Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #webwork, 2014-01-29

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Time Nick Message
01:02 goehle_ joined #webwork
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01:14 goehle_ joined #webwork
01:28 mgage joined #webwork
01:57 goehle_ hey mgage
01:57 mgage hi
02:00 goehle_ one sec
02:00 goehle_ so whats the plan with apache 2.4.  I only ask because I think its a good test case for how features will start in develop and then need to move to 2.9
02:03 mgage The ideal would be if for the lines in authen that are different, that we could detect which version is running (or else have it entered in site.conf ) and then it would be relatively painless to distribute it to current users even if they are on older servers.
02:03 goehle_ sorry
02:03 goehle_ I meant
02:03 goehle_ how is that going to get into release/2.9
02:03 goehle_ (I think it should definitely go into 2.9 once we have a solid way of dealing with it)
02:04 mgage that I don't know quite yet -- I haven't really had time to catch up with the magic Davide has been doing -- and won't until Thursday
02:04 goehle_ right
02:04 goehle_ this is semi unrelated to that
02:05 goehle_ but not completely
02:06 mgage So one clean way would be to pull from release/2.9 and then submit back in to it.  However I expect we'll have lots of use cases where the features have been slowly building up in develop and we are ready to release some but not all of them.
02:06 mgage that's been my worry about the current system from the beginning.
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02:07 mgage one counter is that nothing should be put into develop until its about ready to be released but I'm not sure that is realistic
02:07 goehle_ right
02:07 goehle_ the other option
02:07 goehle_ is that stuff thats going into 2.9 gets pulled into both 2.9 and develop
02:07 goehle_ so master is a subset of 2.9 is a subset of develop
02:08 goehle_ but then you have to *start* your feature branch off of 2.9
02:08 goehle_ and its difficult to decide a priori what needs to go into 2.9 and whats develop
02:08 goehle_ and then when exactly does something in develop move over
02:09 goehle_ on a lighter note
02:10 mgage yep.  I've been careful about developing features on branches but I haven't been paying enough attention with where the branch starts -- I see Davide's point that paying attention to this can make understanding the addition of features much easier.
02:10 mgage we'll wait and see how things work out
02:14 goehle_ yeah
02:14 goehle_ go to
02:14 goehle_ agora.cs.wcu.edu:8080/TestCourse
02:14 goehle_ and log in with teststud / teststud
02:15 goehle_ and go to a problem
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20:20 goehle hey aubreyja
20:20 aubreyja howdy
20:20 goehle so i'm rebuilding some webwork dev machines
20:21 goehle one is a fresh install of 13.10
20:21 aubreyja cool...
20:21 aubreyja 10-4
20:21 goehle I wanted to let you know that your ww_install script doesnt install apache
20:21 aubreyja eh?
20:21 goehle when I ran install_prereques it died on trying to do a2enmod
20:22 aubreyja ok, maybe I know what's going on...
20:22 goehle if I apt-get install apache2 manually then it works
20:22 goehle hmm
20:22 aubreyja I was trying not to have to branch on ubuntu > 13.10 (for apache 2.4) so I took out that package name
20:22 goehle now it complains apreq does not exist
20:23 aubreyja since it changed
20:23 goehle right
20:23 aubreyja and tried to use a package that didn't change it's name but depended on the current apache
20:23 goehle and I mean its not going to deal with the fact that the necessary changes are in develop
20:24 aubreyja right, I haven't gotten that far with it yet.  I think I'm going to have to do all of the getting of system information and prereqs list up in the perl script where I know how to be sophisticated about it
20:25 goehle I forget
20:25 goehle does your script install mathjax
20:25 goehle ?
20:25 aubreyja right now the install_prerequistes.sh script only has to know if you're a debian version or a redhat version or fedora
20:25 goehle ah I see
20:25 goehle you dont want to split that up even further
20:25 aubreyja I think I chagned that so yes it should
20:25 goehle unfortunately this 2.4 thing  is going to be an issue
20:25 goehle even once we get the changes into master
20:25 goehle you still need to use a different config file
20:26 aubreyja right - I already do that in the perl script though (reliably get the linux version and version number)
20:26 aubreyja yeah, but once I know the version of the os I can easily get the new config file.
