Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2017-10-24

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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Time Nick Message
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00:00 bazzaar well simplistically I could eliminate case, and filter away 'prefixed-by-sigil' occurrences, it might be gnarly, but it could be useful, and perhaps be less of a source of frustration than the poorly populated utility tags collection is
00:02 ugexe right, but the simplistic case is already served better by the simple regex it would require
00:03 ugexe your idea is indefinitely better, but to achieve it is much more difficult (regex idea breaks down when its not so simple to come up with and type as a query)
00:08 bazzaar agree that it might be a poor man's egrep, but it would be a first pass summary index of coding 'examples' embedded within the modules code, where the user only need to click to get some results
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00:14 ugexe you could always write a microservice (with Cro or Bailador) to proof of concept, and then simply provide the module website API access to it should you decide it is polished enough
00:14 bazzaar was just an idea that has sprung to my mind a few times, wanted to post it, appreciated folks taking the time to consider
00:14 ugexe come up with a list of keywords, and `git grep $_` your way to a database
00:15 ugexe probably less than 100 lines of code, assuming you have something to clone the repos
00:17 ugexe or write a bot to come in here and send `greppable6: $_` for all your keywords and build your database from that hehe
00:17 bazzaar ugexe: thanks for the insight, I will pursue that line of approach :-)
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01:00 Herby__ Also: how can I use a variable as a regex pattern? my @list-of-patterns[0;1] = '(\w+)'; say $/ if "some string" ~~ / @list-of-patterns[0;1] /;
01:01 Herby__ rather, how do i interpolate a variable in a regex pattern
01:03 MasterDuke Herby__: just the variable if you want it interpreted as a string, <$var> if you want it interpreted as a regex, <{ code }> to execute the code and interpolate the results into the regex
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01:05 MasterDuke m: my $r = "b"; say "abc" ~~ / $r /
01:05 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «「b」␤»
01:05 MasterDuke m: my $r = "a.c"; say "abc" ~~ / <$r> /
01:05 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «「abc」␤»
01:05 Herby__ what if you have capture groups in the variable?
01:06 Herby__ m: my $r = "a(.)c"; say "azc" ~~ / $r /;
01:06 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «Nil␤»
01:06 Herby__ m: my $r = "a(.)c"; say "azc" ~~ / <$r> /;
01:06 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «「azc」␤»
01:06 Herby__ m: my $r = "a(.)c"; say $/ "azc" ~~ / <$r> /;
01:06 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>␤Two terms in a row␤at <tmp>:1␤------> 3my $r = "a(.)c"; say $/7⏏5 "azc" ~~ / <$r> /;␤    expecting any of:␤        infix␤        infix stopper␤        postfix␤        statement end…»
01:06 Herby__ m: my $r = "a(.)c"; say ~$/0 if "azc" ~~ / <$r> /;
01:06 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>␤Two terms in a row␤at <tmp>:1␤------> 3my $r = "a(.)c"; say ~$/7⏏0 if "azc" ~~ / <$r> /;␤    expecting any of:␤        infix␤        infix stopper␤        postfix␤        statement…»
01:06 Herby__ m: my $r = "a(.)c"; say ~$/[0] if "azc" ~~ / <$r> /;
01:06 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «Use of Nil in string context␤␤  in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1␤»
01:07 Herby__ sorry
01:07 MasterDuke Herby__: you might need to use EVAL, not 100% sure
01:07 Herby__ hmmm
01:07 MasterDuke i.e., create the "regex" as a string and then EVAL that
01:08 geekosaur it is known that subcaptures are lost in that case, I don't think anyone has sorted out why yet
01:08 MasterDuke m: my $r = "/a(.)c/".EVAL; say "abc" ~~ $r
01:08 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «「abc」␤ 0 => 「b」␤»
01:09 Herby__ maybe there is a better way to accomplish my goal.  I have a list of regex patterns (that have capture groups) and I want to apply each pattern to a string
01:12 Herby__ MasterDuke: thanks
01:12 MasterDuke np
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01:55 Topic for #perl6 is now »ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | https://perl6.org/ | evalbot usage: 'p6: say 3;' or rakudo:,  or /msg camelia p6: ... | irclog: http://irc.perl6.org or http://colabti.org/irclogger/irclogger_logs/perl6 | UTF-8 is our friend!
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04:39 Geth ¦ doc: lefth++ created pull request #1618: Small changes: wrong link, missing :kv, grammar error
04:39 Geth ¦ doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/pull/1618
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05:00 zostay m: dd \(a => 1, b => <a b c>); dd Capture.new(:hash(%(a => 1, b => <a b c>)));
05:00 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «\(:a(1), :b(("a", "b", "c")))␤\(:a(1), :b($("a", "b", "c")))␤»
05:00 zostay m: dd \(a => 1, b => <a b c>); dd Capture.new(:hash(%(a => 1, b => <a b c>.list)));
05:01 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «\(:a(1), :b(("a", "b", "c")))␤\(:a(1), :b($("a", "b", "c")))␤»
05:01 zostay I keep banging my head on this and can't figure out a way to make a Capture programmatically that behaves the same as the syntactic one.
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05:52 Geth ¦ doc: jstuder-gh++ created pull request #1619: Document List cmp infix and sorting by multiple values (via List)
05:52 Geth ¦ doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/pull/1619
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07:17 * lizmat clickbaits https://p6weekly.wordpress.com/2017/10/23/2017-43-hyper-lands-racing/
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07:26 AlexDaniel` that's a very nice weekly. lizmat++
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07:43 moritz indeed, lizmat++
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08:55 AlexDaniel` oh gosh, pascal's triangle in 26 characters… I'm out :)
08:55 AlexDaniel` ( https://code-golf.io/ )
08:57 * moritz happy to see so many camels and butterflies on that site
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10:12 wander m: grammar G { rule TOP { <number>+ { dd $<number>; die "wrong" if $<number>[0].made !~~ /\w+/; dd $<number>; } }; rule number { \d+ { make ~$/; }} }; G.parse("1 2 3 4");
10:12 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «[Match.new(list => (), made => "1 ", pos => 2, hash => Map.new(()), orig => "1 2 3 4", from => 0), Match.new(list => (), made => "2 ", pos => 4, hash => Map.new(()), orig => "1 2 3 4", from => 2), Match.new(list => (), made => "3 ", pos => 6, hash => …»
10:12 wander grammar G { rule TOP { <number>+ { dd $<number>; die "wrong" if $<number>[0].made !~~ /\w+/; dd $<number>; } }; rule number { \d+ { make ~$/; }} }; G.parse("1");
10:12 wander m: grammar G { rule TOP { <number>+ { dd $<number>; die "wrong" if $<number>[0].made !~~ /\w+/; dd $<number>; } }; rule number { \d+ { make ~$/; }} }; G.parse("1");
10:12 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «[Match.new(list => (), made => "1", pos => 1, hash => Map.new(()), orig => "1", from => 0)]␤Nil␤»
10:12 wander interesting
10:12 mienaikage I'm lost on this one, anyone know why every 4th test fails here? I was up until 2am scratching my head over it 😕 https://glot.io/snippets/euu75yqs7d
10:12 wander after a smart-match, I lose $<numver>
10:15 AlexDaniel` wander: well, matching a regex will reset $/
10:16 AlexDaniel` wander: or set it to whatever you get from matching
10:16 wander aha
10:16 wander right, I forget what $/ is
10:17 AlexDaniel` $<number> is same as $/<number> :)
10:17 AlexDaniel` https://docs.perl6.org/syntax/$$SOLIDUS
10:18 Grimy p6: sub infix:<!~>($a, $b) { say "$a, $b" }; 3 !~ 4
10:19 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>␤Unsupported use of !~ to do negated pattern matching; in Perl 6 please use !~~␤at <tmp>:1␤------> 3fix:<!~>($a, $b) { say "$a, $b" }; 3 !~ 7⏏4␤»
10:19 Grimy Shouldn’t it be possible to override infix:<!~> ? After all, you can override infix:<+>.
