Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2016-04-30

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:01 TreyHarr1 joined #perl6
00:01 zwu Just read that "operators are lexically scoped by default",  so if a module defined operators, must it be exported and imported lexically in order to to them?
00:03 ZoffixLappy Yes
00:03 ZoffixLappy They're just subs.
00:03 ZoffixLappy Also, not sure what "by default means"... is there a way to overide the default?
00:04 zwu If I use a dynamic loading "require ..." how can I import them too?
00:05 zwu or is there a way to use as a call $MyModule::my_subs() for operators defined in a module?
00:05 ugexe there is just so much wrong with this
00:05 ZoffixLappy m: class Foo { sub infix:<+> is export { $^a - $^b } }; import Foo; say 2+2;
00:05 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«0␤»
00:05 ugexe `my $body ... sub test_response(..., $body)`
00:06 ugexe also a my @body
00:07 ZoffixLappy insteresting. Bailador's debug output gives me "{Content-Type => whatever, X-Foo => meow}", but looking at headers I'm getting text/html content-type even though I'm getting the X-Foo header :/
00:07 ugexe the comments for encode-psgi-response say body can be an array, str, or buf, but 10ish lines down it has $body ~~ Supply
00:07 zwu ZoffixLappy: should sub being multi in "... sub infix:<+> is export ...?"
00:09 ZoffixLappy zwu, depends on what you want. In the above, I completely shadowed built-in + operator. I couldn't use a multi in this case because a multi for a + between two Ints is already defined, so it'd be ambiguous. But if you were defining a + for some custom objects, then yeah, you'd use a multi
00:10 ZoffixLappy zwu, if this is of any help (use left/right arrows to navigate slides): http://tpm2016.zoffix.com/#/14
00:10 zwu ZoffixLappy: great, thanks alot!
00:14 ugexe failure to set Content-Type would seem to be related to Bailador::App.render()
00:15 ugexe i suspect in the first multi that the else conditional is reached, which calls the 2nd multi without passing the $type (which then defaults to text/html)
00:19 ZoffixLappy ugexe++
00:19 ZoffixLappy That is exactly it.
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00:52 ZoffixLappy .tell ufobat sent you a PR to fix Bailador's content_type() being broken: https://github.com/ufobat/Bailador/pull/66
00:52 yoleaux ZoffixLappy: I'll pass your message to ufobat.
00:57 dalek ecosystem: 0a12cf0 | (Zoffix Znet)++ | META.list:
00:57 dalek ecosystem: Add Bailador::Plugin::Static
00:57 dalek ecosystem:
00:57 dalek ecosystem: Automatically serve static files in your Bailador apps
00:57 dalek ecosystem: review: https://github.com/perl6/e​cosystem/commit/0a12cf0958
00:57 ZoffixLappy https://github.com/zoffixznet​/perl6-Bailador-Plugin-Static
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01:52 sortiz \o #perl6
01:55 ZoffixLappy "method 'trans' not found for invocant of class 'Any'  in sub uri-unescape at sources/92D0C475746E4D3627F2FFB218718FDAA2724E51 (URI::Escape) line 30"
01:55 ZoffixLappy *sigh* will this day ever end
01:55 ZoffixLappy o/ sortiz
01:56 sortiz ZoffixLappy, technically the day is over in half of the world, may be you are in the wrong half ;-)
01:57 ZoffixLappy :)
01:58 ZoffixLappy It's just I've spent the last 13 hours fixing and writing software to get closer to starting the original goal I started to achieve this morning. I keep getting stymied by unimplemented and broken stuff
02:03 ZoffixLappy Luckily, the last one seems to be my fault :)
02:03 ZoffixLappy Best mistakes are ones in your own software, because they're the fastest to fix \o/
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02:20 grondilu :q
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02:24 ZoffixLappy This is annoying :/ For some reason regular POST request to Bailador app works just fine, but jQuery POST fails (never gets a response) even though doing that same jQ post to httpbin.org/post works fine :(
02:24 ZoffixLappy Programming is hard :/
02:25 sortiz What kind of content-type uses the body of these requests?
02:26 ZoffixLappy text/html.. I guess
02:27 sortiz A POST body almost never is text/html
02:28 ZoffixLappy Ohh. I may know what's up...  I need CORS
02:31 sortiz If your client is using more than one origin, yes.
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02:34 ZoffixLappy No love... This is my code: https://github.com/zoffixznet/js-glot-io  I start app.p6 with perl6 app.p6, so it's listening on :3000. Then I just pop open the HTML file with firefox index.html and when I click the "Run" button, LiveHTTPHeaders plugin tells me I get response 200 and Content-Type: text/html but nothing else at all :/
02:34 ZoffixLappy Even though if I disable JS and do the same step, i get a response :/
02:36 ZoffixLappy battery dying... ENOPOWERSOCKETINSIGHT
02:37 sortiz About Bailador, I'm worst than John Snow ;-)
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02:38 ZoffixLappy found one lol
02:40 ZoffixLappy Shitty table tho :/
02:40 ZoffixLappy I wonder if my issue is because I'm running my page with firefox index.html instead of it being properly served :/
02:44 ZoffixLappy And SURE IT WAS!!! GRRR.... If I serve my index.html with Bailador the stuff works ~_~
02:45 ZoffixLappy Another 100 hours wasted on nonsense and I may end up with a working web app :P \o/
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02:51 BenGoldberg Browsers sometimes treat file:// stuff quite strangely...
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05:09 ufobat good morning :)
05:09 yoleaux 00:52Z <ZoffixLappy> ufobat: sent you a PR to fix Bailador's content_type() being broken: https://github.com/ufobat/Bailador/pull/66
05:09 ufobat ZoffixWin, its merged :-)
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07:16 RabidGravy boom
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07:27 ufobat ola!
07:31 RabidGravy eh up
07:33 jeek Is Shlomi Fish sane now?
07:34 RabidGravy that's a leading question
07:35 jeek I recall a time, and probably a conversation in another channel, where it was strongly implied that Mr. Fish was not all there.
07:35 jeek My memory is admittedly not the greatest.
07:38 RabidGravy there are lot of people who are rather eccentric around the Perl world, I'
07:38 RabidGravy eh?
07:40 RabidGravy ... I know the thing about brilliance and madness is somewhat of a cliche but programming (and programming communities) does seem to bring it into relief
07:48 RabidGravy .seen tokuhirom
07:48 yoleaux I saw tokuhirom 30 Oct 2015 02:34Z in #perl6: <tokuhirom> after: split('=', 'YYY=', 2) returns just 'YYY'
07:48 RabidGravy :(
07:48 RabidGravy could do with him merging a PR against Websocket
07:58 ufobat but tokuhirom is quite active on github, isn't he?
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07:59 ufobat now i am afraid that my PR on HTTP::Server::Tiny will not get merged into it ;) thank you RabidGravy
08:00 RabidGravy reasonably active
08:01 * RabidGravy cleans up a bunch of outdated PRs
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08:21 masak jeek: anything precipitated this question? any relation to Perl 6? :)
08:22 masak (antenoon, #perl6)
08:22 RabidGravy eh up chief
08:22 sjn \o
08:26 jeek rindolf signing off, saw his quit message
08:32 rindolf jeek: the Llama thing?
