Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2017-08-02

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:01 timotimo whoa
00:02 nadim_ Zoffix: not your rendering but the output of the json parsing, actually the code to generate it, the difference between gist, ddt without filter, and ddt with filters makes me wonder how super human you guys are that can read dd output
00:03 nadim_ timotimo: you can also, if you prefer, very easilly generate html files, they also support folding
00:05 Zoffix nadim_: this is the code that makes the dump: https://github.com/zoffixznet/perl6-buggable/blob/master/lib/Buggable/Plugin/CPANTesters.pm6#L13-L22
00:05 Zoffix `dd` seems to work for me fine now, though I know I was using some sort of dumping module when I was just starting with Rakudo.
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00:08 nadim_ it is nice if one doesn't have lots of data, is not interested in references, and has the eyes of a 12 years old :)
00:09 nadim_ I developped the P5 module because I had dumps of over half a million lines, there was no way I could use a standard dumper
00:12 Zoffix 0.o
00:12 Zoffix I don't dump anything even close to that.
00:12 Zoffix just a few lines
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00:16 timotimo i'll go to bed now, have a good one!
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00:18 Zoffix \o
00:19 BenGoldberg m: { say ENTER now - INIT NOW; say now - INIT now };
00:19 camelia rakudo-moar 59ba9c: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>?Undeclared name:?    NOW used at line 1??»
00:20 BenGoldberg m: { say ENTER now - INIT now; say now - INIT now };
00:20 camelia rakudo-moar 59ba9c: OUTPUT: «0.0015279?0.0024228?»
00:20 BenGoldberg m: { say now - INIT now; say ENTER now - INIT now };
00:20 camelia rakudo-moar 59ba9c: OUTPUT: «0.002215?0.00026739?»
00:22 nadim_ Zoffix:  you could use this https://nopaste.linux-dev.org/?1160252
00:22 nadim_ I also notice you use ddt twice let me check that again
00:23 nadim_ maybe you want to change ' : ' to ': ' in the filter I dent french style you may want english style
00:25 Zoffix I don't care about that code enough to bother changing it.
00:26 nadim_ three options a one line filter, not a biggy
00:26 nadim_ I believe it is more redeable without the type and reference information that serve no purpose here
00:26 Zoffix Well. You know where the PR button is at :)
00:26 * Zoffix & # bed
00:26 nadim_ will do!
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00:32 Geth ¦ whateverable: d4286f3c08 | (Aleks-Daniel Jakimenko-Aleksejev)++ | 11 files
00:32 Geth ¦ whateverable: Generate the last test automatically
00:32 Geth ¦ whateverable:
00:32 Geth ¦ whateverable: The problem that these tests are trying to solve is probably
00:32 Geth ¦ whateverable: non-obvious, so here's the explanation. The test bench works by
00:32 Geth ¦ whateverable: sending messages to the bot and waiting for responses. Let's say you
00:32 Geth ¦ whateverable: have a test that expects two messages (‘foo’ and ‘bar’), but the bot
00:32 Geth ¦ whateverable: replies with three instead (‘foo’, ‘bar’, and 3 seconds later ‘baz’)?
00:32 Geth ¦ whateverable: <…commit message has 15 more lines…>
00:32 Geth ¦ whateverable: review: https://github.com/perl6/whateverable/commit/d4286f3c08
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00:43 lookatme morningh
00:43 lookatme morning
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00:46 Geth ¦ whateverable: f537ca14be | (Aleks-Daniel Jakimenko-Aleksejev)++ | 13 files
00:46 Geth ¦ whateverable: Aid for disabled editors
00:46 Geth ¦ whateverable:
00:46 Geth ¦ whateverable: I guess there's nothing wrong with assisting the editor if it can't
00:46 Geth ¦ whateverable: help itself, so let's do it consistently.
00:46 Geth ¦ whateverable: review: https://github.com/perl6/whateverable/commit/f537ca14be
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01:51 Topic for #perl6 is now »ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | https://perl6.org/ | evalbot usage: 'p6: say 3;' or rakudo:,  or /msg camelia p6: ... | irclog: http://irc.perl6.org or http://colabti.org/irclogger/irclogger_logs/perl6 | UTF-8 is our friend!
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04:59 jdv79 ok, my pgup and pgdn keys are broke
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04:59 jdv79 anyway anyone else get segv when using --profile?
05:00 jdv79 https://gist.github.com/anonymous/58209c8bb4c17b1e0467f6bbfce0c13a
05:00 jdv79 ill try updating
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05:18 jdv79 ok.  after updating it throws tons of errors but it doesn't crash outright
05:18 jdv79 progress?
05:18 jdv79 something is still borked
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06:25 benjikun is there a module to hash data with sha256 yet?
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06:41 nine .tell raiph: https://www.reddit.com/r/perl6/comments/6htztl/no_candidate_found_for_zef/dj1bc4p/ sounds highly appropriate :) Thanks!
06:41 yoleaux nine: What kind of a name is "raiph:"?!
06:41 yoleaux 1 Aug 2017 16:42Z <raiph> nine: I just searched my comments mentioning "rakudobrew" and this seems to be my most recent: https://www.reddit.com/r/perl6/comments/6htztl/no_candidate_found_for_zef/dj1bc4p/ Do you consider what I said there appropriate?
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06:47 * zengargoyle chuckles at yoleaux
07:04 sacomo Hi #perl6
07:05 lookatme sacomo, hi
07:05 sacomo ola
07:05 sacomo I was messing around with subsets and hashes and ran into something that I don't understand
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07:07 sacomo this is probably all wrong, but just messing around
07:07 sacomo m: subset ID of Hash where { .key  ~~ 'email'|'accountid' }; my ID %h = Hash.new( email => 'perl@perl6.org' ); say %h.perl; say %h.^name;
07:07 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «(my ID %)?Hash[ID]?»
07:08 sacomo I assing ID type to the new hash, the new hash is created, its type is set, but it is empty
07:08 sacomo no error
07:09 sacomo m: subset ID of Hash where { map { $_ ~~ 'email'|'accountid' }, *.keys }; my ID %h = Hash.new( email => 'perl@perl6.org' ); say %h.perl; say %h.^name;
07:09 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «(my ID %)?Hash[ID]?»
07:09 sacomo just trying to understand the behavior
07:09 lookatme sacomo, Hash.new seems like does not take argument
07:12 sacomo hmm
07:12 benjikun I don't get it: 'Default constructor for 'block' only takes named arguments'
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07:13 lookatme m: subset ID of Hash where { map { $_ ~~ 'email'|'accountid' }, *.keys }; my ID %h = email => 'perl@perl6.org'; say %h.perl; say %h.^name;
07:13 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «Type check failed in assignment to %h; expected ID but got Str ("perl\@perl6.org")?  in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1??»
07:14 lookatme m: subset ID of Hash where { map { .key ~~ 'email'|'accountid' }, *.keys }; my ID $h = email => 'perl@perl6.org'; say %h.perl; say %h.^name;
07:14 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>?Variable '%h' is not declared. Did you mean '$h'??at <tmp>:1?------> 3 ID $h = email => 'perl@perl6.org'; say 7?5%h.perl; say %h.^name;?»
07:14 moritz sacomo: 'my ID %h' declares a hash that contains ID elements
07:15 sacomo ok, is there a way to do subset ID of Hash[Str]? something like that?
07:15 moritz m: subset ID of Hash where {all(.keys) eq any('email'|'accountid'); my %h is ID := ID.new(); %h<email> = 'foo';
07:15 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>?Can't use unknown trait 'is ID' in a variable declaration.?at <tmp>:1?------> 3eq any('email'|'accountid'); my %h is ID7?5 := ID.new(); %h<email> = 'foo';?    expecting any of:?        TypeOb…»
07:16 moritz m: subset ID of Hash where {all(.keys) eq any('email'|'accountid')}; my %h is ID := ID.new(); %h<email> = 'foo';
07:16 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>?Cannot use bind operator with this left-hand side?at <tmp>:1?------> 3'|'accountid')}; my %h is ID := ID.new()7?5; %h<email> = 'foo';?»
07:16 moritz m: subset ID of Hash where {all(.keys) eq any('email'|'accountid')}; my %h := ID.new(); %h<email> = 'foo';
07:16 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «You cannot create an instance of this type (ID)?  in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1??»
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07:16 moritz m: subset ID of Hash where {all(.keys) eq any('email'|'accountid')}; my %h is ID; %h<email> = 'foo';
07:16 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «You cannot create an instance of this type (ID)?  in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1??»
07:16 moritz :(
07:16 sacomo ha
07:16 sacomo ok
07:17 moritz (on the plus side, classes are very cheap in Perl 6, so you could write  class ID is rw { has ($.email, $.accountid) })
07:19 sacomo yeah
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07:19 sacomo just playing with subsets to see how far we can take them
07:20 moritz m: subset ID of Hash where {all(.keys) eq any('email'|'accountid')}; my ID $h = { email => 'foo' };
07:20 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: ( no output )
07:20 moritz m: subset ID of Hash where {all(.keys) eq any('email'|'accountid')}; my ID $h = { other => 'foo' };
07:20 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «Type check failed in assignment to $h; expected ID but got Hash (${:other("foo")})?  in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1??»
07:20 moritz if you are willing to forego the % sigil, this works
07:21 lookatme m: subset ID of Hash where { all(.keys) (elem) any(<email accountid>) }; my ID $h = {email => 'baz'}; say $h;
07:21 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «{email => baz}?»
07:21 sacomo ah
07:21 sacomo ok
07:21 sacomo that is interesting
07:22 lookatme m: subset ID of Hash where { all(.keys) (elem) <email accountid> }; my ID $h = {email => 'baz'}; say $h;
07:22 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «{email => baz}?»
07:22 lookatme m: subset ID of Hash where { all(.keys) (elem) <email accountid> }; my ID $h = {emailx => 'baz'}; say $h;
07:22 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «Type check failed in assignment to $h; expected ID but got Hash (${:emailx("baz")})?  in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1??»
07:24 zengargoyle m: my subset ID of Hash where {all(.keys) eq any('email'|'accountid')}; my ID $h; $h<email> = 'foo'; my %h := %$h; say %h.perl
07:24 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «{:email("foo")}?»
07:24 zengargoyle m: my subset ID of Hash where {all(.keys) eq any('email'|'accountid')}; my ID $h; $h<email> = 'foo'; my %h := %$h; say %h.perl; say %h.^name;
07:24 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «{:email("foo")}?Hash?»
07:24 zengargoyle phbbt.
07:24 sacomo m: subset ID of Hash where { .keys ~~ 'email'|'accountid' }; my ID $h = {email => 'baz'}; say $h; say $h ~~ ID;
07:24 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «{email => baz}?True?»
07:25 sacomo m: subset ID of Hash where { .keys ~~ 'email'|'accountid' }; my ID $h = {notemail => 'baz'}; say $h; say $h ~~ ID;
07:25 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «Type check failed in assignment to $h; expected ID but got Hash (${:notemail("baz")})?  in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1??»
07:29 lookatme if you declare with `ID %h`, it is mean the type of key is ID
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07:31 sacomo ok
07:32 sacomo m: subset ID of Hash where { .keys ~~ 'email'|'accountid' }; sub foo($email --> ID) { { email => $email } }; say foo('p@p6.org');
07:32 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «{email => p@p6.org}?»
07:32 benjikun how do I concatenate two blobs
07:34 sacomo m: say Blob.new([1, 2, 3]) ~ Blob.new([1, 2, 3]);
07:34 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «Blob:0x<01 02 03 01 02 03>?»
07:35 benjikun oh
07:35 benjikun that simple
07:35 benjikun thanks lol
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07:49 sacomo is there a perl 6 playground / codepen where I can share runnable code?