20:26 goehle there is also this
20:26 goehle NOTE: If you are using Apache version 2.4 or higher (available in Ubuntu 3.10 and later) you should use MaxRequestWorkers instead of MaxClients and MaxConnectionsPerChild instead of MaxRequestsPerChild. Furthermore, in Apache 2.4 these directives are stored in the file /etc/apache2/mods-enabled/mpm_prefork.conf.
20:26 aubreyja in fact httpd -V should tell you the version of apache
20:27 goehle ok
20:27 goehle well if you can log in with those two things
20:27 goehle not log in
20:27 goehle deal with
20:27 goehle then it should "just work"
20:27 aubreyja so, those two things being (a) actually install apache and (b) get the right apache config file and deal with the mpm_prefork.conf
20:28 goehle rigth
20:30 aubreyja got it..I know - I'll bet I can start ww_install.pl, get the system info reliably, then pass it to install prerequisites.sh...
20:32 goehle thats a good idea
20:32 goehle right now you cant start ww_install.pl first
20:32 goehle you have to run install_prerequisites first
20:32 goehle this solution would mean that you have the one main file to run
20:33 aubreyja wait a sec - you're doing this on 13.10 with apache 2.4.4 right?
20:34 aubreyja and your install_prerequities.sh script has apache2-mpm-prefork on line 47?
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21:08 goehle sory
21:08 goehle got sidetracked
21:08 goehle yes
21:08 goehle looks like it
21:09 aubreyja the only reason ww_install.pl doesn't work w/o install_prerequistes.sh is DateTime::Timezone
21:09 goehle right
21:09 goehle thats what failed for me
21:09 goehle its not a huge deal
21:09 aubreyja so, if I can figure out a way to get the olsen timezone without that then my life would be a lot easier.  I mean my whole life. It would be a *lot* easier.
21:09 goehle :D timezones make everyone's lives difficult
21:09 aubreyja I can get 'MST' etc. easily, but I need e.g. America/Pheonix
21:09 goehle right
21:10 aubreyja I can do it on ubuntu, but I don't know if it's portable.
21:10 goehle right
21:10 goehle I was going to say that ubuntu knew I was America/New York
21:11 aubreyja yeah, there are a bunch of potential places to check for that. I guess I could just check them all.  Can't be more than 5 or 10.
21:12 aubreyja actually, I'll just copy it from DateTime::Timezone
21:14 aubreyja ah crud - that's a huge perl module
21:16 goehle boo
21:17 goehle ok
21:18 goehle so the script did not install
21:18 goehle apache2-mpm-prefork
21:18 goehle on my machine either
21:19 aubreyja right - that's not in 13.10.  I realized I have a local branch called 13.10, but it's not complete
21:19 goehle which is wierd
21:19 goehle because I see it int he install prerequisits script
21:19 aubreyja do apt-cache search apache2-mpm-prefork
21:19 aubreyja what version of ubuntu do you have?
21:20 goehle 2.4.6
21:21 aubreyja ah -that's your apache version.  The package name has changed in recent ubuntus
21:22 goehle it looks liek it shares a version with apache
21:22 goehle its part of the apache module
21:23 aubreyja yeah, so after getting apache 2.4.6 a2enmod mpm-prefork or something should turn on the prefork mpm
21:24 goehle right
21:24 goehle my prefork_mpm was off
21:24 goehle I had to enable it manually
21:26 goehle hmmm
21:26 goehle ok now I've manually switch to develop
21:26 goehle and copied over the apache2.4 config file
21:26 goehle but it doesnt seem to start
21:26 goehle :(
21:26 aubreyja dependency?
21:26 goehle hmm
21:27 goehle when I do check modules I"m seeing that things like Apache2::Request
21:27 goehle and Apache2:;ServerUtil are missing
21:27 goehle so I must be missing something important
21:27 aubreyja ah, look at webwork_install.log - and search for 'error' or 'warning' apt-get should have complained about this
21:28 goehle yeah
21:28 goehle I'm guessing all of line 47 failed
21:28 aubreyja yeah, that's probably right
21:29 goehle does the isntall prerequisits script use a different log?
