Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2015-12-24

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:00 krshn timotimo: what is SSA?
00:00 cygx single static assignment
00:00 timotimo "single ... " yes
00:00 cygx but in this case, more like single static binding
00:00 woolfy left #perl6
00:01 cygx m: my \hello = my $ = "world"; hello ~= " world"; say hello
00:01 camelia rakudo-moar 895546: OUTPUT«world world␤»
00:01 cygx you can still assign if you bind something assignable
00:02 gfldex m: my @a = <mdash amp>; say ('&' xx * Z~ @a Z~ ';' xx *).join;
00:02 camelia rakudo-moar 895546: OUTPUT«&mdash;&amp;␤»
00:02 timotimo i've already shown that, cygx  :P
00:02 timotimo m: my @a = <mdash amp>; say @a.fmt("&%s;").say
00:02 camelia rakudo-moar 895546: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/Hj_lvmmmnR␤Variable '%s' is not declared␤at /tmp/Hj_lvmmmnR:1␤------> 3my @a = <mdash amp>; say @a.fmt("&7⏏5%s;").say␤»
00:02 timotimo m: my @a = <mdash amp>; say @a.fmt('&%s;').say
00:02 camelia rakudo-moar 895546: OUTPUT«&mdash; &amp;␤True␤»
00:02 timotimo m: my @a = <mdash amp>; say @a.fmt('&%s;')
00:02 camelia rakudo-moar 895546: OUTPUT«&mdash; &amp;␤»
00:02 timotimo too much say
00:03 krshn interesting. thanks.
00:03 cygx timotimo: repetition is an essential teaching tool :p
00:03 krshn cygx: yes++
00:03 timotimo yes yes
00:03 timotimo am i doing it right?
00:04 cygx oO( Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. )
00:04 cygx (Terry Pratchett)++   :'(
00:05 nebuchadnezzar m: my @a = 1; @a[3] = 2; say @a.grep(.defined)
00:05 camelia rakudo-moar 895546: OUTPUT«Cannot use Bool as Matcher with '.grep'.  Did you mean to use $_ inside a block?␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/1IeLr1Vs9X:1␤␤Actually thrown at:␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/1IeLr1Vs9X:1␤␤»
00:06 atweiden timotimo: nom is currently not building
00:06 atweiden No writeable path found in block <unit> at tools/build/
00:06 atweiden it compiled fine, but for this
00:07 krshn so here.. \hello is more like a reference to some memory location ?
00:07 timotimo no
00:07 krshn if it points to something that can change, it can be modified, else not?
00:08 timotimo delete the thought of "reference" from your brain right now :)
00:08 cygx variable names are bound to a thing, normally a scalar container, an array or a hash, depending on whether you use $, @ or %
00:09 cygx then, you can assign to that thing with = or re-bind the name with :=
00:09 nebuchadnezzar erf, how could I grep all those “(Any)”?
00:09 cygx native variables and sgilless ones are special
00:09 cygx *sigilless
00:09 timotimo nebuchadnezzar: you can .grep(*.defined)
00:10 timotimo i'll go to sleep nao
00:10 nebuchadnezzar erf, thanks
00:10 nebuchadnezzar timotimo++
00:10 krshn thanks.. lot of reading to do :-)
00:11 krshn thanks timotimo++ gnite
00:11 nebuchadnezzar lot of things to learn, Perl6++
00:12 krshn nebuchadnezzar: yep.. I am prepared for the long haul. Ideally, I would like to program in perl6 for the next 25 years
00:12 _nadim hi, there a way to grep a list and get two lists, one that matches one that does not? And I means something that is syntaxically pleasant and perl6ish, not a for loop, and if and two lists.
00:12 * nebuchadnezzar read the doc looking for what *.defined means
00:12 _nadim s/there/Is there/
00:13 AlexDaniel nebuchadnezzar: * is whatever star
00:13 AlexDaniel nebuchadnezzar: you can probably do .grep({.defined}) as well
00:13 shmibs joined #perl6
00:13 gfldex it's WhateverCode see:
00:13 cygx m: m: my ($a, @b, %c); my int $d; say $a.VAR.WHAT, @b.VAR.WHAT, %c.VAR.WHAT, $d.VAR.WHAT
00:13 camelia rakudo-moar 895546: OUTPUT«(Scalar)(Array)(Hash)(IntLexRef)␤»
00:13 cygx krshn: ^^
00:13 AlexDaniel nebuchadnezzar: or .grep({$_.defined}) if you wish
00:14 AlexDaniel or .grep: { .defined }; …
00:14 timotimo but never .grep(.defined)
00:14 AlexDaniel hm I wonder, what about .grep(&defined) ?
00:14 cygx just .grep(*.defined)
00:14 nebuchadnezzar gfldex, AlexDaniel: ok, that's what I used to use in perl5
00:14 nebuchadnezzar m: my @a = 1; @a[3] = 2; say @a.grep(&defined)
00:14 camelia rakudo-moar 895546: OUTPUT«Cannot call ACCEPTS(Sub+{<anon|70088992>}: Int); none of these signatures match:␤    (Mu:U $: \topic, *%_)␤    (Mu:U $: Mu:U \topic, *%_)␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/zHLS744LX5:1␤␤»
00:14 nebuchadnezzar m: my @a = 1; @a[3] = 2; say @a.grep(*.defined)
00:14 camelia rakudo-moar 895546: OUTPUT«(1 2)␤»
00:15 nebuchadnezzar m: my @a = 1; @a[3] = 2; say @a.grep: .defined
00:15 camelia rakudo-moar 895546: OUTPUT«Cannot use Bool as Matcher with '.grep'.  Did you mean to use $_ inside a block?␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/GvblBOeuGv:1␤␤Actually thrown at:␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/GvblBOeuGv:1␤␤»
00:15 nebuchadnezzar m: my @a = 1; @a[3] = 2; say @a.grep: {.defined}
00:15 camelia rakudo-moar 895546: OUTPUT«(1 2)␤»
00:15 nebuchadnezzar ok, thanks guys
00:16 krshn can someone point me to SSA doc?
00:16 krshn atleast what do I search for?
00:17 cpage_ joined #perl6
00:17 AlexDaniel m: sub foo { defined $^a }; my @a = 1; @a[3] = 2; say @a.grep(&foo)
00:17 camelia rakudo-moar 895546: OUTPUT«(1 2)␤»
00:18 AlexDaniel honestly I don't understand why you have to wrap 「defined」 into your own sub
00:18 timotimo m: say &defined.perl
00:18 camelia rakudo-moar 895546: OUTPUT«Sub+{<anon|70088992>}.new␤»
00:18 krshn ?
00:19 timotimo m: say &defined.signature
00:19 camelia rakudo-moar 895546: OUTPUT«(Mu)␤»
00:19 timotimo krshn: yeah
00:19 krshn ok. thanks.
00:19 krshn that wiki relevant to perl6 ?
00:19 cygx timotimo: curious notion of 'sleep' you have there ;)
00:19 timotimo yeah.
00:19 * timotimo suspends computer
00:19 AlexDaniel timotimo: which means?
00:21 krshn why do I have the feeling that once I learn a good chunk of perl6, I would have learnt a good chunk of computer science itself ?
00:22 krshn I am a electrical engineer btw :-)
00:22 krshn so this is great
00:22 krshn I would never have come across SSA otherwise
00:22 AlexDaniel krshn: I'm not sure about that. But you will learn a bunch of stuff that you can also use in other languages, yes
00:23 krshn sure.. :-) I am not so naive to think that cs == perl6
00:23 AlexDaniel krshn: which is why I like the idea of using Perl 6 for teaching. Basically anything that you want to show you can show in Perl 6
00:24 hankache TimToady post is up
00:24 hankache check the Advent
00:24 krshn it definitely is overwhelming.. perl6 has everything and the kitchen sink thrown in
00:25 AlexDaniel hankache: nice :)
00:25 krshn thanks hankache
00:25 krshn was waiting for it
00:25 TimToady at one time we had a type named KitchenSink, just so we could say that
00:25 hankache TimToady++
00:25 TimToady we still have the sink
00:26 cygx krshn: documantation is at and
00:26 krshn :-) first time on this channel.. can't believe I am chatting with you Larry.
00:26 gfldex m: my @a = 1, 2, 3; say @a >>~~>> Int:D;
00:26 camelia rakudo-moar 895546: OUTPUT«[True True True]␤»
00:26 cygx *documentation
00:26 gfldex m: my @a = 1, Nil, 3; say @a >>~~>> Int:D;
00:26 camelia rakudo-moar 895546: OUTPUT«[True False True]␤»
00:27 krshn cygx: thanks
00:27 RandalSchwartz joined #perl6
00:27 RandalSchwartz what is panda?  Why doesn't it install from git?
00:28 hankache can you please go to and and upvote Larry's Post (An Unexpectedly Long-expected Party)
00:28 RandalSchwartz I'm building git:// every day, but it doesn't have anything panda in it
00:28 _nadim it installs modules, it needs to be bootstraped. clone repo, follow instructions.
00:29 _nadim
00:29 RandalSchwartz INSTALL.txt doesn't mention it, except to say to "use it"
00:29 RandalSchwartz perhaps that INSTALL.txt needs to be updated to say what you just said
00:30 _nadim Error message "Directives specify 0 arguments, but 2 arguments were supplied" could be more helpful, like where that occures to start with
00:30 skids Most people install it using "rakudobrew build panda"
00:30 RandalSchwartz what the heck is rakudobrew?  What would have told me about that?
00:31 RandalSchwartz that's *also* not mentioned in INSTALL.txt .. I just read that
00:31 skids All good questions.
00:31 RandalSchwartz so there's a lot of folklore around rakudo already
00:31 tadzik what is INSTALL.txt? :)
00:31 tadzik there's some tribal knowledge
00:31 diakopter what is reading?
00:31 AlexDaniel cool.
00:31 RandalSchwartz I'm being the guinea pig for christmas
00:32 RandalSchwartz because I really want this to work when the crowds throng in
00:32 tadzik well, panda and rakudobrew are not official stuff of any sort
00:32 tadzik it's just what a lot of people tends to use
00:32 RandalSchwartz is there a web page I should have read instead of INSTALL.txt?
00:32 RandalSchwartz Nothing is official!
00:32 RandalSchwartz this is perl6!
00:32 tadzik does recommend perlbrew?
00:32 tadzik or cpanminus?
00:32 skids Well, I expect the crowds wil be using xmas's star release which will bundle that all.
00:33 RandalSchwartz Oh - so when I download two days from now, I will get that?
00:33 AlexDaniel RandalSchwartz:
00:33 RandalSchwartz but just not today?
00:33 AlexDaniel RandalSchwartz: this one does
00:33 _nadim
00:33 RandalSchwartz "this" "one"
00:33 diakopter RandalSchwartz: a post from February (on first page still) mentions panda
00:33 RandalSchwartz not the current git?
00:33 skids But, we shoud probably make some "developers install" instructions very easy to find.
00:33 RandalSchwartz I don't see panda anywhere in today's build
00:34 gfldex m: my @a = 1, Nil, 3; say [Z~~] @a, Int:D xx *;
00:34 camelia rakudo-moar 895546: OUTPUT«(True False True)␤»
00:34 diakopter RandalSchwartz: you're not building the star distribution
00:34 hankache can you please go to and and upvote Larry's Post (An Unexpectedly Long-expected Party)
00:34 muraiki joined #perl6
00:34 _nadim I started at, was done within 10 mn. simple enough
00:34 diakopter hankache: you already posted that
00:34 skids panda isn't part of rakudo, so that's way it does not mention it, same way gcc does not mention dpkg.
00:34 hankache diakopter i am spamming
00:35 diakopter as a way of life?
00:35 RandalSchwartz Is there a git archive I can build instead of using brew?
00:35 RandalSchwartz brew conflicts with macports... I went crazy having both of them installed
00:35 diakopter you can try
00:35 _nadim start here:
00:35 diakopter RandalSchwartz: rakudobrew is not brew
00:36 RandalSchwartz ...
00:36 RandalSchwartz says brew install rakudo-star
00:36 RandalSchwartz I don't want to do that
00:36 diakopter very outdated
00:36 RandalSchwartz again... this is festivus
00:36 RandalSchwartz christmas is just around the corner
00:36 diakopter ++
00:36 AlexDaniel actually, I think that the debian package is going to be there
00:36 RandalSchwartz people are going to swamp to this page
00:36 RandalSchwartz s/swamp/swarm/
00:37 AlexDaniel last time I complained about it being outdated somebody on this channel actually uploaded 2015.09
00:37 diakopter who's building the debian package? is it in the pipeline?
00:37 AlexDaniel diakopter: Dominique Dumont <>
00:37 jdv79 just clone rakudo off github and perl --gen-moar && make install
00:37 cygx RandalSchwartz: there's a section 'Building from source'
00:37 RandalSchwartz so perl6 *isn't* ready for a "release on christmas" if the docs on how to get started aren't even correct.
00:38 diakopter RandalSchwartz: start with the "To install rakudobrew" lines on that page
00:38 RandalSchwartz ahh... thank you
00:38 RandalSchwartz sorry, I got stuck on the brew command.
00:38 diakopter it ends with panda install Task::Star
00:38 RandalSchwartz yeah yeah, thanks.  OK, whining volume reduced.
00:39 RandalSchwartz I'll give that a try tonight when I'm on a faster link
00:39 diakopter I think only moritz and pmichaud can post to
00:40 krshn great post
00:41 jdv79 that how-to-get-rakudo is a little verbose and rambly.  a TOC would help too.
00:41 jdv79 s//page/
00:42 RandalSchwartz so rakudobrew will also do what my direct install from git:// has been doing?
00:42 RandalSchwartz I've been doing it the hard way? :)
00:42 jdv79 i fee like it could be < 1/4 that size and then link off to more rambles if they are really needed
00:42 diakopter RandalSchwartz: yes, but you need panda also to get the Star modules
00:43 diakopter
00:43 RandalSchwartz ok... so I'll change my morning workflow
00:43 diakopter someone should try running that lately
00:44 diakopter tadzik: the problem with tribal knowledge is that non-tribal conflicting knowledge is unaware of it
00:45 jdv79 huh.  do we really need install/bin when we have install/share/perl6/site/bin?
00:47 jdv79 nm
00:49 krshn I am not able to do "panda install Task::Star"
00:49 krshn ==> Installing Grammar::Debugger Cannot unbox a type object   in block  at /home/krshn/local/linux/share/perl6/site/sources/443265C9F8492658D1FECC3F5B7DAAC93EDF370F:61   in sub indir at /home/krshn/local/linux/share/perl6/site/sources/19FE314CF0CF0A0E3BC1A2E32118466C7984705D:20   in method install at /home/krshn/local/linux/share/perl6/site/sources/443265C9F8492658D1FECC3F5B7DAAC93EDF370F:42   in method install at /home/krshn/local/li
00:49 krshn this is on the latest version of perl6/8955469
00:50 jdv79 try it again
00:50 krshn and latest version of panda/005eb66
00:50 jdv79 that is a currently difficult to repro bug
00:50 jdv79 it normally only happens the first time
00:50 jdv79 :(
00:51 krshn ok again
00:51 jdv79 i thought that had been fixed.  maybe it should be bumped up in priority.  nine would know.
00:52 krshn failing Template::Mustache
00:53 TimToady URI also appears to be failing
00:53 krshn ==> Installing Template::Mustache ==> Successfully installed Template::Mustache ==> Fetching URI ==> Building URI ==> Testing URI t/01.t ................... ok Use of the 'unpack' method is experimental; please 'use experimental :pack'   in sub uri-escape at /rhel5pdi/workplace/krshn/git/panda/.panda-work/1450918318_9/lib/URI/   in block <unit> at t/escape.t:18  # Looks like you planned 11 tests, but ran 4 t/escape.t ......
00:53 TimToady oh, looks like it needs 'use experimental'
00:54 krshn Sorry URI as TimToady pointed out
00:54 jdv79 krshn: is that literally failing?  looks like a warning only.
00:54 jdv79 oh, nm
00:54 krshn URI failing .. Files=4, Tests=86,  5 wallclock secs ( 0.01 usr  0.00 sys +  5.39 cusr  0.40 csys =  5.80 CPU) Result: FAIL
00:55 shmibs joined #perl6
00:55 TimToady even though we don't promise Star by Christmas, we would do well to make this a bit smoother...
00:57 TimToady hmm, I see a [DISLOCATED MESSAGE] Useless use of enter_result__1 symbol in sink context
00:57 TimToady better fix that...
01:00 c_babbalage joined #perl6
01:00 _nadim TimToady: Error message "Directives specify 0 arguments, but 2 arguments were supplied" could be more helpful, at least  where it occures
01:00 _nadim or shall I report a bug?
01:01 jdv79 krshn: that's from a change made today.
01:01 krshn ok
01:01 krshn jdv79: ok
01:01 raiph joined #perl6
01:02 TimToady _nadim: it could at least mention 'printf' or some such
01:03 _nadim yes, the error was %:2d, note the extra ':' in the format of a sprint. the line could be useful too if one has many sprintf
01:03 c_babbalage _nadim: What makes it a bug? Is `Directives` a separate kind of thing, or the name of a sub/function/method/thingy? Sorry, I'm not helping, I just dropped in here because it's nearly Christmas and I wanted to try it out.
01:04 RandalSchwartz TimToady - that's why I'm helping point out things before the masses approach
01:04 yeahnoob joined #perl6
01:04 TimToady nodnod
01:04 RandalSchwartz since I've been mostly disconnected from everything, other than building moar every day
01:04 TimToady we always need fresh viewpoints
01:05 RandalSchwartz make.rakudo && perl6 -e 'say "Hello, World!"
01:05 jdv79 I don't get why most of the stuff is in Task::Star.
01:07 krshn When I started trying out perl6 about a month back, I was able to get rakudo compiling on gcc 5.2.0 only after: export CFLAGS="-Wno-error=declaration-after-statement"
01:07 jdv79 JSON::RPC, Test::Mock, HTTP::Status, ufo?  most of these aren't general purpose.
01:07 krshn perl --gen-moar --gen-nqp --backends=moar --prefix=$HOME/local/linux
01:07 jdv79 krshn: what os?
01:07 krshn it took me a while to figure out this flag
01:08 krshn Linux <host> 2.6.18-164.el5 #1 SMP Tue Aug 18 15:51:48 EDT 2009 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
01:08 dalek rakudo/nom: 93c6c9f | TimToady++ | src/Perl6/World.nqp:
01:08 dalek rakudo/nom: suppress useless use of enter_result_1
01:08 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
01:08 jdv79 is it redhat 5?
01:08 krshn yes
01:09 jdv79 i think you hit a bug i did in the confif of moar
01:09 jdv79 its reported but aparrently not fixed
01:09 jdv79 *config
01:09 krshn jdv79: now is it fixed?
01:09 krshn can I try removing it and trying?
01:09 jdv79 i'm not sure.  last i tried i wasn't.
01:10 krshn jdv79: so it only works after this declaration? is it documented?
01:10 jdv79
01:10 jdv79 that seems like it
01:11 krshn jdv79: let me try removing it
01:11 llfourn joined #perl6
01:11 jdv79 its likely not fixed
01:12 c_babbalage So.. I have a program that does the countdown game (it's pretty simple, and only does `(.... (a + b).... op n)` forms, not `(a / b) + (c / d)` forms fwiw). It fails bizarrely:
01:13 c_babbalage With `Too few positionals passed; expected 2 arguments but got 1` -- but only after the first ordering of number has been checked (it's a brute force approach, I can share code if that'll help)
01:13 AlexDaniel c_babbalage: that'll help, especially if you can golf it down to something short
01:13 skids c_babbalage: code would help.
01:13 c_babbalage It's about 40 lines...
01:13 c_babbalage :/
01:13 skids Make a github gist
01:13 c_babbalage I am not a golfer
01:14 c_babbalage kk
01:15 AlexDaniel m: my \pi = pi; say pi
01:15 camelia rakudo-moar 895546: OUTPUT«(Mu)␤»
01:16 kanishka joined #perl6
01:16 krshn jdv79: works without the flag -- confirmed
01:16 c_babbalage AlexDaniel:
01:17 c_babbalage Probably I just don't know how to write perl6 yet
01:17 c_babbalage But the error message is LTA
01:17 krshn going to try panda after TimToady update
01:18 AlexDaniel c_babbalage: meh no line number
01:19 jdv79 krshn: its fixed?
01:19 jdv79 doin a pr for a one line change is kinda a pita
01:19 c_babbalage AlexDaniel: Well yeah, hence all the `say`s...
01:19 krshn i am able to build rakudo with setting CFLAGS
01:19 c_babbalage Not a clue where it dies
01:19 jdv79 ok
01:19 TimToady it's just suppressing a warning
01:19 dalek doc: 770c7f8 | (Wenzel P. P. Peppmeyer)++ | doc/Language/operators.pod:
01:19 dalek doc: add TODOs for Meta Operators so it's easier to spot that documenting
01:19 dalek doc: Perl 6 supports lazyness too
01:19 dalek doc: review:
01:19 dalek doc: ded6e00 | (Wenzel P. P. Peppmeyer)++ | doc/Language/operators.pod:
01:19 dalek doc: Merge pull request #258 from gfldex/master
01:19 dalek doc:
01:19 dalek doc: add TODOs for Meta Operators so it's easier to spot that documenting Perl 6 supports lazyness too
01:19 dalek doc: review:
01:19 TimToady won't fix the big issue
01:19 krshn TimToady: ok
01:20 jdv79 anyone with commit on URI -
01:20 TimToady and won't add experimental to modules that need it...
01:20 * gfldex self.tomorrow.push('doc Meta Operators'); self.sleep;
01:21 krshn logging off. thanks.
01:21 cygx_ joined #perl6
01:21 AlexDaniel c_babbalage: I think that it dies here: for comp(@p, %{}) -> $k, $v {
01:21 * grondilu suddenly realises it's December 24th already
01:21 ellybelly joined #perl6
01:21 ellybelly_ joined #perl6
01:22 AlexDaniel c_babbalage: yes, I'm pretty sure that it is what happens
01:22 c_babbalage AlexDaniel: What'd I get wrong there, then?
01:22 krshn great channel btw. I can't believe I stayed away for so long -- bad experience in other channels in the past.
01:22 AlexDaniel c_babbalage: not so fast! Still trying to figure out :)
01:22 jdv79 nite
01:22 c_babbalage :)
01:23 cygx_ AlexDaniel: c_babbalage: if you get LTA error messages, you can try with --ll-exception to get at least a backtrace
01:23 ab6tract joined #perl6
01:24 AlexDaniel cygx_: yeah and get a bunch of errors in m-CORE.setting. True, sometimes it is useful
01:24 cygx_ at troll.p6:23
01:24 c_babbalage AlexDaniel: And that does indeed nail it to the line you mentioned. Nice, thanks :)
01:24 c_babbalage Learning more here every time
01:24 AlexDaniel cygx_: ah!!! Indeed!!
01:25 skids m: my %d = :b; for %d -> $k, $v { say "$k $v" };
01:25 camelia rakudo-moar 895546: OUTPUT«Too few positionals passed; expected 2 arguments but got 1␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/IhLnHC_UnS:1␤␤»
01:25 skids m: my %d = :b; for %d.kv -> $k, $v { say "$k $v" };
01:25 camelia rakudo-moar 895546: OUTPUT«b True␤»
01:25 AlexDaniel yeah, that's what I figured too
01:25 skids That's the issue I think.
01:25 AlexDaniel missing .kv
01:26 TimToady well, the real issue is the missing line number
01:26 TimToady unfortunately binding is very low level
01:27 c_babbalage Thanks so much for the help here
01:27 c_babbalage knew I wouldn't regret dropping by :)
01:28 TimToady oh, it does have a line number, nm
01:28 skids c_babbalage: so for %hash will send one pair from the hash each iteration, if you ask for two via "-> $k, $v" it will fail with that message if the hash had an odd number of keys.
01:28 TimToady sometimes I think the filename:line# notation is a bit too terse
01:29 c_babbalage skids: Yup, that clears it all up
01:29 grondilu "Really, I feel sorry for the people who are only happy when they have something to be unhappy about."  That's a great quote.
01:29 TimToady not only does the line# disappear into the filename visually, it also makes it hard to copy/past the filename
01:30 krshn joined #perl6
01:30 TimToady does anything depend on the foofile:42 format?
01:31 TimToady if not, I'd like to expand it to 'in file foofile line 42' or so
01:31 krshn how does one authenticate name on freenode?
01:31 AlexDaniel krshn: /msg NickServ HELP I think
01:32 AlexDaniel I'm still trying to figure out why there is no line number…
01:33 c_babbalage btw, after the fix, I now have `Type check failed in binding $x; expected Rat but got Num`. Aren't I fun today? Also no line number, but again `--ll-exception` helps
01:33 skids krshn:
01:33 jdv79 why does Bailador give panda such a workout?
01:33 rickbike joined #perl6
01:34 thomax_ joined #perl6
01:34 c_babbalage I'm aliasing `perl6 --ll-exception` to `wtf` right now
01:34 krshn AlexDaniel, skids: thanks
01:35 c_babbalage AlexDaniel, skids: also thanks
01:35 c_babbalage but for different reasons :)
01:38 krshn Colloquy (mac) is asking for username/password which is not same as nick/username
01:38 krshn i mean nick/password
01:39 AlexDaniel c_babbalage: ok down to 30 lines… It's so weird
01:39 AlexDaniel c_babbalage: basically if you change the code at least a bit then the line number suddenly appears!
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01:41 c_babbalage AlexDaniel: If I remove all the` .Rat`s, then the code works
01:41 krshn anyone logging into using mac? need help
01:41 c_babbalage I have no clue with regards the line number, I've only spent a few days looking at the rakudo github ;)
01:41 AlexDaniel c_babbalage: nah I don't know about this one, trying to figure out what makes it hide the line number
01:42 skids krshn: you shouldn't need a password at all.  Try leaving it blank?
01:42 c_babbalage `((((3 + 4) * 12) - 8) * 7)` \o/
01:43 jdv79 DBIish is pretty sluggish too
01:43 c_babbalage AlexDaniel: You have fixed my code, you are a wizard, please have this wheel of cheese as a token of my goodwill O
01:44 krshn skids: Colloquy client needs a username/pass. not the web interface that I am on now.
01:44 c_babbalage Sorry to leave you with a bug, of course. *egress*
01:44 krshn I don't really care for the client. I just need one that stores history.
01:45 skids krshn: well, you sure you selected IRC as the protocol?  There should be a way to do that w/o a password.
01:45 skids (I don't have a mac, so...)
01:45 spannerMallet joined #perl6
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01:47 AlexDaniel 7 lines!
01:47 krshn skids: any GPL client that works on mac? (sorry not much into irc before)
01:48 skids krshn: pidgin maybe?
01:48 jdv79 i'm gettin the feelin that DBIish isn't gonna finish installing
01:49 spannerMallet skids: rejoined (was c_some-sodding-babbage-typo) but srsly, I was stuck for a week . Just realised you were the one who pointed out my .kv error and I may've been insufficiently gracious. Now I will lurk and say n'more. Anyway. Thanks a bunch too.
01:51 skids ◔ I already ate most of AlexDaniel's cheese :-)
01:51 AlexDaniel skids: and by that you mean?
01:52 skids Nothing ust being silly
01:54 AlexDaniel m: gather for %{1 => ‘a’, 2 => ‘b’, 3 => ‘c’} -> $k, $v { take “him” }
01:54 camelia rakudo-moar 93c6c9: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Too few positionals passed; expected 2 arguments but got 1␤»
01:54 AlexDaniel here
01:54 twatmonger joined #perl6
01:55 TimToady oh great, I broke ENTER...
01:55 AlexDaniel m: gather for (1 => ‘a’, 2 => ‘b’, 3 => ‘c’) -> $k, $v { take 1 }
01:55 camelia rakudo-moar 93c6c9: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Too few positionals passed; expected 2 arguments but got 1␤»
01:55 dalek rakudo/nom: 7f30326 | TimToady++ | src/core/
01:55 dalek rakudo/nom: say 'line' when we mean line, not colon
01:55 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
01:55 dalek rakudo/nom: 6471e82 | TimToady++ | src/Perl6/World.nqp:
01:55 dalek rakudo/nom: Revert "suppress useless use of enter_result_1"
01:55 dalek rakudo/nom:
01:55 dalek rakudo/nom: This reverts commit 93c6c9f0ce2ac9f4d4698268c686e34a1c500239.
01:55 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
01:56 TimToady WANTED isn't visible from World, to fix
01:57 AlexDaniel uhh so it seems like gather-take is eating the line number somehow
01:58 TimToady huh
01:59 AlexDaniel m: my %h = <1 a 2 b 3 c>; gather for %h -> $k, $v { take 1 }
01:59 camelia rakudo-moar 93c6c9: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Too few positionals passed; expected 2 arguments but got 1␤»
01:59 jdv79 so I can install Task::Star sans DBIish, LWP::Simple and JSON::RPC.  also had to use my fork of URI for the pack exper thing.
01:59 jdv79 and with that goodnight
01:59 AlexDaniel but it's funny
02:00 AlexDaniel m: my %h = <1 a>; gather for %h -> $k, $v { take 1 }
02:00 camelia rakudo-moar 93c6c9: OUTPUT«Too few positionals passed; expected 2 arguments but got 1␤  in code  at /tmp/HKVx8GP5cC:1␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/HKVx8GP5cC:1␤␤»
02:00 AlexDaniel why? Why now it has no problem finding the line number?