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07:53 moritz sacomo: https://glot.io/new/perl6
07:54 sacomo thanks
07:55 sacomo does anyone know if this behavior is documented somewhere? https://glot.io/snippets/esalbb12gf
07:56 sacomo the final type checks correctly identify each subset
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07:57 sacomo does the type association happen at the test? or when the subs return the ID value?
07:58 moritz subset types can only be verified at runtime
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08:00 sacomo ok, so like the "$id1 ~~ Email" happens at that test? or is the subset associated as part of the sub's return step?
08:01 sacomo doing .^name on the var just prints Str or Int
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08:26 moritz it happens at the test, yes
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08:37 sacomo moritz, thanks.
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09:30 nadim_ Hi, I have this code: multi method get_elements (Hash:D $h) { $h.sort(*.key)>>.kv.map: -> ($k, $v) {'X' ~ $k, ' => ', $v} }
09:30 nadim_ Note the 'X' ~ $k
09:32 nadim_ all works just fine, if I change the 'X' to ':', what i believe is a single quoted string containing ':' then hell breaks lose and i get this error a bit later: Too few positionals passed; expected 5 arguments but got 4
09:32 nadim_ if I change ':' to 'X:' then all works fine
09:32 nadim_ I tried to golf it down without success
09:33 lookatme m: method g (Hash:D $h) { $h.sort(*.key)>>.kv.map: -> ($k, $v) {'X' ~ $k, ' => ', $v} };  g(%{ a => 1, b => 2});
09:33 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5===?Undeclared routine:?    g used at line 1??Other potential difficulties:?    Useless declaration of a has-scoped method in mainline (did you mean 'my method g'?)?    at <tmp>:1?    ------> 3method7?5 g (Hash:D $h) { $…»
09:33 lookatme m: sub g (Hash:D $h) { $h.sort(*.key)>>.kv.map: -> ($k, $v) {'X' ~ $k, ' => ', $v} };  g(%{ a => 1, b => 2});
09:33 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: ( no output )
09:33 lookatme m: sub g (Hash:D $h) { $h.sort(*.key)>>.kv.map: -> ($k, $v) {'X' ~ $k, ' => ', $v} };  say g(%{ a => 1, b => 2});
09:33 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «((Xa  =>  1) (Xb  =>  2))?»
09:33 lookatme m: sub g (Hash:D $h) { $h.sort(*.key)>>.kv.map: -> ($k, $v) {':' ~ $k, ' => ', $v} };  say g(%{ a => 1, b => 2});
09:33 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «((:a  =>  1) (:b  =>  2))?»
09:34 nadim_ as I said golfing it down did not help
09:34 lookatme you can provide more info about your problem
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09:35 nadim_ Yes but it's biggish, I will try isolate it more firs, maybe (probably), I mess up later somewhere. I just wanted to check that I have not missed some magical ':' effect
09:37 nadim_ the code is on github, just think I should do a bit more effort first ;)
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10:02 Zoffix buggable: testers f878354a-6183-11e7-89a5-c5f577a92919
10:02 buggable Zoffix, Cound not find that ID or API is down. Try manually: http://api.cpantesters.org/v3/report/f878354a-6183-11e7-89a5-c5f577a92919
10:03 Zoffix buggable: testers f878354a-6183-11e7-89a5-c5f577a92919
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10:16 nadim_ hi, a few questions. 1/ is it possible to export the same module under different name? IE: I'd like Data::Dump::Tree to also be DDT.
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10:18 nadim_ 2/ do we have a coverage tool? the error I had above (':' messing things up) turned out to be in a completely different module in code that has _never_ been run!
10:19 gfldex nadim_: did you try symlinks to create an alias?
10:20 nadim_ I'd like that to happen for anyone that installs the module
10:23 gfldex nadim_: it could be done with a Build.pm but getting that portable would require quite some work
10:24 jnthn I've no idea if this would actually work, but you could just give it two entries in the provides section of the META6.json?
10:25 jnthn That'd let the use statement work for both
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10:25 jnthn If it's just about exporting it with another name then just stick something like my constant DDT is export = Data;:Dump::Tree; at the end
10:28 nadim_ 3/ in DDT, I use '=>' to separate keys from values in Hashe it is also used for Map and Set.  http://imgur.com/kLLy1cP I am womdering if it is not more per6is to display it this way http://imgur.com/OP3TIb3 or even this way http://imgur.com/Q8o83no, opinions welcome
10:31 nadim_ jnthn: thanks. I understand that the "export"  at the end would let me do DDT.new() but it wouldn't allow me to do use DDT, right?
10:34 jnthn nadim_: No, that was what I was talking about with the provides thing in META6.json
10:34 jnthn afaik that's how (once installed) we map "use Foo" into a file to load
10:34 jnthn In theory poking two entries for the same file into provides would let them both resolve to it
10:34 jnthn In reality I never tried it :)
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10:35 nadim_ Then I'll try it for you :)
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10:57 nadim_ jnthn: although not related to the change, I believe, I get a weird zef install error https://nopaste.linux-dev.org/?1160257, the tests use the Horizontal module so it is weird it can use them but not install them.
10:58 jnthn Maybe your tests don't touch the file doing the use?
10:59 jnthn The whole lot will be compiled on installation
11:00 nadim_ I added a use Datat::Dump::Tree::Horizontal directly in one of the tests, didn't cange a thing
11:02 jnthn Did you include that in the provides section?
11:03 jnthn Did you typo it like you just did here? ;)
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11:04 nadim_ I think not ;) https://nopaste.linux-dev.org/?1160258
11:06 nadim_ honestly I haven't installed the module in ages, if ever, as I work with it in my dev environment directly but I still need to make it install or the whole effort is moot :)
11:11 andreoss are the design docs the only documentation on macros? what is the current state of their support?
11:16 lizmat andreoss: https://github.com/masak/007
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11:38 nadim_ ugexe:  I have this error installing locally with zef https://nopaste.linux-dev.org/?1160257, I just update to the latest zef but it made no change
11:39 nadim_ ugexe: the file is there, it is in the repo, it is used by tests, tests pass, install fails
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11:59 Geth___ ¦ modules.perl6.org: acd5a415cc | (Gabor Szabo)++ | 7 files
11:59 Geth___ ¦ modules.perl6.org: start collecting information about Appveyor - CI on MS Windows  #76
11:59 Geth___ ¦ modules.perl6.org: review: https://github.com/perl6/modules.perl6.org/commit/acd5a415cc
11:59 Geth___ ¦ modules.perl6.org: 5a8b542674 | (Gabor Szabo)++ | .gitignore
11:59 Geth___ ¦ modules.perl6.org: gitignore /blib/
11:59 Geth___ ¦ modules.perl6.org: review: https://github.com/perl6/modules.perl6.org/commit/5a8b542674
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12:25 szabgab Hi there!
12:26 szabgab I have updated the code generating http://modules.perl6.org/ with the initial step to collect information about the use of Appveyor for testing on Windows
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12:33 Zoffix szabgab: someone will need to rebuild the db, I think, 'cause of the added table
12:34 Zoffix bin/build-project-list.pl --interval=0
12:35 Zoffix And then swap the sqlite db the site is currently using with the the resultant sqlite db
12:35 szabgab Zoffix: yes, I was about to ask for that, just got interrupted by doorbell
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12:40 moritz DBIx::Class::Storage::DBI::_prepare_sth(): DBI Exception: DBD::SQLite::db prepare_cached failed: no such column: me.appveyor_status [for Statement "SELECT me.meta_url, me.name, me.author_id, me.build_id, me.travis_status, me.appveyor_status, me.url, me.description, me.stars, me.issues, me.date_updated, me.date_added FROM dists me WHERE ( meta_url = ? )"] at lib/ModulesPerl6/Model/Dists.pm line 136
12:40 moritz do I have to delete the old DB first? do a manual migration step? or anything else?
12:41 moritz git grep -i 'create table'
12:41 moritz comes up empty
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12:41 moritz szabgab: ^^
12:42 Zoffix moritz: bin/build-project-list.pl --interval=0 --db-file=new.db    then when it's done copy new.db to (I think) modules.sqlite.db or something like that (there's a file with that name already) and restart the app
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12:42 Zoffix This process can possibly be improved :D
12:43 Zoffix modulesperl6.db
12:45 Zoffix there's no create table because it's done by DBIC
12:45 szabgab moritz: yes, that's what I had to do locallt
12:46 szabgab locally. It took me about an hour to figure that out :(
12:46 Zoffix :o
12:46 szabgab maybe the suggestion of zoffix is better though.
12:47 szabgab In any case I guess it would be a good idea to add it to the readme
12:47 moritz generation of new DB is now running
12:47 szabgab moritz++ Zoffix++
12:47 Aaronepower Hello, how do you access argv? `@*ARGV` is what a lot of documentation says but it isn't available according to perl.
12:47 moritz Aaronepower: @*ARGS if my memory serves correctly
12:47 Zoffix Aaronepower: it's @*ARGS. Which documentation says @*ARGV? That should be fixed
12:48 gfldex m: say @*ARGS;
12:48 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «[]?»
12:48 gfldex Aaronepower: see https://docs.perl6.org/language/variables#Dynamic_variables
12:49 Zoffix Aaronepower: and that's just the args, without the name of the program itself, which is available as $*PROGRAM
12:49 AlexDaniel m: say $*ARGFILES.filename
12:49 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «No such method 'filename' for invocant of type 'IO::ArgFiles'?  in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1??»
12:49 Zoffix Aaronepower: and if you want the args to mean the files to process, you can also use $*ARGFILES, which is an IO::CatHandle type, with args loaded as filenames (or with STDIN handle if no args were given)
12:49 nowan joined #perl6
12:50 Zoffix m: say $*ARGFILES.path
12:50 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «IO::Special.new("<STDIN>")?»
12:50 Aaronepower Zoffix: Sorry not documentation, just other people's posts.
12:50 Zoffix Ah
12:51 Zoffix Maybe it's something that used to exist during design stages...
12:51 Aaronepower None of the actual perl6 documentation makes it to the top of Google or DuckDuckGo.
12:54 Geth___ ¦ modules.perl6.org: 9f2da12b3c | (Zoffix Znet)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | README.md
12:54 Geth___ ¦ modules.perl6.org: Fix URL to DEPLOYMENT.md docs
12:54 Geth___ ¦ modules.perl6.org: review: https://github.com/perl6/modules.perl6.org/commit/9f2da12b3c
12:59 Geth___ ¦ modules.perl6.org: a48f7213b5 | (Zoffix Znet)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | README.md
12:59 Geth___ ¦ modules.perl6.org: Document how to update database
12:59 Geth___ ¦ modules.perl6.org:
12:59 Geth___ ¦ modules.perl6.org: - Document caching mechanism and how to clear cache
12:59 Geth___ ¦ modules.perl6.org:     from commit messages
12:59 Geth___ ¦ modules.perl6.org: - Document what to do when changes to the database
12:59 Geth___ ¦ modules.perl6.org:    structure are made
12:59 Geth___ ¦ modules.perl6.org: review: https://github.com/perl6/modules.perl6.org/commit/a48f7213b5
12:59 Zoffix Geth___: your extra-long tail annoys me.
12:59 * perlpilot wonders where (and when) people mentioned @*ARGV
13:00 Zoffix oh, it's my geth!
13:00 Zoffix huggable: geth
13:00 huggable Zoffix, Set geth report URL (select application/json and send me everything): http://geth.niner.name:8888/?chan=#perl6-dev
13:01 Geth_ joined #perl6
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13:02 araraloren there is @ARGV in Perl, maybe confused @*ARGS and @ARGV
13:03 daxim I asked a SO question 22 min ago and it promptly is at -1 but no comments for the downvoting reason.  this bothers me more than it should.