10:20 DrForr infix:<<!~>> maybe?
10:20 Grimy Nnope, same result.
10:20 Grimy Looks like infix:<!~> is special-cased to always give this error message.
10:21 DrForr Huh.
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10:31 AlexDaniel` Grimy: I think you should submit a bug report for that. We can definitely do better.
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10:34 Grimy Thanks for the suggestion AlexDaniel, I will
10:34 Grimy Just noticed that infix << and >> have the same behavior, too
10:35 AlexDaniel` and =~ also, and possibly many other things
10:35 DrForr «..» might work around those.
10:36 DrForr Though it arguably shouldn't need characters outside ASCII.
10:36 Grimy Don’t see how.
10:36 Grimy p6: sub infix:«<<»($a, $b) { say "$a, $b" }; 3 << 4
10:36 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>␤Unsupported use of << to do left shift; in Perl 6 please use +< or ~<␤at <tmp>:1␤------> 3nfix:«<<»($a, $b) { say "$a, $b" }; 3 <<7⏏5 4␤»
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10:41 mienaikage re: The above snippet, even more confusingly, it works if I change Int:D, Str:D to Int, Str
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10:53 timotimo mienaikage: looks like the two Hash[Int:D,Str:D] types end up not being the same object
10:54 timotimo oh, no, that's not true
10:54 timotimo Hash[Int,Str] also gives two distinct types, but they are considered equal
10:55 mienaikage is-deeply would be eqv and not === right?
10:55 timotimo so something's not checking equivalence right for definite type constraint thingies
10:55 timotimo not sure
10:55 timotimo will be afk for a bit
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11:03 AlexDaniel` m: $_ = ‘5 6 7 8’; dd «$_» Z+ 1
11:03 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «(27,).Seq␤»
11:03 AlexDaniel` why 27?
11:03 AlexDaniel` I do see that it sum-ed all elements on the left, but why?
11:07 Grimy p6: slip(5, 6, 7, 8) Z+ 1
11:07 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «Potential difficulties:␤    Useless use of Z+ in sink context␤    at <tmp>:1␤    ------> 3slip(5, 6, 7, 8) 7⏏5Z+ 1␤»
11:07 Grimy p6: dd slip(5, 6, 7, 8) Z+ 1
11:07 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «(27,).Seq␤»
11:08 AlexDaniel` hmmm huh
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11:10 Grimy circumfix «» gives a slip, and slips do weird things in argument lists. slip(5, 6, 7, 8) Z 1 gives ((1 5 6 7 8)), not ((1 5)). The behavior of Z+ is consistent with that.
11:12 AlexDaniel` ok, but why does «» give a slip in this particular case?
11:12 AlexDaniel` m: $_ = ‘5 6 7 8’; dd «$_»
11:12 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «slip(IntStr.new(5, "5"), IntStr.new(6, "6"), IntStr.new(7, "7"), IntStr.new(8, "8"))␤»
11:12 AlexDaniel` m: dd «5 6 7 8»
11:12 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «(IntStr.new(5, "5"), IntStr.new(6, "6"), IntStr.new(7, "7"), IntStr.new(8, "8"))␤»
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11:16 Grimy m: $_ = '5 6 7'; dd «$_ 8»
11:16 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «(IntStr.new(5, "5"), IntStr.new(6, "6"), IntStr.new(7, "7"), IntStr.new(8, "8"))␤»
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11:24 Zoffix it's 'cause the variable may contain more than one value
11:25 Zoffix and with a slip it all ends up one with the rest of the things; that's my understanding of it
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11:28 Zoffix m: $_ = ‘5 6 7 8’; dd «"$_"»
11:28 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «"5 6 7 8"␤»
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11:30 AlexDaniel` to me it feels like the slip should not leak outside
11:30 Zoffix m: $_ = ‘5 6 7 8’; dd «$_ 1»
11:30 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «(IntStr.new(5, "5"), IntStr.new(6, "6"), IntStr.new(7, "7"), IntStr.new(8, "8"), IntStr.new(1, "1"))␤»
11:30 Zoffix Yeah, to me too
11:30 mienaikage m: $_ = ‘5 6 7 8’; dd «1$_»
11:30 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «(IntStr.new(1, "1"), IntStr.new(5, "5"), IntStr.new(6, "6"), IntStr.new(7, "7"), IntStr.new(8, "8"))␤»
11:31 Zoffix it's probably made to handle ^ that case and the case where it's just a variable isn't handled
11:31 AlexDaniel` yea
11:31 AlexDaniel` I'll submit a ticket then
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11:32 Zoffix m: dd «x».^name
11:32 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «"Str"␤»
11:33 * lizmat is running a stresstest for a fix for issue 1220
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11:33 lizmat alas, the fix doesn't take away the instability completely  :-(
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11:37 AlexDaniel` lizmat: does it ever hang for you?
11:38 lizmat no, not so far
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11:41 timotimo mienaikage: it turns out glot.io has version 2017.01 of rakudo installed; the bug with is-deeply with Blah:D seems to already be fixed
11:42 raschipi Is code-golf.io not working?
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11:43 lizmat *1202
11:44 AlexDaniel` raschipi: opens just fine here
11:44 mienaikage timotimo: I have the same behaviour on my machine with Rakudo version 2017.09-133-g5ad2fffed built on MoarVM version 2017.09.1-49-gb3dd812a
11:44 timotimo oh!
11:45 ilmari ls
11:45 mienaikage I'd just put it on glot for the sake of sharing
11:45 ilmari EWIN
11:45 raschipi working now, sorry for bothering
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11:53 mienaikage Hmm, I broke it even more... If you use require instead of use it doesn't like the typing at all https://glot.io/snippets/euuaa6wm8p
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11:59 Zoffix mienaikage: what's the bug?
11:59 Zoffix oh /me notices the glot.io snippety
12:03 Zoffix mienaikage: where do I get ETL from?
12:03 Zoffix Oh, there's a second tab, nm
12:03 mienaikage :)
12:04 Grimy m: say circumfix:<[ ]>(3)
12:04 camelia rakudo-moar e4a5bb17c: OUTPUT: «WARNINGS for <tmp>:␤[3]␤Useless use of constant value [ ] in sink context (lines 1, 1)␤»
12:05 Zoffix :S my perl6 refuses to find it
12:05 Grimy This warning seems wrong, isn’t it?
12:05 Zoffix Grimy: yeah. It's ticketed: https://rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=131305#ticket-history
12:05 Grimy Thanks!
12:08 Zoffix mienaikage: reproed the problem. Gimme a sec to golf it a bit.
12:09 mienaikage No worries. Was trying to put together a new exercise for exercism. Wasn't sure if I broke something or was just being silly.
12:09 raschipi But can you do it in 26 characters?
12:10 Zoffix mienaikage: there's definitely something wrong :)
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12:22 Grimy m: $_ = 42; say $_ &= 3
12:22 camelia rakudo-moar 30462d766: OUTPUT: «MoarVM panic: Memory allocation failed; could not allocate 108304 bytes␤»
12:22 Zoffix heh
12:22 Grimy Should I make a ticket for this one?
12:22 Zoffix Grimy: yeah
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12:22 Grimy Alright
12:22 Zoffix Grimy: you can make one here: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/issues
12:23 Zoffix Grimy: note that `&` is an 'all' Junction, not a bit twiddling op
12:23 Grimy Thanks. Is this the recommended method? I’ve been mailing to perl6-bugs
12:23 Zoffix Grimy: it's just something new we're experimenting with. Emailing is fine too.
12:24 Grimy Alright, I’ll use GH issues since it’s more convenient imo
12:25 Geth ¦ doc: a5dee808bc | (Dan Zwell)++ (committed by Dan) | doc/Type/Hash.pod6
12:25 Geth ¦ doc: Document Hash's :kv adverb
12:25 Geth ¦ doc:
12:25 Geth ¦ doc: Also fix a small grammar error.