02:01 AlexDaniel anyway, I'll just rakudobug it
02:02 xpen joined #perl6
02:06 skids m: gather for 1,2,3 { $^k, $^v;  take 1;}
02:06 camelia rakudo-moar 93c6c9: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Too few positionals passed; expected 2 arguments but got 1␤»
02:06 skids m: gather for 1 { $^k, $^v;  take 1;}
02:06 camelia rakudo-moar 93c6c9: OUTPUT«Too few positionals passed; expected 2 arguments but got 1␤  in code  at /tmp/h3cDaNSv_Q:1␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/h3cDaNSv_Q:1␤␤»
02:07 AlexDaniel m: gather for 1,2,3 -> $k, $v { take 1 }
02:07 camelia rakudo-moar 93c6c9: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Too few positionals passed; expected 2 arguments but got 1␤»
02:07 AlexDaniel oh right, that is shorter
02:11 ab6tract TimToady++ / camelia++ # nice blog post!
02:11 dalek rakudo/nom: 1e5c2a4 | TimToady++ | src/Perl6/World.nqp:
02:11 dalek rakudo/nom: suppress enter_result warning a better way
02:11 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
02:12 llfourn .tell tadzik PR for your consideration :)
02:12 yoleaux llfourn: I'll pass your message to tadzik.
02:13 TimToady m: die "phoo"
02:13 camelia rakudo-moar 6471e8: OUTPUT«phoo␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/M2lPyU5Jfg line 1␤␤»
02:14 * TimToady claims another colon, in some sense or other
02:15 ab6tract m: my $z; while ++$z < 5 { $z } # i thought that this leaves a list on the stack now?
02:15 camelia rakudo-moar 6471e8: OUTPUT«WARNINGS for /tmp/qD1K7aExf2:␤Useless use of $z in sink context (line 1)␤»
02:17 ab6tract m: my $z; say while ++$z < 5 { $z }
02:17 camelia rakudo-moar 6471e8: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/pVvDKpyOcH␤Unsupported use of bare "say"; in Perl 6 please use .say if you meant $_, or use an explicit invocant or argument, or use &say to refer to the function as a noun␤at /tmp/pVvDKpyOcH:1␤------> 3…»
02:19 ab6tract TimToady: did I misunderstand your fixes from yesterday? i thought that it would fix this:
02:19 shmibs joined #perl6
02:19 ab6tract m: sub f($x) { my $z; while ++$z < $x { $z }; say f(5)
02:19 camelia rakudo-moar 6471e8: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/pa7WNLbPTI␤Missing block (taken by some undeclared routine?)␤at /tmp/pa7WNLbPTI:1␤------> 3 my $z; while ++$z < $x { $z }; say f(5)7⏏5<EOL>␤    expecting any of:␤        postfix␤        statem…»
02:19 ab6tract m: sub f($x) { my $z; while ++$z < $x { $z } }; say f(5)
02:19 camelia rakudo-moar 6471e8: OUTPUT«WARNINGS for /tmp/Bh1vER8cM3:␤Useless use of $z in sink context (line 1)␤sub infix:«<» (Mu $?, Mu $?) { #`(Sub+{<anon|58275344>}|57596376) ... }␤»
02:20 CasketBase joined #perl6
02:23 TimToady while at statementlist level is never wanted, you have to use parens
02:23 TimToady m: sub f($x) { my $z; (while ++$z < $x { $z }) }; say f(5)
02:23 camelia rakudo-moar 6471e8: OUTPUT«Cannot call prefix:<++>(Any); none of these signatures match:␤    (Mu:D $a is rw)␤    (Mu:U $a is rw)␤    (Int:D $a is rw)␤    (int $a is rw)␤    (Bool $a is rw)␤    (Num:D $a is rw)␤    (Num:U $a is rw)␤    (num $a is rw)␤  in block <uni…»
02:23 TimToady er, hmm
02:23 TimToady that's...odd...
02:24 TimToady m: sub f($x) { (while ++(my $z) < $x { $z }) }; say f(5)
02:24 camelia rakudo-moar 6471e8: OUTPUT«Cannot call prefix:<++>(Any); none of these signatures match:␤    (Mu:D $a is rw)␤    (Mu:U $a is rw)␤    (Int:D $a is rw)␤    (int $a is rw)␤    (Bool $a is rw)␤    (Num:D $a is rw)␤    (Num:U $a is rw)␤    (num $a is rw)␤  in block <uni…»
02:24 ab6tract TimToady: i get () as the return value locally.. that almost looks like a autoviv bug??
02:24 TimToady m: sub f($x) { my $z; do while ++$z < $x { $z } }; say f(5)
02:24 camelia rakudo-moar 6471e8: OUTPUT«Cannot call prefix:<++>(Any); none of these signatures match:␤    (Mu:D $a is rw)␤    (Mu:U $a is rw)␤    (Int:D $a is rw)␤    (int $a is rw)␤    (Bool $a is rw)␤    (Num:D $a is rw)␤    (Num:U $a is rw)␤    (num $a is rw)␤  in block <uni…»
02:25 TimToady something's not right there
02:25 AlexDaniel oh wow, these bug reports by zefram are awesome
02:25 TimToady yeah, he's good
02:25 FROGGS_ joined #perl6
02:26 TimToady m: sub f($x) { my $z; do $z while ++$z < $x }; say f(5)
02:26 camelia rakudo-moar 6471e8: OUTPUT«Cannot call prefix:<++>(Any); none of these signatures match:␤    (Mu:D $a is rw)␤    (Mu:U $a is rw)␤    (Int:D $a is rw)␤    (int $a is rw)␤    (Bool $a is rw)␤    (Num:D $a is rw)␤    (Num:U $a is rw)␤    (num $a is rw)␤  in block <uni…»
02:26 ab6tract m: ++(my $f)
02:26 camelia rakudo-moar 6471e8: ( no output )
02:26 TimToady m: sub f($x) { my $z; return do $z while ++$z < $x }; say f(5)
02:26 camelia rakudo-moar 6471e8: OUTPUT«(5 5 5 5)␤»
02:27 TimToady m: sub f($x) { my $z; return (while ++$z < $x { $z }) }; say f(5)
02:27 camelia rakudo-moar 6471e8: OUTPUT«(5 5 5 5)␤»
02:27 ab6tract interesting and bizarre :)
02:27 TimToady works with explicit return, anyway
02:27 TimToady so at least there's a workaround
02:27 ab6tract indeed!
02:27 diakopter m: sub f($x) { my $z; Nil while ++$z < $x }; say f(5)
02:27 camelia rakudo-moar 6471e8: OUTPUT«sub infix:«<» (Mu $?, Mu $?) { #`(Sub+{<anon|58275344>}|77085112) ... }␤»
02:28 diakopter ahh precedence
02:28 ab6tract i have to admit that most times i get into golfing bugs, it's for cases that may never be useful :)
02:28 TimToady well, that's just what happens to be sitting on the stack, I suspect
02:28 ab6tract TimToady: shall I rakudobug?
02:29 TimToady sure, we can decide if it's blocking later
02:29 TimToady prolly not though
02:29 diakopter m: sub f($x) { my $z; Nil while ++$z < $x }; say f(5)(4)
02:29 camelia rakudo-moar 6471e8: OUTPUT«True␤»
02:29 TimToady cute...that probably should not leak
02:30 diakopter the sub is returning a sub
02:30 TimToady kinda sorta by accident
02:31 TimToady I can think of a way to fix that, which might or might not be the best way
02:32 Su-Shee_ joined #perl6
02:32 AlexDaniel “Sent by the Internet” woo! Marketing!!
02:34 diakopter my signature is Sent by an Internet
02:34 ab6tract also, that's a super interesting thunk form! 'do $z while ++$z < $x'
02:34 ab6tract took me a minute to grok that
02:34 diakopter it's not supposed to be
02:34 shmibs joined #perl6
02:35 diakopter until TimToady makes it work out with a few hundred cavitations
02:35 diakopter excavitations
02:36 ab6tract diakopter: sorry, what?
02:36 diakopter don't mind my loose association drivel. but it's not supposed to be a thunk
02:37 ab6tract why is that not supposed to be a thunk?
02:38 diakopter bc t's the statement form of do
02:38 diakopter it's
02:38 TimToady testing a patch for that bit of it
02:38 TimToady well, compiling, then testing :)
02:39 diakopter it's supposed to mean the same as $z while ++$z < $x, except the do emphasizes the immediate evaluation??
02:40 TimToady do takes it out of statementlist context, which allows it to return a list value
02:40 ab6tract ah, ok i think i'm starting to get it..
02:40 TimToady at statementlist level it's always self-sinking
02:41 TimToady and should return Nil
02:41 TimToady patch dint werk, thinking
02:42 diakopter we need proofs, not tests or uncertain fixes <- this is my new(ish) lifelong refrain
02:47 TimToady could have something to do with botching the patch...
02:47 diakopter TIL that livestream lost my password to a hack, and Hyatt hotels lost my payment card to "all our payment computers had/have malware"
02:49 ilbot3 joined #perl6
02:49 Topic for #perl6 is now »ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | | evalbot usage: 'p6: say 3;' or rakudo:,  or /msg camelia p6: ... | irclog: or | UTF-8 is our friend!
02:49 ab6tract i read that as a thunk-ing version of do { $z } while ++$z < 5 ...
02:49 diakopter I actually suspect it's a parsing problem
02:50 diakopter (the error about ++ not accepting candidates)
02:50 ab6tract so i guess i'm still confused about why it's wrong, when thunking has been explained to be as auto-bracketing
02:50 ab6tract but i can wait for the Butterfly Book to fully grok statementlist ;)
02:51 * ab6tract is glad that no one is pushing the 'but camelia is actually a moth' position :)
02:51 krshn joined #perl6
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02:53 PoopyShoes joined #perl6
02:53 orange_ what's the latest news about Perl6
02:54 PoopyShoes m: "5".Rat.FatRat
02:54 camelia rakudo-moar 1e5c2a: ( no output )
02:54 PoopyShoes m: say "5".Rat.FatRat
02:54 camelia rakudo-moar 1e5c2a: OUTPUT«5␤»
02:54 PoopyShoes m: say "5".FatRat
02:54 camelia rakudo-moar 1e5c2a: OUTPUT«Method 'FatRat' not found for invocant of class 'Str'␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/VClNcqsU7r line 1␤␤»
02:54 TimToady the ++ problem is likely having to do with sneaking an extra scope in there
02:54 ab6tract TimToady: fwiw, the ++ issue doesn't happen locally with a rakudo i just built an hour ago..
02:55 PoopyShoes is the above a bug guys? Why do I have to .Rat my Str before I can fatten it?
02:56 PoopyShoes 's almost like some implicit conversion would be fun here....
02:56 skids orange_:
02:57 ab6tract PoopyShoes: looks like there is no coercion to FatRat implemented in Str
02:57 PoopyShoes ab6tract: looks precisely like that, I'm just wondering why I have to go round the houses here
02:57 ab6tract no reason for implicit anything... it's just a question of whether Str has a method FatRat { ... }
02:58 PoopyShoes Implicit something would belie baving to implement the coercion on a crossproduct basis, though...
02:58 PoopyShoes *baving == having
02:58 PoopyShoes IDK how rakudo works, sorry
02:59 PoopyShoes skids: Great.  Now I'm going to be reading blogs on perl6 for the next half hour. I hope you're happy.
03:00 PoopyShoes I am :)
03:01 skids have fun :-)
03:03 ab6tract PoopyShoes:
03:03 ab6tract it's a bit ramble-y but hopefully that will help get the hang of coercion in perl 6
03:04 ab6tract m: use MONKEY-TYPING; augment class Str { method FatRat { self.Rat.FatRat } }; say "5".FatRat
03:04 camelia rakudo-moar 1e5c2a: OUTPUT«5␤»
03:04 TimToady FatRats are a little dangerous, and contagious, so we try not to let people get them by accident, but maybe this is a valid coercion, since it's explicit
03:05 labster joined #perl6
03:05 thomax why are they dangerous?
03:05 TimToady m: say "5" + 0.FatRat
03:05 camelia rakudo-moar 1e5c2a: OUTPUT«5␤»
03:06 TimToady because they can slow down exponentially if you're not careful
03:06 thomax ok.
03:06 TimToady why we limit Rat denominators to 64 bits
03:06 diakopter I've always wondered why unmatched parens aren't okay
03:06 thomax i thought they could bite me in my..
03:07 TimToady they'll just bite your ankles, hang on, and slow you down
03:07 AlexDaniel TimToady: is it 64 bits on 32-bit system as well?
03:08 diakopter why not let them imply a matching one at the beginning/end of the input (or just after/before the last one of that spin)
03:08 TimToady yes
03:09 TimToady diakopter: redundancy is good
03:09 diakopter (say 55).say) # basically it eliminates any doubled/tripled parens ever
03:09 ab6tract diakopter: wow. auto-matching parens? even perl has never been so insane as to help out with that
03:09 thomax i hope p6 didn;t overdone the operator / syntax shuffle. << is now +<, ?: is now ??||, for is now loop, etc
03:10 ab6tract thomax: for is not loop, only the why-would-you-ever-use-it C version is
03:10 TimToady oh, we overdid it on purpose :)
03:10 diakopter say 55).say
03:11 diakopter I hate doubled up parens when the count can just be implied anyway
03:11 TimToady now, even there it's ambiguous
03:11 TimToady *no
03:11 uruwi The TI-83+ does that.
03:11 cxreg thomax: ??!! btw, not ??||
03:11 TimToady though the effect comes out the same in this case
03:12 diakopter why, just make it match as far back as possible
03:12 cygx thomax: I've actually started to like ?? !! better than ? :
03:12 thomax what does the book publisher think about the 6.c release?
03:12 cygx curse you, perl6 - now my Perl5 and C coding 'feels' wrong!
03:13 uruwi Well, someone could create a slang that autocloses parens.
03:13 diakopter autocloses and opens
03:13 ab6tract_ joined #perl6
03:14 diakopter but yes, it would admittedly be much easier to imagine such an implmentation in the Perl 6 grammar
03:14 uruwi Auto-opening... now even the TI-83+ doesn't do that!
03:15 skids braces too?
03:15 uruwi Probably
03:16 skids well then "as far back as possible" is always the beginning of the compunit.
03:16 diakopter or the previous opener
03:17 diakopter XD
03:18 * cxreg tries
03:19 TimToady testing new patch over dinner...well, not *over* dinner...
03:19 TimToady well, I guess the computer is upstairs to dinner, so maybe it is...
03:19 TimToady afk &
03:19 krshn joined #perl6
03:20 noganex_ joined #perl6
03:21 * thomax hopes that epic, the eclipse plugin, will release a epic6 soon
03:24 PoopyShoes Is there much scope for a FatRat with a particular precision? I'm thinking something like clojure's `(with-precision 10 (/ 1M 6))` --- which gives `0.1666666667M`
03:25 PoopyShoes I'm sure it's implementable _within_ the framework of perl6, but it might be frustratingly slow... oh I don't know, I'm going back to flam people who didn't like the new Star Wars
03:26 skids PoopyShoes: custom types are certainly possible, even MoarVM can be extended if someone wanted to go that deep.
03:26 krshn Are there any Perl6 related talks scheduled for the upcoming year that we can look forward to ?
03:26 thomax PoopyShoes: i don't know anything about the new star wars. but i think i could hate it.
03:26 PoopyShoes skids: It's beginning to sound like my family won't see much of me over Christmas. I'll explore that possibility. Ta
03:27 PoopyShoes thomax: You might, but only if you meant to
03:28 AlexDaniel krshn: what about watching existing ones? :)
03:32 krshn Finished most of them :-)
03:33 thomax junkie
03:34 krshn Now.. but need to start writing more code in perl6. For some reason, perl5 has become so second nature, and because I am lazy ;)
03:35 krshn Exaggerated when I said I saw most of them.. I saw a few of them but unless I actually coded more in perl6, I found it hard to follow may talks by jnthn for ex
03:36 PoopyShoes krshm: perl5 is crazy and if it is second nature to you you are a crazy person ;) But you should look at scala. I've been learning perl6 by translating little scripts from one to the other. They're almost perfect analogues until you start getting into their 'killer features'.
03:37 krshn but today, I have resolved to finish going through perl6intro
03:38 krshn I have hard a lot about Scala -- also finished seeing this video:
03:40 krshn But I have my heart set on perl6, esp. because I love perl so much.
03:40 PoopyShoes Yeah, I use scala every day, but I've already introduced one tiny text munging perl6 into the utils set, and want to add more :)
03:41 PoopyShoes they're very similar, though
03:41 PoopyShoes until you really need one or the other
03:41 dalek rakudo/nom: eea4cb0 | TimToady++ | src/ (2 files):
03:41 dalek rakudo/nom: more s/:/ line /
03:41 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
03:41 dalek rakudo/nom: e34842f | TimToady++ | src/Perl6/Actions.nqp:
03:41 dalek rakudo/nom: suppress accidental return of final loop
03:41 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
03:41 PoopyShoes hence using perl for text
03:41 krshn PoopyShoes: cool
03:42 thomax i just hope the industry will adopt p6, so that all the efforts in developing p6 will  be justified
03:42 PoopyShoes I fully intend to secretly use it on my machine as much as possible. When things need to be shared -- oh, sorry, you'll just have to get used to p6
03:42 krshn I somehow feel scientific computing will be perl6 calling card
03:43 AlexDaniel thomax: I don't really care about this one
03:43 PoopyShoes All the power of J, but not crap
03:43 AlexDaniel thomax: Perl 6 is already extremely useful to me
03:44 PoopyShoes AlexDaniel: What do you mainly use it for?
03:44 PoopyShoes Or is that blogged already
03:44 krshn atleast it is my secret wish ;-). then I can do away with coding in anything else
03:45 TimToady me too, though that's not so secret :)
03:45 PoopyShoes krshm: You'll need the performance wins before it becomes legit for those high-end tasks, though
03:45 krshn TimToady: lol
03:45 PoopyShoes I'm guestimating 2 years
03:46 AlexDaniel PoopyShoes: small projects, throw-away scripts, tests for C code that I'm writing (using NativeCall). Stuff like that
03:46 PoopyShoes Great for anything one off task that takes under a few minutes, though!
03:46 PoopyShoes huh
03:47 PoopyShoes AlexDaniel: never thought of writing tests _in_ it
03:47 PoopyShoes probably because I still suck at p6
03:47 AlexDaniel PoopyShoes: also whenever somebody asks me “how can I write code that does X” I just show them an example in Perl 6 and let them figure out how to do that in their language.
03:47 PoopyShoes but that's a thought right there
03:47 AlexDaniel PoopyShoes: it happens to be shorter than pseudo-code so…
03:48 PoopyShoes AlexDaniel: I was trying to do that a few days ago with the countdown code :) Ended up doing it in scala because of that bug I couldn't find
03:48 PoopyShoes (Yeah, sorry, haven't settled on a handle yet)
03:48 PoopyShoes (This is my second outing here and I'm drunk anyway)(
03:49 krshn PoopyShoes: today is my first :-).
03:49 PoopyShoes krshm: high five
03:49 PoopyShoes krshn: high five (with more accuracy)
03:49 krshn cheers
03:50 mspo I'd like to see something like erlang's ranch + cowboy start to show up
03:51 TimToady m: sub f($x) { my $z; while ++$z < $x { say "hi" } }; say f(5)
03:51 camelia rakudo-moar 1e5c2a: OUTPUT«hi␤hi␤hi␤hi␤sub infix:«<» (Mu $?, Mu $?) { #`(Sub+{<anon|63105296>}|47520344) ... }␤»
03:51 TimToady m: sub f($x) { my $z; while ++$z < $x { say "hi" } }; say f(5)
03:51 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«hi␤hi␤hi␤hi␤Nil␤»
03:51 TimToady better
03:51 TimToady now to see if I can do something about that ++ mess
03:52 krshn why does the REPL in perl6 suck so bad? even sqlite3 has better REPL
03:52 AlexDaniel m: my \pi = pi; say pi # by the way, what is happening here?
03:52 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«(Mu)␤»
03:52 TEttinger what's different between those two lines, TimToady?
03:52 TimToady it's better than perl5's, but that's not sayin' much
03:52 AlexDaniel krshn: have you tried linenoise?
03:52 TimToady TEttinger: nothing :)
03:52 TEttinger wow, last second bugfixes ftw
03:52 TimToady actually, if you look carefully, you'll see it's running a different version
03:53 TEttinger ah yeah
03:53 PoopyShoes AlexDaniel: I have the same complaint. What's linenoise?
03:53 TimToady and I know just about how long a recompile takes, which makes it easy to do before/after
03:53 TimToady it's a readline clone-ish
03:54 AlexDaniel PoopyShoes, krshn:
03:54 TimToady panda install Linenoise
03:54 TimToady or use rlwrap
03:54 TimToady I'm not sure any of them handles Unicode right, though
03:55 krshn I just did on mac on top of rakudo 2015.11. I use vim key bindings and non of them work
03:55 krshn when I try ctrl-p, it does not work
03:55 krshn sqlite3 handles them perfectly :-(
03:56 krshn I should probably try on my linux with latest perl6/moar/panda
03:56 PoopyShoes TimToady: IDK if this is inappropriate querying for IRC, but are you the real Larry Wall Timtowtd? Just, y'know, to confirm that this whole channel is a beautiful dream
03:57 krshn I was gushing like a teenager a little while back for the same reason :-)
03:57 cygx krshn: what about `rlwrap perl6`?
03:57 krshn cygx: i have not tried it yet
03:57 krshn will do now
03:58 TimToady PoopyShoes: I would shoot myself if I were not the real me.
04:00 AlexDaniel PoopyShoes: yes, we would shoot him if he is not real
04:02 mspo but how can you ever know which one is real?
04:03 TimToady well, usually they're all me
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04:03 PoopyShoes *swoons*
04:04 krshn cygx, TimToady: rlwarp is perfect. Thanks
04:05 krshn works perfectly with vim command line bindings
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04:08 PoopyShoes krshn: I tried to 'PM' you... did you get that? If you -- like me -- are using a browser, there may be an extra tab ?
04:09 PoopyShoes But, like, under the real tabs. IRC is too hardcore for me
04:10 AlexDaniel m: enum Animal (Cat => 2005, Dog => 3, Mouse => 25); my $x =, Dog, Mouse); say "{$x.year}-{$x.month}-{$}"
04:10 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«Cat-3-25␤»
04:10 joydong joined #perl6
04:10 AlexDaniel damn, on my machine that's Cat-Dog-Mouse
04:11 AlexDaniel but damn, that's very clever. Zefram++
04:11 cygx 'night o/
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04:21 cxreg if I accidentally declare class Foo when I've previously said "unit module Foo;" then Foo.can("bar") errors with Too many positionals passed; expected 2 arguments but got 3
04:22 cxreg could be more helpful
04:23 AlexDaniel cxreg: consider submitting rakudobug :)
04:24 cxreg not sure what the right thing would be?
04:24 cxreg disallowing the class Foo ?
04:24 cxreg fixing .can?
04:25 AlexDaniel cxreg: list a couple of possible solutions then :)
04:25 skids m: unit module Foo; class Foo { method bar { }}; Foo.can("bar").say
04:25 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«(bar)␤»
04:25 cxreg actually it happens for any "unit module".  will look at submitting
04:26 AlexDaniel m: unit module Foo; class Foo { }; Foo.can("bar").say
04:26 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«()␤»
04:27 cxreg ... ?  hrm.
04:27 skids what version rakudo?
04:28 AlexDaniel cxreg: yeah, I usually try the golfed down code on camelia just in case :)
04:28 cxreg 1e5c2a4
04:28 skids oh so pretty much bleeding edge.
04:29 cxreg just built it
04:29 cxreg camelia is 2 commits ahead
04:30 cxreg i'm gonna try scrapping all of brew, maybe i have something nasty
04:35 cxreg i wonder if github suports git repack.  the repos are getting painful to clone
04:47 [Coke] (bugfixes) those are ok, but they need passing tests in roast.
04:48 [Coke] and probably eyes from one other committer.
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04:56 [Coke] (star release) has anyone signed up to do the star release, or am I implicitly on the hook for that?
04:58 cxreg AlexDaniel: so it repros from file but not with -e
04:58 cxreg o.O
04:59 skids Hrm I can't repro from file.
05:00 cxreg
05:01 skids Oh  the .can from another compunit OK.
05:01 cxreg but it happens even if i remove the class
05:03 * [Coke] catchs up and sees he is not on the hook for R*.
05:04 cxreg skids: i discovered this trying to go through the exercism perl6 set
05:04 skids m: unit module Foo; Foo.can("bar").say
05:04 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«Too many positionals passed; expected 2 arguments but got 3␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/CZGBnLKJ1h line 1␤␤»
05:05 skids Which is probaby related to:
05:05 cxreg ah there we go
05:05 skids m: unit module Foo; Foo.HOW.WHAT.say;
05:05 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«(ModuleHOW)␤»
05:06 skids m: unit module Foo; Foo.HOW.WHAT.say; class Foo { }; Foo.HOW.WHAT.say;
05:06 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«(ModuleHOW)␤(ClassHOW)␤»
05:07 cxreg and the fact that that "shadowing" acts differently across compunits?  not sure if even doing so should be allowed
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05:13 skids cxreg: I think it is actually correct behavior, just an LTA error.
05:13 skids When you do "unit module Foo; class Foo { }" you are defining class Foo::Foo.
05:15 cxreg oh, and in the other unit (outside of that lexical scope) Foo is the module but inside it becomes the class?
05:15 cxreg ok that appears correct
05:16 skids Right, but a module should probably have a better response to .can and such than "not enough args"
05:17 cxreg hilariously, if you pass no args it says too few
05:17 skids m: unit module Foo; Foo.^find_method("can").candidates».signature.say
05:17 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«((Mu \SELF: $name, *%_))␤»
05:18 skids m: unit module Foo; Foo.can(Foo,"bar").say;
05:18 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«Too many positionals passed; expected 2 arguments but got 3␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/7oQB6CzE42 line 1␤␤»
05:24 skids Ah, it's because ^can a.k.a. ModuleHOW.can defaults back to Mu's .can, where HOW methods get passed HOW,obj,<args>
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05:24 skids But Mu's non-introspective form just wants obj,<args>
05:32 cxreg skids++
05:34 skids m: unit package Foo; Foo.can(Foo,"bar").say;
05:34 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«Too many positionals passed; expected 2 arguments but got 3␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/yJ8HQrnpRQ line 1␤␤»
05:35 skids m: Str(Any).can("foo")
05:35 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«Method 'can' not found for invocant of class 'Perl6::Metamodel::CoercionHOW'␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/mbrRcP_CwR line 1␤␤»
05:36 skids That does not inherit .can from Mu apparently
05:38 skids m: (subset Foo of Str).can("foo").say
05:38 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«Too many positionals passed; expected 2 arguments but got 3␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/cOaqEq0HCQ line 1␤␤»
05:44 [Coke] t/spec/S32-array/adverbs.t failing test 21 for anyone else?
05:44 [Coke] t/spec/S17-procasync/stress.t is dying.
05:46 [Coke] t/spec/S32-io/IO-Socket-Async.t also dying
05:46 [Coke] (even when run individually)
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05:57 skids [Coke] yesterday I remember adverbs fails on both array and hash IIRC
05:57 ugexe did ranguard take license into consideration for the distributions he chose to upload to pause? should a 3rd party upload another authors unlicensed work to pause?
05:58 ugexe s/unlicensed/no explicit license/
06:02 skids cxreg: RT#127018
06:03 skids # synopsenonbot
06:08 AlexDaniel .tell Skarsnik have you tried getting “timestamp”s from some table? Today I noticed that 「.allrows」 gives me “Any” instead of some meaningful timestamp
06:08 yoleaux AlexDaniel: I'll pass your message to Skarsnik.
06:10 AlexDaniel .tell Skarsnik that's on postgresql though
06:10 yoleaux AlexDaniel: I'll pass your message to Skarsnik.
06:10 autarch TimToady: I like your advent post
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06:13 tmw1 What's the best book for learning perl6 these days? Have a pretty good knowledge of 5, but not much OO experience
06:14 AlexDaniel tmw1: no good enough book yet, I'm afraid
06:15 AlexDaniel tmw1: though there are many other interesting resources
06:15 tmw1 that's a shame, I like a good book. What resources do you recommend?
06:15 AlexDaniel tmw1: like or rosettacode or
06:16 AlexDaniel tmw1: though that's not what you wanted, I think
06:16 tmw1 thanks
06:17 AlexDaniel tmw1: still, for example advent posts are very interesting to read and you learn about perl 6 itself
06:17 tmw1 yeah, I guess I'll have to take what I can get
06:17 regreg joined #perl6
06:18 AlexDaniel tmw1: and on doc.perl6 there is this section:
06:18 AlexDaniel tmw1: which is more structured, you might like it
06:18 tmw1 yeah, I think this will work, thanks
06:18 tmw1 maybe one day we'll get a new camel book
06:18 AlexDaniel sure!
06:20 AlexDaniel I think that there were attempts to write a book, but I don't think that those had any chance to succeed. Perl 6 was evolving quite fast before this Christmas, perhaps we will see less revolutionary changes next year, thus there will be a chance to write a book :)
06:20 tmw1 that makes sense
06:21 AlexDaniel another thing is that we don't know yet how idiomatic Perl 6 will look like
06:21 awwaiid tmw1: also, as you learn and find holes in, please file issues (or PRs). There are tons of holes, but having a TODO list is great
06:22 tmw1 will do!
