Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2016-02-29

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:12 FreezerburnV joined #perl6
00:12 FreezerburnV Hello all
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00:25 timotimo hello mister burns :P
00:29 FreezerburnV timotimo, Smithers! Pull the lever to drop this man through the floor! ...what do you mean the inspectors had it removed for "safety reasons"? I guess you're safe for today
00:30 timotimo :3
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01:03 flussence uhm, panda just took upwards of 50 minutes to install and strace showed it going crazy with unlink in .precomp dirs for most of that. just thought I should mention it...
01:07 timotimo are we deleting old, incompatible precompiled versions?
01:08 flussence I'm doing this from fresh clones (git clean -dfx) of rakudo, its subrepos and panda each time, so no
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01:32 dalek DBIish: 234c6fa | (Salvador Ortiz)++ | META (2 files):
01:32 dalek DBIish: META.info -> META6.json
01:32 dalek DBIish: review: https://github.com/perl6/DBIish/commit/234c6fa029
01:34 sortiz japhb, Missing the changed META.info, fixing now...
01:35 dalek ecosystem: 73434b5 | (Salvador Ortiz)++ | META.list:
01:35 dalek ecosystem: DBIish: META.info -> META6.json
01:35 dalek ecosystem: review: https://github.com/perl6/ecosystem/commit/73434b5747
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02:13 dalek DBIish: be2a2b2 | (Salvador Ortiz)++ | META6.json:
02:13 dalek DBIish: Remove 'Role'
02:13 dalek DBIish: review: https://github.com/perl6/DBIish/commit/be2a2b2a3c
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02:24 sortiz "Missing serialize REPR function for REPR CPointer" in Panda::Installer.install line 61, Trying to install DBIish. Ideas anyone?
02:30 skids Somehow a NativeCall CPointer got into a constant fold?  Just guessing.
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02:35 sortiz DBDish::Pg now uses "class PGconn is export is repr('CPointer') { ...", dunno if the 'is export' can be a problem.
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02:47 Topic for #perl6 is now »ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | https://perl6.org/ | evalbot usage: 'p6: say 3;' or rakudo:,  or /msg camelia p6: ... | irclog: http://irc.perl6.org or http://colabti.org/irclogger/irclogger_logs/perl6 | UTF-8 is our friend!
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02:51 dalek ecosystem: 1191b55 | (Anthony Parsons)++ | META.list:
02:51 dalek ecosystem: g/flussence/d
02:51 dalek ecosystem:
02:51 dalek ecosystem: I've decided to drop the few modules I had here for various reasons. Shouldn't
02:51 dalek ecosystem: cause problems; I don't know of anyone that was actually using these, but I'll
02:51 dalek ecosystem: leave the repos up temporarily just in case.
02:51 dalek ecosystem: review: https://github.com/perl6/ecosystem/commit/1191b5536d
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02:52 FreezerburnV Can I use rakudobrew to build a specific commit of rakudo from git?
02:55 FreezerburnV Looks like I can. That was easy
02:56 FreezerburnV Hm, apparently rakudobrew wants to build 32 bit on my 64 bit system, which removes JIT ability. How can I force it to build 64 bit?
03:01 diakopter now it'll be really negative
03:02 diakopter (ecosystem)
03:05 FreezerburnV :D FROGGS fixed the "output to stdout breaks compiling" issue (or at least bandaided it, according to the commit)
03:05 skids FreezerburnV: I've never heard of that behavior.  Any idea why it detects 32-bit?
03:06 FreezerburnV skids, No clue :( All I know is I saw it flash by during compiling to test a commit of rakudo that JIT was disabled due to compiling for x86 on windows
03:06 FreezerburnV Lemme up the number of buffers in the command prompt and do another build to see if I can put something into a gist for you
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03:10 diakopter flussence: dare I ask the various reasons?
03:10 skids Hrm, well, me not using windows, maybe someone else will have an easier time figuring it out.
03:12 flussence diakopter: complete lack of motivation, mostly. I'd rather get it out the way now while they're only slightly bitrotted and buggy
03:12 diakopter did the 50 minutes to install panda contribute?
03:14 diakopter flussence: or did you mean it took 50 minutes to use panda to install other things?
03:14 flussence oh, that 50 minutes was ./bootstrap.pl
03:17 FreezerburnV skids, Actually I might be wrong abotu that 32-bit build. Another line mentioned detecting 64-bit. So I'm not actually sure what I have built
03:20 flussence diakopter: but yeah, it did make me realise this stopped being -Ofun for me months ago. I haven't actually done anything interesting in a *long* time, my perl6 time's been completely burned up on dealing with breakage I'm not responsible for.
03:22 skids I take it actually having users might have helped a bit too -- I know I find that discouraging.
03:22 skids (not having them, that is)
03:31 sortiz flussence, I can share your frustration. Right now I'm fighting with CURI with problems *installing* DBIish. :(
03:31 diakopter O_O
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03:42 ugexe just use zef to install panda instead of using bootstrap.pl
03:51 sortiz skids++, You were right, the install time precomp fails 'cus I was using 'constant SQLITE_TRANSIENT = Pointer.new(-1);'
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03:55 skids That'd do it.
03:58 sortiz skids, CPointer REPR should implement a basic serialization for this cases, seems doable.
04:01 skids I wouldn't know enough to comment, other than it would have to be for special cases known to be impossible to dereference on the given architecture.
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04:13 sortiz skids, Anyway thank you so much, I could not find the problem without your hint.
04:15 skids np glad to help
04:17 sortiz pro
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04:19 dalek DBIish: 6f13c35 | (Salvador Ortiz)++ | lib/DBDish/SQLite (2 files):
04:19 dalek DBIish: SQLite: Should not declare a constant Pointer
04:19 dalek DBIish:
04:19 dalek DBIish: Fails at install time with a cryptic
04:19 dalek DBIish: "Missing serialize REPR function for REPRCPointer"
04:19 dalek DBIish: review: https://github.com/perl6/DBIish/commit/6f13c35d2e
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05:51 skids .tell jnthn Another S17 question: should Channel.fail immediately discard unreceived items in the queue?  Currently it does not seem to.
05:51 yoleaux skids: I'll pass your message to jnthn.
05:54 dalek doc: a7468f3 | skids++ | doc/Type/Channel.pod:
05:54 dalek doc: Sundry updates/elaborations.
05:54 dalek doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/a7468f33e0
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07:18 buharin hello my friends
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07:43 buharin how to convert enum to string?
07:48 sortiz m: my enum Foo ( A => 0, B => 1, D => 2 ); dd A.key; say A.value;
07:48 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«"A"␤0␤»
07:50 buharin :)
07:50 buharin thanks
07:50 sortiz m: my enum Foo ( A => 0, B => 1, D => 2 ); say ~A; say A;
07:50 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«A␤A␤»
07:51 sortiz m: my enum Foo ( A => 0, B => 1, D => 2 ); say ~A; say A + B
07:51 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«A␤1␤»
07:51 buharin m: dd "asd";
07:51 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«"asd"␤»
07:52 sortiz Enums are context dependent.
