys hola
04:06 TimToady well, there's also ::($type-string)(), but we oughta fix the T to be properly generic there
04:08 dalek nqp: 2661d27 | TimToady++ | src/vm/moar/QAST/QASTRegexCompilerMAST.nqp:
04:08 dalek nqp: Force <![a]> to always match at EOS.
04:08 dalek nqp:
04:08 dalek nqp: Fixes RT #126746 by explicit test of EOS for <![a]> (because
04:08 dalek nqp: fixing nqp::indexnat to return true at EOS ran into difficulties).
04:08 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/2661d275d2
04:09 dalek rakudo/nom: 50c3155 | TimToady++ | tools/build/NQP_REVISION:
04:09 dalek rakudo/nom: bumb nqp to get patch for RT #126746
04:09 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/50c31553a0
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04:13 TimToady r: say "a" ~~ m/<![a]>/
04:13 camelia rakudo-jvm 1ae680: OUTPUT«Error while reading '/home/camelia/p6eval-token': No such file or directory at /home/camelia/rakudo-j-inst/bin/eval-client.pl line 10.␤»
04:13 camelia ..rakudo-moar 50c315: OUTPUT«「」␤»
04:14 TimToady well, that fixes it for moarvm, anyway
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04:17 uruwi Is ab5tract here?
04:18 TimToady .seen ab5tract
04:18 yoleaux I saw ab5tract 25 Nov 2015 23:14Z in #perl6: <ab5tract> ahh. cool :)
04:19 uruwi Interesting
04:23 uruwi I wonder if for (^1000000) could be optimized into loop (my $i = 0; $i < 1000000; ++$i)
04:26 TimToady already supposedly is
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04:55 b2gills .tell lizmat did you mean `emit $elems = $elems + 1` instead of `emit ++$elems` ? https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/7d636cfc11
04:55 yoleaux b2gills: I'll pass your message to lizmat.
04:56 rigsby joined #perl6
05:06 uruwi 1.76 vs 3.81 secs
05:09 TimToady m: for ^1000000 {}; say now - INIT now
05:09 camelia rakudo-moar 50c315: OUTPUT«0.2576046␤»
05:09 TimToady m: for loop (my $i = 0; $i < 1000000; $i = $i + 1) {}; say now - INIT now
05:09 camelia rakudo-moar 50c315: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/0WV5pbND9Z␤Undeclared routine:␤    loop used at line 1␤␤»
05:10 TimToady m: loop (my $i = 0; $i < 1000000; $i = $i + 1) {}; say now - INIT now
05:10 camelia rakudo-moar 50c315: OUTPUT«0.1774705␤»
05:10 TimToady m: loop (my $i = 0; $i < 10000000; $i = $i + 1) {}; say now - INIT now
05:10 camelia rakudo-moar 50c315: OUTPUT«1.6700395␤»
05:10 TimToady m: for ^10000000 {}; say now - INIT now
05:10 camelia rakudo-moar 50c315: OUTPUT«2.4554113␤»
05:10 TimToady m: loop (my int $i = 0; $i < 10000000; $i = $i + 1) {}; say now - INIT now
05:10 camelia rakudo-moar 50c315: OUTPUT«0.061372␤»
05:10 TimToady I guess it doesn't
05:11 uruwi Auto-optimizing Int's to int's whenever possible is another possibility
05:11 TimToady m: loop (my int $i = 0; $i < 10000000; ++$i) {}; say now - INIT now
05:11 camelia rakudo-moar 50c315: OUTPUT«4.6867952␤»
05:11 TimToady ++ is a lot slower
05:11 skids Hrm, my panda seems to not be installing .moarvm files anymore, is that just interim curli WIP?
05:11 uruwi m: loop (my $i = 0; $i < 10000000; ++$i) {}; say now - INIT now
05:11 camelia rakudo-moar 50c315: OUTPUT«1.68555317␤»
05:11 uruwi Weird
05:12 TimToady ++ on natives is not optimized yet
05:12 uruwi Yeah
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05:12 TimToady m: loop (my $i = 0; $i < 10000000; $i++) {}; say now - INIT now
05:12 camelia rakudo-moar 50c315: OUTPUT«1.4500430␤»
05:12 TimToady huh
05:12 uruwi ++ on natives and range fors to loop are LHF
05:13 uruwi optimization of Int's to int's will be harder
05:13 uruwi will require static analysis
05:13 TimToady well, easy enough to tell that ^10000000 is limited, but it depends on how much unboxing is then needed inside
05:14 uruwi Not to mention dead/unreachable code elimination
05:15 dalek nqp: f17e8c5 | TimToady++ | src/vm/jvm/QAST/Compiler.nqp:
05:15 dalek nqp: Also fix RT #126746 on the jvm
05:15 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/f17e8c56ff
05:16 uruwi m: loop (my $i = 0; $i < 10000000; ++$i) {}; say now - INIT now
05:16 camelia rakudo-moar 50c315: OUTPUT«1.645288␤»
05:16 uruwi m: loop (my $i = 0; $i < 10000000; $i++) {}; say now - INIT now
05:16 camelia rakudo-moar 50c315: OUTPUT«1.64997290␤»
05:17 dalek rakudo/nom: 7c54722 | TimToady++ | tools/build/NQP_REVISION:
05:17 dalek rakudo/nom: bump nqp again for jvm's patch to RT #126746.
05:17 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/7c54722591
05:19 dalek roast: aef8ea1 | TimToady++ | S05-metasyntax/charset.t:
05:19 dalek roast: test that <![a]> always matches at eos
05:19 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/aef8ea1df4
05:21 TimToady okay, I think that was an xmas bug, even if it was never on the official list :)
05:24 Quom_ TimToady++
05:25 autarch so I've completely rewritten Pod::To::HTML by bulding it on top of my new Pod::NodeWalker module - https://github.com/autarch/perl6-Pod-NodeWalker
05:25 autarch Pod::NodeWalker handles walking the POD tree for you, as well as working around some current compiler bugs and generating synthetic start-list and end-list events to make it easier to handle lists
05:26 autarch This all started because I wanted to bring the doc.perl6.org design in line with the main perl6.org site, but the HTML Pod::To::HTML generated was basically hard-coded
05:26 autarch so ... does anyone want to code review all of this?
05:27 Quom_ autarch: Have you compared performance?
05:27 autarch Quom_: not yet
05:27 autarch though it runs ok in the tests
05:28 autarch it's also _way_ more correct - it's handling a lot more pod and doing it more correctly in some cases
05:29 autarch the new Pod::To::HTML is at https://github.com/autarch/Pod-To-HTML/tree/autarch/use-pod-nodewalker - there's no point in a PR since it's essentially a rewrite
05:29 TimToady .oO(first make it run, then make it run right...)
05:29 Quom_ autarch: I don't doubt it :)
05:30 autarch is OO code notably slower than functions? the rewritten code is OO with some multi methods - the old code with FauxO - I'm guessing it was created before OO was really working in Perl 6
05:30 Quom_ autarch: I did a lot of work on the docs and Pod. It's been a mess for some time now…
05:31 JimmyZ autarch: nope. :)
05:32 * TimToady is very glad people other than him are looking after the docs :)
05:32 autarch I actually want to work on the docs themselves too but I've been diving down various rabbit holes that keep distracting me
05:32 TimToady funny how that happens...
05:32 Quom_ autarch: Yup!
05:33 * Quom_ is curious what the compile time is like for the docs nowadays
05:33 autarch TimToady: my first project after the site design is to work towards better organization of the Language overview - then filling in various docs - then writing some new ones
05:33 autarch Quom_: _SLLOOOWWWW_ last time I tried it :(
05:33 TimToady you want slow, try compiling the jvm backend...
05:33 autarch I do wonder if it'd be possible to thread or fork the HTML generation to speed things up - it should be easily parallelizable
05:34 Quom_ OOC, is weirdness of NQPLock wrt exceptions known? It seems to be the cause of #126724 having the wrong error
05:34 Quom_ Really, what happened to that bot? https://rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=126724
05:35 autarch to clarify organizing Language - Mean basically doing what this issue lays out - https://github.com/perl6/doc/issues/114
05:36 TimToady Quom_: no kloo for either question
05:37 Quom_ autarch: The original Pod::To::HTML library relie[d|s?] on global vars and so couldn't be parallized. That was the case a year ago, anyway
05:37 autarch Quom_: ah, then my rewrite will fix that - it's now an object that's entirely self-contained
05:37 autarch so I imagine that this will speed up doc generation a bit
05:37 Quom_ autarch: I tried a few times to rewrite the library to be OO, but never found something that I was satisfied with
05:37 Quom_ autarch: Sweet :)
05:37 autarch Quom_: please take a look at my branch then
05:38 Ben_Goldberg m: multi foo () returns Int { 42 }; multi foo () returns List { 43 }; say foo; # I relize that this is unrelated to the current discussion, but why can't perl's multi dispatch make use of the return type?
05:38 camelia rakudo-moar 7c5472: OUTPUT«Ambiguous call to 'foo'; these signatures all match:␤:( --> Int)␤:( --> List)␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/UjaA2KIdJU:1␤␤»
05:38 Quom_ Well, I'm still trying to figure out where Pod::To::HTML is defined?
05:39 nwc10 yoleaux: tell jnthn valgrind didn't show anything other than the abort
05:39 Quom_ nvm, found the repo ^^
05:39 nwc10 .tell jnthn valgrind didn't show anything other than the abort
05:39 yoleaux nwc10: I'll pass your message to jnthn.
05:39 nwc10 left #perl6
05:40 uruwi Ben_Goldberg because allowing it might create ambiguity
05:40 TimToady Ben_Goldberg: because that would take time travel to know the context in many cases
05:40 uruwi for instance, if you have foo return Int for one, and String for another, then what happens if you say my $bar = foo()
05:41 autarch TimToady: since you're here can you take a look at https://rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=124393 - I think it may be Christmas list worthy - it makes it very hard to use multi methods in roles in any useful way
05:41 Ben_Goldberg Return a superposition? ;)
05:41 autarch the ticket is a little crufty - if someone wants to close it I could make a new one that more clearly describes the problem
05:42 uruwi Ben_Goldberg possibly even more confusing
05:43 Quom_ +1
05:43 Ben_Goldberg I suppose that the better example would be if there were multi bar(Int) and multi bar(Str), then bar(foo) would be ambiguous.
05:43 autarch Quom_: you'll also want to look at Pod::NodeWalker since that does some of the heavy lifting for my PTH rewrite - https://github.com/autarch/perl6-Pod-NodeWalker - it's pretty minimal code, actually
05:43 Quom_ Right :)
05:43 autarch except for the insanity around lists :(
05:44 autarch we really need the compiler to generate start & end list markers or something
05:45 konobi mmm?
05:45 Quom_ autarch: That's been a continual pain point
05:45 autarch yeah, I think maybe 25% of the code in P::NW is about synthesizing start-list and end-list events
05:46 autarch if it's incomprehensible I think the tests may clear up what the goal is
05:46 autarch also re: tests - I wrote a whole bunch for P::T::HTML too - it was nearly untested before
05:48 Quom_ autarch: Would it be better for it to have start & end markers or just to have Pod::ItemGroup.new(contents => [Pod::Item.new xx *])
05:49 Quom_ In your judgement
05:49 autarch Quom_: yeah, a container would be better, you're right
05:49 autarch as long as containers end up container other containers ... so =item1 followed by =item2 means that the =item1 container contains the =item2 container
05:50 autarch yo dawg, I heard you like containers ...
05:51 Quom_ Actually, it should probably be more like Pod::ItemGroup.new(level => 1, contents => ["blahblah", Pod::SomeText.new])
05:51 autarch also, if you have an =item2 without a preceding =item1 it needs to have two containers - without that I still need all the crazy logic I wrote around list levels
05:51 Quom_ (while we're breaking things)
05:51 autarch the compiler is in a much better position to figure this stuff out than any developer is who's just looking at some random chunk of POD later
05:52 Quom_ autarch: I'm not convinced
05:52 autarch ot
05:53 Quom_ wrt two containers without precedence
05:53 autarch it's very painful to handle levels jumps for something like an HTML generator - you need to actually write out all the missed levels of <ul><li><ul><li> etc
05:53 autarch so either the compiler does this for me or I have to keep constant track of the last level I was in (like I'm doing now in Pod::NodeWalker)
05:53 autarch if the compiler isn't going to do that than the groups really aren't that helpful
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06:18 Quom_ autarch: Off the bat, you need to predeclare 'class Renderer' and rename the classes so that they aren't Pod::To::HTML::Pod::To::HTML::
06:18 autarch Quom_: yeah, I don't really understand the unit stuff or how module vs class works re: namespaces
06:18 ShimmerFairy =item2 stuff shouldn't end up inside =item1 stuff, since Pod is explicitly designed so that it's wrong for the writer to do that (thus it'd be weird for the compiler to turn around and do that)  :)
06:19 autarch ShimmerFairy: I'm not sure what you mean
06:19 ShimmerFairy autarch: the spec for Pod6 explicitly says that  =begin item1 ... =item2 ... =end item1  is not how you use sub-items, so having the compiler do that anyway would feel incredibly wrong to me.
06:20 Quom_ ShimmerFairy: That's not it
06:20 ShimmerFairy Quom_: yeah, I just saw  Item(level => 1, contents => Item( level => 2 ) )  as an idea above, which'd be wrong
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06:21 Quom_ ShimmerFairy: The proposal is =item1 … =item1 … =item2 … =item2 … =item1 … gets folded into ItemGroup[…,…,ItemGroup[…,…],…]
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06:22 autarch just providing the sequence of events makes it very difficult for consumers of this information - we really need to know how the =itemX blocks relate to each other
06:22 Quom_ ShimmerFairy: I think =begin item1 ... =item2 ... =end item1 would become ItemGroup[Block[…,ItemGroup[…],…]
06:22 autarch any output format I can think of requires that
06:22 Quom_ ]
06:23 ShimmerFairy Quom_: huh, turns out I haven't messed with lists at all in my Pod parser rewrite yet, so I've not come up with a solution myself :P
06:23 ShimmerFairy (also, I'm reminded again to _really_ get back to working on that more than I have been)
06:23 autarch ShimmerFairy: are you working on the parsing in rakudo?