06:23 AlexDaniel tmw1++
06:25 awwaiid I just discovered that `MAIN` isn't documented well on, for example, and so opened up an issue so I don't forget to do it
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06:32 AlexDaniel .tell Skarsnik Adding 「1114  => 'Str',   # timestamp」 to 「lib/DBDish/Pg/Native.pm6」 seems to solve the problem temporarily, but I don't think that it is right. Do you have any ideas how to make it better?
06:32 yoleaux AlexDaniel: I'll pass your message to Skarsnik.
06:32 cpage_ joined #perl6
06:37 AlexDaniel .tell Skarsnik ah… OK, I open a new issue:
06:37 yoleaux AlexDaniel: I'll pass your message to Skarsnik.
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06:54 [Tux] test             50000    23.661    23.549
06:54 [Tux] test-t           50000    13.903    13.791
06:54 [Tux] csv-parser       50000    50.787    50.675
07:05 [Tux];theater =>;oe=56DA2930
07:11 dalek doc/phasers: 243908a | (Brock Wilcox)++ | doc/Language/phasers.pod:
07:11 dalek doc/phasers: Further refinement of Phasers doc, maybe even useable
07:11 dalek doc/phasers: review:
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07:16 awwaiid Someone might have said this before, but I feel like a lot of reference docs should live more alongside roast. Maybe I'll someday look into at least doing cross-checks for doc coverage
07:23 dalek doc/phasers: 118835a | (Brock Wilcox)++ | doc/Language/phasers.pod:
07:23 dalek doc/phasers: Modify subtitle a bit
07:23 dalek doc/phasers: review:
07:25 krshn tmw1: Try I asked the same question earlier today and was referred to this one. I am going through it as we chat.
07:26 dalek doc: 26e5b69 | (Brock Wilcox)++ | Makefile:
07:26 dalek doc: Add make clean target based on gitignore
07:26 dalek doc: review:
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07:51 awwaiid Enough doc-ticket-smashing for tonight I guess.
07:51 * awwaiid is getting psyched
07:52 xtreak joined #perl6
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07:53 krshn perl6intro mentions 3 naming conventions. The Kebab case seems very interesting. Never seen it before.
07:53 xtreak Posted Larry's announcement to r/programming :)
07:55 AlexDaniel krshn: yeah, well. A lot of programming languages don't allow dashes, that's probably why
07:56 AlexDaniel m: my $what-about'quote'case = 5
07:56 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: ( no output )
07:56 hankache hello #perl6
07:56 * hankache looks for his glasses
07:56 krshn AlexDaniel: Is it very popular in perl6 community? I have not read much perl6 code yet.
07:56 AlexDaniel krshn: definitely not rare
07:56 hankache krshn yes kebab case is popular in Perl 6 community
08:00 Su-Shee good morning. when is official release hour? ;)
08:02 AlexDaniel Eh! Wrote an email to debian maintainer of “rakudo” package and received an answer “next week or so”. Well, better next week than next year, right?
08:03 AlexDaniel looking at the calendar… next week is also possibly next year :/
08:04 hankache AlexDaniel next week is next year :)
08:04 AlexDaniel hankache: only one half of it
08:05 krshn How does perl6 calcuate 3 ** 19999 ? perl gives inf
08:06 AlexDaniel krshn: well, Perl 6 has Rats
08:06 awwaiid very carefully
08:06 AlexDaniel krshn: instead of typical floating-point stuff
08:07 awwaiid m: say 3 ** 19999
08:07 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«8871011424058065973260672374154714571421010996467885015115710929898310137452945851304429162059393570233821582653516803167382678594922333243233401114450897594812655850097238851933466017741150968631087784907969243102046747080031512493303046916206444127860450…»
08:07 krshn Is there any promotion of types going on?
08:07 AlexDaniel m: (3¹⁹⁹⁹).chars.say
08:07 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«954␤»
08:07 AlexDaniel m: (3¹⁹⁹⁹⁹⁹⁹).chars.say
08:07 xtreak is not updated
08:07 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
08:08 AlexDaniel krshn: promotion of types? No, it's just that everything is a Rat
08:08 AlexDaniel m: (3¹⁹⁹⁹⁹).chars.say
08:08 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«9542␤»
08:08 awwaiid krshn: I don't know how many bits it is allowing in it's integer
08:08 AlexDaniel m: (3¹⁹⁹⁹⁹⁹).chars.say
08:08 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«95424␤»
08:08 AlexDaniel krshn: hmmm I'm actually telling the wrong thing
08:08 AlexDaniel krshn: if we are working with Int's then it's all about bigints
08:09 AlexDaniel krshn: that is, unlimited, at least in theory
08:09 AlexDaniel m: (3¹⁹⁹⁹⁹).WHAT.say
08:09 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«(Int)␤»
08:09 AlexDaniel m: (3.5¹⁹⁹⁹⁹).WHAT.say
08:09 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«(Num)␤»
08:09 AlexDaniel whoah!
08:09 AlexDaniel m: (3.5¹⁹⁹⁹⁹).say
08:09 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«Inf␤»
08:09 krshn So in the type hierarchy, BigInt is a Int
08:09 AlexDaniel m: (3.0¹⁹⁹⁹⁹).say
08:09 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«8871011424058065973260672374154714571421010996467885015115710929898310137452945851304429162059393570233821582653516803167382678594922333243233401114450897594812655850097238851933466017741150968631087784907969243102046747080031512493303046916206444127860450…»
08:10 AlexDaniel how come it silently changes it to Num?
08:10 krshn interesting
08:10 AlexDaniel krshn: no, it's just Int. That's how Ints work in perl6
08:11 AlexDaniel krshn: if you want something more dumb then you can use native ints like
08:11 AlexDaniel m: my int $x = 3; say $x¹⁹⁹⁹# let's see if it works
08:11 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«5826237505742172032199915397215535235096874958117295059372960039368954220757584964304954899548937036918696502320484255295904561452918362158381380673645461606243041266966590597938432094927735078397730475605014746864702967381668335492713119396419006351342018…»
08:11 AlexDaniel nope. Well…
08:11 awwaiid m: say (3.5 ** 19999).WHAT
08:11 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«(Num)␤»
08:12 awwaiid m: say (3.0 ** 19999).WHAT
08:12 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«(Rat)␤»
08:13 AlexDaniel m: say (3.5**63).WHAT
08:13 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«(Rat)␤»
08:13 AlexDaniel m: say (3.5**64).WHAT
08:13 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«(Num)␤»
08:13 krshn So a number is more constrained than a Int?
08:13 AlexDaniel krshn: yeah, it's just a normal floating point
08:14 krshn AlexDaniel: with 64 bits ?
08:15 krshn (or a fixed number of bits)?
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08:15 AlexDaniel krshn: “On most platforms, it's an IEEE 754 64-bit floating point numbers, aka "double precision".”
08:15 AlexDaniel krshn:
08:15 vv3 joined #perl6
08:16 krshn I really love perl6 -- it has got a Cool type .. How cool is that!
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08:16 AlexDaniel um, can anybody tell why 1.3⁶³ is a Num and not Rat?
08:16 awwaiid "To prevent the numerator and denominator from becoming pathologically large, the denominator is limited to 64 bit storage. On overflow of the denominator a Num (floating-point number) is returned instead."
08:17 AlexDaniel okay, right
08:17 awwaiid So says
08:17 AlexDaniel which means that we can use FatRat instead
08:17 vv3 joined #perl6
08:17 AlexDaniel m: say (3.5.FatRat ** 1999).WHAT
08:17 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«(FatRat)␤»
08:17 krshn awwaiid, AlexDaniel: thanks for the clarifications
08:17 * awwaiid hasn't heard of FatRat
08:17 AlexDaniel m: say (3.5.FatRat ** 1999)
08:17 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«3908594856673225867459754002670259373811400266845456460424451885859793567912033986871842169304143622039379408590343278414508064984527132097640557167925452623259893176422086544770930264581232866044354347181678427624685940688247646486393149784812532366264677…»
08:18 awwaiid m: (3.5.FatRat ** 1999).WHAT.say
08:18 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«(FatRat)␤»
08:18 awwaiid fancy
08:18 AlexDaniel awwaiid: I was aware of that but didn't expect the denominator to overflow
08:18 awwaiid yeah -- also interesting that it goes Rat -> Num instead of Rat -> FatRat
08:18 krshn say (3.5.FatRat ** 19999) is taking foreever on my computer
08:19 awwaiid krshn: maybe that's why it falls back to Num :)
08:19 AlexDaniel m: say (3.5.FatRat ** 19999).WHAT
08:19 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«(FatRat)␤»
08:19 AlexDaniel m: say (3.5.FatRat ** 199999)
08:19 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
08:20 AlexDaniel krshn: well, 19999 should not be a problem
08:20 AlexDaniel awwaiid: a good clue is that it turns into a Num when you do **64 and not when you do **63 :)
08:20 awwaiid def
08:21 krshn AlexDaniel: I finally got an answer
08:21 AlexDaniel how did I miss that. Okay, I'd better get some sleep
08:21 awwaiid me too
08:22 krshn awwaiid: nice one
08:22 krshn oh.. that was AlexDaniel
08:22 AlexDaniel awwaiid: that's not so interesting actually
08:22 AlexDaniel awwaiid: I think that it was decided that FatRat math is opt-in
08:23 AlexDaniel so that it does not blow up when you don't expect it to
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08:23 krshn AlexDaniel: makes sense
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08:24 sjn \o
08:25 sjn good *, #perl6, and merry x-mas :)
08:25 timotimo oh my. i merged that pull request for uri-escape even though people on the channel vetoed it
08:25 Su-Shee sjn: hey ;)
08:25 * sjn almost wrote merry z-mas, but I'm not sure we're quite at that stage yet :)
08:26 RabidGravy ah, Shell::Command is broken by
08:26 awwaiid ah timotimo, is that why random things are breaking like the doc build?
08:26 RabidGravy "sub cp($from as Str, $to as Str, :$r) "
08:26 RabidGravy hence, panda is broken
08:27 vv3 joined #perl6
08:28 AlexDaniel RabidGravy: just in time! :)
08:28 RabidGravy let's just test again
08:29 AlexDaniel RabidGravy: so according to the commit message it should be 「cp(Str() $from, Str() $to, :$r)」
08:29 AlexDaniel RabidGravy: as simple as that
08:29 RabidGravy yep
08:30 AlexDaniel ahhh it is fixed already
08:31 krshn AlexDaniel: keyboard seq for superscript?
08:31 vv3 joined #perl6
08:31 AlexDaniel krshn: depends.
08:31 AlexDaniel krshn: For example Compose, ^ 2 should give you ²
08:32 AlexDaniel krshn: I have a dead key for that though
08:32 RabidGravy AlexDaniel, just not in the version that panda bootstraps itself with
08:32 krshn AlexDaniel: REPL?
08:32 vv3 joined #perl6
08:32 AlexDaniel krshn: it's a keyboard layout feature, that's everywhere. Not sure if there is any special way to do that in your terminal though
08:32 timotimo i have a nice fix for uri escape now
08:33 vv3 joined #perl6
08:33 krshn AlexDaniel: got it
08:33 timotimo awwaiid: huh? i have no clue.
08:33 timotimo i mean, i have no idea what you're talking about; can you show a travis log or something?
08:33 AlexDaniel krshn: basically to use all the unicode stuff I highly recommend you to set your Compose Key to something
08:33 vv3 joined #perl6
08:34 AlexDaniel krshn: this way you can insert a lot of unicode stuff without changing your layout much
08:34 krshn Compose key equivalent on Mac?
08:34 krshn I already have setup my caps lock to esc
08:34 krshn (vi :-))
08:35 krshn I will come up with something
08:35 krshn so what is the idea here -- you set the compose key to what?
08:35 timotimo  -  check it!
08:35 timotimo isn't it a good improvement?
08:36 RabidGravy yes
08:36 Su-Shee krshn: if mac supports the iso standard, you can just input the codepoint with a keyboard shortcut you'd have to google. it's ctrl-u on linux.
08:36 Su-Shee krshn: no configuration necessary.
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08:37 stmuk
08:37 stmuk my slides will be updated and linked later
08:38 timotimo stmuk: awesome!
08:38 timotimo regretfully don't have time to watch stuff now, really
08:38 timotimo oh, how was the emperor's new programming language?
08:38 timotimo the abstract sounded somewhat like uninformed ranting and uselessness in general
08:39 stmuk its there so we can see (probably post xmas)
08:39 stmuk I think it was supposed to be more positive than the summary suggested
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08:39 AlexDaniel Su-Shee: Somehow I don't think that it is much easier to remember a bunch of numbers than to change your setup…
08:40 timotimo stmuk: well, at least the illusion to "the emperor's new clothes" is a pretty negative thing in my eyes
08:40 vv3 joined #perl6
08:40 Su-Shee krshn: oh you even get a nice menu: see macos.
08:41 timotimo ah well. i'd rather have a positive-ish talk than a terrible rant :)
08:41 vv3 joined #perl6
08:41 timotimo BBIAB
08:41 vv3 joined #perl6
08:42 krshn Su-Shee: Cmd+Ctrl+Space seems to be what I should be looking for
08:42 krshn Su-Shee: thanks for the link
08:43 BenGoldberg joined #perl6
08:43 Su-Shee krshn: it should work almost everywhere.
08:45 krshn Su-Shee: still not sure how to get superscripts
08:45 krshn still looking
08:47 timotimo i liked the TT post again this year :)
08:47 stmuk timotimo: yes I didn't attend that talk based on the summary
08:47 krshn what code should I be searching for for superscript?
08:47 timotimo better not to attend than to stand in the back row and "boo!" or hold up a sign ;)
08:48 Su-Shee krshn: some apps seem to use cmd ctrl + (and -)
08:48 timotimo m: (0 .. 0x10000).grep( *.uniname ~~ / SUPERSCRIPT / ).map( .chr.print )
08:48 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«WhateverCode object coerced to string (please use .gist or .perl to do that)  in block <unit> at /tmp/BYn92MvYzJ line 1␤Method 'chr' not found for invocant of class 'Any'␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/BYn92MvYzJ line 1␤␤»
08:48 timotimo i did that thing again!
08:48 timotimo m: (0 .. 0x10000).grep({ .uniname ~~ / SUPERSCRIPT / }).map( .chr.print )
08:48 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«Method 'chr' not found for invocant of class 'Any'␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/9RVo7btpVf line 1␤␤»
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08:49 timotimo m: (0 .. 0x10000).grep({ .uniname ~~ / SUPERSCRIPT / }).map( *.chr.print )
08:49 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«²³¹ٰܑ⁰ⁱ⁴⁵⁶⁷⁸⁹⁺⁻⁼⁽⁾ⁿﱛﱜﱝﱣﲐﳙ»
08:49 _nadim good morning
08:49 timotimo i did the other thing again, too!
08:49 timotimo i should have BBIAB'd when i wrote "BBIAB" on the channel ...
08:49 _nadim m: "abc123".=trans([0..9] => [<⁰ ¹ ² ³ ⁴ ⁵ ⁶ ⁷ ⁸ ⁹>])
08:49 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«Cannot modify an immutable Str␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/mTr52gGAU_ line 1␤␤»
08:50 timotimo m: say "abc123".trans([0..9] => [<⁰ ¹ ² ³ ⁴ ⁵ ⁶ ⁷ ⁸ ⁹>])
08:50 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«abc¹²³␤»
08:50 _nadim m: my $s = "abc123"; say $s.=trans([0..9] => [<⁰ ¹ ² ³ ⁴ ⁵ ⁶ ⁷ ⁸ ⁹>])
08:50 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«abc¹²³␤»
08:51 AlexDaniel ↑ which is faster than trying to do it by entering the hex code
08:51 Su-Shee so, when is official release? #perl tries to be ready to send people to you.
08:52 timotimo AlexDaniel: but how do you get the contents of that list without entering the hex code? :)
08:52 AlexDaniel timotimo: google it
08:52 krshn timotimo: thanks
08:52 _nadim the code above seems to be a resource hog and I mean HOG, I put it in a loop and I watch my program become a sloth
08:53 timotimo Su-Shee: well, the current release is mostly about the language becoming stable and us devs committing to not break stuff a lot any more. there'll be a rakudo-star release to go with it soon (though i don't actually know how soon. tomorrow? the day after tomorrow?)
08:53 timotimo _nadim: is the "my $s = ..." inside the loop or outside?
08:54 nine .tell TimToady That must be the lovliest announcement I've ever read.
08:54 yoleaux nine: I'll pass your message to TimToady.
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08:55 Su-Shee timotimo: are you telling me that after all the public announcement about a real release on christmas there won't be one on.. christmas? ;)
08:55 _nadim timotimo: inside of course :) but that called, say, 30 times.
08:56 _nadim run time went from 1 second to 3.5 secs
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08:57 timotimo Su-Shee: i don't know much about the christmas release, actually
08:57 Su-Shee who does?
08:57 krshn m: say "abc678".trans([6..9] => [<⁶⁷⁸⁹>])
08:57 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«abc⁶⁷⁸⁹⁶⁷⁸⁹⁶⁷⁸⁹␤»
08:58 AlexDaniel m: say "abc678".trans([6..9] => [‘⁶’..‘⁹’])
08:58 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«abc⁶⁷⁸␤»
08:58 krshn oh. shace
08:58 krshn <space>
08:58 AlexDaniel though the range thing is not going to work from ¹ to ⁹
08:58 _nadim timotimo: this on the other hand is faster  $subscript_level = "$level".comb(/./).map: { <⁰ ¹ ² ³ ⁴ ⁵ ⁶ ⁷ ⁸ ⁹>[$_]} ;
08:58 krshn say "abc678".trans([6..9] => [<⁶ ⁷ ⁸ ⁹>])
08:58 krshn m: say "abc678".trans([6..9] => [<⁶ ⁷ ⁸ ⁹>])
08:58 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«abc⁶⁷⁸␤»
08:58 timotimo please don't comb(/./). either .comb() or .comb(1)
08:59 * RabidGravy starts on the 29 modules that probably all need fixubg
08:59 timotimo fixbug?
08:59 AlexDaniel m: say "abc678".trans([6..9] => ‘¹²³⁴⁵⁶⁷⁸⁹⁰’.comb)
08:59 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«abc¹²³␤»
08:59 * timotimo BBIAB, for real this tim
08:59 AlexDaniel m: say "abc678".trans([0..9] => ‘⁰¹²³⁴⁵⁶⁷⁸⁹’.comb)
08:59 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«abc⁶⁷⁸␤»
08:59 AlexDaniel why [] by the way
08:59 _nadim timotimo: old remains, it was combing more complicated stuff :)
08:59 RabidGravy it's getting off to a bad start as LibraryCheck needs a change for the dll version thing
08:59 AlexDaniel m: say "abc678".trans(0..9 => ‘⁰¹²³⁴⁵⁶⁷⁸⁹’.comb)
08:59 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«abc⁶⁷⁸␤»
09:00 nine Su-Shee: we've done software releases for years. All that was missing was a promise of backwards compatibility. We at least try to give it now :)
09:02 Su-Shee I know. I'm waiting since 2002. I already had pugs. I just need a rough time so people who are coming to #perl aren't left hanging.
09:02 AlexDaniel hanging what. Just tell them to get rakudo and be happy :)
09:02 Su-Shee and people expect something today or tomorrow.
09:03 nine I think the plan is to create the release packages today and announce them tomorrow.
09:03 aigan_ perl6 --version
09:04 aigan_ ... expecting 6.0
09:04 nine aigan_: the release is called 6.c
09:04 stmuk Su-Shee: my guess is its Xmas EST sometime
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09:05 Su-Shee stmuk: ok. well that leaves it all to the estians.
09:05 nine Those yanks think christmas is on the 25th ;)
09:06 domidumont joined #perl6
09:06 AlexDaniel m: say $*PERL
09:06 camelia rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«Perl 6 (6.c)␤»
09:07 stmuk oddly the British Royal Family exchange presents on the 24th .. almost as if they were once German!
09:07 Su-Shee yeah well I just want to be able to send people over and not let them sit around waiting. ;)
09:09 Ben_Goldberg joined #perl6
09:09 aigan_ I guess this was the release then:
09:10 Su-Shee ok then we'll just wait for the announcement to go with it.
09:10 pierre-vigier joined #perl6
09:10 AlexDaniel aigan_: well not really:
09:10 stmuk aigan_: more steps needed than that
09:10 aigan_
09:13 stmuk oh my VLC icon has a Xmas hat! I forgot it did that
09:13 RabidGravy before I start fixing these modules, there aren't going to be any changes to nativecall before 6.c now are there?
09:14 Su-Shee yeah I read that but I didn't see a download link?
09:15 diakopter no, release hasn't occurred; see [Coke]
09:16 stmuk RabidGravy: perl 6 isn't the sort of thing to rush in last minute changes .. or is it ;)
09:17 Su-Shee diakopter: I'll wait then.
09:19 RabidGravy well that's the first
09:19 RabidGravy 28 more to do
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09:30 nine RabidGravy: you're safe from me ;(
09:30 nine ;)
09:33 timotimo wait wait wait ... christmas presents aren't always distributed on the 24th?!
09:33 timotimo are you saying my whole life has been a lie!?
09:35 dalek roast: 7e5f5db | lizmat++ | S32-temporal/Date.t:
09:35 dalek roast: Test for RT #127010
09:35 dalek roast: review:
09:35 brrt joined #perl6
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09:36 brrt cheers #perl6
09:36 dalek rakudo/nom: fb475d2 | lizmat++ | src/core/Date (2 files):
09:36 dalek rakudo/nom: Fix for RT #127010
09:36 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
09:38 st_iron joined #perl6
09:38 st_iron hello
09:41 LLamaRider joined #perl6
09:41 st_iron Merry Christmas My Friends!!!
09:43 timotimo hello :)
09:44 st_iron good morning timotimo
09:45 timotimo now this is surprising: today's advent calendar post already has more views and visitors than yesterday's. i wonder why that is!!
09:45 xtreak I posted it to reddit r/programming
09:45 brrt it's been on hn, too
09:45 brrt although not very popular
09:46 timotimo reddit has a significant lead over hn in the referrers
09:46 timotimo with reddit at 163 views, twitter at 121 and hacker news at 97
09:48 xtreak Is there a version bump on github or something when the release happens?
09:48 timotimo well, rakudo already generates "6.c" as the version
09:49 RabidGravy nine++ # that's good enough for me
09:49 el_amigo joined #perl6
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09:51 el_amigo hmm
09:51 el_amigo I fell out
09:51 el_amigo it is my alternate nick
09:52 st_iron way better
09:55 dalek doc: 4ee960f | labster++ | doc/Type/DateTime.pod:
09:55 dalek doc: document laxness, as brought up in RT #127002
09:55 dalek doc: review:
09:55 timotimo breakfast and celebration and family time! \o/
09:56 FROGGS \o/
09:56 nine Ah, time for the only christmas song I like:
09:57 st_iron \o/
09:58 krshn nine: thanks for sharing
10:02 Begi joined #perl6
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10:09 xtreak How can I profile my programs in perl6. Is there a flag that I can pass?
10:10 RabidGravy --profie
10:10 jdv79 can anyone install DBIish?
10:10 RabidGravy --profile even
10:11 jdv79 so I can install Task::Star sans DBIish, LWP::Simple and JSON::RPC.  also had to use my fork of URI for the pack exper thing.
10:11 RabidGravy let me guess, the nativecall part needs updating
10:12 RabidGravy I think timotimo removed the pack from URI just now
10:12 jdv79 just saw that
10:12 RabidGravy LWP::Simple is broken and there is a PR someone reported earlier
10:12 RabidGravy dunno JSON::RPC
10:13 jdv79 that had a dep on LWP is all i know
10:13 znpy joined #perl6
10:13 jdv79 why stuff like that is in task star is beyond me
10:14 RabidGravy I think it was the best there was when Task::Star was made
10:14 jdv79 but people seem to want to install star
10:14 RabidGravy I'm going to make a Task::Audio and a Task::Author later
10:15 jdv79 best for what? i thought star was about gen purpose non-core type stuff
10:15 jdv79 HTTP::Status?
10:15 RabidGravy anyway off out to get Mrs Gravy's  present
10:15 RabidGravy ttfn
10:16 pierre-vigier joined #perl6
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10:35 st_iron christmas lunch is done
10:35 st_iron family is done
10:35 st_iron what else? yeah the christmas tree
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10:53 dalek DBIish: cd85faf | (Sylvain Colinet)++ | lib/DBDish/ (2 files):
10:53 dalek DBIish: Added API version for sqlite/pg binding
10:53 dalek DBIish: review:
10:53 dalek DBIish: 32a0164 | (Sylvain Colinet)++ | lib/DBDish/ (3 files):
10:53 dalek DBIish: Fix lib name for Pg/mysql/sqlite
10:53 dalek DBIish: review:
10:53 dalek DBIish: 938cac8 | Skarsnik++ | lib/DBDish/ (3 files):
10:53 dalek DBIish: Merge pull request #40 from Skarsnik/master
10:53 dalek DBIish:
10:53 dalek DBIish: Added API version for sqlite/pg binding [Don't merge yet]
10:53 dalek DBIish: review:
10:54 AlexDaniel [Don't merge yet] – Merged! ✓
10:55 nebuchadnezzar m: my $double = -> $x { return $x * 2 }
10:55 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: ( no output )
10:55 nebuchadnezzar m: my $double = -> $x { return $x * 2 }; $double(2)
10:55 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«Attempt to return outside of any Routine␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/ZfNu9lrLSX line 1␤␤»
10:55 nebuchadnezzar could it be caught at compile time?
10:55 AlexDaniel m: my $double = -> $x { $x * 2 }; $double(2)
10:55 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: ( no output )
10:55 AlexDaniel m: my $double = -> $x { $x * 2 }; say $double(2)
10:55 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«4␤»
10:56 nebuchadnezzar AlexDaniel: yes, I'm reading so I saw the note about return in a pointy block
10:56 nebuchadnezzar but I just wonder why it's caught at runtime and not at compile time
10:57 AlexDaniel oh, let's see
10:57 AlexDaniel m: my $double = -> $x { $x * 2 }; sub foo { say $double(2); say ‘test’ }; foo
10:57 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«4␤test␤»
10:57 AlexDaniel m: my $double = -> $x { return $x * 2 }; sub foo { say $double(2); say ‘test’ }; foo
10:57 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«Attempt to return outside of any Routine␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/nLYuurvfu5 line 1␤␤»
10:57 AlexDaniel no idea
10:58 AlexDaniel m: sub foo { my $double = -> $x { return $x * 2 }; say $double(2); say ‘test’ }; foo
10:58 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: ( no output )
10:59 AlexDaniel m: sub foo { my $double = -> $x { return $x * 2 }; say $double(2); say ‘test’ }; say foo
10:59 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«4␤»
10:59 AlexDaniel nebuchadnezzar: there we go
10:59 BenGoldberg_ joined #perl6
10:59 AlexDaniel m: sub foo { my $double = -> $x { return $x * 2 }; return $double }; say foo()()
10:59 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«Too few positionals passed; expected 1 argument but got 0␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/iwJFSki4Vi line 1␤␤»
10:59 AlexDaniel m: sub foo { my $double = -> $x { return $x * 2 }; return $double }; say foo()(2)
10:59 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«Attempt to return outside of any Routine␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/X0kjqA7__k line 1␤␤»
11:00 user1 left #perl6
11:00 nebuchadnezzar ok, the return in the pointy block returns from the outer sub
11:00 AlexDaniel nebuchadnezzar: yea… it's so weird
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11:07 BenGoldberg_ m: my $double = -> $x { leave($x * 2) }; say $double(2)
11:07 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«leave not yet implemented. Sorry. ␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/Hfl85w9g2c line 1␤␤»
11:19 hankache m: say (0, { $_ + 2 } ... 10);
11:19 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«(0 2 4 6 8 10)␤»
11:19 hankache m: say (0, { $_ + 3 } ... 10);
11:19 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«(0 3 6 9 12 15 18 21 24 27 30 33 36 39 42 45 48 51 54 57 60 63 66 69 72 75 78 81 84 87 90 93 96 99 102 105 108 111 114 117 120 123 126 129 132 135 138 141 144 147 150 153 156 159 162 165 168 171 174 177 180 183 186 189 192 195 198 201 204 207 210 213 216 2…»
11:20 hankache why? ^^
11:21 hankache why is it jumping after 10? weird thing is if you replace 10 with 9 or 12 it works fine
11:21 hankache is this a bug or normal behavior??