13:03 Zoffix heh
13:03 cog_ joined #perl6
13:03 perlpilot I would think it must've been a typo or thinko, but if there's enough posts using @*ARGV instead of @*ARGS, then maybe there's some genuine misunderstanding?
13:04 araraloren I search in google, there are no @*ARGV found
13:05 Aaronepower perlpilot: I think my misunderstanding was from this article, which is about perl5. https://perlmaven.com/argv-in-perl
13:06 Aaronepower but is the top result for "perl6 argv" in DuckDuckGo.
13:06 Zoffix hehe
13:06 perlpilot ah ... okay
13:06 Zoffix All the more reasons to rename the language :)
13:07 perlpilot Aaronepower: had you searched for "perl 6 argv" you would have gotten the right article as the top result  ;-)
13:08 Zoffix hah
13:08 Zoffix oh yeah
13:08 jast got a name in mind?
13:08 zakharyas joined #perl6
13:08 Zoffix Aaronepower: you do know about sub MAIN right? If you just want your script to take some args, that's the thing to use. I think this article mentions it: http://perl6maven.com/parsing-command-line-arguments-perl6
13:09 Aaronepower Zoffix: I did, but I just wanted the first argument provided and it seemed like a bit much for just one argument.
13:09 Zoffix jast: Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious
13:09 araraloren XD
13:09 jast I think that one might already been taken for... something
13:11 ugexex joined #perl6
13:13 ugexex nadim_: did you even try using your alias before using it? That's a precomp error as jnthn pointed out
13:13 ugexex Before installing rather
13:13 perlpilot If the long view is that "Perl 5" will eventually obsolesce and "Perl 6" will be the only Perl, then keeping the "Perl" brand makes sense.   If we're to continue to believe that "Perl 5" and "Perl 6" are separate languages with independent life-times and that both will continue indefinitely, then a rename of some sort would be better.  (but I still loathe that option for some reason)
13:14 Zoffix perlpilot: why does keeping the brand make sense?
13:14 Zoffix Rakudo has little in common with Perl. Hell, even sigils are different.,
13:15 AlexDaniel :S
13:15 perlpilot They share the same "spirit".  They are largely syntactically similar.
13:16 Zoffix lol
13:16 araraloren Rakudo and Perl 6 are different, right ?
13:16 perlpilot (but, by the same thinking, PHP is in the Perl family too, so ...  ;-)
13:16 dakkar joined #perl6
13:16 Aaronepower In pattern matching how do you redeclare a symbol?
13:16 Zoffix perlpilot: and any concrete terms to define that? What's does "Perl" brand mean to you?
13:17 araraloren m: say "bb" ~~ /(\w)$0/;
13:17 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «?bb?? 0 => ?b??»
13:17 araraloren Aaronepower, ^^
13:18 perlpilot Zoffix: it means that language that fits my brain and has some elements of procedural programming, oop, functional programming and has strong use of regex.  "Perl" is that thing I go to when I want to get things done quickly, easily, and fun-ly   :)
13:18 Zoffix araraloren: not in my usage. Rakudo (capital R) is the stand-in name I'm using to refer to the language as a trial before I'll present argumentation for extending the language name on 6.d language release: https://rakudo.party/post/The-Hot-New-Language-Named-Rakudo
13:19 Zoffix perlpilot: so... Python, Ruby, PHP, JavaScript.
13:19 Aaronepower m: my @baz = [1, 2, 3, 4, 5];  my (@foo, @bar) = @baz.classify({$_ > 3}){True, False}; my (@foobar, @bar) = @bar.classify({$_ > 2});
13:19 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>?Redeclaration of symbol '@bar'?at <tmp>:1?------> 3$_ > 3}){True, False}; my (@foobar, @bar7?5) = @bar.classify({$_ > 2});?    expecting any of:?        shape declaration?»
13:19 Aaronepower araraloren: ^
13:20 Zoffix perlpilot: Perl11 also, eh?
13:20 perlpilot Zoffix: to me, Perl is an embodiment of TIMTOWTDI, whipituptitude, and manuplexity.  Python doesn't quite fit that, but sure ... Ruby and Javascript.    PHP has a little too much impedance because of the inconsistencies.
13:20 Zoffix Aaronepower: that's the thing I mentioned yesterday. There's no elegant way to do that with `@` sigils, because they take all the things and the signature version with binding needs a `my`
13:20 cantankerousking joined #perl6
13:21 Zoffix HAH
13:21 araraloren I think Rakudo is an implementation of Perl 6, and NQP , even Perl 6 dialect fanlang.
13:22 Zoffix perlpilot: what's "manuplexity"?
13:23 araraloren m: my @baz = [1, 2, 3, 4, 5];  my (@foo, @bar) = @baz.classify({$_ > 3}){True, False}; my (@foobar, @foobaz) = @bar.classify({$_ > 2});
13:23 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: ( no output )
13:23 perlpilot a typo of "manipulexity"  :)
13:24 Aaronepower m: say ["Hello", "World"].join('\n');
13:24 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «Hello\nWorld?»
13:24 araraloren Aaronepower, you type the duplicate name
13:24 perlpilot Zoffix: I can't spell it, but I know it when I see it ;-)
13:24 Zoffix perlpilot: well, what is it?
13:24 Aaronepower Why does `.join('\n')` not actually put in a newline?
13:25 Zoffix Aaronepower: single quotes don't interpolate \n escapes
13:25 Zoffix Aaronepower: use double quotes
13:25 perlpilot https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Citations:manipulexity
13:27 szabgab moritz:could you take a look at the modules process again? When I reload the page it sometimes shows an empty appveyor column, sometimes not even that
13:27 Zoffix All that's too vague and applies to too many languages (even your own reference lists Python as example). So I'd say that's now what Perl brand represents.
13:27 Zoffix It might be why you like "Perl", but not the brand.
13:28 Zoffix s/now/not/;
13:29 perlpilot Could be.  It's hard to remove my own personal history and look at such things objectively.
13:30 moritz szabgab: the run that generates the new DB file is still in progress
13:31 moritz dist 832 of 865
13:31 Geth ¦ modules.perl6.org: 72b93fcb41 | (Zoffix Znet)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | assets/js/main.js
13:31 Geth ¦ modules.perl6.org: Adjust sorter plugin filter
13:31 Geth ¦ modules.perl6.org:
13:31 Geth ¦ modules.perl6.org: to accomodate newly added appveyor column
13:31 Geth ¦ modules.perl6.org: review: https://github.com/perl6/modules.perl6.org/commit/72b93fcb41
13:32 perlpilot I used to tell people that I thought PHP, Python, Ruby, Perl, and Javascript were all converging towards the same language  (and then JS added "use strict"! :-)   But Perl always seemed to be the pioneer in glomming features together in one place in general ways.
13:32 Zoffix perlpilot: are you the author of "PHP training wheels without the bike" website?
13:32 perlpilot uh ... NO
13:33 araraloren PHP is best language in the world. :)
13:34 Zoffix Ah ok. I recall a decade ago, Perl people loved to point to that website and mock PHP, especially for inconsistencies in its routine names. Now, a decade later, Rakudo has the same inconsistencies, if not worse. Maybe there is something to your hypothesis of convergance :D
13:34 Zoffix PHP is awesome because you can program by just googling what you need to and get a copy-pasteable answer.
13:34 perlpilot PHP is "the people's language" in that regard.
13:35 perlpilot Perl kinda was that way in the 1990s too.
13:40 nowan joined #perl6
13:41 Aaronepower What's the throwaway pattern bind?
13:42 * Zoffix shrugs
13:42 timotimo you mean $ ?
13:42 timotimo equivalently @ or % or &
13:42 timotimo well, not equivalent, of course
13:43 timotimo just omitting the name will throw the value away, but you can still require a certain kind to be passed there
13:43 tony-o joined #perl6
13:44 Zoffix m: my @baz = [1, 2, 3, 4, 5];  my @foo = .[.grep: * > 3]:delete with @baz; my @foobar= .[.grep: * > 2]:delete with @baz; dd [@baz, @foo, @foobar]
13:44 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «[[1, 2, 3], [5, Any], [4, Any]]?»
13:44 Zoffix m: my @baz = [1, 2, 3, 4, 5];  my @foo = .[.grep: * > 3, :k]:delete with @baz; my @foobar= .[.grep: * > 2, :k]:delete with @baz; dd [@baz, @foo, @foobar]
13:44 camelia rakudo-moar 01dbd8: OUTPUT: «[[1, 2], [4, 5], [3]]?»
13:45 astj joined #perl6
13:46 Aaronepower timotimo: having just `my (@foo, @)` doesn't work.
13:47 Kyo91 joined #perl6
13:48 Zoffix Aaronepower: doesn't work to accomplish what?
13:48 Aaronepower Zoffix: Fail to compile.
13:48 Zoffix ?
13:49 Zoffix What are you trying to do?
13:49 Aaronepower Zoffix: It just complains about the next one. https://paste.rs/6L2
13:49 moritz Zoffix: can I restart the modules.perl6.org app without re-fetching all the data?
13:49 Kyo91_ joined #perl6
13:50 itaipu joined #perl6
13:50 Zoffix moritz: the app doesn't fetch anything. Yeah you can restart it after you copied the new db you made to modulesperl6.db.
13:50 Aaronepower Zoffix: I want `my (@foo, @dontcare)` but not just bind it to a random variable. In Rust in pattern matching assigning something to `_` means "I don't care about this part of the pattern.
13:50 moritz Zoffix: how do I restart it?
13:51 Zoffix I don't remember. Wasn't there a service?
13:51 moritz no :(
13:51 moritz just a cron job
13:51 Zoffix service modules.perl6.org-init.d restart
13:51 Zoffix I think that did it
13:51 Zoffix I mean I ran it
13:52 Zoffix "Servince unavailable" oops :P
13:52 nhywyll joined #perl6
13:52 moritz Aug 02 13:51:52 www modules.perl6.org-init.d[23266]: Can't load application from file "/etc/init.d/modules.perl6.org-init.d": Can't locate Toadfarm.pm in @INC (you may need to install the Toadfarm module) (@INC contains: /etc/perl /usr/local/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/perl/5.20.2 /usr/local/share/perl/5.20.2 /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/perl5/5.20 /usr/share/perl5 /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/perl/5.20
13:52 moritz /usr/share/perl/5.20 /usr/local/lib/site_perl /usr/local/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/perl/5.20.1 /usr/local/share/perl/5.20.1 .) at /etc/init.d/modules.perl6.org-init.d line 16.
13:52 Zoffix Ah, ok, then I guess that's an outdated service file.
13:53 Zoffix I started it
13:53 moritz thanks
13:53 Zoffix su modules.perl6.org; cd ~/modules.perl6.org; hypnotoad bin/ModulesPerl6.pl
13:53 moritz ah
13:54 Zoffix But I thought we had something automatic to start it when, say, the server reboots and it used to work
13:54 Zoffix .oO( or maybe I was *meant* to make it work but never did )
13:55 moritz the crontab contains a @reboot line
13:56 Zoffix Oh
13:58 Geth ¦ modules.perl6.org: f81e3d3673 | (Zoffix Znet)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | assets/sass/main.scss
13:58 Geth ¦ modules.perl6.org: Fix broken selector
13:58 Geth ¦ modules.perl6.org:
13:58 Geth ¦ modules.perl6.org: Fixes centering of text in Travis/AppVeyor columns
13:58 Geth ¦ modules.perl6.org: review: https://github.com/perl6/modules.perl6.org/commit/f81e3d3673
14:00 szabgab OK, apparently Zoffix and moritz have figured out the http://modules.perl6.org/ issues. Thanks!