06:23 autarch cause there are some bugs I'd like to point you at ;)
06:23 Quom_ ShimmerFairy: Parser or walker?
06:24 ShimmerFairy autarch: yeah, I've been working on developing a new parser out of core (since that's so much easier) over the last couple/few months, off and on. Countless other projects I like working on have slowed things a bit :P
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06:24 autarch why would we need a parser outside of core? I really appreciate being to get objects from $=pod versus the Perl 5 way (which is "use some module off CPAN to read a bunch of text")
06:25 ShimmerFairy autarch: only out-of-core because it's much easier than recompiling rakudo every time one makes a change, it's supposed to go in when it's ready enough :)
06:25 autarch I see
06:26 ShimmerFairy (it's not uncommon for rakudo devs to do this for new big-ish features in general, IIRC)
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06:26 autarch I see
06:26 autarch I'm not very familiar with how any of the Perl 6 core dev works
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06:27 ShimmerFairy autarch: it's just something you do because waiting 100-odd seconds to recompile rakudo to test if your typo fix actually works tends to slow down things too much in the "rapid development" phase of something :)
06:28 autarch makes sense
06:28 ShimmerFairy It's a useful strategy for any project where you'd rather like to prototype some new component without trying to put in a larger context at the same time, I think. :)
06:29 autarch some bugs to look at - https://rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=114480 - https://rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=126740 - https://rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=126742
06:30 autarch https://rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=126651
06:31 ShimmerFairy about those table bugs, =tables have been a sticking point for me for quite a while as well. And incidentally getting some tiny bit of table parsing implemented is the last thing keeping me from wanting to make my project public :)
06:32 autarch I also note that S26 talks about every named block having its own class like Pod::Block::Named::Image but that's not happening right now - named blocks all seem to be Pod::Block::Named
06:32 Quom_ timotimo and I, and probably others, have tried to implement tables as well. PITA
06:32 autarch ShimmerFairy: I ended up just forcing the table contents to become POD in my NodeWalker code - https://github.com/autarch/perl6-Pod-NodeWalker/blob/master/lib/Pod/NodeWalker.pm6 - look for self!podify
06:33 ShimmerFairy autarch: yeah, the Pod "AST" structure is something I find woefully under-defined in S26, so part of my fix-up project is to make a more defined structure
06:34 autarch FWIW I don't think having Named::X classes is really very useful - it might be better to just update S26 here ;)
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06:35 ShimmerFairy Quom_: my current idea is to set up an "interruptible" version of how implicit paragraphs are processed, namely because of one-pass parsing, and because doing too much grammar work actions-side feels like a code smell to me :)
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06:37 autarch that also reminds me - the way things like "=head1 Foo" generates a Para node seems very gross and requires a lot of dumb hacks to generate sane HTML
06:37 autarch I'm constantly flipping a $!render-paras attribute back and forth - very dumb
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06:38 autarch again, this is something that the compiler knows better than I do - "=item1 Foo" - no para - "=begin item1\n\nFoo\n\n=end item1" - has a para
06:38 Quom_ ShimmerFairy: Oh it can absolutely be done in pass, it's just hard to get that to work in NQP
06:39 Quom_ autarch: And what's your proposed behavior?
06:40 autarch Quom_: well, I haven't worked out _every_ corner case - but it seems like "=foo Text on same line" should never generate a Para
06:40 Quom_ Oh, I misunderstood.
06:40 autarch and probably the same goes for "=foo\nText on line immediately after block start"
06:40 ShimmerFairy autarch: well, implied paras are something =head has, as I recall. I did however set up a way for the Pod writer (but _not_ the renderer) to tell the compiler not to imply =para :)
06:41 autarch ShimmerFairy: it seems like some reasonable defaults are in order here
06:41 autarch no one writes "=head2 Thingy" and expects HTML like "<h2><p>Thingy</p></h2>"
06:41 autarch in fact, that's not even legal HTML
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06:42 ShimmerFairy I don't think we can expect all potential rendering formats to support exactly what Pod does, so the fact that HTML supposedly can't handle a paragraph in a header isn't Pod6's fault to me :)
06:42 Quom_ autarch: I was going to throw together a PR for ItemGroup, but I forgot how messy the Rakudo code is, and implementing without cleaning up would make a much bigger mess. So sorry, not tonight :9
06:43 autarch that's ok, I already spent the time to work around it and test my workarounds
06:43 autarch now you'd just be making _more_ work for me ;)
06:43 ShimmerFairy Quom_: if I work fast enough, I'll be able to make my code finally public tonight :)
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06:43 Quom_ ShimmerFairy: Well, if it's public in any form I could assist :)
06:44 Quom_ Tonight, though, it seems I've run up against my fair share of dead-ends
06:44 Quom_ (half-dead-ends? wilted-ends? sprouting-ends?)
06:44 ShimmerFairy Quom_: sure, the only reason it isn't atm is because of my tendency to want something "good enough", or something representative enough of where my ideas are headed, plus other interests taking my attention :)
06:45 Quom_ understandable :)
06:52 autarch ok, bed time, but feel free to have the bots send me messages - if people like the new Pod::To::HTML I'll try using it for doc.perl6.org before I write API docs and submit a PR
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07:29 [Tux] lizmat, what changed for me to get this:
07:29 [Tux] ===(   17210;53  14730/?  0/?  0/? )====================================Cannot directly create a Supply. You might want:
07:29 [Tux] - To use a Supplier in order to get a live supply
07:29 [Tux] - To use Supply.on-demand to create an on-demand supply
07:29 [Tux] - To create a Supply using a supply block
07:29 [Tux] in sub in at t/90_csv.t:78
07:29 [Tux] in block <unit> at t/90_csv.t:104
07:32 [Tux] test             50000    23.383    23.268
07:32 [Tux] test-t           50000    20.935    20.820
07:32 [Tux] csv-parser       50000    29.589    29.474
07:34 arnsholt [Tux]: jnthn recently changed some parts of how Supplies work; that's probably it
07:35 [Tux] s/Supply/Supplier/ => hang, so it is not that simple
07:36 arnsholt There's a Rakudo commit with a long commit message that details what live and on-demand is, I think
07:37 [Tux] s/Supply.new; start/supply/ => No such method 'emit' for invocant of type 'Supply'
07:38 [Tux] a8231f14b2d5400e06
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07:44 dr4ngd hi
07:46 [Tux] reading the commits and the docs, it looks like I would need https://gist.github.com/Tux/ccaa53f28b5744ead7ee but that causes the tests to hang
07:46 moritz hi dr4ngd
07:46 yoleaux 26 Nov 2015 23:51Z <gfldex> moritz: i would like to book a day in advent, but don't know how!
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07:51 [Tux] jnthn, why does Supply::Preserving not have .from-list ???
07:51 [Tux] my $sup = Supplier::Preserving.new;
07:51 [Tux] $sup.from-list (@data,);
07:51 [Tux] should DWIM?
07:52 moritz .tell gfldex claim a spot on https://github.com/perl6/mu/blob/master/misc/perl6advent-2015/schedule and /msg me your email address (unless you already have write access to the blog)
07:52 yoleaux moritz: I'll pass your message to gfldex.
07:52 moritz .msg gfldex claim a spot on https://github.com/perl6/mu/blob/master/misc/perl6advent-2015/schedule and /msg me your email address (unless you already have write access to the blog)
07:52 yoleaux moritz: Sorry, this command is admin-only.
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07:53 moritz m: my $sub = Supplier::Preserving.from-list((1, 2, 3))
07:53 moritz what's up with the bots today? bad net wheather?
07:54 camelia rakudo-moar 7c5472: OUTPUT«Method 'from-list' not found for invocant of class 'Supplier::Preserving'␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/D2GaiJAK1d:1␤␤»
07:54 [Tux] Method 'from-list' not found for invocant of class 'Supplier::Preserving'
07:54 [Tux] in sub in at t/90_csv.t:78
07:54 masak m: say .subst(/h/, "") and say .subst(/a/, "") given "wheather"
07:54 yoleaux 26 Nov 2015 02:50Z <Zoffix> masak: you seem to know math well. Does this make any sense or should it be throwing due to division by zero? m: say (0/0)+(0+1i) <camelia> rakudo-moar : OUTPUT«Inf+1i␤»
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07:55 masak Zoffix: I think that's conformant with IEEE 754.
07:56 camelia rakudo-moar 7c5472: OUTPUT«weather␤whether␤»
07:56 [Tux] m: my $sup = Spplier::Preserving.from-list((1, 2, 3));
07:56 [Tux] m: my $sup = Supplier::Preserving.from-list((1, 2, 3));
07:57 camelia rakudo-moar 7c5472: OUTPUT«Could not find symbol '&Preserving'␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/RbxhuE_MyV:1␤␤Actually thrown at:␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/RbxhuE_MyV:1␤␤»
07:57 camelia rakudo-moar 7c5472: OUTPUT«Method 'from-list' not found for invocant of class 'Supplier::Preserving'␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/tt_wVxeREr:1␤␤»
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08:41 [Tux] .tell jnthn my $sup = Supplier::Preserving.from-list((1, 2, 3));
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08:47 moritz http://perlpunks.de/paste/show/56581877.355a.147
08:47 moritz somehow the rebuild is b0rked
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08:52 moritz never mind, that's an old one
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09:45 jnthn morning, #perl6
09:47 nine_ Good morning, jnthn
09:47 nine_ It's a quiet morning
09:47 jnthn [Tux]: .from-list is still used as Supply.from-list. It's only when you had a Supply.new that things need to change.
09:47 [Tux] reading the commits and the docs, it looks like I would need https://gist.github.com/Tux/ccaa53f28b5744ead7ee but that causes the tests to hang
09:48 [Tux] that is when I started to read the commit messgaes and concluded I needed Supplier::Preserving instead
09:48 jnthn If you had Supply.new before you just want Supplier.new now
09:49 [Tux] then the tests hang, so it is not 100% compatible
09:49 jnthn Oh, wait
09:49 jnthn *sigh* I think there was some weird notion of "paused" things...that was horrible.
09:49 jnthn :)
09:50 [Tux] that *was* the first thing I tried. I learned how to read the errors by now :)
09:50 jnthn So it could be you need Supplier::Preserving after all.
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09:50 jnthn @i.push: $sup;
09:50 jnthn That probably wants to be
09:50 jnthn @i.push: $sup.Supply;
09:50 jnthn The Supplier is the thing you emit with
09:51 jnthn The Supply is what you want the outside world so they can tap into the things you emit
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09:51 [Tux] ah, makes sense
09:51 jnthn uh, what you *give* the outside world
09:52 [Tux] @i.push: Supplier::Preserving.from-list (@data,);
09:52 [Tux] that would DWIM
09:52 jnthn No, that one is still Supply.
09:53 jnthn You only ever need a Supplier if you will be calling .emit yourself
09:53 jnthn Supply.from-list gives an on-demand supply, as it always has, meaning that it starts feeding you the list every time you tap it.
09:54 [Tux] my $sup = Supplier::Preserving.new.Supply;
09:54 [Tux] $sup.from-list (@data,);
09:54 [Tux] @i.push: $sup;
09:54 [Tux] like that?
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09:55 jnthn No
09:55 jnthn from-list is a factory method
09:55 jnthn Supply.from-list(@data) is all you need
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09:56 [Tux] won't that bork on the one-arg rule?
09:56 jnthn You only need a Supplier at all if you will do .emit calls yourself
09:57 jnthn .from-list follows the 1-arg rule now (didn't before, though)
09:57 jnthn I'm assuming you want a supply that, when tapped, will emit each item in @data?
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09:57 [Tux] yes
09:58 jnthn Then it should work fine (now)
09:59 jnthn m: my @a = 1..10; Supply.from-list(@a).tap(*.say)
09:59 jnthn Aww...netsplits probably upset dalek :(
10:00 camelia rakudo-moar 7c5472: OUTPUT«1␤2␤3␤4␤5␤6␤7␤8␤9␤10␤»
10:01 jnthn heh, 2 minutes :)
10:02 [Tux] @i.push: Supply.from-list (@data);
10:02 [Tux] tests pass. it is that simple
10:02 [Tux] jnthn++
10:05 gfldex .tell moritz post posted, set to private and to be published on 2015/12/02@00:01
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10:06 jnthn \o/
10:07 gfldex .botsnack
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10:11 RabidGravy who was it that was complaining that HTTP::UserAgent didn't have a .post() method?  I just implemented it.
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10:15 RabidGravy after a bit of refactoring I did yesterday, it became too easy to avoid
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10:34 yvarGdibaR what's all that about
10:35 yvarGdibaR SPLITTERS!
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11:01 RabidGravy is this thing on?
11:03 jnthn Stormy morning on the internets, it seems...
11:10 dalek rakudo/nom: 916b01b | lizmat++ | src/core/Supply.pm:
11:10 dalek rakudo/nom: We want the todo per tap, jnthn++
11:10 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/916b01b35b
11:11 lizmat .botsnack
11:11 lizmat aww
11:11 lizmat :-)
11:12 jnthn lizmat: Did you see the "need the empty whenever for side-effects" one too? :)
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11:12 lizmat was just about to ask
11:12 * jnthn thinks he's figured out a bunch of the Proc::Async and IO::Socket::Async data loss flappiness
11:12 lizmat so, we should not last out of a whenever also ?