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11:23 mre m: say (0, {$_ + 3} ... 9)
11:23 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«(0 3 6 9)␤»
11:23 mre m: say (0, {$_ + 3} ... 10)
11:23 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«(0 3 6 9 12 15 18 21 24 27 30 33 36 39 42 45 48 51 54 57 60 63 66 69 72 75 78 81 84 87 90 93 96 99 102 105 108 111 114 117 120 123 126 129 132 135 138 141 144 147 150 153 156 159 162 165 168 171 174 177 180 183 186 189 192 195 198 201 204 207 210 213 216 2…»
11:23 mre m: say (0, {$_ + 3} ... 11)
11:23 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«(0 3 6 9 12 15 18 21 24 27 30 33 36 39 42 45 48 51 54 57 60 63 66 69 72 75 78 81 84 87 90 93 96 99 102 105 108 111 114 117 120 123 126 129 132 135 138 141 144 147 150 153 156 159 162 165 168 171 174 177 180 183 186 189 192 195 198 201 204 207 210 213 216 2…»
11:23 mre m: say (0, {$_ + 3} ... 12)
11:23 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«(0 3 6 9 12)␤»
11:23 mre m: say (0, {$_ + 3} ... 13)
11:23 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«(0 3 6 9 12 15 18 21 24 27 30 33 36 39 42 45 48 51 54 57 60 63 66 69 72 75 78 81 84 87 90 93 96 99 102 105 108 111 114 117 120 123 126 129 132 135 138 141 144 147 150 153 156 159 162 165 168 171 174 177 180 183 186 189 192 195 198 201 204 207 210 213 216 2…»
11:23 mre m: say (0, {$_ + 3} ... 13)
11:23 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«(0 3 6 9 12 15 18 21 24 27 30 33 36 39 42 45 48 51 54 57 60 63 66 69 72 75 78 81 84 87 90 93 96 99 102 105 108 111 114 117 120 123 126 129 132 135 138 141 144 147 150 153 156 159 162 165 168 171 174 177 180 183 186 189 192 195 198 201 204 207 210 213 216 2…»
11:23 mre m: say (0, {$_ + 3} ... 14)
11:23 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«(0 3 6 9 12 15 18 21 24 27 30 33 36 39 42 45 48 51 54 57 60 63 66 69 72 75 78 81 84 87 90 93 96 99 102 105 108 111 114 117 120 123 126 129 132 135 138 141 144 147 150 153 156 159 162 165 168 171 174 177 180 183 186 189 192 195 198 201 204 207 210 213 216 2…»
11:24 mre hankache: that doesn't appear to be doing what I expected. It seems if the lhs of the range is a result of the $_ + 3 then it stops there
11:24 hankache m: say (0,3 ... 10);
11:24 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«(0 3 6 9)␤»
11:24 hankache mre whenever we use a custom generator enclosed in {}, the endpoint seems to be skipped
11:24 timotimo if you put a code object in there, all bets are off
11:25 timotimo we don't intends on trying to solve the halting problem for you
11:25 hankache timotimo is this by design?
11:25 hankache or just a bug?
11:25 timotimo so just use * > 10
11:25 timotimo by design
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11:26 hankache m: say (0, { $_ + 3 } ... * <10);
11:26 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«(0)␤»
11:26 timotimo there are series that are not monotonic
11:26 timotimo other way around
11:26 hankache m: say (0, { $_ + 3 } ... * > 10);
11:26 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«(0 3 6 9 12)␤»
11:26 timotimo and you can exclude the final value by using ...^
11:27 mre m: say (0, { $_ + 3 } ... ^ * > 10
11:27 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/f9KYjLsWK0␤Unable to parse expression in parenthesized expression; couldn't find final ')' ␤at /tmp/f9KYjLsWK0:1␤------> 3say (0, { $_ + 3 } ... ^ * > 107⏏5<EOL>␤    expecting any of:␤        st…»
11:27 mre m: say (0, { $_ + 3 } ... ^ * > 10)
11:27 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«(0 3 6 9 12)␤»
11:27 hankache but timotimo if one works why would the other not?
11:28 okazu joined #perl6
11:28 * hankache knows nothing about how hard it is.
11:31 mre hankache: I believe that: In you ... 10 example there is now halt point. Its says "keep adding 3 until the result is 10" which is never true. It works for 12 as that is true.
11:32 mre changing it to "unitl the result is greater than 10" makes it halt correctly
11:32 kjs_ joined #perl6
11:32 hankache mre indeed
11:33 dalek rakudo/nom: 888ecd8 | lizmat++ | src/core/
11:33 dalek rakudo/nom: Add max day check for moving years as well
11:33 dalek rakudo/nom:
11:33 dalek rakudo/nom:"2016-02-29T00:00:00").later(:1year)
11:33 dalek rakudo/nom:
11:33 dalek rakudo/nom: now works and gives
11:33 dalek rakudo/nom:
11:33 dalek rakudo/nom:   "2017-02-28T00:00:00Z"
11:33 dalek rakudo/nom:
11:33 dalek rakudo/nom: just like
11:33 dalek rakudo/nom:
11:33 dalek rakudo/nom:"2017-01-31T00:00:00").later(:1month)
11:34 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
11:34 hankache what i was saying is that the average user will expect  ... 10 to behave like ... * > 10
11:34 mre timotimo: t/01-sanity/55-use-trace.t is failing for me on latest nom. Seems that the line number output has changed from $filename:$line to $filename line $line. Should I change the test to match the new output
11:35 hankache so why not *magically* make one equivalent to the other
11:35 hankache not that i know how.
11:35 mre hankache: I am not sure thats true. I was actually expecting ... 10 to be xx 10. Then when I realised what it was doing the ... * == 10 made sense
11:36 dalek roast: 70cca29 | lizmat++ | S32-temporal/DateTime.t:
11:36 dalek roast: Add test for problem fixed with 888ecd85e63a3c1ed
11:36 dalek roast: review:
11:37 hankache well anyway i guess it's a matter of perspective. I have no issue using *>10
11:38 mre TimToady: timotimo: The above seems to be as a result of TimToady's change yesterday eea4cb0ad0
11:38 mre hankache: it seems to be better to be explicit about what halts the loop in this case
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11:40 hankache m: say (0,3 ... 10);
11:40 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«(0 3 6 9)␤»
11:40 mre TimToady: timotimo: Have fixed the test. Just checking everything passes now.
11:40 hankache mre what confuses me is why then this ^^ halts?
11:41 ZoffixWin TBH, this makes me think the "be explicit in ... end point" will become the recommended practice, simply because real-world examples would likely be something you can't be arsed calculating whether or not it'll halt on your end point
11:41 mre hankache: I suspect that uses p6's cunning range generation logic. whereas if you use a code block it can't
11:42 ZoffixWin Are there any usecases where making it halt if * > $end-point when lone $end-point is specified NOT what the user would've wanted?
11:42 Skarsnik Hey ZoffixWin, can you merge my PR in xml, so it can install? x)
11:42 yoleaux 06:08Z <AlexDaniel> Skarsnik: have you tried getting “timestamp”s from some table? Today I noticed that 「.allrows」 gives me “Any” instead of some meaningful timestamp
11:42 yoleaux 06:10Z <AlexDaniel> Skarsnik: that's on postgresql though
11:42 yoleaux 06:32Z <AlexDaniel> Skarsnik: Adding 「1114  => 'Str',   # timestamp」 to 「lib/DBDish/Pg/Native.pm6」 seems to solve the problem temporarily, but I don't think that it is right. Do you have any ideas how to make it better?
11:42 yoleaux 06:37Z <AlexDaniel> Skarsnik: ah… OK, I open a new issue:
11:42 hankache ZoffixWin i don;t
11:42 ZoffixWin Skarsnik: xml? You might got the wrong person :P
11:42 Skarsnik and Hello there
11:43 hankache ZoffixWin i don't think so
11:43 hankache * > end-point should work properly
11:43 Skarsnik hm, I probably dreamed seeing merge on of my pr in it x)
11:45 mre hankache: I think that is a req that would need to be dealt with by one of the architects. Unless you can find a spec that says otherwise.
11:45 ZoffixWin This behaviour is especially pernicious, since there ARE conditions when it'll halt as expected (at least by me).
11:46 mre ZoffixWin: it seems that it will halt in a "* == $endpoint" situation
11:46 ZoffixWin m: say (0,3 ... 10);
11:46 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«(0 3 6 9)␤»
11:46 lizmat masak moritz is there a reason why "daycount" is not documented?  Is it supposed to be an implementation detail of Dateish and friends?
11:46 Skarsnik someone know how the str (not Str) type is encoded?
11:46 ZoffixWin m: say (0,{ 3+0} ... 10);
11:46 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«(0 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 3 ...)␤»
11:46 ZoffixWin m: say (0,{ *+3} ... 10);
11:46 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/FJHQApzxqO␤Malformed double closure; WhateverCode is already a closure without curlies, so either remove the curlies or use valid parameter syntax instead of *␤at /tmp/FJHQApzxqO:1␤------> 3say (0,{ *+3}…»
11:47 ZoffixWin At this point changing it would have to be left until next language release, so we have plenty of time to think about it :P
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11:47 ZoffixWin m: say 0, *+ 3 ... 10
11:47 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«(0 3 6 9 12 15 18 21 24 27 30 33 36 39 42 45 48 51 54 57 60 63 66 69 72 75 78 81 84 87 90 93 96 99 102 105 108 111 114 117 120 123 126 129 132 135 138 141 144 147 150 153 156 159 162 165 168 171 174 177 180 183 186 189 192 195 198 201 204 207 210 213 216 2…»
11:47 hankache i don't mind * > endpoint. What i propose it to make it behave the same way in both cases. Either ... end point works everywhere or doesn't
11:47 ZoffixWin m: say (0,3 ... 10);
11:47 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«(0 3 6 9)␤»
11:48 ZoffixWin ^ that is a problem in my eyes
11:48 ZoffixWin And...I'm late for my bus >_<
11:48 ZoffixWin \o
11:49 hankache m: say (0, { $_ + 3 } ... * > 10)
11:49 camelia rakudo-moar fb475d: OUTPUT«(0 3 6 9 12)␤»
11:49 hankache why does it stop at 12 not 9?
11:50 hankache is this also by design?
11:51 mre hankache: because ! 9 > 10
11:51 mre so it halts at the first number after 10
11:51 hankache m: say (0, { $_ + 3 } ... * > ^10)
11:51 camelia rakudo-moar 888ecd: OUTPUT«(0 3 6 9 12)␤»
11:51 hankache m: say (0, { $_ + 3 } ... ^* > 10)
11:51 camelia rakudo-moar 888ecd: OUTPUT«(0 3 6 9 12)␤»
11:51 mre that I am not sure about
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11:52 hankache mre is there a way to tell it to stop before 10?
11:52 mre the ^ * > 10 should I believe do that. Don't know why it isn't
11:52 hankache m: say (0, { $_ + 3 } ... ^Inf > 10)
11:52 camelia rakudo-moar 888ecd: OUTPUT«(0)␤»
11:53 hankache :(
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11:54 mre m: say (0, * + 3 ... ^ * > 10)
11:55 camelia rakudo-moar 888ecd: OUTPUT«(0 3 6 9 12)␤»
11:55 ZoffixWin You havta put the ^ as part of the ... operator, otherwise (I think) it's interpreted as a junction
11:55 ZoffixWin m: say (0, { $_ + 3 } ...^ * > 10)
11:55 camelia rakudo-moar 888ecd: OUTPUT«(0 3 6 9)␤»
11:55 mre m: say (0, * + 3 ...^ * > 10)
11:55 camelia rakudo-moar 888ecd: OUTPUT«(0 3 6 9)␤»
11:55 mre ZoffixWin++ aha
11:55 hankache mre ZoffixWin thanks
11:55 mre m: say (0, * + 3 ..^ * > 10)
11:55 camelia rakudo-moar 888ecd: OUTPUT«(0␤»
11:55 mre m: say (0, * + 3 ...^ * > 10)
11:55 camelia rakudo-moar 888ecd: OUTPUT«(0 3 6 9)␤»
11:56 mre ($work laptop)-- # Killed by running make spectest
11:56 dalek DBIish: 39f65b8 | (Sylvain Colinet)++ | / (3 files):
11:56 dalek DBIish: Should fix pg for timestamp and other missing type
11:56 dalek DBIish: review:
11:56 dalek DBIish: 6109493 | Skarsnik++ | / (3 files):
11:56 dalek DBIish: Merge pull request #42 from Skarsnik/master
11:56 dalek DBIish:
11:56 dalek DBIish: Should fix pg for timestamp and other missing type
11:56 dalek DBIish: review:
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11:59 lucasb stmuk++ for sharing the youtube link of LPW talks
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12:02 dalek rakudo/nom: 2ef8881 | lizmat++ | src/core/
12:02 dalek rakudo/nom: Add max day check for Date.later as well
12:02 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
12:03 dalek roast: b54c7b9 | lizmat++ | S32-temporal/Date.t:
12:03 dalek roast: Add test for problem fixed in 2ef8881e9e4b1a401
12:03 dalek roast: review:
12:05 dalek doc: a3d9a03 | lizmat++ | doc/Type/Date.pod:
12:05 dalek doc: Verify correctness of documented Date methods
12:05 dalek doc: review:
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12:09 lucasb m: while $++ < 5 { FIRST { 42 } }
12:09 camelia rakudo-moar 888ecd: OUTPUT«[DISLOCATED MESSAGE] Useless use of LOOP_BLOCK_1 symbol in sink context␤»
12:10 lucasb ^^ just to show the dislocated message so that it can be fixed later
12:11 vv3 joined #perl6
12:12 andreoss .seen masak
12:12 yoleaux I saw masak 22 Dec 2015 23:21Z in #perl6: <masak> 'night, #perl6
12:13 El_Che -a
12:15 vv3 joined #perl6
12:15 lizmat m: loop { FIRST last }
12:15 camelia rakudo-moar 2ef888: OUTPUT«[DISLOCATED MESSAGE] Useless use of LOOP_BLOCK_1 symbol in sink context␤»
12:16 vv3 joined #perl6
12:16 lizmat golfed ^^^
12:16 dalek DBIish: 1e86465 | (Sylvain Colinet)++ | lib/DBDish/Role/StatementHandle.pm6:
12:16 dalek DBIish: Remove fetch_typedhash/fetch_alltypedhash, there were already marked as DEPRECATED
12:16 dalek DBIish: review:
12:16 dalek DBIish: 19c6a1e | (Sylvain Colinet)++ | lib/DBDish/Role/StatementHandle.pm6:
12:16 dalek DBIish: forget to remove something
12:16 dalek DBIish: review:
12:16 dalek DBIish: b6a92ad | Skarsnik++ | lib/DBDish/Role/StatementHandle.pm6:
12:16 dalek DBIish: Merge pull request #43 from Skarsnik/master
12:16 dalek DBIish:
12:16 dalek DBIish: Remove fetch_typedhash/fetch_alltypedhash, there were DEPRECATED
12:16 dalek DBIish: review:
12:16 vv3 joined #perl6
12:16 Skarsnik PR are quite noisy x)
12:17 vv3 joined #perl6
12:17 mre lizmat: is that issue just caused by using FIRST in a void context loop?
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12:18 lizmat m: my $a = loop { FIRST last }
12:18 camelia rakudo-moar 2ef888: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/G_1SVpm7ig␤Undeclared routine:␤    loop used at line 1␤␤»
12:19 lizmat m: my $a = do loop { FIRST last }
12:19 camelia rakudo-moar 2ef888: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Cannot find method 'CURSOR'␤»
12:19 lizmat mre: not sure
12:19 mre lizmat: could that be related to the fix for UNDO in while loops that was done the other day?
12:20 mre lizmat: I am happy to write a test for it if you want.
12:20 mre (when I understand what the expected result should be)
12:20 lizmat tests are always good (well, generally :-)
12:20 lizmat well, that's the problem, I'm not sure
12:20 mre lizmat: (on that can you merge a pull request fixing a rakudo test)
12:22 lizmat afk for a bit
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12:33 El_Che I see the metamodel has an add_method and add_private_method method. It there something to replace a private method (e.g. for mocking a method doing external connections). I guess I could test a sub class for that
12:33 timotimo mre, i think you were creating a range with ^*
12:36 timotimo m: (1..10).map( ^* ).map(*.say)
12:36 camelia rakudo-moar 2ef888: OUTPUT«^1␤^2␤^3␤^4␤^5␤^6␤^7␤^8␤^9␤^10␤»
12:36 timotimo m: (1..10).map( ^* ).map(*.list.say)
12:36 camelia rakudo-moar 2ef888: OUTPUT«(0)␤(0 1)␤(0 1 2)␤(0 1 2 3)␤(0 1 2 3 4)␤(0 1 2 3 4 5)␤(0 1 2 3 4 5 6)␤(0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7)␤(0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8)␤(0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9)␤»
12:36 timotimo m: (1..10).map( ^* ).map({ $_.list.say; say $_ > 10 })
12:36 camelia rakudo-moar 2ef888: OUTPUT«(0)␤False␤(0 1)␤False␤(0 1 2)␤False␤(0 1 2 3)␤False␤(0 1 2 3 4)␤False␤(0 1 2 3 4 5)␤False␤(0 1 2 3 4 5 6)␤False␤(0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7)␤False␤(0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8)␤False␤(0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9)␤False␤»
12:36 timotimo m: (1..10).map( ^* ).map({ $_.list.say; say $_ > 5 })
12:36 camelia rakudo-moar 2ef888: OUTPUT«(0)␤False␤(0 1)␤False␤(0 1 2)␤False␤(0 1 2 3)␤False␤(0 1 2 3 4)␤False␤(0 1 2 3 4 5)␤True␤(0 1 2 3 4 5 6)␤True␤(0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7)␤True␤(0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8)␤True␤(0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9)␤True␤»
12:36 timotimo there you can see why it still aborted after 10
12:37 timotimo because the > operator interpreted the list as the number of its elements
12:38 timotimo and since you were getting ^* evaluated against the last element in the sequence, it was growing more and more
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12:38 ab6tract El_Che: sounds like a use case for MONKEY-TYPING
12:39 mre timotimo: ah makes sense
12:40 ab6tract m: use MONKEY-TYPING; augment class Str { method Rat { "ooo you dirty rat! i'm mocking you lol " ~ self } }; "foo".Rat
12:40 camelia rakudo-moar 2ef888: ( no output )
12:40 ab6tract m: use MONKEY-TYPING; augment class Str { method Rat { "ooo you dirty rat! i'm mocking you lol " ~ self } }; say "foo".Rat
12:40 camelia rakudo-moar 2ef888: OUTPUT«ooo you dirty rat! i'm mocking you lol foo␤»
12:41 ab6tract El_Che: note that this does not populate to subclasses yet, afaik
12:42 pierre-vigier joined #perl6
12:45 mre <-- Any one have any ideas why this if failing to install
12:51 lucasb I've never hit this "Could not find symbol '&bool'" error because I always starting with a clean environment. But, by reading the backlog, the answer is always to nuke everything.
13:02 dalek rakudo/nom: 8f1d504 | (Mike Eve)++ | t/01-sanity/55-use-trace.t:
13:02 dalek rakudo/nom: Fixed test broken by 7f3032685
13:02 dalek rakudo/nom:
13:02 dalek rakudo/nom: Line numbers in errors/trace are now "line $number" rather than
13:02 dalek rakudo/nom: ":$number"
13:02 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
13:02 dalek rakudo/nom: 939c94b | lizmat++ | t/01-sanity/55-use-trace.t:
13:02 dalek rakudo/nom: Merge pull request #650 from ungrim97/nom
13:02 dalek rakudo/nom:
13:02 dalek rakudo/nom: Fixed test broken by 7f3032685
13:02 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
13:05 mre lucasb: cheers will try that
13:05 mre lizmat: thanks
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13:07 timotimo thank you, mre :)
13:08 Skarsnik ok, time to get lost in bitsec hell!
13:09 dalek rakudo/nom: 4af3ff0 | lizmat++ | docs/announce/
13:09 dalek rakudo/nom: Add Mike Eve to list of contributors
13:09 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
13:10 mre lizmat: I suspect that I am in the list of contributers as Mike Francis (Finally got round to updating my name in gitconfig after almost a year of marriage)
13:10 lizmat ah, ok, so which name would you like to have in there ?
13:10 mre Mike Eve please
13:10 timotimo the new one , i'd expect :)
13:11 mre :D
13:11 Skarsnik I am not in! (but who care!)
13:12 mre Skarsnik: :(
13:12 dalek rakudo/nom: 5b377cc | lizmat++ | docs/announce/
13:12 dalek rakudo/nom: Mike Eve was Mike Francis
13:12 dalek rakudo/nom:
13:12 dalek rakudo/nom: As requested at
13:12 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
13:13 lizmat Skarsnik: with which name would you like to be  in?
13:13 Skarsnik Sylvain Colinet
13:14 dalek rakudo/nom: da1ad00 | lizmat++ | docs/announce/
13:14 dalek rakudo/nom: Add Skarsnik to list of contributors
13:14 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
13:15 lizmat any new contributors that aren't in the list yet ?
13:16 Skarsnik Thanks!
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13:21 BooK lizmat: maybe add my nickname ;-)
13:21 BooK so is Christmas today or tomorrow?
13:21 BooK which TZ?
13:21 xinming joined #perl6
13:23 lizmat tomorrow
13:24 BooK +0000 ?
13:24 lizmat as BooK or as Philippe Bruhat ?
13:24 BooK Philippe Bruhat (BooK)
13:25 lizmat you were already in there :-)  but now corrected  :-)
13:25 BooK I wouldn't have said anything if I wasn't already  in the list
13:25 dalek rakudo/nom: 89cdb53 | lizmat++ | src/core/
13:25 dalek rakudo/nom: Can use native ints in daycount calculation
13:25 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
13:25 dalek rakudo/nom: 491f775 | lizmat++ | docs/announce/
13:25 dalek rakudo/nom: Philippe Bruhat is BooK
13:25 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
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13:27 lizmat can anybody tell me why DateTime needs a dedicated clone method ?
13:27 patrickas joined #perl6
13:27 BooK now is the time where the more minor contributors become the more vocal :-)
13:28 Skarsnik lizmat, what does the clone method do ? x)
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13:29 lizmat m: class A { has $.a; has $.b };,:666b).clone(:67a).say  # create a clone, with possibly changed attributes
13:29 camelia rakudo-moar 939c94: OUTPUT« => 67, b => 666)␤»
13:30 badsanta joined #perl6
13:30 patrickas Hello all, I just thought I drop by 5 years later and wish you all a merry christmas :-)
13:30 Skarsnik Merry christams to you them ^^
13:30 timotimo lizmat: maybe because it wants to verify the changes?
13:31 badsanta m: 5⁸⁸ == 5 × × 88
13:31 camelia rakudo-moar 491f77: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/87Hki9ckVP␤Preceding context expects a term, but found infix × instead␤at /tmp/87Hki9ckVP:1␤------> 5⁸⁸ == 5 × ×7⏏5 88␤»
13:32 lizmat timotimo: ah yes, I guess
13:32 badsanta m: 5⁸⁸ == 5 ** 88
13:32 camelia rakudo-moar 491f77: OUTPUT«WARNINGS for /tmp/Q9jXvTdwYs:␤Useless use of "==" in expression "⁸⁸ == 5 **" in sink context (line 1)␤»
13:33 timotimo m: say 5⁸⁸ == 5 ** 88
13:33 camelia rakudo-moar 491f77: OUTPUT«True␤»
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13:39 timotimo the last advent post has surpassed 2k views
13:39 timotimo er, no
13:39 timotimo the *day* has
13:40 timotimo 1.3k direct views on the latest post, 525 views on the front page, which includes it
13:41 st_iron and my comment is still under moderation :)
13:41 timotimo oh
13:41 timotimo let me have a look
13:41 rindolf joined #perl6
13:42 st_iron ;)
13:42 timotimo i didn' tget any notifications and on the page i looked at all the time it didn't even show comments
13:42 RabidGravy joined #perl6
13:42 timotimo i had to click the wp admin button on the bottom left
13:43 st_iron yeah, I had the same problem with wp
13:43 badsanta m: say 5⁽⁸⁸⁾
13:43 camelia rakudo-moar 491f77: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/vOdzYdvBI0␤Bogus postfix␤at /tmp/vOdzYdvBI0:1␤------> 3say 57⏏5⁽⁸⁸⁾␤    expecting any of:␤        infix␤        infix stopper␤        postfix␤        statement end␤        statem…»
13:43 dalek doc: c20d1c8 | lizmat++ | doc/Type/DateTime.pod:
13:43 dalek doc: Check validity of documented DateTime methods
13:43 dalek doc: review:
13:44 timotimo wordpress has become so much better since i started using it for the weekly
13:44 timotimo er
13:44 timotimo i meant to say
13:44 timotimo wordpress has become so much *worse* since i started using it for the weekly
13:45 lizmat before / after, left / right, up / down,   it's all relative  :-)
13:45 vv3 joined #perl6
13:46 dalek rakudo/nom: 09ca24c | lizmat++ | src/core/
13:46 dalek rakudo/nom: No need to make YAH (YetAnotherHash) when cloning
13:46 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
13:46 vv3 joined #perl6
13:47 lizmat these conclude my commits for today
13:47 st_iron let's write a great blog saas in perl6 :)
13:50 patrickz joined #perl6
13:50 patrickz Hi everyone and merry Christmas!
13:51 patrickas patrickz: I feel a great disturbance in the force!
13:51 patrickz Oh nose!
13:52 patrickz Right there in the middle of your face!
13:52 vv3 joined #perl6
13:53 patrickz should be updated: The rakudobrew installation instructions do not reflect what rakudobrew itself recommends.
13:53 vv3 joined #perl6
13:53 patrickz git clone %USERPROFILE%\rakudobrew
13:53 patrickz SET PATH "%USERPROFILE%\rakudobrew\bin;%PATH%"
13:53 RabidGravy st_iron, that's how I got in this mess in the first place
13:53 patrickz echo 'eval "$(rakudobrew init -)"' >> ~/.profile
13:53 patrickz would be better
13:54 vv3 joined #perl6
13:54 lizmat brb
13:54 vv3 joined #perl6
13:55 geekosaur patrickz, the quoted stuff indicates Windows, there may not be a Unix-like shell in play
13:56 patrickz geekosaur You're right!
13:57 felher joined #perl6
13:57 patrickz Then copying the "Installation" part from might be the best idea.
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14:08 lizmat I wish everybody a very nice Christmas Eve...
14:08 lizmat see you tomorrow
14:08 lizmat afk for the rest of the day&
14:08 RabidGravy :)
14:08 perlpilot lizmat: you too!
14:08 st_iron merry christmas to you too
14:09 RabidGravy Just in case you're into a spot of classic techno and getting festive
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14:13 AlexDaniel oh, 24th of December! What a great day for cycling
14:14 Skarsnik AlexDaniel, hey, can you see if the last dbiish commit fix your timestamp issue? x)
14:14 AlexDaniel well, I had exactly the same thing done locally
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14:14 AlexDaniel I can upgrade it just to make sure
14:15 AlexDaniel Skarsnik: I don't really like that it is Str and not DateTime
14:15 AlexDaniel Skarsnik: or any other type… Instant or whatever it should be
14:15 Skarsnik Other people in dbiish seem to not like being too clever with type ^^
14:16 Skarsnik so I left it as discusion
14:16 Skarsnik Because I already though of returning date for date field
14:16 vv3 joined #perl6
14:17 AlexDaniel Skarsnik: fine, whatever. By the way, what is going to happen if some type is not listed in Native.pm6?
14:17 Skarsnik I make it default to Str
14:17 vv3 joined #perl6
14:17 RabidGravy I'm in the "leave it to a higher level abstraction" party by the way
14:18 AlexDaniel Skarsnik: ok, great then
14:18 vv3 joined #perl6
14:18 Skarsnik You could try removing the timestamp stuff, but it should be fine
14:19 vv3 joined #perl6
14:20 Skarsnik RabidGravy, I will need to have hight level abstraction have access to the native type
14:20 AlexDaniel Skarsnik: “No appropriate parametric role variant available for 'NativeCall::Native'”
14:20 AlexDaniel what the
14:20 Skarsnik duh
14:20 AlexDaniel that's when I try to install it
14:22 Skarsnik old rakudo?
14:22 Skarsnik like 4 days olds
14:23 AlexDaniel g9a01b4b
14:23 jcrespo joined #perl6
14:23 Skarsnik because the lib version stuff make dbiish don't work with old rakudo
14:24 AlexDaniel 2 days old
14:24 raiph joined #perl6
14:24 Skarsnik hm
14:25 Skarsnik check NC code if the NativeCall::Native role accept List in the where
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14:27 AlexDaniel Skarsnik: I'll just build the newest version hoping that it will solve it somehow
14:28 Skarsnik timotimo, I found the faulty commit: 02588190492349fabde00c5a15b873ea61a9333e is the first bad commit
14:28 Skarsnik so I can blame TimToady
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14:40 perlpilot Does DBIish keep the original column information around somewhere?  (just thinking that if dates/timestamps come a cross as strings, you'd want the original type so that you could make something akin to DBIC::InflateColumn::DateTime)
14:41 vv3 joined #perl6
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14:42 timotimo Skarsnik: well, i'm glad it wasn't one of my (few) commits :)
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14:45 lucasb panda is taking forever to install some modules
14:46 lucasb only some modules. I experienced it with Bailador and 007
14:46 tadzik hmm
14:46 yoleaux 02:12Z <llfourn> tadzik: PR for your consideration :)
14:46 tadzik which part of the process?
14:47 lucasb the "==> Installing" part
14:47 tadzik llfourn++, and lizmat++
14:47 tadzik lucasb: ah, yes, copying files is notoriously slow
14:47 lucasb but maybe it's not panda's issue
14:47 lucasb maybe it has something to do with precomp
14:48 tadzik that's about as precise as I nailed it down to
14:48 lucasb I run this cmdline: find ~/.perl6 -printf "%C+ %f\n" | sort | less
14:48 llfourn :D merry christmas tadzik & all ( it is actually christmas where I am )
14:49 tadzik llfourn: likewise, merry christmas!
14:49 lucasb and I can see the *.rev-deps files are the ones getting modified last
14:50 lucasb tadzik: by "notoriously slow" do you mean like more than 30 minutes? that's what is happening here :)
14:50 llfourn lucasb: is it hanging?