08:34 jeek No.
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09:09 _nadim Morning
09:13 RabidGravy marnin
09:16 _nadim I am not making sense of grammar actions, I have this http://nopaste.linux-dev.org/?1097109 where, I thought, I'd extract only what is of interest to me. I get 'arguments' but not the rest.
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09:17 AlexDaniel m: dd split(‘=’, ‘YYY=’, 2)
09:17 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«("YYY", "").Seq␤»
09:17 rurban joined #perl6
09:18 AlexDaniel m: dd split(‘=’, ‘YYY=’, NaN)
09:18 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«This type cannot unbox to a native integer␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/8fiYS8YJd5 line 1␤␤»
09:18 AlexDaniel m: dd split(‘=’, ‘YYY=’, Inf)
09:18 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«("YYY", "")␤»
09:18 AlexDaniel so it wants a native integer but not quite
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09:32 AlexDaniel m: say {$^_}(42) # heh
09:32 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/bs2evkclrG␤Redeclaration of symbol $^_ as a placeholder parameter␤at /tmp/bs2evkclrG:1␤------> 3say {$^_7⏏5}(42) # heh␤»
09:37 AlexDaniel m: my $_-_-_-_-_ = 42
09:37 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: ( no output )
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10:07 AlexDaniel What's the maximum length for a variable name?
10:10 AlexDaniel 10 million characters seems to be ok, nice
10:10 xfix I don't think there is one, other than your memory limit.
10:11 xfix Perl 6 grammar is written in Perl 6 itself, so it's not using some low level language where an user can be worried about overflowing some buffer.
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10:15 psch m: my $x = (("a" xx 2 ** 63) xx 2 ** 63) xx 2 ** 63; say $x.chars
10:15 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«0␤»
10:15 psch hm, precedence?
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10:15 psch m: my $x = (("a" xx (2 ** 63)) xx (2 ** 63)) xx (2 ** 63); say $x.chars
10:15 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«0␤»
10:15 psch m: my $x = (("a" xx (2 ** 63)) xx (2 ** 63)); say $x.chars
10:15 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«0␤»
10:15 psch m: my $x = (("a" xx (2 ** 63)); say $x.chars
10:15 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/1YJTTEOOg2␤Cannot use variable $x in declaration to initialize itself␤at /tmp/1YJTTEOOg2:1␤------> 3my $x = (("a" xx (2 ** 63)); say $7⏏5x.chars␤    expecting any of:␤        argument list␤   …»
10:16 psch m: my $x = ("a" xx (2 ** 63)); say $x.chars
10:16 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«0␤»
10:16 psch m: my $x = ("a" xx (2 ** 31)); say $x.chars
10:16 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«Memory allocation failed; could not allocate 17179869184 bytes␤»
10:16 psch ah, there
10:16 Hotkeys Rip
10:16 psch m: my $x = ("a" xx (2 ** 15)); say $x.chars
10:16 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«65535␤»
10:16 psch well, that's a limit in xx, not Str i suppose
10:16 psch m: my $x = "a"; $x ~= $x for ^1000; say $x.chars
10:16 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«Memory allocation failed; could not allocate 536870912 bytes␤»
10:17 psch m: my $x = "a"; $x ~= $x for ^15; say $x.chars
10:17 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«32768␤»
10:17 psch m: my $x = "a"; $x ~= $x for ^32; say $x.chars
10:17 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«Memory allocation failed; could not allocate 536870912 bytes␤»
10:17 psch m: my $x = "a"; $x ~= $x for ^31; say $x.chars
10:17 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«Memory allocation failed; could not allocate 536870912 bytes␤»
10:17 AlexDaniel psch: it does weird stuff silently, so that's still a bug I guess
10:17 psch m: my $x = "a"; $x ~= $x for ^16; say $x.chars
10:17 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«65536␤»
10:17 psch m: my $x = "a"; $x ~= $x for ^17; say $x.chars
10:17 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«131072␤»
10:17 * psch stops poking for magic numbers
10:17 AlexDaniel psch: https://rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=126014
10:18 psch AlexDaniel++: ah, already ticket
10:18 AlexDaniel but it says nothing about getting 0
10:18 psch +ed
10:18 psch i think we have a magic number that truncates a bigint to 0?
10:18 psch maybe in pow too
10:18 AlexDaniel not in pow
10:19 psch m: say 2 ** 2 ** 64
10:19 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«Numeric overflow␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/zusMCQeiqU line 1␤␤Actually thrown at:␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/zusMCQeiqU line 1␤␤»
10:19 AlexDaniel well, in pow it was kinda fixed: https://rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=125811
10:19 AlexDaniel it does not work on jvm though
10:19 AlexDaniel j: say 2 ** 2 ** 64
10:19 camelia rakudo-jvm 40a953: OUTPUT«cannot connect to eval server: Connection refused␤»
10:19 AlexDaniel well, that's not what I meant
10:20 psch the fix doesn't work?
10:20 AlexDaniel psch: yeah, it does not throw a proper exception as it does on moar
10:20 psch yeah, 'cause the fix checks for 0, but r-j produces Inf :)
10:20 psch $ ./perl6-j -e'say 2 ** 2 ** 64'
10:20 psch Inf
10:22 AlexDaniel hmm there's also this error message
10:22 AlexDaniel “repeat count > 1073741824 arbitrarily unsupported..”
10:22 AlexDaniel ah, that's for strings
10:22 psch m: use nqp; say nqp::pow_n(2, nqp::pow_n(2, 64))
10:22 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«This type cannot unbox to a native number␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/YmNBughccP line 1␤␤»
10:23 psch m: use nqp; say nqp::pow_n(2, 99999999999999999999999999999999999)
10:23 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«This type cannot unbox to a native number␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/KH3STvD5Td line 1␤␤»
10:23 AlexDaniel m: my $x = ("a" x (2 ** 63)); say $x.chars
10:23 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«repeat count (-9223372036854775808) cannot be negative␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/DTJByw_7LC line 1␤␤»
10:23 psch ah, pow_I...
10:23 psch m: use nqp; say nqp::pow_I(2, 99999999999999999999999999999999999, Int, Int)
10:23 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«0␤»
10:23 psch m: use nqp; say nqp::pow_I(2, 99999999999999999999999999999999999, Num, Int)
10:23 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«0␤»
10:24 psch $ ./perl6-j -e'use nqp; say nqp::pow_I(2, 99999999999999999999999999999999999, Num, Int)'
10:24 psch -Inf
10:24 psch i do think pow_I should be better there, instead of trying to catch that in the HLL...
10:25 psch otoh, how many digits would that even be?  ...and how many bytes?