11:13 jnthn You can
11:13 jnthn last in a whenever means "close the tap on this whenever"
11:14 jnthn done in a whenever means "emit done and close the taps on all whenevers in this supply block"
11:14 lizmat ok, so then re 39869f1bc15b2f03fd8a , I could just do: whenever self -> \val { last } ?
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11:14 jnthn This is about tail, right?
11:14 jnthn Imagine
11:14 lizmat *and* head, in the case of number <= 0
11:15 jnthn m: Supply.from-list(1..10).do(&say).last(5).tap
11:15 camelia rakudo-moar 7c5472: OUTPUT«Method 'last' not found for invocant of class 'Supply'␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/xThmNUkCuF:1␤␤»
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11:15 jnthn m: Supply.from-list(1..10).do(&say).tail(5).tap
11:15 camelia rakudo-moar 7c5472: OUTPUT«1␤2␤3␤4␤5␤6␤7␤8␤9␤10␤»
11:15 jnthn m: Supply.from-list(1..10).do(&say).tail(1).tap
11:15 camelia rakudo-moar 7c5472: OUTPUT«1␤2␤3␤4␤5␤6␤7␤8␤9␤10␤»
11:15 jnthn m: Supply.from-list(1..10).do(&say).tail(0).tap
11:15 camelia rakudo-moar 7c5472: ( no output )
11:15 jnthn That's the problem.
11:16 lizmat aha, so I *shouldn't* last out of it
11:16 jnthn Right
11:16 lizmat ok
11:16 jnthn It was right as I had it, though I really shoulda put a comment explaining why it's not pointless :)
11:16 lizmat I will
11:16 jnthn Thanks
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11:19 lizmat jnthn: so: basically we can never "last" out a built-in / library type of Supply method
11:19 yoleaux 00:16Z <[Coke]> lizmat: - should we again remove all deprecations before xmas?
11:19 yoleaux 04:55Z <b2gills> lizmat: did you mean `emit $elems = $elems + 1` instead of `emit ++$elems` ? https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/7d636cfc11
11:20 jnthn lizmat: Well, .head can last, for example
11:20 yoleaux 26 Nov 2015 22:48Z <lizmat> jnthn: supply test fails on OS X seem to be related to setting $*SCHEDULER
11:20 yoleaux 26 Nov 2015 22:49Z <lizmat> jnthn: could it be some missing decont on $*SCHEDULER maybe ?
11:20 yoleaux 26 Nov 2015 23:07Z <lizmat> jnthn: question: should you be able to last out of a whenever block without further consequences ?
11:20 yoleaux 00:36Z <TimToady> jnthn: I rejected RT #120916 because it suffices to stub the accessor instead.
11:20 yoleaux 05:39Z <nwc10> jnthn: valgrind didn't show anything other than the abort
11:20 lizmat yoleaux is back!
11:20 jnthn lizmat: The issue with tail is simply that it's an odd discontinuity that going towards zero you get all the side-effects, but when you hit zero you get none
11:21 jnthn Whereas with head, 0 immediately meaning "done" is fine, because 1 will be done with just one thing processed, etc.
11:21 lizmat m: Supply.from-list(1..10).do(&say).head(0).tap
11:21 camelia rakudo-moar 7c5472: ( no output )
11:21 lizmat isn't that the same issue ??  ^^^
11:22 jnthn But it's fine there 'cus it's not a weird discontinuity :)
11:22 jnthn m: Supply.from-list(1..10).do(&say).head(1).tap
11:22 camelia rakudo-moar 7c5472: OUTPUT«1␤2␤3␤4␤5␤6␤7␤8␤9␤10␤»
11:22 jnthn uh...
11:22 jnthn That's wrong though.
11:22 jnthn That should just do 1
11:22 lizmat why?  the .do is before the .head ?
11:23 jnthn .head should close the tap once it's seen enough though
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11:23 jnthn I'm not sure why that isn't happening "for free" with the code already there
11:23 yoleaux jnthn: Sorry, that command (.head) crashed.
11:23 lizmat m: Supply.from-list(1..10).head(1).do(&say).tap
11:23 camelia rakudo-moar 7c5472: OUTPUT«1␤»
11:23 lizmat this makes sense to me
11:23 jnthn yoleaux: I didn't really want head from you, tbh :P
11:24 lizmat the .head is *before* the .do, so the .do only sees 1
11:24 jnthn But it's a pipeline, that values are meant to be pushed through one at a time.
11:25 jnthn Think of the lazy list dual
11:25 jnthn m: (1..10).map(&say).head(1)
11:25 camelia rakudo-moar 7c5472: OUTPUT«1␤»
11:25 jnthn m: (1..10).map(&say).head(2)
11:25 camelia rakudo-moar 7c5472: OUTPUT«1␤2␤»
11:26 lizmat jnthn: gotcha
11:27 jnthn I really don't know why it doesn't Just Work though. I can't see anything you've done wrong in head.
11:27 * jnthn can take a look
11:27 lizmat well, lemme test some changes  :-)
11:27 jnthn OK :)
11:27 jnthn I need to debug/fix something weird happening with async sockets
11:28 lizmat yeah, and I should be preparing my slides for tomorrow  :-)
11:28 jnthn ;)
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11:32 lizmat jnthn: looks like lasting out of a whenever doesn't close the ta[
11:32 lizmat *tap
11:35 jnthn lizmat: OK, that's prolly the isuse then
11:35 lizmat jnthn: can I leave that to you?
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11:37 jnthn lizmat: Yeah, it'll probably be in SUPPLY somewhere, or some other nasty place.
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11:38 lizmat ok, I will have a stab at it
11:38 lizmat BTW, shouldn't that live in Rakudo::Internals ??
11:38 jnthn Maybe. :)
11:38 jnthn Rakudo::Internals didn't exist at the time I added it :)
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11:39 jnthn Feel free to move 'em.
11:39 jnthn Though Actions.nqp will need an update.
11:39 lizmat not clear how to change Actions.nqp, tbh
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11:39 lizmat find_method in Rakudo::Internals ?
11:40 jnthn Probably just a callmethod node instead of a call node
11:40 jnthn And with first child being a WVal holding Rakudo::Internals (which you get with find_symbol)
11:40 lizmat ok
11:41 jnthn Socket tests showed up my first fix wasn't so smart.
11:41 jnthn Now I've got it working nicely :)
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11:46 lizmat jnthn: hmmm... S17-supply/syntax.t now gives me an "Abort trap: 6"
11:48 jnthn After changing things?
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11:48 * jnthn can try looking at the patch
11:48 lizmat not sure
11:49 * lizmat stashes and rebuilds
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11:52 lizmat jnthn: before my changes, could have been a while already so
11:53 dalek nqp: 2253c07 | jnthn++ | tools/build/MOAR_REVISION:
11:53 dalek nqp: Bump MOAR_REVISION for async I/O protocol fix.
11:53 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/2253c07d27
11:53 dalek nqp: d9545f4 | jnthn++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/nqp/io/AsyncSocketHandle.java:
11:53 dalek nqp: Tweak async socket sequence number emission.
11:53 dalek nqp:
11:53 dalek nqp: Matches a fix in MoarVM. Enables fixing various data loss bugs.
11:53 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/d9545f4d91
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11:57 dalek rakudo/nom: 139be68 | jnthn++ | / (5 files):
11:57 dalek rakudo/nom: Fix various data loss bugs with async I/O.
11:57 dalek rakudo/nom:
11:57 dalek rakudo/nom: In some cases, async sockets and processes could lose data from the
11:57 dalek rakudo/nom: end of the stream. Further, there was a data race in the sequencing
11:57 dalek rakudo/nom: code, which was duplicated in a couple of places also. This factors
11:57 dalek rakudo/nom: the sequence logic out to a single place, removes the data race, and
11:57 dalek rakudo/nom: uses protocol changes in Moar/JVM backend code to fix the data loss
11:57 dalek rakudo/nom: issue.
11:57 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/139be68194
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12:03 dalek roast: 1971ba1 | jnthn++ | S (2 files):
12:03 dalek roast: Test for RT #125515.
12:03 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/1971ba1ffa
12:03 jnthn oops, an unfudge slipped into that commit too
12:04 dalek rakudo/nom: ee1dbdd | jnthn++ | t/spectest.data:
12:04 dalek rakudo/nom: Run S17-procasync/stress.t as stress test.
12:04 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/ee1dbdddef
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12:10 jnthn .tell leont I fixed a Proc::Async issue that could cause data loss in various cases, which was quite likely responsible for your harness issues.
12:10 yoleaux jnthn: I'll pass your message to leont.
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12:12 moritz \o/
12:12 yoleaux 11:17Z <gfldex> moritz: post posted, set to private and to be published on 2015/12/02@00:01
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12:12 lucasb freenode still unstable for me :( very hard to connect
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12:16 RabidGravy what larks
12:16 jnthn lunch &
12:18 dalek roast: f013d55 | lizmat++ | integration/no-indirect-new.t:
12:18 dalek roast: Apparently the exception type has changed
12:18 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/f013d55d71
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12:22 lizmat .tell jnthn looks like most of the problems I see in supply tests, are related to "done" and lasting out of a whenever (which should do a "done" I assume)
12:22 yoleaux lizmat: I'll pass your message to jnthn.
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12:22 lizmat .tell jnthn since I have no idea where "done" is being done, I have no idea how to debug this further  :-(
12:22 yoleaux lizmat: I'll pass your message to jnthn.
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12:31 RabidGravy testing oauth stuff is a mammoth pain in the arse
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12:42 dalek rakudo/nom: ae5bc14 | lizmat++ | src/core/Supply.pm:
12:42 dalek rakudo/nom: Remove done() / Replace by last
12:42 dalek rakudo/nom:
12:42 dalek rakudo/nom: This seems to fix a large number of the supply test breakage on OSX
12:42 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/ae5bc141cc
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12:44 dalek rakudo/nom: 3ce3df5 | lizmat++ | src/core/Supply.pm:
12:44 dalek rakudo/nom: Fix semantics of Supply.head/tail, jnthn++
12:44 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/3ce3df5c11
12:44 dalek rakudo/nom: 8a2f0c7 | lizmat++ | src/core/Supply.pm:
12:44 dalek rakudo/nom: Adopt suggestion by Brad Gilbert++
12:44 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/8a2f0c7c99
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12:56 jnthn lizmat: I assume all those places you removed done don't have more than one whenever?
12:56 yoleaux 12:22Z <lizmat> jnthn: looks like most of the problems I see in supply tests, are related to "done" and lasting out of a whenever (which should do a "done" I assume)
12:56 yoleaux 12:22Z <lizmat> jnthn: since I have no idea where "done" is being done, I have no idea how to debug this further  :-(
12:57 jnthn lizmat: I think they're OK except the one in throttle
12:58 jnthn Which will now fail to "done" the supply and keep the timer alive, by the looks of it
13:00 lizmat jnthn: ok, will put that one back
13:00 jnthn The others seem like nice simplifications
13:00 jnthn done throws a control exception btw
13:00 jnthn Which means that control flow ends at a done
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13:03 * jnthn is looking at https://rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=123949
13:03 [Tux] Inline::Perl5 still FAILs
13:04 jdv79 RabidGravy: i did.  just never got around to doing it myelf
13:04 * jdv79 should check if the headers bug(s) i found are fixed yet..
13:04 RabidGravy unlikely
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13:07 lucasb Does it make sense to say that .head and .tail are "non-destructive" versions of shift and pop?
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13:08 jnthn lucasb: Well, aside from the numeric parameter, kinda :)
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13:08 lucasb What is your opinion about making shift and pop accept an integer argument, meaning the number of elements to be shifted/poped? Another argument is that you can push and unshift more than one element, not just one.
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13:10 jnthn I'd like to think we're mostly done with features before Christmas.
13:10 lucasb moar features! moar features! :D
13:10 lucasb just kidding :)
13:10 lucasb jnthn: thanks
13:11 nine_ [Tux]: does it happen with Inline::Perl5's tests or with your own code?
13:11 [Tux] basic tests
13:11 [Tux] t/use.t ....................... ok
13:11 [Tux] No such method 'context' for invocant of type 'Inline::Perl5::Perl6Callbacks'
13:11 [Tux] in method invoke-parent at /pro/3gl/CPAN/rakudobrew/.panda-work/1448628920_4/lib/Inline/Perl5.pm6:503
13:11 [Tux] in block  at /pro/3gl/CPAN/rakudobrew/.panda-work/1448628920_4/lib/Inline/Perl5.pm6:991
13:11 [Tux] in block <unit> at t/v6.t:19
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13:13 Ulti m: say ³²
13:13 camelia rakudo-moar 8a2f0c: OUTPUT«9␤»
13:14 Ulti get why that's happening but maybe not the best outcome
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13:18 dalek rakudo/nom: 72d0970 | lizmat++ | src/core/Supply.pm:
13:18 dalek rakudo/nom: Fix timer reset on Supply.throttle, jnthn++
13:18 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/72d0970661
13:18 dalek rakudo/nom: 62ddc6d | lizmat++ | src/core/Any-iterable-methods.pm:
13:18 dalek rakudo/nom: Remove grep-index/first-index/last-index
13:18 dalek rakudo/nom:
13:18 dalek rakudo/nom: Please use grep(:k), first(:k), first(:k,:end) instead
13:18 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/62ddc6db33
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13:28 timotimo lucasb: you can't push and unshift more than one element, though :)
13:29 timotimo lucasb: that was recently changed; we have append and prepend to put more than one element at the beginning or end, but pop is always a single element
13:29 timotimo so that push and pop can be symmetric
13:29 dalek rakudo/nom: 842010f | jnthn++ | src/core/IO/Socket/Async.pm:
13:29 dalek rakudo/nom: Missing space in an error.