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07:53 sortiz m: my enum Foo ( A => 0, B => 1, D => 2 ); dd ~A, A, +A;
07:53 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«"A"␤Foo::A␤0␤»
07:58 moritz \o
07:58 sortiz \o moritz
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08:03 buharin hey what is this? https://github.com/perl6/roast
08:03 buharin it is language tests?
08:03 buharin isnt
08:03 moritz yes, language tests
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08:10 buharin moritz, how to pass by ref? is ref?
08:10 buharin it won't work
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08:11 moritz buharin: what are you trying to achieve?
08:11 moritz passing is by read-only reference by default
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08:33 sortiz .tell japhb The DBIish install time issues are solved and a PR opened in MoarVM for a definite fix. Thanks for your report.
08:33 yoleaux sortiz: I'll pass your message to japhb.
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09:01 dalek ecosystem: 44e38d6 | (Dean Powell)++ | META.list:
09:01 dalek ecosystem: Add Locale-Codes-Country to ecosystem
09:01 dalek ecosystem:
09:01 dalek ecosystem: See https://github.com/PowellDean/Locale-Codes-Country.git
09:01 dalek ecosystem: review: https://github.com/perl6/ecosystem/commit/44e38d64c0
09:01 dalek ecosystem: 9b9cdc7 | RabidGravy++ | META.list:
09:01 dalek ecosystem: Merge pull request #163 from PowellDean/master
09:01 dalek ecosystem:
09:01 dalek ecosystem: Add Locale-Codes-Country to ecosystem
09:01 dalek ecosystem: review: https://github.com/perl6/ecosystem/commit/9b9cdc7ec1
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09:16 RabidGravy MARNING!
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09:17 sortiz \o RabidGravy
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09:34 RabidGravy someone be a love and make something that pretends to be an icecast server
09:34 Hotkeys Marnin
09:34 RabidGravy erp
09:35 RabidGravy I've been testing Audio::Libshout along with all my other modules quite frequently and it's been passing
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09:39 RabidGravy however on actually trying to use it last night I discovered that it wasn't actually sending anything to the server, because of ye old Native typeconstraint thing deep in some async code
09:39 RabidGravy and of course failing silently
09:39 Hotkeys Spooky
09:46 * sortiz Learned, also, that one should install and use the modules and don't depend only on passing tests. :)
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09:47 pmurias hi
09:47 Hotkeys Hi
09:48 Hotkeys Speaking of modules I really should get around to writing Lingua::En::Pluralize that I made a repo for ages ago
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09:49 pmurias ugexe: is there anything stoping zef from becoming a panda replacement?
09:49 sortiz Too much golf? Hotkeys ;-)
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09:55 RabidGravy maybe if I do another set of tests that by-pass the async parts
09:56 sortiz What needs a dummy icecast server?
09:56 Hotkeys sortiz: I haven't done much golfing recently either
09:57 Hotkeys I've been fretting about school stuff mostly
09:57 Hotkeys How much I dislike my history class etc.
09:59 sortiz Hotkeys, just joking.
10:02 RabidGravy sortiz Audio::Libshout - I can test that it *thinks* it sent something but without actually *listening* to the resultant stream I don't know whether it was any good :)
10:06 RabidGravy If I get a minute I may actually have a look at making one, after all if you can make one in javascript (StreamMachine) how difficult can it be?
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10:08 RabidGravy it's basically HTTP with some custom parts and a lot of chunks sent over an open connection
10:12 sortiz I've never worked on audio apps.
10:18 * jnthn last did audio stuff when he was in his teens :)
10:18 yoleaux 05:51Z <skids> jnthn: Another S17 question: should Channel.fail immediately discard unreceived items in the queue?  Currently it does not seem to.
10:19 jnthn Had fun programming simple reverb/delay effects :)
10:21 sortiz Sound funny ;)
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10:27 jnthn .tell skids No, it defaults to not losing information.
10:27 yoleaux jnthn: I'll pass your message to skids.
10:28 jnthn .tell skids I expect it'd be sort-of easy to write a subclass that did that
10:28 yoleaux jnthn: I'll pass your message to skids.
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10:47 dalek nqp: 11bebcb | (Pawel Murias)++ | src/vm/js/Compiler.nqp:
10:47 dalek nqp: [js] Use a cheating source looking heuristic to determin in which way we should compile a block.
10:47 dalek nqp:
10:47 dalek nqp: The previous one was broken by the optimizer.
10:47 dalek nqp: If we guess incorrectly the semantics of the generated code shouldn't be broken.
10:47 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/11bebcb142
10:47 dalek nqp: 8064bfb | (Pawel Murias)++ | src/vm/js/nqp-runtime/ (14 files):
10:47 dalek nqp: [js] Fix errors found by js-lint.
10:47 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/8064bfbf90
10:47 dalek nqp: d023883 | (Pawel Murias)++ | src/vm/js/ (7 files):
10:47 dalek nqp: [js] Uncuddle else/elsif
10:47 dalek nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/d023883283
10:54 lizmat good *, #perl6!
10:56 jnthn o/ lizmat
10:57 lizmat jnthn  o/
11:06 pmurias \o
11:07 llfourn o/
11:11 RabidGravy actually I'm wondering if I actually need to make that much of an icecast server really, it just needs to check there's a PUT, check the auth header matches what I sent, check the content type and content length and the jobs a good un
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12:08 dalek DBIish: 6f4452f | (Salvador Ortiz)++ | .travis.yml:
12:08 dalek DBIish: Make travis-ci do an install
12:08 dalek DBIish:
12:08 dalek DBIish: For a more complete testing.
12:08 dalek DBIish: review: https://github.com/perl6/DBIish/commit/6f4452f97a
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12:09 moritz sortiz++
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12:13 dalek ecosystem: 6271bd4 | RabidGravy++ | META.list:
12:13 dalek ecosystem: Rename META for Audio::Libshout
12:13 dalek ecosystem: review: https://github.com/perl6/ecosystem/commit/6271bd4d22
12:19 llfourn why don't we add v6.c spectest to travis on rakudo?
12:20 Skarsnik will take forever?
12:21 llfourn is that the reason? it's not like you have to wait for it.
12:23 moritz llfourn: iirc there's a 20min timeout on one core, or something like that
12:23 moritz llfourn: which is also the reason why rakudo doesn't run spectests at all on travis
12:23 llfourn ah ok
12:24 moritz llfourn: if you do a bit of research and it turns out that's not the case anymore, that would be awesome :-)
12:24 * llfourn takes a look
12:25 llfourn If a script or test suite takes longer than 50 minutes (or 120 minutes on travis-ci.com)
12:25 llfourn https://docs.travis-ci.com/user/customizing-the-build/#Build-Timeouts
12:25 llfourn I don't think that make spectest should take 2 hours even on one core
12:26 * llfourn searches for other limitations
12:27 moritz memory might be interesting
12:28 llfourn it seems in May 2013 they increased it to 50mins
12:28 moritz though since the core build works, it can't be that bad :-)
12:28 moritz ah right, .org is the free and open source version, and .com is the commercial one
12:28 llfourn ah
12:28 moritz so the 50min limit is the one that applies to us
12:29 llfourn yeah 50min might be too tight
12:29 moritz (just yesterday I listened to a podcast with the travis folks)
12:29 llfourn (wouldn't mind listening to a podcast like that)
12:31 llfourn moritz: https://www.producthunt.com/podcasts/continuous-integration-with-travis-ci-josh-kalderimis-python-test-podcast #?
