Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #phasers, 2010-09-07

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
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16:42 mberends <pre-report> translated a few more KB in jnthn/6model from .cs to .java and have similar work in progress to commit soon. Attending Amsterdam.pm tonight, possibly offline/distracted during #phasers time. May do a short Perl 6 presentation if the occasion suits. </pre-report>
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17:47 moritz_ <pre-report> fixed a small buglet in prefix:<so> and prefix:<not> (they autothreaded)
17:48 moritz_ moved pugs repo to git; split it up
17:48 moritz_ spend most of the week cleaning up the fallout from that
17:49 moritz_ like updating http://perlcabal.org/syn/ , perl6.org and various cron jobs
17:49 moritz_ </pre-report>
18:00 ash_ the next attempt at a try.rakudo.org's backend is almost complete, its using a daemon to manage actual repl's now, i am working through the issues on github's issue tracker for the repo, then i'll push it live, maybe tonight if i can find time to finish it tonight
18:00 moritz_ ash_: it's fine for it go live before you fixed all bugs -- release early, release often :-)
18:01 ash_ moritz_: well, i fixed one of them already, and tracking down the source of another, but i'll try to push all of my changes to the feather server tonight
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18:52 pmichaud <pre-report>
18:52 pmichaud Been reviewing RT tickets and fixing bugs
18:52 pmichaud Refactored whatever currying in Actions.pm to properly create closures
18:52 pmichaud Refactoring string numification
18:52 pmichaud Sped up slurp($filename) somewhat
18:52 pmichaud Found another place where Parrot's GC hurts
18:52 pmichaud Likely will work on .Stringy soonish
18:52 pmichaud Likely will re-implement Hash soonish
18:53 pmichaud Lots of design discussion on #perl6: - Discussed marking of infinite lists using ",*" - Hoping to see improved specs for series operator and range subscripting soon
18:53 pmichaud </pre-report>
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19:01 jnthn Pre-report:
19:01 jnthn LAST WEEK
19:01 jnthn * Was on vacation! \o/
19:01 jnthn * Came back from vacation. Aww.
19:01 jnthn * Sort of caught up a bit on some stuff.
19:01 jnthn THIS WEEK
19:01 jnthn * Plan more 6model stuff, especially boxing/unboxing bits, more research into the new multi-dispatch stuff, make attributes work, and start to get some first bits of ClassHOW running
19:01 jnthn * Hope to start porting various bits I'm confident about to Parrot
19:01 jnthn * Will keep it in the 6model repo for the time being, then Branch The World when not doing so starts to block me
19:01 jnthn EOR
19:02 lue Time to start #phasers, no?
19:02 moritz_ indeed
19:02 moritz_ let's start
19:02 moritz_ colomon: do you have a report?
19:03 colomon erm....
19:04 colomon Tweaked a few minor things.  Added a couple tests.  Pondered what to tackle next.
19:04 colomon .eor
19:04 moritz_ sorear?
19:05 colomon (I guess I did module work as well, not sure if that should count or not.)
19:05 moritz_ colomon: it doesn't hurt to report :-)
19:05 sorear 1. #cpan6sketch is officially dead
19:05 moritz_ :(
19:05 sorear I'm the only person with any interest in it, but I'm in the wrong timezone to promote it
19:06 sorear so nobody has shown up for 3 weeks in a row
19:08 sorear 2. random niecza work; finally got the new regex backend working; starting to optimize it
19:11 * moritz_ afk for a moment
19:13 moritz_ any other reports?
19:13 mberends sorear: the only blocker on #cpan6sketch for me was the time of day. Apart from that I'd like to participate
19:14 pmichaud last week I was in a hospital and couldn't attend.  week before last I couldn't make it at the time but arrived 20 mins late
19:15 PerlJam If simultenaity is a problem, might as well use email.
19:15 pmichaud the main thing is that we have people saying "don't repeat mistakes" but we don't have a list of mistakes not to repeat
19:16 moritz_ or alternative solutions
19:16 pmichaud well, I think we can come up with alternative solutions
19:16 pmichaud indeed, that's what proto and pls and etc.  really are
19:18 pmichaud anyway, I'm fine if we hold off on cpan6 a little while longer
19:18 pmichaud (or whatever it ends up being called)
19:19 mberends cpanminus is a good example of looking at the existing situation and devising a new solution that gets closer to what users often want.
19:20 pmichaud exactly.
19:20 pmichaud and I think we should be aiming at cpanminus
19:20 pmichaud (or something very much like it)
19:21 pmichaud anyway, if nobody picks it up again in a few weeks then I may do so
19:21 pmichaud if only because we need to clean up module handling for R*
19:23 mberends pmichaud: aye, great if you also decide to
19:23 mberends get into the guts of that
19:27 sorear pmichaud: Why didn't you make this week?