14:00 szabgab It now works and shows the Appveyor column
14:03 nowan joined #perl6
14:05 Zoffix szabgab: if you add a PostProcessor to fetch AppVeyor's status, don't forget to add `[REBUILD]` at the start of the commit message title, so that the site rebuilds cached dists too
14:06 Zoffix Here's postprocessor to fetch travis status. IIRC just adding a new file to the directory will work, as it's using Module::Pluggable to find them https://github.com/perl6/modules.perl6.org/blob/master/lib/ModulesPerl6/DbBuilder/Dist/PostProcessor/TravisCI.pm
14:06 szabgab Zoffix: I'll try to remember, but I am not sure when, if at all, I'll be able to do that.
14:06 Zoffix OK :)
14:07 szabgab Anyway, thank you both!
14:08 mcmillhj joined #perl6
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14:14 sena_kun https://rt.perl.org/Public/Bug/Display.html?id=131827 can be closed, btw.
14:16 moritz did anybody add a test?
14:16 moritz if so, I don't see it documented in the ticket
14:16 sena_kun yeah, it was merged today.
14:16 Zoffix Closed (and added link to tests)
14:16 sena_kun give me a second...
14:16 sena_kun Zoffix++
14:19 lizmat Q: of the people here, *if* you're coming to the TPCiA, would you like to attend a 2-day hackathon afterwards?
14:20 El_Che lizmat: I suspect most people have already book they train/plain ticket and hotel
14:20 lizmat yeah
14:20 El_Che what makes the pool smaller
14:21 lizmat and the people that *will* stay behind, most likely would like to see more of Amsterdam anyway
14:21 El_Che certainly
14:23 sena_kun a new regression bug for `[]` is filled if anyone feels a courage within. :)
14:23 lizmat sena_kun: RT ?
14:24 wamba joined #perl6
14:24 timotimo Aaronepower: oh, the difference is that "my" won't let you declare things without a name
14:24 Zoffix lizmat: https://rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=131830
14:24 sena_kun lizmat, https://rt.perl.org/Public/Bug/Display.html?id=131830
14:24 timotimo Aaronepower: but you can declare the variable separately from the destructuring, or put the "my" inside the parenthesis
14:24 sena_kun lizmat, it doesn't golfed though.
14:24 sena_kun *isn't
14:25 Zoffix bisect: m: use NativeCall; CArray[Str].new[my int $ = 1]
14:25 bisectable6 Zoffix, Bisecting by exit code (old=2015.12 new=5f68c77). Old exit code: 0
14:25 bisectable6 Zoffix, bisect log: https://gist.github.com/5ab1ea4789d86778ce9b8554c1fdeca0
14:25 bisectable6 Zoffix, (2017-07-31) https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/a256c26d850c0e5ff986a6dfa1b1ef1ffaf55f40
14:26 lizmat sena_kun: could you check whether reverting a256c26d850c0e5f fixes it ?
14:26 lizmat and PR a test for it?  :-)
14:26 sena_kun lizmat, hmm, to be honest, I doubt I can right now. Can try later today though.
14:26 Zoffix c: a256c26d850c0e5f,a256c26d850c0e5f~1 use NativeCall; CArray[Str].new[my int $ = 1]
14:26 committable6 Zoffix, ¦a256c26: «Ambiguous call to 'postcircumfix:<[ ]>'; these signatures all match:?:(\SELF, int $pos)?:(NativeCall::Types::CArray:D \array, $pos)?  in block <unit> at /tmp/ZrEjw1fX0F line 1? «exit code = 1»» ¦a256c26d850c0e5f~1: «»
14:26 Zoffix Yup, fixes it
14:27 sena_kun \o/
14:27 nadim_ ugexe:  Hi, thank you for your quick answer. The problem is not with the alias, it is not even there. I try to install as shown in the link, I get an error message for the Horizontal module, the tests that are run by zef make use of it. I appreciate any help you can give.
14:27 Zoffix c: HEAD use Test; use NativeCall; lives-ok { CArray[Str].new[my int $ = 1] }, 'native int as index to CArray does not crash'
14:27 committable6 Zoffix, https://gist.github.com/51b84d58476f362e210355f21d15153d
14:27 Zoffix c: a256c26d850c0e5f~1 use Test; use NativeCall; lives-ok { CArray[Str].new[my int $ = 1] }, 'native int as index to CArray does not crash'
14:27 committable6 Zoffix, ¦a256c26d850c0e5f~1: «ok 1 - native int as index to CArray does not crash»
14:28 Zoffix lizmat: sena_kun ^ test :)
14:28 sena_kun Zoffix++
14:29 sena_kun I'll commit it to roast right now then?
14:29 Zoffix PR it. Otherwise it'll be failing for all the devs until the issue is fixed
14:29 El_Che lizmat: I am looking to volunteer, but the timespots looks weird: wednesday afternoon timekeeping: 14:15-15:30
14:29 Zoffix I don't get why that commit causes that issue tho
14:29 El_Che lizmat: while talks start soon and finish later
14:30 sena_kun Ok.
14:31 Zoffix sena_kun: nevermind. I see in #perl6-dev the suspect commit was reverted
14:31 sena_kun Zoffix, nod. Where should I stick in the test?
14:31 lizmat El_Che: looking
14:31 El_Che thx
14:31 nadim_ Zoffix: can you do me a favor and install the latest Data::Dump::Tree with Zef? I have an issue and I'd like to know if it happens just here.
14:32 Zoffix Pass :P I don't want issues
14:32 sena_kun nadim_, I can, I guess.
14:32 nadim_ thanks sena_kun
14:33 nadim_ Zoffix: chicken ;) the issue would have been that it does not instll that's all
14:33 lizmat http://act.perlconference.org/tpc-2017-amsterdam/wiki?node=Post%20Conference%20Hackathon   # add your name if you're interested
14:35 sena_kun nadim_, Could not find Data::Dump::Tree::Horizontal at line 2 in:
14:35 jonathon joined #perl6
14:37 jonathon Hi. Having an issue packaging `zef` for a system-wide install; i've been pointed to this being a bug (or similar) within rakudo but i don't know how to proceed. any help or pointers appreciated. (https://github.com/ugexe/zef/issues/190)
14:38 lizmat El_Che: I don't see the 14:15:  I do see a plenary presentation missing at 13:50
14:39 lizmat El_Che: maybe we should take this to #yapc on irc.perl.org ?
14:40 skids joined #perl6
14:40 El_Che I am just wonderting if they don't need volunteerd in the other afternoon spots or just a wiki typo
14:40 nattefrost joined #perl6
14:41 zakharyas joined #perl6
14:42 Zoffix jonathon: well, would be helpful to get --ll-exception info to know where that error is happening, but it just happened that the 2017.07 has a commit that breaks that feature :|
14:43 nadim_ sena_kun: thank you, I hope I can find what silly thing I have done quickly. I may ask for you to test installing again if it ok with you
14:43 Zoffix oh, but maybe there's a better way.
14:43 lizmat El_Che: looks like a typo to me :-)
14:43 sena_kun nadim_, no problem
14:43 Zoffix jonathon: 1 sec, lemme try to a potential workaround around the --ll-exception breakage
14:46 Zoffix bah
14:46 Zoffix But I found a workaround
14:48 jonathon joined #perl6
14:49 Zoffix jonathon: can you run this and pastebin the output? cd $(mktemp -d); mkdir Exceptions; echo 'class Exceptions::Foo { method process ($e) { say "$e.message() $e.backtrace.full()"; False } }' > Exceptions/Foo.pm6; RAKUDO_EXCEPTIONS_HANDLER=Foo perl6 -I. -MExceptions::Foo /usr/share/perl6/vendor/bin/zef
14:49 Zoffix Bassically --ll-exception switch prints full backtrace, include core code, but it's broken. So the workaround is to make a custom exception handler that prints the full backtrace
14:50 zakharyas joined #perl6
14:51 lizmat --ll-exception broken again ?
14:51 Zoffix lizmat: no, but jonathon is on 2017.07
14:51 lizmat aaaahhh  *phew*  :-)
14:53 jonathon Zoffix: https://hastebin.com/inijoqapib.rb
14:54 Khisanth joined #perl6
14:54 Zoffix \o/ my workaround worked \\o/
14:54 mspo would you guys be open to replacing the perl6 shell script with a c program?
14:54 mspo so it works on bsd/osx?
14:56 Zoffix ugexe: you mentioned jonathon's issue is a Rakudo issue. Do you know what it is or was it just a hunch?
14:56 Zoffix I see this check is using `.e`; should it be `.f` instead? https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/blob/nom/src/core/CompUnit/Repository/Installation.pm#L424
14:57 Zoffix I mean, it being `.f` would avoid jonathon's issue, but does that just move the goalpost to another issue?
14:58 Zoffix mspo: maybe ask in #perl6-dev?
14:59 mspo Zoffix: ETOOMANYCHANNELS
14:59 lizmat .e would work for directories also, is that what you want ?
15:00 Zoffix lizmat: no, the code expects a file (and .f does .e too). It's currently crashing because it's trying to treat a directory as a file, but I don't know if it's a bug that it's a directory in the first place or if the crash is preventing it from Doing The Right Thing
15:01 nadim_ joined #perl6
15:01 Zoffix I'll file an RT and .tell nine to take a look :)
15:02 jonathon Do you need me to report/file anything anywhere?
15:03 tony-o jonathon: are you jonathonf on github?
15:03 jonathon yup
15:03 Zoffix jonathon: imma do it right now and then I'll give you the ticket number so you could follow it
15:04 jonathon Grand :)
15:05 tony-o not trying to be rude towards you, but the documentation you quoted says how to make the custom location known.
15:05 Zoffix jonathon: here: https://rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=131831
15:06 Zoffix .tell nine would you have any ideas on this ticket? https://rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=131831
15:06 yoleaux Zoffix: I'll pass your message to nine.
15:06 Zoffix jonathon: and nine is the expert on that part of codebase, so they might know why this is happening and fix it or improve the error
15:07 jonathon tony-o, if you're installing a module, yes. it's not explicit about installing `zef` itself to a custom location, and without knowing exactly how zef works it's not obvious it's the same thing. That may be down to a lack of experience with Perl6 but that's the reason for having a README
15:08 jonathon Zoffix: thank you :) I suspect this is going to help a number of distro packagers too.
15:09 ugexe you are still expecting "vendor" to point to your system vendor directory
15:09 tony-o jonathon: zef relies on zef modules to run.  the CLI bin loads them, so if you're installing zef manually to a custom location, the CLI portion of zef needs the libraries
15:09 tony-o and you'd need to tell perl6 (which is what is running 'zef') where to find them
15:09 jonathon yes, i get that
15:10 jonathon you're looking at it from the perspective of an expert, not from the perspective of someone who's new to the ecosystem
15:10 tony-o well, perl6 can't automagically know the arbitrary location of where you installed its libs to
15:10 tony-o someone who is new to the ecosystem is unlikely to be installing zef from source to a custom location
15:10 ugexe in your package script you have `perl6 -Ilib "$srcdir/install-dist.pl" --to="$pkgdir/usr/share/perl6/vendor" --for=vendor --from=.` is not --for="inst#/usr/share/perl6/vendor"
15:10 jonathon no, perl6 can't - but zef can. i even says "installed to $LOCATION"
15:10 tony-o perl6 is what runs zef.