12:34 llfourn oh no he's a kiwi
12:44 vendethiel joined #perl6
12:54 moritz llfourn: yes
13:15 esh joined #perl6
13:15 * [Coke] ~~
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13:42 dalek ecosystem: 31a020c | (Lance Wicks)++ | META.list:
13:42 dalek ecosystem: Add new Scientist module
13:42 dalek ecosystem:
13:42 dalek ecosystem: This is a WIP port of the Perl5 Scientist module into Perl6.
13:42 dalek ecosystem: It does not have all features yet.
13:42 dalek ecosystem: review: https://github.com/perl6/ecosystem/commit/31a020cf62
13:42 dalek ecosystem: 0e8a642 | azawawi++ | META.list:
13:42 dalek ecosystem: Merge pull request #162 from lancew/patch-1
13:42 dalek ecosystem:
13:42 dalek ecosystem: Add new Scientist module
13:42 dalek ecosystem: review: https://github.com/perl6/ecosystem/commit/0e8a642c54
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13:52 sortiz Using -Ifoo when running perl6 modify the precompilation behavior ? (I see a foo.precomp directory created, something more)
13:53 jnthn sortiz: Yes, it creates a .precomp directory under -Ilib directories to store precomps
13:54 sortiz Asking 'cus: with RAKUDO_LOG_PRECOMP=1, RAKUDO_MODULE_DEBUG=1 and a clean ~/.perl6, running "perl6 -Ilib t/foo.t" the only that I see precompiled is "Test". None of the involves modules.
13:54 nine_ Other than that precompilation works exactly the same. I even centralized the code for "load an existing precomp file, otherwise precompile and load the result". There's not much repository specific code involved anymore.
13:55 nine_ sortiz: remove lib/.precomp before running that
13:56 sortiz Nuked, re running and saving the output...
13:59 sortiz The same results: https://gist.github.com/salortiz/5abae4b898666c4f9d2c
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14:00 sortiz nine_, When those changes landing in nom?
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14:02 sortiz That test involve the use of a constant pointer.
14:02 nine_ sortiz: The centralized code is already in nom. method try-load in PrecompilationRepository
14:04 nine_ That looks quite odd
14:04 sortiz Updating rakudo...
14:04 nine_ What does your t/foo.t look like?
14:06 sortiz It's DBDish's t/40-sqlite-common.t
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14:08 sortiz I'm testing with and without "constant Foo = Pointer.new(-1)", but can't see the precompilation attempt.
14:08 nine_ Oh that's interesting. It uses "need"
14:08 araujo joined #perl6
14:09 sortiz Indeed. I uses "need" whenever a module does not export anything.
14:10 sortiz (to avoid the "import" step)
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14:15 nine_ Aaah
14:15 nine_ use v6; use Test; use lib 't/lib'; <--- you're changing the repo chain after loading a module. This deactivates all precompilation.
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14:16 rudi_s Hi. Is this expected?
14:17 rudi_s m: say "".split("x", :skip-empty).perl
14:17 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«("",)␤»
14:17 sortiz Ok, something like that I was thinking when asked the question obove!!
14:17 rudi_s I'd expect to get just ().
14:17 sortiz *above
14:18 nine_ sortiz: you asked about commandline -I which is save as that happens before the first use or need statement :)
14:18 perlpilot m: say "foo".split("x", :skip-empty).perl;
14:18 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«("foo",)␤»
14:18 perlpilot rudi_s: For the same reason as that one.
14:19 perlpilot rudi_s: er, you get "" in yours for the same reason I get "foo" in mine
14:19 rudi_s perlpilot: I see. The extra "" feel a little confusing though.
14:19 DrForr '' isn't empty, it's nonexistent :)
14:20 rudi_s Well ...
14:20 dalek doc: 38f902a | (Simon Ruderich)++ | doc/Type/Str.pod:
14:20 dalek doc: Str: split: use .perl in examples
14:20 dalek doc:
14:20 dalek doc: Shows the exact return value (Str vs. Int) and makes it clear when empty
14:20 dalek doc: strings are returned.
14:20 dalek doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/38f902a5f8
14:20 dalek doc: 45447c7 | (Simon Ruderich)++ | doc/Type/Str.pod:
14:20 dalek doc: Str: split: add splitting the empty string as example
14:20 dalek doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/45447c705e
14:21 sortiz nine, sure, not the same question, I'm searching...,  I wasn't aware that a "use lib ..." disables precompilation.
14:21 nine_ We should advertise that fact better
14:22 sortiz Ok, but seams that not at install time, though.
14:23 nine_ The install code does not do that use lib 't/lib' from the test script
14:24 sortiz You right, now is clear.
14:27 lizmat afk for a few hours&
14:29 sortiz nine_, Thank you for your time.
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14:36 chris2 hi. i'm running panda --notests install Task::Star on a fresh installed system, and it fails with Terminal::ANSIColor:ver<*>:auth<>:api<> already installed
14:36 chris2 probably because Grammar::Debugger already depended on that
14:38 nine_ Now that I think of it, with the work I'm doing, we may even be able to relax the no precomp after use lib rule somewhat.
14:38 tadzik huh, that shouldn't be happening
14:38 tadzik it shouldn't attempt to install modules that are already in
14:38 chris2 there are no modules initially
14:38 tadzik chris2: were all of those modules installed by panda?
14:38 chris2 but it shouldnt attempt to install modules it already installed as deps
14:39 tadzik yep
14:39 chris2 the system has nqp, moarvm and panda installed
14:39 llfourn nine_: I thought use lib just meant that it would just change the head repo not that it would never precomp anything after that
14:39 chris2 does panda already pull in Terminal::ANSIColor?
14:39 tadzik so, steps to reproduce is: install fresh rakudo, fresh panda, install Grammar::Debugger, install Task::Star?
14:39 tadzik chris2: no, it doesn't
14:39 chris2 tadzik: just Task::Star
14:39 tadzik oh
14:40 tadzik so it first installs grammar::debugger, for which it installs Term::ANSIColor, and then installs Term::ANSIColor itself?
14:40 tadzik and that fails?
14:40 chris2 look slike it
14:40 tadzik stupid bug
14:40 tadzik and yes, it is a bug :)
14:40 tadzik you can probably workaround by --force installing Task::Star
14:40 tadzik which is hardly ideal
14:40 chris2 http://sprunge.us/eDKC output
14:40 tadzik dependency resolution in panda could clearly be better
14:41 tadzik yeah, I see the problem
14:41 chris2 lets try force
14:42 chris2 that helps
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14:42 tadzik it'll also install things that have tests failing
14:43 chris2 i skip tests :P
14:43 sortiz tadzik, In fact I expect that an attempt to install some module already installed don't proceed until the error reported by CURI.
14:43 tadzik I don't like how --force ended up
14:43 tadzik sortiz: I don't think I understand
14:43 perlpilot .oO(  May you never need to use the --force )
14:43 perlpilot .oO( May the --force *not* be with you? )
14:44 chris2 are these hashed file names going to stay btw?