12:25 Geth ¦ doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/a5dee808bc
12:25 synopsebot Link: https://doc.perl6.org/type/Hash
12:25 Geth ¦ doc: 932d9f6801 | (Dan Zwell)++ (committed by Dan) | doc/Type/Signature.pod6
12:26 Geth ¦ doc: Fix the destructuring docs linking to the "Capture" type instead of method.
12:26 synopsebot Link: https://doc.perl6.org/type/Signature
12:26 Geth ¦ doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/932d9f6801
12:26 Geth ¦ doc: e4cce1e799 | (Rafael Schipiura)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | 2 files
12:26 Geth ¦ doc: Merge pull request #1618 from lefth/master
12:26 Geth ¦ doc:
12:26 Geth ¦ doc: Small changes: wrong link, missing :kv, grammar error
12:26 Geth ¦ doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/e4cce1e799
12:28 Geth ¦ doc: 92927dfa18 | (Jeremy Studer)++ | doc/Type/List.pod6
12:28 Geth ¦ doc: Document the List variant of the cmp operator
12:28 Geth ¦ doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/92927dfa18
12:28 Geth ¦ doc: 191db0bd5a | (Jeremy Studer)++ | 2 files
12:28 Geth ¦ doc: Document sorting by multiple criteria
12:28 synopsebot Link: https://doc.perl6.org/type/List
12:28 Geth ¦ doc:
12:28 Geth ¦ doc: This is a powerful way of sorting, but it's not currently apparent that
12:29 Geth ¦ doc: it can be done this way in the documentation.
12:29 Geth ¦ doc:
12:29 Geth ¦ doc: Also, in this section have infix:<cmp> link to a page documenting the
12:29 Geth ¦ doc: various instances of the cmp operator.
12:29 Geth ¦ doc:
12:29 Geth ¦ doc: Also, added myself to credits.
12:29 Geth ¦ doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/191db0bd5a
12:29 Geth ¦ doc: 26ab76444d | (Rafael Schipiura)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | 2 files
12:29 Geth ¦ doc: Merge pull request #1619 from jstuder-gh/sort_multiple
12:29 Geth ¦ doc:
12:29 Geth ¦ doc: Document List cmp infix and sorting by multiple values (via List)
12:29 Geth ¦ doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/26ab76444d
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12:38 Zoffix mienaikage: field an Issue for it. It's a bug in Rakudo; something's busted with hashes parametired with Int:D types: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/issues/1207
12:38 Zoffix mienaikage: you can workaround it by not using the `:D` in your types or sticking `no precompilation` at the top of your module (note that'd cause it to be re-compiled each time which can make things very much slower)
12:39 Zoffix .oO( you know you're too tired when you write 'parametirized' as 'parametired' ... )
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12:39 Zoffix *filed too
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12:46 perlpilot huh ... I was just reading the weekly and the code for running "once in a batch" surprised me.
12:48 lizmat perlpilot: why ?
12:48 [Coke] do we want doc tickets to get announced her?
12:48 [Coke] *here
12:49 raschipi yes
12:50 perlpilot lizmat: because "once {...}*      run only once, suppressing additional evaluations"  That batching is a side-effect of .hyper/.race should factor in to that IMHO.  At least not without something more explicit.
12:51 perlpilot *shouldn't
12:52 [Coke] I would not expect once to mean "once per batch"
12:52 Zoffix perlpilot: then which batch should it be run in?
12:52 Zoffix The phasers will also get special treatment
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12:54 Zoffix [Coke]: it'd just need to add an event handler here https://github.com/perl6/geth/blob/master/lib/Geth/GitHub/Hooks.pm6#L114-L121 and IRC responder here: https://github.com/perl6/geth/blob/master/lib/Geth/Plugin/GitHub.pm6#L123  AlexDaniel` probably already has code for that from the squashable6 bot
12:54 lizmat my proposal would be to *not* handle phasers in hypers/races differently
12:54 lizmat but set a $*BATCH dynamic variable indicating that it's being run in a batch
12:54 perlpilot Or put another way, if I have a .map that calls a function to do work and that function calls `once { }` somewhere down the line, will I accidentally change the semantics of the once block by adding .hyper or .race?
12:54 Zoffix lizmat: but would it be per-batch?
12:54 lizmat which could have additiional information, like batch number
12:55 Zoffix perlpilot: yes
12:55 Zoffix perlpilot: same as if you have that function do something thread-unsafe
12:55 lizmat Zoffix: yes, a FIRST / LAST would be per batch
12:56 Zoffix Yeah, sounds like what I was thinking
12:56 lizmat *and* before the very first batch
12:56 lizmat (FIRST that is)
12:56 lizmat and after the very last batch (LAST)
12:56 lizmat those two cases would *not* have $*BATCH set
12:56 Zoffix Not that I know much about this part of language :)
12:57 lizmat NEXT/REDO/ENTER/LEAVE phasers should work as normal
12:57 piojo joined #perl6
12:57 lizmat well, that would be my suggestion
12:59 piojo Is rakudo failing to build for everyone, or just me? I'm seeing this error: While looking for 'Perl6/ModuleLoader.moarvm': no such file or directory
12:59 Geth ¦ doc: cd197c1fe6 | (Alex Chen)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | doc/Type/Whatever.pod6
12:59 Geth ¦ doc: Delete incorrect doc of Exception of Whatever-star
12:59 Geth ¦ doc:
12:59 Geth ¦ doc: `1 ~~ *` will return a WhateverCode instead of return true
12:59 Geth ¦ doc:
12:59 synopsebot Link: https://doc.perl6.org/type/Whatever
12:59 Geth ¦ doc: Example:
12:59 Geth ¦ doc: ```
12:59 Geth ¦ doc: > map (1 ~~ *), <1 2 3>
12:59 Geth ¦ doc: (True False False)
12:59 Geth ¦ doc: ```
12:59 Geth ¦ doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/cd197c1fe6
12:59 perlpilot piojo: probably just you as I built mine just fine mere moments ago.
12:59 lizmat piojo: not seeing that
12:59 piojo The build target that's failing is blib/Perl6/World.moarvm
12:59 * Zoffix had no problems last night
12:59 piojo I should say it's on Windows
12:59 piojo I haven't tested Linux, though I should do that
12:59 lizmat ah, k, can't help then
12:59 * Zoffix had no problems a couple weeks ago
13:00 Zoffix piojo: is that with a fresh checkout?
13:00 Zoffix e.g. like these steps: https://github.com/zoffixznet/r#windows
13:00 Zoffix That's how I built it a couple weeks ago
13:00 piojo Zoffix: no, it's not. Thanks! I'll try that
13:01 perlpilot anyway ... let's just say that I continue to be uncomfortable with the action-at-a-distance for once (and other phasers)
13:01 mienaikage Zoffix: Thanks. I've added a little extra info on GH re: require as well
13:01 lizmat perlpilot: what would be your suggestion?
13:01 lizmat a complete new set of phasers ?
13:02 lizmat or just no phasers (change the NYI into a real error)
13:02 lizmat afk again&
13:03 perlpilot I dunno, I'm not awake enough yet :-)   Maybe I'd be more comfortable if the documentation for .hyper/.race called these things out explicitly?   Right now, the weekly reads like ".hyper/.race makes things faster" (and I think that's how many people will think of them  too) but really it's more like ".hyper/.race will make things faster, but beware the semantic differences they impose upon certain phasers and phaser-like constructs"
13:04 Zoffix perlpilot: my impression of watching this work from a distance is people seem to be expecting a magic "make it faster" button that will perform work on all the cores, when in reality there's gonna be a bunch of race conditions people will be struggling with or, like you point out, receiving new semantics for stuff like `once` because they expected the program to know when once has been executed already on one
13:04 Zoffix of the threads. gfldex already had a bug in their code that cached a Seq twice from a hyper and it took even jnthn some time to figure out what the crash was about. I fully expect more of that stuff to turn up and possibly people eventually realizing .hyper/.race aren't a magical fire-and-forget make-it-faster solution
13:05 cdg joined #perl6
13:06 perlpilot Zoffix: agreed.