14:50 tadzik llfourn: wooo what
14:50 tadzik lucasb: ^
14:50 tadzik lemee try :)
14:51 llfourn panda has has a few hanging issues in the past few days...
14:51 lucasb llfourn, tadzik: idk if its hanging, it seems to be doing its job somehow :)
14:51 tadzik :P
14:51 El_Che hi
14:51 RabidGravy Another one down only 26 more to do
14:52 lucasb I'm just hopefull it will end. because I waited very long for Bailador and it didn't end after a while
14:52 vv3 joined #perl6
14:52 tadzik RabidGravy: what's your quest?
14:52 xpen joined #perl6
14:52 RabidGravy fix all my modules before midnight ;-)
14:52 tadzik ah :)
14:52 RabidGravy only three work for sure at the moment
14:52 tadzik I should teach smoker to only run stuff for github user X and then scream at me on the console
14:53 El_Che so, what the plannig? Release at midnight at Larry's timezone or too optismistic?
14:54 RabidGravy also at some point after the actual release I'm going to bounce all the modules to v0.1.0
14:55 lucasb *I meant to say Bailador *did* end installing successfully, after a long while.
14:55 tadzik lucasb: okay, panda is now "==> Installing Bailador" here
14:55 tadzik let's see how it fares
14:55 tadzik cpu is actually working hard
14:56 RabidGravy El_Che, nothing much is broken. All the target RTs are done, no-one is going to push anything today so yeah I'd say
14:56 lucasb I'll just abort the "==> Installing 007"... can't wait longer for this...
14:57 tadzik I'm now very interested in this
14:57 vv3 joined #perl6
14:58 lucasb tadzik: I'll just repeat that I think this is not an issue with panda itself... It may be more like a precomp problem
14:58 vv3 joined #perl6
14:58 lucasb because other modules install without any problem
14:59 vv3 joined #perl6
14:59 tadzik yeah, I still want to know what's taking so long :)
14:59 tadzik time for some print debugging
15:00 RabidGravy I think that some low level stuff takes longer to compile
15:00 vv3 joined #perl6
15:00 RabidGravy I've noticed this with "trait heavy" stuff
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15:01 mspo many passes?
15:02 tadzik argh
15:02 tadzik now CUR doesn't allow installation of stuff with the same version
15:02 tadzik I don't like that
15:03 tadzik that makes module development a PITA
15:03 AlexDani` joined #perl6
15:03 AlexDani` Skarsnik: it didn't help
15:03 bobv joined #perl6
15:04 AlexDaniel Skarsnik: same error on lines 14 and 52 in this file
15:04 Skarsnik dug
15:05 Skarsnik perlpilot, not for now
15:05 vv3 joined #perl6
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15:06 RabidGravy tadzik, use the --force
15:06 Skarsnik AlexDaniel, I am confused. did you check the file it point out?
15:06 Skarsnik it should not fail like that x)
15:07 Skarsnik tadzik, merge my pr so I can rework on Discord! x)
15:07 tadzik Skarsnik: but you can make it work using the custom unmarshaler :)
15:07 tadzik and it turns out to be easier than we both thought
15:07 Skarsnik merge the null stuff at least x)
15:08 tadzik oh, oh
15:08 Skarsnik if you don't want to keep the Int
15:08 AlexDaniel Skarsnik: uhmmh, which file?
15:08 Skarsnik AlexDaniel, the error point you to a file (the sha of NC)?
15:08 tadzik Skarsnik: yes, I'll do the null thing
15:09 AlexDaniel Skarsnik: that's the same file that I've linked
15:09 tadzik I still have mixed feelings about the automatic Str-Int conversion
15:09 Skarsnik AlexDaniel, I mean your local (precompiled) file
15:11 AlexDaniel Skarsnik: that's exactly the same file, I've diffed it
15:12 Skarsnik The Int thing I can work around with, well not typing the attribute, but the null was more trickyt x)
15:12 AlexDaniel Skarsnik: or what do you mean?
15:12 Skarsnik AlexDaniel, yes but you must have the can't find role thingy error pointing to the
15:12 tadzik Skarsnik: does it not work to name it as Int but have a is unmarshalled-by('Int') or so?
15:12 tadzik as RabidGravy pointed out?
15:12 Skarsnik No idea
15:12 AlexDaniel Skarsnik: nope, it points to this file
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15:14 tadzik argh, now my panda broke because of the 'as' changes
15:14 AlexDaniel tadzik: just edit the file
15:14 tadzik for some reason, even if I update it to HEAD
15:14 Skarsnik it seem like it using an old NC file
15:14 tadzik yeah
15:14 timotimo tadzik: because a panda lib is still pre-installed?
15:14 tadzik I just nuked my installation
15:14 timotimo in the sources?
15:14 hankache hola!
15:14 AlexDaniel tadzik: $x as Str to Str() $x and it will work
15:14 timotimo hola hankache
15:14 Skarsnik did you nuke the installed stuff?
15:14 tadzik timotimo: well, 'rakudobrew build panda' should overwrite them, no?
15:15 timotimo not necessarily
15:15 AlexDaniel Skarsnik: I didn't, but I probably should
15:15 AlexDaniel jeez, these issues are annoying
15:15 AlexDaniel Skarsnik: anyway, I have to go now. Thanks for your help
15:15 regreg joined #perl6
15:16 Skarsnik timotimo, Could I fill a rakudo bug for my bug, even if I don't golf it?
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15:23 Skarsnik use experimental :pack; it's from today? x)
15:23 rurban joined #perl6
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15:24 timotimo Skarsnik: i forgot what bug you had where ...
15:24 Skarsnik the Can't find infix < A in my Gumbo module (on a given switch)
15:25 timotimo please golf it
15:28 Skarsnik I have no idea where to start x)
15:31 timotimo it's a parse error, right?
15:31 timotimo just cut out things all over the place
15:31 timotimo wait ... it's not a parse error, it's a parse mitsake or something like that
15:32 Skarsnik it's a call error? "Cannot call infix:(Any, Int)"
15:33 nine tadzik: it's not copying but precompilation onbinstall that's slow
15:34 nine lucasb: ^^^
15:34 timotimo Skarsnik: can you get rid of all but that one function and call it in isolation?
15:36 * thomax waves & shouts Ho Ho Ho
15:36 tadzik ah
15:38 thomax is p6.c official now?
15:38 FROGGS not yet I think
15:38 timotimo not completely, no
15:39 timotimo wait for the tag in the perl6/roast repository
15:39 timotimo that'll be the release of the language version
15:39 timotimo and then we'll tag a rakudo version that does well enough with that language version
15:39 timotimo and then a rakudo star, so that we also have panda and a few modules bundled
15:40 thomax nice! what else is in the package?
15:40 awwaiid thomax:
15:41 awwaiid some delicious stuff!
15:41 timotimo rakudo star also comes with a lovely .pdf introduction course
15:41 timotimo i wonder if we should also ship the in rakudo star?
15:41 thomax nice!
15:41 timotimo .ask hankache if we should perhaps put the perl6intro text into rakudo star tarballs and such?
15:41 yoleaux timotimo: I'll pass your message to hankache.
15:42 thomax and don't forget to press release it!
15:44 timotimo i expect the perl foundation would be able to do something like a press release?
15:45 timotimo i personally have no clue how press releases work
15:45 thomax let's hope the best
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15:49 Skarsnik hm, that work with just calling the method
15:49 Skarsnik I updated rakudo too in between also x)
15:49 xinming joined #perl6
15:54 ChoHag How can I set a value to the result of breaking early from looping over another value?
15:55 ChoHag ie. better than my $result = sub { loop (...) { return processed($_) if $_.ok } }()
15:55 Skarsnik last
15:55 Skarsnik oh in a loop
15:55 grondilu { value; last; }?
15:56 ChoHag Does the last return the value of the previous expression?
15:56 grondilu m: say do loop { pi; last }
15:56 camelia rakudo-moar 09ca24: OUTPUT«WARNINGS for /tmp/iycH0KttNW:␤Useless use of constant value pi in sink context (line 1)␤()␤»
15:56 grondilu apparently not, my bad
15:56 nine Put the loop in a sub and return?
15:57 grondilu javascript-style, basically
15:57 ChoHag Well that's what I did, but it looks clunky.
15:57 grondilu I like it, personally
15:57 nine subs should be small anyway ;)
15:59 perlpilot m: my $v = do loop (my $i = 0; $i < 10; $i++) { say $i };
15:59 camelia rakudo-moar 09ca24: OUTPUT«(timeout)0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0␤0…»
15:59 perlpilot bug!
15:59 grondilu took a while
15:59 TimToady it loops forever
15:59 yoleaux 08:54Z <nine> TimToady: That must be the lovliest announcement I've ever read.
15:59 grondilu oh yeah, and wrong
15:59 konobi happy perl6 day y'all!
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16:00 timotimo merry sixmas
16:00 pierre-vigier joined #perl6
16:01 timotimo i must admit the last paragraph of the advent post reads a whole lot like "here you go. perl6 is released."
16:01 ChoHag Oh is it?
16:02 perlpilot timotimo:  Every month, like clock work  ;)
16:02 timotimo my clock works more often than once a month, to be honest
16:02 perlpilot If we'd been tagging roast every month too, we could call it "done"  (for some values done)
16:04 vendethiel joined #perl6
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16:05 perlpilot I bet on boxing day people are going to be like, "Where's my Perl 6 MSI?"  and "Where's my Perl 6 RPM?"  etc.
16:05 thomax it's official?
16:06 thowe joined #perl6
16:06 * grondilu is always a bit confused when people talk about "boxing day".  Always thinks about the punching sport.
16:07 flussence perlpilot: I'm trying to make sure gentoo has some sort of perl6 package ready to go at release, even if nobody else has shown any interest :)
16:08 perlpilot grondilu: For those people who don't quite get the Christmas spirit, that could be the result of the christmas festivities
16:08 perlpilot grondilu: well ... less like "sport" and more like "fight"
16:08 timotimo well, not everybody is aware that what's just been released is the spec test suite
16:08 Skarsnik one of the dep of H:UA suffer from the as stuff
16:09 timotimo which one is that?
16:09 Skarsnik IO::Capture::Simple
16:09 LLamaRider merry perl6 day to everyone! :)
16:11 konobi grondilu: it originates from giving a box filled with stuff as a gift to the "help"
16:11 Skarsnik sub prints-stdout-ok (Callable $code, $expected as Str, $reason = '') does the as keyword get removed?
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16:12 jeturcotte joined #perl6
16:12 jeturcotte ahoyhoy
16:13 perlpilot greetings jeturcotte
16:14 pierre-vigier joined #perl6
16:14 vendethiel merry sixy
16:14 vendethiel also o/, #perl6.
16:14 jeturcotte I come to poke around for wisdom, re: io::socket::async and why I can't telnet to the example given on
16:14 jeturcotte im missing out on some fundamental little bit
16:15 awwaiid greetings jeturcotte
16:16 jeturcotte *points*
16:16 awwaiid lemme see if I can get it to work
16:16 nine Skarsnik: yes
16:16 nine use Str() ibstead
16:16 perlpilot Skarsnik: apparently.  See 4355eacf825ff33f906ae75b2d613ed57e228390
16:16 perlpilot Str() implies Str(Any), right?
16:16 jeturcotte i can telnet to the inet version, but have had equally little luck separating it off onto a separate thread, whereas that works fine with the async one, but the communication back and forth is in some way different
16:16 awwaiid jeturcotte: er... which example?
16:17 jeturcotte sample server on
16:17 lucasb awwaiid: Hi. I'm sorry to be picky, but can you review your doc commit about hash literals?
16:17 Skarsnik It's getting annoying having half the ecosystem that broke at each commit ~~
16:18 cpage joined #perl6
16:18 jeturcotte i can telnet TO it, but not have a conversation as is
16:18 awwaiid ah sure lucasb
16:18 jeturcotte and i don't comprehend enough of the fundamentals yet to anticipate where the problem is
16:19 FROGGS o/
16:19 xfix joined #perl6
16:19 jeturcotte alternatively, their sample client DOES communicate, but I'd rather not make a client when telnet is sufficient
16:19 awwaiid lucasb: mmm, I'm not sure to what you are referring
16:20 lucasb awwaiid: :{} is syntax for an object hash
16:20 pierre-vigier joined #perl6
16:20 awwaiid ah great! Can you point me to the Synopsis or something for that so I can fix it?
16:20 lucasb but to be honest, I don't know how to put it into words :)
16:21 awwaiid I asked some folks about :{} but nobody answered so onward I drove :)
16:21 mre how does one go about debugging nqp? (as in print string of something)
16:21 lucasb it's ok. thanks for adding to the docs, awwaiid++
16:22 skids joined #perl6
16:22 lucasb idk if this :{...} has made it into the synopses... I'll take a look
16:22 awwaiid but ya -- explain it to me or link it to meme and I'll fix
16:24 Skarsnik I can't even insall Inline::Perl5 (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
16:24 mre Skarsnik: I couldn't either
16:25 flussence ooc, who's our designated driver for rakudo 2015.12 and/or star?
16:26 Skarsnik Inline::Perl5 is in Star? x)
16:28 jeturcotte reading rfc 854 ... might as well start from the beginning
16:29 andreoss joined #perl6
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16:31 lucasb awwaiid:
16:31 lucasb iow, :{...} isn't to disambiguate between hash and blocks. it's a special hash composer.
16:32 ghost_ joined #perl6
16:32 lucasb and doing 'my %when = :{ ... }' results in a warning, just like normal 'my %h = { ... }'
16:33 TimToady yes, that's a one-arg thing, not a type thing
16:33 TimToady it'll iterate either {} or :{} for a list
16:33 TimToady but it's probably not what was intended
16:34 totimkopf joined #perl6
16:34 awwaiid cool, thanks lucasb, I'll fix the doc
16:35 xinming joined #perl6
16:35 awwaiid jeturcotte: running the server and then telnetting into it isn't behaving how I expect either, so that's good
16:36 jeturcotte aye; the INET one just works, but the async one cooperates with my having a separate process/thread going
16:36 pierre-vigier joined #perl6
16:36 jeturcotte i just get the feeling one end or the other doesn't understand the other
16:36 jeturcotte as a connection is made
16:37 jeturcotte but then there's no intelligible back and forth
16:37 jeturcotte i need to understand how they're expected to work so I an diagnose
16:37 jeturcotte reading in another screen
16:38 awwaiid I'm surprised you can't assign a non-string-key hash to a %-var
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16:40 jberger I just read the p6advent post today and then read the backlog from the channel today
16:41 jberger if there isn't some huge party popper popping, champaign pouring, release announcement today or tomorrow then you will have blown your chance for it
16:41 lucasb iiuc, one *can* assign both {...} and :{...} to %-sigiled variables. it just emits a warning
16:41 jberger this has to be the "get out the word" "its not vaporware" day(s)
16:42 lucasb like I said the other day, a new user would maybe expect some symetry between 'my @a = [...]' and 'my %h = {...}'
16:42 jberger and if its a dithering "we are committing to backwards compatibility" and "this is only for the test suite" then you lose the moment and no one will give you another such moment
16:42 jberger land this one!
16:42 lucasb that's why I suggested that this warning could be reconsidered
16:44 jberger right now I have nothing to link to hacker news
16:44 jberger nothing to show a project manager
16:44 awwaiid lucasb: ah, yes I see, does work with %h = :{ ... }, and seems totally fine despite the warning
16:45 vv3 joined #perl6
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16:45 awwaiid jberger: For myself, I'm holding back until we can point at a full Rakudo + Task::Star / toolchain release :)
16:45 vv3 joined #perl6
16:46 jberger is that tomorrow?
16:46 Su-Shee joined #perl6
16:46 jberger I'm not kidding, this is the moment
16:46 jberger that advent post can't be "the announcement"
16:46 flussence why not?
16:46 awwaiid mmm. dunno. ASAP I guess; I've only been working on the docs and those aren't nearly as ready as the rest, sadly.
16:47 jberger it was cute, but it doesn't say anything to those outside the community
16:47 awwaiid flussence: because I can't link my friends over to something to give it a spin :)
16:47 flussence ah, it's not farmable for upvotes. gotcha.
16:47 jberger that's what you need, cynical as it sounds
16:47 jberger we need to get eyeballs
16:48 perlpilot mre: nqp has say()
16:48 awwaiid well in my case I'm not looking for upvotes, I'm looking for something that my friend scott can run on his machine
16:48 molok joined #perl6
16:48 jberger no, you need upvotes or scott doesn't ever consider this language
16:48 awwaiid that too
16:48 awwaiid but I'll take the long view on that
16:48 jberger nor does scott's boss or his boss
16:49 jberger 15 years of promising christmas isn't long view enough?!
16:49 dalek doc: 958ca8a | (Brock Wilcox)++ | doc/ (2 files):
16:49 dalek doc: Fix reference to :{} syntax
16:49 dalek doc: review:
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16:50 awwaiid jeturcotte: well, i have to go for a bit, I'll see if I can construct a working example later
16:50 lucasb awesome, thanks awwaiid++
16:50 awwaiid thanks for helping me understand :)
16:51 jeturcotte no prob; this isn't terrible important anyhow... trying their bind-udp by getting errors on that, like maybe the documation's a bit aged on that part.
16:51 jeturcotte have a good eve
16:51 mre perlpilot: what about for things that don't stringify (hashes)
16:53 jberger would you all like me to write the press release?
16:53 vv3 joined #perl6
16:54 ribasushi TimToady: ^^ having a relative outsider write one is likely rather sensible, I'd "thumb up" that
16:54 vv3 joined #perl6
16:54 flussence depends; do you understand the language and community well enough to do it right?
16:54 mre jberger: You could write one and let us review it :D
16:54 vv3 joined #perl6
16:55 jberger "I, Larry Wall, along with the tireless team of developers that have helped me, am very happy to announce that after 15 years of development, the Perl6 spec has now reached a stable release ..."
16:55 jdv79 its a good point - why isn't tpf doing promotion or something
16:55 jdv79 isn't that part of what they are for
16:55 vv3 joined #perl6
16:55 jberger "I expect that within days or hours, implementations of the Perl6 spec, such as the Rakudo project will make their announcements of their v6.c releases"
16:56 isBEKaml joined #perl6
16:56 jdv79 when will the release(s) be cut?  is that [Coke] solely?
16:56 flussence jdv79: think so...
16:57 jdv79 [Coke]: what's happenin?
16:57 jberger "This represents thousands of hours of effort by hundreds of developers over 15 years. The language is like nothing you've ever seen before, providing such features as ..."
16:57 jdv79 jberger: mabe a gist or a blog post that's not chopped up into irc sized chunks:)
16:57 jdv79 *maybe
16:58 jberger flussence: notice that I don't have to know anything about the development process nor the community to do this
16:58 isBEKaml jdv79: there's already one. It's up there on perl6advent
16:58 jberger because its not for us and its not about that
16:58 isBEKaml jdv79:
16:58 mre jberger++
16:58 skyheights joined #perl6
16:58 jdv79 that's not what jberger is looking for
16:58 jberger its something that we can proudly point to outside of the perl bubble and get them to look
16:58 jberger jdv79: thanks
16:58 isBEKaml Ah, okay
16:59 mre Yeah it needs to be synically markitable
16:59 jberger larry's post is cute, we all like it
16:59 jberger but that's not going to sell on hackernews
16:59 jberger its not going to get tech writers to write about it
16:59 jberger this story is interesting
16:59 isBEKaml HN is a dour crowd
16:59 flussence that's fine, we aren't trying to sell anything :)
16:59 jberger but we have to make it accessible
16:59 jberger flussence: if you aren't then this is all a waste
17:00 jberger your aren't selling it for cash, but you should be selling it for eyeballs
17:00 isBEKaml Do we already have R* distributions up anywhere?
17:00 jberger s/your/you/
17:00 mre flussence: We really are trying to sell it. Not financially but in terms of use. I would very much like it to be used in companies and they sadly only will do that if it becomes fashionable.
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17:02 flussence in all seriousness, I'd nominate raiph++ to write a press release. He's done an amazing job of that sort of thing over the past few years IMO.
17:02 jberger then let raiph do it
17:03 lichtkind joined #perl6
17:03 jberger but someone really should
17:03 jberger for all your sakes
17:03 jberger you have put in tons of time
17:03 jberger I WANT to see this get the attention it deserves
17:03 andreoss .seen masak
17:03 yoleaux I saw masak 22 Dec 2015 23:21Z in #perl6: <masak> 'night, #perl6
17:03 vv3 joined #perl6
17:04 Khisanth joined #perl6
17:04 Begi .seen azawawi
17:04 yoleaux I saw azawawi 7 Dec 2015 10:00Z in #perl6: <azawawi> RabidGravy: hi
17:05 jdv79 it is a holiday so might have to settle based on availablity
17:06 Begi Happy Christams #perl6 ! ++
17:09 vv3 joined #perl6
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17:10 dalek rakudo/nom: b49aa3e | TimToady++ | docs/announce/
17:10 dalek rakudo/nom: Be very clear what's being delivered, or not
17:10 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
17:10 peteretep joined #perl6
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17:12 andreoss is it ready yet?
17:12 TimToady ready for what?
17:12 pierre-vigier joined #perl6
17:12 andreoss for the release
17:13 TimToady well, we'll see if any last-minute bug fixes sneak in, but largely, yes
17:13 TimToady we do need to figure why t/spec/S32-array/adverbs.t is failing
17:14 TimToady that's the only test that fails for me when running a single test job
17:14 xfix joined #perl6
17:15 TimToady multiple jobs still get occasional hangs, but maybe the tests are assuming things they shouldn't about load
17:15 jdv79 jberger: oh yeah.  forgot about the announce that has all the contrib names.  that's probably what you are looking for.
17:16 skids I actually found a circumstance where "use Test" hangs reliably
17:16 kjs_ joined #perl6
17:16 jberger jdv79: if you mean I'm looking to see my name in lights, no I'm not, I don't have a single p6 commit
17:16 TimToady I guess I'm willing (given what I just put into the release notes above) to ship with tests passing in single file, but it'd be nice if we could do a little better
17:16 lichtkind joined #perl6
17:17 skids Proc::Screen commit  ef49cd156 will hand on tests
17:17 jdv79 jberger: no.  the thing you can link to and such.
17:17 skids hang even.
17:17 jberger yeah, that's all I want
17:17 vv3 joined #perl6
17:18 jberger give the press something to feed on
17:18 vv3 joined #perl6
17:18 jberger hope for (or cajole) a tech journal to write a story on the release
17:18 jberger this is how people who have long since moved beyond perl see it
17:19 vv3 joined #perl6
17:19 andreoss there's still time to adopt eastern customs to gain two extra weeks
17:19 flussence it's almost certain that the reputable ones (like LWN) will pick it up regardless :)
17:19 TimToady well, Infoworld already ran an article
17:20 jberger andreoss: greek orthodox christmas :-P (is that a thing? I know it is for Easter)
17:20 vv3 joined #perl6
17:20 [Coke] The christmas release is going to be on christmas, yes. tomorrow is christmas here.
17:21 jberger [Coke]: if something else is being said tomorrow then I'll shut up
17:21 btyler although it is entertaining to think about perl6 shipping a day early :)
17:21 TimToady yes, we're going to release on Christmas regardless of how many disclaimers we have to put in the release notes :)
17:21 araujo hello, anybody knows where I can find information about interfacing perl6 with C libs?
17:21 jberger [Coke]: I came here because of the advent calendar post, which, though cute, couldn't be the only release message
17:21 Su-Shee I agree.
17:22 Su-Shee #perl is ready to send people over here tomorrow regardless. ;)
17:23 TimToady if we have to put a big fat "We know of one or two stabiity issues in the multithreading and precompilation" then we will
17:23 TimToady the rakudo release will serve as the official announcement of the frozen 6.c spec; see my edits above
17:25 mre araujo: the best place to start I think is
17:25 mohae_ joined #perl6
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17:25 thomax huhu Su-Shee
17:26 vv3 joined #perl6
17:26 ZoffixW joined #perl6
17:26 * ZoffixW is almost ready for party :)
17:27 ZoffixW TimToady++ # awesome Advent post
17:27 vv3 joined #perl6
17:28 araujo mre, Thanks!, pretty much what I was looking for
17:28 vv3 joined #perl6
17:28 lucasb That announce edit clarified a lot, thanks. If one does a "serious" announcement, people expect to find a polished product. I think that's why most P6 people prefers to not be sooo serious. :)
17:29 vendethiel joined #perl6
17:29 [Coke] jnthn: you have a link to your "what to do post release" in re: branches & spectests?
17:30 lucasb this?
17:30 Su-Shee lucasb: well considering that the "release at christmas" bell rang a lot this year, people expect something more serious, yes.
17:30 Su-Shee lucasb: and trust me they will ignore all disclaimers. ;)
17:31 * awwaiid is totally psyched for some rakudo christmas
17:31 jcrespo joined #perl6
17:31 TimToady every time I announced christmas, I said "there will be bugs, it won't be as fast as we'd like"
17:31 peteretep I personally will be taking credit for being a supporter all along :-P
17:31 TimToady but we've pretty much hit the mark we set for ourselves, and we can never make everyone happy with that
17:32 peteretep I al still interested in sponsoring some hackathons
17:32 awwaiid totally. I think some folks are worried that the roast is the ONLY christmas gift they are getting
17:32 * FROGGS raises his glass to TimToady
17:32 |Tux| I *do* have a X-mas present for you :)
17:32 Su-Shee well I trust you made it nice enough to properly install and to make module installation not fail. if it's then not fast enough, nobody will really care.
17:32 khw joined #perl6
17:33 ZoffixW |Tux|, watisit? :)\
17:33 jdv79 Su-Shee: well...:)
17:33 |Tux| <drumrolllllll>…
17:33 peteretep Does it still complain about installation in directories with soaces in?
17:33 Skarsnik most of the ecosystem is broken probably x)
17:33 ZoffixW Su-Shee, there's still some obscure panda issue where modules with prereqs fail on first try, but succeed on second
17:33 TimToady Su-Shee: module installation doesn't *always* fail :)
17:33 ZoffixW :P
17:33 * Su-Shee stuffs her fingers in her ears and sings *lalalala* ;)
17:33 jdv79 progress i guess
17:34 |Tux| test             50000    22.561    22.439
17:34 |Tux| test-t           50000    12.440    12.318
17:34 |Tux| csv-parser       50000    50.349    50.227
17:34 stmuk I did wonder whether panda should have a "please wait" message since some installs are *very* slow
17:34 |Tux| UNDER 13! this is an all-time low
17:34 ZoffixW |Tux|, what do those numbers mean?
17:34 TimToady wow
17:34 flussence 12 means fast(ish)
17:34 ZoffixW heh... mkay :)
17:34 TimToady maybe panda should have an autoretry when it sees that happen
17:34 awwaiid what are they numbers of?
17:34 ZoffixW I do notice rakudo is much faster than when I first started playing with it
17:35 skids Post release I think some thought into how ecosystem module maintainers go about offering a works-with-6.c version and a works-with-nom version is in order.
17:35 flussence considering it started at about... 250 or so that's quite good
17:35 |Tux| ZoffixW,
17:35 awwaiid fancy graphs |Tux|!
17:35 |Tux| time to go home and celebrate!
17:35 * [Coke] hurls for those who keep asking about the release.
17:36 |Tux| for those that have other/better things to do than hang around here, enjoy X-mas :)
17:36 vv3 joined #perl6
17:36 ZoffixW What we really need to ensure is there's something for Windows users to install and play with. I often noticed in the past the Windows R* was lagging significantly behind.
17:37 TimToady [Coke]: are my edits above okay by you?
17:37 awwaiid [Coke]++ # throwing release notes
17:37 pierre-vigier joined #perl6
17:37 TimToady maybe we want a specific link to roast?
17:37 nebuchadnezzar time to make an unreasonable diner
17:38 ZoffixW nebuchadnezzar, a whole diner? Use thick plywood :P
17:38 autarch I'm trying to run "panda gen-meta" but it complains that it can't find Panda::DepTracker - when I try to install such a module, panda says it doesn't exist
17:39 * [Coke] sees he needs to pull TimToady++'s insert into the release announcement - thank you, I was just composing something like that.
17:39 flussence seems like DepTracker was deleted in panda commit a7040f8450
17:40 autarch I just did "rakudobrew build-panda" to make sure I had the right version too
17:40 ZoffixW Hm
17:40 autarch and zef won't even build at all
17:40 ZoffixW When I run this, I just get panda usage instructions: panda gen-meta --name=Foo::Bar --auth=Blah --ver=v0.1 --desc="A sec"
17:40 autarch ZoffixW: yeah, I had that problem too
17:40 TimToady who all has write access to the rakudobrew/panda stuff?  Do we need to fork versions of those that could have last-minute emergency patches applied?
17:41 skids lizmat has access to panda and a bunch of tadzik's stuff.
17:41 [Coke] TimToady: I would love to be able to give a URL that says "here's the tests". I know our eventualy goal was a standalone copy of tests that didn't need fudging, but I think a tag of "6.c" as the "official" christmas spec is a reasonable place to start (or, more likely, a 6.c branch, since we expect there to be incremental clarifications that don't count as a new spec.)
17:41 autarch it seems like it'd be good to move panda to the perl6 org, no?
17:41 stmuk I don't think "gen-meta" has worked for months
17:42 vv3 joined #perl6
17:42 TimToady yes, a 6.c branch will be sufficient for now; we can work out the 'unfudging' later
17:42 ZoffixW autarch, agreed
17:42 vv3 joined #perl6
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17:43 vv3 joined #perl6
17:44 vv3 joined #perl6
17:44 RandalSchwartz joined #perl6
17:44 TimToady well, it's tadzik++'s stuff, so it'd be nice to get preapproval of that, but he's been pretty busy lately
17:44 sftp joined #perl6
17:44 RandalSchwartz where is panda installing things?