14:44 perlpilot There's a good star wars pun in there somewhere
14:44 sortiz If I have, for example DBIish installed, what is the correct form for update it?
14:45 tadzik just panda install should work, provided that the version actually changed
14:45 gfldex chris2: the files names will stay, error messages will improve
14:46 tadzik wow, --force is even documented as "install even if the module's already installed"
14:47 tadzik I'd think --update may feel less...forced
14:47 tadzik --force sounds like a fancy --notests
14:48 tadzik I don't like what panda became over time :/
14:48 tadzik good thing the QA hackathon is soon :)
14:48 chris2 there is only one version for each module?
14:49 tadzik where? )
14:49 tadzik :)
14:49 tadzik there can be many version in the ecosystem
14:49 chris2 they are not listed on the website
14:50 tadzik modules.perl6.org?
14:50 chris2 yeah
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14:50 chris2 and the META files i looked at only had one
14:50 tadzik well, by spec we rakudo implementation we can have many versions
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14:50 chris2 is there a way to tell panda which one to install?
14:50 nine_ llfourn: with the current implementation we only load precomp files from one single repository. If you load a module and then do a use lib, you change the head repo and thereby change the repository we would load precomp files from. We cannot guarantee that this would work, so we disable precomp in that case.
14:51 tadzik chris2: I *think* panda knows how to do that
14:51 tadzik if it actually detects more than one available
14:51 tadzik thing is, I don't think we have even one such occurence "in the wild"
14:51 llfourn nine_: ah ok I always thought that it had to be the first statement anyway... in which case I think it works?
14:52 chris2 tadzik: this essentially means it will be impossible to install todays version tomorrow, yes? :P
14:52 chris2 i know this is all new and beta
14:53 tadzik chris2: well, if you can get ahold of it, you will be :)
14:53 tadzik so this is how it looks:
14:53 tadzik modules.perl6.org only provides one META.info per module in the ecosystem
14:53 tadzik panda installs stuff from there, so it can only install the latest (only) versions available
14:53 nine_ llfourn: yes, you may change $*REPO as much as you like before loading modules
14:54 tadzik if you, say, clone the git repo with the module, roll it back a couple commits and tell panda to install that, it'll do it just fine
14:54 perlpilot tadzik: are you planning on redesigning panda at the QA hackathon?
14:54 tadzik (should)
14:54 tadzik perlpilot: yes
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14:54 tadzik perlpilot: possibly before :)
14:54 llfourn nine_: cool thanks for clearing that up :)
14:54 nine_ tadzik: panda should really check if a dist is already installed before installing again.
14:54 tadzik but I got a bit out of the loop on a lot of things, and I'm gonna need the company of all the competent people at QAH :)
14:54 tadzik nine_: agreed
14:54 chris2 but when repos dont tag releases etc it is quite a mess to figure out
14:54 llfourn nine_: also ++ for working on precomp it really helps
14:54 tadzik nine_: I hope CUR allows that? :)
14:55 tadzik I hate it when software throws when you try to do something, but doesn't tell *if* you can do something
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14:55 perlpilot tadzik++ good luck!  :)
14:55 tadzik perlpilot: thanks, I'll probably need it :)
14:56 tadzik chris2: that's a problem we have, our module ecosystem, since the dawn of time, is "a list of git repos"
14:56 tadzik ironically, it makes it hard to managed multiple version of stuff
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14:56 perlpilot tadzik: having a few smart people handy gives you better odds than "luck" :)
14:56 tadzik :) yeah
14:56 chris2 fun to hear given than cpan should be well known to everyone :~
14:57 kjs_ good afternoon. Does anyone know how to detect whether a JSON parser just parsed the value null.
14:58 skids tadzik: that's simply a matter of not actually utilizing the features of a git repo... e.g. defining a standard for tags that are significant to the installer.
14:58 yoleaux 10:27Z <jnthn> skids: No, it defaults to not losing information.
14:58 yoleaux 10:28Z <jnthn> skids: I expect it'd be sort-of easy to write a subclass that did that
15:00 skids .tell jnthn thanks. I'd say it might be worth 6.d consideration to add a method which does flush the queue, otherwise Channel code gets fugly when you want to handle cancellation like that.
15:00 yoleaux skids: I'll pass your message to jnthn.
15:02 nine_ tadzik: there's a $*REPO.resolve($dependency-specification) method now that returns a CompUnit if it found one and Nil otherwise. What panda and zef actually need however would be something that takes a Distribution object.
15:02 kjs_ note to self: ah, I think evaluating the value in a boolean context is the way to do it.
15:02 tadzik skids: yeah, and good lack getting your module authors to do that :P
15:03 tadzik nine_: is Distribution still something specced that module managers are expected to define on their own?
15:05 skids tadzik: I'd leave the task of wrangling the module authors to the users, filing issues or PRs.  They seem to want it :-)
15:05 tadzik skids: ye, that might even work :P
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15:10 nine_ tadzik: yes and now. ugexe++ has done a lot of thinking on the topic and in short: Distribution should become a role. Concrete implementations are provided by the Repository classes _and_ module managers. A module manager might want to provide a Distribution::Tar or Distribution::Directory class while Repository::Installation may provide a Distribution class that deals with all our SHA-1 fun
15:11 nine_ So the module manager may ask $*REPO for some name, auth, version (exact match) and get a Distribution object back. Or Nil if it's not installed.
15:11 nine_ I wonder how that method may be called
15:12 tadzik makes sense
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15:17 rudi_s Is return %() the correct way to return an empty hash in a function?
15:17 jnthn return {} is another way
15:17 yoleaux 15:00Z <skids> jnthn: thanks. I'd say it might be worth 6.d consideration to add a method which does flush the queue, otherwise Channel code gets fugly when you want to handle cancellation like that.
15:17 rudi_s jnthn: Ah, too easy. Thanks.
15:20 chris2 does the perl6 repl with linenoise not understand utf8 lengths?
15:20 rudi_s Is there a "return" out of a block?
15:20 rudi_s I just want to skip the rest of the block.
15:20 jnthn rudi_s: no; use a sub instead of a block if you want to use return
15:21 jnthn rudi_s: If you're in a loop, there's also `next` to skip the current iteration
15:21 rudi_s Ok, thanks.
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15:22 perlpilot Or just use goto   ;)
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15:29 dalek DBIish: 2baf7aa | (Salvador Ortiz)++ | META6.json:
15:29 dalek DBIish: Use a real version (now at 0.1.0) in META6.json
15:29 dalek DBIish: review: https://github.com/perl6/DBIish/commit/2baf7aafeb
15:29 dalek DBIish: 4986523 | (Salvador Ortiz)++ | .travis.yml:
15:29 dalek DBIish: Merge branch 'master' of github.com:perl6/DBIish
15:29 dalek DBIish:
15:29 dalek DBIish: A local change in .travis-yml
15:29 dalek DBIish: review: https://github.com/perl6/DBIish/commit/49865237de
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15:40 jaldhar hello.  I was trying to compile nqp for rakudo 2016.2 on Ubuntu Linux 14.04 and one test fails  in t/nqp/60-bigint.t is that a known problem?
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15:46 perlpilot jaldhar: can you make a gist of the failure?  I don't remember any test failures when I compiled Rakudo on ubuntu 14.04, but I may have just missed it.
