Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #salt, 2014-05-24

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00:16 timoguin wt: pillar.get fetches values from the minion. most likely the updated values on the master had not been synced down the the minion
00:16 timoguin when you ran highstate it synced them
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07:58 trantkat hi
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08:56 Mr_K Hello All, does the the make_master: True option work in cloud.maps ?
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12:08 nkuttler mh. can i somehow configure my default target with salt (1)? i have a longish compound target..
12:09 nkuttler or maybe i should just push just another grain..
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15:33 mnaser anyone ever tried to run a salt minion on the same node as a salt master?
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15:58 nkuttler mnaser: sure. no problem
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15:58 mnaser nkuttler: i found this but im gonna run both as root so wont be an issue - https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/salt-users/gVt_KA7MUNY
15:59 mnaser shouldve read more :P
15:59 nkuttler mnaser: oh, i run the master as normal user, but with it's own config dir
16:00 mnaser yeah.. ill see what path t odo
16:00 nkuttler didn't really want something in /etc/ in revision control
16:00 mnaser gotcha
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17:15 Mr_K afternoon all
17:16 nkuttler good evening
17:16 Mr_K has anyone used the make_master= True in cloud.map and  did it work ?
17:17 Mr_K Trying to spin a few EC2 instances using the doc but cant get this option to work
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17:18 Mr_K Getting in "<string>", line 4, column 11:
17:18 Mr_K minion:
17:19 nkuttler Mr_K: can you dpaste the entire error?
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17:19 Mr_K sure thing
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17:20 Mr_K http://fpaste.org/104653/14009520/
17:20 Mr_K nkuttler:http://fpaste.org/104653/14009520/
17:20 nkuttler hm, and the cloud.map?
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17:24 Mr_K nkuttler:http://fpaste.org/104654/52218140/
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17:25 nkuttler Mr_K: i don't think yaml does =, use a :
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17:26 nkuttler sorry i missed that at first
17:28 Mr_K nkuttler: makes no diff even if I use :
17:28 Mr_K http://fpaste.org/104657/40095253/
17:31 st0newa11 w
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17:33 UtahDave Mr_K: You're syntax is a little bit off.  Let me redo your paste
17:33 Mr_K ok
17:33 nkuttler Mr_K: for one you forgot the : after node name
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17:34 nkuttler Mr_K: http://yaml-online-parser.appspot.com/ might help :)
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17:35 nkuttler btw, what is a ScannerError? wasn't obvious to me it's a yaml issue
17:35 nkuttler ah, yeah, it's a yaml exception
17:36 Mr_K Just following this m
17:36 Mr_K http://docs.saltstack.com/en/latest/topics/cloud/map.html
17:37 nkuttler sure, but your yaml syntax is off, like UtahDave said
17:37 Mr_K ok
17:38 nkuttler oh, the docs have an incorrect example as well :|
17:38 nkuttler three at least
17:38 UtahDave Mr_K: look here: http://docs.saltstack.com/en/latest/topics/cloud/map.html#setting-up-new-salt-masters
17:38 nkuttler anybody wants to make a pull request? don't even have a cloned repo around
17:38 nkuttler UtahDave: yeah, those are wrong
17:39 UtahDave needs a   :    after the minion id, right?
17:39 nkuttler right
17:42 Mr_K This doesn't work
17:43 manfred nkuttler: what are you trying to do?
17:43 nkuttler manfred: Mr_K is
17:44 manfred ok
17:44 nkuttler Mr_K: still get an error? paste error + map?