15:11 lizmat three little words: http://act.perlconference.org/tpc-2017-amsterdam/talk/7149
15:11 nicq20 joined #perl6
15:11 jonathon tony-o, yes, i get that
15:11 tony-o so, not really, it can't.  it only knows the location when you're installing it, after that it's a problem
15:12 Zoffix "2.8 million lines of code" :o
15:12 tony-o oh dear
15:12 vendethiel joined #perl6
15:13 jonathon ugexe: switching it to --for="inst#/usr/share/perl6/vendor", install-dist.pl throws an error (Type check failed in binding to parameter '$next-repo'; expected CompUnit::Repository but got Nil (Nil))
15:14 jonathon going by the OpenSUSE approach, --for=vendor is correct (https://build.opensuse.org/package/view_file/devel:languages:perl6/perl6-Inline-Perl5/perl6-Inline-Perl5.spec?expand=1)
15:14 eliasr joined #perl6
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15:20 Zoffix sena_kun ? Zoffix, nod. Where should I stick in the test?
15:20 Zoffix sena_kun: here: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/blob/nom/t/04-nativecall/05-arrays.c
15:20 Zoffix Don't look like NativeCall is part of Perl 6 spec
15:21 Zoffix Oh, oops
15:21 Zoffix sena_kun: I meant here: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/blob/nom/t/04-nativecall/05-arrays.t
15:21 sena_kun Zoffix++
15:21 ugexe well, it shouldn't be surprising that when you install to site, a location that perl6 specifically knows about, it works. and that when you install it to a custom location without also setting up the PERL6LIB (something a system packager should be doing, not zef) that its not going to work as expected
15:21 sena_kun give me a minute...
15:23 ugexe the problem is you are copy and pasting someone else's system build script without taking the time to understand how any of the pieces work, and instead of asking how they work you declare things are broken or wrong
15:24 jonathon you mean like the possible bug that occurs when installing to vendor?
15:24 jonathon you're also making a lot of assumptions, but i'm not here to discuss this. i left the issues with zef on the GitHub issue lists.
15:25 jonathon left #perl6
15:27 sena_kun https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/pull/1127 may be merged and https://rt.perl.org/Public/Bug/Display.html?id=131830 may be closed. \o/
15:27 ugexe right, which is why i'm not making assumptions
15:27 AlexDaniel joined #perl6
15:28 Zoffix Merged and closed. Thanks, sena_kun++
15:37 nicq20 Is $*IN still used to get piped input?
15:38 lizmat m: .say for $*IN.lines
15:38 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «»Wann treffen wir drei wieder zusamm?«?   »Um die siebente Stund‘, am Brückendamm.«?     »Am Mittelpfeiler.«?         »Ich lösche die Flamm.«? »Ich mit«??         »Ich komme vom Norden her.«?        »Und ich vom Süden.«…»
15:38 lizmat nicq20: I'd say, yes  :-)
15:39 khw joined #perl6
15:39 nicq20 Ok, thanks! I must be doing something else wrong then.
15:43 Zoffix nicq20: why? What issue are you having?
15:43 tony-o Zoffix++
15:43 Zoffix ?
15:44 moritz (general awesomeness) :-)
15:44 tony-o haha, ^^
15:44 nicq20 I'm trying to pipe text from `tail -f` into a Supply, but I can't seem to get passed `.tap`.
15:44 nicq20 `tail -f test | perl6 -e '$*IN.Supply.tap: *.perl.say'`
15:45 nicq20 Not entirely sure why I had some code that would do this, and it no longer works.
15:45 Zoffix nicq20: because it sits and waits until X number of bytes are read.
15:45 Zoffix tail -f test | perl6 -e '$*IN.Supply(:size<1>).tap: *.perl.say
15:46 nicq20 When was that setup? Or was it always like that?
15:46 Zoffix probably always
15:47 Zoffix Default size is 65536 characters (in char mode)
15:47 Zoffix And the remaining stuff will get sent when the handle gets closed
15:47 Zoffix nicq20: .lines.Supply maybe?
15:48 Zoffix so it feed line-by-line
15:49 robertle joined #perl6
15:49 lizmat I think there's also some interaction with -f there
15:53 rindolf joined #perl6
15:53 perlpilot What were Damian's three little words?  class, role, method ?
15:54 perlpilot and .... I need to scroll to now
15:57 * perlpilot wonders if their is a difference between `$*IN.lines.Supply` and `Supply.from-list($*IN.lines)`
15:58 Zoffix s: ().Seq, 'Supply', \()
15:58 SourceBaby Zoffix, Sauce is at https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/blob/7599e0c/src/core/Any.pm#L458
15:58 Geth ¦ ecosystem: 53cfcfb607 | (brian d foy)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | META.list
15:58 Geth ¦ ecosystem: Add PrettyDump
15:58 Geth ¦ ecosystem: review: https://github.com/perl6/ecosystem/commit/53cfcfb607
15:59 Zoffix s: ().Seq.list, 'Supply', \()
15:59 SourceBaby Zoffix, Sauce is at https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/blob/7599e0c/src/core/List.pm#L912
15:59 Zoffix perlpilot: nope
16:00 perlpilot Zoffix: I wish I could remember how to use that bot  :)
16:01 Zoffix It's very easy: you're just giving arguments to a Rakudo routine and there are two multies:  &Callable, Capture $args?   and    Mu $object, Str:D $method-name, Capture $args?
16:01 Zoffix If you don't give args, you'll get location of proto for multies
16:01 Zoffix Hm
16:01 Zoffix mi6 generates META.info files instead of META6.json? https://github.com/briandfoy/perl6-PrettyDump/blob/master/META.info
16:02 Zoffix m: say "Trying to submit a PR to that repo to rename that file is {<pointless ok>.pick}"
16:02 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «Trying to submit a PR to that repo to rename that file is ok?»
16:02 ugexe I dont think it generates it, but will reuse it if it already exists
16:03 ugexe btw, lets get rid fo META.info in 6.d :)
16:03 Zoffix Lets :)
16:04 Geth Swapped META.info ? META6.json in 1 dists in https://github.com/perl6/ecosystem/commit/2318406976
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16:10 Zoffix $ perl6 -MWWW -e '"https://raw.githubusercontent.com/perl6/ecosystem/master/META.list".&get.lines.grep(*.ends-with: "META.info").elems.say'
16:10 Zoffix 85
16:10 Zoffix Pretty good, consdering the Great META Rename started with like 45% of ecosystem using META.info
16:15 tony-o did you do all of those PRs manually Zoffix ?
16:17 ugexe nadim_: well, you have copypasta in the module names from your meta file (https://github.com/nkh/P6-Data-Dump-Tree/blob/release/META6.json#L24).
16:17 Zoffix Semi-manually. I had a bash script opening firefox windows to edit the files and a GreaseMonkey script filling in the details into the form, so I was just clicking "submit PR" buttons basically
16:19 [Coke] .
16:19 ugexe nadim_: seems like Test::META could use something to catch that
16:23 zakharyas joined #perl6
16:28 ugexe I could tweak something to catch that during test phase though... last time I attempted it (1, 1.5 years ago?) there were issues with Build.pm workarounds preventing it, and those should be gone since 2017.06
16:29 ugexe which all basically boils down to the difference between `perl6 -I. t/my-test.t` and `perl6 -Ilib t/my-test.t` (unless you have a META6.json in your lib folder... then these are the same :)
16:30 itaipu joined #perl6
16:31 ugexe note you would have seen your failure with `perl6 -I. -e 'use Data::Dump::Horizontal;'` because that name is not in the META6.json that -I. points at. with -Ilib it works, because there is no META6.json to get the wrong name from - instead it guesses the file name from the module name (which exists)
16:32 Ulti is there a reason you can't do parametric types of Pairs ?
16:32 Zoffix Pair is a class, not a role..
16:33 Ulti ok... is there a reason you can't do parametric types on Classes that are container like
16:33 Ulti is there a role Pair does thats Pairy?
16:34 Zoffix Oh, it does do Associative
16:34 Zoffix Ulti: then I don't know why
16:35 Ulti m: my Associative[Str, Callable] $thing = 'rofl' => sub { 'copters' };
16:35 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «Type check failed in assignment to $thing; expected Associative[Str,Callable] but got Pair (:rofl(sub () { #`(Sub...)?  in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1??»
16:35 ugexe m: role Foo[::T] { has $!bar = T; method bar { T } }; say Foo[Int].new.bar; # seems like technically it could be done though?
16:35 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «(Int)?»
16:35 Ulti Im answering that reddit about 3 things that suck about P6 webdev
16:35 Ulti one is definately Bailador using Pairs for its routing API
16:35 Ulti but I cant think of a compile time way to prevent stupid stuff
16:36 Ulti since where $x.value ~~ Callable is going to only be checked on dispatch right?
16:36 Zoffix Not guranteed. It can be checked at compile time.
16:36 Ulti get (Pair $x where $x.value ~~ Callable)
16:36 Ulti Zoffix: with a sufficiently advanced compiler with static analysis...
16:37 Ulti but not Rakudo right now?
16:37 tony-o Ulti: check out http::server::router::yaml
16:37 Zoffix Dunno, I just remember jnthn++ mentioning that you can't rely on `where` running at runtime (or having sideeffects)
16:37 Ulti yeah I mean I treat it as if it was some static compile time constraint in my head
16:38 Ulti wonder if subset would be the way to go here CallablePair with that where
16:38 szabgab joined #perl6
16:39 Zoffix m: Pair[Int,Int].new: 42, 42
16:39 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>?Pair cannot be parameterized?at <tmp>:1?------> 3Pair[Int,Int]7?5.new: 42, 42?»
16:39 Ulti tony-o: cool, but personally I'd prefer just meta package structure implying most of that a bit like Catalyst and even that is probably not the best either
16:39 Zoffix m: Associative[Int,Int].new: 42, 42
16:39 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «Default constructor for 'Associative[Int,Int]' only takes named arguments?  in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1??»
16:40 troys joined #perl6
16:40 szabgab Zoffix: is there some magic I can add to the commits of modules.perl6.org that will restart the web application?
16:40 Zoffix m: dd Hash[Int,Int].new: 42, 42
16:40 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «(my Int %{Int} = 42 => 42)?»
16:40 Zoffix szabgab: that's done automatically after each db rebuild
16:40 Ulti :3
16:40 szabgab I don't need to rebuild the whole db but it seems I need a restart ...
16:41 szabgab oh so maybe the template has been already updated but the the process is still running?
16:42 szabgab the (currently) should contain a number as well, and it does on my system.
16:42 szabgab and it just a select statement, no changes in the db, not even content, is required
16:42 Zoffix Ulti: yeah, I've no idea what makes things parametarizeable. Hash and Pair both do Associative and you can parameterize a HJash but not a Pair vOv
16:43 Zoffix szabgab: I don't see any recent commits to it that didn't make it
16:43 ChoHag joined #perl6
16:43 Zoffix that didn't make it to the site
16:43 Cabanossi joined #perl6
16:43 Zoffix Oh
16:43 szabgab the template was updated on the site, but it is using the previous code. AFAIK
16:44 Zoffix yeah, it's just the bot seems ded
16:44 szabgab anyway, Zoffix what was you wrote I need to add to the commit message to get a full rebuild of the db?  Can I add it to the README?
16:44 Geth ¦ modules.perl6.org: 9afb961eb4 | (Gabor Szabo)++ | 3 files
16:44 Geth ¦ modules.perl6.org: show number of modules using Travis and using Appveyor
16:44 Geth ¦ modules.perl6.org: review: https://github.com/perl6/modules.perl6.org/commit/9afb961eb4
16:45 Zoffix szabgab: `[REBUILD]` I already added it: https://github.com/perl6/modules.perl6.org/commit/a48f7213b50f83ea4f4599bf51595368bf25217d
16:45 szabgab ok
16:46 szabgab I see it now. Thanks
16:46 szabgab Numbers appeared on the site. Great! thanks
16:47 Zoffix szabgab: As for app restarting. It happens after each DB rebuild which is set to cron run on 20th and 40th minute of the hour and takes like ~1hr to run. You can view latest build log on https://modules.perl6.org/update.log
16:47 Zoffix And yeah, a run just finished.