10:25 psch m: say so -Inf
10:25 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«True␤»
10:26 psch that's what causes r-j not to throw the overflow, fwiw
10:26 psch 'cause infix:<**> does < nqp::pow(...) or otherchecks() || fail overflow >
10:26 psch ...paraphrased
10:27 AlexDaniel ok so at least I am going to report this
10:27 AlexDaniel m: my $x = ("a" x (9999999999999999999))
10:27 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«repeat count (-8446744073709551617) cannot be negative␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/mmOv8ANGbM line 1␤␤»
10:27 psch m: use nqp; say nqp::unbox_i(9999999999999999999)
10:27 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«-8446744073709551617␤»
10:28 AlexDaniel or this!
10:28 psch m: use nqp; say nqp::unbox_i(2 ** 64 - 1);
10:28 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«-1␤»
10:28 psch that's just native int semantics vOv
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10:31 psch m: use nqp; my $x = 2 ** 64 - 1; say $x; say nqp::p6box_i(nqp::unbox_i($x));
10:31 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«18446744073709551615␤-1␤»
10:31 psch boxing is destructive... /o\
10:38 AlexDaniel OK, that's what I got: RT #128035
10:38 synopsebot6 Link:  https://rt.perl.org/rt3//Publ​ic/Bug/Display.html?id=128035
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10:39 AlexDaniel m: my $x = 42 xx (2 ** 62); say $x.elems
10:39 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«(signal SEGV)»
10:39 AlexDaniel yeaaaah!
10:39 AlexDaniel m: my $x = 42 xx (2 ** 62)
10:39 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«(signal SEGV)»
10:40 AlexDaniel so it's not just 32-bit systems!
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10:45 psch hrm, quite a few phaser and CX related jvm tickets
10:45 psch i'm fairly sure those two things hang more or less on the same peg
10:45 AlexDaniel CX?
10:45 psch control exception
10:45 psch m: { last; CONTROL { default { .perl.say } } }
10:45 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«CX::Last.new␤»
10:46 psch m: class CX { }; { last; CONTROL { default { .perl.say } } } # ooh
10:46 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«CX::Last.new␤»
10:46 psch aw, that doesn't clobber all over it :P
10:46 psch did that get fixed for X:: as well and i didn't notice?
10:47 psch m: class X { }; say 1 + "foo";
10:47 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«Cannot convert string to number: base-10 number must begin with valid digits or '.' in '3⏏5foo' (indicated by ⏏)␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/X387dC3Woy line 1␤␤Actually thrown at:␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/X387dC3Woy line 1␤␤»
10:47 AlexDaniel psch: anyway, thanks for noticing that xx is broken on 64-bit too. I updated the ticket
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10:55 psch oh boy, my first actual RT weirdness!
10:55 psch i don't have Reply or Comment on #124628
10:55 synopsebot6 Link:  https://rt.perl.org/rt3//Publ​ic/Bug/Display.html?id=124628
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11:05 AlexDaniel psch: Actions/Reply ?
11:06 psch AlexDaniel: ooh!  i never used them there, usually just on the top right of an existing comment...
11:07 AlexDaniel yeah, but there is no discription and no comments :/
11:07 AlexDaniel description*
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11:35 psch m: A: { }; last A # heh
11:35 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«control exception without handler␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/sImK7xYQJf line 1␤␤»
11:35 psch m: last
11:35 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«last without loop construct␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/9qFbYQ25QW line 1␤␤»
11:39 psch well, that's a rather easy fix at least...
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12:29 itcharlie seems like Im in the right place now :)
12:30 itcharlie Perl 6 module installations are not working in windows
12:30 itcharlie First error without Git Shell: https://gist.github.com/itcharlie​/cec33e5b470f19e215a7fbc9c9258e9a
12:30 itcharlie Second error with Git Shell:  https://gist.github.com/itcharlie​/b379b122620259fa3688d36b9a13f7e1
12:31 itcharlie First error shows that it doesn't find Git command in path.
12:31 ugexe no, you mean panda doesnt work on windows
12:31 itcharlie ugexe:
12:31 itcharlie correct
12:32 itcharlie probably due to the full path name not being Windows friendly
12:33 itcharlie more specifically this error here:  Can't execute /c/Strawberry/perl/bin/prove.bat.
12:33 ugexe maybe try zef
12:33 ZoffixWin zef++
12:33 itcharlie zef?
12:34 itcharlie ah ok
12:34 itcharlie found it
12:34 loren joined #perl6
12:35 itcharlie zef comes installed by default with Rakudo Star?
12:36 ZoffixWin Doesn't look like it: https://github.com/tadzik/Tas​k-Star/blob/master/META.info
12:36 ZoffixWin itcharlie, https://github.com/ugexe/zef
12:36 itcharlie Thanks ZoffixWin
12:36 itcharlie ZoffixWin:  I enjoy your blog posts on Perl6 by the way
12:36 itcharlie thank you
12:36 ZoffixWin Thanks.
12:37 itcharlie thank you ugexe I will try zef now
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12:53 moritz hi all; what's that "Perl 6 in your browser" link that recently circulated?
12:53 psch moritz: glot.io i think?
12:54 psch apparently so: https://glot.io/new/perl6
12:54 moritz psch: thanks!
12:57 grondilu m: role A { method foo { "oops" } }; class :: does A { has $.foo }.new(:foo<var>).foo.say
12:57 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«oops␤»
12:57 grondilu ^methods always prevail over attribute, even when they come from a mixin?
12:58 psch m: class A { has $.foo; method foo { "oops" } }; A.foo # that's equivalent at runtime
12:58 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: ( no output )
12:59 grondilu m: role A { method foo { $!foo // "oops" } }; class :: does A { has $.foo }.new(:foo<var>).foo.say
12:59 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/lKTYUuSU99␤Attribute $!foo not declared in role A␤at /tmp/lKTYUuSU99:1␤------> 3ole A { method foo { $!foo // "oops" } }7⏏5; class :: does A { has $.foo }.new(:foo␤    expecting any of:␤        …»
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13:00 psch m: role A { method foo { ::?CLASS.^attributes.grep(*.name eq '$!foo')[0].get_value(self) // "oops" } }; class :: does A { has $.foo }.new(:foo<bar>).foo.say
13:00 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«bar␤»
13:01 psch not sure that's the cleanest method there...
13:02 grondilu m: role A { method foo { "oops" } }; class :: does A { has $.foo; method foo { $!foo } }.new(:foo<var>).foo.say
13:02 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«var␤»
13:02 grondilu I can do that I guess
13:02 psch i think you can still reach A.foo somehow, but i always forget how exactly... :S
13:02 ZoffixWin m: role A { method foo { self!foo // "oops" } }; class :: does A { has $.foo; method !foo { $!foo } }.new.foo.say
13:02 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«oops␤»
13:03 ZoffixWin m: role A { method foo { self!foo // "oops" } }; class :: does A { has $.foo; method !foo { $!foo } }.new(:var<meow>).foo.say
13:03 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«oops␤»
13:03 ZoffixWin m: role A { method foo { self!foo // "oops" } }; class :: does A { has $.foo; method !foo { $!foo } }.new(:foo<meow>).foo.say
13:03 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«meow␤»
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13:05 grondilu ZoffixWin: that looks slightly cleaner indeed
13:06 Emeric joined #perl6
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13:24 AlexDaniel m: $_ = Empty; say S/a/b/
13:24 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«Nil␤»
13:25 AlexDaniel m: $_ = Empty; say .substr(5)
13:25 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«(HANDLED) Start argument to substr out of range. Is: 5, should be in 0..0; use *5 if you want to index relative to the end␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/Ua2Aieiyrs line 1␤␤»
13:25 AlexDaniel What is “(HANDLED)”?