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17:47 Mr_K nkuttler::http://fpaste.org/104659/53653140/
17:47 Mr_K ty
17:49 nkuttler Mr_K: http://yaml-online-parser.appspot.com/?yaml=++base_ec2_private%3A%0A++++-+web10%0A++++++make_master%3A+True%0A++++-+web20%0A++++-+web30%0A++++++minion%3A%0A++++++++master%3A+10.0.2.15%0A++++++++local_master%3A+True&amp;type=json
17:50 nkuttler Mr_K: and http://yaml-online-parser.appspot.com/?yaml=++base_ec2_private%3A%0A++++-+web10%3A%0A++++++make_master%3A+True%0A++++-+web20%0A++++-+web30%3A%0A++++++minion%3A%0A++++++++master%3A+10.0.2.15%0A++++++++local_master%3A+True&amp;type=json
17:51 UtahDave Mr_K: you're missing   :   after the minion ids that have extra options.  http://fpaste.org/104660/14009538/
17:51 UtahDave also, I'm not familiar with the   local_master: True   option.   What does that do?
17:53 Mr_K Thanks guys -  Now I'm getting a diff error
17:54 Mr_K http://fpaste.org/104662/40095404/
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17:59 Mr_K UtahDave & nkuttler: Thanks so much . Will try and work the rest out
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18:06 agronholm does anyone have any clue how to run the salt command as non-root? no such luck here
18:06 agronholm if I try that, it complains that ~/.salt is a directory
18:06 agronholm if I remove that directory, salt creates it again and then complains that it's a directory :/
18:08 agronholm even if give an alternative configuration path to salt with -c, it still complains about it
18:08 agronholm 2014.1.4 here
18:09 UtahDave agronholm: That's a known bug that has been fixed in develop.   Let me see if there's a workaround
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18:10 agronholm thanks
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18:11 agronholm when is the next release due?
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18:12 UtahDave we're probably going to cut a 2014.1.5 bugfix release sometime in the next 7 to 10 days.  The next full feature release is tentatively scheduled for the 18th of june, I believe
18:12 agronholm cool
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18:30 Gareth morning
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18:48 manfred agronholm: it is also fixed in 2014.1.5
18:48 manfred or 2014.1 branch*
18:48 manfred UtahDave: when is rc1 coming out to get us to that?
18:48 agronholm manfred: ok
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19:16 UtahDave manfred: sorry, that's the RC target date
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20:14 agronholm I would like to run cp.cache_dir only if it's required by a state
20:14 agronholm is this possible?
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20:30 agronholm and does a state exist that returns changes only when files on the master have changed since the last run?
20:34 MTecknology agronholm: http://docs.saltstack.com/en/latest/ref/states/requisites.html   -prereq is the closest you'll get
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20:34 agronholm I was playing with prereq but I couldn't figure how to apply that
20:34 MTecknology file.managed for the other part
20:34 MTecknology I've never played with -prereq
20:35 agronholm I guess there is no way to do this with the minion cache
20:35 agronholm what I was after was updating the minion cache from the master and if files had changed, apply some state
20:36 MTecknology afaik, file.managed and pretty much anything that works on files will do exactly that
20:37 MTecknology I've never touched cache beyond deleting it for debugging
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20:43 agronholm MTecknology: if I used prereq, should I use cmd.run or cmd.wait?
20:43 agronholm or something else
20:43 MTecknology probably cmd.wait
20:43 agronholm but that one is documented to only react to watches
20:44 agronholm in fact if I do that, the state the pre-requires won't run at all
20:45 agronholm although I find nothing in the docs indicating that
20:45 agronholm oh scratch that
20:45 agronholm it is documented.
20:46 agronholm but yeah, neither cmd.run or cmd.wait works the way I want
20:46 agronholm I guess I'll try my luck with file.managed
20:47 babilen And a prereq on that?
20:47 agronholm hm, file.managed says it only manages single files
20:47 babilen file.recurse
20:48 agronholm yeah, that looks better
20:48 babilen And you have your cmd.run state with a prereq on that one. That command will only be run if the file.recurse state has changes (i.e. new files to copy)
20:49 agronholm babilen: but cmd.run will run every time, won't it
20:49 agronholm babilen: the cmd.run was for syncing the minion cache with master's
20:49 babilen no, only if the file you declare a prereq on has changes. That is what prereq is for.