17:45 TimToady same install directory as rakudo, wherever that is
17:45 flussence m: say $*REPO.writable-path
17:45 camelia rakudo-moar b49aa3: OUTPUT«Method 'writable-path' not found for invocant of class 'CompUnit::Repository::Installation'␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/V0S2SQDFFc line 1␤␤»
17:45 lucasb RandalSchwartz: on $PREFIX/share/perl6/site
17:45 RandalSchwartz Oh, and installing Task::Star failed on Grammar::Debugger
17:45 autarch TimToady: I'm not saying steal it, I'm saying it'd be good to ask him if it's cool to move it
17:45 [Coke] ok. anyone planning any changes for the tests? If not, I'll cut a branch now, and remove any tests not explicitly listed in rakudo's t/
17:45 flussence m: say $*REPO.writeable-path
17:45 camelia rakudo-moar b49aa3: OUTPUT«"/home/camelia/.perl6/2015.11-779-gb49aa3e".IO␤»
17:45 stmuk RandalSchwartz: it should work if you try again
17:45 Skarsnik RandalSchwartz> Oh, and installing Task::Star failed on Grammar::Debugger <= retry it should work x
17:45 RandalSchwartz oh weirfd.
17:46 TimToady and I'm saying if we have to steal it to fix a last minute issue, we will, but I'd rather not :)
17:46 RandalSchwartz and yes, it did
17:46 TimToady like, if we decided that we had to hack in an autoretry to panda, for instance :)
17:46 pdcawley joined #perl6
17:46 ZoffixW RandalSchwartz, that will happen for a few more modules. Just retry. It happens on any modules that have uninstalled prereqs
17:46 RandalSchwartz would prefix there be moar-nom, or its parent
17:47 RandalSchwartz heh... same error on URI
17:47 ZoffixW Yup :)
17:47 Skarsnik should xml be moved to perl6 or something like that? it's quite a nice module and the author see not that active x)
17:48 rurban joined #perl6
17:48 pdcawley Feeling slightly silly. I have sub example($a,$b,$c) { ... } and I want to do example( "2x3x4".split(/x/) ) and have it act in a perl 5ish manner. What's the syntax to turn the result of split into a capture?
17:48 ZoffixW I think that type of stuff should be avoided as much as possible, or we'll be drowning in forks
17:49 * flussence is watching `top` report 30% cpu usage while "==> Installing Net::HTTP" has been on screen for the past 15 minutes or so
17:49 jdv79 ZoffixW: huh?
17:49 ZoffixW jdv79, sup?
17:49 awwaiid Skarsnik: probably not -- that is more likely a work-with-author thing for xml, ultimately forking maybe but probably not a #perl6 ownership
17:49 jdv79 just use a different auth, no?
17:49 jdv79 i don't get your commen is what i meant.
17:49 lucasb pdcawley: maybe try ( |("2x3x4".split(/x/)) )
17:49 RandalSchwartz ahh... moar-nom/install/share/perl6/site
17:49 jdv79 *comment
17:49 TimToady git has taught us that forks are not evil, if there's the intent to remerge
17:50 TimToady but it's still less efficient than non-fork
17:50 jdv79 or abandon
17:50 vv3 joined #perl6
17:50 flussence strace shows this doing *something* precomp-related, but it seems to be looping over a huge number of files and I've no idea wtf's going on
17:50 Skarsnik well you can replace exemel in ecosystem to my work to have an install copy x)
17:50 awwaiid TimToady: profound thought! that's why some people prefer threads over forks! hahahaha
17:50 ZoffixW jdv79, yeah, but then the author comes back and what's then? What if they don't like the direction the fork has taken? I see there has been activity on the repo 19 days ago. IMO that's a bit too early for hostile forks.
17:50 roguelazer joined #perl6
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17:51 TimToady well, emergency forks are a gray area
17:51 ZoffixW jdv79, the :auth stuff is no different than simply using a different name. At the end, you still have two diverged forks.
17:51 ZoffixW Sure, emergency is a different matter.
17:51 lucasb flussence: I have experienced the same hang up on installing Bailador and 007 :(
17:51 jdv79 idk how that's hostile.  we have auth to ameliorate some of the issues.
17:51 Skarsnik well we can just change the file in ecosystem6 to a working fork, the time the issue get fixed?
17:51 TimToady and we aren't promising that anything downstream works, but it'd at least be nice if some of it works :)
17:51 vv3 joined #perl6
17:52 jdv79 some of it does work most of the time
17:52 ZoffixW jdv79, maybe I don't understand the auth, but I see no difference between Foo:auth<zoffix>/Foo:auth<perl6> and Foo::Zoffix/Foo::Perl6
17:52 pdcawley lucasb: Right... so... map { example(|(.split(/x/)) } lines...
17:52 vv3 joined #perl6
17:53 autarch I note that forking panda also requires everyone to update rakudobrew since it hard codes tadzik's repo
17:53 nemsys joined #perl6
17:53 dalek rakudo/nom: 9fcf651 | coke++ | docs/announce/
17:53 dalek rakudo/nom: Add a link to the roast branch with the Christmas
17:53 dalek rakudo/nom: version of the tests.
17:53 dalek rakudo/nom:
17:53 dalek rakudo/nom: Minor cleanup
17:53 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
17:54 skids ZoffixW: module with the :auth will still work if you do not specify an :auth, that's the difference.
17:54 skids One will be chosen.
17:54 ZoffixW jdv79, and the hostility is in the form that if the fork was required to make some fix, then logically there will be X number of people using that fork. Now, when I come back from my vacation and fix my code (even assuming I approve of the change someone else made in their fork), what happens to the original fork? Will it be deleted? Will those X number of users have to change their code?
17:55 Skarsnik what happend if you put two Meta to the same module in ecosystem6?
17:55 TimToady one would hope there's a way to say "pick the latest on from either auth"
17:55 TimToady *one
17:56 RandalSchwartz until panda install Task::Star; do echo retrying; done
17:56 TimToady then it would automatically revert
17:56 TimToady there you go :)
17:56 ZoffixW Skarsnik, at the same location? Nothing (as far as is concerned)
17:56 Skarsnik Like if I add my exemel fork. will panda try this one if the first one fail to install?
17:57 RandalSchwartz does rakudobrew self-update also update installed modules?
17:57 Skarsnik self-update only update rakudobrew I think
17:57 stmuk RandalSchwartz: no
17:57 ZoffixW skids, that's actually a real problem. A security problem I'd even say. All that tells me is if I don't explicitly specify an :auth<>, I open myself to action-at-a-distance errors if me or $evil-guy installs a same-named module with different auth
17:57 RandalSchwartz and the moar-vm?  or is that update separate
17:57 TimToady ZoffixW: true, there are security implications if you don't nail down the identity
17:57 ZoffixW So the "one will be chosen" is an unresolved ambiguity in my eyes, not a feature by a long shot.
17:58 Skarsnik I don't even know if there is a way to update module in panda?
17:58 vv3 joined #perl6
17:58 pdcawley It feels like map { example(|(.split(/x/))) } lines is a bit clumsy. Would like to write lines>>.split(/x/)>>
17:58 skids ZoffixW: depends on your use case.  If your worried about security to that level you should be excercising change control on your systems.
17:58 pdcawley Argh... don't it return when you mean to hit delete.
17:59 vv3 joined #perl6
17:59 ZoffixW skids, that was just one of the examples. My general complaint is that { use Foo } is ambiguous be definition, since :auth<> is missing.
17:59 RandalSchwartz it's been installing DBIsh for about 4 minutes.
17:59 RandalSchwartz normal?
17:59 ZoffixW RandalSchwartz, Not in my experience
17:59 TimToady yes, unless you have some authoritative recommender that tells you what to trust
18:00 vv3 joined #perl6
18:00 flussence RandalSchwartz: seems normal for that part to break lately...
18:00 jdv79 i ctrl-c'd it last night after 10min
18:00 RandalSchwartz so I'm not going to be able to complete this task?
18:00 ZoffixW RandalSchwartz, I've seen several commits fly through this morning into it tho. Maybe Skarsnik would know more.
18:00 jdv79 Bailador takes long but not that long
18:00 skids ZoffixW: I view that as a feature.  You tune what you're willing to except in your installer/repo manager.
18:00 Skarsnik err DBIish should install?
18:00 skids *accept
18:00 vv3 joined #perl6
18:01 jdv79 Skarsnik: you installed it today?
18:01 RandalSchwartz yes I noticed that.  And DBIsh also failed because I don't have every possible server installed. :)
18:01 ZoffixW skids, on a scale between -10 (complete misfeature) and 10 (good feature), I view :auth<> as -3
18:01 Skarsnik Nop but travis build ok
18:01 Skarsnik maybe I should add a panda --install . at the end?
18:01 jdv79 its the install though
18:01 jdv79 the precomp its taking forever they say
18:02 skids ZoffixW: if the ecosystem repos you are using are unstable or unreliable, that's a problem with the repo, to fixed on that end.
18:02 Su-Shee if one of you gets to the press release/release notes for .. "us common folks" and the internet mob, I'd love to link, tweet, and spread it.. I'd need a simple "yay, awesome perl 6 features, unicode, numbers, threads, types, whatever now go make awesome things with it", just one page really. with a download link.
18:02 Skarsnik precomp is very slow latelty lol
18:02 jberger Su-Shee++ me too
18:02 RandalSchwartz oh, so it's actually compiling during this install into something intermediate?
18:02 ZoffixW Su-Shee, jberger I'll ping ya :)
18:03 Su-Shee ZoffixW: excellent.
18:03 ZoffixW RandalSchwartz, yes, pre-compilation. Makes subsequent start ups for stuff using those modules faster
18:03 Su-Shee ZoffixW: don't be shy, make it hip. ;)
18:03 stmuk it all mostly works!  certainly the test suite is in better state than the last week to 10 days
18:03 Skarsnik DBIish should install even if you have no working lib for t
18:04 * ZoffixW & commute
18:04 RandalSchwartz yes... it made it past that
18:05 RandalSchwartz yeah... at least moar seems to be running something. :)
18:05 Skarsnik Someone has an idea why Inline::Perl5 just fail all its test?
18:06 TimToady does it say anything?
18:06 vv3 joined #perl6
18:07 Skarsnik
18:07 vv3 joined #perl6
18:07 xtreak29 joined #perl6
18:07 Skarsnik parse errors: no plan found? hm weird
18:08 awwaiid sounds like no output at all
18:08 vv3 joined #perl6
18:08 TimToady sounds like an old/corrupt Test precompile
18:08 TimToady try blowing away install/share/perl6 maybe
18:08 xtreak29 Are perl6 threads lightweight like goroutines?
18:08 xinming_ joined #perl6
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18:09 TimToady Skarsnik: it's passing here, btw, so I suspect a local precomp issue
18:10 flussence xtreak29: not familiar with go, but perl6 threads behave a lot like libgcd's in practice
18:10 flussence s/libgcd/libdispatch
18:11 TimToady xtreak29: yes, they're really an abstraction that gets run by various actual worker threads underneath
18:12 timotimo how is zef these days btw?
18:12 TimToady Skarsnik: so my Inline::Perl5 passes all its tests, then fails the install because it's already installed, which seems a bit off
18:12 xtreak29 goroutines are lightweight threads with 4kb at start and then expand on need.. I saw a talk where rob pike spinned up and killed a million of them in few seconds..
18:12 stmuk panda --force install Inline::Perl5
18:13 skids TimToady: That seems to be normal behavior these days for all modules
18:13 stmuk will reinstall a module
18:13 flussence is there an env var I can use to force-disable precomp?
18:13 dalek roast: 1b0a10c | coke++ | README:
18:13 dalek roast: Someday is here
18:13 dalek roast: review:
18:14 stmuk flussence: no I started to look at that but couldn't work it out
18:14 autarch is there any way to get perl6 to tell me how it's trying to match a multi?
18:14 autarch some sort of debugging output
18:14 vv3 joined #perl6
18:14 stmuk flussence: you can use "no precompilation" pragmas
18:15 flussence stmuk: that doesn't help when I'm trying to write an ebuild :)
18:15 [Coke] Su-Shee: updated to note that I'm going to post an advent post with the release announcement.
18:15 vv3 joined #perl6
18:15 TimToady autarch: that would be difficult; it is, by necessity, very low-level code that has to run blazing fast
18:15 autarch makes sense
18:16 TimToady that being said, there's a fast path, and a slow path, so one could hope to instrument the slow path without slowing the fast path
18:16 autarch I'm trying to figure out why panda's gen-meta isn't matching a specific multi when given arguments
18:16 TimToady but I don't think it has much instrumentation of that nature
18:16 vv3 joined #perl6
18:16 RandalSchwartz Hmm... moar is still moaring on DBIsh
18:16 RandalSchwartz I'll give it a bit... uh.. more.
18:17 TimToady I suspect it's hung
18:17 dalek rakudo/nom: 313832d | FROGGS++ | src/Perl6/Actions.nqp:
18:17 dalek rakudo/nom: fix explosion found by lucasb++ because missing .node
18:17 dalek rakudo/nom:
18:17 dalek rakudo/nom: m: say ({ 42 } while $++ < 3)
18:17 dalek rakudo/nom: rakudo-moar e34842: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Cannot find method 'CURSOR'␤»
18:17 vv3 joined #perl6
18:17 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
18:17 stmuk no it's just very slow
18:17 awwaiid autarch: one thing to note with panda is that the options come BEFORE the action, unlike git or other action-based cli
18:17 RabidGravy joined #perl6
18:17 autarch awwaiid: that could explain it
18:17 jdv79 coo.  IO::Capture::Simple is broke too?  so H::UA is a bust atm:(
18:18 autarch yep, that was the problem - that's _really_ confusing and non-standard, it'd be nice to fix that somehow
18:18 dalek roast/6.c: 485f471 | coke++ | README:
18:18 dalek roast/6.c: Note which version of the spec this branch is for
18:18 dalek roast/6.c: review:
18:18 awwaiid autarch:
18:19 autarch seems like a core issue based on that issue discussion
18:19 autarch but maybe the solution is to write a simple module that command-pattern scripts like this can use
18:19 awwaiid autarch: my inclination is, now that there are more eyeballs, go ahead and "fix" panda, trying to talk tadzik into it :)
18:19 awwaiid yeah, shared command-pattern lib good idea
18:20 TimToady or fix MAIN to support it
18:20 awwaiid even better
18:20 TimToady but probably not this side of xmas
18:20 awwaiid but I don't know what that would look like
18:20 awwaiid yeah
18:21 TimToady it's actually been in my todo list for a while, but never bubbled up to the top
18:22 TimToady one could write a shim in the mainline that moves all --foo to the front of @*ARGS before MAIN sees it, but that'd just be a hack
18:22 awwaiid autarch: I bet with that and xmas in mind, tadzik would accept a normalization MAIN that then re-dispatched to the others
18:22 zengargoyle joined #perl6
18:22 TimToady but yeah, we really need the input processing to create multiple captures that dispatch at different levels
18:22 vv3 joined #perl6
18:23 TimToady rather than just clumping all switches together
18:23 jcrespo joined #perl6
18:23 dalek roast/6.c: 3dea37e | coke++ | S (63 files):
18:23 dalek roast/6.c: Remove any tests not currently part of Christmas
18:23 dalek roast/6.c:
18:23 dalek roast/6.c: These files will remain on master and can be pulled
18:23 dalek roast/6.c: into this branch if we determine they are part of the
18:23 dalek roast/6.c: spec.
18:23 dalek roast/6.c: review:
18:23 TimToady would be nice if 'panda help' explained that switches need to go in front
18:23 vv3 joined #perl6
18:24 [Coke] ok. There's a spec, such as it is. Feels anticlimactic. :)
18:24 vv3 joined #perl6
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18:25 stmuk I added an example of the switches to panda
18:25 RandalSchwartz are there plans to make moar multi-threaded at some point?
18:25 stmuk it's at the top and scrolls by I guess
18:25 mspo isn't it?
18:26 RandalSchwartz well, why is this panda install using only one thread?
18:26 timotimo RandalSchwartz: yeah, we'v eplanned to make it multi-threaded more than a year ago, and actually also did make it multi-threaded
18:26 timotimo zef installs stuff in parallel
18:26 timotimo ugexe is responsible for that project. it's pretty cool, but i think it hasn't been updated to handle the newest changes yet
18:27 [Coke] RandalSchwartz: because panda is a script that wasn't written to be multi-threaded.
18:27 jdv79 it seemed broke a few days ago
18:27 [Coke] It could be, sure.
18:27 RandalSchwartz does zef work better installing DBIsh? :)
18:27 jdv79 perfect timing
18:28 pierre-vigier joined #perl6
18:28 awwaiid stmuk: TimToady: -- made the note about switches in front louder :)
18:28 [Coke] Note! Any changes made to roast going forward are NOT part of christmas unless you merge those tests into the 6.c branch.
18:29 TimToady were those test removed all outside of
18:29 [Coke] We should probably have a soft rule about that. At least get another pair of eyes on any test changes to 6.c
18:29 TimToady +1
18:29 [Coke] TimToady: that was the plan. Someone might want to double check that, but i just ran the "update-passing..." test and removed all the unrun tests it found.
18:29 timotimo RandalSchwartz: zef doesn't install anything at the moment
18:30 RandalSchwartz oh... so, no.
18:30 [Coke] Doing a test run with a 6.c checkout now.
18:30 RandalSchwartz do I need Task::Start, or can I just let anything that needs it install its own depends?
18:30 RandalSchwartz I'm not doing anything with DBI at the moment
18:30 jdv79 it looks like it might be precomping the same file over and over
18:30 awwaiid RandalSchwartz: you should be fine with just depends rather than full Task::Star
18:31 TimToady someone should take out the auto-retry...oh wait...
18:31 [Coke] Thanks to everyone trying to kick the tires before tomorrow, btw.
18:31 awwaiid RandalSchwartz: ... and if there is a hidden dependency it should be fixed :)
18:31 timotimo oh lord. the first "buggy interaction of features" zefram shows in his talk is just the REPL being dumb
18:31 timotimo and i can't even read the damn code
18:31 RandalSchwartz I really wanted to try Inline::Perl6, which requires building Inline::Perl5 for Perl 6. :)
18:31 * TimToady wonders if it would help our launch to cut Task::Star way down for the moment
18:32 krshn joined #perl6
18:32 RandalSchwartz Oh - can't do that.  Still running with 5.16 on my laptop
18:32 jdv79 taking DBIish out is pretty obvious.
18:32 [Coke] TimToady: I'm thinking that instead of saying "here's what we added in this release" like we normally do for the announcement, instead list various features/paradigms available in the spec/impl.
18:32 jdv79 most of task star is fine
18:32 AndChat268400 joined #perl6
18:32 stmuk a star release in a few days is fine I think
18:32 mspo so does the announcement mean that the spec is stable for some amount of time?
18:32 vv3 joined #perl6
18:32 AndChat268400 Merry Xmas eve
18:32 TimToady yeah, but a lot of people may try it before then and get frustrated, and if it works again in a few days, can be put back in
18:32 [Coke] We don't have anyone on deck for a star release, that I know of.
18:33 [Coke] mspo: yup
18:33 vv3 joined #perl6
18:33 TimToady mspo: that's the intention, we'll see how it works out after first contact with the enemy :)
18:33 mspo where is are moar and rakudo in terms of compliance?
18:33 [Coke] we don't have a particular time frame, but you should be able to track the monthly releases now and get bug fixes and speedups instead of death and destruction.
18:33 timotimo hey everybody
18:33 [Coke] moar isn't perl6. it's a backend.
18:33 timotimo should we kick out the REPL part of rakudo?
18:33 aenaxi joined #perl6
18:34 timotimo or just a big fat warning?
18:34 ZoffixMobile joined #perl6
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18:34 [Coke] TimToady: what's wrong with the REPL?
18:34 [Coke] er, timotimo.
18:34 TimToady besides sucking?
18:34 timotimo well, in this example here, zefram could assign CORE:: into my Int $a
18:34 pierre-v_ joined #perl6
18:35 ZoffixMobile cutting R* is definitely a good option. I rather people get something usable without errors than include all sorts of modules.
18:35 * stmuk is going to see what subset of the current Task::Star works quickly
18:35 [Coke] with linenoise, it's been tolerable.
18:35 TimToady stmuk: thanks!
18:35 lucasb m: my Int $x = CORE; say $x
18:35 camelia rakudo-moar 313832: OUTPUT«(CORE)␤»
18:35 lucasb it's not just in the REPL :)
18:35 timotimo er, huh?
18:35 ZoffixMobile [Coke], is it hard to cut R* release? I'm free for the next 4 days, but I dunno what to do
18:35 [Coke] mspo: rakudo is (not quite tautologically) at 100% of spec compliance on 2 or 3 platforms at the moment.
18:35 timotimo ah, i locally tried my Int $x = CORE::; that one blows up
18:36 timotimo so ... how the fuck does that happen %)
18:36 TimToady maybe a repl without history could come up with a suggesting to install linenoise or rlwrap
18:36 [Coke] ZoffixMobile: if you've never done it before, christmas is probably not the time to cut your teeth on it.
18:36 lucasb timotimo: I tried watching his talk, but couldn't read anything on the screen, so I gave up
18:36 [Coke] TimToady++
18:36 timotimo m: my Int $x = CORE; dd $x
18:36 camelia rakudo-moar 313832: OUTPUT«CORE $x = CORE␤»
18:36 ZoffixMobile [Coke], good point :)
18:36 timotimo it changes the type of the variable, even
18:36 * [Coke] ponders a faq, "no, dd is not part of the spec"
18:37 jdv79 18 mins and counting so far
18:37 mspo it isn't? :)
18:37 TimToady that's a pretty amazing bug, but I wouldn't call it a blocker
18:37 jdv79 wonder if its an infiloopy thing
18:37 [Coke] "There's always next month", said the overworked volunteers.
18:38 [Coke] (which, btw, is a good thing)
18:38 sdo joined #perl6
18:38 * geekosaur still thinks there's always Orthodox Christmas if necessary
18:38 lucasb jdv79: what is hanging for you?
18:39 TimToady DBIish precomp, I presume
18:39 timotimo the next thing he brings up is "you can pull IterationEnd out of the CORE symbol table and it'll stop any map or grep that's run over multiple values containing that thing"
18:39 jdv79 ==> Installing DBIish
18:39 sdo merry Xmas
18:39 jdv79 yeah, tis precomping over and over
18:39 lucasb ah, ok. I waited more than 30 minutes to install 007, but then I gave up :(
18:39 jdv79 did DBIish install for you?
18:40 lucasb didn't try DBIish
18:40 stmuk I have seen DBIish install in the last day or so but it took ~20mins
18:40 stmuk not sure if it always works
18:40 jdv79 i'm at 22mins now
18:40 jdv79 and the strace is a loop to my eyes
18:41 lucasb It looks like precomp keeps re-generating the same *.rev-deps files
18:42 jdv79 i just see it precomping one of the SQLite files over and over
18:43 autarch can someone tell me how to add a module to the ecosystem?
18:43 jdv79 because the 101st time will be different?!
18:43 jdv79 add it to the META.list file in the perl6 eco repo
18:43 vv3 joined #perl6
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18:43 awwaiid autarch: PR on
18:43 RabidGravy is there an indirect circular dependency?
18:44 flussence
18:44 nemsys joined #perl6
18:44 [Coke] autarch:
18:44 [Coke] flussence++ # coke too slow
18:44 autarch yeah, I had read that - the last step says "Ping someone on IRC (#perl6 at freenode) to either show you how to add your module to the ecosystem, or else ask them if they could please add it for you." - that's where I was
18:45 dalek doc: f14aae5 | (Anthony Parsons)++ | doc/Language/modules.pod:
18:45 dalek doc: Fix typo
18:45 dalek doc: review:
18:45 awwaiid autarch: I'm going to fix the doc for that right now.
18:45 autarch since I have commit access is it ok to commit directly to master in that repo?
18:45 TimToady the big question is at what point it's looping; does it actually finish and do the whole thing over?  if so, we can probably short-circuit the loop somehow and call it done
18:45 ZoffixMobile autarch, yes
18:45 TimToady if not, we can maybe at least abort precomp and install it without precomp
18:46 dalek ecosystem: 7841fce | (Dave Rolsky)++ | META.list:
18:46 dalek ecosystem: Add Pod::TreeWalker to ecosystem
18:46 dalek ecosystem:
18:46 dalek ecosystem: <img class="alignnone  wp-image-2908" src="" alt="Camelia-small" width="147" height="107" />
18:46 dalek ecosystem:
18:46 autarch pood, done
18:46 autarch poof*
18:46 flussence TimToady: I ^C'ed it on Net::HTTP and the result seemed to run fine, so probably
18:46 timotimo i don't think it's a valid complaint, but here's some code zefram threw up:
18:46 ZoffixMobile heh, nice commit message :)
18:46 timotimo m: my @a = 1, 2, 3; @a[1] = slip(9, 9, 9);{ $_ }).perl.say
18:46 camelia rakudo-moar 313832: OUTPUT«(1, 9, 9, 9, 3).Seq␤»
18:46 dalek joined #perl6
18:46 autarch ZoffixMobile: that's automatically filled in for me when I do the edit directly on github - not sure how that was configured
18:47 ZoffixMobile ahh
18:47 timotimo zefram argues that .map({ $_ }) should be an identity map, but isn't because the resulting list isn't the same as the incoming list
18:47 vv3 joined #perl6
18:47 cxreg when i'm installing all of Task::Star i sporadically get a "Cannot unbox a type object" error during installation
18:47 timotimo he argues that this should be the boilerplate everybody should use to identity-map whatever data you get, because it could contain slips you don't want to slip:
18:48 ZoffixMobile autarch, you've made 777th commit! :) too bad it's not a slot machine :p
18:48 vv3 joined #perl6
18:48 autarch we're rich in code
18:48 timotimo m: my @a = 1, 2, 3; @a[1] = slip(9,9,9);{ my @s = $_; @s.Slip }).perl.say;
18:48 camelia rakudo-moar 313832: OUTPUT«(1, slip$(9, 9, 9), 3).Seq␤»
18:48 ZoffixMobile cxreg, not sporadic: any dist with uninstalled prereqs. retrying fixes the issue
18:48 dalek doc: b015b24 | (Brock Wilcox)++ | doc/Language/modules.pod:
18:48 dalek doc: Direct people to open PR on ecosystem
18:48 dalek doc: review:
18:48 cxreg ZoffixMobile: parallelism bug?
18:48 vv3 joined #perl6
18:49 ZoffixMobile cxreg, no clue :(
18:49 cxreg hm, i'm sure it'll get figured out eventually
18:49 jdv79 RabidGravy: i don't see one.  but could be.
18:49 vv3 joined #perl6
18:49 jdv79 at 30mins i'm stopping
18:50 cxreg any spoilers on the time of release?
18:51 ZoffixMobile cxreg, yes: "tomorrow" :)
18:51 leont joined #perl6
18:51 cxreg heh.  tomorrow GMT is in a few hours
18:51 awwaiid cxreg: no more specific time is available to anyone
18:52 cxreg roger that
18:53 timotimo oh, this is an interesting bug:
18:53 timotimo m: (1, 2, 3)[0] := 4
18:53 timotimo (hangs)
18:53 lucasb (suspense)
18:54 camelia rakudo-moar 313832: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
18:54 cxreg o_o
18:54 timotimo ah, zefram even found out the cause of the problem
18:54 timotimo and didn't tell us, i guess?
18:54 cxreg that's how you destroy a replicant
18:57 stmuk grrr LWP::Simple is broken and is a dependency of quite a few Task::Star modules
18:58 stmuk oh nine fixed it in a PR .. its not applied though
18:58 vv3 joined #perl6
18:58 lucasb m: say $(slip).perl
18:58 camelia rakudo-moar 313832: OUTPUT«slip$()␤»
18:58 stmuk
18:58 stmuk does anyone have access to
18:58 timotimo the slip thing seems a bit like a DIHWIDT, though. dunno.
18:58 lucasb ^^ just prepending 'slip' won't do the right thing with a itemized list
19:00 TimToady cxreg: given the Moar-folk won't be spinning their release till tomorrow, I don't see anything coming out at midnight, but it should still be Christmas in *someone*'s timezone :)
19:00 cxreg heh
19:00 TimToady meaning the 25th
19:01 stmuk I could hack the ecosystem to use nine's working LWP::Simple for a bit
19:01 cxreg either way, it's a minor miracle
19:01 timotimo TimToady: any comment on the "identity map" thing?
19:01 timotimo and now i'm wondering how to not-implement BIND-POS inside List
19:02 TimToady the point of a map is to *map* something, and the map is not the territory, duh
19:02 timotimo since Any has a fallback that is supposed to handle multi-dim bind-pos, but it accidentally also handles single-dimension bind-pos by not checking if the argument list has two arguments in it
19:02 TimToady one should use *.self if one wants and identity function
19:02 TimToady *an
19:03 aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa joined #perl6
19:03 aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa yo
19:03 vv3 joined #perl6
19:03 timotimo TimToady: well, mapping $_.self doesn't not-iterate the slip
19:04 vv3 joined #perl6
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19:09 dalek ecosystem: c5bf53c | (Steve Mynott)++ | META.list:
19:09 dalek ecosystem: migrate perl6-lwp-simple into perl6 for the moment
19:09 dalek ecosystem: review:
19:09 timotimo stmuk: why not into perl6-community-modules instead?