13:26 psch m: $_ = Empty; $x = .substr(5); say "alive"
13:26 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/MkaHV6_09_␤Variable '$x' is not declared␤at /tmp/MkaHV6_09_:1␤------> 3$_ = Empty; 7⏏5$x = .substr(5); say "alive"␤»
13:26 psch m: $_ = Empty; my $x = .substr(5); say "alive"
13:26 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«alive␤»
13:26 psch m: $_ = Empty; .substr(5);
13:26 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: ( no output )
13:26 psch AlexDaniel: "don't complain when sunk or evaluated", pretty much
13:26 pmurias It would be awesome if we could somehow reuse glot.io to have runnable synopsises for modules
13:28 AlexDaniel I'm not sure why we can host camelia ourselves but would need some external dependency (that has unknown goals) to have runnable whatever
13:28 AlexDaniel unless I am missing something
13:29 psch scope of users is a concern i'd guess
13:29 llfourn I think glot.io did the hard work of building a container spawning thing
13:29 psch as in, i'm assuming glot.io can handle at least a few more that camelia could
13:29 psch oh, yeah, security is probably another concern
13:30 llfourn with glot.io you can IO I guessed but haven't tried
13:30 pmurias it's a case of usefulness overiding security for camelia
13:30 pmurias there used be a lot of ways to overide the sandbox for camelia in the past
13:31 pmurias s/sandbox/restricted setting/
13:31 psch 'use nqp' pretty much still clobbers all sense of security
13:31 llfourn yeah I wouldn't trust restricted setting for security anyways
13:31 psch but restricting that would be too detrimental for devs
13:32 AlexDaniel pmurias: there are still many
13:32 llfourn yeah writing to file works on glot.io just checked
13:33 AlexDaniel if we're going to host glot.io thingy ourselves then I'm all for it, of course
13:34 llfourn it seems to be open source :)
13:34 grondilu m: role A { method f($ where * > 0) {...} }; class :: does A { method f($ where * > 0) {} }
13:34 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: ( no output )
13:34 grondilu m: role A { multi method f($ where * > 0) {...} }; class :: does A { multi method f($ where * > 0) {} }
13:34 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/0cR5LXBhQ_␤Multi method 'f' with signature :(<anon|84841888> $: $ where { ... }, *%_) must be implemented by <anon|84841888> because it is required by a role␤at /tmp/0cR5LXBhQ_:1␤»
13:34 grondilu m: role A { multi method f($) {...} }; class :: does A { multi method f($) {} }
13:34 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: ( no output )
13:34 grondilu ^something's wrong here
13:35 jnthn grondilu: where constraints are never considered equivalent (because the usual slipperly slope on those things), so you can't use them as a thing to satisfy in a role requirement.
13:37 grondilu ok, previously I was using a subset but I thought I was overdoing it.  Apparently I really need them, then.
13:37 jnthn So, behaving as designed, though a warning (or error) may be in order if you do use an unsatisfiable signature in a stub in a role.
13:37 * llfourn wonders if it would work if they both refered to the same subset type...
13:37 jnthn llfourn: I think thay may cut it, yes
13:37 llfourn role A { multi method f($ where * > 0) {...} }; class :: does A { multi method f($ where * >
13:37 llfourn woops nvm that
13:38 zwu joined #perl6
13:38 llfourn m: role A { multi method f(UInt) { ... } }; class :: does A { multi method f(UInt) { }} # works
13:38 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: ( no output )
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13:41 AlexDaniel hmmm
13:42 AlexDaniel m: say so ().all
13:42 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«True␤»
13:42 AlexDaniel m: say so ().any
13:42 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«False␤»
13:42 AlexDaniel m: say so ().none
13:42 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«True␤»
13:42 BenGoldberg m: Slip.all.say, Slip.any.say, Slip.none.say;
13:42 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«all((Slip))␤any((Slip))␤none((Slip))␤»
13:42 AlexDaniel m: say so ().one
13:42 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«False␤»
13:43 BenGoldberg m: Slip.all.so.say, Slip.any.so.say, Slip.none.so.say, Slip.none.so.say;
13:43 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«False␤False␤True␤True␤»
13:43 jnthn m: say [||](); say [&&](); # also :)
13:43 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«False␤True␤»
13:44 BenGoldberg m: say [+^]();
13:44 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«0␤»
13:44 BenGoldberg m: say [+|](), [+&]();
13:44 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«0-1␤»
13:46 Ben_Goldberg joined #perl6
13:46 * Ben_Goldberg can forsee that -1 being used for obfuscated code.
13:48 AlexDaniel m: say [==]()
13:48 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«True␤»
13:49 AlexDaniel m: say [X]()
13:49 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«(((Any)))␤»
13:50 pmurias joined #perl6
13:51 psch m: say [&&] Empty
13:51 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«True␤»
13:52 psch right, Empty is just a special Slip, isn't it
13:52 psch m: say Empty ~~ Slip; say defined Empty
13:52 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«True␤False␤»
13:52 llfourn m: say Empty eqv |()
13:52 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«True␤»
13:54 ZoffixWin Does anyone know where (and if) all the file tests are documented? like IO.e, IO.f, etc
13:57 AlexDaniel ZoffixWin: https://github.com/perl6/roast/​blob/master/S32-io/file-tests.t ?
13:57 ZoffixWin :S
13:57 AlexDaniel yea :S
13:58 AlexDaniel ah
13:58 AlexDaniel “documented”
13:58 AlexDaniel I've read it as “tested”
13:58 ZoffixWin All that tells me is our IO spectest is incomplete. I see .rwx and .z and whole bunch of other things in https://github.com/rakudo/rakud​o/blob/nom/src/core/IO/Path.pm
13:59 dogbert2 http://doc.perl6.org/type/I​O::Path#File_Test_operators
13:59 ZoffixWin dogbert2++ thanks
13:59 AlexDaniel some are also mentioned here: http://doc.perl6.org/language/io​#Checking_files_and_directories
14:00 AlexDaniel perhaps /io should also have a link to /IO::Path#File_Test_operators
14:00 BenGoldberg One would hope for all of those docs to have links to one another.
14:03 dalek doc: 9e2eac3 | (Mathieu Gagnon)++ | doc/Type/Bag.pod:
14:03 dalek doc: Fix broken link in type/Bag
14:03 dalek doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/9e2eac3e7a
14:06 ZoffixWin There are some artifacts of copypasta in exception messages. PR to fix: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/pull/761
14:07 ZoffixWin It was an edit on GitHub; I didn't run spectests.