13:08 Zoffix m: hyper for ^4 { sleep 1 }; say now - INIT now
13:08 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «4.0099630␤»
13:08 perlpilot I think it's just we need more words out there (in documentation, blogs, etc.) talking about the intersection of these features and I'm uncomfortable right now because I've been operating from a mindset that didn't consider this intersection.
13:08 Zoffix m: hyper for ^4 .hyper { sleep 1 }; say now - INIT now
13:08 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «4.00964309␤»
13:08 * Zoffix was expecting 1s in both cases :/
13:09 Zoffix m: ^4 .hyper.map: { sleep 1 }; say now - INIT now
13:09 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «4.0106535␤»
13:09 Zoffix :/
13:10 wander m: say (42 ~~ *)
13:10 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «{ ... }␤»
13:10 wander m: say (* ~~ 42)
13:10 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «{ ... }␤»
13:10 AlexDaniel` Zoffix: isn't it ok? you didn't specify the batch size
13:11 wander m: 42.ACCEPTS(*)
13:11 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: ( no output )
13:11 Zoffix AlexDaniel`: oh, duh
13:11 wander m: say 42.ACCEPTS(*)
13:11 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «False␤»
13:11 AlexDaniel` m: ^4 .hyper(:1batch).map: { sleep 1 }; say now - INIT now
13:11 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «1.051253␤»
13:11 Zoffix m: say (42 ~~ (*))
13:11 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «True␤»
13:11 Zoffix wander: your variant made a WhateverCode closure
13:12 Zoffix m: hyper for ^4 .hyper: :batch { sleep 1 }; say now - INIT now
13:12 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «1.0510388␤»
13:12 Zoffix \o/
13:12 cdg_ joined #perl6
13:12 Zoffix m: for ^4 .hyper: :batch { sleep 1 }; say now - INIT now
13:12 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «4.00893443␤»
13:12 wander WhateverCode in `* ~~ 42`, while Whatever in `42.ACCEPTS(*)`, is it?
13:13 ilmari m: hyper for ^4 { sleep 1 }; say now - INIT now
13:13 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «4.0116992␤»
13:13 piojo I can build rakudo against an older moar/nqp, but not against the newest
13:13 Zoffix perlpilot: ^ (my last eval) another semantic difference. `for` is no longer just a `map` under the hood; it's `.serial.map` and a `for` without a `hyper` or `race` prefix iterates over HyperSeq and RaceSeq serially
13:13 Zoffix wander: right
13:14 piojo never mind, I thought it was working but it wasn't
13:14 Zoffix piojo: can you create an Issue ( https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/issues/ ) with full output of the error, along with Windows version and what type of C compiler/perl you got installed?
13:15 piojo Zoffix: I'll do that now
13:15 Zoffix Thanks.
13:16 perlpilot Zoffix: yeah, but that's a difference I was expecting, whereas "once" running more than once wasn't   :-)
13:17 ryn1x joined #perl6
13:18 Zoffix perlpilot: dunno, for me I'd be more surprised with ^4 .hyper(:batch).map: { my $x; once $x = Foo.new; $x.do-things };  crashing, just because the `once` block ran in only one of the batches
13:18 Zoffix Or something like that. Text::CSV uses this setup
13:20 darkmorph joined #perl6
13:21 wander m: Whatever.new.Capture
13:21 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «Cannot unpack or Capture `*`.␤To create a Capture, add parentheses: \(...)␤If unpacking in a signature, perhaps you needlessly used parentheses? -> ($x) {} vs. -> $x {}␤  in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1␤␤»
13:22 Zoffix wander: that's by design. Is that creating a problem in some code?
13:23 khw joined #perl6
13:23 Zoffix m: my atomicint $v = 0; ^4 .race(:batch).map: { once $v⚛++ }; say $v
13:23 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «4␤»
13:23 Zoffix m: my atomicint $v = 0; ^4 .race(:2batch).map: { once $v⚛++ }; say $v
13:23 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «2␤»
13:24 Zoffix perlpilot: yeah, kinda surprising behaviour.
13:24 wander on my PC, it doesn't throw Exception
13:24 wander This is Rakudo version 2017.07 built on MoarVM version 2017.07 implementing Perl 6.c.
13:24 Zoffix wander: it's a new feature. Implemented like 2 weeks ago.
13:24 wander got it
13:27 Zoffix .oO( `hyper once` )
13:28 perlpilot lizmat++ also because I learned something new in the p6weekly.  I'm an "episodic volunteer"  :-)  (Ann Barcomb)++ too
13:28 AlexDaniel` what new feature? atomicint? Isn't it like 2 months ago now?
13:28 Zoffix AlexDaniel`: you're mixing up conversation threads :)
13:29 piojo Zoffix: I get a different error with --gen-moar --gen-nqp. Should I file a separate bug report for that?
13:29 DrForr Might want to watch the talks from the Open Source Summit in Prague - she's giving a similar talk there.
13:29 Zoffix "m: Whatever.new.Capture" " wander: that's by design." "on my PC, it doesn't throw Exception" "it's a new feature"
13:30 AlexDaniel` Zoffix: not only that, but I'm also blind /o\ Somehow skipped “doesn't”
13:30 AlexDaniel` alright, back to release stuff then
13:30 ggoebel joined #perl6
13:30 Zoffix piojo: I think adding that to the same bug report is fine
13:30 piojo Okay, thanks
13:30 perlpilot DrForr: thanks, I'll check it out
13:31 DrForr Kind of annoying - the summit is at the Hilton just a few blcoks from here but she's too busy to hang :/
13:32 DrForr *hang out.
13:33 timotimo m: for ^4 { for ^3 { once say "hi" } }
13:33 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «hi␤hi␤hi␤hi␤»
13:33 Zoffix :)
13:33 timotimo for your consideration, perlpilot, Zoffix
13:34 perlpilot hmm
13:36 perlpilot Makes me think "once" needs a new name  :)
13:36 moritz roughly-once
13:37 perlpilot I would guess that falls out of the "once per clone of the containing object"
13:37 DrForr 'just' :)
13:38 Zoffix once-in-a-blue-moon
13:39 perlpilot once-upon-a-time
13:39 perlpilot once-and-future-once
13:39 perlpilot once-more-into-the-breach
13:39 perlpilot once-in-a-while
13:40 perlpilot once-twice-three-times-a-once
13:40 sjn once-twice-often
13:40 timotimo once upon a closure in the west
13:40 ilmari once-for-the-money
13:41 sjn once-for-the-road
13:41 perlpilot once-or-maybe-more is a probably accurate.  :)
13:41 timotimo first-time?
13:41 raschipi change 'once' to 'nonce'
13:42 Zoffix 'monce' for 'mostly-once'
13:44 perlpilot once-per-clone  ->  clonce
13:44 perlpilot once-per-batch  ->  bounce (kinda :)
13:46 [Coke] to be clear, I am fine with once meaning something slightly different based on hyper, map, just wasn't expecting it at first.
13:47 perlpilot [Coke]: did you expect timotimo's example either?  :)
13:48 napo1eon joined #perl6
13:49 wander joined #perl6
13:51 AlexDaniel` is anybody using a 32-bit system here?
13:53 Zoffix I may have one handy.. why?
13:54 AlexDaniel` Zoffix: I'm wondering if https://github.com/perl6/nqp/issues/377 is related to that
13:54 AlexDaniel` this is just a wild guess
13:54 pmurias bisect: my $b = {"a" => 1000000000000000000}.BagHash; $b.grab(100); say $b.total;
13:54 bisectable6 pmurias, On both starting points (old=2015.12 new=b19e352) the exit code is 0 and the output is identical as well
13:54 bisectable6 pmurias, Output on both points: «999999999999999900»
13:55 Zoffix AlexDaniel`: well, I got 2017.09-223-gd565ded built on it
13:58 AlexDaniel` Zoffix: that's great but kinda 277 commits behind :)
13:58 callyalater joined #perl6
14:00 Zoffix Statistically irrelevant :) dogbert17 also got a 32-bit system IIRC
14:00 Zoffix s/irrelevant/insignificant/;
14:02 Zoffix I noticed some edited paths in that Issue's output; I suspect something was messed up with --prefix or whatever
14:02 Zoffix That or the nqp-lib thing was messed up and there's some conditon where it causes extra args given
14:02 Zoffix (missing quoting on paths with spaces?)