13:29 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/842010f8b9
13:30 lizmat .tell [Coke] maybe the contributor list for 2015.12 should contain *all* contributors we can cull from the git logs ?
13:30 yoleaux lizmat: I'll pass your message to [Coke].
13:31 timotimo oh my word! my ipv6 connectivity issues have been resolved!
13:31 lucasb timotimo: I'm not sure I understand
13:31 avalenn joined #perl6
13:31 timotimo m: my @foo; @foo.push(1, 2, 3, 4); say @foo.perl
13:31 camelia rakudo-moar 62ddc6: OUTPUT«[1, 2, 3, 4]␤»
13:31 timotimo that's not ... huh?
13:31 ilmari joined #perl6
13:31 timotimo m: my @foo; @foo.push(1, 2, 3, 4); @foo.push("hi"); say @foo.perl
13:31 camelia rakudo-moar 62ddc6: OUTPUT«[1, 2, 3, 4, "hi"]␤»
13:32 lucasb timotimo: ^^ see? :)
13:32 timotimo didn't ... huh?
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13:32 jnthn timotimo: The difference is that it doesn't follow the 1-arg rule
13:32 timotimo oh
13:32 jnthn timotimo: One argument = one item
13:32 timotimo m: my @foo; @foo.push((1, 2, 3, 4)); @foo.push("hi"); say @foo.perl
13:32 camelia rakudo-moar 62ddc6: OUTPUT«[(1, 2, 3, 4), "hi"]␤»
13:32 timotimo that's how
13:32 timotimo yeah, that makes sense
13:32 dalek rakudo/nom: dee63c3 | lizmat++ | src/core/Str.pm:
13:32 dalek rakudo/nom: Remove support for Str.split(:all)
13:32 dalek rakudo/nom:
13:32 dalek rakudo/nom: Please use Str.split(:v) instead
13:32 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/dee63c3de5
13:33 dalek roast: e3c4965 | lizmat++ | S32-str/split-simple.t:
13:33 dalek roast: Fix Str.split tests using :all, use :v instead
13:33 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/e3c4965ba4
13:34 lucasb timotimo: so.. it *can* push and unshift more than element, right? I was just asking that .shift(5) and .pop(5) shifted and poped 5 elements
13:34 timotimo oh!
13:34 timotimo how did i misread that?
13:34 timotimo my quality of sleep must be declining or something
13:34 timotimo on that note: how do i find a topic to write about for the advent calendar? :\
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13:35 lizmat lucasb: an argument against multiple elements being popped/unshifted, is that it would change the return signature
13:36 timotimo we should make types in perl6 pretend they are a list of that type %)
13:36 lizmat timotimo: they already are
13:36 lizmat m: say Int[0]
13:36 camelia rakudo-moar 62ddc6: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/zi5V51GrNY␤Int cannot be parameterized␤at /tmp/zi5V51GrNY:1␤------> 3say Int[0]7⏏5<EOL>␤»
13:36 lizmat ah?
13:36 lizmat hmmm...
13:36 timotimo values are, but types aren't
13:36 lucasb lizmat: oh, ok. I didn't thought about that :)
13:36 timotimo you can assign 1 to a my Int @foo only because of list assignment/STORE semantics
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13:36 timotimo not because Int also matches Positional[Int]
13:37 * lizmat is not touching on DEPRECATED IO features until jnthn is done
13:37 timotimo and that would quite frankly be insane... probably
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13:39 dalek rakudo/nom: e270327 | lizmat++ | docs/ChangeLog:
13:39 dalek rakudo/nom: Mention Supply.new -> Supplier.new change
13:39 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/e2703274c2
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13:50 timotimo we didn't end up releasing last month's rakudo star that moritz prepared?
13:52 jnthn I need some input on a few IO API things: https://gist.github.com/jnthn/9d8b2e22882d7f7a871e
13:52 lucasb lizmat: idk if I undestand you correctly, but shift and pop doesn't have a 'return signature', there is no contract about what they return
13:52 jnthn 2 xmas RTs and 2 other RTs depend on it! :P
13:52 lucasb their signature says 'is nodal', but idk what that means :)
13:54 jnthn moritz, hoelzro # ^^ these involve tickets you filed :)
13:55 timotimo "nodal" defines how things operate when used in a hyper context
13:55 lucasb timotimo: oh, ok. thanks. ...and do you know what does 'is raw' means?
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13:56 timotimo that's about re-containerization, especially with lists  -  i think
13:58 lizmat m: sub a is raw { state $a = 42 }; say a; a++; say a
13:58 camelia rakudo-moar e27032: OUTPUT«42␤43␤»
13:58 lizmat m: sub a { state $a = 42 }; say a; a++; say a
13:58 camelia rakudo-moar e27032: OUTPUT«42␤Cannot call postfix:<++>(Int); none of these signatures match:␤    (Mu:D $a is rw)␤    (Mu:U $a is rw)␤    (Int:D $a is rw)␤    (int $a is rw)␤    (Bool:U $a is rw)␤    (Bool:D $a is rw)␤    (Num:D $a is rw)␤    (Num:U $a is rw)␤    …»
13:58 lizmat lucasb timotimo ^^^
14:00 lucasb lizmat: thanks, made it somehow clear to me :)
14:00 moritz timotimo: not yet; it's still on my TODO
14:02 timotimo can i do something to help you?
14:02 timotimo i didn't test the tarball yet; would that help?
14:03 timotimo http://hack.p6c.org/~moritz/rakudo-star-2015.11-rc0.tar.gz  -  the link from the backlog
14:03 moritz jnthn: I'm OK with your proposals, including not unifying the things for you do't have good ideas how to unify them
14:03 moritz timotimo: it would. So far I haven't received a single bit of feedback on the tarball (only on the announcement)
14:03 jnthn moritz: Any feeling on the print-async thing?
14:03 timotimo damn.
14:04 timotimo i still find it a bit annoying that Configure.pl --gen-moar doesn't try to set a -j on the moar build
14:04 * jnthn could go either way on that
14:04 timotimo given that it has interp.c somewhat early in the build and that takes a phenomenal amount of time compared to the other individual files
14:04 timotimo parallelization by -j2 would already help a whole lot there
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14:04 moritz jnthn: I'd be fine with 'print' being async, and that you have to explicitly await for it
14:05 timotimo it's still less than a mintue on my box, but not sure if it's a good first impression... also this isn't feedback on the starball
14:05 jnthn moritz: OK, so that's the status quo.
14:05 jnthn moritz++ # feedback
14:05 moritz jnthn++ # proposal
14:05 moritz timotimo: also, there's a rakudo/star PR for including linenoise; testing that would also help
14:07 arnsholt I've never used async stuff before, but intuitively I agree with moritz, it makes sense that output would be async like input is. Convenience methods for synchronous output might make sense though
14:08 jnthn Well, you'd just write await $foo.print ...
14:08 jnthn I'm not sure putting that into the method name is a win :)
14:09 arnsholt Yeah, I guess it's not possible to shorten much =)
14:09 timotimo you can also .print(...).await to make it look a bit more LTR
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14:10 timotimo ===SORRY!=== Error while compiling /tmp/rakudo-star-2015.11-rc0/install/share/perl6/lib/DBDish/TestMock/Connection.pm6
14:10 timotimo Invalid typename 'DBDish::Role::Connection'
14:11 timotimo that happens during the precompilation
14:11 moritz timotimo: with moar or JVM?
14:11 timotimo moar
14:12 moritz :(
14:12 moritz why didn't that happen for me?
14:12 moritz timotimo: do the tests still pass?
14:14 timotimo oh, make test, eh?
14:14 timotimo ah
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14:19 timotimo DBIish tests are very unhappy
14:19 timotimo https://gist.github.com/timo/39e793ad327c917c721b
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14:20 moritz timotimo: make modules-test
14:21 moritz timotimo: and you did a 'make install' first?
14:21 timotimo i did make install
14:21 timotimo "make test" doesn't suggest "make modules-test", it probably should
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14:23 timotimo with make modules-test everything everywhere is happy
14:23 timotimo but "make test" suggests invoking prove on modules/foo/t
14:23 timotimo that's perhaps what breaks dBIish?
14:24 moritz timotimo: does 'make modules-test' work for you?
14:24 timotimo yes
14:24 timotimo all tests succeed everywhere
14:25 moritz then I guess we should not recommend the prove/ step
14:25 moritz which assumes that stuff is installed, and thus doesn't set paths
14:26 moritz which won't file test-only modules
14:26 timotimo oh?
14:26 timotimo but i ran the prove thing post-make-install
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14:28 moritz timotimo: yes, but make install doesn't install test-only modules
14:28 moritz (under t/lib/ or so)
14:28 timotimo ah!
14:28 timotimo of course
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14:32 donaldh I have been experimenting with MAIN and USAGE - I would really like to document the command-line params
14:32 donaldh How is this for a proposal https://gist.github.com/donaldh/478814e68ab9d674eab9
14:32 donaldh hat-tip to jnthn++ for pointing out declarator pod
14:33 moritz donaldh: +1
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14:36 donaldh worth putting in core ?
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14:38 timotimo http://examples.perl6.org/categories/cookbook/13classes-objects-and-ties/13-01constructing-an-object.html - urgh! recommending the use of .isa("Foo") is a terrible, terrible idea IMO
14:39 jnthn Yes, .isa(Foo) or just ~~ Foo
14:39 timotimo yes
14:39 timotimo should i just go ahead and change that?
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14:39 jnthn Aye
14:40 dalek perl6-examples: 61ebb06 | timo++ | categories/cookbook/13classes-objects-and-ties/13-01constructing-an-object.pl:
14:40 dalek perl6-examples: do not recommend the use of .isa("Foo").
14:40 dalek perl6-examples:
14:40 dalek perl6-examples: use ~~ Foo instead
14:40 dalek perl6-examples: review: https://github.com/perl6/perl6-examples/commit/61ebb061f3
14:41 timotimo it wouldn't be terrible if the examples site would directly link to a folder or file on github at the very bottom
14:42 timotimo how about this: the yahtzee game example has this line: sub roll-dice { map { (1..6).pick }, 1..$^rolls };
14:42 lizmat upgrading&
14:42 timotimo should i just go into the source and replace roll-dice with (1..6).roll($num) where it used to be used?
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14:44 jnthn Or keep the sub roll-dice but put that inside of it
14:44 timotimo that's definitely less intrusive
14:44 timotimo also, it'll document more clearly what it is about
14:46 dalek perl6-examples: 243ac3c | timo++ | categories/games/yahtzee.p6:
14:46 dalek perl6-examples: use .roll instead of .pick in a map
14:46 dalek perl6-examples:
14:46 dalek perl6-examples: leaving it in the roll-dice sub for enhanced clarity
14:46 dalek perl6-examples: review: https://github.com/perl6/perl6-examples/commit/243ac3c0cd
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14:49 timotimo ugh. http://examples.perl6.org/categories/shootout/n-body.html extends past the right margin of the code box
14:49 timotimo i should file an issue
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14:51 JimmyZ donaldh: +1 # looks awesome
14:51 * RabidGravy wonders if soundcloud oauth authorisation grant codes expire themselves
14:52 dalek perl6-examples: a718f31 | timo++ | template/head.html:
14:52 dalek perl6-examples: remove reference to jquery custom css that 404s
14:52 dalek perl6-examples: review: https://github.com/perl6/perl6-examples/commit/a718f31e90
14:52 donaldh JimmyZ: note I just added the 5 lines of code to emit the arg docs after the usage docs.
14:53 JimmyZ donaldh: I like it about adding .WHY docs
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14:55 jnthn phew, lizmat survived her upgrade ;)
14:55 lizmat :-)
14:55 lizmat yup
14:55 timotimo \o/
14:55 timotimo up all the grades
15:03 hoelzro o/ #perl6
15:04 jnthn o/ h\o/elzr\o/
15:05 hoelzro =)
15:05 hoelzro morning jnthn
15:05 AlexDaniel Ulti: (³²) this thing is reported, so yeah
15:05 jnthn There's some IO API stuff in recent backlog
15:05 jnthn Input would be welcome, when you get chance :)
15:05 hoelzro jnthn: regarding the Proc::Async API, I think print-async and co. are the right way forward
15:05 timotimo argh!!
15:06 timotimo why is this http://www.learningperl6.com/Chapters/11.filehandles.html placed first on a google search for "perl6 file handle"
15:06 timotimo it says you get a line from a file handle with =$filehandle
15:06 jnthn Not for like 5 years it ain't :)
15:06 timotimo Last Modified: Tue May 1 09:34:54 2007
15:06 jnthn hoelzro: OK. Not everyone else feels that way...
15:07 timotimo File Handles- Cooksongold - buy now and get 15% off. use code "NOVEMBER" offer ends 30th nov!
15:08 timotimo yeah, people, hear that? get your file handles at an exquisite price!
15:09 JimmyZ .oO(IO API backlog)... I have a PR for it :P
15:10 * timotimo pinged bdfoy on twitter
15:10 timotimo JimmyZ: i'm +1 on getting that in
15:10 timotimo but i didn't review the code. i can't imagine what could go wrong, though
15:10 timotimo so there's that ...
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15:12 JimmyZ well, it is waiting for jnthn++ IO work.
15:12 timotimo ah!
15:13 hoelzro moritz, jnthn: so the P::A resolution is to leave the API as is, and just make sure people know to await() what print() returns?