14:08 AlexDaniel ZoffixWin++
14:16 dalek doc: 7b5fc80 | (Zoffix Znet)++ | doc/Type/IO/Path.pod:
14:16 dalek doc: Document .rw and .rwx file tetss
14:16 dalek doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/7b5fc80281
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14:24 ZoffixWin Would be nice to have .fr
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14:28 ZoffixWin m: say "works" if .r and .f given 'evalbot/TODO'.IO;
14:28 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«works␤»
14:28 ZoffixWin Never mind :)
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14:50 AlexDaniel m: say "works" if .r&.f given 'evalbot/TODO'.IO;
14:50 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«works␤»
14:50 AlexDaniel ZoffixWin: perhaps that will work too?
14:56 TimToady m: ''.substr(5).handled.say
14:56 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«True␤»
14:56 TimToady that's one bug
14:56 TimToady m: ''.substr(5).say
14:56 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«(HANDLED) Start argument to substr out of range. Is: 5, should be in 0..0; use *5 if you want to index relative to the end␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/15O6RJvQjC line 1␤␤»
14:56 TimToady the *5 is another bug
14:57 AlexDaniel m: say "works" if 'evalbot/TODO'.IO ~~ :f:r;
14:57 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/1LzvJmz4S3␤You can't adverb ␤at /tmp/1LzvJmz4S3:1␤------> 3say "works" if 'evalbot/TODO'.IO ~~ :f:r7⏏5;␤    expecting any of:␤        pair value␤»
14:57 AlexDaniel can't adverb what?
14:57 * masak submits rakudobug
14:57 * masak submits rakudobug
14:58 masak TimToady: that first one -- what output did you expect?
14:58 TimToady False
14:59 masak danke
14:59 TimToady something is testing the Failure for boolean/defined somewhere and marking it handled
14:59 TimToady when it should be returned unhandled
14:59 BenGoldberg m: say '.'.IO ~~ :d;
14:59 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«True␤»
14:59 ZoffixWin m: say "works" if 'evalbot/TODO'.IO ~~ :f & :r;
14:59 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«works␤»
15:01 masak m: "a".substr(7)
15:01 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: ( no output )
15:01 masak m: say "a".substr(7)
15:01 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«(HANDLED) Start argument to substr out of range. Is: 7, should be in 0..1; use *7 if you want to index relative to the end␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/uMfJBXCIvx line 1␤␤»
15:01 AlexDaniel m: say "works" if ‘perl6testya’.IO ~~ (:f:r) # ha, whoops
15:01 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: ( no output )
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15:02 masak #128038 #123039
15:02 synopsebot6 Link:  https://rt.perl.org/rt3//Publ​ic/Bug/Display.html?id=128038
15:02 synopsebot6 Link:  https://rt.perl.org/rt3//Publ​ic/Bug/Display.html?id=123039
15:03 masak m: say "works" if "README".IO ~~ :f:r
15:03 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/KLoVH5FhmZ␤You can't adverb ␤at /tmp/KLoVH5FhmZ:1␤------> 3say "works" if "README".IO ~~ :f:r7⏏5<EOL>␤    expecting any of:␤        pair value␤»
15:03 masak m: say "works" if "README".IO ~~ (:f:r)
15:03 camelia rakudo-moar 1acf80: ( no output )
15:03 AlexDaniel xD
15:05 ZoffixWin Where is that substr() coming from? It's not an nqp:: and I see no `use` statements: https://github.com/rakudo/rakud​o/blob/nom/src/core/Cool.pm#L77
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15:09 timotimo subs don't have to be defined before they show up in the source code
15:09 timotimo it's in src/Core/Str.pm
15:09 timotimo lines 2025 and following
15:11 ZoffixWin m: class Foo { method moo { bar } }; class Bar is Foo { sub bar { say 'woo' };  }; Foo.new.moo
15:11 camelia rakudo-moar b939c4: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/syJNwJOOon␤Undeclared routine:␤    bar used at line 1. Did you mean 'VAR', 'bag'?␤␤»
15:14 timotimo class inheritance won't give you package contents
15:15 ZoffixWin But how does Cool get "package contents" of Str?
15:16 jnthn ZoffixWin: The piece you're maybe missing is that everything in src/core is concatenated into a single file
15:16 ZoffixWin Ahhh. OK
15:16 jnthn (Called CORE.setting)
15:16 jnthn And compiled together
15:16 jnthn So it can be a single outer scope for the program.
15:17 * jnthn blogged about his Perl 6 work over the last two weeks: https://6guts.wordpress.com/2016​/04/30/refactoring-and-torture/
15:17 ZoffixWin \o/
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15:19 mscha p6: my @arr = (0 xx 4) xx (0 xx 4); say @arr; say @arr[1][2]; @arr[1][2] = 1;
15:19 camelia rakudo-moar b939c4: OUTPUT«[(0 0 0 0) (0 0 0 0) (0 0 0 0) (0 0 0 0)]␤0␤Cannot modify an immutable Int␤  in block <unit> at /tmp/tmpfile line 1␤␤»
15:19 mscha What am I doing wrong?
15:20 jnthn Creating an array of lists (immutable) rather than an array of arrays
15:21 mscha And how do I fix this?
15:21 jnthn p6: my @arr = [0 xx 4] xx (0 xx 4); say @arr; say @arr[1][2]; @arr[1][2] = 1;
15:21 camelia rakudo-moar b939c4: OUTPUT«[[0 0 0 0] [0 0 0 0] [0 0 0 0] [0 0 0 0]]␤0␤»
15:21 jnthn But..why not just [0 xx 4] xx 4 ? :)
15:21 ZoffixWin "The NQP and Rakudo builds easily take an hour between them, and running spectest this way takes over 12 hours." holy hell... and I thought regular builds were slow :P
15:22 jnthn The RHS of xx is coerced to an integer
15:22 jnthn ZoffixWin: :)
15:22 jnthn ZoffixWin: The speed of regular builds is certainly up for improvement too :)
15:22 ZoffixWin :)
15:23 mscha p6: 'my @arr = [0 xx 4] xx 4; say @arr; say @arr[1][2]; @arr[1][2] = 1; say @arr
15:23 camelia rakudo-moar b939c4: OUTPUT«5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling /tmp/tmpfile␤Unable to parse expression in single quotes; couldn't find final "'" ␤at /tmp/tmpfile:1␤------> 3say @arr[1][2]; @arr[1][2] = 1; say @arr7⏏5<EOL>␤    expecting any of:␤        single quo…»
15:23 mscha p6: my @arr = [0 xx 4] xx 4; say @arr; say @arr[1][2]; @arr[1][2] = 1; say @arr
15:23 camelia rakudo-moar b939c4: OUTPUT«[[0 0 0 0] [0 0 0 0] [0 0 0 0] [0 0 0 0]]␤0␤[[0 0 0 0] [0 0 1 0] [0 0 0 0] [0 0 0 0]]␤»
15:23 mscha Thanks/
15:30 lizmat perlpilot: re http://irclog.perlgeek.de/p​erl6/2016-04-28#i_12406261 short story: it was deprecated, and deprecations were to be removed before Xmas
15:31 lizmat perlpilot: long story: IO::Handle.ins created an overhead that was only necessary in some use cases
15:31 * grondilu suddenly suspects JIT is the reason rakudo on VirtualBox is so much faster than on a Raspberry Pi.  There is no JIT available on the Pi.