21:29 aubreyja no, should be the same log...
21:29 goehle I only see stuff from the main install run
21:29 goehle not output from the prerequisite run
21:29 aubreyja did you run the scripts separately? install_webwork.sh opens one log for all to use, so if you didin't start with that then it won't have the prerq stuff in there
21:30 goehle I guess I did
21:30 goehle I wasn't sure which one to r un
21:30 aubreyja rtfm
21:30 goehle manuals are for losers and lesser wimps
21:30 goehle real men guess and deal with the concequences
21:30 goehle fg
21:30 aubreyja who do you think I wrote the whole package for?
21:31 aubreyja I thought that's why you were using it.
21:31 goehle yeah, too many similarly named htings I guess
21:31 goehle I ran ww_install
21:31 goehle but it didn't work
21:31 goehle and so I tried the prereq file
21:32 goehle if you want to make idiot/goofjelly proof you should put everyting in a bin file
21:32 goehle except for the one you want people to run
21:32 aubreyja yeah, who would guess trying 'install_webwork.sh'
21:32 aubreyja (ok, good point)
21:33 aubreyja ok, there must be a clever way to get the Olsen timezone info from the system.
21:33 aubreyja the system f-ing knows it after all
21:33 goehle right
21:33 goehle I got the issue
21:33 goehle libapreq2 does not exist on 13.10
21:34 aubreyja yeah, it inexplicably changed names too
21:34 goehle right
21:34 goehle you need libapreq2-3 or libapache2-mod-apreq2
21:35 aubreyja gimme a day or so and I can get this all worked out.
21:36 goehle sure, no worries
21:36 goehle I just wanted ot let you know
21:36 goehle unfortunatelly people are going to be trying to run this on the latest ubuntu
21:36 goehle so we have to kind of keep a little up to date
21:36 aubreyja right on
21:37 goehle boo still doenst work
21:37 goehle I wonder what I"m missing now
21:37 aubreyja actually, maybe everything after line 47 in that function didn't run
21:38 goehle looks like it got to the other ones
21:38 goehle its jsut wierd
21:38 goehle its not even trying to run
21:40 goehle ok
21:40 goehle so now I changed line 47
21:40 goehle but when I run install_prerequisites I get
21:40 goehle ERROR: Module apreq does not exist!
21:41 goehle ah thats coming from sudo a2enmod apreq
21:41 aubreyja did you change libapreq2 to libapreq2-4 or whatever it is?
21:41 goehle I did libapache2-mod-apreq2
21:41 aubreyja you can check in /etc/apache/mods-available
21:41 goehle should I have done the other?
21:42 goehle well apreq2 is in mods enabled
21:42 goehle my guess is that line should be a2enmod apreq2
21:42 goehle still doesnt tell my why the installation doesn't start
21:42 aubreyja ok, looks like it then
21:42 aubreyja nothing in the error log?
21:42 aubreyja (apache error log)
21:43 goehle no
21:43 goehle thats the wierd part
21:43 goehle its not even trying to start webwork
21:43 goehle its like its not in sites-enabled
21:43 goehle but it is
21:43 aubreyja ah, I thought something else changed - just a sec I think it's in my issues
21:44 aubreyja yes, it should be linked in /etc/apache2/conf-enabled maybe
21:45 aubreyja I think it's currently linked in /etc/apache2/conf which doesn't exist any more
21:45 goehle nope
21:45 goehle I just put a link in there right?
21:45 aubreyja yeah, link (say) webwork.conf to webwork.apache2.4.conf
21:46 goehle oooooooh
21:46 goehle I'm stupid
21:46 goehle It can go in either conf-enabled
21:46 goehle or sites-enabled
21:46 goehle but it has to end in .conf
21:46 goehle which I knew
21:47 goehle ok
21:47 goehle good
21:47 goehle now its running
21:47 goehle something to think about
21:47 aubreyja ah, ok, good
21:47 goehle is that dancer support will be needed in probably the release after this one
21:47 goehle for now people can enable it manually though
21:48 aubreyja Yeah, I need to catch up on the dancer install stuff.
21:54 aubreyja outta here - time to pick up the kids...

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