15:14 moritz hoelzro: aye
15:14 timotimo i think so, too
15:14 timotimo make it very clear in the documentation
15:15 timotimo if you ask for async, you should not be surprised by getting async; but it should still be pointed out prominently
15:15 Axord joined #perl6
15:15 daxim inviting you to chip in:  https://www.reddit.com/r/perl/comments/3ugm8r/dataeither_in_perl_6_exist/
15:17 hoelzro alright
15:18 hoelzro thanks jnthn, moritz, timotimo, and others for weighing in!
15:18 jnthn hoelzro: I note it doesn't disorder the writes themselves, which would be nuts.
15:18 hoelzro right
15:18 * hoelzro .oO( write? )
15:18 hoelzro I think as long as everything returns promises and the documentation is very clear that everything is async, that should work fine
15:20 Skarsnik daxim, http::useragent return a http::response object for his example, wish make sense for http since there can be some additionnal stuff that just error x)
15:21 jnthn daxim: If you want to return something indicating failure, but that the caller can work with as a value, then "fail" is the typical way. You can fail with a typed exception to include more data, and there are various constructs to support processing either case (and if you ignore the failure it'll end up blowing up just like an exception)
15:22 jnthn m: sub foo($ok) { fail 'oops' unless $ok; 42 }; with foo(1) { .say } else { say "failed: $_" }
15:22 camelia rakudo-moar e27032: OUTPUT«42␤»
15:22 jnthn m: sub foo($ok) { fail 'oops' unless $ok; 42 }; with foo(0) { .say } else { say "failed: $_" }
15:22 camelia rakudo-moar e27032: OUTPUT«failed: (HANDLED) oops␤  in sub foo at /tmp/TzRxtu1jYc:1␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/TzRxtu1jYc:1␤␤»
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15:24 lucasb oh, a '(HANDLED)' gets prepended in the stringfication of a failure?
15:25 lichtkind cheers
15:26 lucasb m: fail; say 'hi'  # <-- I think this is a serious one to get fixed before xmas, isn't it?
15:26 camelia rakudo-moar e27032: ( no output )
15:27 lucasb I mean, someone will certainly put a fail in the toplevel scope and will not know what happened
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15:30 jdv79 but does fail make sense for a http ua?
15:30 Skarsnik http ua does not fail
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15:32 gtodd1 .u 228E
15:32 yoleaux U+228E MULTISET UNION [Sm] (⊎)
15:33 jdv79 Skarsnik: huh?
15:33 Skarsnik my $rep = $ua.get($url);if ! $rep.is-success {die "Can't contact $url" ~ $rep.status-line;
15:33 Skarsnik }
15:34 lizmat fetching a van&
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15:36 gtodd "U+" is Unicode "bootstrapping" itself from ASCII ? :-)
15:36 gtodd http://stackoverflow.com/a/8891122/2019415   http://unicode.org/mail-arch/unicode-ml/y2005-m11/0060.html
15:36 jdv79 but thats not relevant to my question.
15:37 jdv79 i was asking if returning fail sounds like a good idea
15:37 dalek perl6-examples: 34da7ab | (Zoffix Znet)++ | html/css/style.css:
15:37 dalek perl6-examples: Fix: long code lines are hidden by the right margin (Closes #37)
15:37 dalek perl6-examples: review: https://github.com/perl6/perl6-examples/commit/34da7ab42a
15:39 lab Hi all. Is there a module equivalent to Devel::Size for P6?
15:41 jnthn Not yet, though --profile includes information on how many objects are allocated and which subs/methods allocate them.
15:41 jnthn And also stats on garbage collectino.
15:42 jnthn *collection
15:42 Skarsnik jdv79, I don't know, I don't know enought about http, but the request can fail but does not mean it's a failure, like you do a get, you can receive 404/403 that are failure but you can maybe get a redirect response too
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15:44 hoelzro jnthn: I guess the remaining issue for kill.t is that kill doesn't return a promise; should I RT that separately?
15:46 lab jnthn: thanks, looking forward to some fun devel::XXX modules and htat one in particular.
15:48 * jnthn quite wants a "heap explorer" style tool also :)
15:51 jnthn hoelzro: Does kill work asynchronously?
15:52 hoelzro jnthn: it sets up something to run in the cancel task queue, so it seems so
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15:53 jnthn ah, ok
15:53 jnthn Then yeah, it should
15:54 timotimo then the problematic code example should read $proc.write("hi").then(*.kill).then(*.write("oh my gosh")) ?
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15:55 jnthn timotimo: No, just with await before each line. :)
15:55 timotimo pff. timtowtdi
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16:18 skids I think the Supply work may have made $fh.watch.Promise not fire anymore.
16:20 skids watch.tap still works.
16:21 jnthn The semantics of Supply.Promise changed
16:21 jnthn You'll need $fh.watch.head(1).Promise to get the original ones
16:21 skids Ah that would explain it.  jnthn++
16:22 skids Hrm that doesn't seem to do it though.
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16:34 jnthn Hm, head doesn't seem to be filing the "done"
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16:34 * zengargoyle missed the great POD debate of last nite. sigh.
16:34 nine_ There was a POD debate?
16:36 zengargoyle a lot of talk about Pod::ToHtml, Pod::Walker, item lists and such.
16:41 dalek perl6-roast-data: f384ba5 | coke++ | / (9 files):
16:41 dalek perl6-roast-data: today (automated commit)
16:41 dalek perl6-roast-data: review: https://github.com/coke/perl6-roast-data/commit/f384ba5da6
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16:45 nine_ How can I get verbose output of the spectests?
16:47 autarch zengargoyle: if you want to take a look at my code, I'd appreciate feedback - https://github.com/autarch/perl6-Pod-NodeWalker and https://github.com/autarch/Pod-To-HTML/tree/autarch/use-pod-nodewalker
16:47 jnthn nine_: Not sure there's a Makefile entry for it, you'd need to run t/harness directly, and pass --verbosity=1 or so
16:47 nine_ ok
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16:52 moritz search for "loud" in the makefile
16:53 flussence half of the old pod::to::html was my fault :D
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16:56 flussence (I wish we'd had that ::NodeWalker module 5 years ago...)
16:56 zengargoyle autarch: in DESCRIPTION: object that your[you] provide ; do something without[with] a Pod document without having to know
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16:57 autarch zengargoyle: thanks, fixed
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16:58 autarch flussence: I kind of assumed that OO wasn't really up to the task 5 years back or else PTH would not be written the way it was
16:58 moritz OO was quite usable 5 years ago
16:59 TimToady it was usable 10 years ago if you didn't need a MOP :)
16:59 jnthn Was gonna say, that was one of the earlier things to be in decent shape. :)
16:59 jnthn ooh, a TimToady :)
16:59 * TimToady hides behind a cricket
16:59 zengargoyle i'm sorta less concerned about various processing methods, more about specification things at the moment.  luckily most of the hard POD stuff isn't in roast so isn't set in stone at christmas. :)
17:00 moritz TimToady: uhm, 10 years ago we only had pugs, and that barely; I don't think it was very usable
17:00 jnthn :)
17:00 TimToady but it did OO
17:00 jnthn The cricket?
17:00 flussence autarch: it was more a case of refactoring itself being horrible; the only real world user we had was S26.pod, and rendering that took about half an hour
17:00 jnthn oh
17:00 * jnthn should learn to read :)
17:01 jnthn TimToady: When you get to backlogging, there's a few I/O API cleanups I proposed to address 4ish RTs that you may like to glance over.
17:02 xfix joined #perl6
17:02 zengargoyle TimToady: and when you're not pondering something terribly important... i'd like to pick your brains on POD if you have any thoughts..
17:02 * TimToady tries to delegate all the POD stuff :)
17:02 TimToady (except insofar as it relates to syntax)
17:04 zengargoyle well sorta syntax...  like it seems =finish has morphed into __DATA__ and unspecial blocks are treated as paragraphs.
17:06 TimToady I'd think a __DATA__ thing should be conveyed by =data
17:06 TimToady (and I've never particularly liked =finish, maybe it should be =eof)
17:07 * zengargoyle has been meaning to write up a current implementation vs S26 doc to try and figure out what's supposed to be and what isn't.
17:07 zengargoyle well spec is =finish is the same as a <<=begin pod>> that doesn't end.  implying that =finish if full of POD documentation.
17:07 [Coke] messages?
17:07 yoleaux 13:30Z <lizmat> [Coke]: maybe the contributor list for 2015.12 should contain *all* contributors we can cull from the git logs ?
17:08 TimToady but as for reducing the impedance mismatch of Pod and various rendering engines, I haven't much of a clew, just a crew :)
17:08 [Coke] lizmat: Or another sentence indicating that this is just one month and we're going on 15 years of hacking.
17:08 lizmat [Coke]: so also from *way* back ?
17:08 pmurias joined #perl6
17:08 lizmat well, maybe both ?
17:09 lizmat seems to me there are many more people on whose shoulders we are standing now that should be mentioned for 6.c
17:09 zengargoyle and it seems to me that <<=unknownthing>> are useless to post-processing if they're treated like Paragraph blocks and munged/folded like regular Para.
17:09 domidumont joined #perl6
17:10 lizmat m: say my $ = do { 1 until 42 }   # not sure what this should say, but the current error is LTA
17:10 camelia rakudo-moar e27032: OUTPUT«Cannot call method 'gist' on a null object␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/PIOFzX_vXh:1␤␤»
17:10 TimToady I would not be against listing everyone who contributed to pugs/parrot/niecza as well, since we learned a great deal from those projects, and this is more of a language release than a compiler release
17:12 abraxxa joined #perl6
17:12 * TimToady prefers to err on the side of inclusiveness...
17:13 gtodd1 inclusiveness++
17:13 jnthn +1
17:13 gtodd1 espcially for Christmas :-D
17:13 TimToady and if anyone asks to have his name removed, we'll refuse :)
17:14 gtodd what about tricking famous people to contribute and then including their names ? :-D
17:15 TimToady well, we gave Guido a commit bit, but he never did anything with it :)
17:15 TimToady well, he threw a cream pie, I guess
17:15 TimToady we could thank him for that :)
17:15 gtodd ha
17:15 zengargoyle maybe a case for <<=data>> in a <<=finish|end>> being like <<=finish>> in not needing termination to cover the __DATA__ usage where you can just `echo new data >> file.p6` to append.
17:16 * jnthn bbl
17:16 TimToady how 'bout =eof pod|data|comment  where the default is comment
17:17 timotimo that's ... a bit weird
17:17 timotimo "end of file pod"?
17:17 TimToady and =eof pod would allow a subsequent =eof data or =eof
17:18 TimToady =eof <mumble> says there's only <mumble> from here to end-of-file
17:18 timotimo ah ... hmm.
17:18 TimToady and to the code parser, it's an effective EOF
17:18 lizmat_ joined #perl6
17:18 zengargoyle =pod :to<eof> ; =data :to<eof> ; =comment :to<eof>
17:18 timotimo so <![a]> must also be allowed to match before \n=eof? :)
17:18 TimToady =eof is just a =begin that doesn't need an end
17:20 timotimo so let's call it =endless :D
17:20 TimToady I don't see a need for a :to
17:20 dalek rakudo/nom: 61ea661 | lizmat++ | src/core/Range.pm:
17:20 dalek rakudo/nom: Implement Range.rand, as suggested by pmichaud++
17:20 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/61ea661d8d
17:20 Skarsnik_ joined #perl6
17:20 TimToady well, there are other possibilties =code =fini =owari  :)
17:21 zengargoyle yeah, =eof == unclosed =begin makes sense.
17:21 TimToady =終
17:22 dalek rakudo/nom: c33fdac | coke++ | docs/announce/2015.12.md:
17:22 dalek rakudo/nom: lizmat++'s idea of listing EVERYONE
17:22 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/c33fdac261
17:23 TimToady er s/'code='/=coda/
17:23 TimToady but I still kinda lean toward =eof
17:23 timotimo why the hell doesn't =over mean the same as =eof? :P
17:23 zengargoyle should <<=data Abbreviated Form␤>> include the newline when used as $=data[N]
17:24 JimmyZ and repo specs? ;)
17:24 [Coke] is 唐鳳 Audrey ?
17:24 JimmyZ since specs is not in mu :)
17:24 TimToady yes
17:24 zengargoyle and trim leading spaces or not?
17:25 TimToady zengargoyle: my yes was to [Coke], dunno about your Q
17:25 lichtkind joined #perl6
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17:26 zengargoyle seems somewhow that =data Abbreviated/Paragraph/Block should be alike in leading space/trailing space/nl to be consistent.
17:28 dalek rakudo/nom: f302159 | coke++ | docs/announce/2015.12.md:
17:28 dalek rakudo/nom: Add authors from Pugs
17:28 dalek rakudo/nom:
17:28 dalek rakudo/nom: https://github.com/perl6/Pugs.hs
17:28 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/f302159964
17:28 skids joined #perl6
17:28 zengargoyle specs make things like <<say $=data[0]>> seem weird if ␤
17:29 Skarsnik_ joined #perl6
17:30 zengargoyle is kept (double newlines) but makes it consistent when using just $=data (all un-keyed data as string)
17:31 zengargoyle guess =data Abbreviated could trim leading whitespace... use =for data or =begin data if you have a problem with that.
17:31 Quom_ jnthn, or someone, is this right?
17:32 Quom_ m: NQPLock.new.protect({ nqp::say("attempting to die: "); nqp::die("...") })
17:32 camelia rakudo-moar f30215: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/0fDARGF9j2␤Undeclared name:␤    NQPLock used at line 1␤␤»
17:32 Quom_ nqp-m: NQPLock.new.protect({ nqp::say("attempting to die: "); nqp::die("...") })
17:32 camelia nqp-moarvm: OUTPUT«attempting to die: ␤»
17:32 dalek rakudo/nom: 35f88bd | coke++ | docs/announce/2015.12.md:
17:32 dalek rakudo/nom: Add authors from niecza
17:32 dalek rakudo/nom:
17:32 dalek rakudo/nom: ... that weren't already listed
17:32 dalek rakudo/nom:
17:32 dalek rakudo/nom: https://github.com/sorear/niecza
17:32 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/35f88bd864
17:32 zengargoyle then again <<=data Bob>> <<=data Alice>> keeping the ␤
17:32 Quom_ The latter is the cause of https://rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=126724
17:32 zengargoyle makes simple usage a bit odd... need to chomp...