15:32 lizmat perlpilot: this made sense in Perl 5, but in Perl 6 we have .kv and -> $k, $v, so line counting can be done very easily in another way
15:33 lizmat perlpilot ZoffixWin re http://irclog.perlgeek.de/p​erl6/2016-04-29#i_12412332 , I still think IO::Spec should die
15:34 ZoffixWin die how? :)
15:34 ZoffixWin The $*SPEC thing is kinda awkward to use
15:34 lizmat I still think that all OS's that we support with rakudo, support simple forward slashes
15:35 ZoffixWin Ah
15:35 lizmat they may supply backslashes, but they accept just simple slashes
15:35 lizmat so all of the $*SPEC business is just a gigantic overhead
15:35 lizmat I don't think we'll ever see rakudo run on VMS
15:35 lizmat and if it would, I'm pretty sure VMS would simply support / as well
15:36 lizmat that was part of the work I did in the newio branch
15:36 lizmat which didn't make it
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15:53 lizmat m: (substr "",5).handled.say
15:53 camelia rakudo-moar d7698f: OUTPUT«False␤»
15:53 lizmat m: "".substr(5).handled.say
15:53 camelia rakudo-moar d7698f: OUTPUT«True␤»
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16:40 skink .seen soundart
16:40 yoleaux I haven't seen soundart around.
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16:49 BenGoldberg m: say "".^can('handled')
16:49 camelia rakudo-moar d7698f: OUTPUT«()␤»
16:52 BenGoldberg m: say Failure.^can('handled')
16:52 camelia rakudo-moar d7698f: OUTPUT«(handled)␤»
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17:20 dalek ecosystem: b33259c | (Zoffix Znet)++ | META.list:
17:20 dalek ecosystem: Add Bailador::Plugin::AssetPack::SASS
17:20 dalek ecosystem:
17:20 dalek ecosystem: Automatically preprocess and serve SASS files in Bailador apps: https://github.com/zoffixznet/per​l6-Bailador-Plugin-AssetPack-SASS
17:20 dalek ecosystem: review: https://github.com/perl6/e​cosystem/commit/b33259c3fd
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18:07 Herby_ \o #perl6
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18:21 brrt masak: excellent blog, fwiw :-)
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18:57 dalek perl6.org: 32b09e7 | (Steve Mynott)++ | source/downloads/index.html:
18:57 dalek perl6.org: add some errata for Star.  Windows nativecall and panda issues.  Recommend upgrading DBIish
18:57 dalek perl6.org: review: https://github.com/perl6/p​erl6.org/commit/32b09e715e
18:58 ZoffixWin Is zef also broken? Maybe it should be mentioned as an alternative
19:01 stmuk_ scrollback suggests zef works I'll add that as a suggestion
19:02 ZoffixWin Is there a way to use some sort of base template with Bailador and then just include smaller templates in it for each page? Like the layouts in Mojolicious
19:06 * ZoffixWin looks at code
19:06 ZoffixWin Nope
19:06 dalek perl6.org: eedaf87 | (Steve Mynott)++ | source/downloads/index.html:
19:06 dalek perl6.org: suggest use of zef on windows
19:06 dalek perl6.org: review: https://github.com/perl6/p​erl6.org/commit/eedaf87fd8
19:07 ZoffixWin stmuk_++
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19:26 buharin hi
19:26 buharin :)
19:26 buharin I want to ask you about opinion
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19:29 ZoffixWin *About* opinion? Well... opinions are like buttholes.. Everyone has them and each of them stinks :)
19:30 ZoffixWin buharin, so what was the question?
19:31 buharin what do you think about qt/qml?
19:31 buharin when whole world moving to qt
19:31 ZoffixWin Alien land to me. I'm a web person.
19:32 buharin qt will go to web
19:32 buharin also
19:32 stmuk_ perl people tend to be server-side and use desktop graphics libraries lightly
19:33 stmuk_ so I doubt anyone has used it much
19:34 ZoffixWin buharin, "Enjoy the first 30 days for free!" Am I looking at the wrong place? https://www.qt.io/
19:34 ZoffixWin 'cause I highly doubt "whole world" is moving to a paid product
19:34 buharin :D
19:35 stmuk_ ZoffixWin: you need to watch the webinar first :P
19:35 ZoffixWin heh
19:36 buharin but
19:36 buharin qt apps are completely free if open source
19:37 ZoffixWin Yeah, let me ask my boss how he feels about releasing to the public all of the code they pay me thousands of dollars to write :P
19:39 buharin :)
19:41 moritz fwiw at $work, the default for general-purpose libraries is to realease them as open source
19:41 moritz sadly, most of my work is business specific
19:42 moritz but for example the perl 5 modules Text::PageLayout and Text::BlockLayout were written for formatting invoices :-)
19:43 ZoffixWin Mojo::PDF was written for auto-generating clearance flyers :)
19:43 buharin last time one guy asked me about Perl5 job but sadly I didn't know Perl 5 :(
19:43 buharin I focus on C/C++
19:45 mst ZoffixWin: I'm sure he'd be xtatik about it
19:47 sortiz joined #perl6
19:47 ZoffixWin Heh, well, yeah, there's also xtatik.org but I now I kinda wish I could make it in Perl 6 :)
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19:51 mst that will be doable eventually, I'm sure
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19:54 sortiz \o #perl6
19:55 ZoffixWin \o
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20:55 pmurias buharin: how does qt work on the web?
20:56 buharin I am going to sleep
20:56 buharin sorry
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21:03 tbrowder AlexDaniel: I have a pull request being tested now which should improve the Dynamic variables table here: https://doc.perl6.org/language​/variables#Dynamic_variables; take a look at it now if you can and I'll hold off merging it until you approve; I have tested it locally and I think you will like the results.
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21:04 dalek doc: 3105e84 | (Tom Browder)++ | doc/Language/variables.pod:
21:04 dalek doc: improve table looks
21:04 dalek doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/3105e84e55
21:04 dalek doc: 05bb136 | RabidGravy++ | doc/Language/variables.pod:
21:04 dalek doc: Merge pull request #478 from tbrowder/master
21:04 dalek doc:
21:04 dalek doc: improve table looks
21:04 dalek doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/05bb13602b
21:05 ZoffixLappy joined #perl6
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21:08 ZoffixLappy ugexe++ I'm really loving zef
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21:21 travis-ci Doc build failed. Jonathan Stowe 'Merge pull request #478 from tbrowder/master
21:21 travis-ci https://travis-ci.org/perl6/doc/builds/126937106 https://github.com/perl6/doc/com​pare/7b5fc80281df...05bb13602b1e
21:21 travis-ci left #perl6
21:23 AlexDaniel tbrowder: I don't think that you should ask anyone when doing such minor changes :)
21:25 AlexDaniel travis did not like it but it does not look like it is related
21:25 ZoffixLappy Yeah, looks like something completely different
21:27 AlexDaniel “double free or corruption”
21:27 hotel wow, I never knew how much nicer-looking travis was than jenkins
21:38 rurban left #perl6
21:40 sortiz Latest nom 'make spectest' : t/spec/S17-promise/start.t .................................... Dubious, test returned 17 (wstat 4352, 0x1100) # Still running...