14:02 AlexDaniel` could be that yeah
14:03 AlexDaniel` oh, he responded
14:03 Zoffix .oO( "he"? )
14:04 AlexDaniel` they
14:04 Zoffix ZofBot: what's your preferred pronoun?
14:04 ZofBot Zoffix, '"Down with Big Brother!" Yes, I said that! Said it over and over again, it seems
14:04 Zoffix hah
14:05 AlexDaniel` “Cloning into '.'...”
14:05 Altreus Did you forget that bonce is a word?
14:07 Zoffix AlexDaniel`: well, I see what it's complaining about: "/tmp/tmp.o2BIF8otPY/install/bin/moar --libpath= [...] gen/moar/stage1/nqpmo.nqp" I guess that line needs to be found in make file and the `gen/moar/stage1/nqpmo.nqp` stuff put before the named args? Wonder what that line is like on working builds..
14:07 Zoffix AlexDaniel`: Cloning into '.' is the rakudo clone from my command that person ran
14:07 AlexDaniel` ah
14:07 mempko joined #perl6
14:08 Zoffix Altreus: didn't know it was :D
14:08 mr-foobar joined #perl6
14:08 Grimy ^... and ^...^ are NIY, but aren’t marked as such, and give really confusing error messages instead.
14:09 zakharyas joined #perl6
14:09 [Coke] apparently pigsconce is also a word. (pig-sconce)
14:10 AlexDaniel` m: say 1,20^...30
14:10 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «120^..0.3␤»
14:10 AlexDaniel` well
14:11 Zoffix Grimy: I thought they weren't meant to be implemented
14:11 Zoffix But I guess they could be. The ...^ is already done and ^... can be done with .tail now
14:11 Grimy Maybe? They’re listed in S03.
14:12 Grimy How do I know when an idea in the Synopses has been abandonned?
14:12 Zoffix Ah, OK. Just vaugely recall TimToady talking about these
14:12 Grimy Also ...^ is implemented but isn’t listed in https://docs.perl6.org/routine.html
14:13 Zoffix Grimy: no real way. Synopses are historical documents. Roast is the current spec. Some of the design desisions are archived ( e.g. https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/blob/nom/docs/2017-IO-Grant--Action-Plan.md )
14:13 AlexDaniel` Grimy: that's a doc issue that should be filed here: https://github.com/perl6/doc/issues/
14:13 AlexDaniel` Grimy: it seems that it's linked but there's no special section for it https://docs.perl6.org/language/operators#index-entry-%E2%80%A6^_operators
14:14 [Coke] (spec) there's also a load of those enshrined in NYI tickets in rt that may never be I.
14:15 Zoffix Grimy: looks like ... is in that list, but only the stub op shows up when clicked, not the sequence op
14:15 Zoffix And … ain't in the list
14:16 Grimy Well UTF-8 operators aren’t in the list, right?
14:16 Grimy Wait, some of them are.
14:17 dakkar joined #perl6
14:18 Grimy Thanks for the links, roast looks interesting. Is there a NYI ticket for prefix:<~^>? It seems simple enough to me and I’m wondering why it’s not there yet.
14:18 Altreus Zoffix: I thought perlpilot should ... maybe not though, perhaps
14:19 ryn1x joined #perl6
14:20 Zoffix huggable: tag nyi
14:20 huggable Zoffix, nothing found
14:20 Zoffix huggable: tag niy
14:20 huggable Zoffix, nothing found
14:21 Zoffix buggable: tag nyi
14:21 Zoffix c'mon, robot. I ain't got all day
14:21 Zoffix Grimy: if there is, it'd be one of these here: https://fail.rakudo.party/t/NYI
14:22 buggable joined #perl6
14:22 buggable New CPAN upload: JSON-Tiny-1.0.tar.gz by MORITZ https://cpan.metacpan.org/authors/id/M/MO/MORITZ/Perl6/JSON-Tiny-1.0.tar.gz
14:22 [Coke] Zoffix: what is [MOLD] ?
14:23 [Coke] seems to be on .party only, not on original ticket.
14:23 AlexDaniel` [Coke]: old tickets that were not touched for more than a year or so
14:23 Zoffix FWIW, I closed a couple of NYI last week 'cause they were not applicable anymore. So I'd say just 'cause there's an NYI ticket doesn't mean it's accepted that it should be implemented that way or implemented at all.
14:23 Zoffix Grimy: we also have #perl6-dev where more dev eyes would see your questions
14:24 [Coke] anything that is NYI or RFC at this point needs some kind of sanity check, yes, zoffix++
14:24 Grimy Alright, thanks!
14:24 [Coke] (even if there's a roast test; some of those tests predate rakudo)
14:24 Zoffix [Coke]: tickets that were last updated more than 60*60*24*365*2 seconds ago
14:24 Geth ¦ ecosystem: 974a161733 | (Moritz Lenz)++ | META.list
14:24 Geth ¦ ecosystem: JSON::Tiny now lives on CPAN
14:24 Geth ¦ ecosystem: review: https://github.com/perl6/ecosystem/commit/974a161733
14:25 [Coke] I mean, why not 365.24? :)
14:25 Zoffix :)
14:29 piojo Thanks for the help, everyone--I found the problem was basically "git checkout master"--that does nothing, since there is no "master" branch in rakudo ;)
14:29 Zoffix lol
14:29 piojo so I had an old commit checked out the whole time, and didn't notice.
14:29 Zoffix :)
14:29 piojo :D
14:29 AlexDaniel` well… maybe we should finally rename it
14:29 Grimy Why is the branch named «nom», anyway?
14:30 Zoffix Grimy: historical reasons. it started as "New Object Model" and eventually became the "master"
14:30 Grimy Ooh ok
14:30 piojo The funny thing is that it was in the first line of my bug report. It feels like I accidentally made a riddle
14:31 Zoffix I like "nom" as name, though I admit to on occasion typing "git checkout master" only to be told there ain't no master...
14:31 AlexDaniel` I'm doing that all the time
14:31 AlexDaniel` especially when working with moar or nqp
14:32 piojo I'm surprised I didn't notice, but building moar then nqp then rakudo, the process gets a little robotic
14:32 moritz I think we had an agreement that basically all core devs were fine with renaming nom to master
14:32 AlexDaniel` OK
14:32 moritz just nobody done it so far
14:32 AlexDaniel` then will do it after the release
14:32 moritz ++AlexDaniel`
14:32 piojo good idea
14:33 stmuk I think there may have been talk of using nom as a dev branch and master the release (or was it the other way round?)
14:34 Zoffix Yeah, something like that. My pushback against that is people will be more loosy with pushing breaking changes and the commits have to be sequential anyway due to reliance on MoarVM/nqp/roast
14:35 piojo That reminds me, do --gen-moar and --gen-nqp only use the latest release, or are there stable versions in between releases?
14:35 AlexDaniel` I expect it to be consistent across the trio, so if it's “master” for nqp and moar, then let's please have “master” in rakudo
14:35 Zoffix So "release" branch would be blocked anyway. The current system where people make scary changes in branches kinda more preferable IMO.
14:35 moritz piojo: they use whatever is in tools/build/NQP_REVISION
14:35 moritz or MOAR_REVISION in nqp
14:36 piojo moritz: Is that bumped more frequently than the montly releases?
14:36 AlexDaniel` piojo: yes
14:36 [Coke] only slightly
14:36 piojo oh, great
14:36 pmurias Zoffix: if I remember correctly master was meant to be the nom commit that passes automated testing
14:37 Zoffix pmurias: yeah. So what happens when latest nom commit doesn't pass stuff?