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15:47 Skarsnik sortiz++ for DBIish version
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15:55 lucs Given "a〔", how can I obtain its ostensible length (3)?
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15:56 DrForr m: say "a〔".chars
15:56 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«2␤»
15:56 lucs Same for .codes.
15:57 lucs (which all makes sense of course)
15:57 sjn \o/m: say "a〔".ords
15:57 sjn m: say "a〔".ords
15:57 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«(97 12308)␤»
15:57 DrForr I see 2 characters there, what about that doesn't look like 2?
15:57 jnthn m: say ""a〔".codes
15:57 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/u_40CdsYOi␤Two terms in a row␤at /tmp/u_40CdsYOi:1␤------> 3say ""7⏏5a〔".codes␤    expecting any of:␤        infix␤        infix stopper␤        postfix␤        statement end␤        s…»
15:57 jnthn m: say "a〔".codes
15:57 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«2␤»
15:57 jnthn m: say "a〔".NFC
15:57 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«NFC:0x<0061 3014>␤»
15:57 jnthn m: say "a〔".NFD.elems
15:57 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«2␤»
15:57 lucs DrForr: Monospaced, it takes up 3 spaces.
15:57 sjn it's a whide character in there
15:57 sjn wide*
15:57 lucs Right.
15:57 jnthn Hmm
15:58 jnthn I wonder if those have a unicode property on 'em
15:58 lucs (I'm trying to align stuff.)
15:59 jnthn m: say uniname('〔')
15:59 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«LEFT TORTOISE SHELL BRACKET␤»
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16:02 jnthn m: say uniprop('〔', 'East_Asian_Width')
16:02 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«0␤»
16:03 jnthn hmm
16:03 jnthn m: say uniprop('x', 'East_Asian_Width')
16:03 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«0␤»
16:03 b2gills m: say "a〔".encode.bytes
16:03 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«4␤»
16:03 jnthn Well, so much for that...
16:04 b2gills It would be nice to be able to find out what uniprops a given character has. That is what makes sense as the second argument to uniprop
16:05 jnthn b2gills: Well, every character has all the props in some sense... :-)
16:06 jnthn http://unicode.org/cldr/utility/properties.jsp is a list
16:07 jnthn Sadly, I don't see anything in there about the problem in question
16:08 jnthn Which may mean it's in the realm of "that's a rendering issue, not a Unicode one" :)
16:08 DrForr http://www.unicode.org/pending/properties.html#General_Category_and_Other_Properties doesn't mention width.
16:09 geekosaur width is outside the realm of unicode, it is a property of a particular font
16:11 lucs Hmm... '〔' has an East_Asian_Width property of 'wide': http://unicode.org/cldr/utility/character.jsp?a=3014&amp;B1=Show
16:11 b2gills What is interesting is some of the space codepoints have a defined width, but it is defined in terms of other characters (EN/EM SPACE)
16:17 sjn would it be sensible to have a .columns method (or something) that helps figure out stuff terminal output alignment stuff?
16:17 sjn (is there already such a method?)
16:18 jnthn sjn: Since it'd seemingly depend on font, not sure how far that'd go to help...
16:18 sjn well, with terminal output, it might be safe to assume a fixed-with/monospace font?
16:18 perlpilot sounds like good user-space module fodder
16:19 DrForr Link in to ncurses and mbwidth() functions?
16:19 jnthn Yeah, sounds like module space
16:19 jnthn m: say uniprop('〔', 'East_Asian_Width')
16:19 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«0␤»
16:19 jnthn I'm curious why that comes back as 0 though
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16:20 jnthn m: say uniprop('〔', 'Some_Unknown_prop')
16:20 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«0␤»
16:20 jnthn Probably 'cus we don't actually support it...
16:20 sjn no warnings either?
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16:21 jnthn Nope
16:21 jnthn (Think TimToady++ wired this stuff up, going to assume the failsoft was intentional)
16:27 geekosaur the existence of some of it depends on what version of the unicode standard, hence of icu, is available
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16:32 jnthn In this case, Moar supports the latest Unicode standard (doesn't use ICU), but just doesn't pull that property into its database.
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16:49 rudi_s Is it possible to split a path in its path components. e.g. "foo/bar/baz".IO.bla -> "foo", "bar", "baz" - I know I could use split("/") but that might break on different systems.
16:49 ugexe .tell pmurias no. it already past feature parity as well as handling things like cpan, allowing plugins, etc
16:49 yoleaux ugexe: I'll pass your message to pmurias.
16:51 hoelzro rudi_s: probably something in IO::Spec
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16:51 hoelzro m: '/dev/null'.IO.splitpath
16:51 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«Method 'splitpath' not found for invocant of class 'IO::Path'␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/VPvef8hlIo line 1␤␤»
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16:53 pmurias ugexe: the README mentions that tests and features need to be ported from the old version
16:53 yoleaux 16:49Z <ugexe> pmurias: no. it already past feature parity as well as handling things like cpan, allowing plugins, etc
16:53 pmurias ugexe: anything you want help with?
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17:00 rudi_s hoelzro: splitpath doesn't help, it only splits $volume, $dir and $file:
17:00 rudi_s m: say $*SPEC.splitpath("/foo/bar/baz").perl
17:00 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«("", "/foo/bar/", "baz")␤»
17:00 RabidGravy splitdir
17:01 RabidGravy m: say $*SPEC.splitdir($*CWD.Str)
17:01 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«( home camelia)␤»
17:02 pmurias hmm, do we have a way to make the command line parser for main take short flags: both -h and --help?
17:03 rudi_s RabidGravy: Thanks.
17:04 rudi_s Splitting is a little weird:
17:04 rudi_s m: say $*SPEC.splitdir("/").perl
17:04 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«("", "")␤»
17:04 rudi_s m: say $*SPEC.splitdir("/a").perl
17:04 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«("", "a")␤»
17:04 rudi_s m: say $*SPEC.splitdir("/a/").perl
17:04 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«("", "a", "")␤»
17:05 rudi_s I guess that's perl6's normal splitting behavior but I still find it confusing.
17:07 RabidGravy m: say $*CWD.Str.split('/').perl
17:07 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«("", "home", "camelia")␤»
17:08 perlpilot pmurias: sub MAIN( :h(:$help) ) { ... }
17:08 RabidGravy m: say $*CWD.Str.split('/', :skip-empty).perl
17:08 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«("home", "camelia")␤»
17:09 RabidGravy however it probably isn't quite as easy as adding the :skip-empty to the split in IO::Spec
17:09 ugexe pmurias: ah, that can probably be removed (lots of testing just happens in CI now). the features its missing from before is paralellization (although it should easy to add in the future) and the CLI overlay that did loading bar animations and stuff. the last big thing to do is a messaging system for the adapters to talk to the client and the client to either the CLI frontend or a theoretical GUI frontend. and
17:09 ugexe optimizations in regards to looping over X distributions to find a match
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17:42 muraiki jnthn: sorry to bother you directly about this, but a few months ago I mentioned a bug and you thought it had to do with the garbage collector stalling during a long running perl 6 process. did you happen to look into this or do you know an RT ticket about it? I couldn't find one
17:57 timotimo https://github.com/bluebear94/Terminal-WCWidth  -  btw
17:57 timotimo lucs: ^ did you see this yet?