16:47 Zoffix s/DB rebuild/DB update/;
16:47 Zoffix :)
16:49 Zoffix 20th and 50th minute actually
16:51 Zoffix And takes 1hr.20m
16:51 * Zoffix &
16:54 tony-o Ulti: it's like that in hiker too
17:10 [Coke] going to add something to the doc site so we can tag sample code as runnable with 'no strict;' so we can avoid pedagogically uses cases of predclaring variable names. any one care to bikeshed that that tag on "=code" would look like? We already have :skip-test, :lang<perl5>, and ok-test<WHAT> (last one allows use of .WHAT in code)
17:11 [Coke] *useless cases
17:13 * Zoffix .o( :no-strict-ok ? :no-strict ? :it's-ok-to-not-predeclare-variables-in-this-code-snippet )
17:14 mcmillhj joined #perl6
17:15 astj joined #perl6
17:19 [Coke] I'll go with :no-strict for now. Danke.
17:20 moritz :preamble('no strict;')
17:20 moritz then you can add other preambles if you want
17:22 ilmari then you could do :preamble('my ($foo, $bar, $baz)') too
17:28 setty1 joined #perl6
17:28 itaipu joined #perl6
17:30 andreoss m: my $f := lazy fail ; say(1);
17:31 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «Failed?  in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1??»
17:32 andreoss is there a way to lazily fail only when variable is being referenced? like Haskell's `undefined`
17:32 mr-fooba_ joined #perl6
17:32 andreoss without a closure
17:32 astj joined #perl6
17:33 ugexe thats what fail is
17:33 ugexe m: sub foo { fail "xxx" }; my $x = foo(); say 1; say $x
17:33 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «1?xxx?  in sub foo at <tmp> line 1?  in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1??»
17:34 andreoss m: my $f = ->{ fail }() ; say(1);
17:34 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «Failed?  in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1??»
17:36 andreoss m: my $f = sub { fail }() ; say(1);
17:36 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «1?»
17:36 andreoss why direct assignment doesn't work?
17:38 moritz andreoss: you have to be aware that fail() returns from the routine it's in (and returns a failure)
17:38 moritz and dies if there is no outer routine
17:39 moritz which why all of your examples except the last immediately threw the exception
17:39 moritz after you take that into account, fail() is pretty much a lazy exception; it throws when you do something with it that isn't a careful inspection
17:40 Zoffix It dies when it's sunk,.
17:40 Zoffix Oh, nevermindm misread'
17:40 moritz or if you call any number of methods, basically all exception .defined or .Bool
17:41 andreoss m: constant \undefined = sub {fail} (); my $f = undefined ; say(1);
17:41 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>?Strange text after block (missing semicolon or comma?)?at <tmp>:1?------> 3constant \undefined = sub {fail}7?5 (); my $f = undefined ; say(1);?    expecting any of:?        infix?        in…»
17:41 andreoss m: constant \undefined := sub {fail} (); my $f = undefined ; say(1);
17:41 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>?Strange text after block (missing semicolon or comma?)?at <tmp>:1?------> 3constant \undefined := sub {fail}7?5 (); my $f = undefined ; say(1);?    expecting any of:?        infix?        i…»
17:41 andreoss m: constant \undefined := sub {fail}(); my $f = undefined ; say(1);
17:41 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «1?»
17:43 moritz m: constant undefined = sub { fail }(); my $f = undefined; say 'alive';
17:43 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «alive?»
17:43 moritz no need for binding or \ here
17:44 Zoffix andreoss: note that it will become unexplosive the second you .Bool or .defined on it.
17:45 Zoffix Also, constants get precompiled. Be careful using stuff that changes in modules
17:45 Zoffix Lastly, instead of sub {fail}() you can just write Failure.new
17:45 Zoffix huggable: Failure
17:45 huggable Zoffix, Delayed exception: https://docs.perl6.org/type/Failure
17:45 Zoffix ^ some docs on that type
17:49 Altreus joined #perl6
17:50 Altreus Um hello. I finally decided to try p6 so now I'm here too
17:50 perlpilot Altreus: welcome
17:50 Zoffix Sweet. Welcome
17:51 Altreus I'm mostly here because Text::CSV doesn't pass its tests but no one has noticed and I thought it might be me
17:51 El_Che Altreus: you traitor :)
17:51 Altreus But I'm having wireless issues so it's hard to paste stuff usefully
17:52 Altreus Do we have a paste bot?
17:52 Zoffix Altreus: weird. That module is our benching canary.
17:52 perlpilot Altreus: gist works
17:52 Altreus k
17:52 Zoffix Altreus: yeah, the shadowpaste one
17:52 Altreus I figured it would be me because I'm a total noob
17:52 Altreus but
17:52 Altreus 2 ticks
17:52 st_elmo joined #perl6
17:53 Zoffix Altreus: what are the test failures? Something about malformed UTF8?
17:54 Altreus OK the wireless is terrible so I'll use 4g so i can actually communicate
17:54 Zoffix :)
17:54 Altreus I do have a lot of utf8 test failures
17:54 Altreus Expected false, got (Bool)
17:54 Zoffix maybe it's a known bug then, we're trying to hunt it down
17:54 Zoffix huh
17:55 Zoffix Altreus: what rakudo version you got?
17:55 Altreus Also, invocant of method Bridge must be int not bool
17:55 Altreus I'm paraphrasing due to phone
17:55 Altreus I just installed 2017.07 last night
17:56 Zoffix Altreus: report it :)
17:56 Altreus What output is useful besides what zef gives?
17:59 emeric joined #perl6
17:59 Altreus perl6 -V ?
18:01 Zoffix Altreus: no, just full output of test failures. I'm unsure how to make zef report them in full
18:02 Zoffix buggable: eco Text::CSV
18:02 buggable Zoffix, Text::CSV 'Handle CSV data. API based on Text::CSV_XS': https://github.com/Tux/CSV
18:02 Zoffix gonna
18:02 Zoffix gonna try the module myself
18:02 El_Che module fails also on my computer
18:03 Zoffix ...maybe. I'm using a laptop to connec to  a windows box to putty to a linux box to ssh to my server to run weechat in scrteen :)
18:03 Altreus Attempting to submit data...
18:04 Altreus I would tether but I'm low on data ????
18:04 Altreus Ah, submitted
18:04 Altreus El_Che: same issue as I just posted on gh?
18:05 El_Che ah gist kills the formatting
18:05 Altreus Try ```
18:05 El_Che Altreus: yes, identical
18:05 Altreus Not just me hooray
18:05 Altreus I'm just the canary
18:06 El_Che I am on 2017.06 on this machine
18:06 Altreus Perl6's type system just changes the bugs you make \o/
18:06 rindolf joined #perl6
18:07 Altreus Meanwhile I'm going to process CSV with split
18:08 Altreus I'm going to assume it's broken tests and skip them for now
18:08 ugexe https://github.com/Tux/CSV/commit/06a450d811b7bd5e9b9cb714e2888f1816fbdd91 # last commit looks related ?
18:09 Zoffix ooohh
18:09 Zoffix Yeah that is it
18:09 Altreus Hmm installing it again is reinstalling deps
18:09 Zoffix Altreus: basically the issue is the module added a commit that works only on bleed rakudo
18:10 El_Che We need CPAN
18:10 Altreus Does zef keep nothing if the target failed, or is it installing to the wrong place?
18:10 Zoffix lizmat: ^^ maybe that commit should be removed at least for now, since is default is broken on attributes on older rakudos
18:10 Zoffix El_Che: we *have* CPAN
18:10 El_Che Zoffix: there is have and kind-of-have
18:10 ugexe its on cpan, the problem is the version uploaded was before the automatic source-url setter worked
18:10 Zoffix Altreus: keeps nothing, unless --serial was using
18:11 Zoffix *was used
18:11 Altreus Ah, that's both pesky and not
18:11 El_Che ugexe: does zef download cpan or github nowadays?
18:11 Zoffix El_Che: what's kind-of-have?
18:11 ugexe both
18:11 Altreus El_Che: Mine came from gh
18:11 ugexe for the last few years
18:11 Altreus All of them
18:11 Zoffix Altreus: because not every module's author is using cpan
18:12 Altreus Uh
18:12 Altreus I can't back up what I said ... I know some came from gh
18:12 * Zoffix doesn't; too lazy
18:12 Altreus I guess I don't know
18:12 El_Che I mean with have: zef installs from cpan
18:12 El_Che and not from github
18:12 ugexe that doesn't mean it wasnt found on cpan - again the version on cpan has its source-url as a github url
18:12 Zoffix Altreus: it's likely. It'll only use from cpan if cpan has a newer version
18:12 El_Che except as a one off
18:13 Zoffix El_Che: zef installs from cpan
18:13 Zoffix El_Che: if people bother uploading
18:13 El_Che Zoffix: it's not zef's fault
18:13 Zoffix El_Che: so what we need isn't CPAN but people who care about CPAN to upload to it
18:13 Zoffix El_Che: no, it's not. I was responding to your "we need CPAN" :P
18:13 Altreus Wouldn't that install unreleased stuff all the time? :s
18:14 El_Che Zoffix: people upload p5 code to cpan because it's the "only" way to get it installed
18:14 El_Che if there was a short cut, many won't bother
18:14 Zoffix El_Che: yeah, and that's not what we want with Rakudo.
18:14 ugexe dont depend on unreleased stuff
18:14 Altreus I skipped tests and it seems OK
18:15 Zoffix El_Che: you can disable p6ecosystem in zef and only get your stuff from CPAN
18:15 El_Che I like writing go, but downloading random stuff from github makes me nervious
18:15 Zoffix heh
18:15 El_Che Zoffix: that's the thing, it shoudn't be a user choice
18:15 Zoffix As opposed to downloading random stuff from CPABN?
18:15 Zoffix El_Che: why not?
18:15 ugexe you are not thinking about the problem very deeply
18:15 Altreus Maybe i misunderstood what Zoffix said... Zef installs from gh if gh has a newer version than cpan?
18:16 ugexe it doesnt matter where it comes from
18:16 Zoffix Altreus: yes
18:16 Altreus Isn't that always the case?
18:16 El_Che ugexe: with CPAN I expect releases. With github I expect random commits on master
18:16 Altreus GH would never be behind cpan
18:16 El_Che huge difference
18:16 Zoffix Altreus: "newer version" meaning newer version in META6.json
18:16 ugexe github is not a p6c thing
18:17 Altreus Ah so you update that to "release" it
18:17 El_Che with CPAN I expects tests when released/uploaded
18:17 Zoffix Altreus: oh. I see the confusion. It doesn't install from github, unless the GitHub source is listed in our p6ecosystem
18:18 Zoffix Altreus: so if an author only upploads to CPAN, it'll always use CPAN versions.
18:18 Zoffix We have two ecosystems. CPAN and GitHub-based.
18:18 Zoffix El_Che: why do you expect that?
18:19 Altreus How does the ecosystem index gh things? Do you submit just the information about where it is?