14:37 Zoffix The devs won't care as much, since bleed users are using master and aren't affected, and the rest of the devs now have a breaking commit in their workflow
14:37 [Coke] There's no rush to move it immediately post release; why don't we plan on having it hashed out in time to do so immediately after the next release?
14:38 stmuk talking of "release" .. is there going to be one? :)
14:38 * moritz kinda agrees with Zoffix
14:38 moritz at $work we had some kind of stabilization branch, and it didn't work out too well
14:39 Zoffix BTW, that branch proposal is documented here: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/blob/nom/docs/language_versions.md#rakudo-branches
14:39 moritz people did stuff there that wasn't tested by the same mechanism as the trunk, and so we had untested releases
14:40 moritz and the "oh, people can just use master" mentality also took hold, at least somewhat
14:41 Geth ¦ mu: 05001f3b99 | (Zoffix Znet)++ | misc/perl6advent-2017/schedule
14:41 Geth ¦ mu: Start Advent 2017 Schedule
14:41 Geth ¦ mu:
14:41 Geth ¦ mu: Call dibs on 1st and 23rd
14:41 Geth ¦ mu: review: https://github.com/perl6/mu/commit/05001f3b99
14:41 stmuk wouldn't that proposal also have to specify *which* roast branches pass?
14:42 moritz oh, it's this time of the year again? :)
14:42 Zoffix New blog post: "Rakudo Perl 6 Advent Calendar 2017 Call for Authors": https://rakudo.party/post/Rakudo-Perl-6-Advent-Calendar-2017--Call-for-Authors
14:45 moritz Zoffix: do you plan to cover Perl 6 books in your review post, or should I do a separate one for that?
14:46 Zoffix moritz: wasn't planning. If you can do it, it'd be great, as despite owning many preview copies I haven't had time to read much of the available books...
14:47 Geth ¦ mu: 2a4cf374b5 | (Moritz Lenz)++ | misc/perl6advent-2017/schedule
14:47 Geth ¦ mu: Claim Dec 02 to talk about books
14:47 Geth ¦ mu: review: https://github.com/perl6/mu/commit/2a4cf374b5
14:48 Zoffix \o/
14:50 Zoffix .tell TimToady I called dibs on Advent post for the 1st. If you wanted to post something there instead, just take that spot: https://github.com/perl6/mu/blob/master/misc/perl6advent-2017/schedule#L3
14:50 yoleaux Zoffix: I'll pass your message to TimToady.
14:50 AlexDaniel` stmuk: yes, when it's ready. We're putting some extra effort into making sure it's really good
14:51 * Zoffix &
14:51 moritz traditionally, our benevolent dictator has been happy to take the last spot in the Advent series, if any
14:54 Zoffix AlexDaniel`: stmuk Gonna take a crack at using `isatty` for the $*IN.getc macos issue in 8hr. If the fix fixes the things and doesn't negatively affect perf of my spectest, I'll merge it and do the bumps and I think that's the last thing blocking the release, no? There's RT#132343 ... looks really big
14:54 synopsebot RT#132343 [new]: https://rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=132343 [REGRESSION] better-sched and other async improvement ecosystem fallout
14:54 * Zoffix & for 8hrs :)
14:54 Zoffix left #perl6
14:55 AlexDaniel` Zoffix: yes. I'm looking into RT #132343 right now (but I've decided that most of the stuff in that ticket is a non-issue for the release)
15:06 callyalater How can you use matching adverbs with grammars?
15:06 callyalater Like the :exhaustive adverb.
15:07 perlpilot Zoffix++ for jump starting the advent calendar this year.
15:07 zakharyas joined #perl6
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15:09 perlpilot callyalater: I don't think that you can use that particular one inside of a grammar.  (I could be wrong though)
15:11 perlpilot callyalater: as for "how", normally you just put the modifier in the grammar at the beginning of a rule or grouping construct
15:11 perlpilot callyalater: token foo { :i foo }  # match "foo" case insensitively
15:26 Geth ¦ mu: 82e64bbd8a | (Nigel Hamilton)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | misc/perl6advent-2017/schedule
15:26 Geth ¦ mu: Update schedule
15:26 Geth ¦ mu: review: https://github.com/perl6/mu/commit/82e64bbd8a
15:27 lostinfog joined #perl6
15:28 callyalater perlpilot: Dang it. I was hoping that I could pass it in to the parse method...
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15:50 Geth ¦ doc/master: 5 commits pushed by (Patrick Spek)++, (Rafael Schipiura)++
15:50 Geth ¦ doc/master: 9f05edcb57 | Remove link to outdated spec
15:50 Geth ¦ doc/master: c6f619fc48 | Add differently worded reference to S22
15:50 Geth ¦ doc/master: 057a2e87a7 | Update modules.pod6
15:50 Geth ¦ doc/master: 86094fcdb1 | Update modules.pod6
15:50 Geth ¦ doc/master: bb723c2f7b | Merge pull request #1614 from Tyil/update-module-meta6
15:50 Geth ¦ doc/master: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/compare/cd197c1fe6...bb723c2f7b
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16:35 * [Coke] gets annoyed at perl6/docs mix of make & perl6 site build again.
16:36 * [Coke] suspects with new concurrency stuff, we could shove everything into p6 at this point, and do a better job of enforcing build deps than we do now.
16:37 Geth ¦ doc: 42e2bc0603 | (Will "Coke" Coleda)++ | xt/words.pws
16:37 Geth ¦ doc: Learn new word
16:37 Geth ¦ doc:
16:37 Geth ¦ doc: Closes #1620
16:37 Geth ¦ doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/42e2bc0603
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16:41 Geth ¦ doc: a0afc5ce15 | (Will "Coke" Coleda)++ | htmlify.p6
16:41 Geth ¦ doc: use pod for long form comment;minor cleanups
16:41 Geth ¦ doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/a0afc5ce15
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16:55 knight__ sssddddddssss
16:56 knight__ ops
16:56 knight__ Sorry
16:57 knight__ Hello, I am newbie. I have question about calling a function/sub.In mython I can do something liek def fun(a,b,c)... and call it fun(10, b=100, c=300) (for example)
16:57 knight__ How can I mix positional argument in perl6?
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17:00 knight__ i want call function for example fun($a, b=>100, c=>300). Of course I can do it with ($a, $:b, $:c), but what if I want something like fun(20, 30, c=>300)?
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17:00 timotimo you can have three optional positional parameters and the three nameds
17:00 knight__ How can I do it without definition in signature?
17:01 timotimo then depending on how many positionals were actually passed, you fill those into the variables you want
17:02 timotimo m: sub fun($one?, $two?, $three?, :$a, :$b, :$c) { say $one // $a; say $two // $b; say $three // $c }; fun(20, 30, c => 300); fun(10, b => 100, c => 100)
17:02 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «20␤30␤300␤10␤100␤100␤»
17:02 timotimo m: sub fun($one?, $two?, $three?, :$a, :$b, :$c) { say $one // $a; say $two // $b; say $three // $c }; fun(10, b => 100, c => 300)
17:02 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «10␤100␤300␤»
17:02 timotimo that was your actual example
17:02 timotimo it should even work to use defaults in your signature for this purpose
17:02 timotimo m: sub fun($one = $a, $two = $b, $three = $c, :$a, :$b, :$c) { say $one; say $two; say $three }; fun(10, b => 100, c => 300)
17:02 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>␤Variable '$a' is not declared␤at <tmp>:1␤------> 3sub fun($one = 7⏏5$a, $two = $b, $three = $c, :$a, :$b, :$␤»
17:03 timotimo nope, they have to be available in order
17:04 raschipi [15:02] <timotimo> m: sub fun($one?, $two?, $three?, :$a = $one, :$b = $two, :$c = $three) { say $a; say $b; say $c }; fun(10, b => 100, c => 300)
17:04 raschipi m: sub fun($one?, $two?, $three?, :$a = $one, :$b = $two, :$c = $three) { say $a; say $b; say $c }; fun(10, b => 100, c => 300)
17:04 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «10␤100␤300␤»
17:04 raschipi m: sub fun($one?, $two?, $three?, :$a = $one, :$b = $two, :$c = $three) { say $a; say $b; say $c }; fun(10, 100, c => 300)
17:04 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «10␤100␤300␤»
17:05 knight__ Thank you
17:05 raschipi defaults work, just need to rmember they are only available to the right of where they were declared.