21:41 sortiz plus some "Missing test file" in t/spec/S06-* and t/spec/S32-*
21:43 khw joined #perl6
21:44 tbrowder AlexDaniel: well, better safe than sorry...you may change yr mind on my next pull req...
21:46 ZoffixLappy tbrowder, don't worry revert feature works :)
21:46 ZoffixLappy tbrowder++ # all the doc PRs \o/
21:47 AlexDaniel tbrowder: yeah, no need to ask for permission. Just ask for forgiveness if something goes wrong ;)
21:50 AlexDaniel also, some people are reviewing every commit anyway, so if there's something not ok it wont be unnoticed
21:51 timotimo and there's also travis-ci and appveyor that catch things that asplode on platforms and configurations you can't test directly
21:57 sortiz FWIW: Latest nom spectest results: https://gist.github.com/salortiz/​cc6ec8148a65dc64305791d6a2ef1201
21:59 timotimo mhm mhm
22:00 timotimo well, jnthn found and fixed something in his frame overhaul branch, which may be put into master separately
22:04 ZoffixLappy lovely :/ "===SORRY!=== P6M Merging GLOBAL symbols failed: duplicate definition of symbol NoRouteFound"
22:04 tadzik may have involved nuking my entire env multiple times
22:05 tadzik ooh, I know
22:05 tadzik check your META6.json for copy-pastos
22:05 ZoffixLappy Me?
22:05 * skink wonders what mischief you could do with unlink($*PROGRAM)
22:06 sortiz ZoffixLappy, some of these can be cured with s/module/package/
22:07 ZoffixLappy I think I know why. I have multiple modules using Bailador and I also attempted to use a local copy, thus the conflict
22:08 ZoffixLappy .seen ufobat
22:08 yoleaux I saw ufobat 07:59Z in #perl6: <ufobat> now i am afraid that my PR on HTTP::Server::Tiny will not get merged into it ;) thank you RabidGravy
22:08 ZoffixLappy .seen ZoffixLappy
22:08 yoleaux You're right there.
22:08 sortiz :P
22:08 ZoffixLappy yoleaux, you could still tell me, yo. I need to know the time in Z :)
22:08 ZoffixLappy .seen sortiz
22:09 yoleaux I saw sortiz 22:08Z in #perl6: <sortiz> :P
22:09 ZoffixLappy aha :)
22:09 RabidGravy it's 22:09Z :)
22:10 sortiz 17:09CDT :)
22:12 hotel zulu?
22:13 hotel isn't that just america-speak for utc?
22:14 ZoffixLappy Zulu is the "word of choice" to use for Z when spelling out letters
22:14 hotel when referring to time I mean
22:15 hotel s/word of choice/what NATO uses in their phonetic alphabet/
22:15 ZoffixLappy ah
22:15 hotel :)
22:17 sue joined #perl6
22:19 skink Zulu time is UTC yeah
22:20 hotel :+1:
22:25 stmuk_
22:25 timotimo
22:26 ZoffixLappy ?                     !
22:30 dalek perl6.org: 59e441f | (Steve Mynott)++ | source/downloads/index.html:
22:30 dalek perl6.org: sortiz++ DBIish update don't require --force, the version was changed
22:30 dalek perl6.org: review: https://github.com/perl6/p​erl6.org/commit/59e441f41a
22:30 geekosaur not even america-speak precisely. US Armed Forces-speak
22:31 geekosaur http://www.worldtimezone.com/index24.html the single-letter zone designations are in the bottom ribbon of the map
22:32 ZoffixLappy zef --force --/tests install .    # doesn't seem to work
22:33 TEttinger Llueve, Djembe, Xhosa
22:33 geekosaur (using the IPA words instead of letters)
22:33 ZoffixLappy Gives me usage :/ without --force --/tests fails with some sort of error :/
22:34 TEttinger I don't even know how Xhosa is pronounced, opening X is diverse enough in sounds without an h modifying it...
22:35 hotel I assume it's like a 'sh' or a 'phlegm'
22:35 arnsholt /k/ according to Wikipedia
22:36 hotel I sit corrected
22:36 TEttinger Llueve, Djembe, Xhosa, Phlegm
22:36 hotel ^^
22:36 stmuk_ BTW has anyone noticed Bailador test fails on OS X?
22:36 TEttinger so like the others it would be a very misleading letter for an acronym
22:37 hotel last time I built rakudo (2016.04) and ran tests most of them were dubious
22:38 hotel not on mac but since we're talking about tests...
22:38 ZoffixLappy Dammit: https://gist.github.com/zoffixznet​/eb304e46fababd8fc2708a5550c689d4
22:38 stmuk_ it passed on linux but I saw "body must be a Supply
22:39 stmuk_ on OS X .. I've suspected  threading issues there for a while
22:39 hotel is it bad that I'm turning in a paper about procrastination like three weeks late?
22:40 stmuk_ will investigate more tomorrow
22:40 ZoffixLappy wtf... looks like it was trying to install my local version :S from that dir.... Moving to another dir changed behaviour
22:41 skink RabidGravy, Seems like at least one other module re-implements OAuth like in WebService::Soundcloud
22:41 ugexe ZoffixLappy: if the version is the same still it will use a cached copy
22:41 ugexe (can be disabled in config.json or with --/cached)
22:41 skink Might be worth having an OAuth module?
22:41 ZoffixLappy ugexe, home come zef --force --/tests install FooBar gives me the usage message?
22:42 ZoffixLappy well, add --debug... I have zef aliased to zef --debug
22:42 ugexe --/test
22:42 sortiz ZoffixLappy, And beware that Bailador in unvesionized: https://github.com/ufobat/Bail​ador/blob/master/META.info#L3
22:42 RabidGravy skink, yes just there wan't when I made that :) I'd like to make pluggable auth for http::useragent at some point
22:42 ZoffixLappy ugexe, seems like USAGE needs an update: "FLAGS      --/tests                Skip the testing phase"
22:43 ugexe ZoffixLappy: ah good eye
22:45 ugexe maybe i should use :tests(:$test) in the signature
22:45 ZoffixLappy :S still failing install all of a sudden :/ https://gist.github.com/zoffixznet​/85fc90c802870dd1dc0cd35d472ba8fb
22:46 grondilu joined #perl6
22:47 ZoffixLappy :/ so much for my going to the bar to hack on stuff :\
22:50 ugexe hmm, that might be CUR.install itself
22:50 ZoffixLappy panda fails too: https://gist.github.com/zoffixznet​/dbe6d40e8e88cdfd467f08a997916619
22:50 ugexe ill see if i can get some more details
22:50 * ZoffixLappy suspects some recent change to one of the modules very recently
22:52 ugexe since its pointing to ends-with for panda and zef, i wonder if its this: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/blob/1037​8163b007267f80e488477d9b6bd305104880/src/c​ore/CompUnit/Repository/FileSystem.pm#L100
22:54 ZoffixLappy rm -fr .perl6/precomp/; solved the issue
22:54 ugexe hmmm, you had precomp issues yesterday too right? something about Bailador seems to mess with CUR invalidation of precomps
22:55 * ZoffixLappy doesn't remember
22:56 ZoffixLappy Ah, that was on installing of zef with rakudobrew build zef; and I think rakudobrew rehash fixes that
22:57 ugexe oh. someone else had to delete .perl6/precomp yesterday for a problem then
22:57 ZoffixLappy This time, it might have been due to my (a) trying to `use` Bailador from a local dir, while some other modules were using it from installation, causing symbol merge (b) trying to install Bailador from that local dir using zef install .