20:50 agronholm babilen: I am very confused
20:50 agronholm the cmd.run thing copies over the packages which can be installed then with the pip.installed state
20:51 agronholm but I want pip.installed to only run if there are new files on the master
20:51 agronholm I need to go, brb
20:51 babilen ack
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21:05 agronholm back
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21:06 agronholm basically my goal is to have the latest versions of all packages in a certain directory installed in a virtualenv
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21:06 agronholm and I don't want to reinstall packages that haven't changed
21:06 agronholm right now I've worked around this by installing from git
21:06 agronholm but that only works locally
21:07 agronholm if I wanted to have a dev server on another box, I'd have to at least use git+ssh
21:07 agronholm works fine as long as no windows minions are involved
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21:29 agronholm actually the git approach does not work :/
21:29 agronholm because I need to compile my coffeescript files to .js
21:29 agronholm and sometimes .scss to .css
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21:45 MTecknology agronholm: coffee?... bleck
21:46 agronholm coffeescript makes JS bearable until ECMAScript 6 comes
21:47 MTecknology JS will never be bearable
21:47 agronholm it's still a pain to work with
21:47 agronholm but it's not like there's a choice
21:47 MTecknology people seem to think it should be the answer to everything
21:47 agronholm at least I don't use it server side
21:48 MTecknology coding well alleviates the need for 90% of the js out there
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21:48 agronholm MTecknology: hardly when you're doing apps that run on the browser
21:48 MTecknology 10% of the rest can be cut down by 90% via coding well
21:49 MTecknology agronholm: ya, that's some of the dip shit stuff I'm referring to
21:49 MTecknology javascript is not a web browser or rendering engine; don't make it into such things!
21:49 agronholm I do like angularjs as a concept
21:50 agronholm if only I could choose to run it on something else than JS
21:51 MTecknology I'm pretty sure angularjs was built as a joke and proof of concept
21:51 MTecknology I put it in the same ballpark as brainfuck
21:51 agronholm hardly
21:51 agronholm angularjs is actually useful, I've built a couple small apps with it
21:51 agronholm at least it's better than the other stuff available for JS
21:52 MTecknology anything built like that is a fly-over site to me
21:52 agronholm suit yourself
21:52 agronholm do you even build client side web apps?
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21:53 MTecknology yup, a lot of them actually
21:53 agronholm what do you use?
21:53 MTecknology server side?
21:53 agronholm for client side stuff
21:53 MTecknology python mostly, sometimes php
21:54 agronholm I didn't ask about server side frameworks
21:54 agronholm I asked if you build client side web apps
21:54 agronholm you said you build a lot of them
21:54 MTecknology for client side, html, css, js
21:54 agronholm yes, but what JS framework(s) do you use?
21:54 MTecknology none
21:54 MTecknology every one of them is garbage
21:55 MTecknology that was my point
21:55 agronholm I take it they don't have a lot of client side functionality
21:55 MTecknology more than you would think
21:55 MTecknology that's where coding well comes in
21:55 MTecknology my point continues to be missed
21:55 MTecknology I'm done caring
21:56 agronholm you speak of coding well without specifying what that means to you
21:56 agronholm are you implying that I'm not doing that?
21:56 agronholm that by using a framework I'm coding badly?
21:57 miles32 bros coding badly
21:57 miles32 next on _
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22:20 eliasp UtahDave: I think you can close https://github.com/saltstack/salt/issues/6240 as that's IMHO a dup of #6859…
22:21 UtahDave ah, yeah.  thanks, eliasp
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22:28 MTecknology UtahDave: I'm trying to read the salt pdf... boy oh boy there's a lot there  (https://media.readthedocs.org/pdf/salt/latest/salt.pdf)
22:30 UtahDave Yeah, you're going to be reading for a while if you want to read the whooooole thing.    :)
22:31 MTecknology I figured it'd be good to read it all before the cert test
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22:31 MTecknology maybe overkill
22:32 jcockhren every one of them is garbage
22:32 UtahDave 1249 pages....