19:27 sorear pmichaud: as in, 3 hours ago
19:28 sorear pmichaud: getting a list of mistakes from Alias et al is *exactly* what I'm trying to accomplish
19:28 sorear s/I'm/I was/
19:29 pmichaud sorear: this week, I was on #perl6 waiting to see if anything happened with it.
19:30 pmichaud sorear: I understand what you're trying to do, and approve -- but we'll need Alias to arrive at some point also.
19:30 sorear People like Alias will only arrive if someone other than me picks up the "poke a bunch of people at 1400 UTC" banner
19:31 sorear I think a mailing list would work better
19:32 pmichaud we can certainly use perl6-compiler or perl6-languages
19:32 pmichaud the problem I see with a mailing list is that there's likely to be a *ton* of bikeshedding
19:32 moritz_ especially if it's p6l
19:32 sorear yes, we would need a private mailing list
19:32 pmichaud that's traditionally what has happened on this topic
19:33 pmichaud sorear: anyway, what I'm trying to convey is that many of us truly appreciate the effort you've made and share in the disappointment that it hasn't yet worked out
19:34 sorear "yet"?
19:34 pmichaud if you want to continue to push forward somehow, I'll definitely support that; if you want to give it a break for a while, I'll support that too :)
19:34 sorear you think it still has any hope?
19:34 pmichaud I'm certain that module management will be solved at some point.
19:34 pmichaud just like many seemingly intractable problems in p6 land have been solved :)
19:34 sorear what does "waiting on #perl6" mean anyway
19:35 pmichaud well, for #phasers we normally see "#phasers in 9 mins" and the like
19:35 pmichaud at 1600 UTC today I was active on #perl6, and just didn't open another channel for #cpan6sketch
19:35 pmichaud I figured if something was happening, it'd get mentioned on #perl6 the way the other sketches do :)
19:35 sorear pmichaud: I was asleep and nobody else cares enough about #cpan6sketch to make those announcements. ***This is exactly the problem***
19:35 pmichaud sorear: okay, so we agree it's apparently not a good time to meet, and let's regroup
19:36 moritz_ sorear: don't equate "care" with "being active2
19:36 sorear ok.
19:36 sorear moritz_, you were the one who picked Tue, ?
19:36 moritz_ sorear: I suggested it, I don't think I picked anything
19:36 pmichaud Apparently Tue doesn't work.  If we're currently blocking on Alias' participation, then let's get him to suggest times.
19:37 pmichaud and he may be (understandably) busy with other things, but at least we'd know.
19:37 sorear he suggested 1600 UTC and 2300 UTC initially
19:37 sorear masak shot down the latter
19:38 moritz_ wouldn't work for me either
19:38 sorear I should have shot down the former
19:38 sorear but I thought it wouldn't need me
19:38 pmichaud at this point, I think the important thing is to get a conversation started (with Alias).
19:38 pmichaud So, let him pick a date and time and let's see if anyone can make it.  I'll certainly do my best to make it.
19:39 sorear ->#toolchain?
19:39 pmichaud Like you, I figured the conversation didn't necessarily need me to be there.
19:39 pmichaud I'm fine with doing it on #toolchain, if it's logged somewhere.  And if it's not going to end up being more bikeshedding or a place where the me-too noise drowns out constructive discussion.
19:40 pmichaud since we're already logging #cpan6sketch, that's a reasonable meeting place.
19:40 sorear I was more pondering taking the planning there
19:41 pmichaud I tend to think that discussion and identification of constraints is part of planning
19:41 pmichaud but that's just me, perhaps.
19:42 sorear half of the people I want to get for #cpan6sketch are here
19:42 sorear the other half are in #toolchain aka #cpan5
19:42 pmichaud afk, kidpickup
19:46 moritz_ aynthing else we need to discuss today?
19:49 [Coke] any blockers from parrot land?
19:49 moritz_ [Coke]: nothing beyond the usual, afaict
19:51 jnthn I may have some results from 6model re lexical handling (not closure semantics, just storage/lookup stratergy) in a week or two that I'll try and write up and suggest Parrot adopt.
19:52 colomon [Coke]: I meant to ask you about using the Parrot profiler on rakudo code -- my attempts the other day failed miserably.  but that doesn't need to be done here.
19:54 jnthn I wonder if we could get the profiler to know about HLL annotations (ala .annotate)
19:54 jnthn They tend to be quite accurate, not to mention more useful from the POV of the Perl 6 developer.
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20:22 mberends jnthn: I just gave your 'Solved in Perl 6' talk again, accelerated :)
20:22 jnthn :-)
20:22 jnthn mberends: We could have a competition some day to see which one of us can give it fastest. ;-)
20:22 mberends lol
20:23 jnthn Hope it went well ;-)
20:23 mberends yes, the hecklers were put down efficiently ;-)
20:24 jnthn Good good.
20:24 mberends Juerd++ helped with that :)
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