22:57 ZoffixLappy I did delete .perl6/precomp yesterday to solve zef issue on my main box, but I found the rehash was enough on my lappy
22:58 ugexe i would bet its on Bailador using sigless 'app' to call methods on, when its declared with 'my $app;'
22:58 grondilu I also have problems installing my module.  http://paste.debian.net/451974/  Currently trying again after having removed .perl6/precomp
22:59 grondilu nope, failed again same way
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23:01 grondilu what's weird and annoying is that there isn't even an error message.
23:01 ZoffixLappy sigilles app is a sub: https://github.com/ufobat/Bailado​r/blob/master/lib/Bailador.pm#L10
23:03 ugexe grondilu: first you should declare all your provides in your META6.json
23:04 grondilu all compunits?
23:04 ZoffixLappy all files, yeah
23:05 ugexe you are missing 3 in the deepest subfolder
23:05 grondilu ok
23:05 ZoffixLappy You have 6 files, but just 3 in META
23:05 ZoffixLappy grondilu, also "author" key is not specced. It's authors that takes an Array
23:05 ZoffixLappy and `perl` key is mandatory. perl: "6.c"
23:05 ugexe s/author/owner/
23:06 ZoffixLappy owners?
23:06 ugexe https://design.perl6.org/S22.html#owner
23:07 ugexe what you would typically use as the user portion of the auth
23:07 ugexe origin:owner
23:09 * grondilu learns about https://github.com/jonathanstowe/Test-META/
23:09 ZoffixLappy But is that a key of META6.json? I only see this listed: https://design.perl6.org/S22.html#authors
23:11 ugexe well, it doesnt list auth/authority either
23:15 TimToady actually, 'Xhosa' begins with a lateral click
23:16 TimToady (the one you sometimes hear when people are making horses go :)
23:17 ugexe grondilu: yours is failing precomp too (likely because of the missing `provides`) from gen/moar/m-CORE.setting:35905  (/home/nickl/.rakudobrew/moar-2016.04/install/sha​re/perl6/runtime/CORE.setting.moarvm:precompile)
23:18 ZoffixLappy Because those aren't keys: https://design.perl6.org/S22​.html#recommendation_manager  My interpretation of it is "cpan:" and "github:" stuff is determined by the installation tool. The "owner" would be listed in the "authors" key of META, and asking for Foo:auth<cpan:bar> would make the installer look for Foo on CPAN with a module that has :auth<> adverb set to 'bar'
23:18 ZoffixLappy Seems "authors" is irrelevant for that choice and the spec does mark it as 'optional'
23:18 * ZoffixLappy still thinks :auth<> stuff is a mistake
23:18 ugexe auth should be the origin, where it was originally located. this way other sites can still mirror it
23:19 ugexe auth != content storage
23:19 TimToady correct
23:19 TimToady auth is part of the identity
23:19 TimToady cpan can only be part of the identify if the original naming authority decides that that's its name
23:20 TimToady that is, if 'bar' thinks 'cpan:bar' is his/her most official name
23:21 TimToady if so, cpan:bar is more correct than bar
23:21 TimToady since it's rooted universally
23:21 * ZoffixLappy is really confused
23:22 ugexe you shouldnt expect the package managers to keep a list of what each of the authorities expand to
23:22 ugexe its just to identify the distribution. XXX:auth<github:foo> might be on github or maybe not
23:23 zwu joined #perl6
23:23 TimToady it's all identity, nothing to do with distributions, just as a URI used for identity is not really necessarily where you get that information from
23:24 TimToady it's kind of a shame that so far the universal naming schemes in the world are all location-based
23:24 ugexe aye, or an email (:auth<foo@bar.net>)
23:25 TimToady these days that arguably works better for identity than almost anything
23:25 TimToady it's a bit confusing to say "identify the distribution" though
23:26 TimToady distribution is overloaded
23:26 ugexe often it will be rooted with something that also happens to represent a content storage, which is why at first one might think it should determine where to obtain it from
23:26 TimToady that's what I just said :)
23:28 ugexe i never said i could read
23:28 ZoffixLappy :D
23:33 sufrostico joined #perl6
23:33 zwu I wonder if the compact array will allow structures too in order to exchange data between C array of structures. In numpy, the structure array is supported http://docs.scipy.org/doc/nump​y-1.10.1/user/basics.rec.html.
23:36 TimToady it should be, or else it should be :)
23:37 TimToady the intent is certainly that it should work, whether it does yet or not
23:38 TimToady we can currently inline a C struct into another struct with HAS rather than has
23:39 TimToady something similar would need to be operative on the array level
23:41 zwu is there doc about inline a C struct into another struct with HAS rather than has. If so, extending that inline to array may be an option.
23:42 TimToady it's documented a bit under nativecall, but not, I suspect, how it interacts with the underlying 6model
23:44 timotimo oh, is a CArray of a CStruct an array of pointers?
23:44 * TimToady is a non-expert in this corner of things
23:45 zwu TimToaday: thanks.
23:45 TimToady pay more attention to timotimo here :)
23:45 timotimo oh, er, what, me?
23:46 * timotimo slowly backs away
23:46 * TimToady hides behind the cricket hiding behind timotimo
23:47 timotimo ah, yes, CArray of CStruct is an array of pointers to structs
23:47 timotimo https://github.com/MoarVM/MoarVM/blob​/master/src/6model/reprs/CArray.c#L53  -  check these lines
23:48 sortiz zwu, If you need to pass an inline array of CStructs to C you can use NativeHelpers::CStruct, from NativeHelpers::Blob.
23:48 timotimo nice
23:49 sortiz See: https://github.com/salortiz/NativeHel​pers-Blob/blob/master/t/02-cstruct.t
23:50 timotimo we might want to offer a deprecation cycle for CArray of CStruct and ask users to use CArray[CPointer[type]] instead?
23:51 zwu that's cool!
23:53 TimToady that would seem like a more straightforward way to deal with things in the future, if we can get there from here
23:54 * sortiz searching RabidGravy's original related RT ticket.
23:57 sortiz That is RT #127730
23:57 synopsebot6 Link:  https://rt.perl.org/rt3//Publ​ic/Bug/Display.html?id=127730
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