17:58 timotimo i'm honestly getting a little bit annoyed by how often people ask for some feature that exists in the ecosystem already and don't bother to look for it there ... why do we have an ecosystem at all? :|
17:59 timotimo if only the 10 most interesting modules are ever going to be used and the rest is never looked at?
18:00 btyler discoveribility is a very hard problem
18:00 Skarsnik yay this process almost take half my ram after 10h of running x) thx leak :)
18:00 btyler see: CPAN, npm, etc.
18:00 Skarsnik how it's hard?
18:00 Skarsnik modules.perl6.org x)
18:02 timotimo i disagree. i searched for "width" and it only gave me one result, which was "Returns what the character width should be on the terminal."
18:02 timotimo the problem of discoverability on npm is potentially that for any given task, there's thirty people with at least fifty different solutions and none of them talk about what's different between them and others
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18:05 timotimo oh well
18:06 btyler fair enough. I suppose I just mean that successfully using a module ecosystem requires some fair degree of expertise already (knowing that it's there, knowing what terms to search for, knowing which modules are reasonable choices and which are half-baked weekend projects, etc.)
18:06 timotimo lucs: don't interpret this as me complaining about you; nobody bothered to look for this module and i've seen this pattern multiple times already
18:06 timotimo ah, yes, that's true as well
18:06 ugexe we could start using a field to advertise features, like `tags`
18:06 timotimo we don't yet have half-bakedness indicators on modules' readmes or anywhere, really
18:07 jdv79 isn't that in META already?
18:07 timotimo only few modules mention what their status actually is
18:07 btyler it's the google search problem: if you don't use the same word as the experts use, you'll have a hard time finding the expert solution
18:07 btyler because you don't share vocab or habits
18:08 btyler totally understand the frustration, though, you're on the front lines here :)
18:08 jdv79 yes, META has tags.  also, metacpan search helps if the dist contains enough keywords.
18:08 jdv79 don't remember if reviews are part of the search.  that could help.
18:11 Skarsnik The issue with tags, they need to be 'standardized'
18:12 Juerd Or normalized.
18:12 jdv79 s/need/could/
18:12 ugexe later on once the `supercedes`, `superceded_by`, `emulates` are used search clients can use other modules search relevant meta data to augment/improve its own
18:16 jdv79 timotimo: actually - it worked:  http://hack.p6c.org:5001/search?size=20&amp;q=width&amp;search_type=modules
18:16 jdv79 problem solved:)
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18:17 jdv79 of course the pod view just crashed...  i'll bug that.
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18:21 nine_ Hm....watch some more Mr. Robot or try to fix the locking issue with the new precomp code?
18:22 jdv79 fixed it
18:23 jdv79 must have been caught up in that rigamarole with precomp and me failing to get along:(
18:27 Skarsnik damn still no comment on https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/pull/716 ? x)
18:27 Skarsnik I say don't force yourself if you just want to relax x)
18:29 nine_ Well if I didn't have to give a talk about this stuff next week at the GPW...
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18:41 ugexe give a talk about mr. robot
18:41 nine_ I don't know if that would be easier :)
18:42 nine_ Question to the audience: what would you want to hear in a talk titled "A look behind the curtains - module loading in Perl 6"
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18:46 timotimo "how do i debug stuff when it goes wrong", perhaps? "what parts can be replaced by user-supplied code?"?
18:46 timotimo "what makes it more interesting/powerful than in perl5 or python, for example"
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18:52 timotimo "how did you learn from other languages' module systems"?
18:54 perlpilot nine_: I'd want to know what works today and what's broken.  And if there's a really interesting story about why it's broken, maybe that too.
18:54 perlpilot nine_: and all the stuff that timotimo said :)
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18:57 timotimo don't forget to point out places where you could drop in cool things like "well, i actually distributed my own moar executable with a zip file concatenated to it which contains all the bytecode" or something
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19:09 skids m: my @skew = (([\,] (Nil xx *)) Z "0 1 2\n3 4 5\n6 7 8".lines.map(+«*.words)).map(*.flat); print @skew[*;$_].grep(Int) ~ "\n" for 1..^@skew[*-1].cache.elems
19:09 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«0␤1 3␤2 4 6␤5 7␤8␤»
19:09 skids (Today's daily programmer)
19:10 nine_ timotimo, perlpilot: thanks for your input :) Very appreciated
19:10 * timotimo is often glad to help
19:11 * lizmat starts working on the next P6W
19:13 nine_ Wait a second, why am I checking a precomp file that we've already loaded? If it was good the first time, it ought to be still fine. Especially since we don't load it again anyway but just return the cached CompUnit
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19:17 * perlpilot changes nine's precomp file between loadings just to mess with him
19:23 nine_ And the locking issue is gone :)
19:23 nine_ Which is much more relaxing than another Mr Robot episode :)
19:25 timotimo \o/
19:25 timotimo glad to hear it
19:28 nine_ However I wonder why this hasn't been an issue with nom so far. The bug is clearly there already.
19:31 jnthn muraiki: I think it's a variant of https://github.com/MoarVM/MoarVM/issues/140. I've been somewhat recovering from the Christmas release and various other things over the last couple of months. Will be digging back in to Perl 6 things again more from this week, and that bug is high on my list.
19:32 muraiki jnthn: thanks! also, you certainly deserve as long of a break as you need :) I just didn't know where to look / who else to ask
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19:34 mr_ron m: my subset Odd of Int where {$^n % 2}; my Odd $i; say $i.WHAT; $i = 3; say $i.WHAT
19:34 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«(Odd)␤(Int)␤»
19:35 timotimo subset types only check upon assignment (or, indeed, checking), they do not change the object itself
19:36 timotimo the first output is "(Odd)" because the default value for a scalar container is the type object of the type constraint
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19:43 mr_ron thx
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19:43 timotimo yw
19:43 jnthn muraiki: Well, "GC bug" sends 90% of sensible people running away screaming, and "concurrency bug" does the same for the other 90%...and this is a concurrent GC bug... :-)
19:44 timotimo fortunately we don't do concurrent GC in moarvm :P
19:44 jnthn Well, a GC concurrency bug then :P
19:44 timotimo :)
19:44 muraiki hehe
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19:44 jnthn Our GC *will* be getting more concurrent soon though (*after* fixing this issue ;-))
19:45 jnthn As we'll switch to doing finalizatino etc. in the background
19:45 jnthn But yeah, I doubt we'll go much further than that for a good while. True concurrent GC is really, really hard, and it's a trade-off with throughput.
19:46 jnthn So for a bunch of workloads it'd likely hurt benchmarks.
19:49 * jnthn goes to finish up prepping the dinner :)
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20:02 mr_ron m: my subset Odd of Int where {$^n % 2}; multi sub f(Odd $i) { say "odd" }; multi sub f(Odd $i) { say "odd 2" }; multi sub f(Int $i) {say "int"}; multi sub f(Int $i) {say "int 2"}; f(3); f(4)
20:02 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«odd␤Ambiguous call to 'f'; these signatures all match:␤:(Int $i)␤:(Int $i)␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/zedwxuiSYn line 1␤␤»
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20:33 buharin moritz, are you here?