22:32 jcockhren "every one of them is garbage, that was my point" -- MTecknology on tech
22:32 jcockhren heh
22:33 MTecknology jcockhren: javascript web frameworks - I'll stick by that statement
22:33 agronholm and what would that make me, who uses JS frameworks?
22:34 jcockhren well... fwiw, marvel and kibana are client side apps. they're pretty aweseom
22:34 jcockhren +e
22:34 agronholm I find it very hard to take such broad claims seriously without any specifics or any convincing arguments to support them
22:35 jcockhren full client side applications appeared in browsers mostly last
22:35 jcockhren css+emcascript -> c/c++ for a while
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22:35 jcockhren for example, qt
22:36 jcockhren with that said I like using them. I haven't took the time to dive into the underpinnings
22:37 jcockhren who knows what monstrocities are underneath the hood. heh ;)
22:37 agronholm what sucks most about JS development is debugging
22:37 agronholm hard to get a decent stack trace from errors
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23:11 eliasp is there a way to flag arguments as "sensitive" (e.g. credentials) passed to a method in a salt module to prevent them from ending up in debug logs etc?
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23:17 MTecknology eliasp: afaik, no
23:18 eliasp my concern: system.join_domain (fixing it currently, #13020) requires a plain password to be passed to it… I don't feel comfortable doing so as that's usually a password of a trusted domain account… having this password end up in logs and possibly other uncontrolled places is really bad…
23:21 MTecknology I've had the same concern, not because of debug logs on the system, but because I want to have returners push things to another server
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23:25 eliasp I'm still thinking of ways to forward a Kerberos TGT to the module, but I'm missing Kerberos knowledge to get this done correctly… or even having this fully interactive would be awesome, but I don't think Salt's architecture would allow that…
23:26 eliasp maybe somehow in combination with LDAP/AD as eauth backend to re-use those credentials
23:26 eliasp for now I'm going to make system.join_domain work the way it should have worked until now… then I'll try to come up with something better
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23:26 UtahDave eliasp: Hm.  I think there might be a way to do that. ask on the mailing list and I'll ask some other devs to look at it
23:26 eliasp UtahDave: I'll do… thanks a lot!
23:27 UtahDave eliasp: what version of  Windows are you using?  join_domain was working when I originally wrote it, but it's been a while since I've used it.
23:27 eliasp UtahDave: Win7 Enterprise, AD is very likely a 2008R2 structure
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23:28 UtahDave Hm.  OK.  Thanks for tracking that down
23:29 eliasp UtahDave: I feel like in the end it's just https://github.com/saltstack/salt/blob/develop/salt/modules/win_system.py#L261
23:29 eliasp {4} which should be {0}
23:29 eliasp and not really a windows issue…
23:29 eliasp but while I'm at it I'm spicing up the doc a bit and cleaning up lint-reported issues etc.
23:31 eliasp UtahDave: I'm wondering why you implemented the removal of \ from the OU string at all… in which scenario would you expect a \ to show up in a RDN?
23:32 eliasp s/RDN/DN/g
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23:34 UtahDave hm. It's been quite a while since I wrote that code.  You're right, looks like I pulled that ou section out of the cmd above and didn't change the format index
23:35 UtahDave I don't remember at this point.  I must have run into a situation where \ was in the OU.  I wrote that while on a customer site
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23:41 UtahDave feel free to make it more robust, eliasp.
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23:43 MTecknology I don't know that I'm able to hide the password used for joining the domain since it's 'net ads join -U<user>%<pass>'
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23:48 eliasp MTecknology: that's why I was wondering whether the Kerberos TGT which is generated during an LDAP/AD external-auth could be somehow forwarded
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23:49 eliasp MTecknology: and I was primarly worried about Salt/ZeroMQ logs… I don't think the win shell is logged in any way, esp. when it's non-interactive
23:50 eliasp e.g. a local admin of a Minion could set "log_level: debug" and then extract my admin password from the logs
23:51 eliasp but as I said… going to fix it now the way it was intended to work… then think about better ways…
23:55 MTecknology eliasp: if you figure something out, I'm extremely curious
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