18:19 Altreus Wait
18:19 El_Che Go gets away with murder because you need a breakage-free dependency chain only at compile time
18:19 Altreus Is there a document that explains it all? :p
18:19 ugexe you should be depending on :ver<...>, and github or cpan it doesnt matter
18:19 Altreus No point retyping it if there is
18:19 El_Che installing p6 modules kan be frustrating (again, not zef, but upstream breakage)
18:19 ugexe if you dont depend on a specific version then its your own fault
18:19 El_Che ugexe: true
18:20 Zoffix Altreus: there's a README in this repo that also has the list (META.list) file and authors need to publish there to add it:
18:20 Zoffix https://github.com/perl6/ecosystem
18:22 Zoffix Altreus: also two "Modules" guides here https://docs.perl6.org/language.html
18:22 Altreus Cool
18:22 Altreus Now I'm going to mix my languages :/
18:23 Zoffix Join the club :) Yesterday I spent 5 minutes debugging Perl code because I typoed $data[-1]{last} as @data[-1]{last} and error was about undeclared $self :)
18:23 Zoffix (in Rakudo you write $data[42] as @data[42])
18:26 ugexe I put $<xxx>=(.*?) into a production perl5 code base (it passed peer review, and was the only line changed)
18:27 hobbs Perl 6 sighting: https://www.johndcook.com/blog/2017/08/02/wolfram-alpha-finnegans-wake-and-quaternions/
18:27 hobbs (in the comments)
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18:30 Altreus I'm going to have to use it in anger to recognise various constructs
18:30 Zoffix neat
18:30 Altreus But I'm already taking advantage of being able to use hyphens in identifiers
18:30 [Coke] ... I already did the :no-strict, but haven't committed yet; I like :preamble, because then you can also do things like :preamble<sub foo {};>, because &foo isn't covered by no-strict.
18:30 Zoffix Altreus: single quotes too :)
18:31 Altreus My $john's-account-number
18:31 Zoffix m: sub term:<anything-really:DDDD-/o\> { 42 }; say anything-really:DDDD-/o\
18:31 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>?Unable to parse expression in quote words; couldn't find final '>'?        ?at <tmp>:1?------> 3o\> { 42 }; say anything-really:DDDD-/o\7?5<EOL>?    expecting any of:?        colon pair? …»
18:32 Zoffix :(
18:32 Zoffix Oh, I escaped it
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18:32 Zoffix m: sub term:<anything-really:DDDD-/o\-:)> { 42 }; say anything-really:DDDD-/o\-:)
18:32 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «42?»
18:35 Altreus Better whip out my pocket book again
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18:49 ufobat is it me doing something wrong with %*RESOURCES or could it be the case that you can't look for the keys in the hash? like in %*RESOURCES<foo>{$bar}
18:49 ufobat i've got this error from moarvm "Cannot look up attributes in a Distribution::Resource type object"
18:54 ufobat i mean %?RESOURCES sorry
18:56 Zoffix m: $?RESOURCES<fsdfsdfsdfsd>
18:56 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>?Variable '$?RESOURCES' is not declared?at <tmp>:1?------> 3<BOL>7?5$?RESOURCES<fsdfsdfsdfsd>?»
18:56 Zoffix m: %?RESOURCES<fsdfsdfsdfsd>
18:56 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: ( no output )
18:56 Zoffix m: %?RESOURCES<fsdfsdfsdfsd><bar>.say
18:57 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «Nil?»
18:57 Zoffix ufobat: what's your rakudo version?
18:57 ufobat 2017.07
18:57 lizmat Zoffix: CSV commit reverted
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18:58 Zoffix Altreus: ^^ your test failures should now be gone
18:58 ufobat how does %?RESOURCES work, or does it even work, if you dont have the module installed yet? then the hash is probably always empty?
18:59 Zoffix Do you have META6.json?
18:59 nadim_ ugex: Test::META was removed 2 days ago from my test becaus it failed with an error, that I reported to the author :(
18:59 ufobat yes
18:59 Zoffix Then, dunno.
19:00 ufobat META6.json in the cwd or in a include path?
19:00 Zoffix ufobat: no idea :/
19:01 nadim_ ugexe: what copypasta at line 24? I think I am tired and just can't see the error!
19:01 Zoffix Does it work if you have it in current dir?
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19:01 ufobat in my resources directory there is a file named error.template, and a directory that is named skeleton
19:01 ufobat the file itself works
19:02 ufobat say %?RESOURCES<error.template>.IO;
19:02 ufobat say %?RESOURCES<error.template>.IO.slurp;
19:02 ufobat but this line causes the error:     my %skeleton = %?RESOURCES<skeleton>{$type};
19:02 rightfold Is there P6CRE?
19:03 Zoffix ufobat: oh ok, but what is $type then? something inside that directory?
19:03 ufobat i did install the module, btw
19:03 Zoffix rightfold: no
19:03 ufobat let me check to be sure, but i would say yes.
19:03 Zoffix m: %?RESOURCES.keys.say
19:03 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «()?»
19:04 Zoffix ufobat: what does that give you ^
19:05 ufobat therefor i need to reinstall it in my docker container, needs a while ;(
19:05 rightfold Zoffix: ????
19:05 Zoffix ufobat: also, do you have resources listed in your meta file? That's what I get from the docs
19:05 [Coke] (:preamble now working locally)
19:05 ufobat yeah i have
19:06 [Coke] also testing all pod6 files for examples now, no file-level skips
19:06 Zoffix ufobat: shouldn't it then be <skeleton/whatever> instead of <skeleton>{$type}?
19:06 ufobat http://design.perl6.org/S22.html#%25%3FRESOURCES
19:06 ufobat the exaples there access it like this:   %?RESOURCES<images><fido.png>.absolute
19:06 Zoffix Man, now I get what users are saying about having trouble finding stuff. The scant few docs don't say anything
19:07 ufobat "resource" : [
19:07 ufobat "images/fido.png",
19:07 Zoffix ufobat: that's the design docs
19:07 ufobat i didnt find anything usefl in the docuentation
19:07 Zoffix Yeah, I wish core devs ensured the docs are written/up to date when they make changes to stuff.
19:08 Zoffix or make new stuff
19:09 Zoffix ufobat: but dump %?RESOURCES.keys, I'd expect that to give some answers
19:10 ufobat will do :)
19:10 ufobat brb
19:10 ufobat thank you so far for the help zoffix :)
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19:19 jdv79 i have an app that kills my box. is there anything but the rakudo profiler that i can use to easily pinpoint the issues?
19:19 jdv79 or is printing times all over the place needed?
19:19 jdv79 because the profiler borks the app
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19:22 Zoffix is that something strace or whatever can help with?
19:23 Zoffix One of those tools people tell me to use all the time :)
19:23 jdv79 i guess.  just wanted to know if there was other rakudo specific things
19:23 timotimo hmm. i'm stumped by this design problem: things like NativeHelpers::Blob use the cc command that moarvm was built with
19:24 timotimo but in the fedora package that's a compiler that's not necessarily available to the normal user
19:24 timotimo i.e. "/usr/lib/rpm/redhat/redhat-hardened-cc1"
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19:29 Geth ¦ doc: 6646cc9c53 | (Zoffix Znet)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | doc/Language/testing.pod6
19:29 Geth ¦ doc: Document behaviour of TODOed subtest
19:29 Geth ¦ doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/6646cc9c53
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20:08 * Zoffix contemplates jumping in on the Rakudo Books bandwagon
20:09 El_Che Zoffix: the reddit comments?
20:10 El_Che Going for the "Rust book" Rakudo equivalent?
20:10 Zoffix Three books: "The White Book", "The Grey Book", and "The Black Book" convering progressively more arcane and complex features of the language, not exhaustive, but well enough to let the reader be comfortable learning the rest on their own from, say type reference. Digital version free; the equivalent of Rust's "the book"
20:11 Zoffix El_Che: yup. I mulled over "The Black Book" for a while but yesterday's reddit conversation opened my eyes for the need of tje other two as well
20:11 El_Che p6 is huge
20:11 Zoffix yup
20:11 El_Che so your progression approach is nice
20:12 El_Che although the White one is the most important
20:12 El_Che (I haven't read moritz one yet, and the oreilly one is still on the works)
20:13 moritz Zoffix: for a while I pondered a "Perl 6 Complete" series, with one volume for each group of features (like regexes, routines and signatures, OO and MOP, ...)
20:14 moritz so basically a "The Black Book" series :-)
20:14 Zoffix :)
20:14 moritz but I don't think I'll write more than the regex one
20:14 moritz I find MOP stuff really fascinating, but I don't see a big audience
20:15 El_Che some should make a joke comparing "The Go Programming Language" or "The Rust Book" with the Wheel of Time Perl 6 series
20:15 moritz and subroutines and multis and stuff are immensely useful when writing actual Perl 6 code, but I wouldn't know how to convince people to actually buy that
20:17 moritz and I'm too greedy to invest 500+ hours in a book for even more marginal financial returns
20:17 Zoffix :)
20:19 moritz (writing a book is typically *not* profitable, unless you can really streamline it, and/or have a huge audience, and/or you happen to hit the jackpot once)
20:20 Zoffix Yeah.
20:21 moritz if Perl 6 suddenly gets an exponential grows curve like node.js or docker had, maybe I can afford a family vacation from the books :-)
20:23 mspo yeah I used to work with one of the author of "high performance mysql" who gave me the skinny on his "profits"
20:23 mspo they were quite low
20:23 mspo good book, though :)
20:23 Zoffix I still get profits from a book I wrote 8 years ago.
20:23 Zoffix .
20:23 mspo you can probably get more money via speaking fees and reputation building
20:24 mspo might be better to use the "learn you some erlang" model
20:24 Zoffix ... about $8/year and the tax people often waste a ton of my time trying to process the form for that profit :)
20:24 moritz mspo: well, writing a book can be part of reputation building.
20:24 mspo moritz: yeah that's what I mean
20:25 mspo moritz: the long term "profit" from the book has a lot to do with marketing of the author himself
20:25 moritz recently I charged about 2k€ for a two-day Perl 6 training I gave. I think I might have underchaged
20:25 mspo any travel involved?
20:25 El_Che moritz: I am impressed. I didn't know there was a market for P6 training yet
20:26 moritz mspo: a bit, yes (400km or so)
20:27 moritz El_Che: it was 4 people at a research institute that did Perl 5, and were interested in Perl 6
20:27 mspo moritz: 2k for local seems pretty good.  I'd add travel expenses, obviously
20:27 moritz mspo: right
20:27 moritz (and I did)
20:28 mspo seems like a fair rate to me :)
20:28 https_GK1wmSU joined #perl6
20:28 mspo it's what I would expect my company to pay someone, roughly, at least
20:28 moritz on the one hand, it totally is, and it was real fun
20:28 mspo if I found out we were paying $10k for a two day class I'd expect a hell of a lot
20:29 moritz on the other hand I needed to spend two vacation days, was away 2.5 days and had another ~2 working days of preparations
20:29 moritz and then taxes eat half of it
20:30 moritz I don't regret it at all, but I can understand why people charge more if they do it professionally
20:30 mspo yeah but you can re-use the prep
20:30 mspo get one of those going every money and you've got a pretty nice side biz :)
20:30 https_GK1wmSU left #perl6
20:31 moritz aye
20:31 moritz but when you can do it regularly, competition will spring up
20:31 moritz no free lunch :-)
20:31 mspo turn it into an online course and make passive $$$
20:31 mspo probably similar $$$ to writing a tech book ;)
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20:32 moritz no, much better
20:32 moritz people are willing to pay between 30 and 300 USD or so for a video course
20:33 moritz getting somebody to pay more tha $50 for a tech book is an uphill battle
20:33 moritz even if much more work went into it
20:35 ufobat Zoffix, yay the output of     %?RESOURCES.keys.say;
20:35 ufobat say %?RESOURCES<error.template>.IO; is:
20:35 ufobat # (0)
20:35 ufobat # "/srv/resources/error.template".IO
20:35 ufobat the # is from use Test
20:36 andreoss macros won't be worked upon until 007 is done?