17:07 raschipi m: sub fun(:$a, :$b, :$c, $one = $a, $two = $b, $three = $c ) { say $one; say $two; say $three }; fun(10, b => 100, c => 300)
17:07 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>␤Cannot put optional positional parameter $one after variadic parameters␤at <tmp>:1␤------> 3sub fun(:$a, :$b, :$c, $one = $a7⏏5, $two = $b, $three = $c ) { say $one; s␤    expecting any of:…»
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17:11 Geth ¦ doc: 55a077d429 | (Will "Coke" Coleda)++ | htmlify.p6
17:11 Geth ¦ doc: Fix issue with proc async usage hanging on mac
17:11 Geth ¦ doc:
17:11 Geth ¦ doc: mac's TMPDIR ends with a /, so we ended up with paths
17:11 Geth ¦ doc: like ...//... ; the external program normalized the filenames
17:11 Geth ¦ doc: to a single slash, so nothing matched.
17:11 Geth ¦ doc:
17:11 Geth ¦ doc: Remove the command line option that allowed us to force it
17:11 Geth ¦ doc: on the mac; it's now the default.
17:11 Geth ¦ doc:
17:11 Geth ¦ doc: Fixes #1129
17:12 synopsebot GH#1129 [closed]: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/pull/1129 Fix comment
17:12 Geth ¦ doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/55a077d429
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18:02 bdmatatu In this section, is '.unique' necessary (after .invert)? https://docs.perl6.org/type/Hash#method_push
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18:03 timotimo m: my %wc = 'hash' => 323, 'pair' => 322, 'pipe' => 323; say %wc.invert.unique.perl;
18:03 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «(322 => "pair", 323 => "pipe", 323 => "hash").Seq␤»
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18:07 bdmatatu m: my %wc = 'hash' => 323, 'pair' => 322, 'pipe' => 323; say %wc.invert.perl;
18:07 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «(322 => "pair", 323 => "pipe", 323 => "hash").Seq␤»
18:10 mr-foobar joined #perl6
18:10 timotimo i find that usage of invert rather strange
18:11 timotimo er
18:11 timotimo the usage of unique i mean
18:14 bdmatatu ok, me too. I'll go ahead and remove it.
18:17 Geth ¦ doc: b5a907758b | (Brian Duggan)++ | doc/Type/Hash.pod6
18:17 Geth ¦ doc: Remove extraneous .unique call
18:17 Geth ¦ doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/b5a907758b
18:17 synopsebot Link: https://doc.perl6.org/type/Hash
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18:40 knight__ ok, this works https://ideone.com/sa8j79 ,but I do not understand why this not https://ideone.com/UOcLOj Can somebody explain me...
18:41 knight__ thanks :-X
18:42 ugexe what is `Str $currency_?` supposed to mean?
18:43 ugexe i see
18:43 knight__ I am calling method fun
18:44 ugexe because your new method returns the result of say("..."), which is true
18:44 knight__ when 'new' method is not overrided It is works, but when I override it, fun method does not work
18:44 knight__ Ahm
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18:44 knight__ I understand
18:44 ugexe if you use .new you need to bless attributes
18:44 knight__ thank you!
18:45 knight__ I must check, what method/sub bless does :-)
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18:56 knight__ ugexe: Thank you! Now, understands what is going - I guess. So bless returns my class/objects
18:56 knight__ And I have pointer to my object and I can call method/function
18:57 knight__ I guess?
18:57 knight__ TLDR; Is something life self reference?
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18:59 knight__ *like
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19:04 AlexDaniel` knight__: like “self” ?
19:05 AlexDaniel` https://docs.perl6.org/language/terms#term_self
19:07 knight__ I mean  it returns pointer = like pointer to self object
19:07 knight__ method bless
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19:17 tyil anyone using vim willing te try out https://github.com/Tyil/vim-perl6/blob/add-unicode-ops-abbrevs/ftplugin/perl6.vim#L83
19:22 AlexDaniel` tyil: is there any way to have **32 converted to ³²?
19:22 tyil not that I know, unless I add abbrev for **32
19:23 AlexDaniel` aww
19:24 AlexDaniel` tyil: π τ and 𝑒 seem to be missing
19:24 tyil good ones
19:25 tyil I was considering to add an (atom) to turn into the atom icon for use with atomicints
19:25 AlexDaniel` yeah, although “atomic” is probably more expectable
19:26 tyil what are the ascii ways to represent the 2nd and 3rd char you gave"
19:26 tyil ?*
19:26 AlexDaniel` pi tau e
19:26 AlexDaniel` m: say (pi, tau, e)
19:26 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «(3.14159265358979 6.28318530717959 2.71828182845905)␤»
19:26 AlexDaniel` m: say (π, τ, 𝑒)
19:26 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «(3.14159265358979 6.28318530717959 2.71828182845905)␤»
19:26 tyil cool
19:27 AlexDaniel` tyil: maybe consider adding unicode minus
19:28 AlexDaniel` or maybe not
19:28 ryn1x joined #perl6
19:28 tyil http://www.fileformat.info/info/unicode/char/2212/index.htm this one?
19:28 AlexDaniel` tyil: wait, you know about this page, right? https://docs.perl6.org/language/unicode_ascii
19:29 tyil (i actually stole this list from the atom plugin)
19:29 AlexDaniel` because I realize that some things are missing
19:30 AlexDaniel` like ∘
19:30 AlexDaniel` tyil: is it possible to make ‘ "’ (space, double quote) convert to ‘ “’ and just " convert to ” ?
19:31 tyil you cant match spaces for iabbrev afaik, since spaces indicate the end of an abbreviation
19:33 ChoHag joined #perl6
19:35 tyil about that page, on the atomic ops
19:35 tyil the last entry in the table isnt part of the table
19:35 AlexDaniel` the table seems to be broken yeah
19:36 tyil I can try to fix it after I add the ops to this list and push it
19:36 AlexDaniel` tyil++
19:37 tyil is there a atomic-dec-fetch missing from the table?
19:38 mr-foobar joined #perl6
19:42 knight__ m: say (π**π)
19:42 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «36.4621596072079␤»
19:42 tyil oh, its not particularly missing
19:43 TreyHarris AlexDaniel`: just noticed the term doc you just linked to has a definition for Rat terms that includes numbers with a dot, but not for <1/3> forms. So what's happening there?
19:44 TreyHarris m: say (<3>.WHAT, <1/3>.WHAT, <3/1>.WHAT, <3.2>.WHAT)
19:44 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «((IntStr) (Rat) (Rat) (RatStr))␤»
19:45 TreyHarris (I'm asking, how does the constructor get dispatched?)
19:47 llfourn joined #perl6
19:47 AlexDaniel` TreyHarris: it's not really dispatched, it's parsed like this directly
19:47 konsolebox joined #perl6
19:47 AlexDaniel` TreyHarris: for example: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/blob/nom/src/Perl6/Grammar.nqp#L3637
19:49 TreyHarris AlexDaniel`: ah, that makes sense. Then it doesn't really have a proper place in the docs except in Rat's own, does it? Unfortunate, as it surfaces as a higher-level feature.