17:34 dalek rakudo/nom: 8228e7e | coke++ | docs/announce/2015.12.md:
17:34 dalek rakudo/nom: remove dupe author
17:34 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/8228e7e055
17:35 zengargoyle guess <<=eof data>> would best be accessed with $=data[*-1] ?
17:36 zengargoyle or maybe just $=eof since pod would get pushed to $=pod and comment would vanish..
17:38 * zengargoyle sorta thinks having =data support formatting codes that include static data like A<> E<> might be cool
17:41 ilbelkyr joined #perl6
17:41 timotimo Quom_: good catch; do you feel confident enough to propose a patch?
17:45 skids WRT inclusiveness is everyone who worked on "smop" listed already?
17:46 dalek rakudo/nom: 015965e | (Matthew Wilson)++ | docs/announce/2015.12.md:
17:46 dalek rakudo/nom: adapt my name
17:46 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/015965e7e3
17:48 dalek rakudo/nom: 0de0671 | coke++ | docs/announce/2015.12.md:
17:48 dalek rakudo/nom: keep sorted
17:48 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/0de0671c96
17:48 TimToady jnthn: I may be old-fashioned, but I think of listen and connect as having positional parameters, not that we have to stick with *nix culture necessarily, but a lot of people will expect a positional interface
17:48 ZoffixWeb joined #perl6
17:49 ZoffixWeb Hey check it out :) https://github.com/edebill/modulecounts/issues/29
17:49 diakopte1 how does one pronounce коледа
17:49 ZoffixWeb And it's live already even: http://www.modulecounts.com/
17:50 ZoffixWeb diakopte1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Koliada
17:50 diakopter heh
17:52 xpen joined #perl6
17:54 nadim joined #perl6
17:55 * masak .oO( I learned the pronunciation from a коллега ) :P
17:56 * pink_mist thinks he gets that one :P
17:56 diakopter [Coke]: are you named from that
17:57 kid51 joined #perl6
17:57 TimToady jnthn: everything else looks okay to me, don't really have a formed opinion on the print-async thing, unless maybe it should use "start" somehow instead, since we did s/async/start/ in the language
17:57 TimToady start-print maybe
17:58 Peter_R joined #perl6
17:58 TimToady family stuff &
17:58 ilbelkyr joined #perl6
18:00 timotimo TimToady is stuffing his family for thanksgiving?!
18:00 diakopter today is the day after
18:00 timotimo oh, right
18:01 lucasb joined #perl6
18:01 timotimo thanksgiving makes me cynical
18:03 [ptc] joined #perl6
18:05 xfix joined #perl6
18:05 MadcapJake joined #perl6
18:06 autarch if I have a hash var and I want to pass that to a method that takes named ags, how does that work?
18:07 zengargoyle |%whatever
18:07 moritz autarch: obj.meth(|%hash)
18:07 autarch moritz: thanks
18:07 autarch what does | do?
18:07 zengargoyle flatten
18:07 pink_mist flattens
18:07 lucasb joined #perl6
18:08 skids joined #perl6
18:08 zengargoyle in argument lists |% goes to named |@ goes to positional as i grok it.
18:08 moritz aye
18:09 autarch that makes sense
18:10 timotimo and you can put named parameters after the flattening to override keys from the hash
18:11 jnthn Quom_: No, that lock swallowing the exception thing looks wrong
18:11 autarch how about if I have a method that takes named params and I want to pass them all on to another method? is there an equivalent of this in Perl 5 - "sub foo { my %p = @_; bar(%p) }" ?
18:12 autarch specifically, I want to define a "sub MAIN" with named params that are the same as an object's constructor params
18:14 timotimo you can just take *%foo as an argument
18:14 timotimo then you'll end up with a hash containing all named arguments that were passed
18:15 autarch timotimo: but then "script --help" isn't useful
18:15 autarch I really want a Perl6 equivalent of MooseX::Getopt here
18:15 moritz autarch: you can do sub f(*%x) { g(|%x) }
18:16 autarch moritz: again, I need to actually name all the params for sub f here, because it's sub MAIN
18:16 moritz autarch: if you want to pass on named and positional, sub f(|c) { g(|c) }
18:17 timotimo will the usage be correct if you multi sub MAIN(|c, :$key, :$val) { ... }?
18:18 lucasb_ joined #perl6
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18:19 nadim joined #perl6
18:19 zengargoyle somehow i'm remembering a problem with MAIN and slurpy... maybe i was doing it wrong at the time.
18:21 skids joined #perl6
18:21 lizmat_ dinner&
18:21 pnu joined #perl6
18:22 [Coke] .seen quietfanatic
18:22 yoleaux I saw quietfanatic 24 Nov 2015 04:13Z in #perl6: <quietfanatic> https://twitter.com/dadgumjames/status/668999214685376512  https://twitter.com/dadgumjames/status/668999737790566400
18:23 [Coke] diakopter: don't know for sure, but it's very plausible, yes. Family emigrated from Belarus and anglicized the name about 3 generations back.
18:24 skids .oO(anglicide)
18:28 solarbunny joined #perl6
18:29 dalek rakudo/nom: f6fe538 | coke++ | docs/announce/2015.12.md:
18:29 dalek rakudo/nom: add parrot authors
18:29 dalek rakudo/nom:
18:29 dalek rakudo/nom: https://github.com/parrot/parrot
18:29 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/f6fe538290
18:29 [Coke] ok, that's enough of that for the moment.
18:30 hankache joined #perl6
18:35 colomon joined #perl6
18:39 autarch what's the best API to use in order to thread no more than N operations at a time? For example, I have a list of 100 items and I want to do an operation on each with 4 threads active at a time.
18:40 autarch or does the interpreter itself figure out the best number of threads to use and just DTRT?
18:40 timotimo if you use "hyper" then it will, you can tell it what number of things to batch and such
18:41 moritz the other method is to instantiate your own scheduler with max 4 threads
18:41 moritz and then do a 'start' for each task, and the scheduler will use just those four threads
18:42 autarch so something like "for @list.hyper( :batch(4)  ) -> $item { ... }" ?
18:42 timotimo right
18:42 timotimo i'm not sure if for just picks it up, i know it'll work with .map
18:43 timotimo m: my @l = <1 2 3 4> X~ <foo bar baz>; @l.list.hyper(:4batch).map({ .say; sleep 1 });
18:43 camelia rakudo-moar 0de067: OUTPUT«2bar␤3baz␤1foo␤2baz␤4foo␤1bar␤3foo␤4bar␤1baz␤3bar␤4baz␤2foo␤»
18:43 timotimo m: my @l = <1 2 3 4> X~ <foo bar baz>; @l.list.hyper(:4batch).map({ .say; sleep 0.5; say "wakeup" });
18:43 camelia rakudo-moar 0de067: OUTPUT«2bar␤3baz␤1foo␤wakeup␤wakeup␤4foo␤2baz␤wakeup␤1bar␤wakeup␤4bar␤wakeup␤3foo␤wakeup␤1baz␤wakeup␤4baz␤wakeup␤3bar␤wakeup␤2foo␤wakeup␤wakeup␤wakeup␤»
18:44 autarch that's easy enough, thanks!
18:47 moritz m: my @l = <1 2 3 4> X~ <foo bar baz>; @l.list.hyper(:4batch).map({ .say; sleep 0.1; say "wakeup $_" })
18:47 camelia rakudo-moar 0de067: OUTPUT«2bar␤3baz␤1foo␤wakeup 2bar␤2baz␤wakeup 3baz␤4foo␤wakeup 1foo␤1bar␤wakeup 2baz␤3foo␤wakeup 4foo␤4bar␤wakeup 1bar␤1baz␤wakeup 3foo␤3bar␤wakeup 4bar␤4baz␤wakeup 1baz␤2foo␤wakeup 3bar␤wakeup 4baz␤wakeup 2foo␤»
18:50 zacts joined #perl6
18:51 dalek rakudo/nom: d310001 | coke++ | docs/announce/2015.12.md:
18:51 dalek rakudo/nom: don't forget these repos
18:51 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/d310001d8d
18:51 dalek rakudo/nom: 22b4ea7 | coke++ | docs/announce/2015.12.md:
18:51 dalek rakudo/nom: consolidate 2 sections of authors
18:51 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/22b4ea7165
18:53 xpen joined #perl6
18:53 autarch is it just me is it weird that IO::Spec returns plain Str instead of IO::Path for its various operations?
18:57 skids ISTR Spec is supposed to let you manipulate other-os filenames, and Path is your-OS-only.
18:57 skids Or something like that.
19:04 autarch skids: that's not how the docs make it seem
19:04 autarch it seems like $*SPEC if your native OS and you should use
19:04 autarch use it*
19:06 dalek rakudo/nom: 4dd8062 | coke++ | docs/announce/2015.12.md:
19:06 dalek rakudo/nom: consolidate 2 sections of authors
19:06 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/4dd80620d0
19:06 dalek rakudo/nom: c1ad9fe | coke++ | docs/announce/2015.12.md:
19:06 dalek rakudo/nom: de-asciify a name.
19:06 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/c1ad9fe446
19:08 rigsby joined #perl6
19:10 ugexe m: my $s = Supplier.new; $s.Supply.act: {.say}, done => {say "done"}; $s.emit(1); $s.done;
19:10 camelia rakudo-moar f6fe53: OUTPUT«1␤»
19:10 ugexe m: my $s = Supplier.new; $s.Supply.tap: {.say}, done => {say "done"}; $s.emit(1); $s.done;
19:10 camelia rakudo-moar f6fe53: OUTPUT«1␤done␤»
19:12 ugexe .done is broken for .act
19:15 nadim joined #perl6
19:15 hankache joined #perl6
19:16 hankache is there any plan to make the windows installer automatically add C:\rakudo\bin to the PATH?
19:20 ugexe m: my $s = Supplier.new; $s.Supply.interval(1); $s.tap{.say};
19:20 camelia rakudo-moar c1ad9f: OUTPUT«Invocant requires a type object of type Supply, but an object instance was passed.  Did you forget a 'multi'?␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/2KKV7iXPe9:1␤␤»
19:21 jnthn ugexe: Did act ever pay attention to done?
19:21 * jnthn checks
19:21 ugexe jnthn: yeah
19:22 autarch any idea why File::Temp spits out weird warnings when run in a hyper op? https://gist.github.com/autarch/a701c62a40643169913f
19:23 AndyDee joined #perl6
19:23 autarch I'm guessing this is some sort of low-level bug of the sort I'd prefer to let someone else figure out ;) it seems to be working even when it spits out the warning
19:23 jnthn eek, wait, it did it how... :)
19:23 jnthn ugexe: Fixing.
19:26 ugexe m: Supplier.new.Supply.interval(1)
19:26 camelia rakudo-moar c1ad9f: OUTPUT«Invocant requires a type object of type Supply, but an object instance was passed.  Did you forget a 'multi'?␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/qkgW162TtC:1␤␤»
19:26 ugexe is there a different way to do supply intervals now?
19:27 lizmat ugexe: Supply.interval is unchanged, afaik
19:29 jnthn No, all the factor methods are still on Supply. Because they give you a Supply.
19:29 jnthn It's only code that did Supply.new that needs much changing.
19:29 jnthn Testing .act fix now
19:29 jnthn And already written a test for it :)
19:30 ugexe m: my $s = Supply.interval(1); $s.done # so how do i tell the supply im finished with it?
19:30 camelia rakudo-moar c1ad9f: OUTPUT«Method 'done' not found for invocant of class 'Supply'␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/wc28_jX4n_:1␤␤»
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19:32 dalek rakudo/nom: 6403ca0 | jnthn++ | src/core/IO/Socket/INET.pm:
19:32 dalek rakudo/nom: Remove two empty methods.
19:32 dalek rakudo/nom:
19:32 dalek rakudo/nom: No point in pretending we support these things, then returning Nil.
19:32 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/6403ca0921
19:32 dalek rakudo/nom: e42b109 | jnthn++ | src/core/Supply.pm:
19:32 dalek rakudo/nom: .act should support emit and done
19:32 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/e42b1095f8
19:33 jnthn m: my $s = Supply.interval(0.5); my $tap = $s.tap({ say 42 }); sleep 2; $tap.close; sleep 2;
19:33 camelia rakudo-moar c1ad9f: OUTPUT«42␤42␤42␤42␤»
19:34 jnthn ugexe: That's the right way to turn things off. Calling .done to "inject" a message into the stream owned by another supply was never really an intended feature. In the case of doing it with an interval, you'd leak the timer and it'd go on emitting values to nowhere forever.
19:35 dalek roast: 64f7ee4 | jnthn++ | S17-supply/act.t:
19:35 dalek roast: Test :done argument to act.
19:35 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/64f7ee45d7
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19:44 zengargoyle hrm... adding «dd $tempfile;» in File::Temp gives interesting error: *** Error in `/opt/rakudobrew/moar-nom/install/bin/moar': double free or corruption (fasttop): 0x0000000005dab9a0 ***
19:44 dalek rakudo/nom: d091ca8 | coke++ | docs/announce/2015.12.md:
19:44 dalek rakudo/nom: add nqp authors & use sane temp format
19:44 dalek rakudo/nom:
19:44 dalek rakudo/nom: Put each author on a line; otherwise our sort contortions are insane.