20:38 [Coke] buharin: something we can help with?
20:39 buharin yeah I was talking about passing by ref
20:39 moritz buharin: yes-ish
20:39 buharin argument to method
20:40 buharin and I need to go to work :D
20:40 buharin so back right now
20:41 buharin I wanna pass Str variable to method modify it and so on
20:42 buharin or class
20:42 buharin and it will be more expensive if I will pass it by copy
20:42 buharin you know what i mean?
20:42 hoelzro sub foo(Str $arg is rw) { ... }
20:42 hoelzro that should do it.
20:43 buharin really?:D
20:43 buharin and whats raw?
20:43 hoelzro m: sub foo(Str $arg is rw) { $arg = 'hello' }; my Str $s; foo($s); say $s
20:43 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«hello␤»
20:43 hoelzro rw - read/write
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20:43 hoelzro really?:U is also acceptable =P
20:43 moritz raw = rw if available, ro otherwise
20:44 moritz buharin: but are you sure you need to pass an RW parameter? it typically makes things much harder to understand
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20:44 moritz buharin: I'd start with a nomral method that returns a new string
20:44 moritz *normal
20:45 moritz and only use a different API when performance can't be fixed otherwise
20:46 buharin moritz, what do you mean by different API?
20:46 moritz buharin: like the rw argument
20:47 geraud joined #perl6
20:47 buharin moritz, looks very complicated
20:48 moritz buharin: what looks complicated?
20:48 lizmat do we actually have a website where we can read mails on p6-language?  moritz?
20:49 moritz lizmat: http://www.nntp.perl.org/group/ should do it
20:49 moritz http://www.nntp.perl.org/group/perl.perl6.language/
20:49 lizmat moritz++
20:50 moritz there's also https://www.mail-archive.com/perl6-language@perl.org/
20:51 moritz which, IMHO, is a bit nicer with clickable links and all that
20:54 flussence http://news.gmane.org/gmane.comp.lang.perl.perl6.language # best, imo
20:55 flussence (except for their idiotic anti-harvester mangling @array sigils)
20:56 _dolmen_ joined #perl6
20:56 nine_ As if those things had ever worked
20:59 itaipu joined #perl6
21:00 sno joined #perl6
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21:01 nine_ YES!
21:02 lizmat anything that can be merged before the P6W comes out ?
21:02 nine_ panda installed successfully and first run after installation takes 1.5 seconds :)
21:02 lizmat :-)
21:02 nine_ lizmat: no, this will need extensive review and testing, but I'm getting close to pushing this stuff somewhere :)
21:03 lizmat ah, cool...  next week then  :-)
21:03 nine_ Depends on when I will finally replace coding fun with writing slides...
21:09 lizmat or after the GPW  :-)
21:18 ptolemarch Is there currently a well-defined way to call Perl6 code (via Rakudo-on-JVM) from Java?
21:19 [Coke] rakudo-on-java itself is not well at the moment.
21:22 ptolemarch I see that I can create .jar files, and I see quite a few Rakudo and NQP Java classes.
21:22 buharin joined #perl6
21:23 ptolemarch Rakudo can obviously compile Perl6 and run it, as it does in the REPL...
21:23 [Coke] well at some point it's all java, yes. (doing a build right now, haven't tried to build since christmas.)
21:23 ptolemarch ...but is there a way to ask Rakudo "please find this class which you've already compiled and give me an instance of it"?
21:24 [Coke] I don't think you can easily get at the java version of a perl6 object.
21:24 * ptolemarch nods
21:24 [Coke] (you have perl6 at that point anyway, which is "better") - I do think there's a way to get at an arbitrary class from java, though.
21:25 [Coke] j: use java.lang.String :from<java>; say "alive";
21:25 camelia rakudo-jvm f99bdb: OUTPUT«cannot connect to eval server: Connection refused␤»
21:25 [Coke] can answer that better after my local java build finishes.
21:26 ptolemarch Yeah, perl6 is quite better, for my money. :-) And now I'd like to try to create a Minecraft server mod in Perl6 rather than in Java.
21:27 ptolemarch I'm quite willing to hack on it reasonably hard; basically I think a Minecraft-mod-in-Perl6 talk at YAPC would be pretty awesome and right now I'm trying to verify that it's feasible before I try to submit a talk proposal.
21:27 [Coke] ptolemarch: that would be awesome, please do that. :)
21:27 ptolemarch But I'm having a hard time finding where to start. :-)
21:27 [Coke] give me another 30 minutes to finish this build. :)
21:27 [Coke] (kidding, but the jvm build is slow)
21:27 ptolemarch Please take your time.
21:27 ptolemarch Heh, yesterday I built it on my Chromebook. *that* was *slow*.
21:34 cdg joined #perl6
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21:43 [Coke] already, 'make install' still broken on jvm.
21:44 [Coke] *alright
21:47 [Coke] ok. r-j builds (can't install); when running t/03-jvm/01-interop.t, you get an error that EVAL is very dangerous! (wondering if the failed install has anything to do with this)
21:47 [Coke] ptolemarch: see t/03-jvm/01-interop.t for examples on how interop would theoretically work if r-j was working.
21:49 [Coke] but I can't get any of those examples to work. I know some work was done recently on this, trying to find who touched it.
21:49 ptolemarch Hmm, I'm able to build rakudo 2016.02 with JVM backend
21:51 [Coke] ptolemarch: maybe the remotes/origin/jvminterop branch
21:51 [Coke] ptolemarch: did "make install" work?
21:51 [Coke] and I don't think anyone's cleaned up "make stresstest" in sometime.
21:51 ptolemarch [Coke]: this was basically `rakudobrew install jvm 2016.02`
21:52 [Coke] no clue if that reports errors if make install failed.
21:52 [Coke] (or if it runs spec tests)
21:52 ptolemarch well, and I'm able to use `perl6-j` after...
21:52 [Coke] but the interop branch is probably where you want to be looking if you care about interop.
21:53 ptolemarch gotcha
21:54 ptolemarch So far, everything I've seen about interop has been "call Java from Perl6" rather than the reverse.
21:54 ptolemarch That file seems to be the same thing.
21:55 [Coke] I'm not sure how well it works the other way; you could probably try to build a p6 class, see what jar file you get and decompile it.
21:56 ptolemarch yeah, that's where I've been all day
21:56 [Coke] sorry. :|
21:58 [Coke] I can't build that branch, unfortunately.
21:59 [Coke] I'd ping the last committer on that branch and see if they have any guidance for you.
21:59 ptolemarch Oh, I missed your above mention of remotes/origin/jvminterop
21:59 ptolemarch Thank you, I'll do that.