19:09 Actualeyes left #perl6
19:10 timotimo anyway. binding to any subclass of Any that doesn't implement BIND-POS gives us an infinite recursion
19:10 stmuk timotimo: I wasn't aware of that .. if you want to do that . please do
19:10 labster joined #perl6
19:10 timotimo whatever's least friction at the moment is fine with me
19:11 sivoais joined #perl6
19:11 timotimo - i suggest this patch for rakudo
19:11 vv3 joined #perl6
19:11 stmuk grrr it doesn't work .. is the META.list cached?
19:12 timotimo it takes a litle bit for the ecosystem website to update
19:12 timotimo and "panda update" is also required
19:12 stmuk ah I tried the "panda update" but need to wait for some cron I guess
19:12 vv3 joined #perl6
19:12 timotimo yeah
19:13 vv3 joined #perl6
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19:14 TimToady oh lovely, Shell::Command uses 'as', and panda uses Shell::Command
19:14 skids That was fixed earlier today
19:14 ZoffixMobile yeah, it runs server/
19:14 timotimo panda has to pull in new versions with the update-subtree script
19:14 timotimo did anybody do that?
19:15 TimToady apparently not
19:15 * timotimo has been familying a lot today
19:17 skids Before Shell::Command was fixed, lizmat pulled in 6073de4c which removed the "as" by hand.
19:18 skids So I don't know why anyone is seeing it anymore.
19:18 skids I'm not.
19:18 kjs_ joined #perl6
19:19 TimToady I guess I'll try the nuclear option
19:19 vv3 joined #perl6
19:20 stmuk I have a Task::Star installing with only two modules removed I think ..
19:20 virtualsue joined #perl6
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19:23 cxreg "The MONKEY pragmas" sounds like a book series
19:24 kjs_ joined #perl6
19:24 stmuk trying on another platform
19:26 ChoHag Can I print the call stack at a given point?
19:26 stmuk say
19:26 stmuk still hasn't changed!
19:27 stmuk is anyone able to manually refresh that?
19:27 hankache joined #perl6
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19:28 RandalSchwartz now DBIish is failing differently
19:28 RandalSchwartz ... DBIish:ver<*>:auth<>:api<> already installed
19:28 RabidGravy :-\
19:28 stmuk RandalSchwartz: look at the panda examples at the top
19:28 stmuk --force
19:28 vv3 joined #perl6
19:29 dalek rakudo/nom: 986f98d | timotimo++ | src/core/
19:29 dalek rakudo/nom: if multidim BIND-POS candidate fires for single-dim ...
19:29 dalek rakudo/nom:
19:29 dalek rakudo/nom: we're in trouble, because that means the class we're a
19:29 dalek rakudo/nom: part of doesn't implement binding. So we throw X::Bind.
19:29 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
19:29 quux joined #perl6
19:29 quux is it realy happening??
19:29 vv3 joined #perl6
19:29 RandalSchwartz and of course, I intuitively typed: panda install --force Task::Star
19:29 timotimo that fixes the hang of (1, 2, 3)[0] := 4, but it also makes ([1] := 5 not hang, but die, as it should.
19:29 RandalSchwartz that argument is really in the wrong place
19:30 * TimToady is testing a bandaid fix to the precompile loop
19:30 vv3 joined #perl6
19:30 ChoHag Is $foo[*-1] (where $foo does Positional) supposed to call $foo's list method?
19:30 RandalSchwartz because --force is an adverb on install
19:30 ChoHag The document suggests otherwise.
19:30 RandalSchwartz not on panda
19:31 timotimo ChoHag: it at least has to figure ou tthe number of elements
19:31 timotimo not sure that should go through .list, though
19:31 ChoHag suggests is uses .elems, which exists.
19:31 timotimo and $foo[1] doesn't call .list?
19:32 ChoHag No.
19:32 timotimo mhm mhm
19:34 atweiden joined #perl6
19:35 ChoHag I don't mind - and having it work that way revealed an off-by-one bug in my .list - but not sure if the documentation is wrong or unclear.
19:35 sivoais joined #perl6
19:35 krshn I am testing perl6/panda/task::star on mac
19:36 vv3 joined #perl6
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19:37 stmuk can people try "panda update && panda --force install LWP::Simple" please?
19:37 TimToady I can at least tell you that the rev-dep-id precompile is recompiling the same id over and over
19:37 TimToady I do not yet know whether it's finite
19:37 cxreg RandalSchwartz: i got that same DBIish error just now.  it hung and i killed it, and that happened on trying again
19:37 vv3 joined #perl6
19:38 krshn Cannot unbox a type object
19:38 krshn in block  at /Users/krshn/local/osx/share/perl6/site/sources/54D6C35C8308A2355B72B5AB93E9C21E57E7E2AF line 61
19:38 ChoHag TimToady: Get back to us after the heat death.
19:38 vv3 joined #perl6
19:38 krshn I ran "panda install Task::Star"
19:38 ChoHag Universe or CPU. Whichever comes first.
19:38 TimToady my attempted patch is to keep a %done array and skip precomps we've done, in the hopes that the input is finite
19:39 asht joined #perl6
19:39 RabidGravy krshn, run it again it should work
19:39 hankache i think DBIish should be removed from star
19:39 yoleaux 15:41Z <timotimo> hankache: if we should perhaps put the perl6intro text into rakudo star tarballs and such?
19:39 krshn RabidGravy: yes -- doing it now
19:39 woosley joined #perl6
19:39 stmuk try removing both "DBIish" and "Bailador" from a local checkout of Task::Star .. that should now work
19:39 RabidGravy it sometimes fails when there are deps that aren't yet installed
19:39 brrt joined #perl6
19:40 hankache .tell timotimo no problem. I have pdf copies if it's easier
19:40 yoleaux hankache: I'll pass your message to timotimo.
19:40 timotimo very cool.
19:40 yoleaux 19:40Z <hankache> timotimo: no problem. I have pdf copies if it's easier
19:40 timotimo .botsnack
19:40 yoleaux :D
19:40 krshn running again -- I get this
19:40 krshn ==> Installing URI
19:40 krshn Cannot unbox a type object
19:40 stmuk does anyone have access to
19:40 asht Hi mates, new to Perl 6. just installed rakudo on mac os/x. panda is giving errors when installing module Inline::Perl5 prereq Pod::Coverage:
19:41 hankache timotimo as a matter of fact I am finalizing it right now
19:42 timotimo asht: we're currently very busy fixing last bits; i'm not sure, but i think your problem might be known
19:42 krshn should I put Task::Star in the back-burner and test LWP::Simple instead?
19:42 stmuk krshn: trying LWP::Simple would help .. you might have to "panda update"
19:43 krshn stmuk: ok trying panda update && panda --force install LWP::Simple
19:44 krshn How does LWP::Simple look on linux? I can test that too
19:44 vv3 joined #perl6
19:44 krshn stmuk: worked on mac
19:44 krshn no issues
19:44 krshn using yosemite
19:44 stmuk krshn: also "git clone" and "panda install ." in target might work
19:44 krshn latest xcode
19:45 TimToady now testing my patch on DBIish
19:45 vv3 joined #perl6
19:45 krshn ok.. let me test
19:45 sivoais joined #perl6
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19:47 TimToady yatta!
19:47 krshn stmuk: can you give me url without git@.. I have not setup git hub yet to use do authentication
19:47 * TimToady should run a spectest before checking in the fix, however
19:47 stmuk
19:47 krshn thanks
19:47 TimToady but think I've solved the hung install problem
19:47 krshn I did a quick search and yours did not come up
19:48 TimToady (my log of DBIish showed that it probably would have finished eventually, but after doing many, many unnecessary precomps)
19:48 timotimo again and again and again ... :)
19:49 stmuk I did see it finish once .. I guess I was lucky :)
19:49 timotimo what's the function called again that has two arguments and grows incredibly fast?
19:49 timotimo perhaps we were trying to implement that just with precompilation
19:49 timotimo ackermann
19:49 hankache woot! I added a new chapter on functional programming
19:50 krshn stmuk: works on mac
19:50 krshn task::star
19:50 stmuk krshn: thanks for your help .. just retesting on linux
19:50 krshn no problems
19:50 krshn anything else I can help
19:50 krshn I have access to redhat 5, ubuntu, mac yosemite
19:51 FROGGS TimToady: yesterday the also recompiled stuff again and again... might that be related?
19:51 krshn ubuntu 12.4 i think
19:51 krshn pretty dated :-)
19:51 stmuk testing on redhat 5 might be useful ... I guess of us use more recent debianish distros
19:51 krshn ok.. will do it on redhat 5
19:51 FROGGS I used 12.4 until two weeks ago
19:52 TimToady FROGGS: could well be
19:52 FROGGS err, no, 14.4
19:52 hoelzro o/ #perl6
19:52 brrt i'm using fedora but that is quite Ala different beast
19:52 hoelzro I don't have a whole lot of free time today, but is there anything I can help with?
19:52 TimToady there will be a RAKUDO_LOG_PRECOMP envvar that you can watch what it's precomping while it's working
19:52 vv3 joined #perl6
19:52 FROGGS TimToady: nice
19:52 FROGGS hoelzro: hi
19:52 hoelzro o/ FROGGS
19:53 TimToady it works through panda too, that way
19:53 vv3 joined #perl6
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19:54 hankache away for lunch
19:54 hankache will be back later
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19:56 ugexe timotimo: hey, regarding zef status: its still actively developed despite the lack of a recent public release. mostly waiting on precompilation issues and custom CUR loading (loaded before other modules so the custom CUR can not just install but load). I've been lucky to get most of this development time funded, but thats also why I won't release a partially finished result or change the milestones :(
19:56 Rotwang Hi, could someone tell me why:
19:56 ugexe on the plus side it does work with metacpan
19:56 Rotwang m: my @a[0] = 1;
19:56 camelia rakudo-moar 986f98: OUTPUT«Index 0 for dimension 1 out of range (must be 0..-1)␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/44JWEKl7_Z line 1␤␤»
19:57 nine TimToady: what was wrong exactly?
19:57 quux perl 6!
19:57 FROGGS hi quux
19:57 timotimo ugexe: oh, sounds good!
19:58 quux hi
19:58 FROGGS Rotwang: you're declaring an array with a dimension there, an that cannot be zero
19:58 FROGGS m: my @a[1] = 1;
19:58 camelia rakudo-moar 986f98: ( no output )
19:58 Rotwang FROGGS: ok, thanks
19:59 TimToady the rev dependency lists produces lots of duplicates
19:59 jdv79 ugexe: is that usable in anh form?
19:59 TimToady nine: I'll go ahead and check in my "fix", and you can fix it better if you like
19:59 timotimo TimToady: since things pretend they're a list of themselves, should $a[0] := 1 be the same as $a := 1, actually?
20:00 FROGGS TimToady / nine: that fits, I got the feeling the takes longer and longer every time
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20:00 dalek rakudo/nom: 11040a7 | TimToady++ | src/core/CompUnit/Repository/
20:00 dalek rakudo/nom: dedup precomps
20:00 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
20:00 FROGGS timotimo: is that sensible or does that just cover a braino?
20:00 TimToady nine ^^
20:01 timotimo TimToady: what "that" exactly?
20:01 timotimo m: (1, 2, 3)[0] := 1
20:01 camelia rakudo-moar 986f98: OUTPUT«Cannot use bind operator with this left-hand side␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/kR29jFz0aP line 1␤␤»
20:01 vv3 joined #perl6
20:01 timotimo m: (Int)[0] := 1
20:01 camelia rakudo-moar 986f98: OUTPUT«Cannot call BIND-POS(Int: Int, Int); none of these signatures match:␤    (Any:D $: **@indices is raw, *%_)␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/VytyU7jPn6 line 1␤␤»
20:01 timotimo m: (10)[0] := 1
20:01 camelia rakudo-moar 986f98: OUTPUT«Cannot use bind operator with this left-hand side␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/JUzgZehixi line 1␤␤»
20:01 jdv79 interesting.  wonder where all the dups come from.
20:01 timotimo the first one and last one used to hang
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20:03 timotimo i'm just now writing tests that test that these things should throw X::Bind
20:03 timotimo but i'm not entirely sure that's the right thing.
20:03 ugexe jdv79: only as much as metacpan currently allows. im sure you know what the problems are regarding dists actually on metacpan. but it uses the metacpan API to obtain the metadata, and fetches/extracts the .tar.gz archive
20:04 jdv79 the p5 metacpan?
20:04 ugexe yes, i couldnt figure out how to access the api for the version you have on hack (although I tried)
20:04 jdv79 ust curious how you are doing the resolving and recommendation parts
20:05 jdv79 with the auth, ver, api, and different collections to choose from
20:05 nine TimToady: there's already RAKUDO_MODULE_DEBUG with some infrastructure
20:05 sivoais joined #perl6
20:05 jdv79 is there a collection hierarchy?  is there a way to force it to fetch from only one place or block a place.
20:05 TimToady well, this is something a panda --verbose could set if it wanted to
20:05 jdv79 i'd like to get into that soon
20:06 llfourn joined #perl6
20:06 TimToady not sure panda --verbose would want all the debugging...
20:06 tadzik stmuk: yes, me
20:06 raiph joined #perl6
20:06 TimToady nine: I was just trying the simplest thing that could possibly work :)
20:07 ugexe it will use any ContentStorage that is configured in the configuration file (or explicity chosen with a command line flag)
20:07 TimToady and it seems to've, wonder of wonders...
20:07 jdv79 nice
20:07 * TimToady is quite certain he's never see the word "to've" before...
20:07 brrt quite likely
20:08 stmuk
20:08 brrt twas understood though
20:08 nine I'd prefer if we avoided writing redundant entries in the first place so repository implementations wouldn't have to deal with it
20:08 stmuk I'm suggest removing Bailidor and DBIish unless other fixes work
20:08 ugexe versions and auth are hacked together as much as i could do with the current state of metacpan, so as you probably guessed its just string concating to create the identity t should look for
20:08 vv3 joined #perl6
20:08 jdv79 stmuk: i think what TimToady just did may be the ticket, no?
20:09 ugexe and then does some local filtering of meta data to get what you really want
20:09 jdv79 i'm rebuilding now
20:09 nine TimToady: thanks for fixing my bug in any case
20:09 vv3 joined #perl6
20:09 jdv79 ugexe: ok
20:09 stmuk jdv79: yes hence "unless other fixes work
20:10 stmuk :)
20:10 TimToady I successfully precomped DBIish, anyway
20:10 stmuk yay
20:10 TimToady though haven't tried it in my rakudobrew dir
20:10 vv3 joined #perl6
20:10 quux I like the perl talk you gave about lord of the rigns
20:10 quux i'm reading the silmarrilion
20:11 vv3 joined #perl6
20:11 ugexe jdv79: is there a way to access the actual API to the metacpan stuff you have on hack?
20:11 TimToady trying that now...
20:11 jdv79 its there.  port 5000 i think i what you are asking for
20:11 jdv79 what is normally api....
20:11 ugexe$api-stuff
20:12 tadzik stmuk: what's the problem with them, the installation time?
20:13 jdv79 ugexe:
20:14 nine TimToady: don't know if I'll be able to sneak away from Christmas celebrations, so I guess we'll just go with your fix. To my shame the same problem appeared with the .deps files, too, so I could have anticipated rev-deps...
20:14 RabidGravy I'm doing quite well here, only a quarter of the modules thus far have needed fixing
20:14 jdv79 ugexe: that download_url is unforunate - it should be the other port *sigh*
20:14 stmuk tadzik: yes which may be fixed
20:15 sivoais joined #perl6
20:15 ChoHag What's the closest perl6 thing to perldoc Mod::ule?
20:15 tadzik stmuk: but is it already dropped from Star itself? I try to have Task::Star follow that
20:15 ugexe jdv79: ah cool, that will help. i was hoping the <metadata> would use meta-spec 6 (or whatever META6.json is)
20:15 jdv79 Bailadfor installed in 3m here
20:15 jdv79 way better than before ~ 10min
20:16 jdv79 ugexe: in what way.  it is kinda shorhorned atm
20:16 stmuk tadzik: ah I thought Task::Star was master
20:16 jdv79 one of those messy details for later unless its important to you sooner
20:16 jdv79 *shoehorned
20:17 tadzik stmuk: it probably should be somehow integrated, I'm not very good at keeping it up-to-date
20:17 vv3 joined #perl6
20:17 vv3 joined #perl6
20:17 stmuk OK will close PR
20:17 tadzik I'm having a shameful shortage of tuits these... years
20:17 TimToady RandalSchwartz: I think if you 'rakudobrew build moar' again you should be able to finish DBIish now
20:18 TimToady and you can watch its progress now if you say: RAKUDO_LOG_PRECOMP=1 panda --force install DBIish
20:18 jdv79 now what are the chances of finding a resturant open now in berlin.  i'm pretty sure this mission wil fail.
20:18 flussence tadzik: I know the feeling, been procrastinating on some projects since before I started using p6 :(
20:18 vv3 joined #perl6
20:18 jdv79 wow!  DBIish installed in 3m here as well
20:18 ugexe jdv79: i was guessing that all the data was generated *from* the <metadata> field itself, and that the <metadata> field was the meta/makefile data as distributed in the actual distribution. i.e. <metadata> would be the literal META6.json of the distribution
20:18 jdv79 TimToady++
20:19 nine TimToady++ indeed :)
20:19 vv3 joined #perl6
20:19 cxreg TimToady++ # merry 6mas
20:19 tadzik flussence: in my case it embarrasingly coincided with the release of Steam for linux ;P
20:19 flussence I've got no excuse, never got that damn thing to work right :)
20:20 jdv79 ugexe: well, for p5 its something like meta.json transformed into a meta obj thing
20:20 * TimToady was just trying to help out his old pal RandalSchwartz++
20:20 jdv79 it could be different for p6, probably should be.
20:20 jdv79 its largely very similar as far as i've soon so far though
20:21 tadzik Skarsnik: yt?
20:21 cxreg once upon a time there was accomodation for multiple versions/authors of a module loaded at once.  is that still so?
20:21 jdv79 ugexe: what do you need from it?
20:21 jdv79 maybe that'll help give me or whoever direction
20:21 jdv79 but i must at least look for food now.  later.
20:22 cxreg i've become quite fond of nodejs's load-by-reference model that discards the symbol table
20:23 TimToady cxreg: in theory, using 'need' instead of 'use' just loads the module without import, but I dunno if we get name collisions anywhere that way
20:23 TimToady it's possible we're still storing things under the short name, in which case, the short answer is "no"
20:24 TimToady and the long answer is "not yet"
20:24 TimToady :)
20:24 Skarsnik tadzik, yes?
20:24 asht_ joined #perl6
20:25 stmuk does Bailador install?
20:25 vv3 joined #perl6
20:25 sivoais joined #perl6
20:25 vv3 joined #perl6
20:26 stmuk and is the multiple install fix for "unbox" still needed?
20:26 stmuk "fix" :)
20:26 vv3 joined #perl6
20:26 asht_ just installed rukudo on mac os x and windows. panda fails to install Inline::Perl5 on both platforms
20:26 cxreg TimToady: cool.  maybe later?  is it crazy to imagine a version of need/use that skips the symbol table or returns some localized one to the caller?
20:27 cxreg my $Foo-Bar = need Foo::Bar;
20:27 vv3 joined #perl6
20:27 asht_ any one with ideas on what could be wrong? On windows it complains no program ccalled "git" when it tries to get module from goit:://github....
20:28 nine TimToady: I think jnthn++ did some work in that direction, but there's a link missing between module loading and class naming
20:28 pmurias joined #perl6
20:28 stmuk asht_:
20:28 TimToady ==> Successfully installed Task::Star  \o/
20:28 ugexe jdv79: nothing in particular, mostly for ease of use. i have a fallback that tries to generate a meta6 without using the <metadata> field. but things like identity strings for prereqs/depends involving authority/api stuff would work better using the META6 spec i think. i think i might have run into something regarding replacing '::' with '-' like meta-spec 2 does when a module name actually has a '-' in it.
20:28 stmuk asht_: "You will need Windows Git to use panda"
20:28 stmuk TimToady++
20:29 pmurias is there a special christmas rakudo release today?
20:29 TimToady tomorrow
20:29 asht_ where can I get windows GIT?
20:30 TimToady sometime on the 25th, somewhere in the world :)
20:30 stmuk asht_:
20:30 Rotwang What about this one:
20:30 Rotwang m: say (**/2)(4,4)
20:30 camelia rakudo-moar 11040a: OUTPUT«(2 2)␤»
20:31 Rotwang what on earth just happened?
20:32 Bleary joined #perl6
20:33 Rotwang Two stars have special semantics?
20:33 vv3 joined #perl6
20:34 ranguard now being populated from
20:34 vv3 joined #perl6
20:34 TimToady Rotwang: yes, that's a HyperWhatever, works on a list
20:34 stmuk ranguard++
20:34 vendethiel joined #perl6
20:34 vv3 joined #perl6
20:35 sivoais joined #perl6
20:35 TimToady m: say WHAT **
20:35 camelia rakudo-moar 11040a: OUTPUT«(HyperWhatever)␤»
20:35 vv3 joined #perl6
20:36 Rotwang TimToady: thanks, there is much to learn over christmas C:
20:37 * vendethiel waves
20:37 rindolf Hi all! To commemorate the release of Perl 6 , I think I'll translate my solution to the most recent Project Euler problem to Perl 6.
20:38 Skarsnik i:p5 still does not want to install :(
20:40 TimToady installed for me
20:40 TimToady did you rebuild moar?
20:41 vv3 joined #perl6
20:42 vv3 joined #perl6
20:42 perlpilot Who is doing the PSIXDISTS uploads to CPAN?
20:42 ranguard me
20:43 vv3 joined #perl6
20:43 nine Skarsnik: what goes wrong?
20:43 * stmuk confesses his ecosystem module stealing crime to cosimo
20:43 Skarsnik Yes I just nuke and rebuild 10 min ago
20:43 vv3 joined #perl6
20:43 Skarsnik
20:43 perlpilot ranguard: to what end exactly?
20:44 Skarsnik could is be my perl5 version? (5.20)
20:44 ranguard perlpilot:
20:44 stmuk ranguard++ # DoS protection from Chinese Govt
20:45 Bleary Merry Christmas from Melbourne, AU.  Five sugar high children here...  I'm trying to explain my stocking has a programming language in it :-)
20:45 TimToady Skarsnik: are you running this as root?
20:45 ranguard perlpilot: slightly out of date - the version bit... as I need a version that gets indexed to help jdv79 with metacpan6
20:46 RabidGravy stmuk, hey I've just copied a third of a module into one of mine since it never got fixed after the GLR and I only needed ten lines of code
20:46 perlpilot ranguard: yeah, I understand what your doing now.  I had some lingering worries, but they've been answered.  Thanks.
20:47 ranguard :)
20:47 virtualsue joined #perl6
20:48 nine Skarsnik: is your perl cimpiled with -fPIC like the README describes?
20:48 perlpilot So ... how do I upload my Perl 6 stuff to CPAN?  is it just as easy as provising a META6.json in the tarball?
20:49 perlpilot s/provising/providing/
20:49 Skarsnik Yes I am running stuff as root x)
20:49 Skarsnik nine, How I can check that? it's perl5 from debian stable x)
20:49 vv3 joined #perl6
20:49 ranguard perlpilot: and using a subdir of Perl6
20:50 ranguard perlpilot: has instructions
20:50 vv3 joined #perl6
20:50 perlpilot cool.  I may try it in the next week or so.
20:50 labster joined #perl6
20:50 nine perl -V prints a lot
20:51 perlpilot anyway ... Merry Christmas all!
20:51 vv3 joined #perl6
20:51 * perlpilot has to run
20:51 * perlpilot *poof*
20:51 Skarsnik Dynamic Linking:
20:51 Skarsnik dlsrc=dl_dlopen.xs, dlext=so, d_dlsymun=undef, ccdlflags='-Wl,-E'
20:51 Skarsnik cccdlflags='-fPIC', lddlflags='-shared -L/usr/local/lib -fstack-protector'
20:51 Skarsnik I guess it's fine?
20:51 lucasb joined #perl6
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20:52 cxreg does panda pull from cpan?  i thought it was separate
20:52 TimToady Skarsnik: it's possible that perl is automatically turning on tainting when run as root
20:52 ranguard cxreg: not yet
20:52 TimToady so try it outside of root
20:52 cxreg ranguard: oh ok, still the case, thx
20:54 rurban1 joined #perl6
20:54 Skarsnik TimToady, sound like an issue if you can't install I:p5 system wide as root x)
20:55 TimToady yeah, but it's not an xmas issue because we're not promising system-wide installation yet
20:56 atweiden vim users of youcompleteme, i think i figured out why kebab case completions aren't working
20:56 atweiden there needs to be a custom ruleset for p6 at:
20:56 * flussence dryly notes that is massively more helpful than right now, because the former is showing 40% of the ecosystem broken while the latter is claiming everything's all green all the time...
20:56 leont wait status 11 means segfault
20:57 leont Skarsnik: ^
20:57 hallbjorn joined #perl6
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20:58 Skarsnik damn smoke is interesting :)
20:58 vv3 joined #perl6
20:59 vv3 joined #perl6
21:00 leont I'd advice running one of those tests with GDB and see what shows up
21:00 vv3 joined #perl6
21:02 dalek doc: 8e543e3 | (Wenzel P. P. Peppmeyer)++ | doc/Language/operators.pod:
21:02 dalek doc: doc Assignment Operators
21:02 dalek doc: review:
21:02 dalek doc: 7c1a0c0 | (Wenzel P. P. Peppmeyer)++ | doc/Language/operators.pod:
21:02 dalek doc: Merge pull request #262 from gfldex/master
21:02 dalek doc:
21:02 dalek doc: doc Assignment Operators
21:02 dalek doc: review:
21:04 RabidGravy gah, sergot you in the house?
21:05 llfourn joined #perl6
21:05 vv3 joined #perl6
21:06 atweiden rakudo nom fails at `make install`:
21:06 atweiden tools/build/ at issue
21:06 vv3 joined #perl6
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21:08 moritz PSA: now has lambdacamel t-shirts
21:10 ZoffixWin joined #perl6
21:11 ZoffixWin flussence: note that smoke page is like 20 days old
21:12 Guest11856 joined #perl6
21:12 ZoffixWin .oO( second system? )
21:12 tadzik Skarsnik: so I tried the Any/null test, and it works even wihtout the code changes
21:12 hankache joined #perl6
21:12 dalek doc: 12df7b2 | (Wenzel P. P. Peppmeyer)++ | doc/Language/operators.pod:
21:12 dalek doc: explain Meta Operators
21:12 dalek doc: review:
21:12 dalek doc: ad5fae0 | (Wenzel P. P. Peppmeyer)++ | doc/Language/operators.pod:
21:12 dalek doc: Merge pull request #263 from gfldex/master
21:12 dalek doc:
21:12 dalek doc: explain Meta Operators
21:12 dalek doc: review:
21:14 vv3 joined #perl6
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21:15 hallbjorn joined #perl6
21:15 vv3 joined #perl6
21:15 * ZoffixWin wants a black mug with camelia and "Just another Perl 6 hacker" on it...
21:16 vv3 joined #perl6
21:17 leont tap-harness passes its tests again \o/ (though minus a feature until a rakudobug is fixed)
21:18 yqt joined #perl6
21:19 flussence ZoffixWin: that's a very good point (I assume it's been failing to complete a daily run since then), but at the same time, the other one doesn't even have timestamps!
21:20 ZoffixWin flussence: well, at the bottom it says "generated at Dec 24"
21:20 atweiden between 2015.11 release and now, did something change in to make it no longer take DESTDIR (`make DESTDIR=...`) into consideration when checking for path writeability?
21:20 Guest11856 why is perl 6 named "perl 6" if it's a completely new language, isn't it damanging both ecosystems?
21:21 ZoffixWin Guest11856: the answer is "history"
21:21 flussence Guest11856: why is C# named C#?
21:21 ZoffixWin Guest11856: as for damage, I'm not sure why you think there would be any damage.
21:21 ZoffixWin Guest11856: if you care to elaborate, I can answer more questions.
21:21 dalek rakudo/nom: 6c3e8ad | TimToady++ | src/Perl6/Optimizer.nqp:
21:21 dalek rakudo/nom: Suppress usually harmless DISLOCATED MESSAGEs
21:21 dalek rakudo/nom:
21:21 dalek rakudo/nom: The need for this bug flusher outer is largely past.
21:21 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
21:21 dalek rakudo/nom: 08ba7f5 | TimToady++ | tools/build/NQP_REVISION:
21:21 dalek rakudo/nom: bump NQP to get sprintf message fix
21:21 dalek rakudo/nom:
21:21 dalek rakudo/nom: and apparently a lot of other accumulated changes that we'd
21:21 dalek rakudo/nom: better get some time on before release...
21:21 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
21:21 tadzik it's half a tone higher than C, duh
21:21 ZoffixWin tadzik++
21:21 flussence *groan* :)
21:22 dalek nqp: b345d13 | TimToady++ | / (2 files):
21:22 dalek nqp: improve LTA sprintf message
21:22 dalek nqp:
21:22 dalek nqp: Otherwise people are clueless what "directives" mean...