19:44 dalek rakudo/nom:
19:44 dalek rakudo/nom: We'll combine this into a single list as part of the release, and can
19:44 dalek rakudo/nom: now easily sort and add more as we go.
19:44 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/d091ca8ba6
19:45 zengargoyle $tempfile is correct '"**********' for first 4 dd's, then the Use of Nil error followed by the moar Error.
19:48 zengargoyle $tempfile is set in tempdir() signature: tempdir($tmpl? = '*' x 10, ..., :$template = $tmpl)
19:48 * [Coke] hopes he didn't too eagerly turn github nicks into names.
19:48 zengargoyle maybe that isn't getting done correctly when hypering...
19:50 zengargoyle setting $template outside of signature makes it get the Nil warning less often and sorta randomly and someties warning is incomplete...
19:50 * zengargoyle dunno
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19:54 ugexe thats a lot of dependence on side effects
19:54 ugexe and order
19:55 zengargoyle sometimes the $/.chars is returning 0.  looks like the: $tempfile ~~ s/ '*' ** 4..* /{ dd $/.chars; @filechars.roll($/.chars).jo
19:55 ugexe without looking at it i would wonder how it knows it can use a specific file name if you are using it in a hyper where the side effect order isnt guarenteed and thus any checks for file existence arent guarenteed to occur when you think they would if the effects were executed in order
19:56 zengargoyle the file is created with open ... :rw, :exclusive which should be atomic.  if that fails it trys again.
19:57 zengargoyle if that somehow maps down to the system level open O_RW|O_WHATEVER ...
19:58 ugexe https://github.com/perlpilot/p6-File-Temp/blob/master/lib/File/Temp.pm#L17
20:00 zengargoyle that the next if $name.IO ~~ :e line?  don't see an issue there, probably could be left out and just let the open fail.
20:02 zengargoyle seems it's just sometimes... $tempfile = '*' x 10; $tempfile ~~ s/ '*' ** 4..* /{ dd $/.chars; @filechars.roll($/.chars).jo
20:02 zengargoyle seems it's just sometimes... $tempfile = '*' x 10; $tempfile ~~ s/ '*' ** 4..* /{ dd $/.chars; @filechars.roll($/.chars).join }/; # bah cut-n-paste
20:03 zengargoyle $/.chars is 0 instead of 10....
20:03 zengargoyle when it should always be 10 assuming defaults
20:04 jnthn Hmm, https://rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=126315 is curious
20:04 jnthn It claims that Moar sits in a loop when reading from sockets, but in fact it seems it only does one read.
20:05 zengargoyle dd [ $tempfile, $/.chars ]; # should not be: Array $var = $["**********", 0]
20:05 dalek modules.perl6.org/new-db-builder: 8f6564e | (Zoffix Znet)++ | lib/ModulesPerl6/ (9 files):
20:05 dalek modules.perl6.org/new-db-builder: Use Mew instead of Moo/Mojo::Base for consistency and more concise code
20:05 dalek modules.perl6.org/new-db-builder: review: https://github.com/perl6/modules.perl6.org/commit/8f6564ed0c
20:06 zengargoyle seems regex / $/ is borkded over hyper.
20:07 zengargoyle wtf? : Array $var = $["PB_rmld5ng", 0]
20:08 zengargoyle that looks like $template from another thread *after* substitution happened..
20:13 zengargoyle pretty much at the end of my diagnostic abilities.  put «dd [$template,$/.chars]» inside the replacement block of File/Temp.pm:15 or on the next line and you can see that things aren't always what they should be.
20:16 ugexe jnthn: is there still a way to emit into the Proc::Async supplies without access to the Supplier itself? ie. `my $proc = Proc::Async.new("ls"); $proc.stdout.tap: {.say}; $proc.stdout.emit("xxx");`
20:16 autarch zengargoyle: sounds like threading is a little buggy here - which is sad/scary because by threading the docsite generation I could make it _way_ faster
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20:18 timotimo zengargoyle: you may want to give your multi-threaded code your own $/ variable?
20:19 jnthn ugexe: No, you'll need to explicitly do it with .merge or so now
20:19 zengargoyle m: sub foo() { my $x = "*" x 2; $x ~~ s/ "*" ** 1..* /{ "+" x $/.chars }/; $x}; (1..100).map({say foo});
20:19 camelia rakudo-moar d091ca: OUTPUT«++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤+…»
20:19 timotimo otherwise it may happen that multiple things share the same $/ scalar and that's bad
20:19 jnthn ugexe: What's the use case, ooc?
20:19 zengargoyle m: sub foo() { my $x = "*" x 2; $x ~~ s/ "*" ** 1..* /{ "+" x $/.chars }/; $x}; (1..100).hyper.map({say foo});
20:19 camelia rakudo-moar d091ca: OUTPUT«++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤Use of Nil in string context++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤  in block  at /tmp/CWKir_YoI3:1␤++␤␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤Use of Nil in string context++␤++␤++␤  in block  at /tmp/CWKir_YoI3:1␤␤++␤Use of Ni…»
20:19 zengargoyle timotimo: not my code :)
20:19 timotimo k
20:19 zengargoyle is File::Temp
20:20 ugexe jnthn: stdmuxing. i prefix every line from multiple processes with their file name to differentiate the otherwise jumbled lines from multiple process output
20:20 ugexe every stdout line^
20:20 ugexe er no sorry, thats a different thing. this is just for outputting the command that Proc::Async executed
20:20 zengargoyle the previous seems to be a minimal test case... considering randomness of failure.
20:21 ugexe so everytime Proc::Async starts, it would .emit('perl6 -Ilib some-cmd') to show what was ran
20:21 timotimo m: sub foo() { my $/; my $x = "*" x 2; $x ~~ s/ "*" ** 1..* /{ "+" x $/.chars }/; $x}; (1..100).hyper.map({say foo});
20:21 camelia rakudo-moar d091ca: OUTPUT«Potential difficulties:␤    Redeclaration of symbol $/␤    at /tmp/Ks3yjL26N6:1␤    ------> 3sub foo() { my $/7⏏5; my $x = "*" x 2; $x ~~ s/ "*" ** 1..* ␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++␤++…»
20:21 jnthn ugexe: Hm, so you really want a supply concat.
20:21 timotimo hm, so it already has its own $/?
20:21 jnthn m: Supply.concat
20:21 camelia rakudo-moar d091ca: OUTPUT«Method 'concat' not found for invocant of class 'Supply'␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/D2haGCSBYT:1␤␤»
20:21 timotimo yeah, because it's a sub
20:21 jnthn Which we should have but don't.
20:22 ugexe ah yeah
20:22 jnthn I'll implement it, once I'm done writing tests for socket read vs recv... :)
20:22 jnthn I fixed a nasty Proc::Async bug earlier today also, that could cause occasional data loss.
20:24 zengargoyle should i rakudobug that?
20:24 jnthn zengargoyle: Yes, that's a really nice golf of it
20:24 jnthn I can guess what it might be too
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20:32 zengargoyle RT #126752
20:38 dalek roast: 647468a | jnthn++ | S32-io/socket-recv-vs-read.t:
20:38 dalek roast: Tests for semantics of read and recv on sockets.
20:38 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/647468af7a
20:39 dalek rakudo/nom: 8430b22 | jnthn++ | t/spectest.data:
20:39 dalek rakudo/nom: Run S32-io/socket-recv-vs-read.t.
20:39 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/8430b22cbf
20:40 nadim joined #perl6
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20:43 MadcapJake I have a working linter plugin for Atom https://github.com/MadcapJake/linter-perl6
20:43 autarch does anyone have an example of how Supply and Scheduler interacts in some real code?
20:44 MadcapJake It needs more errors supported.  I could really use some help with this as I don't really know how to trigger many of the errors in rakudo/src/core/Exception.pm
20:47 moritz MadcapJake: have you loooked into t/spec/S32-exceptions/misc.t ?
20:47 moritz MadcapJake: it contains a great many examples
20:47 moritz MadcapJake: also, the docs at doc.perl6.org often include examples of how to provoke each error
20:47 moritz (though the tests are more comprehensive)
20:48 MadcapJake moritz: where is that spec file in perl6/spec or perl6/roast repo?
20:48 moritz MadcapJake: perl6/roast in S32-exceptions/misc.t
20:50 moritz the other way round :-)
20:51 lizmat jnthn: if I find more problems in the SPW slides, should I still let you know ?
20:52 jnthn lizmat: yes, but maybe collect them and mail them to me
20:52 lizmat yup, will do
20:52 lizmat nits like .WHAT    # Str  instead of (Str)
20:52 lizmat that kinda stuff
20:54 MadcapJake moritz: how do i read these throws-like statements? just copying into a file, I'm not getting any syntax errors printed (it has to be something caught by `perl6 -c`)
20:55 MadcapJake i even tried placing a block of em into a `BEGIN` block
20:56 MadcapJake wait nvm, I am getting something
20:57 MadcapJake no, that's incorrect, I am *not* getting something xD
20:57 timotimo MadcapJake: can you put up a screenshot or two? :)
20:57 MadcapJake yeah sure!
20:57 timotimo mhhh
20:57 timotimo i don't have a tom
20:57 moritz MadcapJake: for example throws-like 'my $a::::b', X::Syntax::Name::Null;
20:58 moritz MadcapJake: means that the string   my $a::::b  as a program will throw an exception of type X::Syntax::Name::Null
20:58 moritz m: my $a::::b
20:58 camelia rakudo-moar 8430b2: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/djtjXD5o6D␤Name component may not be null␤at /tmp/djtjXD5o6D:1␤------> 3my $a::7⏏5::b␤»
20:58 moritz m: try EVAL 'my $a::::b'; say $!.^name
20:58 camelia rakudo-moar 8430b2: OUTPUT«X::Syntax::Name::Null␤»
20:58 zengargoyle not sure if -c will get you exceptions in all cases...
20:58 MadcapJake sweet! what's the third paremeter mean? e.g., `throws-like { Buf.new().Str }, X::Buf::AsStr, method => 'Str';;`
20:59 moritz MadcapJake: that's more criteria for which we test the exception
20:59 moritz MadcapJake: in this case, that $!.method eq 'Str'
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21:02 MadcapJake timotimo: https://twitter.com/MadcapJake/status/670346844761751552
21:03 jnthn MadcapJake: Wow! :D
21:03 MadcapJake Right now it just catches X::Syntax::Confused, X::Undeclared, X::Undeclared::Routine, and X::Parameter::Twigil, but I'm working on a generic one
21:04 timotimo neat
21:04 jnthn MadcapJake: btw, did you see the highlighter issues I mentioned a few days back?
21:04 MadcapJake oh no, i missed it! what is it?
21:05 jnthn http://irclog.perlgeek.de/perl6/2015-11-21#i_11578807
21:05 Skarsnik joined #perl6
21:05 autarch does this look like the correct pattern to iterate over an array of items with a fixed number of threads? https://gist.github.com/autarch/5ddae1da5bce447d45f4
21:07 dalek rakudo/nom: b2e6ca0 | jnthn++ | src/core/IO/Socket/Async.pm:
21:07 dalek rakudo/nom: Change IO::Socket::Async reading API.
21:07 dalek rakudo/nom:
21:07 dalek rakudo/nom: To bring it inline with IO::Handle. You now just .Supply for chars,
21:07 dalek rakudo/nom: and .Supply(:bin) for bytes. Deprecations will be short lived, but
21:07 dalek rakudo/nom: may help somebody in the coming days.
21:07 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/b2e6ca0150
21:07 dalek roast: cfd61e5 | jnthn++ | S32-io/IO-Socket-Async.t:
21:07 dalek roast: Chase API changes.
21:07 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/cfd61e58ac
21:08 ugexe sweet, i hated bytes-supply/chars-supply
21:08 autarch it does seem to be working if I print out each item that is tapped - they're not in the original order which suggests that they're getting threaded
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21:09 MadcapJake jnthn: thanks for putting it through the wringer! I'll get cracking on these right now. What did you mean by `And emit took.`? http://irclog.perlgeek.de/perl6/2015-11-21#i_11578814
21:10 jnthn oops
21:10 jnthn "And emit too"
21:10 MadcapJake ohhh lol
21:10 moritz on an unrelated note, I finally managed to patch a bug for $work that I simply couldn't leave be before the weekend (took me to 10pm)
21:10 jnthn MadcapJake: emit/done are keywords
21:11 jnthn moritz: Eww. And congrats for nailing it.
21:11 MadcapJake alright! I'll get them added in as well.
21:11 vendethiel joined #perl6
21:13 timotimo moritz: damn, that sucks :(
21:13 diakopter moritz++ # congrats, by 10 pm only!
21:16 espadrine joined #perl6
21:21 moritz it was one of these "the fix is just around the corner", but the fix breaks something else, in several iterations
21:26 ugexe star: my constant CAN-TEST = (try require Test) // False; say CAN-TEST
21:26 camelia star-m 2015.09: OUTPUT«True␤»
21:26 ugexe m: my constant CAN-TEST = (try require Test) // False; say CAN-TEST
21:26 camelia rakudo-moar b2e6ca: OUTPUT«False␤»
21:26 ugexe which behavior is correct?