20:37 lizmat andreoss: I'm afraid so, unless another masak stands up  :-)
20:40 jnthn 007 is to work out how macros will be done, so work on it *is* work on macros :)
20:40 ufobat so my personal conclusion %?RESOURCES does not behave as i expect it from a hash :/
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20:45 Geth ¦ ecosystem: mcsnolte++ created pull request #356: Add Text-UpsideDown to ecosystem
20:45 Geth ¦ ecosystem: review: https://github.com/perl6/ecosystem/pull/356
20:46 Geth ¦ ecosystem: b1c6c79745 | (Steve Nolte)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | META.list
20:46 Geth ¦ ecosystem: Add Text-UpsideDown to ecosystem
20:46 Geth ¦ ecosystem: review: https://github.com/perl6/ecosystem/commit/b1c6c79745
20:46 Geth ¦ ecosystem: e0f136e913 | lizmat++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | META.list
20:46 Geth ¦ ecosystem: Merge pull request #356 from mcsnolte/patch-1
20:46 Geth ¦ ecosystem:
20:46 Geth ¦ ecosystem: Add Text-UpsideDown to ecosystem
20:46 Geth ¦ ecosystem: review: https://github.com/perl6/ecosystem/commit/e0f136e913
20:47 Zoffix ufobat so what's the output of %?RESOURCES.keys.say ?
20:48 ufobat (0)
20:50 Zoffix m: %?RESOURCES.^name.say
20:50 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «Nil?»
20:50 Zoffix mkay
20:50 ufobat thats pretty frustrating :(
20:51 Zoffix ufobat: can you pastebin your META file?
20:52 ufobat of course
20:53 ufobat https://pastebin.com/q259Huz1
20:56 Zoffix yeah, %?RESOURCES is not a Hash, it's Distribution::Resources
20:56 * Zoffix reads the sauce
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20:57 zengargoyle m: my subset ID of Str where * eq any('email'|'accountid'); dd Hash[Any:D,ID].new: 'accountid', 123;
20:57 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «(my Any:D %{ID} = :accountid(123))?»
20:58 zengargoyle m: my subset ID of Str where * eq any('email'|'accountid'); dd Hash[Any:D,ID].new: 'email', 'foo';
20:58 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «(my Any:D %{ID} = :email("foo"))?»
20:58 zengargoyle m: my subset ID of Str where * eq any('email'|'accountid'); dd Hash[Any:D,ID].new: 'emailx', 'foo';
20:58 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «Type check failed in binding to parameter 'key'; expected ID but got Str ("emailx")?  in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1??»
20:59 Zoffix ufobat: %?RESOURCES<skeleton/default/bin/app.pl6>
20:59 ufobat maybe you can enlighten me if it's possible to play around with %?RESOURCES without installing the module first?
21:00 Zoffix ufobat: basically the key to %?RESOURCES is the key you used in your metafile. It includes the entire path, instead of your original way of using a new nested key for each path
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21:00 ufobat but i need to know the keys i cant read them from %?RESOURCES
21:00 Zoffix ufobat: that's what I did now. I didn't install the module. https://gist.github.com/zoffixznet/3cf736df372c53d66dd52e895ba9051d
21:01 ufobat so it's impossible to read out the resources dynamically, e.g if i have a skeleton/something/<some files> and skeleton/somethingelse/<...>
21:02 zengargoyle m: my subset ID of Str where * eq any('email'|'accountid'); my %h := Hash[Any:D,ID].new: 'accountid', 123; dd %h;
21:02 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «(my Any:D %{ID} = :accountid(123))?»
21:02 Zoffix zengargoyle: | already means "any"
21:02 zengargoyle m: my subset ID of Str where * eq 'email'|'accountid'; my %h := Hash[Any:D,ID].new: 'accountid', 123; dd %h;
21:02 camelia rakudo-moar c43ba0: OUTPUT: «(my Any:D %{ID} = :accountid(123))?»
21:04 zengargoyle cool, it was golfing from previous attempts.
21:04 Zoffix ufobat: nah, not impossible
21:05 ufobat but it would be nice :)
21:05 ufobat anyway. thanks a lot for your help ZofBot
21:05 ufobat Zoffix,
21:07 zengargoyle would there be any way to constrain a certain value type to go with a certain key type?  i believe original question was subset ID of Hash where keys were only email/accountid.
21:07 zengargoyle it would be really cool to subset Hash where 'email' => Str:D or 'accountid' => Int only...
21:07 zengargoyle but that's prolly better as a Class anyways....
21:10 Zoffix ufobat: OK, don't really see a nice way that doesn't poke too much at the guts.
21:10 Zoffix I invite people who designed this stuff to document it in full.
21:13 ufobat hash like or not, but it would be at least great if you could get the list of available resources. otherwise you need to "know" that name in the META6.json and in the source :(
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21:14 Geth ¦ whateverable/master: 4 commits pushed by (Aleks-Daniel Jakimenko-Aleksejev)++
21:14 Geth ¦ whateverable/master: 1166167de8 | Fix quotable tests
21:14 Geth ¦ whateverable/master: 43d7df24c3 | Reduce the delay for “no response” tests
21:14 Geth ¦ whateverable/master: 787680c5d1 | Minimal tests for ‘m:’ messages
21:14 Geth ¦ whateverable/master: c3e8329b6d | No more commaed commands
21:14 Geth ¦ whateverable/master: review: https://github.com/perl6/whateverable/compare/f537ca14be...c3e8329b6d
21:15 Zoffix There's %!meta in CUR::FS that has that info, but it's a private attribute
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21:41 Geth ¦ whateverable: 24b0b2ebd5 | (Aleks-Daniel Jakimenko-Aleksejev)++ | 2 files
21:41 Geth ¦ whateverable: Don't get excited about windows paths
21:41 Geth ¦ whateverable:
21:41 Geth ¦ whateverable: Resolves issue #196
21:41 Geth ¦ whateverable: review: https://github.com/perl6/whateverable/commit/24b0b2ebd5
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21:52 Geth ¦ whateverable: 754efdfe89 | (Aleks-Daniel Jakimenko-Aleksejev)++ | t/unicodable.t
21:52 Geth ¦ whateverable: Unicodable no longer hates parens
21:52 Geth ¦ whateverable:
21:52 Geth ¦ whateverable: Tests for issue #142.
21:52 Geth ¦ whateverable:
21:52 Geth ¦ whateverable: Arguably the output is less than awesome but so is life.
21:52 Geth ¦ whateverable: review: https://github.com/perl6/whateverable/commit/754efdfe89
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22:19 ugexe you could just try
22:19 ugexe perl6 -I. -e 'say %?RESOURCES<blah.txt>'
22:19 ugexe but yes, it works
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22:30 ugexe %?RESOURCES is not intended to be used for a plugin system where you can add things to later dynamically look up and load - for that use a CompUnit::Repository
22:30 Zoffix ugexe: how?
22:30 Zoffix How to see what `resources` are available?
22:30 Zoffix If for no other reason than to not repeat the values in two places in code, risking a typo
22:31 ugexe why would you not repeat the value in the code? the purpose here is so you can refer to your file after it gets renamed to some hash
22:32 ugexe so you use %?RESOURCE{"my-file-original-name.txt"} instead of "my-file-original-name.txt".IO
22:32 Zoffix I want to just load the data, I don't care about names.
22:32 Zoffix Why would I want to repeat the value
22:33 ugexe so do %?RESOURCE{"whatever"}.slurp
22:33 Zoffix I can access the values if I type out the names. The system knows the available values. Yet, there's no way to obtain the available values.
22:33 Zoffix ugexe: what exactly is "whatever" in that context?
22:33 ugexe again, %?RESOURCES is not a generic file storage
22:33 Zoffix Says who?
22:34 Zoffix We have a real user trying to solve Problem X. Your response is "don't solve the problem"
22:35 ugexe ok
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22:36 Zoffix Can you access distribution's META file from userland?
22:36 Zoffix or data in it, rather
22:38 ugexe m: say $*REPO.need( CompUnit::DependencySpecification.new( :short-name<Test> ) ).distribution.meta
22:38 camelia rakudo-moar e86bdf: OUTPUT: «{auth => perl, files => {}, name => CORE, provides => {CompUnit::Repository::Staging => {lib/CompUnit/Repository/Staging.pm => {cver => 2017.07-123-ge86bdfca4, file => C57EBB9F7A3922A4DA48EE8FCF34A4DC55942942, time => 1492446520.0385}}, NativeCall => {li…»
22:40 Zoffix Thanks
22:41 ugexe m: say $*REPO.need( CompUnit::DependencySpecification.new( :short-name<Test> ) ).distribution.content("lib/Test.pm6").slurp
22:41 camelia rakudo-moar e86bdf: OUTPUT: «use MONKEY-GUTS;          # Allow NQP ops.??unit module Test;?# Copyright (C) 2007 - 2017 The Perl Foundation.??# settable from outside?my int $perl6_test_times = ?%*ENV<PERL6_TEST_TIMES>;?my int $die_on_fail      = ?%*ENV<PERL6_TEST_DIE_ON…»
22:51 Zoffix "Legacy Distribution object used in code expecting an object consuming the Distribution role"
22:51 Zoffix When I swap `<Test>` to `<WWW>`
22:52 mcmillhj joined #perl6
22:53 ugexe well I know Test is installed to a CURI
22:53 ugexe and that it'll be found first by need
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22:54 ugexe you might be loading from CURFS if you are using -I. or -Ilib
22:56 Zoffix .tell ufobat some tips for your resources issue: https://irclog.perlgeek.de/perl6/2017-08-02#i_14960004
22:56 yoleaux Zoffix: I'll pass your message to ufobat.
22:57 zengargoyle is whatever that log thing was all fixed now?
22:58 Zoffix zengargoyle: it was changed to be differently broken, but still broken
22:58 Zoffix «»‘’«‘’»…?””?…?…?””×÷????
22:58 Zoffix Oh, I stand corrected. Yes, fixed now.
22:59 zengargoyle ah, i had that sparkline usage pattern thing but put on hold because someting was not right ATM...
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23:13 Geth ¦ doc: dd934a1902 | (Will "Coke" Coleda)++ | 2 files
23:13 Geth ¦ doc: Allow example code to have a preamble.
23:13 Geth ¦ doc:
23:13 Geth ¦ doc: Allows us to specify code before the user-visible code
23:13 Geth ¦ doc: to allow for correct compilation without cluttering
23:13 Geth ¦ doc: examples.
23:13 Geth ¦ doc:
23:13 Geth ¦ doc: Fixes #1432
23:13 Geth ¦ doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/dd934a1902
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23:22 Geth ¦ doc: 13e2f9f588 | (Will "Coke" Coleda)++ | 7 files
23:22 Geth ¦ doc: Run all example files when testing.
23:22 Geth ¦ doc:
23:22 Geth ¦ doc: Fixes #1387
23:22 Geth ¦ doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/13e2f9f588
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23:43 profden Is there a shorter way to implement sha-256 than how it is here: https://rosettacode.org/wiki/SHA-256#Perl_6
23:43 profden I'd think there would be a much more concise way
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23:47 lichtkind_ has perl 6 its perldoc viewer?
23:52 zengargoyle lichtkind_: perl6 --doc ./lib/Module.pm6 -- shows POD....
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23:53 lichtkind_ thank you very much but i take it as no
23:53 zengargoyle and there's p6doc a little more like perldoc
23:53 lichtkind_ since ther eseems to be no cli version of docs.perl6.org
23:53 lichtkind_ ah thanks
23:53 lichtkind_ i will look into that
23:54 zengargoyle p6doc is basically the docs.perl6.org thing.... yeah, sometimes it is a bit hard/broken, but mostly helps a bit.
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