19:49 TreyHarris m: my $x = 1 / 3; say $x.WHAT, $x.nude
19:49 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «(Rat)(1 3)␤»
19:50 AlexDaniel` it's a little bit different for things like < 1/3 >
19:50 AlexDaniel` when you get RatStr
19:50 TreyHarris my $x = <1 /3); say $x.WHAT, $x.nude;
19:50 TreyHarris m: my $x = <1 /3); say $x.WHAT, $x.nude;
19:50 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>␤Unable to parse expression in quote words; couldn't find final '>' (corresponding starter was at line 1)␤at <tmp>:1␤------> 3my $x = <1 /3); say $x.WHAT, $x.nude;7⏏5<EOL>␤    expecting any o…»
19:50 AlexDaniel` m:
19:50 evalable6 AlexDaniel`, rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «»
19:51 TreyHarris m: my $x = <1 /3>; say $x.WHAT, $x.nude;
19:51 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «No such method 'nude' for invocant of type 'List'. Did you mean any of these?␤    none␤    note␤␤  in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1␤␤»
19:51 AlexDaniel` m: my $x = < 1/3 >; say $x.WHAT, $x.nude;
19:51 TreyHarris m: my $x = <1/3>; say $x.WHAT, $x.nude;
19:51 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «(RatStr)(1 3)␤»
19:51 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «(Rat)(1 3)␤»
19:51 TreyHarris gah
19:51 AlexDaniel` :D
19:51 TreyHarris that's too weird
19:52 setty1 joined #perl6
19:53 TreyHarris m: my ($x, $y) = <1/3>, < 1/3 >; say $x == $y; say $x === $y;
19:53 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «True␤False␤»
19:53 TreyHarris m: my ($x, $y) = <1/3>, < 1/3 >; say "$x and $y"
19:53 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «0.333333 and 1/3␤»
19:53 TreyHarris ooooh, my brain hurts now
19:54 TreyHarris < n/d > form is clearly better than <n/d> for most uses where you'd use a literal, but it's not obvious unless you generally put spaces inside bracketing constructs (which in my experience most don't if the contents are very simple like 1/3)
20:01 cdg joined #perl6
20:04 geekosaur it's known we need a better/mrore obvious syntactic construct there, but coming up with one that isn't excessively verbose is difficult :(
20:05 AlexDaniel` well
20:05 AlexDaniel` m: say ⅓
20:05 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «0.333333␤»
20:05 AlexDaniel` doesn't give a RatStr, but maybe it should?
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20:13 [Coke] m: say ⅓.^name;
20:13 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «Rat␤»
20:13 ChoHag joined #perl6
20:13 [Coke] It's a numerical literal, Rat seems fine.
20:13 [Coke] *numeric
20:14 moritz m: say <⅓>.^name
20:14 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «Str␤»
20:14 [Coke] m: say <⅓/3>.^name
20:14 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «Str␤»
20:24 TreyHarris m: say ³/₁₆
20:24 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>␤Bogus postfix␤at <tmp>:1␤------> 3say ³/₁7⏏5₆␤    expecting any of:␤        infix␤        infix stopper␤        postfix␤        statement end␤        statement modifier␤    …»
20:24 TreyHarris heh
20:25 TreyHarris so it only knows vulgar fractions
20:25 TreyHarris er, vulgar fraction ligatures
20:41 [Coke] is anyone using --parallel on the doc build? seems like it's very likely to conflict with the highlighter.
20:41 mr-foobar joined #perl6
20:43 gfldex [Coke]: precomp is not threadsafe either
20:43 gfldex and that's used for caching
20:46 TreyHarris from #perl6 logs, it looks like moritz and timeless were looking at this back in June, but didn't get anywhere. I don't see anything since then.
20:46 * timeless looks up
20:46 TreyHarris (the doc htmlifying parallelization, I mean)
20:47 timeless m: say ³/(₁₆)
20:47 camelia rakudo-moar b19e352ec: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>␤Bogus postfix␤at <tmp>:1␤------> 3say ³/(₁7⏏5₆)␤    expecting any of:␤        infix␤        infix stopper␤        statement end␤        statement modifier␤        statement mo…»
20:48 timeless [Coke]: anyway, TreyHarris is right, that sounds familiar
20:48 timeless and i don't think i got very far w/ it. I suspect I still have access to the vm that hosts it
20:48 timeless but it definitely isn't something i'm spending time on
20:48 timeless (tomorrow's adventures are fighting ldap and jenkins)
20:48 [Coke] TreyHarris: ok. tempted to rip it out, but will try to fix it instead.
20:49 TreyHarris timeless: yeah, you mentioned trying to run it on 100 cores
20:49 timeless yep, that's gcc112, the box i still use :)
20:50 TreyHarris but Moore's law is still in effect, right? So between June and now ew've had a 100x speedup anyway. Just on chips that have had since June to evolve though, so if you rebooted a lot in the meantime you may not have as much speedup. ;-)
20:51 * TreyHarris thinks this is how that works
20:51 * timeless chuckles
20:51 timeless actually there was a recent argument about moore's law
20:52 timeless some pointed out that mostly we're getting more of a coore's law -- we can double computing power by doubling die count or something
20:52 TreyHarris "recent" meaning every year since it was proposed? yes.
20:52 timeless no
20:52 timeless an argument about whether we're still properly shrinking, or whether we're just gaining by adding cores
20:52 timeless i think intel came back and showed they could still gain by shrinking
20:53 timeless > gcc112      2TB    2x10x8x3.42 GHz IBM POWER8 / 256 GB RAM / IBM POWER System S822 / CentOS 7 ppc64le
20:54 timeless -- it's actually 160 cores, but to be polite, I try to avoid using more than 100  :-)
20:54 [Coke] (docs) anyone mind if I remove the highlight path that doesn't use proc::async? i seem to recall we only needed it for the mac.
20:54 timeless back then, when I wasn't on gcc112, i was probably on a mac ;-)
20:55 timeless (these days i have a w10 laptop at home, and an mbp at work)
20:55 timeless anyway, i'm off, happy iterating
20:56 TreyHarris sorry, was kidding again. No, in all seriousness, I think Moore's Law "informal" form, about the speed of a general-purpose consumer CPU to carry out however many ops/sec, has already died. but we are still cramming transistor density at predicted rates right now--we won't hit fundamental issues with unknown physics for at least a few more years, I think.
20:57 TreyHarris s/however many/however many serial/ # important distinction
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22:39 tyil AlexDaniel`: I've looked at the broken table on the atomic ops, but in the source it looks correct
22:42 callyalater m: sub infix:['<<'] (Str $s, Int $n) { say "$s, $n" }; "Name" << 42;
22:42 camelia rakudo-moar eb1febd56: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>␤Unsupported use of << to do left shift; in Perl 6 please use +< or ~<␤at <tmp>:1␤------> 3 $s, Int $n) { say "$s, $n" }; "Name" <<7⏏5 42;␤»
22:42 callyalater m: sub infix:['<<'] (Str $s, Str $n) { say "$s, $n" }; "Name" << "42";
22:42 camelia rakudo-moar eb1febd56: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>␤Unsupported use of << to do left shift; in Perl 6 please use +< or ~<␤at <tmp>:1␤------> 3 $s, Str $n) { say "$s, $n" }; "Name" <<7⏏5 "42";␤»
22:43 callyalater m: sub infix:['<>'] (Str $s, Int $n) { say "$s, $n" }; "Name" <> 42;
22:43 camelia rakudo-moar eb1febd56: OUTPUT: «Name, 42␤»
22:43 callyalater m: sub infix:['!~'] (Str $s, Int $n) { say "$s, $n" }; "Name" !~ 42;
22:43 camelia rakudo-moar eb1febd56: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>␤Unsupported use of !~ to do negated pattern matching; in Perl 6 please use !~~␤at <tmp>:1␤------> 3$s, Int $n) { say "$s, $n" }; "Name" !~ 7⏏42;␤»
22:48 geekosaur gah
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23:37 Herby_ o/
23:38 APic \o
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23:44 raiph .tell moritz comment for you at https://stackoverflow.com/questions/46897895/how-to-make-perl-6-grammar-produce-more-than-one-match-like-ex-and-ov/46920109?noredirect=1#comment80788171_46920109 thanks
23:44 yoleaux raiph: I'll pass your message to moritz.
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