21:33 ugexe m: say (try require Test); say (try require TestXXX);
21:33 camelia rakudo-moar b2e6ca: OUTPUT«(Test)␤Nil␤»
21:33 Sgeo joined #perl6
21:33 ugexe m: say (try require Test) // False
21:33 camelia rakudo-moar b2e6ca: OUTPUT«False␤»
21:34 ugexe i dont understand that
21:34 moritz first of all, require always returns something undefined, so // False at the end just confuses you
21:35 moritz second, FROGGS++ patched require to return the required type, but that wasn't very long ago
21:35 moritz certainly after star 2015.09
21:36 ugexe yes, it happened sometime in the last week or so
21:36 moritz commit 95558bb58e4f7ad47153c0b9c3f6e4e6f0179f5d
21:36 moritz Author: Tobias Leich <email@froggs.de>
21:36 moritz Date:   Sat Nov 21 21:54:07 2015 +0100
21:36 moritz make "require PAKAGE/STRING" return said PACKAGE/STRING
21:36 kjs_ joined #perl6
21:37 dalek rakudo/nom: c542888 | jnthn++ | src/core/IO/Socket/INET.pm:
21:37 dalek rakudo/nom: Give IO::Socket::INET connect/listen methods.
21:37 dalek rakudo/nom:
21:37 dalek rakudo/nom: For convenience and consistenty with IO::Socket::Async.
21:37 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/c542888154
21:37 dalek roast: 22c6057 | jnthn++ | S32-io/IO-Socket-INET. (2 files):
21:37 dalek roast: Test .connect/.listen on IO::Socket::INET.
21:37 dalek roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/22c6057b2b
21:38 MadcapJake What is `<?{ ... }>` in a regex? Is it a multiline block of regular perl6 code?
21:39 TimToady it's evaluated as a zero-width assertion
21:39 TimToady <!{...}> is the negative assertion
21:39 jnthn But yes, it's Perl 6 code inside the block.
21:39 TimToady that returns something with a boolean interpretation, which is almost anything
21:40 MadcapJake cool, I don't think I was capturing either of those (or least it isn't working currently).
21:40 lucasb_ moritz, ugexe: can't I use require in a runtime expression?
21:40 lucasb_ m: say require Test
21:40 camelia rakudo-moar b2e6ca: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/o8WrIHQdll␤Undeclared name:␤    Test used at line 1␤Undeclared routine:␤    require used at line 1␤␤»
21:40 lucasb_ m: say do { require Test }
21:40 camelia rakudo-moar b2e6ca: OUTPUT«(Test)␤»
21:40 ugexe m: say "ok" if (try require Test) ~~ ::("Test") # this newer way seems cumbersome
21:40 MadcapJake jnthn: thanks for the mention of this grammar.nqp file, lots of things to fix in there!
21:40 camelia rakudo-moar b2e6ca: OUTPUT«ok␤»
21:41 jnthn MadcapJake: Yes, the grammar for Perl 6 itself is a rather good stress test. ;-)
21:41 kjs_ joined #perl6
21:42 moritz m: say do require Test;
21:42 camelia rakudo-moar b2e6ca: OUTPUT«(Test)␤»
21:42 moritz no need for braces
21:43 lucasb_ I just didn't understand why plain 'say require Test' sees Test as a subname
21:44 MadcapJake jnthn: Atom takes a couple seconds to render all of it on my machine! I'm actually quite pleased with that, I wrote a grammar for an indentation-blocked language and it takes 5-10 seconds for files half as big as grammar.nqp
21:45 lucasb_ oh, 'require' is a statement, not an expression... right? so it can't be used in an expression context... ?
21:46 moritz right
21:47 moritz and 'do' turns statements into expressions
21:48 ZoffixMobile joined #perl6
21:49 jnthn Down to 27 xmas RTs. :)
21:49 ZoffixMobile MadcapJake, isn't your linter kinda dangerous? BEGIN { *delete wrong dir by mistake* }
21:49 ZoffixMobile jnthn++ sweet!
21:49 MadcapJake ZoffixMobile: yes I guess it is! Is there any way I can make it safer? Or should I put a warning or something?
21:50 pink_mist have it in a restricted setting?
21:50 ZoffixMobile MadcapJake, no fix that I know of. I had a similar problem in P5's Test::Synopsis
21:50 jnthn Restricted setting may do it, in the longer run we'll want something to enforce such things VM-level.
21:53 zacts joined #perl6
21:54 MadcapJake pink_mist: how do I do that?
21:54 pink_mist ¯\(°_o)/¯
21:55 xpen joined #perl6
21:56 pink_mist MadcapJake: I don't actually know perl 6 .. I just follow along with things mentioned in here so I've heard of stuff that's useful :P
21:57 MadcapJake seems I would add `--settings=RESTRICTED` as a command line flag, is that accurate jnthn?
21:57 timotimo yeah, something like that
21:58 MadcapJake cool, that's a simple fix then
22:02 jnthn I think just --setting
22:02 nadim joined #perl6
22:02 jnthn uh, --setting=RESTRICTED
22:02 jnthn (not settings plural)
22:03 timotimo ah
22:03 timotimo i didn't see that little s there
22:03 jnthn :)
22:04 * jnthn realies that for the first time, we have less xmas RTs than we have days from now until Christmas day :)
22:04 Zoffix woohoo \o/
22:04 jnthn *realizes
22:04 Zoffix *fewer :P
22:05 jnthn :P
22:06 * jnthn just can't instinctively feel that distinction
22:08 colomon \o/
22:08 Zoffix jnthn, if it's countable, then it's fewer :)
22:09 colomon if it’s uncountable, it’s less?  ;)
22:10 skids .oO(less mess, fewer sewers)
22:11 colomon fewer rationals, less irrationals?
22:11 Zoffix fewer eggs and less milk, yes :)
22:12 Zoffix Time to go offline to drink beer and be productive hacking on stuff :) \o have a good night
22:13 vendethiel joined #perl6
22:13 jnthn .oO( maybe I should drink less beers...oh wait... )
22:13 pink_mist isn't it like this: "we have few RTs left" so -> fewer ... vs "we have little milk left" so -> less
22:13 jnthn pink_mist: Yes. :)
22:14 jnthn pink_mist: For some reason, there's a bunch of cases where my brain doesn't feel like it wants to make the distinction, so I have to conciously think about it. Which at 11pm on IRC isn't that likely to happen. :)
22:15 pink_mist right :P
22:15 jnthn I wonder if it's partly dialect or something, and that I grew up around folks not caring about the distinction much.
22:15 jnthn It's also one way; "I should drink fewer beer" sounds obviously wrong to me. :)
22:16 timotimo "we are the borg. your distinctiveness will be added to our species" - "nope, no distinctiveness to be found here!"
22:16 pink_mist well, beer is uncountable there ... 'beers' is countable though :P
22:17 * jnthn remembers a local supermarket making the news for putting up a sign by a checkout lane reading "10 items or less" :)
22:17 huf the distinction doesnt *really* exist
22:17 huf and never has
22:17 huf but it got entrenched as a thing so people worry about it
22:18 pink_mist doesn't "it got entrenched as a thing" imply it now does exist? =)
22:18 pink_mist language does change
22:18 huf but not as an actual rule. just as a rule people think is a rule.
22:18 autarch jnthn: are you taking nominations for things to add to the christmas list?
22:18 huf some people obey it more than others, sure
22:19 pink_mist huf: who decides which rules are 'actual'? 0_o
22:20 huf the fact that people so often get it "wrong" decides
22:20 pink_mist I want to tipi his house
22:20 jnthn autarch: I'm trying to keep it as something we might realistically make it through. :)
22:20 autarch https://rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=124393 is my nomination
22:21 jnthn autarch: The criteria is "semantic issue" and "we won't be able to easily fix it after 6.c"
22:21 autarch hmm, probably doesn't qualify - it's just _really_ annoying but since it makes certain things impossible it won't cause anyone to do something that a fix will break later
22:23 jnthn It's certainly substantive and worth considering.
22:23 jnthn At some point, I need to do a pass through the RTs opened since I made the xmas list.
22:24 jnthn Part of the consideration is "do we actually have the ability to do anything about this before 6.c"
22:24 jnthn For this one it may be possible to deal with with relatively little work, which also helps.
22:24 jnthn Anyway, will consider it.
22:25 autarch can someone explain what this error means - This Seq has already been iterated, and its values consumed
22:25 jnthn A Seq is a one-shot source of values; that error shows up if you try to use it twice
22:25 autarch I'm really sure I haven't used it!
22:26 jnthn m: my @a = gather { .take for ^10 }; for @a { }; for @a { } # this is fine because list assignemnt copies into the array
22:26 camelia rakudo-moar c54288: ( no output )
22:26 jnthn m: my \a = gather { .take for ^10 }; for a { }; for a { } # this isn't
22:26 camelia rakudo-moar c54288: OUTPUT«This Seq has already been iterated, and its values consumed␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/MrqEHZm7oM:1␤␤»
22:26 autarch I'm calling .Supply on a variable, but I only do it once
22:27 jnthn Got an isolated exaple?
22:27 jnthn *example
22:27 jnthn m: my \a = gather { .take for ^10 }; a.Supply.tap(&say)
22:27 camelia rakudo-moar c54288: OUTPUT«0␤1␤2␤3␤4␤5␤6␤7␤8␤9␤»
22:28 autarch jnthn: no, I'm having a hell of a time making one
22:28 autarch m: my %h = (:a(42)); %h.pairs.Supply.tap(&say)
22:28 camelia rakudo-moar c54288: OUTPUT«a => 42␤»
22:28 autarch that's comparable to what I'm doing and of course it works there ;)
22:29 nine_ So there's some detail that's different and important
22:29 skids Maybe there's an element being flattened that is a used-up Seq?
22:29 autarch aha, it's probably because I have $items.elems before I have $item.Supply?
22:29 jnthn nine_: How's things with the curi branch?
22:29 jnthn autarch: Yes
22:29 nine_ autarch: it's easy to use up a Seq by accident. Debug output is one way :)
22:29 skids That'd do it.
22:30 autarch so what's the solution here?
22:30 jnthn But .cache on the end of the expression that gives you the Seq
22:30 jnthn *Put
22:30 nine_ jnthn: having a look at the tests. There's some failures that disappear when I run the files manually. Spectest output is still not verbose enough to be useful :/
22:31 jnthn nine_: Urgh, ok.
22:31 nine_ It's hard to say if it's curli that's at fault. Haven't had a clean spectest in a long while :(
22:32 autarch ok, looks like .cache did the trickl
22:32 david_cassel joined #perl6
22:32 autarch maybe the error message could recommend that?
22:32 jnthn Yes, nice idea
22:32 telex joined #perl6
22:34 nine_ I'm doing a run with TEST_JOBS=1. Seems to be the only way to get the full output. Will be interesting if the failures are still there.
22:34 * jnthn wonders how to word it
22:36 nine_ "A Seq is a one-shot source of values. Use .cache or assign to an array to re-use to be able to re-use the values."
22:36 pink_mist s/to re-use //
22:36 pink_mist (the first 'to re-use' that is)
22:37 dalek modules.perl6.org/new-db-builder: 216d712 | (Zoffix Znet)++ | lib/ModulesPerl6/DbBuilder/Dist/Source/GitHub.pm:
22:37 dalek modules.perl6.org/new-db-builder: Add docs for ModulesPerl6::DbBuilder::Dist::Source::GitHub
22:37 dalek modules.perl6.org/new-db-builder: review: https://github.com/perl6/modules.perl6.org/commit/216d7121c9
22:37 nine_ pink_mist: of course :)
22:37 dalek rakudo/nom: fec2b52 | jnthn++ | src/core/Exception.pm:
22:37 dalek rakudo/nom: Add suggestion of .cache to Seq consumed error.
22:37 dalek rakudo/nom:
22:37 dalek rakudo/nom: autarch++
22:37 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/fec2b5226d
22:37 jnthn Mentioned the array option too
22:37 jnthn Feel free to wordsmith it
22:38 jnthn Time for me to get some rest :)
22:38 autarch it'd be nice to find a way to say that "if you call methods like .X or .Y you have already exhausted the sequence"
22:40 nine_ autarch: or just a link to the documentation
22:40 autarch nine_: yeah, that could work too
22:40 autarch I think a lot of this is just that I don't understand Array vs List vs Seq very well (at all?) in Perl 6
22:41 rvchangue joined #perl6
22:42 skids "Values already iterated from this Seq are gone... maybe you wanted to .cache them for re-use as a List, or assign them to an array?"
22:43 b2gills joined #perl6
22:44 RabidGravy gosh I appear to have soundcloud OAuth working, still a pain in the arse to test though
22:44 cognominal joined #perl6
22:59 MadcapJake what are the postcircumfix parentheses on this non-captured group doing: <.malformed("$*SCOPE (did you mean to declare a sigilless \\{~$<ident>} or \${~$<ident>}?)")>
23:00 skids passing the args to the rule.
23:01 MadcapJake but i thought the `.` made it an uncaptured group?
23:01 skids Right, but that does not mean the rule does not get called.
23:01 MadcapJake oh ok, but rules like that can take arguments then eh?
23:02 skids Yes they are essentially subs/methods.
23:02 MadcapJake good to know, thanks skids!
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23:42 dalek doc: 8d3c195 | (Wenzel P. P. Peppmeyer)++ | doc/Language/containers.pod:
23:42 dalek doc: mention sigilless variables and 'is raw' for binding
23:42 dalek doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/8d3c1952b3
23:42 dalek doc: fe4b4a1 | (Wenzel P. P. Peppmeyer)++ | doc/Language/containers.pod:
23:42 dalek doc: mention and provide example for Proxy in Containers
23:43 dalek joined #perl6
23:47 d4l3k_ joined #perl6
23:48 * diakopter cackles wildly at `purl` being listed as a contributor
23:55 dalek joined #perl6
23:57 BenGoldberg joined #perl6
23:58 lizmat diakopter: I'm afraid the humour of 'purl' being listed as a contributor is lost on me
23:58 lizmat diakopter: would you care to elaborate ?
23:58 yqt joined #perl6
23:59 diakopter I thought purl was a bot
23:59 dalek joined #perl6
23:59 diakopter on magnet (originally/mostly?)

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