21:59 tmch joined #perl6
22:02 lizmat and another Perl 6 Weekly hits the net: https://p6weekly.wordpress.com/2016/02/29/2016-9-blobs-leaping-away/
22:04 dalek rakudo/relocateable-precomp: e8c22d6 | (Stefan Seifert)++ | tools/build/install-core-dist.pl:
22:04 dalek rakudo/relocateable-precomp: Fix weird errors in precomp files generated on installation
22:04 dalek rakudo/relocateable-precomp:
22:04 dalek rakudo/relocateable-precomp: Setting PROCESS::<$REPO> without initializing $*REPO first creates a repo-chain
22:04 dalek rakudo/relocateable-precomp: containing only the single repository. Without the NQP repository in the chain,
22:04 dalek joined #perl6
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22:05 nine_ https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/e8c22d66f35c9bc6d26c1a686773484c784ed7b4
22:05 nine_ and more importantly https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/12995e5b9bc866817a27f5c32fc746e3b7d6de11
22:09 idiosyncrat_ joined #perl6
22:17 pyrimidine lizmat++ # p6weekly
22:20 pyrimidine lizmat: ...and I agree re: the sad blog post, though not unexpected :(
22:20 lizmat yeah  :-(
22:26 lizmat .tell jnthn I noticed that in the ShapedArrayCommon role, protos like .push are not marked "is nodal": is that intentional ?
22:26 yoleaux lizmat: I'll pass your message to jnthn.
22:26 jnthn lizmat++ # p6weekly
22:26 yoleaux 22:26Z <lizmat> jnthn: I noticed that in the ShapedArrayCommon role, protos like .push are not marked "is nodal": is that intentional ?
22:26 jnthn hah, what timing :P
22:26 lizmat hehe
22:26 jnthn No, not intentional
22:27 lizmat ok, so I guess I should add that to make sure they work ok in meta ops, right ?
22:27 jnthn Aye, please :)
22:27 jnthn Just an oversight
22:27 lizmat will do
22:28 tmch joined #perl6
22:29 dalek rakudo/nom: 00bfa4d | lizmat++ | src/core/Range.pm:
22:29 dalek rakudo/nom: Add a sensible error for ^Inf .rand
22:29 dalek rakudo/nom:
22:29 dalek rakudo/nom: Instead of just hanging.  Also fix the (NaN..NaN).rand case
22:29 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/00bfa4d16a
22:31 lizmat jnthn: on hot path code size: would it make sense to make a private method taking a single argument to throw the X::IllegalOnFixedDimensionArray in?
22:31 lizmat so that: self.DEFINITE
22:31 lizmat ?? X::IllegalOnFixedDimensionArray.new(operation => 'push').throw
22:31 lizmat would become: ?? self!illegal("push")
22:31 jnthn Probably not worth much
22:32 jnthn X::IllegalOnFixedDimensionArray may look long, but actually compiles into a single instruction
22:32 hoelzro lizmat, timotimo: is it too late to make a change to the p6weekly?
22:32 lizmat yes, but it needs a .new and a .throw ?
22:32 timotimo it isn't too late
22:32 timotimo what's wrong?
22:32 lizmat hoelzro: what
22:32 lizmat ?
22:32 hoelzro I just want to point out that sortiz++ did must of the work in that REPL stuff =)
22:33 hoelzro I just reviewed and merged it!
22:33 bpmedley joined #perl6
22:33 lizmat ok, will change
22:33 hoelzro thanks!
22:33 jnthn lizmat: True...method calls aren't that long instruction wise either, though.
22:34 timotimo especially when we can sp_findmethod and/or fastinvoke, too, right?
22:34 jnthn btw, from now on http://www.moarvm.org/measurements/perl6-bench/ has 3 files per day
22:35 lizmat jnthn timotimo are you saying it *would* make sense ?
22:36 timotimo i'm thinking more about the new call; that should be cheap-able
22:36 timotimo as well as the .throw
22:36 jnthn The one with the date is current standing of Rakudo against NQP and Perl 5. The one -releases.html is xmas release vs. last month's release vs. HEAD, and releases-history is a different plot of that data.
22:37 jnthn lizmat: It makes sense in that it's a win, just saying it's a fairly small one. :)
22:37 lizmat well, it also make the code more readable  :-)
22:37 jnthn True, that's actually a better reason than performance ;-)
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22:48 lizmat jnthn: will there be a .plan for shaped arrays?  I thought that was pre-GLR ?
22:48 jnthn lizmat: It doesn't really make sense, since you can't resize it?
22:48 jnthn Or you mean just a throwing one?
22:49 lizmat the one in ShapedArrayCommon is the only "method plan" in the whole setting
22:49 jnthn Or did we throw out .plan altogether?
22:49 jnthn Hm :)
22:49 jnthn Innerestin' :)
22:49 lizmat yeah, I think we did...
22:49 jnthn Guess it can go
22:49 lizmat ok
22:49 jnthn Or we can ponder if .plan will return :)
22:50 lizmat yup
22:50 jnthn m: my @a = 1..3; @a.push: 1..Inf; say @a[^5]
22:50 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«(1 2 3 1..Inf (Any))␤»
22:50 jnthn ah
22:50 jnthn m: my @a = 1..3; @a.append: 1..Inf; say @a[^5]
22:50 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«Cannot push a lazy list onto a Array␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/ifn_9nvUOQ line 1␤␤Actually thrown at:␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/ifn_9nvUOQ line 1␤␤»
22:50 jnthn m: my @a = 1..3; @a.push: slip 1..Inf; say @a[^5]
22:50 camelia rakudo-moar 9dc21a: OUTPUT«Cannot push a lazy list onto a Array␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/9bfdXGKaCn line 1␤␤Actually thrown at:␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/9bfdXGKaCn line 1␤␤»
22:50 jnthn Yeah, probably .plan should return :)
22:50 jnthn Otherwise there's no way to do that :)
22:51 lizmat but for now it can go, right ?
22:51 jnthn Yeah, I guess so
22:51 FreezerburnV joined #perl6
22:51 timotimo that means it might come back in 6.d (or later), right?
22:51 rburkholder joined #perl6
22:52 jnthn timotimo: Yeah, I think it's worth having
22:52 jnthn But we've bigger fish to fry for now
22:52 timotimo yeah
22:53 dalek rakudo/nom: 1ef2470 | lizmat++ | src/core/Rakudo/Internals.pm:
22:53 dalek rakudo/nom: Add accidentally omitted "is nodal" to protos
22:53 dalek rakudo/nom: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/1ef24707e3
22:55 ugexe when a proc throws an exception, is there any way to get the $exception.proc out of the try/catch so that it can still be used? otherwise anytime you do anything to it (method sink) the exception gets rethrown
22:56 ugexe .resume inside the CATCH seems to switch the non-zero exitcode back to 0, so im not sure how to do it
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23:01 lizmat argh.  guess what, we have tests for .plan ???
23:01 lizmat jnthn: ^^
23:02 jnthn Ah
23:02 jnthn OK, less effort to keep it :)
23:02 lizmat I guess.. :-)
23:02 jnthn A proper Array.plan isn't a lot of effort to implement
23:03 lizmat fwiw, I'm still not sure what it is supposed to do
23:04 jnthn lizmat: Stick the thing into the unreified part of the array, so it'll be lazily reified
23:05 lizmat hmmm... S32-setting-library/Containers:827 actually describes it
23:05 lizmat I guess I'll leave it as LHF for someone else :-)
23:06 jnthn Tempting. But not tonight :)
23:07 lizmat seems I borked something
23:08 lizmat getting too tired now
23:08 lizmat will look at it in the morrow
23:08 lizmat so good night, #perl6!
23:09 jnthn 'night, lizmat
23:09 hoelzro night lizmat
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