21:22 dalek nqp: review:
21:22 vv3 joined #perl6
21:23 vv3 joined #perl6
21:23 Guest11856 ZoffixWin, it carries all the stigma that perl has over perl 6
21:23 RabidGravy Skarsnik, you know everything about how NativeCall finds the libraries don't you
21:23 leont How can I figure out why my Koalatee score isn't 100%? If I click on the number/link, I get a "Not Implemented Yet" error
21:23 lichtkind joined #perl6
21:23 ZoffixWin Guest11856: which stigma in particular?
21:23 vv3 joined #perl6
21:23 Guest11856 people also thing that perl 6 is just another version of perl, but they're completely different
21:24 ZoffixWin Guest11856: true.
21:24 Guest11856 ZoffixWin, it's old, it's line noise, it's spaghetti, ...
21:24 vv3 joined #perl6
21:24 RabidGravy it works
21:24 flussence I don't think we're targeting the sort of audience that base their entire prejudices on a number or name...
21:24 ZoffixWin Guest11856: but for historical reasons, it's too late to change the name. We just have to make the best out of the situation and if the two communities join together, I believe we can clarify any confusion
21:24 pierre-vigier joined #perl6
21:25 ZoffixWin Guest11856: those arguments can be applied equally to Perl 6, regardless of what it's named. The only one that's not quite true is "it's old."
21:25 Theophane joined #perl6
21:25 Theophane o/
21:26 n0xff joined #perl6
21:26 flussence .oO( if you think the name is bad, wait 'til you bother to read the website for the first time... )
21:26 ZoffixWin Guest11856: you're also leaving the beneficial aspects of the name. Perl is a well-known name.
21:26 ZoffixWin s/leaving/leaving out/;
21:27 cognominal joined #perl6
21:27 Su-Shee oh well why is javascript named after java and it quite emancipated from that...
21:28 joydon joined #perl6
21:28 ZoffixWin Guest11856: and since you mention that the damage is being done to both ecosystem, I disagree with that point. I think Perl 5 can get new users too. Users that haven't been following the Perl world and don't realize that P5 changed significantly. If they don't care about new P6 features, they could go and check out the improvements in P5.
21:29 Theophane Su-Shee: because of commercial interests :)
21:29 Su-Shee Theophane: that was rhetorical to the subject. not a question.
21:29 ZoffixWin Guest11856: what are your thoughts on my reasoning?
21:30 RabidGravy dun trollin
21:30 vv3 joined #perl6
21:30 ZoffixWin Ah :D
21:30 ZoffixWin Oh
21:30 hankache joined #perl6
21:30 Theophane Su-Shee: :P okay
21:30 ZoffixWin Guest11856: ronin! :) The name sounds familiar :)
21:31 vv3 joined #perl6
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21:32 vv3 joined #perl6
21:33 Su-Shee javascript managed very nicely to overcome its bad rep and become hip and clojure managed nicely to be a lisp finally used. perl 5&6 can only learn from that.
21:34 awwaiid HyperWhatever! so many things to learn :)
21:34 rindolf Hi all! With close to latest Rakudo moar, this program does not print the Discord line and instead starts consuming all CPU and RAM - . Why?
21:34 hankache awaiid you like it?
21:35 hankache the hyper operator is one of my favorites, no more for loops
21:36 labster joined #perl6
21:37 * flussence saw hyperwhatever used for the first time a few days ago, and now can't remember what for
21:38 awwaiid hankache: I haven't digested it yet, but I have been fascinated by the "regular" WhateverStar for a while now :)
21:38 vv3 joined #perl6
21:39 rindolf And happy holidays , everybody.
21:39 vv3 joined #perl6
21:39 RabidGravy anyone in a position to help work out how to fix the library function in OpenSSL
21:40 rindolf RabidGravy: the P6 module?
21:40 RabidGravy happy everything rindolf
21:40 vv3 joined #perl6
21:40 rindolf RabidGravy: thanks.
21:40 RabidGravy yeah
21:40 leont What are the Koalatee items anyway? The percentages suggest there are 5, but I can only find suggestions for 4 (has readme, has tests, has source-url and has provides)
21:40 dalek rakudo-star-daily: dca119d | coke++ | log/ (8 files):
21:40 dalek rakudo-star-daily: today (automated commit)
21:40 dalek rakudo-star-daily: review:
21:40 rindolf RabidGravy: ah, where is the code?
21:40 vv3 joined #perl6
21:41 RabidGravy this is the offending file
21:42 flussence RabidGravy: try replacing the bare 'libssl' string with just 'ssl', I think it does some magic if there's no .so appended now
21:44 RabidGravy no tried that, it doesn't do quite the same magic if it's a Routine in the native trait
21:44 flussence ah, dunno then...
21:45 atweiden rakudo isn't building on arch due to this commit:
21:45 atweiden DESTDIR is not being passed to, so the installer thinks a writeable path DNE
21:45 ZoffixWin leont: not having a failing Travis is a point
21:45 rindolf Does anyone have any idea about my problem? Am I doing anything wrong?
21:46 leont I see. Then I'm still not sure which ones I'm failing :-/
21:46 flussence atweiden: thanks for tracking it down! exact same problem's happening on gentoo but I had no idea where to begin
21:46 vv3 joined #perl6
21:47 ZoffixWin leont: which dist?
21:47 leont YAMLish and Path::Iterator
21:48 leont Ow wait, YAMLish is missing a README
21:48 * leont is just blind -_-
21:49 Su-Shee left #perl6
21:49 dalek rakudo/nom: 70ab538 | TimToady++ | src/Perl6/Optimizer.nqp:
21:49 dalek rakudo/nom: whoops, only comment the message, not the return
21:49 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
21:50 rindolf I see - I had a |= instead of a +|= - and it caused the runtime to FUBAR.
21:50 rindolf Now it runs but yields the wrong result . :-(
21:50 awwaiid rindolf: I'm practicing hitting it with LREP; one hting is that if you try to print out $mymin right at Pinkie it hangs; I don't know what is in there but seems bad
21:50 awwaiid ahh
21:50 rindolf awwaiid: ah,
21:51 awwaiid yeah -- $mymin.WHAT -> (Junction)
21:51 awwaiid interesting
21:51 dalek doc: d82b06c | (Wenzel P. P. Peppmeyer)++ | doc/Language/operators.pod:
21:51 dalek doc: doc Assignment Operators
21:51 dalek doc: review:
21:51 dalek doc: c35787f | (Wenzel P. P. Peppmeyer)++ | doc/Language/operators.pod:
21:51 dalek doc: Merge pull request #265 from gfldex/master
21:51 dalek doc:
21:51 dalek doc: doc Assignment Operators
21:51 dalek doc: review:
21:51 awwaiid with your change, $mymin is an Int == 864691128455135232
21:52 * ZoffixWin got distracted
21:52 flussence that looks vaguely 2**63ish
21:52 ZoffixWin leont: YAMLish is losing 20% for missing README
21:52 flussence m: say 2**63
21:52 camelia rakudo-moar 08ba7f: OUTPUT«9223372036854775808␤»
21:52 dalek roast: 57179ad | TimToady++ | S32-str/sprintf.t:
21:52 dalek roast: test for upgraded printf directives message
21:52 dalek roast: review:
21:52 flussence well, some of the digits match...
21:52 travis-ci joined #perl6
21:52 regreg is there any release date for final xmas rakudo on windows?
21:52 travis-ci Rakudo build failed. TimToady 'bump NQP to get sprintf message fix
21:52 travis-ci
21:52 travis-ci left #perl6
21:52 ZoffixWin leont: and so is the other dist
21:52 rindolf what's the equivalent of python -i (= run the script and then enter the REPL with all defs present) in perl6?
21:52 [Tux] joined #perl6
21:53 atweiden flussence: really want to figure this out before christmas
21:53 ZoffixWin leont: sorry, I intend to make a proper Koaleety page that shows what's failing and why and how to fix it.
21:53 flussence atweiden: yeah, me too :(
21:53 ZoffixWin .... when I stop celebrating :)
21:53 * ZoffixWin does another shot
21:53 atweiden i did find this though:
21:53 flussence compunit stuff is way over my head atm...
21:53 awwaiid don't think there is one, but you can try my LREP alternative REPL (which is not as good as the built in one for some definitions, but good for others). For this I did "panda install LREP", dropped "LREP::here" right after Pinkie, then perl6 -MLREP prob539-shlomif.p6 . Then you get a prompt
21:53 atweiden am now rerunning with `make install DESTDIR=... PERL6_LANG_DIR=...`
21:54 pdcawley joined #perl6
21:54 rindolf awwaiid: are you talking to me?
21:54 TimToady .tell [Coke] where are the 6.c tests?  I don't see a branch, and 57179ad needs to go over
21:54 yoleaux TimToady: I'll pass your message to [Coke].
21:54 awwaiid rindolf: biggest drawback right now is that newly defined stuff doesn't get kept
21:54 jdv79 ugexe: so obv you could walk deps one META6 file at a time like does i think or maybe we could setup some special services off metacpan?...
21:54 awwaiid rindolf: yeah sorry, forgot to prefix my reply
21:54 [Coke] TimToady: I thought I pushed to a branch. checking.
21:54 yoleaux 21:54Z <TimToady> [Coke]: where are the 6.c tests?  I don't see a branch, and 57179ad needs to go over
21:54 rindolf awwaiid: OK.
21:55 [Coke] ?
21:55 rindolf Maybe I'll just EVAL A cmd line arg.
21:55 TimToady how come it doesn't show up here as a git branch?
21:55 flussence TimToady: I see a remotes/origin/6.c in my local copy...
21:55 awwaiid rindolf: "LREP::here;" will start a REPL at that line and you can execute many (but not all) things in the context of your script execution
21:56 * [Coke] hopes he didn't screw up the branching.
21:56 lichtkind joined #perl6
21:57 TimToady I guess it doesn't show up here till I checkout it
21:57 labster good postnoon, #perl6
21:57 halto joined #perl6
21:58 [Coke] seems to be fine in a fresh checkout
21:58 [Coke] oh, you found it? ok.
21:58 Skarsnik RabidGravy, mostly, what is your issue?
21:58 [Coke] probably needed a branch -r or -a to see it before you made a local one.
22:00 dalek roast/6.c: 57179ad | TimToady++ | S32-str/sprintf.t:
22:00 dalek roast/6.c: test for upgraded printf directives message
22:00 dalek roast/6.c: review:
22:00 dalek roast/6.c: 0cb65f1 | TimToady++ | S32-str/sprintf.t:
22:00 dalek roast/6.c: Merge commit '57179ad' into 6.c
22:00 dalek roast/6.c: review:
22:00 TimToady did I do it right?
22:00 RabidGravy Skarsnik, actually I think it's cool - just use  $*VM.platform-library-name in the
22:00 TimToady looks like, or it wouldn't have only listed one file
22:00 [Coke] seems plausible. :()
22:00 [Coke] er, :)
22:00 rindolf awwaiid: thanks.
22:01 TimToady funny that a branch is invisible till you co it
22:01 [Coke] how were you looking for it?
22:01 TimToady git branch
22:01 awwaiid need "git branch -a" maybe
22:01 atweiden flussence: it appears setting PERL6_LANG_DIR=... is necessary but not sufficient
22:02 Skarsnik RabidGravy, hoo good find on openssl x) I did not manage to install h:ua so I did not stumble on that
22:02 [Coke] yah, that only shows local branches.
22:02 labster git branch -r
22:02 TimToady ah, yeah, that lists a whole lot more of 'em
22:04 TimToady well, gotta go play my fiddle at a Christmas Eve thingie, so I'd better go take a shower...
22:05 TimToady afk &
22:05 El_Che cheers TimToady , cheers #perl6
22:06 llfourn joined #perl6
22:06 dalek doc: 8fe1835 | (Wenzel P. P. Peppmeyer)++ | doc/Language/operators.pod:
22:06 dalek doc: doc Reversed Operators, the question "why?" remains unanswered.
22:06 dalek doc: review:
22:06 dalek doc: 1cbb2cf | (Wenzel P. P. Peppmeyer)++ | doc/Language/operators.pod:
22:06 dalek doc: Merge pull request #266 from gfldex/master
22:06 RabidGravy sergot, I've sent a PR for OpenSSL
22:06 dalek doc:
22:06 dalek doc: doc Reversed Operators, the question "why?" remains unanswered.
22:06 dalek doc: review:
22:07 * flussence has a sinking realisation that most of the people who'd know how this compunit stuff works aren't gonna be around until tomorrow, if at all...
22:08 pmurias Guest11856: The way 6 relates to 5 in Perl 6 vs Perl 5 is similiar to the way movies and computer games are versioned
22:08 RabidGravy :)
22:09 Skarsnik not a good day for me: Update Gumbo for nativecall change in lib, the module fail on a weird error now. I want to work on Discord module (for a bot of mine) http::ua does not install. I switch to write something to play with a movie format => inline:perl5 does not install xD
22:11 rindolf - I am getting an empty b_exp at the Griffon line.
22:11 Skarsnik too bad, no perl in this x)
22:14 cygx joined #perl6
22:14 cygx merry almost-christmas o/
22:14 vendethiel *g*
22:14 rindolf cygx: it's already 25-Dec here.
22:15 ZoffixWin rindolf: stop bragging, future boy :P
22:15 cygx re flags after arguments and MAIN, one of my scripts actually does this:
22:15 cygx not a general solution, but good enough for what I was doing
22:16 cygx rindolf: are you, like, from the future?
22:16 cygx do you have flying cars yet?
22:16 rindolf cygx: heh.
22:17 Skarsnik rakudo does not like when the build fail in a middle for an external reason (not enought disk space)
22:17 Skarsnik need to nuke everytime lol
22:17 labster stop filling up your disk
22:18 rindolf Anyone knows what the problem is ?
22:18 ZoffixWin_ joined #perl6
22:18 rindolf Griffon b_exp = <2..1> ==> this is wrong.
22:19 Zoffix joined #perl6
22:19 * [Coke] off-topicalyl hurls - his kid's acapella group.
22:19 kjs_ joined #perl6
22:20 dalek rakudo/nom: 9cab516 | labster++ |
22:20 dalek rakudo/nom: document --make-install and --no-clean in
22:20 dalek rakudo/nom: review:
22:20 atweiden flussence: sed -i 's/$.prefix.w/True/g' src/core/CompUnit/Repository/
22:20 atweiden :)
22:20 rindolf Oh, I needed triple dot.
22:20 ZoffixWin left #perl6
22:21 Skarsnik hm
22:21 Skarsnik In file included from src/vm/moar/ops/perl6_ops.c:2:0:
22:21 Skarsnik #include <uv.h>
22:21 Skarsnik /home/piko/.rakudobrew/moar-nom/install/include/moar/moar.h:24:16: fatal error: uv.h: Aucun fichier ou dossier de ce type
22:21 flussence atweiden: that looks... reeeeeeeally wrong but I'll give it a shot
22:21 ZoffixWin__ joined #perl6
22:21 atweiden flussence: what it's not proper sed regex? :)
22:22 flussence if I understand it right, it's changing the code so it thinks all paths are installable to even if they're root-owned
22:23 flussence that'll probably explode the first time someone tries to install a module as a regular user
22:24 flussence (which, admittedly, is an improvement over right now...)
22:24 noda joined #perl6
22:24 labster m: '/'.IO.mkdir # if anyone feels like fixing this one while poking around moar, that would be nice
22:24 camelia rakudo-moar 70ab53: OUTPUT«(signal SEGV)»
22:25 atweiden good point
22:25 atweiden yea it's not a fix
22:26 RabidGravy ouch
22:27 dalek doc: f12060a | ab5tract++ | doc/Language/operators.pod:
22:27 dalek doc: Clarify about assignment meta op
22:27 dalek doc: review:
22:27 kjs_ joined #perl6
22:34 dalek perl6-examples: 26f59ff | (Shlomi Fish)++ | categories/euler/prob539-shlomif.p6:
22:34 dalek perl6-examples: Add a solution to Euler #539.
22:34 dalek perl6-examples:
22:34 dalek perl6-examples: It works but is incredibly crude.
22:34 dalek perl6-examples: review:
22:35 AlexDaniel joined #perl6
22:36 dalek perl6-examples: a4a4673 | (Shlomi Fish)++ | categories/euler/prob539-shlomif.p6:
22:36 dalek perl6-examples: Add missing trailing semicolons.
22:36 dalek perl6-examples: review:
22:36 * rindolf nuzzles dalek
22:36 uruwi joined #perl6
22:36 atweiden flussence: hmm it still doesn't build
22:37 rindolf Wow! these junction operators sure can yield subtle errors if used instead of the bitwise operators.
22:37 atweiden could be because i didn't set PERL6_LANG_DIR
22:41 RabidGravy All sorts of not installing action going on here
22:42 leont Style question: in enum values, would you use Foo-Bar or Foo-bar?
22:44 atweiden nope this is fubar
22:44 flussence :(
22:45 TimToady leont: I'd use whatever looks best in the situation :)
22:45 atweiden flussence: now it's breaking on `my $lock //= $.prefix.child('repo.lock').open(:create, :w);`
22:46 atweiden (line 111 of
22:46 flussence looks like it's trying to write where it's not allowed to...
22:46 RabidGravy I tend to go with CamelCase in enums, but that's just me
22:47 TimToady yeah, as honorary types, I'd tend to CamelCase too
22:47 TimToady I mean, yeah, they're really integers, but they parse like types
22:47 leont My head wants to make Camel Kebab out of it, not sure yet if that's sensible
22:48 flussence I've never used Arch, is it the same as in gentoo where things compile in a sandbox and the package manager merges the result to the live filesystem itself?
22:48 atweiden yes
22:48 flussence yup, guess we're both seeing the exact same problem then
22:48 leont Debian likes to do a similar thing, AFAIK
22:49 Skarsnik still the same issue with i:p5 with a normal user :(
22:50 leont Skarsnik: tried gdb?
22:50 travis-ci joined #perl6
22:50 travis-ci Rakudo build passed. Brent Laabs 'document --make-install and --no-clean in'
22:50 travis-ci
22:50 travis-ci left #perl6
22:51 rickbike joined #perl6
22:53 Skarsnik leont, How I can do that with panda?
22:53 atweiden idk what rakudo/src/core/CompUnit/Repository/ does exactly, but am strongly considering patching in an earlier version
22:53 atweiden idk what that blows up though
22:53 RabidGravy what do we do with a problem like maria
22:53 leont perl6-m-gdb -Ilib t/whatever.t
22:54 flussence it's part of the stuff responsible for precompiling on demand and loading the precomped files
22:54 flussence problem is, it just puts those files wherever
22:54 leont Not sure how to make panda get you there though, there must be a way
22:54 flussence and wants to do so in the middle of compiling rakudo :(
22:55 RandalSchwartz if I do "rakudobrew build moar", is that an incremental build with the latest commits?
22:55 labster joined #perl6
22:55 atweiden earlier version of tools/build/ would probably be more sensical
22:55 atweiden sensible*
22:55 kjs_ joined #perl6
22:56 Skarsnik leont, I mean I git clone I::perl5, I just need to run the configure to make it work?
22:56 leont RandalSchwartz: it's an upgrade, yes
22:56 RandalSchwartz ok thanks
22:56 leont Skarsnik: I think the panda-build command will help you
22:58 Skarsnik running autoload test it sigsev and with perl6-gdb it does nothing
22:58 Theophane hmm
22:59 TimToady hmm, on the throttle.t hangs, it appears to hang on the 8th test, which has these curious lines:
22:59 TimToady my @a; @a[9] = 0; # pre-size array to allow seamless multi-thread updates
22:59 TimToady (1..10).Supply.throttle( $n, { @a[$_] = 1 } ).wait;
22:59 TimToady is @a.sum, 10, "ok with $n at a time";
22:59 Theophane does anyone know if someone released a module with a pipe operator?
22:59 Theophane (or if it's a native operator)
23:00 palfrey joined #perl6
23:00 Skarsnik Should work like any other operator x)
23:00 TimToady is presizing an array really sufficient to allow multi-thread write access?
23:02 flussence ...and ought code like that be able to work seamfully too?
23:02 ZoffixWin joined #perl6
23:02 ZoffixWin joined #perl6
23:02 TimToady .ask jnthn see thread safety question I asked at which might be related to hang of throttle.t
23:02 yoleaux TimToady: I'll pass your message to jnthn.
23:04 nine TimToady: it's a race condition that hits mostly when running parallel tests
23:04 nine TimToady: the block passed to throttle runs too fast
23:05 TimToady is there a safe way to write the test that still, er, tests?
23:05 BenGoldberg joined #perl6
23:05 nine I think it's a genuine bug.
23:06 TimToady is it just load based, or something more structural?
23:06 TimToady it's not like our parallel tests share an eval-server, at least on moar, ifaiu
23:07 TimToady so how could it be anything but load based?
23:08 nine It is load based. The block finishes before some thread handling or Supply's code finishes
23:08 * cygx wonders if we should put the .precomp directories in a central location
23:08 nine Typing on this phone is tedious
23:08 llfourn joined #perl6
23:09 flussence cygx: I tried writing a patch to do that, it didn't really solve anything
23:09 cygx flussence: what was the issue?
23:09 BenGoldberg joined #perl6
23:10 rindolf Good night everyone.
23:10 nine cygx: please read jnthn++'s gist with the module handling design before speculating about changes :)
23:10 flussence my initial reason was a petty "I don't want these cluttering up git-status output" :)
23:10 Joy joined #perl6
23:10 flussence but also I think ugexe mentioned trying to load modules from a readonly filesystem doesn't work because of .precomp also
23:11 cygx nine: there's nqp::const::STAT_PLATFORM_DEV and nqp::const::STAT_PLATFORM_INODE, so the physical location of the file doesn't matter
23:11 biggy joined #perl6
23:12 nine flussence: I thinkbthe read only issue can be fixed in a less drastic way
23:13 nine cygx: I'm not sure I can follow you there
23:13 TimToady cygx: and now's not the time to reorg things
23:15 cygx you can keep the design as-is, but instead of adding .precomp to the location in question, jst use the path's device and inode number to uniquely identify them
23:15 cygx TimToady: sure, just musings about future directions
23:15 nine TimToady: maybe Supply thinks the block is still running, because it only started listening to finish messages when it was already finished
23:16 nine cynx inode number on Windows?
23:16 cygx nine: sure
23:16 cygx NTFS has an equivalent thing, and nqp supports it
23:16 _nadim Merry Christmas, or whatever you belive in or like, to all of you.
23:16 nine and FAT32?
23:17 FROGGS Merry Christmas _nadim :o)
23:18 cygx nine: FAT32 might indeed be a problem
23:19 FROGGS cygx: I don't favour solutions that ties us to filesystems
23:19 Skarsnik ms drop suport for win xp and 7 is soon to come, I don't think there is still a lot of fat32 stuff x
23:19 FROGGS Skarsnik: arn't usb sticks Fat32 usually?
23:20 nine they are
23:20 Skarsnik oh yeah... that
23:20 FROGGS and what if the repo is located on a samba share?
23:20 dalek doc: 381bd11 | skids++ | doc/Language/control.pod:
23:20 dalek doc: Flesh out for loop docs a bit
23:20 dalek doc: review:
23:20 cygx whatif it's located somewhere you don'T have write access?
23:20 FROGGS then you can install
23:21 FROGGS I guess
23:21 FROGGS and also cant precomp
23:22 flussence okay I went and looked up where STAT_PLATFORM_foo values come from, it's libuv
23:22 nine cygx: you ought to be able to write somewhere
23:22 TimToady .oO(compile to memory)
23:23 flussence their stuff makes no mention of ntfs/fat32 specifics, so I gave up looking
23:23 cygx I'm not convinced central storage is the right things to do (additional complexity, garbage collecting the store, ....)
23:23 cygx but at least i principle, it could be made to work
23:23 cygx *in
23:26 jdv79 so is the precomp stuff considered an official part of the release?
23:26 nine Sure, it's's usually just a matter of time, effort and patience (kudos to anyone catching the Babylon 5 reference there :)
23:26 jdv79 as in could it change "under the hood" in 6.c or is that 6.d
23:26 flussence jdv79: it's going in 2015.12, but it's not part of 6.c
23:26 jdv79 stuff like moving file locations and having readable names and such
23:26 cygx but then, creating a .precomp directory somewhere just because you used -I also is somewhat sketchy
23:27 skids jdv79: I would assume only to the extent of what is tested in roast
23:27 jdv79 oh good cause not much is:)
23:27 TEttinger so what happens after 6.z ? 6.alpha ? 6.aa ?
23:27 skids By then everyone wil have gotten used to unicode
23:27 Skarsnik the world end
23:27 cygx TEttinger: unicode's the limit ;)
23:27 TimToady m: say v6.z cmp v6.1
23:27 AlexDaniel TEttinger: hold on, isn't it supposed to take some time between .c and .z?
23:27 camelia rakudo-moar 9cab51: OUTPUT«Less␤»
23:27 flussence after 6.z people start getting angry that the language that's supposed to last a century has gone through 25 changes already
23:28 TimToady so we've just put off having version 6.6.6 for 25 years or so
23:28 ZoffixWin :P
23:28 TEttinger AlexDaniel: isn't perl 6 intended to last like 100 years?
23:28 Theophane :D
23:28 AlexDaniel TEttinger: yea, but first it has to last at least 25 :)
23:29 flussence perl 5's only used a dozen or so major version numbers in the past while, I think we're safe
23:29 RabidGravy I only care if it lasts ~30
23:29 geekosaur keep in mind that it's only going to last 100 years if it continues to evolve
23:30 AlexDaniel RabidGravy: hey, think about your kids!
23:30 geekosaur humans are notoriously bad at predicting the future, after all >.>
23:30 RabidGravy infact maybe only ~13 (until I retire)
23:30 RabidGravy AlexDaniel, no kids
23:30 virtualsue joined #perl6
23:30 nine cygx: -I makes most sense for development where you usually have write permission
23:31 llfourn joined #perl6
23:31 AlexDaniel geekosaur: not if we implement time travel in Perl 6! :)
23:31 Theophane :D
23:33 dalek doc: 1d0000d | (Wenzel P. P. Peppmeyer)++ | doc/Language/operators.pod:
23:33 dalek doc: show of with Hyper Operators
23:33 dalek doc: review:
23:33 dalek doc: e4624b9 | (Wenzel P. P. Peppmeyer)++ | doc/Language/ (2 files):
23:33 dalek doc: Merge remote-tracking branch 'upstream/master'
23:33 dalek doc: review:
23:33 dalek doc: 047a3cf | (Wenzel P. P. Peppmeyer)++ | doc/Language/operators.pod:
23:33 dalek doc: Merge pull request #267 from gfldex/master
23:33 dalek doc:
23:33 dalek doc: show of with Hyper Operators
23:33 dalek doc: review:
23:33 flussence .oO( the worst-case scenario is someone invents brain-uploading, and we'll end up being unwilling maintenance programmers trying to keep 6.c code working in 2115 )
23:34 AlexDaniel flussence: we in 2115. You are rather optimistic
23:34 nine Time for need. Good night all!
23:34 nine for bed
23:34 flussence o/
23:34 jdv79 later
23:35 cygx flussence: sorry, but we'll likely be dead when that becomes a reality
23:35 cygx it's in fact one of the more plausible sci-fi technologies
23:35 jdv79 not if ray kurzweil is right
23:35 cygx in contrast to, say, FTL travel
23:36 jdv79 iirc he believes we'll achive immmoratily before he _would have_ died
23:38 cygx in the not-too-distant future (relatively speaking), it might be possible to fork a brain, so to speak
23:38 pdcawley Hmm... what does 'Unknown QAST node type NQPMu' mean?
23:38 jdv79 my guess is "a serious problem"
23:39 AlexDaniel cygx: yeah, would be great to use my right to fork in case of some people.
23:40 BenGoldberg joined #perl6
23:40 AlexDaniel pdcawley: well, just another LTA error, I guess.
23:40 pdcawley LTA?
23:40 AlexDaniel pdcawley: report it if possible :)
23:40 AlexDaniel pdcawley: Less Than Awesome
23:41 pdcawley AlexDaniel: Ah.
23:41 pdcawley Let's see if I can reduce it first.
23:42 pdcawley Hmm... I think it might be me just making shit up and expecting the computer to understand it.
23:43 pdcawley map { :w<$^w>, :h<$^h> } (1,2), (2,3), ... is all kinds of wrong isn't it?
23:43 AlexDaniel pdcawley: basically, this error message is not wrong, possibly. But it is definitely less than awesome because someone ended up asking what it means here. That kind of stuff usually comes up when something weird happens internally.
23:44 flussence needs a comma after the } in any case
23:44 flussence m: map { :w<$^w>, :h<$^h> } (1,2), (2,3)
23:44 camelia rakudo-moar 9cab51: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/LBal7cIYwE␤Missing comma after block argument to map␤at /tmp/LBal7cIYwE:1␤------> 3map { :w<$^w>, :h<$^h> }7⏏5 (1,2), (2,3)␤    expecting any of:␤        infix␤        infix stopper␤»
23:44 pdcawley flussence: It actually _does_ in the code that caused the error.
23:44 AndyDee joined #perl6
23:44 flussence hrm
23:44 flussence m: map { :w<$^w>, :h<$^h> }, (1,2), (2,3)
23:44 camelia rakudo-moar 9cab51: OUTPUT«Cannot call map(Hash, List, List); none of these signatures match:␤    (&code, + is raw)␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/TQaXGrVWjH line 1␤␤»
23:45 pdcawley m: map { :w<$^w> :h<$^h> }, (1,2), (3,4)
23:45 BenGoldberg_ joined #perl6
23:45 camelia